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President Obama Working Out; Bowe Bergdahl Controversy

Aired June 05, 2014 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

RICHARD REEVES, AUTHOR, "PRESIDENT KENNEDY: PROFILE OF POWER": What saved the world, if that is what happened, was because each of them recognized that the other guy was just a politician in a different system. And they worked it out the way politicians do. And, also, it wasn't their first rodeo.

There had been a chance of a nuclear confrontation over Berlin in 1961. And Kennedy and Khrushchev had secretly worked out a deal and solved their own problems. And the chance of a nuclear war then, which might happened if the Soviets had not built the Berlin Wall, were pretty high, and then they were even higher the next year.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: OK. Not their first rodeo. And, listen, looking at the relationship between Putin and Obama now and then the chilliness, not their first in that regard either.

Richard Reeves, author of "Kennedy: Profile of Power," thank you so much, sir.

And I hope you watch with the rest of us tonight the latest installment of CNN's original series "The Sixties" tonight at 9:00 Eastern and Pacific.

And we roll on, top of the hour. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

These shocking new claims here about the night Bowe Bergdahl was captured -- we're hearing now from this local Afghan official telling CNN that he was there that evening and that he watched as villagers warned Bergdahl that he was in danger, warning him, go back to your base. But they were not able to communicate.

Bergdahl didn't speak their local language of Pashto, and they didn't speak English. Bergdahl, unresponsive to them, saying he appeared to be, according to this Afghan, official under the influence of a hallucinogenic substance. Just minutes later, he was reportedly beaten and kidnapped by members of the Taliban.

Plus, we are learning why Congress was not told about the deal, not given that 30-day heads-up, as per the law, to swap Bergdahl for those five Gitmo detainees. According to this Senate aide to CNN, Bergdahl's life was in danger. The U.S. reportedly was told if the news was leaked, he would be killed.

So, let me go straight to CNN's Jake Tapper, host of "THE LEAD."

And first things first. With regard to this credible information and the possibility of his death, what do you make of that news?

JAKE TAPPER, CNN CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: I don't doubt it.

It seems though -- as though -- as we have heard from many in the administration and people who have been briefed by the administration, that Taliban was threatening Bergdahl's life if the information about any swap leaked.

Now, a counterargument that was offered by Republican Senator Rob Portman was that Congress was brought into the loop. Not everybody in Congress, but some members of Congress, the key members of the key committees, eight individuals total, were brought in on the OBL, on the Osama bin Laden operation, and his argument, Portman's argument was, you can't tell me this was more sensitive than that.

Some people could have been brought in. But the Obama administration arguing that the law requiring them to notify Congress before any Gitmo prisoners were transferred was one that they couldn't afford to abide by.

BALDWIN: Let me ask you about this. And we talked about this yesterday and I think the way you describe Bowe Bergdahl as -- talking to so many different people, that he was a bit of a wanderlust, a bit of a dreamer I think is how you put it.

And one of the questions has been if he did actually desert, abandon his post, was he consciously seeking the Taliban? And so, as we have heard from this Afghan official, it sounds as though he was not seeking the Taliban, but that he did on his own volition leave the base. And you wrote a piece on this for CNN.com. What do you think?

TAPPER: Well, here's what we know.

BALDWIN: OK.

TAPPER: Two individuals on the record, two sergeants, his platoon leader -- I'm sorry -- his squad leader and his team leader, both told me on air this week that they heard an interpreter listening to insurgent chatter, and the insurgent said that an American soldier walked into this village.

He wanted to find somebody who spoke English and he wanted to talk to the Taliban. That is one thing.

BALDWIN: OK.

TAPPER: That is not witnessing Bergdahl doing it. That is hearing somebody describe it.

The next thing we know is that there is a WikiLeaks, a war log from that time that mentions a soldier from the insurgent chatter seeking somebody who speaks English, does not mention the Taliban aspect of it. I went back to Evan Buetow, one of the sergeants in question, and asked him about it. He said, then the war log must just have left that off, because he heard it with his own ears and he notified his -- the authorities, his superior officers. And he notified investigators of that. Now here is the other facet to

this. The idea that Bergdahl was looking for the Taliban, if true, if true, one person very familiar with the investigation, a former government official, says it would square with what he had heard about Bergdahl, not that he was seeking to join the enemy, but that maybe as a dreamer with a messianic sense of mission, he was trying to make peace or apologize or discuss things with the Taliban, not that he was seeking to join and commit acts of violence, but that he was...

BALDWIN: But wanted to communicate with them?

TAPPER: Exactly.

BALDWIN: Wanted to communicate with them.

So how through -- we know he's still in Landstuhl. We know that his health thus far is number one priority. We're hearing that he is in a better condition. We hear he is speaking English.

Jake, do we have any idea at what point these questions, these key questions will be asked of him?

TAPPER: They will be asked as soon as the Army feels like he is mentally prepared to answer them. And the truth of the matter is, we have no idea if that has already started.

BALDWIN: OK.

TAPPER: We may be told something by the military or by the government that such and such is happening, but we don't actually know what is really going on.

BALDWIN: OK.

Let's get to John McCain, because you just wrapped an interview with Senator John McCain and I understand you called him out on a couple of things.

TAPPER: Well, this is what happened. Earlier this week, I ran some sound from Senator John McCain's on Anderson's show, Anderson Cooper's show, "A.C. 360," from February in which Senator McCain sounded inclined to accept a deal that included these five individuals.

And I played that sound. Now, of course, we're giving Senator McCain the opportunity to respond to that charge. Here is a little bit, a little taste, a little dollop of this exchange.

BALDWIN: OK.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: This is just an attack by the Obamaphiles. Look, I would never agree to such a thing. And I said I would have to know -- depending a lot of the details, depending on the details.

TAPPER: OK.

MCCAIN: And then I went on and said again after asked, I obviously would have to know the details. OK?

TAPPER: Got it.

MCCAIN: The details are unacceptable.

And for anyone to accuse me therefore of saying I would support any -- any prisoner swap under any circumstances is lying.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: ... details.

TAPPER: That's just a little -- that's just a little bit of the exchange.

Obviously, we got a little bit more into the details themselves in our interview.

BALDWIN: OK.

TAPPER: But a lot of people are saying, Republicans put a whole bunch of flyers out and tweets and signs, free Bowe Bergdahl, get him home, get him home, but now that he's home...

BALDWIN: Delete, delete, delete.

TAPPER: Exactly.

BALDWIN: OK. Thanks for the dollop, Mr. Tapper.

We will look for some saltiness, I imagine, from you, sir, on "THE LEAD" at the top of the hour. Thank you so much for hopping on with me before then.

TAPPER: Thanks, Brooke.

BALDWIN: A lot of news coming into us here at CNN about this U.S. soldier, Bowe Bergdahl.

So, let's go straight to Pentagon to our correspondent there, Barbara Starr.

And so, as Jake and I were alluding to, getting some new information this hour from this local Afghan official to CNN about the night that Bowe Bergdahl apparently wandered into this village. What do we know?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's actually really the key question, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Right.

STARR: What do we know?

There is rumor, gossip, innuendo, urban legend, and maybe a few facts. But until the U.S. military can directly question Bowe Bergdahl in a questioning fashion, which we do not think has happened yet, once he's out of that recovery phase, once his psychologists believe he can withstand some more direct questioning, then there might be some facts.

Right now, I have spoken to a number of defense officials who say they just have no information to confirm these local Afghan accounts one way or the other, the Afghan official saying Bergdahl appeared to be on hallucinogenic drugs. Maybe yes, maybe no. We don't know.

One of the things that they are continuing to say here at the Pentagon is innocent until proven guilty. They want to get him better. That's the first priority. And then they want to hear his side of the story. They want to hear exactly what was in his mind, what he was doing and what actually happened.

BALDWIN: We wait. We wait for the questions to be asked from -- get them the source himself, from Bowe Bergdahl. Barbara Starr, thank you so much from the Pentagon for us this afternoon.

Coming up here, as we have been discussing, listen, all kinds of strong opposition to this Bowe Bergdahl swap, why the former Secretary of Defense Bob Gates was -- quote -- "very uncomfortable" with this idea in the past.

And then President Obama, have you seen this? Lunge, Mr. President, breaking a sweat, his workout caught on a cell phone camera. We will talk with a man who was in the room, happened to be working out with the president when this was taken, coming up.

You're watching CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Welcome back. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

More now on all of this backlash against the release of U.S. soldier Bowe Bergdahl.

Gloria Borger, our CNN chief political analyst, let me bring your voice in here, because you are reporting, right, we're hearing from former Secretary of Defense Bob Gates that he was -- quote, unquote -- "very uncomfortable" with this idea of swapping Gitmo detainees for Bergdahl when that idea was first floated back in 2011...

GLORIA BORGER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Right.

BALDWIN: ... over the idea of negotiating with terrorists. We have heard some skepticism from Hillary Clinton, voicing concerns that some of these five members of the Taliban would turn around and fight with the bad guys, Leon Panetta, same worries, But despite all of that, green light.

BORGER: Pretty powerful group of people there, all of which...

BALDWIN: Yes.

BORGER: ... back in 2011 were uncomfortable with it. But they are gone. This is not 2011.

BALDWIN: Right.

BORGER: So the question you are asking is the appropriate one. What has changed, what is different?

And the White House is starting to do know is sort of lift the veil for everybody on why they're doing this. And what we're hearing from a senior administration official is that there were concerns about Sergeant Bergdahl's life and that there -- were also worried about his health. Also, you know, Brooke, I would have to say the timing of this is important.

This is a president who has wound down wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. This is legacy issue, no person left behind. Killed Osama bin Laden. Did that play into this?

And then there's another big question out that I have, which is, how is all of this affected by Guantanamo and the future of what the president wants to do in Guantanamo?

BALDWIN: Exactly. Exactly.

BORGER: I think the calculation was, this would help close Guantanamo. I don't think that is case now anymore, but that has to play itself out.

BALDWIN: As he promised during the State of the Union, by the end of this year, they would all be out.

BORGER: Right.

BALDWIN: We have had that conversation.

But I'm also curios. It seems to me that the White House underestimated criticism, because -- because they knew Congress would be ticked when they did this, right, but they didn't realize -- from what I have read, they didn't realize how loud this chorus would be over these allegations that Bowe Bergdahl was a deserter, did they?

BORGER: What they were anticipating was the sort of outcry on the national security front, which is, you're letting five really bad guys go with -- for a year, they are going to be watched, the equivalent of ankle bracelets, on, and then they're -- and then they could go back and do what they want to do.

BALDWIN: Right.

BORGER: They anticipated that. And the White House was also quite aware of questions surrounding Sergeant Bergdahl, but they did not really anticipate the way people would be coming out of the woodwork, his compatriots, raising questions about him.

And I think that led them to do this Rose Garden ceremony, where the president was sort of trying to make the point, look, these are parents. This was a young guy. These are parents who haven't seen their kid in five years. They want to know that he's alive, and we -- and we saved him.

And I would argue that the Rose Garden ceremony kind of backfired on them...

BALDWIN: Yes.

BORGER: ... and pointed a light more on Sergeant Bergdahl, prompting people to sort of say, wait a minute, he's not a hero.

And the jury is out on who he is. However, the notion that you leave no soldier left behind, I should say, is something that I think everyone agrees on, which is that it's a matter of keeping faith with the troops.

BALDWIN: Right.

BORGER: But they didn't anticipate the personal questions about Bergdahl and his family, at least not so soon.

BALDWIN: Let's remind everyone to read your piece, CNN.com/opinion.

Gloria Borger, thank you, ma'am.

BORGER: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Appreciate it very much.

BORGER: Sure.

BALDWIN: Coming up, speaking of the president, but in a much different light, caught on camera, President Obama lifting weights, doing squats, breaking a sweat.

We will talk with the man who was lifting weights with the president when this video was taken coming up next.

Plus, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, Mr. "Fit Nation" himself, pumps iron as well. What does he think about this? What is the message the president is sending? We will chat next.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: All right.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Welcome back. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

OK, you're going to see this video and you're going to see the president grimacing and yawning and pumping irony and getting his heart rate moving, the whole thing caught on video. Everyone is looking at this, President Obama working out in his hotel gym in Poland with -- where are we, 2014, of course, cell phone cameras rolling, his lunges.

Looks like he's listening to some tunes. I wonder what his on his iPod? Lateral raises all the talk today, especially since there were other hotel guests in the gym working out next to him. Can you imagine? This normally very private moment also happened with the Secret Service of course standing around, the White House playing down questions about breaches of security.

Officials say the president was never in any danger. And we know the president frequently works out in hotel gyms in his travels. He's on the road a lot. Here he was leaving a gym during -- Hawaii during his first term. We have seen him shooting hoops with a bunch of members of his staff.

So, do we think he's in shape?

Let's talk to our chief medical correspondent, Dr. Sanjay Gupta.

Also joining me from Warsaw, Jean Ekwa, former and current, I believe, personal trainer who can now say he has worked out with the president of the United States.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: So, Jean, first to you. Can you just describe the moment when you realized, oh, that's Barack Obama?

(CROSSTALK)

JEAN EKWA, PERSONAL TRAINER: It was amazing. It was -- the Secret Service stated to come to the gym, I thought that they would ask us to leave, which was actually a pity because I wanted to finish my workout. But, no, they didn't do that. And I was really happy.

(LAUGHTER)

BALDWIN: So, what was it like when the president first walked in and you were pumping iron or whatever it was you were doing? Did you stop? Did you speak with him? Did others speak with him? What does that look like?

EKWA: All the people there tried to played cool. And on the outside they looked calm, but, inside, I was really excited. I didn't want to do anything that would -- ended up with security guards breaking my arm or something.

(LAUGHTER)

BALDWIN: Jean, I'm coming back to you.

But let me bring in Dr. Gupta.

From -- here he is, some weights, a little bench press, quick, quick little reps.

What do make of this? GUPTA: Well, he's there, first of all, in the gym, which is terrific.

BALDWIN: Good for him.

GUPTA: He's 52 years old, right, and terrific -- and busy travel schedule.

It's very hard -- I would hate to get videotaped working out.

BALDWIN: Of yourself, right.

GUPTA: Because every single thing is going to be critiqued. Right?

Couple things -- and we talk about this a lot in terms of our own "Fit Nation" team, but the elliptical, for example, that's probably a pretty good thing maybe for a little bit of a cooldown. It's not a very intense sort of exercise. A lot of people don't recommend the elliptical machine anymore. It probably doesn't do nearly what you think it is going to, go and it also causes a lot of hyper-reflection of the knee.

So people who have knee injuries, that can actually make it worse. They think it's going to be better.

BALDWIN: No.

GUPTA: Also, you're showing there a little bit of a seated press. And this is a big workout. And everybody know this.

And if you watch -- I think we have some of that video. You watch him, he is sort of moving those weights around this area up here, not really as much bringing the weights all the way down to about 90 degrees from his shoulders, then all the way back up. I don't know if we have that video, but you get more of your workout then.

But it's interesting. I'm curious. I can't see how much weight he is lifting there.

BALDWIN: Jean, you were there. How big were these barbells? Were you doing some eavesdropping?

EKWA: Yes. It was 12 -- 12 kilos, as we say in Europe.

GUPTA: Twenty-five pounds.

BALDWIN: Twenty-five pounds.

GUPTA: Yes.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Jean, you're the personal trainer. How's his form?

(LAUGHTER)

EKWA: Well, I mean, first, it is great that he has such a training regime and he is consistent at what he's doing.

But, as for the technique, I can't honestly say that it's perfect.

BALDWIN: We will all agree. I think it's perfect that he's even there and that this whole thing is on video.

Were there a lot of people, Jean, on cell phones? Did you have to be -- I imagine, with the Secret Service, there's always Secret Service sweep. So, how were you checked out security-wise?

EKWA: We were all scanned for the weapons and stuff like that before we entered the gym.

All the members are known to the gym (INAUDIBLE) so there was no random people in there. And we were all checked before we came, so there was no chance to do any harm to anybody. Apart from that, there was like around 10 Secret Service agents all over the place. So...

(LAUGHTER)

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Jean Ekwa, you can forever say you got to work out with the president of the United States, so one up on all of us, Jean. Thank you so much for joining me.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta, thank you very much.

(CROSSTALK)

GUPTA: Thank you.

BALDWIN: And so make sure you watch Sanjay this Saturday 4:30 p.m. Eastern right here on CNN, "S.G. MD."

Just ahead, as CNN gets ready to air another episode of "The Sixties" tonight focusing on the Cold War, right now, France is preparing not one, but two state dinners because President Obama and Vladimir Putin are so at odds, all of this as Putin has ripped Hillary Clinton, calling her weak, suggesting it is better not to argue with women. What? We will debate this coming next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)