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Iraqis Express Fear Through Anonymous App; U.S. And Iran Might Cooperate On Iraq; IRS: Lerner E-mails Lost In Computer Crash; USA Plays Ghana In "Redemption" Match

Aired June 16, 2014 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Amateur video purports to show tanks firing against the Iraqi army today. Take a look. As the explosions and gunfire and battles intense tie in Iraq, those caught in the middle are resort to go whisper. And not Whisper as in lowering their voices as in the app is actually giving voice to frightened Iraqis who can't seem to get on Facebook or Twitter.

Whisper allows users to share their thoughts and remain anonymous. So joining me now to talk about this, CNN Money Tech correspondent, Laurie Segall. And Laurie, company officials say the last three days Whisper has seen the number of users double. What are these posters saying?

LAURIE SEGALL, CNN MONEY TECH CORRESPONDENT: It's pretty interesting, also, that the name is Whisper and really giving folks a bit of a voice and they're called -- they're called Whispers, right? These postings, if you look at the app, scrolling through, everyone is anonymous postings from all around the world and seeing an influx come in from Iraq right now.

Let me get to what they say. One, the U.S Embassy in Baghdad is evacuating that one is very interesting. That was reported before the media actually reported it. They put that out there on 8:00 a.m. Eastern Time and the media reported a couple hours later.

Another one, we're fine in Baghdad, but we are ready for the worst. So Brooke, you just get the sense of fear. And another one, we're waiting -- our miserable deaths, as ISIS is progressing towards Baghdad.

And how folks are trying to deal with this. A user posted I'm trying to escape by my writing poems and story. And Brooke, you're also seeing cultural confessions, too. One user posted about being able to realize his sexual identity before something catastrophic happened.

He posted a Whisper saying, "I'm gay and single in Iraq and that makes me feel empty. I want to find a boyfriend before a bomb goes off." It's really heart breaking stuff. Really a taste of the culture and what's happening on the ground there -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: With everything that's being shared, you talked to the CEO of Whisper last month. Did he have any idea, any inkling, people would be using it as they are?

SEGALL: It's always so interesting to see social networks come out and then be used for all sorts of things and he hinted at it. He said this isn't just for high school people to tease each other. We don't want that. We want this to be a safe place that anyone, regardless of their ethnicity, their background, can post and feel safe and they have a voice and can talk about the government. They can be a whistle blower, but they can post anonymously and be heard -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: Laurie Segall, thank you. I want to stay on social media and expand the conversation because my next guest as ISIS embraces social media much to their advantage. Michael Weise is a contributor to "Politico" magazine. It's a foreign policy. Michael, nice to have you on.

MICHAEL WEISE, CONTRIBUTOR, "POLITICO" MAGAZINE: Thanks for having me back.

BALDWIN: So talking with social media, you wrote this piece in "Politico" magazine basically saying that these ISIS fighters are, you know, in particular don't seem to have any restrictions on what they can and can't do on social media. How do you mean?

WEISE: Yes, well, there is actually one restriction, typically speaking, which is don't post anything about upcoming military operations, which would give the game away, of course. But anything else, from beheading people to crucifying people in Syria. You have to understand, ISIS is not just a terrorist group, and I would say it's not just even a conventional or guerrilla style military apparatus now.

It's functioning as a state. It has government facilities. It provides medical treatment and, you know, food supplies and it's controlling the dam in Syria. And much of the oil supply in Syria now in northern and central Iraq. In that respect, it's important to think of ISIS as something that is sort of trying to be a quasi state entity.

And, indeed, they use social media very well to their advantage. And I think, you know, it's important to understand, what they're putting out is propaganda, and no one should take it at face value. It should always be cross-checked in terms of what they claim to be doing versus what they actually are.

But there is an app they're using themselves, and we were talking about Whisper. Just before I sat down, I read a very good piece in "The Atlantic." It's called "The Dawn of Glad Tidings" and this is an app that you can download, basically it's controlled by, I don't know who. Probably ISIS central command.

Anybody who downloads the app, will have tweets that central command automatically posts to their Twitter account, as well. So what this is, it's sort of like a force multiplier effect for ISIS propaganda. It makes them seem like they're everywhere throughout the internet so for instance, the #baghdad would call up images that they dictated to Twitter. Images suggesting, you know, we're going to bring hell and fury on the city. So it has a very miniature effect I think on the current crisis, which is exactly what they want.

BALDWIN: Insane. And I think it's important to reiterate what our senior international correspondent, Nic Robertson was saying. Listen, Brooke, this isn't just propaganda, they are documenting war crimes so --

WEISS: Yes.

BALDWIN: It's clear that it's at that level, but then we read this article, and I don't know if you've seen this, Michael. But "The Wire" is now reporting that Twitter has suspended multiple ISIS accounts, right, for obviously the violence. But there is the criticism, because by doing that, that negates the opportunity down the road to prosecute war crimes.

WEISS: Right. I think the incentive for doing that and western governments is going to argue this, we want to stop the recruitment effort. They're using this as kind of a rallying cry or casting call to get fighters not just from the region in Syria and Iraq but all over. I mean, the U.K., there is something like 400 foreign fighters from Britain who have gone to join the civil war in Syria, probably most with groups affiliated with ISIS or certainly not the moderate Free Syrian Army types.

So absolutely. There's going to be this sort of attempt at censorship. But ISIS is clever and they find out ways to circumvent this. They're saying they should use the tour system, which is kind of like the shadow internet.

BALDWIN: Right. The underbelly.

WEISS: Exactly. So now I think, you know, as we try to adapt to their methods, they're going to adapt to ours. So I don't see them quieting down any time soon.

BALDWIN: This is a whole new way of covering stories like this. In real-time and watching how this gets ahead, sophistication sounds like the understatement when it comes to this group. Michael Weise, come back to the show. Thank you so much for your knowledge, really appreciate it.

WEISS: Yes, thanks for having me.

BALDWIN: And just quickly, a programming note, Anderson Cooper. Anderson is in Baghdad. He will be anchoring "AC360" live tonight starting at 8:00 Eastern. Do not miss that.

Coming up next, back in 2006, Joe Biden made a suggestion on how to fix Iraq. At the time, this idea of his didn't get much traction. But now it has many asking, was he right? We'll talk about the idea with "CROSSFIRE" colleagues, let them debate that, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BALDWIN: The crisis gripping Iraq has become so dicey that now the United States and long-time foe, Iran, are considering actually joining forces to contain this. According to reports, these two sides could hold discussions as early as this week as both have sent teams to Vienna, Austria for another round of talks in Iran's nuclear program.

The U.S. and Iran. Is this a good idea? Joining me now from Washington, my colleagues, Van Jones and S.E. Cupp, hosts of CNN's "CROSSFIRE." Good to see both of you. Let's get right into it. Beginning with you, S.E., just flat out, should the U.S. be talking to Iran about Iraq?

S.E. CUPP, CNN CO-HOST, "CROSSFIRE": Hell, no. No, Iran has one singular interest in Iraq and that is to prop up you and continue to prop up a Shiite regime. Iraq has had a Shiite regime for some time now. It's been overtly hostile to Iraq's Sunni population. So if we want Iraq's Sunni population to go running into the arms of Sunni is, then the first thing we should do is bring Iran in to conduct negotiations or to get Iran's help in dealing with this. That will engender absolutely no trust with the Sunni population that we very much want to keep interested in this process and optimistic about the possibilities for Iraq's future.

BALDWIN: So a hell, no from you, S.E. and I think a lot of Americans would agree with you. Van Jones, do you agree?

VAN JONES, CNN CO-HOST, CNN'S "CROSSFIRE": Well, I think you can talk to anybody and there's no harm in talking. I agree with S.E. There is a danger we actually drive some of the Sunnis further into the arms of extremists. But we have to take a step back here and recognize, we are now living in a multipolar world. As Americans, we're used to being the only power that matters. George W. Bush started these wars, kicked over a hornet's nest, broke the bank, hurt our military and now we have to deal with the consequences. Part of the consequences are, you've got to talk to people like Iran and Russia.

BALDWIN: So you say yes. Given the dangers.

JONES: I think it's worth talking. What you do, after you talk, that's another question.

BALDWIN: OK. Let me take you back. This is because everybody is thinking, what could Iraq look like down the road? And actually, to do that, let's go back to 2006, because this plan put forth to end full-scale civil war in Iraq, back when the U.S. forces were actually still fighting there. And here's the idea. Take a look.

You split Iraq into three sections, roughly comported to what we're seeing now. You have the Kurds in the northeast, the Sunnis in the heartland, Shiites in the south, all bound together in this loose confederation. That's -- an idea, and van, actually an idea put forth by Senator Joe Biden at the time. Do you see that as plausible, might we see this resurrected?

JONES: Well, I think that's kind of what is beginning to emerge. And I think that the whole world has an interest in trying to keep some kind of confederated state there. But I think the idea that you can just go over there, start a war, throw out the existing leadership, have an election and everything is going to work out fine, that region has been held together very delicately for decades, if not centuries. And George Bush had a plan to win the war. He didn't have a plan to win the peace and that's why we got this humpty dumpty scenario over there.

BALDWIN: S.E., would you like to respond to your colleague on the humpty dumpty issue and do you think that the partitioning of Iraq would be smart?

CUPP: You know, it's something to consider if you're looking at the geo politics of that region. Let me promise you this, ISIS is not running into Iraq because no one heeded Joe Biden's advice in 2006. ISIS is running into Iraq because there is a power vacuum there. And that's what these groups, ISIS, other the al Qaeda aligned groups, that's what they do, they exploit power vacuums.

If you look at Syria, Mali, that's what they do, and the difference in Iraq is this is a power vacuum that we created. Yes, we went into Iraq, we can litigate whether that was a good idea or not. But we went in and then we left before stability had been completely achieved. So we created a power vacuum. And now we're left to deal with it.

Joe Biden also said that Iraq was going to be one of President Obama's greatest successes. It looks like he was happy to accept responsibility and the credit, when Iraq was stable. But by the same hand, you have to take this same kind of responsibility for Iraq's instability now.

BALDWIN: All right, each of you got the presidential jabs in both ways. We'll call it even. Van Jones, S.E. Cupp, we'll watch tonight, 6:30 Eastern on "CROSSFIRE" here on CNN.

Did the IRS unfairly target Tea Party groups? Let's talk about that. That's the question some in Congress want answered. But we may never find out because the IRS says a computer crash erased important e- mails. Really? Are lawmakers buying that excuse? We'll talk to Jake Tapper on that one, next.

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BALDWIN: The IRS tends to be pretty unforgiving when it comes to deadlines, submitting paperwork, right? But the agency actually finds itself in a bit of a bind over e-mails from a former official. It says some e-mails from Lois Lerner were lost because of a computer crash. Lawmakers want those e-mails all part of this investigation into whether the agency did target Tea Party groups over tax exempt status.

To Washington, we go to the chief Washington correspondent, host of "THE LEAD," Jake Tapper. Jake Tapper, so lost e-mails? Are lawmakers buying that? JAKE TAPPER, CNN CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Well, it seems to be splitting down party lines. Republicans are very skeptical already. The House Ways and Means Committee and the House Oversight Committee say they're looking into this. Lois Lerner is having a closed door meeting with the ranking Republican on the Senate Finance Committee, Orrin Hatch later today.

You know, because there are questions here not only about the credibility of the claim that two years' worth of e-mails from 2009 through 2011 disappeared because of a hard drive that crashed, but also because of testimony that the acting IRS director gave before Congress just in March when asked about the ability to store and back up e-mails. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's one of the brilliants of the e-mail system. You go in and you check the sent box, the inbox, and you suddenly have all the e-mails, correct?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right, they get taken off and stored in servers.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: They get taken off and stored in servers from the IRS Commissioner John Koskinen. So there are questions about how could one person's hard drive crashing obliterate all of these e-mails especially when the government has laws requiring the storage of these e-mails -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: OK. We'll watch for it on "THE LEAD," thank you, sir, at the top of the hour. Jake Tapper.

It is the biggest sporting event in the world, the World Cup. In mere hours the U.S. takes the pitch for the first game. CNN's Lara Baldesarra is live in Brazil with a preview. Hi, Lara.

LARA BALDESARRA, CNN SPORTS: Hi, Brooke. Yes, I certainly do. We're just over two hours away. Excitement is building for the grudge match of all grudge matches. I'll have more on that coming up for you in just a moment.

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BALDWIN: Baseball has lost one of its best players, nicest guys. Tony Gwynn has died at the age of 54. He played his entire career 20 seasons in all for the San Diego Padres. He was so adored fans called him Mr. Padre. Gwynn won eight national league batting titles and had this incredible career batting average of .338. Those achievements made him a first Ballot Hall of Famer. He believed the cancer that ended his life was actually caused by chewing tobacco.

And tonight, the United States begins its World Cup adventure when it goes toe to toe with Ghana. They have knocked the U.S. competitions, the last two go rounds both in 2006 and in 2010. So tonight, basically a must win for the U.S. Team. CNN Sports Lara Baldesarra is live in Natal, Brazil. Lara, all right, so might this be sweet, sweet redemption for the U.S.?

BALDESARRA: It most certainly is. This is all about that grudge match. The 2010 World Cup like you mentioned USA was eliminated from the World Cup in the knockout stages by Ghana. So there is a lot of redemption here. Now none of the players are actually saying that. They're saying they're going in with a clean slate. There's only six guys on this roster who was on the U.S. national team roster back in 2010.

But either way, all of the fans feel like this is a match that they need to get some redemption out of. I just saw a whole group of American fans just walking to be here in full force tonight cheering on their team. Everybody wants a little payback after what happened last time in the World Cup.

BALDWIN: So they want a little payback. The U.S. coach who apparently some time ago wasn't really sure if his team was capable of making it all the way changing his tune about winning the World Cup.

BALDESARRA: Yes, he did come out and say that it's not a reasonable expectation for the USA to win the World Cup. You know what? Not the popular thing to say, but it is a little bit honest. However, most recently in his press conference yesterday, he said he still is going out there wanting to win just like all the 23 guys on the roster. They're playing every game to win.

He said that the drive is exactly the same. Whether he thinks it's reasonable or not they can win, they're going in, they're going to go out there, win all three games. If they do, that would be extremely impressive because the USA is in the toughest group in the entire World Cup. Winning any of these games would be impressive for the USA.

BALDWIN: OK, so you say that would be impressive. You've been studying the statistics. Yes, this would be sweet, sweet redemption for America. Prediction time. How is it looking, U.S., Ghana.

BALDESARRA: I don't know. I'm going to become the most unpopular person -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: Totally putting you on the spot.

BALDESARRA: USA is going to lose, 2-1 to Ghana. That's my prediction. I hope it doesn't come true, Brooke. I really, really do, but that's what I think. We'll see. Do you have a prediction?

BALDWIN: Gosh, I hope it's the U.S., but I'll take your word for it. You've been studying up on all of this. Enjoy Brazil either way, my friend. Lara Baldesarra in Brazil for us covering the World Cup, thank you. We'll be watching in a couple hours.

Before I go, how about this, Starbucks is adding a perk for some of its employees. The company helping them earn a college degree. Starbucks will offer full and part-time employees a generous tuition reimbursement benefit for Arizona State University's online studies program. So for employees going to college as a junior or senior, they will get full tuition reimbursement for two years, translation, that's about $30,000 for those who will be freshman or sophomores, they'll get 22 percent of their tuition paid for two years. That's about $6500.

And get this, employees aren't required to stay with Starbucks after earning their degrees. How about that? To see Poppy Harlow's entire interview with the CEO of Starbucks, make sure you go to cnnmoney.com and stay right here. We're going to Washington. "THE LEAD" with Jake Tapper starts right now.