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Pentagon Briefing; Benghazi Mastermind Caught; Mother of Benghazi Victim Reacts

Aired June 17, 2014 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Wolf, thank you.

I'm Brooke Baldwin. Crazy busy news days. Let's get right to it.

For almost two years, the U.S. has been trying to bring to justice the terrorist behind the raid on the consulate in Benghazi, Libya. But even though CNN could locate one of these suspects, the U.S. apparently could not. In fact, we talked to him, in public, inside a cafe. But finally today, that suspect is in U.S. custody. Authorities say they arrested Ahmed Abu Khattalah over the weekend and are now holding him in a location outside of Libya. The FBI and military carried out that raid.

I should also tell you, we're waiting for more details as we await this Pentagon daily briefing that we'll take live for you any minute now.

Now, Khattalah is charged in the attack that left four Americans dead. And our senior international correspondent, Arwa Damon, sat down with him in a cafe last year. He denied involvement in that attack in Benghazi and claimed no official has ever asked him about the attack.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARWA DAMON (through translator): Did anyone from the American or Libyan government get in touch with you?

AHMED ABU KHATTALAH (through translator): (INAUDIBLE).

DAMON: Never?

KHATTALAH: Never.

DAMON: No American official or Libyan official tried to contact you?

KHATTALAH: Even the investigative team did not try to contact me.

DAMON: You're talking about the FBI team?

KHATTALAH: Yes.

DAMON: And if they tried, are you ready to meet with them?

KHATTALAH: Yes, no problem, but not as an interrogation. As a conversation like the one we are having right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Obviously, agreeing to sitting down with Arwa on condition we wouldn't show his face, but we could hear his voice. We'll get to Arwa live in a minute to talk about that interview. But I should also mention, President Obama just mentioned this major arrest moments ago and talked about what it means for him and the United States.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: You know, we continue to think about and pray for the families of those who were killed during that terrible attack. But more importantly, it's important for us to send a message to the world that when Americans are attacked, no matter how long it takes, we will find those responsible and we will bring them to justice. And that's a message I sent the day after it happened. And regardless of how long it takes, we will find you. And I want to make sure that everybody around the world hears that message very clearly because my first and most solemn duty as president and commander in chief is to keep the American people safe.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: That was the president minutes ago speaking at a stop in Pennsylvania.

And here we go. Let's go to the Pentagon briefing. More details on this raid. Take a listen.

REAR ADMIRAL JOHN KIRBY, PENTAGON SPOKESMAN: Khattalah has been charged for his role on the attacks on U.S. facilities in Benghazi, Libya, on September 11, 2012. No U.S. personnel or civilians were injured in this operation, which was carried out in close coordination with law enforcement personnel. The United States has taken Khattalah to a secure location outside Libya. He will be brought to the United States to stand trial in a court of law.

Secretary Hagel is proud of everyone who meticulously planned and executed this operation. They took great personal risk to fulfill our pledge that the United States will do whatever it takes to ensure justice comes to those who harm American citizens. It is also an important reminder to the American people, as well as to our partners and our adversaries alike, that the U.S. military works every single day to be ready to carry out the orders of the commander in chief and to defend this nation.

Just a quick note on scheduling. As you may know, Secretary Hagel will testify on our budget before the Senate Appropriations Committee Subcommittee on Defense tomorrow. And on Thursday, he will host the German minister of defense for her first visit to the Pentagon since taking office earlier this year.

With that, I'll take your questions.

Leah (ph). UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: John, can you say whether he will be coming back here to D.C. area for trial? Is that the plan? And he was living out in the open in Libya for some time. I mean he was interviewed by reporters, the press last year. Can you address why this took so long and whether or not there was any either notification or coordination with the Libyans at all? Anyone?

KIRBY: OK, there's a lot there. On where he's coming back to stand trial, I'd referring you to the Justice Department. I just - I can't speak to that.

What I can tell you is that certainly that -- we have long maintained, on the consultations with Libya, we've long made it clear that we were going to hold accountable the perpetrators of Benghazi. This is - this should come as no surprise to anyone, least of all the Libyan government. And I can tell you that they were - they were notified. They were notified about the - about this capture operation.

On the -- I'm sorry, your other one was? Oh, about living in -- well, look, terrorists go to great lengths to evade capture. And it can be -- it can be a complicated process trying to get at them. And you don't ever want to execute a mission like this, a complicated mission like this, that - you know without - without having the proper information and resources all in place. And so what matters is not that it took a matter of time to get him, but that we got him. And I can't speak for his living habits, but let's just say for argument's sake he was living in plain sight. He's not any more.

BALDWIN: OK, let's pull away. That's really the question is it, if our own Arwa Damon sat down with this man at some point last year, what took the U.S. so long to grab him and arrest him?

We're going to double back to that. Let me just bring in Arwa Damon. She's standing by live. Evan Perez standing by live. Bob Baer, our national security, former CIA, standing by as well.

But, Evan Perez, let me go to you, because you have the answer to one of the questions that was asked of the admiral, that being the tick- tock, if you will, as far as where he will be brought to the U.S. and where specifically. Tell me about that.

EVAN PEREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right, Brooke. We expect that he'll be brought to the United States in the next couple of days. And he is set to be tried in Washington, D.C., where the charges were filed last July. Now, we first reported last September that these charges existed and the president confirmed them in a press conference a couple months later.

But, you know, this has been a very complicated thing for the - for the Justice Department, for the FBI and for the Pentagon simply because he was - he was in Benghazi, which is obviously not very friendly territory, and they - you know, before they capture someone, they want to go in with overwhelming force. And they assumed that perhaps they were going to get shot at and maybe civilians might get harmed. So it took a lot of planning to be able to carry out this operation. We're told that that is something that they've been trying to do and

they've been planning to do for several months. They even had a chance last October when the U.S. captured another terrorist, Abu Anas al Libi, who was involved in the 1998 embassy bombing case. And, you know, at that time, they thought they had a chance to get Abu Khattalah as well and that didn't prove to be the case. They finally did get an opportunity today -- I'm sorry, over the weekend, and they grabbed him.

BALDWIN: OK. Evan, stand by for me.

Arwa, let me go to you because, you know, I re-watched your whole piece from last year and the fact that you tracked this man down, Ahmed Abu Khattalah, and sat with him in this cafe. I know he took offense, it seemed like, to his opinion your interrogative (ph) tone, which is -- it sounded like his fear of talking to U.S. officials that it would be more of an interrogation, surprise (ph). But what do you make of the fact this question, once again, what took the U.S. so long?

ARWA DAMON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think one has to look at the groundwork that existed in Libya at the time that we sat down with Abu Khattalah. This was almost exactly a year ago, it was May of 2013, when we first met him. It was at a time when America's relationships with the Libyan government was tenuous at best. There was a lot of anti-American sentiment, therefore not a lot of support within the Libyan security forces, nor within the government in and of itself to actually allow the U.S. to conduct any sort of raid on Libyan soil or any sort of attempt to capture him.

There were also a lot of concerns at the time that his capture, especially at the hands of U.S. forces, would perhaps further inflame anti-American sentiment, further complicate what was already a very complicated security situation in Benghazi at the time, again, a year ago. Ansar al-Sharia was gaining even more ground. We were seeing pro- al Qaeda graffiti being painted on the walls. The Libyan security forces were not necessarily in control.

Fast forward to what Benghazi looks like right now. Still very lawless, still a very dangerous place, but at the same time, interestingly, you have this big anti-Islamist movement that has been happening, part of it spearheaded by a renegade general who has made it his mission to go after these various different Islamist brigades, focusing very heavily on Ansar al-Sharia and also the support of the population when it comes to these operations against Ansar al-Sharia. So the circumstances inside Libya right now make it much more conducive for this kind of operation to take place.

BALDWIN: OK.

DAMON: Plus, after the attack on the U.S. consulate and the CIA annex, America lost a lot of its eyes on the ground, those valuable assets on the ground that could be intelligence gathering. So that could have contributed to this as well.

BALDWIN: OK. So two explanations, two very valid explanations there. And, Bob, I should point out to the viewers, you know, even though we

pulled away from the Pentagon briefing, we're watching. We're watching it from the control room. And thus far really Kirby hasn't revealed anything specific about the raid. That's what we were really listening for. But from sources, Bob, we know that it was either Army Delta Forces or Navy SEALs who conducted it. That's from our own reporting at the Pentagon. Can you tell me what kind of operation might have gone down here?

BOB BAER, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: It was entirely covert in a city like Benghazi. You can't go in with uniforms showing guns. Both Delta and the SEALs have been practicing this for years where they can pull up in a couple vans, jump out, grab the person --

BALDWIN: For years?

BAER: Yes, for years. They've been doing this, well, since Iraq, really. And they need to come in quietly. They cannot come into a neighborhood firing. At the same time, they need to have complete dominance in that neighborhood. They don't want to be surprised.

They brought along an FBI agent, I can read between the lines on this, simply to effect the arrest because the chain of evidence, you don't want Delta Force or the SEALs having to show up in court. So the FBI agent throws the cuffs on him. They pull him away. So he's in the Department of Justice control at this point.

BALDWIN: Right.

BAER: And it tells me that this is going to be a civilian trial, which is the way it should be.

BALDWIN: Right. As Evan was reporting, he'll be heading to the U.S. in a matter of days to face justice. But what about, we were wondering, Bob, you know, the U.S. has killed, we've taken out alleged terrorists in other countries, no trial, no evidence, no lawyers. What makes Khattalah different?

BAER: Well, I think all Americans want to know what happened. Why -- what happened with this raid. I mean how far in advance it was planned and the rest of it. It's a huge political issue. Yes, Delta and the SEALs could have used - done a targeted killing and gotten rid of the guy, but I think for all of us we'd like to know what happened and see somebody come to justice. And I think it's fortunate timing for the administration, although they've been planning this for years, or two years at least.

BALDWIN: Timing for that Hillary Clinton town hall tonight, I'm sure this is something she will be asked about for sure here on CNN.

Arwa Damon, Bob Baer, Evan Perez, thank you all so much for your expertise, for your reporting on this story.

Coming up next, we're staying on this because I will speak live with Patricia Smith, a mother who lost her son. He was one of the four Americans killed in that attack in Benghazi. She has been very critical of the administration for the lack of answers despite all kinds of promises to her about what happened to her son that night. Stay here.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Welcome back. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Back to our breaking news here, the search for answers about what happened in Benghazi. It's been a long road. So the arrest of Ahmed Abu Khattalah is finally some news for those waiting, wanting answers. One of the most outspoken critics has been Patricia Smith, because her son, Sean Smith, a State Department information officer, was one of the four Americans killed in Benghazi in September of 2012. Patricia Smith talked to Anderson Cooper a month after that attack.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PATRICIA SMITH, SON SEAN SMITH DIED IN BENGHAZI: I told him, if it's such a secret thing, fine, take me in another room, whisper in my ear what happened so that I know and we'll go from there. But no, no, they then - you know, they treat me like -- at first I was so proud because they were treating me so nice when I went to that reception. They all came up to me and talked to me and everything. I cried on Obama's shoulder. And then he kind of looked off into the distance. So that was worthless to me.

I want to know, for God's sakes, or for Allah's sake or for whoever's sake is there. I don't even know if that's true or not.

ANDERSON COOPER, ANCHOR, CNN'S "AC 306": So you don't even know the cause of death?

SMITH: No, I don't. I don't know where -

COOPER: It -

SMITH: I look on TV and I see bloody handprints on walls, thinking, my God, is that my son's? I don't know if he was shot. I don't know - I don't know. They haven't told me anything. They're still studying it. And the things that they are telling me are just outright lies.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: That was Patricia Smith then. She is joining me now on the phone.

Ms. Smith, welcome. I'll never forget that interview and thinking of those bloody handprints and you not knowing if it was your son. I want to follow-up on that interview and see if you have gotten the answers you so deserve. But first, what do you make of the news today that the U.S. has finally captured this key suspect in the attack that killed your son?

Pat Smith, can you hear me? It's Brooke with CNN. We're live on TV.

PATRICIA SMITH, SON SEAN SMITH DIED IN BENGHAZI (via telephone): OK. BALDWIN: Can you hear me?

SMITH: I can hear you. I can hear you.

BALDWIN: OK, wonderful.

SMITH: But you're cutting in and out.

BALDWIN: Hopefully we won't.

SMITH: OK.

BALDWIN: But I'll just repeat my question and I'll speak slowly for you. My question is this. With the news today of this key capture of one of these alleged terrorists involved in the attack that killed your son, what do you make of that news?

SMITH: Well, I think it's wonderful that they finally caught him after all this time. I didn't have too much hope for it anymore because they didn't want to.

BALDWIN: How do you mean?

SMITH: Well, if he was out there and available to be spoken to and other people can speak to him, why did it take them so long to do this? They didn't want to. I don't know if it was because of something that's so secret over there. I don't know. They haven't told me anything. They still haven't told me anything. Anything that I have gotten, any information I've gotten has been from the outside, from the -- not from the State Department, because they just told me lies. What I've gotten is from the SEALs and from the people that were there and some terrorists even called me on the phone and told me some of the things that happened. So I don't have too much hope for anything else other than that they've got to get the rest of those guys. They've got to get them and -- like they promised, and they've got to just - just do it, for God's sakes. Let' them do it. But, no, they don't want to because they're afraid something might come out.

BALDWIN: They did it, it sounds like, with this one individual. And I hear you, we know that there could be others that they are looking for. But I hear - I hear the passion, I hear the frustration in your voice. You were frustrated two years ago, and understandably so, in talking to my colleague, Anderson. When you say you haven't got the answers, the answers that you were promised from Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama and Joe Biden, can I ask, when's the last time you heard from either of those individuals or someone from State?

SMITH: OK. The last time I heard from them was at the casket ceremony when they said that they're going to give me a -- let me know when the medal ceremony comes up so that they can get me down there for the medal ceremony. They never did. I had to get - to get transportation from Hannity. He was able to afford or he paid for my airplane ticket to go there for the medal ceremony. But they did not contact me at all. Not at all.

BALDWIN: Do you even know to this day, we're coming up on two years in just a couple of months, do you know the official cause of death for Sean?

SMITH: Do I know?

BALDWIN: Yes, ma'am.

SMITH: I don't know if I do or not. I know what I've been told. But I've been told two different things. Both of them are the same type of thing, that it was asphyxiation from the diesel fire. But I'm not even sure if he was in the casket. I asked to see him and they wouldn't let me see him. They said I had to go to Dover in order to see who was in that casket, which I didn't do.

BALDWIN: What about the fact we have now learned that this man, this alleged terrorist, will be brought to U.S. soil, he will face the American justice system, federal court in Washington, D.C. How do you feel about him being brought to the U.S.? How do you -- what does justice look like for you?

SMITH: Justice, for me, I don't think there is justice for me. My son is gone. He's dead. Nobody has been standing up to say it's their fault. And they stand up for it and this is the reason why. That's what I want to know, why. Why was it - why were those decisions made, not a bunch of baloney that they've been handing out, but why were those decisions made, and why, just why. A whole bunch of whys because nobody's talked to me about anything. Not about anything. And, yes, I'm upset and I think I'll be upset until the day I die. I'm sorry.

BALDWIN: You have every right to be upset and you deserve all the answers that were promised to you.

SMITH: But they don't care. They don't give a damn. Nobody -- you would think that after all this time, all I've asked for is for Hillary to give me a telephone call and tell me what happened. If it's classified, fine, whisper it in my ear, but just tell me. But, no, she gets to know. Everybody else up there in the big shot wing gets to know. But my -- the mother of the son that got killed is not allowed to know these things.

BALDWIN: Ms. Smith, I -

SMITH: Because (INAUDIBLE) don't know why.

BALDWIN: Hillary Clinton will be answering questions as part of a town hall in a couple of hours here on CNN.

SMITH: No, she won't (INAUDIBLE) anything.

BALDWIN: Let me ask you live on CNN, if you could ask her one question, because Christiane Amanpour will be doing so, what is your one question for Hillary Clinton?

SMITH: Why did she not give security to those people that were there. She sent them in there to do her thing, whatever it is that she was supposed -- they were supposed to do, which they did willingly. And my son, I'm sure, did willingly. And he would probably do it again even knowing what the outcome is. But why can't they just tell me the truth? Just the truth. That's - that should be something that's allowable. But she don't care. She wants to be president.

BALDWIN: We - we don't know. She's written about this. She's answered many questions. She's testified under oath for seven hours. I hear you, though. I hear your frustration. Let me just end with this and we'll be watching to see how she responds to some of this that will certainly be brought in front of her in a couple of hours. I want to talk about it. I want to end with Sean. He left behind a family, a wife, children. What do you want the world to know about Sean?

SMITH: Oh, God. He - he -- I'm sure he was -- he agreed to do whatever it is that they wanted him to do. I'm sure he volunteered, as they say, because this is the way he was. And like I had always told him, honey, just -- you don't choose it, it chooses you. It will find you and have you do what's necessary to do.

But the State Department stinks. When I was there at the ceremony for the Colin Powell ceremony, when Sean was elected into the Foreign Services Institute, Colin turned around to all the people that were there -- I was there, I know -- he turned around to everybody there and he says look, everybody, look at the people that are here on this stage graduating from the institute. I want you to know that these are my people and I will never, ever let you down. Turned around and looked at everybody and said, look at that person, that's the one that's going to be helping you, that's the one that's going to be there for you when you need help.

And guess what? Nobody was there. They even denied him -- why did they deny him the security that they asked for over eight times? And why did Hillary sit there and watch it on the - watch the drones go through and not do anything about it? And why did Obama go to Las Vegas to make his bets or whatever it is he did in Las Vegas to raise money, because that's his important thing.

BALDWIN: OK. OK.

SMITH: Why is (ph) all that? Why can't they just give me an answer on something? That would just - that would make me go away. But they won't do it. I'm angry (ph).

BALDWIN: Maybe they will. Maybe they will. Maybe they will.

SMITH: No, they won't. No, they won't. They want to save their ass.

BALDWIN: I hear your - I hear the question of why. Patricia Smith, I am so sorry for the loss of your son and I appreciate all the time you've given me quite candidly here live on TV. Thank you. And I am so sorry.

SMITH: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)