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Explosions in Gaza City; Hamas Strike

Aired July 28, 2014 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Hi there. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Let's begin where Wolf left off there, this new outbreak of Mideast violence has claimed more young victims. Gaza's health ministry today says 10 people died in this explosion at a refugee camp. Eight of the 10, children. The IDF, the Israel Defense Forces, say the blast and a near simultaneous explosion at a Gaza hospital that wounded two people were both caused by misfired rockets launched by Hamas militants. But Hamas, and witnesses inside the refugee camp, they disagree. They blame Israel for those blasts.

And you have these ongoing diplomatic squabbles over cease-fire terms and time limits. Form (ph) a backdrop to the violent reality playing out on the ground. Rockets flying into Israel, air strikes in Gaza, and no easy or obvious way to end the violence. U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry says he will continue working toward a cease-fire.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN KERRY, SECRETARY OF STATE: Any process to resolve the crisis in Gaza in a lasting and meaningful way must lead to the disarmament of Hamas and all terrorist groups. And we will work closely with Israel, and regional partners, and the international community in support of this goal.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Just last hour, we learned from Israeli media that four Israelis have been killed and at least six other wounded in a mortar attack near the Gaza border. Before this new report, Israel had confirmed that 43 of its soldiers have died in this conflict, along with three Israeli civilians. Meantime, the death toll in Gaza has climbed above 1,000. The United Nations says about 70 percent of the people killed there have been civilians.

CNN's Karl Penhaul is standing by for us live in Gaza.

And, Karl, you have just returned, I know, from this refugee camp where the explosion killed those kids we were just talking about. Tell me what you saw.

KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Brooke, before I bring you to that, I want to bring you another piece of information we're just getting from our producers, from the rest of the team here on the ground. Things could be about to take a turn for the worse. To Palestinian cell phones and SMS text messages being sent right now. It is signed IDF. It is warning Palestinians, stay in your homes. Do not go out. This is the first time that we've had an SMS message of that type in the last three weeks. The first time that we have had a blanket message to Palestinian cell phones telling the people of Gaza to stay home.

Now, that has been combined in the last hour or so with a lot of fire. You may see that over my shoulder. You may see some illumination flares coming down through the night sky. We have seen what appear to be tank rounds flashing across the sky. Some red trace rounds as well. I'm not sure, you might have another picture as well of the Gaza skyline. So it could be that the fighting here is about to get much worse, and that comes also -- we have also heard from the Israeli military that once again Gaza militants have tried to burrow through their tunnels into Israeli territory to stage attacks there. We don't know what the outcome of that is, but, of course, we'll bring you it when we have -- again, the sound of artillery firing across in eastern Gaza.

BALDWIN: We hear it.

PENHAUL: Not sure if you managed to hear that. But certainly action is going on. This could be a long night. And it could be a long night after a horrible afternoon.

About an hour and a half ago, I and the rest of the crew got back from the Beach Camp area of Gaza. It's called a refugee camp, but they've been living there for so long it's like a normal -- again, more artillery fire coming out. I'll carry on because that kind of fire is going to be going on for some time. But an area of central Gaza, north central Gaza anyway called the Beach Camp. And that is where more kids have been killed. One of their grandfathers was killed, as well. The Palestinian Health Authority tells us eight children, two adults, were killed in an explosion.

As you rightly say, the Israeli military saying that this was a misfire from a Hamas rocket. We have heard that explanation before. Hamas turns around and says, no, this was an Israeli air strike or an Israeli missile. We've heard that explanation before. The ones who aren't going to hear this explanation, the kids whose blood got spilled on the street. They were out there playing. Today is the Ede (ph) holiday. It's the holiday that marks the end of Ramadan. It was a group of friends, a bunch of friends, next door neighbors, playing in the street there. It's a street about 15 yards wide. They were playing toy guns. It's a game they call here doom (ph) doom (ph). And as we were there in the street trying to find out what happened, the body of one of those young kids was brought home so his mother could kiss him goodbye before he was taken off for burial.

And I said to his next door neighbor, tell me something about these kids. I don't just want to hear the number of kids that have died. And she said, with the permission of her father, she says, I'll try to be brave. I want to tell you about Mohamed (ph). She said he's six years old. He looked like a big six to me. And he was top of his class at math. And he's a huge sports fan. He was a Barcelona futbol fan. Lionel Messi, his hero. And the little girl looked at me. She said, he loved Lionel Messi, you know. And Lionel Messi for him was an amazing player, the top player in the world. That was Mohamed. He died there on the street, along with seven of his buddies, a couple of adults, as well.

And we're seeing this now day after day. And as you're hearing through the night now, blasts going off there in the distance. And just to bring you up to date, this text message now purportedly signed from the Israeli military telling the people of Gaza to stay home. Could be a long night, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Karl, let me just stay with -- as you're describing this young boy's story, he of the eight children who were killed, I know you are unfazed by this artillery fire. And your background, we have, just to tell you, a huge picture of up. These are live pictures over the night sky there in Gaza. It's after 9:00 p.m. your time. And I just want to stay on these pictures. How often have you been hearing this artillery fire? And I know we've talked before where you've discussed these illumination flares for the IDF, presumably, to come in, to see what they're about to target. Can you explain to all of us what we are seeing?

PENHAUL: Yes. Stay on that big picture, Brooke, and with your permission I'm going to turn around so I can tell you a little bit more of what I'm seeing. Those illumination flares have now seemed to have either dropped behind a cloud or fallen to the ground. Typically over the last few days and the last couple of weeks, what the Israeli military's been doing is using those flares to guide their soldiers, perhaps guide their tanks into positions inside the Gaza Strip. That might mean the final phase of a maneuver. They may also pop those illumination flares up so that they can target something on the ground.

And we do know that Hamas and the other militant factions have been trying to draw the Israeli troops into ambushes to fight them guerilla style on the ground. And, of course, the military's aim here is to destroy the rocket launchers which are still being fired and also to destroy these militant tunnels, which are still being used, even this afternoon. We've had reports by the Israeli military of another infiltration attempt.

Again, up there now, I can just see another of those illumination flares twinkling. And it's funny, you know, there's a black humor here in Gaza. Yesterday marked the end of Ramadan. Today is the first day of Ede, the Ramadan holiday. And what people of Gaza were describing these illumination rounds as were Ramadan lanterns, because during Ramadan it's typical to have a lantern, possibly a candle or a little bulb inside to light the way. And the people of Gaza, with their black humor, have to put up with this and they're saying those are the Ramadan lanterns. Thanks to the Israelis, they're giving us the Ramadan lanterns.

As I say, in addition to those illumination flares, we've also seen in the distance some large trace of flares. They're too large to be bullets. It looks like there may be some artillery rounds with trace rounds. So that essentially marks the way to see if they're targeting the correct target. A lot of big booms, to be honest. Sometimes you can't really tell what they are, although our colleague, Atika Shubert, who's just across the other side of the border in Israel, said that she saw some big Israeli guns firing up and firing into Gaza. Across on that eastern border, of course, we know that they've got their main battle tanks and their carver tanks, and we also know that they've got what are called M-109s, their self-propelled field guns - some big guns to fire artillery. And over on the coast of Gaza, as well, there are still Israeli battleships there. Not sure that I've heard any rounds coming in from the sea just yet. But certainly a lot of action going on now that night has fallen, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Karl Penhaul, thank you so much for your reporting. Please stay close to the camera, as we could be coming to you intermittently as we're watching these illumination flares, artillery fire, as you've been describing for us, over the night sky, just after 9:00 p.m. there in Gaza City. Karl, thank you. As the violence and the volleys continue on both sides.

We're going to stay with this breaking story as -- as many sides, including U.S. Secretary of State, John Kerry, we heard from him again today, hoping, praying, for Mideast peace, praying for a cease fire, a permanent cease fire. CNN will be right back.

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BALDWIN: Let's come up with some live pictures here as we've been watching the night sky, 9:13 at night in Gaza City. Listening to hear - if I can see anything. We've been watching and talking to our reporter there who has been describing now this warning from Israeli defense forces, the IDF, to Palestinians in Gaza, take shelter. This is what they're getting via text messages. You've heard of the rooftop knocks and the dropping of leaflets of papers of warning. Now we're hearing of text messages, which is a first. Karl Penhaul was reporting in about three weeks.

All the while we have been watching these illumination flares lighting up the night sky, artillery fire. Ramadan is over. This is the beginning of Ede. And it could be the beginning of much more to come as far as violence is concerned.

And you have U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry. We heard him just today saying this, lock in a cease-fire. And if -- when it crumbles, restore it, restore it again and again if necessary. And in the meantime, try to address the life and death concerns that have pushed each side here into war.

All right. So then which concerns precisely? CNN political analyst Josh Rogin is with us here. He is also with "The Daily Beast," their senior national security correspondent.

Josh, and let me just get right into Hamas and the people it represents in the Gaza Strip, their concerns. Look at the map here because we'll see this tiny strip here on the left side of the screen. This is Gaza. That is Hamas. And their number one concern appears to be the Israeli blockade. Can you just -- the blockade, what exactly is the blockade, what are we talking about here?

JOSH ROGIN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Sure. Sure. As we saw in Secretary of State John Kerry's draft proposal for a cease-fire late Friday, there are several things that Hamas wants. Chief amongst them is the opening of border crossings. Two border crossings that enter into Israel and one that enters into Egypt. That would allow them to flow humanitarian aid to the people suffering in Gaza, but it would also allow them to start to rebuild their economy and start the flow of humanitarian assistance and economic assistance back as part of a final cease-fire. This is the number one Hamas demand.

John Kerry was trying to find a way to pitch this to the Israeli's. Of course, the Israeli's rejected this demand. They're not about to open these border crossings until they feel that the tunnel situation has been resolved. They believe that can take one week, two weeks, maybe even three weeks more. So that's why -- at least partially why they rejected Kerry's draft proposal last week.

BALDWIN: Let's talk about the tunnel situation because you have these smuggling tunnels that Israel has been blowing up. They're clearly used to bring in weapons, as the Israeli's allege. But also, Josh, you know, they're used for, what, food and water, et cetera, for the people of Gaza.

ROGIN: Right. What's clear is that these tunnels were much more extensive, much longer, much better infrastructure and many more of them than the Israeli's believed when they started this operation. They're used for all sorts of things, including nefarious contraband. The bottom line here is that the Israelis want to be sure that every tunnel is taken care of before they sign any cease-fire whatsoever.

BALDWIN: Taken care of. Bombed.

ROGIN: Bombed, destroyed, accounted for, exactly. They're in the middle of that.

What's interesting is that part of the Kerry proposal and part of what the secretary of state was telling the Israelis was that they would be able to continue working on the tunnels during the cease-fire. It wasn't clear exactly how that would work. During previous cease-fires, the Israeli defense forces have stayed in the tunnels, have continued working to destroy the tunnels. But the Israeli's didn't believe - the Israeli government didn't believe that they could take care of the tunnels during the cease-fire to their satisfaction. So this was one out of many gaps between the Kerry proposal and what the Israeli government wanted.

Now that the violence has started again, as your reporters on the ground have shown -

BALDWIN: Yes.

ROGIN: It seems that John Kerry's remarks of only an hour ago have been overtaken by events. The temporary cease-fires that he's pushing for to lead to a permanent cease-fire will have to wait no matter what he wants, no matter what the United States government wants. It's clear that the Israelis have decided that this is going to continue on a military level. Of course Hamas has never really abided by the cease-fire in the first place. So this violence will continue. And John Kerry will be pushing for the cease-fire. But this doesn't seem like he's going to get his way any time soon.

BALDWIN: So we were talking about the wants with Hamas. We talked about the blockade, the border crossings from Israel and also from Egypt. But let's talk now about the concerns, the priorities among Israelis. We know that their top concern when they launched the attacks on Gaza two weeks ago today, by the way, were the rocket attacks. They wanted to stop these rocket attacks on Israel that, you know, over the years have become increasingly menacing. Do you think that's still the Israeli objective and their number-one concern, vis- a-vis Gaza, vis-a-vis Hamas?

ROGIN: No, it's clear that since the operation began, the Israeli government has been very clear, telling everybody, reporters, the U.S. government, anyone who will listen really, that their top concern has now shifted from the rockets, which are largely contained, not totally contained but largely contained by the Iron Dome missile defense system, to the tunnels, because the tunnels were so much more extensive than they thought and because they see the danger from the tunnels as much more dangerous than the threat of the rockets, now the focus is the tunnels. It's also a way for the Israeli government to justify continued operations for the next two or three weeks, despite calls from the international community, including the United Nations, for an immediate cease-fire. The Israelis say that these tunnels were planning to be used for a massive attack, a coordinated attack, on Israel proper, and that that attack was thwarted by these operations. They will not, cannot, have pledged and said publicly and privately, that they won't agree to any cessation of hostilities until they feel confident these tunnels have been dealt with. Now, the rockets are another problem, but they are now secondary to the tunnels, according to Israeli officials.

BALDWIN: OK. Josh Rogin, thank you so much, from Washington for us.

ROGIN: You bet.

BALDWIN: Much more on our special coverage in just a moment, including, we'll take you live. This -- we're talking about the tunnels, more on the tunnels, more on this tense situation actually inside Israel. We're just hearing from our reporter on the scene there.

Plus, the crash site of Malaysian Air Flight 17, it is still not secure. More than a week since that plane was taken down. Dozens of investigators turned away today. Despite that, somehow the parents of one victim made their way through. We'll show you what happened as they walked among the remains.

And two Americans infected with Ebola, a virus that kills 90 percent of its victims. Stay with me.

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BALDWIN: Coming up are these live night pictures over Gaza, as we have heard from our reporter there on the ground, reports of blanket text messages sent from Israeli Defense Forces to the people of Gaza to stay home, presumably a heads up of violence to come here. All of this as there is a tense situation in Israeli. Our Atika Shubert is standing by, joining me on the phone.

Atika, tell me were exactly you are, first of all.

ATIKA SHUBERT, CNN CORRESPONDENT (via telephone): Well, I'm actually near the Gaza/Israel border. And I'm actually on that main highway that's been blocked off for most people. And the reason it's been blocked off is because - well, two reasons, actually. A mortar attack actually killed several people in that area near Kabutberi (ph), injured a number of others. I think we're still trying to get the final details on that. But this would be one of the deadliest attacks we've had on this side of the border since Operation Protective Edge started.

But also near that area, a number of infiltrations have been reported. In fact, the Israel Defense Forces has confirmed that they foiled one attempt by Hamas militants to come - to infiltrate under the border and come up near the communities there. So we've been seeing a lot -

BALDWIN: Are you referring through the tunnels? Forgive me for jumping in. When you say infiltration --

SHUBERT: Yes, exactly the tunnels that they burrow under -

BALDWIN: Got it.

SHUBERT: To infiltrate to the Israeli side. So it's been very tense. They've blocked off a number of the highways and roads leading to that area. There's a lot more security now in this area. And it does seem like they are now mobilizing for more military activity in Gaza. I saw a number of tanks lined up in formation and rounds and rounds of artillery being fired in the direction of Gaza City and Kaninas (ph), in the southern Gaza Strip. So it does look like there's a significant escalation of fighting now into the night.

BALDWIN: So just to clarify, and you may very well not know, but when we talk about one of the deadliest incidents in Israel, there have been reports that several of the fatalities are IDF soldiers. Do we know definitively whether that is the case?

SHUBERT: We don't know exactly what this mortar hit, if they are soldiers or civilians.

BALDWIN: OK.

SHUBERT: But the fact that a mortar -- this is the first time we've seen such high casualties from a mortar strike on this side of the border. And so that's what I mean when I say one of the deadliest incidents on the Israeli side. And the reaction, as we have seen, has been multiple artilleries firing into Gaza Strip now. And what it looks like to be -- looks like to be a much bigger escalation into several neighborhoods around Gaza City.

BALDWIN: Back to your point, Atika, about the infiltration, about these members of Hamas burrowing through the tunnels trying to get into Israel. And we're talking to Josh Rogin who said really the priority from Israel as far as Gaza and Hamas is considered is to destroy those tunnels. How many tunnels are they, the tunnels specifically from Egypt into Gaza? And do we have any idea how many have been hit?

SHUBERT: We know that they have found at least 34 of these tunnels. And when I say tunnels, these are the maybe tunnel shafts. And these are tunnels going from Gaza into Israel, quite often. And though -- but these are the main shafts. They're (INAUDIBLE) -- they're cement. And you can stand in them. They've got electricity running through them. And what often happens is these are the main shafts, but then you have these sort of smaller tunnels branching out from it. And often these are the smaller tunnels where they're able to branch into the Israeli side of the border.

And these tunnels are being used, according to the IDF, not only to infiltrate, but also to store weapons. They're used as command centers. In some cases even used to -- as rocket launching areas. So these - it's a quite sophisticated tunnel system. And it's been described to me as a -- an underground city, underneath Gaza, that stretches sometimes into Israel for infiltration.

BALDWIN: OK. I know Wolf Blitzer had a chance to take a look at one of the tunnels. We'll talk to him about what he saw, how small but how complex and how long they are at the top of the next hour. Atika Shubert, thank you so much for joining me there on the phone with word of that mortar attack on the Israeli side.

Meantime happening, live in Washington, D.C., it is actually something you don't see very often because at this event you have Susan Rice, House Speaker John Boehner, they are in agreement of something. They are both showing their support, from either side of the aisle, when it comes to Israel. We'll take you there live.

Plus, as I mentioned, Wolf Blitzer, he gets an inside look at the tunnels we were just discussing, these tunnels Hamas militants are using to get in and out of Israel. We'll talk to Wolf, see what it was like, coming up.

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