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Benghazi Suspect on Navy Ship to U.S.; Crisis in Iraq; GM CEO back on Capitol Hill

Aired June 18, 2014 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Does she know you practice every day after the show in the NEWSROOM, Chris?

CUOMO: Didn't work. Whatever I'm doing is not enough, Poppy.

HARLOW: I guess it's not. Too much fun you guys are having there, enjoyed it and you're a rock star right there, by the way.

Thanks so much, guys.

NEWSROOM starts right now.

Good morning, everyone. I'm Poppy Harlow in Washington, D.C. today. I'm in for Carol Costello. Thanks so much for joining me this morning. A lot of news to get to.

First off, right now, one of the men believed to be a mastermind of the deadly attack on the American consulate in Benghazi nearly two years ago is on a slow boat to the United States. Ahmed Abu Khattala is being transported by a U.S. Navy ship, not by air.

This is strategic. This is so that investigators can have the maximum amount of time to question him about the attack that led to the death of U.S. ambassador to Libya, Chris Stevens, and three others.

Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Ahmed Abu Khattala was lured to a location south of Benghazi, U.S. officials from multiple agencies tell CNN. Army Delta Force commandos, FBI and intelligence agencies were watching and waiting for days.

Khattala, a key operative in Ansar al-Sharia, the group the U.S. blames for the 2012 attack on the U.S. compound in Benghazi. Intelligence gleaned from local Libyans helped draw Khattala to the location. U.S. commandos captured him with no shots fired, no one getting hurt. A surprising feat, one former Libyan intelligence official tells CNN, because Khattala usual surrounded himself with guards.

U.S. commandos whisked him to a Navy ship in the Mediterranean to begin undergoing questioning for his role in the attack and anything else he knows about terrorist activity. Officially the Pentagon will say little.

REAR ADM. JOHN KIRBY, PENTAGON PRESS SECRETARY: I'm not going to get into specifics on the actual execution of the operation.

STARR: President Obama touted the capture.

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It's important for us to send a message to the world that when Americans are attacked, no matter how long it takes, we will find those responsible and we will bring them to justice.

STARR: But some wonder why it took so long, when journalists like CNN's Arwa Damon were able to find and talk to Khattala more than a year ago.

ARWA DAMON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We met with Ahmed Abu Khattala in public at the coffee shop of a well-known hotel here in Benghazi for around two hours. He seemed to be confident, his demeanor most certainly not that of a man who believed that he was going to be detained or targeted any time soon.

STARR: So how could CNN get to Khattala and it took U.S. commandos over a year to find him?

LT. COL. RICK FRANCONA, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: And in order to do this safely, effectively, efficiently, and nobody got hurt, by the way, that takes time to plan, that takes a lot of information gathering and we did this in a very stealthy way.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HARLOW: Joining me now to talk about all of it Barbara Starr at the Pentagon, along with chief national security correspondent, Jim Sciutto.

Good morning to both of you.

Barbara, let me get to you first, and you know how these operations work very well. What else do we know about the unit that captured Khattala?

STARR: Well, these were Army Delta Force commandos, along with the FBI, and Delta Force is part of one of the most secretive organizations in the United States military, a group called the Joint Special Operations Command. That includes Navy SEALs and other Special Operations commandos.

This command, this overall command, these are the guys that a few weeks ago walked right up to the Taliban and got Bowe Bergdahl back. These are the guys that went into Osama bin Laden's compound and killed him -- Poppy.

HARLOW: Yes, the most experienced. But, you know, the question has come up from the outset, minutes after this news broke yesterday. Why was CNN and other media outlets able to talk to Khattala, sit down with him in plain sight a year before the United States was able to capture him?

I want you to take a listen, Jim, this for you, to what State Department spokeswoman Jen Psaki told our Jake Tapper yesterday on "THE LEAD."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR, THE LEAD WITH JAKE TAPPER: Our own Arwa Damon found Abu Khattala in a coffee shop. He said he had not been contacted by any American investigators. Now earlier today, you were -- you called this irrelevant. But I'm not trying to be flip here, why did it take long to get him if journalists were able to find him more than a year ago?

JEN PSAKI, STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESWOMAN: Well, Jake, the factors that the president of the United States and the National Security team look at when they are about to undertake operations like this one are, is it ready to go and is it prepared to succeed? And what we're looking at here is this individual has now been detained and it was a successful operation.

We know there's ample precedent for journalists interviewing terrorists or other individuals, but there are a range of factors the United States government has to look at before taking action.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: You know, Jim, I remember talking to Arwa a year ago after she had done this interview and her talking about the fact that U.S. forces, you know, had not been in contact with Khattala at all.

Should it have taken a year? I know that the execution has to be carefully planned and you have to make sure there are no civilian casualties and there weren't, but should it have take this long?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Here what's military officials say, they say there's a difference between arranging an interview and taking someone by force into custody. This is a guy surrounded by armed gunmen. You have to expect a gun fight, although that didn't happen yesterday, arguably because the intelligence they used and they surprised him, but you also have to worry about civilian casualties.

A very different thing. The line from Admiral Kirby, the Pentagon spokesperson, yesterday was it's not like we can wait for him to go for a milk shake from McDonald's and pick him up in a taxi. I think there is some truth to that.

But in addition to that we're told by U.S. officials within -- over the last several months, Khattala changed his habits. He was not meeting in public with journalists anymore, he was concerned about his safety. And as a result of that he became a more difficult target.

HARLOW: Talking about the legal process, right, there has been some question about -- a few people questioning whether or not he'll go to Guantanamo. That was highly unlikely, although Senator McCain brought that up. He's going to go through the U.S. justice system, through the courts here, right, Jim?

SCIUTTO: That's right.

HARLOW: And what is that -- what's that process going to look like? How quickly can he get into court, get that trial started?

SCIUTTO: He is not going to Guantanamo, administration officials have made that very clear. They have made the point that they have not sent anybody new to Guantanamo since President Obama came into office. And in fact, he is trying to shut it down and get those prisoners out of there. So he is going to be tried in a U.S. district court here in Washington, D.C. He is facing three charges, at this point, though those could expand, one of them is killing someone in an attack on a federal facility and others providing material support to terrorist and the other is using a weapon in the prosecution of a crime.

That first one, killing someone in an attack on a federal facility, could carry the death penalty.

HARLOW: Right.

SCIUTTO: And so this is something that's going to move very quickly. He's going to take that slow boat to the U.S., but once he gets here, he is going to appear in court very quickly and what administration officials will say, they will cite past successes of using civilian courts to try to terrorists. For instance, you will remember the Times Square bomber successfully prosecuted. More recently, Osama bin Laden's nephew, successfully prosecuted.

HARLOW: Right. Exactly. And of course that slow boat key to see how much, if any, information they can get out of him that's a really big question in all of this, how much intelligence will come out.

But, Barbara, the Obama administration says this arrest is a statement to the world. Given all the fronts that this country is fighting terrorism on, what is your opinion? How big of a statement do you think that this really sends?

STARR: Well, you know, the whole Libya Benghazi attack stirred up an unending political firestorm.

HARLOW: Right.

STARR: Between Congress and the White House. So what the White House has certainly achieved here is saying that we got one of the key masterminds behind Benghazi. I think the question is exactly what Jim addressed. How much critical intelligence does Khattala really have at this point and if they can get it out of him, will it make a difference in the war on terror? Does he have current intelligence? Does he have any information that would really make a difference? That remains to be seen.

HARLOW: Right. And also someone who just months ago was willing to sit down with journalists and talk to them, not someone who was in hiding over the last two years or so since the attack. We'll see what happens. Appreciate the reporting from both of you this morning. Thank you.

Well, much of the firestorm following the Benghazi attack and the administration's handling of it has been directed at former secretary of state, Hillary Clinton. Last night, she faced that criticism head on, sitting down for a CNN hour-long town hall meeting prior to -- and also while promoting her book "Hard Choices."

Clinton admitted that she isn't satisfied with the answers that have been uncovered so far.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, FORMER SECRETARY OF STATE: There are answers, not all of them, not enough, frankly. I'm still looking for answers because it was a confusing and difficult time. But I would hope that every American would understand, number one, why we were there because we need to be in dangerous place, and number two, that we're doing the best we can to find out what happened and I hope that fair-minded people will look at that seriously.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: What specifically do you still not know?

CLINTON: There's a lot we don't know, Christiane. Because now that we have Khattala in custody, hopefully, we will learn more, at least from his perspective. The reason it takes long is to put together cases, which is what the FBI and other law enforcement agencies were doing. They have to piece it together, just as we started piecing it together on the night of the attack.

We want to know who was behind it, what the motivation of the leaders and the attackers happen to be. There are still some unanswered questions. It was, after all, the fog of war. But I'm absolutely convinced that the United States and all of our various agencies, with all of our professionals, including the Congress, is, you know, piecing together the best information we can find.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: We are going to have more on Clinton's town hall last night including what Hillary Clinton's possible presidential run might look like, if she does, indeed, decide to run. And what would her presidency look like if she gets elected. That is coming up later here in the hour.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Breaking News.

HARLOW: I want to bring you this breaking news just out to us coming out of Iraq. Due to increasing threats of violence, here's what we know. Oil giant, ExxonMobil, is carrying out a major evacuation of its staff from the region. That is coming to us according to Reuters. Exxon has branch offices in both Baghdad and Basra.

BP, that other oil giant, also reportedly evacuating some 20 percent of its staff over concerns about workers' safety there. Of course this comes on the heels of the news that Iraq's government

and their troops have repelled a siege on Iraq's largest oil refinery, that is just north of Baghdad, which at one point, terrorists had taken control of.

It underscores the global reliance on the region's oil supply, which is now at a nine-month high when you look at prices. Today, President Obama later on this afternoon will meet with congressional leaders to discuss and debate the crisis in Iraq. What, if any, the U.S. response should and will be. There seems to be very little agreement on what role, if any, the U.S. should play in stopping the terrorists' bloody march toward Baghdad and the politics grow uglier.

In today's "Wall Street Journal," former vice president, Dick Cheney, rips Obama's handling of Iraq from the troop pullout to today's indecisiveness. In that op-ed, Cheney and his daughter, Liz, write, quote, "Rarely has a U.S. president been so wrong about so much at the expense of so many."

We're going to discuss that in depth shortly. First, though, I want to get straight to Anderson Cooper. He is on the ground in Baghdad.

Anderson, when you look at where the terrorists are they are less than 40 miles away, 37 miles to be exact, we believe, from where you are. Just coming out from Nuri al-Maliki there, a statement on television talking about the fact that he says the Iraq government, his soldiers, are on the rebound. He says they have absorbed the initial shock of military operations, calling this a catastrophe, not a defeat.

What is your sense on the ground there? Is that how it feels? Does it feel as though a corner has been turned?

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR, ANDERSON COOPER 360: Well, you know, it's interesting, in his statements, in his weekly address, he said that it wasn't really a military defeat, it was a problem of political stalemate. That's what he said was the problem over the last several days. And as you said, he said Iraqi forces are on the rebound.

There is not really sign of that. I would be very cautious, you know, you said earlier that the oil refinery in Baiji was back in the Iraqi government's hands. I would be very cautious on that.

HARLOW: Right.

COOPER: That's based on a statement made by the Iraqi government in the last several days. They have made a number of statements in the battle of the Tal Afar. That they were still in control of Tal Afar. It turned out they weren't.

So that may be wishful thinking on the part of Iraqi security forces, Iraqi government. We simply don't know who's in full control of the oil refinery up in Baiji. We know the entire area is under control of ISIS forces and they have been laying siege to that oil refinery. It's the largest oil refinery up in the north. It would be a major blow to this regime and certainly, they are trying to contradict a number of local reports from the area, saying that that refinery is actually in the hands of ISIS at this point.

So we're going to have to wait and see exactly who's in control of that but we have not seen large-scale victories on the part of Iraqi forces. Certainly, we have known over the last 24 hours there has been intense fighting in the city of Baqubah. ISIS and Sunni militant forces said to be in the western part of that city. They briefly took over a police station, took all the weapons from that station and then moved back into western parts of Baqubah. So, it may be wishful thinking on Nuri al Maliki's part to say that the momentum is now in the hands of the Iraqi government. We'll have to see what happens over the next several days.

HARLOW: And that brings up such an important point. I mean, you interviewed former British Prime Minister Tony Blair last night, and I was watching it, Anderson, and you asked him repeatedly if he thought that Nuri al-Maliki is able to do the political work to unite Iraq. Again, and Tony Blair frankly didn't know. He said if he's not able to, if someone else needs to. So in many ways, this is politics for Nuri al Maliki, trying to hang on to his country and being able to unite it there.

And so your caution about listening to the words of the Iraqi government is a good one. What is your sense from people that you're speaking to in the streets? Do they believe al Maliki can lead them through this?

COOPER: You know, there is a -- there is a grace in Baghdad, there is a sense of certainly optimism. There's a lot of fear, there's a lot of concern, but this is a largely Shia city, there is a sense that they are drawing a line, that Baghdad itself will not fall. We've seen tens of thousands of volunteers. Heeding the call of religious figures here. Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani who called for people to take up arms to defend Iraq, largely Sunni -- Shia volunteers.

And so there is a sense that Baghdad itself will be able to withstand, that as ISIS forces get closer to the capital, they'll be -- they are fighting in more Shia-dominated areas and those areas, Shias there are going to be more likely to stand up and fight. So there is a sense of confidence, but the question of will they be able to retake some of the areas that have already fallen, and that is a very open question.

HARLOW: Yes, and whether this will become a divided country, especially given how much financing and funding they now have from the banks that they've looted, the gold that they have, I mean this is a very well-funded and growing operation. Appreciate the report live from Baghdad this morning -- Anderson. Thank you.

Still to come here in the NEWSROOM, General Motors' CEO Mary Barra back on Capitol Hill, back in the hot seat. In less than an hour, lawmakers set to grill her about why the country waited more than a decade to address a deadly ignition switch defect.

Meanwhile, happening right now, family members of crash victims holding their own news conference. We will dig deeper, straight ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: Well, General Motors CEO Mary Barra facing more tough questions on Capitol Hill. In less than an hour, she will testify about GM's handling of an ignition switch defect that has been linked to at least 13 deaths. GM knew about this problem for over a decade but they did not do anything about it until this year. An internal report found a corporate culture that discouraged the flow of bad news. Meanwhile, victims' families right now -- that is a live press conference happening on the Hill, victims' families at their own press conference.

I want you to take a moment to listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CANDICE ANDERSON, WITNESS: My name is Candice Anderson, and I'm a survivor of the GM ignition defect. So many families have been affected by GM's negligence.

November 15th of 2004, I was at the wheel of a 2004 Saturn Iron that veered off the road and struck a tree, killing my best friend Gene M. Erikson. For the better part of two years, I've carried this unnecessary guilt that I was the cause of Michael's death, that I was the cause of a mother to lose her own son so tragically, that I was the cause of two innocent girls to cry for their dad who will never come home.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Now joining me from New York, chief business correspondent, Christine Romans, also from the New York Stock Exchange, CNN business correspondent, Alison Kosik.

And, you know, we've all been covering this really closely. General Motors just put out this internal investigation done by former U.S. attorney, Anton Valukas, that was scathing. Over 300 pages saying there was a culture of negligence, of incompetence and she told employees, I never want you to forget this, because this is not how GM should operate.

Christine, she is saying, vowing that this is a new General Motors that will never do anything like this again. What does she have to say to lawmakers on the hill today to convince them and the -- and the American public of this?

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: And, you know, Poppy, I think that report, that Anton Valukas report, should be a required reading for anybody who has a company, big or small.

HARLOW: Yes.

ROMANS: Because it is withering what was going on inside that company. The GM nod, meaning people looking around saying, yes, nodding them fix it and no one actually doing it. Really, really damning stuff. What she has to do tell them, Poppy, is she's got to show this committee that, in fact, they understand what the problems were in the company and they are fixing it going forward.

I mean, listen real quickly to -- just briefly the tone from the last time she stood before these people, stood before Congress, she couldn't really say much because there was an investigation. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARY BARRA, GM CEO: We are doing a full and complete investigation. That's why we are doing this investigation. That is part of the investigation that we're doing. The investigation will tell us that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMANS: And she has got to answer some very serious questions, like why did they even build this faulty ignition switch in the first place?

HARLOW: Right.

ROMANS: Why did they change a part number in -- not change -- you know, change a part without changing the part number in 2006.

HARLOW: So people didn't know. Right.

ROMANS: Well, how was this allowed to go on? And she's going to have to be very careful because you have all of these people whose lives have been affected by this. So it's a very serious situation with lives lost.

HARLOW: Yes, and let's not forget the fact that this is GM's investigation. Granted they've got in a former U.S. attorney to do this independently who had full access, I'm told, to all documents, all employees, no restrictions. However, the Department of Justice is still investigating. There's a criminal probe going on. And Congress is still investigating. So this isn't the end of the road for General Motors.

Alison, what is so interesting is the business side of this. The fact that GM stock has not been harmed that much, frankly, since the majority of these recalls came, that GM sales are the best they've been in years, even after just Friday and Monday, we got millions more recalls for an ignition switch problem. What's going on?

ALISON KOSIK, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, you mentioned the stock, the stop hasn't been heard at all. I mean, you saw GM shares take a hit, down 4 percent since the recall started but they made up ground. Now those shares are up 2.6 percent for the year. You know this company is beginning to look like Teflon. I mean, this is a GM that bounced back from bankruptcy and even as these recalls come almost on a weekly base circumstance the company, as you said, just had its best May in seven years.

HARLOW: Right.

KOSIK: Sales up 13 percent from a year ago. I know it sounds crazy, but the funny thing is that these recalls could actually wind up boosting sales because you get more people strolling through the show room as they go and bring their cars in for repairs and they say, hmm, I'm going to go buy that car. Then you've got some people who bring their cars in for repairs and they take those loaners and they say, you know what, I like this loaner better, could I go ahead and buy this loaner instead?

One thing that's not being advertised, Poppy, is that GM is also offering steep discounts to owners of cars recalled because of the ignition switch defect.

HARLOW: Right.

KOSIK: So this all kinds up piling on for sales. One other thing to keep in mind, analysts are saying that GM at this point, it's got a really strong product pipeline that over -- that its overall auto demand is robust. These are reasons why you're seeing sales really holding in there.

HARLOW: That's an important point to make, I mean, that pent-up demand to buy cars for years since the -- you know, downturn in the crisis, people are finally spending money. This isn't just yes, I'm doing well, this is the industry doing well. But, interesting, guys, that people are still really trusting GM and buying those -- buying those cars.

Appreciate the reporting this morning, Christine and Allison. Thanks so much.

Still to come here in the NEWSROOM, the crisis in Iraq and the cauldron of debate that is reaching a tipping point. We're going to look at the political and military equations and what Washington is considering doing. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: This morning major developments in Iraq. We are learning that ExxonMobil, that oil giant, is reportedly evacuating staff in its branch offices that are located in Basra and also in Baghdad. We also are learning that BP is also evacuating about 20 percent of its staff from that area right now.

Well, this comes as we're hearing from Iraq's government that its forces wrestled back -- they are saying wrestle back control of the nation's largest oil refinery. At one point, earlier in the day, it had been reported that terrorists had reportedly seized more of that site. That would have pushed up oil prices obviously still very volatile there. Oil prices still at a nine-month high right now.

Also former vice president ratcheting up his criticism of the Obama administration's handling of all of this. We'll take a look at Liz and Dick Cheney's op-ed in the "Wall Street Journal."