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Bergdahl Returns to U.S.; Militants Threaten Baghdad; World Cup Protests; Children Flock to U.S.

Aired June 12, 2014 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Pamela Brown, in for Brooke Baldwin.

Breaking now on CNN, U.S. Army Sergeant Bowe Bergdahl is scheduled to arrive back in the U.S. overnight a U.S. official confirms to CNN. Dr. Elspeth Ritchie joins me now to talk about this.

Great to have you here with us, Dr. Ritchie.

First off, if you would, tell us, what did Bergdahl have to do? What did he have to show in order for him to be transferred back here to the U.S. from the hospital in Germany where he has been recovering?

DR. ELSPETH RITCHIE, MILITARY PSYCHIATRIST (via telephone): So the decompression process, which is what he's been going through, is a series of steps. It's doing a medical evaluation, a psychological evaluation, gathering intelligence. We don't know the whole story yet, at least I don't, but it's very likely that Sergeant Bergdahl had to be evaluated psychologically to show that he's stable enough to get back into the glare of media publicity that he's about to face, and to reunite with his family after so many years away.

BROWN: And let's talk about that glare of media publicity because there, obviously, has been a huge backlash since that controversial exchange where we traded five Taliban detainees for him to be returned to the U.S. And in a sense, how will that affect his recovery here in the U.S.? And how do you shield him from that backlash?

RITCHIE: That's a good question. And there is not going to be an easy way to shield him from the backlash. I would caution the viewers to wait to pass judgment. There are a lot of people that seek to condemn him without knowing everything that happened. What we do appear to know is that he was fragile psychiatrically, psychologically before he left his post. One of the questions that I still have is whether he was being treated with the anti-malarial agent Methalin Malariam (ph), which is known to cause nuro psychiatric reactions, or did he have a different kind of psychiatric reaction, a psychosis or something related. So I would urge readers, listeners to wait to rush to judgment. But there's no question that his release has been caught up in politics and there will be backlash.

BROWN: And another part of this equation here is the union that he will presumably have with his family soon. As far as they go, how do you think they should approach the situation and talk to him? Is there a certain strategy that you advice families who are being reunited with their loved ones in the military after traumatic events?

RITCHIE: Well, in general, take it easy, take it slow. Limit the time together. And the United States Army is actually pretty good at advising on this. They've done this, unfortunately, too many times, reunited hostages or prisoners of war. So he will have psychologists available to help him through this. They will be so-called SERE (ph) psychologists, survival, escape, rescue, evasion psychologists, who will accompany him back and be there with him for an extended period of time. But in general, the family should go slow, not expect too much. Take it easy and give him enough time and space.

BROWN: And I want to bring in Bob Baer now, national security analyst, to talk a little bit more about this.

Bob, there has been a lot of push and pressure for an investigation to take place as to the circumstances surrounding Bowe Bergdahl's, you know, when he left the outpost five years ago. When do you think that will happen now that we're getting this word that he's going to be arriving back in the U.S. overnight?

BOB BAER, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Well, Pam, I think probably right away. I think the military's going to want to sit him down and ask him why he left post on the occasion that he was taken and the occasions before. I mean this has turned into a political firestorm whether he was a deserter or he was suffering psychological problems. And I think we need to put this to bed. I think it's very unfortunate the way this has turned and the military and the military alone is going to be able to answer that question.

BROWN: OK. And then I'd like to, right now, take a look at what Chuck Hagel -- Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel has to say about this situation. Let's take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're trying to tell me that he's being held at Landstuhl, Germany, because of his medical condition?

CHUCK HAGEL, DEFENSE SECRETARY: Congressman, I hope you're not implying anything other than that. The fact is he --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm just asking the question, Mr. Secretary. If you won't answer -

HAGEL: I'm going to give you an answer to it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, answer it.

HAGEL: I don't like the implication of the question.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Answer it. Answer it.

HAGEL: He's being held there because our medical professionals don't believe he's ready until their -- they believe he is ready to take the next step to rehabilitation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you -- have you ever -

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: A fiery exchange there yesterday on The Hill where Chuck Hagel was testifying.

Bob, what do you think this signals now that Bowe Bergdahl is being transferred from that hospital in Germany to the U.S.? He'll be arriving, we're learning, at a hospital in San Antonio overnight.

BAER: Well, I think he's going to be turned over to professionals and it's going to stay that way. I don't -- the military is not going to let this become anymore politicalized than it has. It wants the answers quickly. And I think, again, it's just unfortunate, the political nastiness. I mean he needed to be brought home. We need to get out of that war. And with the less politics we do it, the better for this country, especially when you've got other parts of the Middle East starting to explode.

BROWN: All right, Bob, stay with us because we're going to be talking to you a little bit later in the show about this unfolding situation going on right now in Iraq.

In fact, at this moment, the U.S. is considering a, quote, "range of options," including air strikes, after Iraq conducted its own last night. As a violent Islamist group, too extreme for even al Qaeda, tears through northern Iraq.

That was the scene in Kirkuk. Militants also seized Saddam Hussein's hometown, Tikrit. The city has been retaken by the Iraqi government, we've learned. But the fear now, Baghdad will be the next to fall. President Obama talking a short time ago and giving some hints about a U.S. response. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: But what we've seen over the last couple of days indicates the degree to which Iraq is going to need more help. It's going to need more help from us and it's going to need more help from the international community. So my team is working around the clock to identify how we can provide the most effective assistance to them. I don't rule out anything because we do have a stake in making sure that these jihadists are not getting a permanent foothold in either Iraq or Syria.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: The fighting forcing hundreds of thousands of people from their homes in hot spots across the country. The situation so bad right now some U.S.-trained Iraqi security forces are putting down their arms and running. Others, we're hearing, have been taken captive. Video reportedly showing hundreds of soldiers in civilians clothing captured by this extremist group, ISIS, and paraded through the streets there, although CNN cannot independently confirm the authenticity of the video.

And joining me now on the phone, CNN's Arwa Damon, who is actually in Iraq right now monitoring the situation here.

Arwa, as we mentioned, Tikrit, a second city, just one day after they took control of Iraq's second largest city, Mosul. Two cities in a matter of days. The speed of this takeover is frightening. We know Iraq is fighting back, air strikes overnight, reclaiming Tikrit, but is Baghdad at risk here?

ARWA DAMON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (via telephone): This (INAUDIBLE) doesn't seems as if the advance is going to be powerful enough to take over Baghdad, but the speed with which these ISIS fighters managed to clear brigades of Iraqi security forces out of the country's second largest city, Mosul, most certainly did prove that the Iraqi security forces and the government itself were caught on their back foot.

When you speak about Tikrit, Saddam Hussein's hometown, they also did manage to briefly take over that. Video from there showing ISIS fighters detaining hundreds of men who were identified as being members of the Iraqi security forces. The Iraqi government is now saying though, Pam, that they do have Tikrit under control. But another key city also being fought after and that is the oil-rich city of Kirkuk. The Iraqi army there also abandoning their post. But the Kurdish keshmerga (ph) are moving in and managing to regain control and clear ISIS out of that area.

But this move certainly is a very, very difficult and trying situation for this country. ISIS has proven itself to be arguably more capable than even al Qaeda was back in the day, Pam.

BROWN: And I'm sure the situation in Syria has only helped them, right, Arwa?

DAMON: Well, the two countries, nations (ph), right now as the very battlefields have morphed and changed over the years, most certainly are intertwined. ISIS, the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria, started off simply as ISI, the Islamist state of Iraq, and then it branched out into Syria. And following that branching out, it managed to gain even more control, not just in Syria, but in Iraq, as well, capitalizing on growing Sunni anger against Nuri al Maliki's Shia led government and managing to take over territory not only in Syria and Iraq. This most certainly is not the terrorist organization whose - whose - we (INAUDIBLE) are just confined to the borders of Iraq, but it's also (ph) growing into an even more transnational one, at the core of which, again, are these underling Sunni and Shia tensions, which is why, moving forward, it is so critical that if Iraq or Syria are to come out of the other side of this, as even remotely viable nations, there is some sort of political resolution, some sort of reconciliation and inclusive government.

BROWN: Well, and as we're hearing, President Obama looking at the options on to whether or how to intervene in this situation. Arwa Damon, thank you so much. We appreciate it.

And more on the fast moving crisis coming up, including what options the U.S. has here. Former CIA operative Bob Baer joins me live.

Plus, this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHASTA DARLINGTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It looks like protests are going to start get moving and there's some pushing back, as you can see. We may have - if they shoot the - got to go!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: As the world's biggest sporting event kicks off today, a CNN crew hurt after tense protests at the World Cup. See how this scene ended, up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: In Brazil, the biggest sporting event in the world taking center stage. The World Cup, of course, kicking off today, but not everyone is enjoying the opening day fanfare.

Several protests there throughout the streets of Sao Paulo today. Demonstrators are furious that the Brazilian government spent nearly $11 billion on the World Cup when the country is in dire need of low income hospitals, housing and schools. And one of CNN's producers caught in clashes and injured near the World Cup stadium. She was with Shasta Darlington, who was live on air when this happened.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHASTA DARLINGTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Things are getting pretty crazy here. There was a skirmish a short while ago. The police fired tear gas. They ended up arresting one person. It looks like protestors want (ph) to start get moving and there's some pushing back, as you can see. We may have, if they shoot the - got to go! That hit my arm.

Here, I can come back up. I can come back up now. As you can see they -- if you guys can see us, if you can see us they did - yes, (INAUDIBLE). They - OK, they shot the tear gas. This is obviously getting very tense. There isn't actually a large group of protesters, but the police are firing tear gas. It's clear they do not want protesters getting anywhere near the stadium.

At this point we're 11 kilometers away. The idea is to march as close as they can get. But police have said they're going to keep a perimeter of at least five kilometers.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).

DARLINGTON: They are, obviously, not going to get much closer than that. But I've got to say, things are very tense. These are people who feel the World Cup should never have been held here in the first place. They think the $11 billion spent on the event should have been spent on things like schools and hospitals, public transportation, and they want to make sure that today, the opening game day, people aren't just thinking about the game, they're also thinking about what's going on in Brazil, about what they feel are very poor services, and they also accuse the government of using a lot of the money for own personal gain. So this is something I think we're going to be seeing all day and not letting up any time soon.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: And Shasta Darlington joins us now live. Her first appearance since that frightening incident.

Shasta, first of all, how are you doing? Are you OK?

DARLINGTON: Thanks, Pam.

Yes, we're doing all right. Barbara Arbanitedes (ph), our producer, she got a pretty nasty gash in her arm as a result of a stun grenade. Bits of the canister shot out. I had a little cut, but mine was just a couple stitches. So we -- she is home. She's resting, out of the hospital.

And basically we're back out here to continue reporting on these protests. They've largely been dispersed. But you can see, there are a lot of police still right here behind me. The protesters moved up into the metro. And basically what they don't want to let the protesters do is come out onto this street right here. This is the red line. This is the street that leads to the stadium. We're still a good 11 kilometers away, eight miles, but the idea is they don't want fans who are trying to get their block -- blocked from getting there and they don't want them getting anywhere near the stadium itself, Pam.

BROWN: Certainly a chaotic situation there. Shasta, take it easy. My best to you, your producer, your photographer out there. Thank you for all of your hard work.

Moving to Iraq now where, in the city of Tikrit, ISIS overran a military base there. American supplied Humvees, weapons and ammunition now in their hands. These highly trained, highly motivated fighters are now highly armed. Let's bring in Bob Baer CNN national security analyst and former CIA operative, to talk about this.

Bob, if they were powerful enough to make gains without that arsenal, how much more dangerous are they now, especially considering that they're taking over these cities there in Iraq and able to gain other resources in those cities?

BAER: They're extremely dangerous. They have heavy armor. And by the way, they have been doing this for the last six months, first in Fallujah, then Ramadi. They are capable of attacking Baghdad. I doubt that they can take it, but we're going to have to wait and see. I think what we're rising here is a full-fledged civil war in Iraq like we've never seen, even since 2006. And, frankly the administration cannot let this stand. We cannot let an al Qaeda-like state, well- armed, with a lot of money, with a lot of oil, set up in Iraq. I wouldn't be surprised if we see Washington try to put together some sort of coalition to defeat this group.

BROWN: Yes. I mean this is a country where we waged a war, where we lost a lot of blood and treasure. More than 4,000 lives lost there in Iraq. And I just reading today that Washington has spent $15 billion in training and giving resources to the Iraqi government. But it seems, Bob, and we're hearing reports of soldiers there with the Iraqi government fleeing, leaving their weapons behind and running. I mean is the Nuri Maliki government capable of fighting back against this growing extremist group?

BAER: No, they're completely incapable. All that money was waste. In fact, all the weapons are now in the hands of ISIS. You know, Maliki has done an awful job, including the minority Sunnis, who are 20 percent of the population. And, you know, another thing we're facing here is the potential partition of Iraq into three states. You've got the Kurdish state in the northeast, in the west you have the Sunnis, and in the south you have the Shia. But these are messy, messy lines and I think what we're all facing now is we cannot let this descend into a full-fledge conflict. I mean this would be a disaster. It would be a disaster for the rest of the Gulf (ph). I'm painting the worst picture here, but, trust me, this is what's going through the minds of the policymakers at the White House.

BROWN: Right. And we know today that they're weighing their options. We're hearing from sources at the White House that they're not considering boots on the ground approach, but there has been talk of whether there will be air strikes or other measures the U.S. will take. What do you think the realistic options are for the U.S. to get involved at this point in the game?

BAER: I agree with you, Pamela, air strikes at this point. We can hit that armor from the air. We can use drones. We can use heavy bombers. I mean I'm not advocating getting back into Iraq. I'm not saying that. But this is a catastrophic situation where we're going to have to reverse policy.

BROWN: And, of course, this puts President Obama in a bit of a political dilemma. After all, he ran and won based on his pledge to, you know, remove troops from Iraq. And now he's dealing with this chaotic situation there. And you can't just turn a blind eye to it. It's - it threatens U.S. interests and it's important to keep an eye on.

Bob Baer, thank you very much. We appreciate it.

And more on this in just a moment. But first, back here at home, another crisis, thousands of children are walking across the border alone and being packed into holding centers where there are reports of abuse by U.S. agents. We'll take you there after this break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: The pictures alone are disturbing. Immigrant children crammed into rooms, sleeping on floors. Take a look here. But allegations of abuse of some of these children flocking across the border into the United States are even worse. Sexual abuse, beatings, verbal threats, strip searches, freezing cold rooms, not enough food or water, food that made them sick, denial of medical treatment. Those are just some of the allegations in a complaint filed by the American Civil Libraries Union and immigrant rights groups on behalf of more than 100 undocumented children held in the custody of U.S. Customs and Border Protection. A spokesman for the federal agency says, quote, "extraordinary measures have been taken to care for the children." And he says, "mistreatment or misconduct is not tolerated."

CNN contributor and national syndicated columnist Ruben Navarrette is here to talk about this.

Ruben, I read an op-ed piece that you wrote about the detention of these children for cnn.com in which you ask, where did our country go? Tell us what you mean by that.

RUBEN NAVARRETTE, CNN.COM COMMENTATOR: Right. So -- thanks, Pam.

We've always had this tradition in this country. We have a soft spot for children. And we have laws that say you can't have child labor, for instance, or there are all these measures we take to protect children. And we have a whole series of government agencies that protect children, even take them out of the home if necessary.

In this case you have thousands of children who have come across the U.S.-Mexico border and they are not being protected. The Department of Homeland Security is violating its own - its own rules and regulations that says they're supposed to hold onto these juveniles, these minors, for 72 hours before handing them over. They're keeping them much longer than that, six, seven days in some cases, all the things you talked about leading up to this story.

It's clear they're overwhelmed. There's a lot of chaos going on, on the border, but we have to do much better than this. This is not in keeping with the best traditions of our country.

BROWN: Yes, they said that, you know, they knew that there was going to be an influx of these undocumented children, but the numbers far exceed their expectations. They appear to be blindsided here. Upwards of 60,000 are expected to enter the United States this year. And I'm looking at the numbers, Ruben. That's ten times what we saw in 2011. Tell us, I mean, what is your reaction to that. Because, on the other hand, the government can say, look, we tried to prepare for this but this is just overwhelming the resources that we have.

NAVARRETTE: Right. The evidence shows that they were actually alerted to the situation two years ago in 2012. They started coming across the Texas border. There are four border states, but Texas is the most attractive one to smugglers because of the infrastructure is easiest to come in through Texas. So the Texas officials in the state of Texas who guard that border alerted the federal government two years ago to prepare for this saying that they were already seeing a trend of young, unaccompanied minors coming through the border. Now 1,000 a day are coming through the border.

It's clear that the Obama administration and the Department of Homeland Security has fallen asleep on the job here and now they're scrambling to keep up, but they're not doing a very good job. Literally, in some cases, you know this story, they're driving people to military bases, to bus stations, in neighboring states, dropping them off, drop the kids and run off. This is not how we should be doing this. And, obviously, it's a big failure on the part of the administration. BROWN: And you're seeing, you know, Republicans, Democrats sort of

pointing fingers, talking about what's behind this surge. Do you think this is a political landmine just waiting to explode, and for whom, Republicans or Democrats?

NAVARRETTE: Really for both parties. The Republicans are incredibly bone-headed when it comes to immigration. They've proven it again now. All I hear from conservative talk radio and Republicans is somehow that these people are coming out of these central American countries because they were lured here by the promise of some sort of amnesty. In reality, you have a lot of turmoil in Honduras, Guatemala and El Salvador, owing (ph) to drug violence and gang violence. These kids are refugees. The story is much more complicated than the folks on the far right wing would have us believe. So neither party understands immigration or does a good job of dealing with this issue. And both parties are failing this population of people.

BROWN: And to be fair, Secretary Jay Johnson (ph) holding a press conference right now and he said yesterday on The Hill that they're doing everything to try to manage the situation, moving border patrol officers to help care for these children, trying to give them hot meals and showers. So they are making the case that they're doing everything they can. And, of course, we'll be waiting to hear Secretary Johnson's comments soon.

Ruben Navarrette, thank you very much.

NAVARRETTE: Thank you.

BROWN: Coming up right here on NEWSROOM, more on the latest violence in Iraq. Terrorists are toppling cities there and marching towards Baghdad. And now Iraq is asking for U.S. assistance. What options are on the table? That's next.

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