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Former Reagan White House Press Secretary James Brady Dies; Both Israel, Hamas Say Media Portraying Them Unfairly; Mudslide Traps 500 Kids at Camp Site; "Chicagoland" Student Shot

Aired August 04, 2014 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Just past the bottom of the hour. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Want to pass on news just in at CNN. Gun control advocates are mourning one of their movement's heroes. Former White House press secretary, James Brady, has died. Brady served under President Ronald Reagan. And back in 1981, he was nearly killed. He was wounded during that assassination attempt on President Reagan. That attack left Brady permanently disabled and turned him into a passionate supporter of gun control. In 1993, Congress passed a gun control law known simply as the Brandy Bill. James Brady was 73 years old.

And Brian Stelter, CNN senior media correspondent, host of "Reliable Sources," joining me to talk about this.

So many people, having covered too many school shootings and issues involving guns, we have heard a lot from specifically the Brady campaign to prevent gun violence.

BRIAN STELTER, CNN SENIOR MEDIA CORRESPONDENT & CNN HOST, RELIABLE SOURCES: And when we have seen mass shootings more recently -- I think it was after the Gabby Giffords shooting in Tucson -- he said been there, know that. She has become a crusader for the same issue.

But I found it very telling as stories come out about James Brady. Some of the headlines have said former White House press secretary dies. Many others said gun control advocate dies. He'll be remembered for his advocacy work. He wasn't in the press secretary role very long. Even though, or even so, Josh Earnest, current White House press secretary, said this afternoon, he thinks James Brady revolutionized the job. And there is a plaque in the briefing room, now the Brady Briefing Room, commemorating him.

BALDWIN: That's right.

We have David Gergen on the phone, a former Reagan adviser.

David Gergen, as we learn of James Brady's passing, tell me about him.

DAVID GERGEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST & FORMER REAGAN ADVISOR (voice-over): It was a very sad moment. I had the privilege of working with Jim way back when in the Reagan administration when he was the press secretary. And I was supposed to be with him that day, and therefore the grace of God, I stayed back for a meeting. That isn't the point. The point is he was a very fine press secretary. He was responsive to the press. And he also understood that he always -- when he came in to his meetings, he would always say give me some raisins. I have to give some raisins to the press.

(LAUGHTER)

I have to give them something they can enjoy and taste.

And the day of the Reagan shooting, the rest of us gathered in the situation room. I remember vividly when the report came in from the Secret Service he actually died in surgery, that Jim had died in surgery. And Frank Reynolds went on the air with ABC to say he died, because that's what the report was. It was hard. And then we learned, thank God, he had lived. But it was a traumatic moment. We said a prayer for him in the situation room. His daughter was on the way to the Denver Airport when she heard on the radio she had died. And you can imagine how traumatic that was for her. So those were very searing moments.

And the remarkable thing is that Jim not only didn't die, but he went on to serve this country in a very honorable way. That he and Sarah, his wife, you know, became crusaders for gun control. I think they did an enormous amount of good for helping people understand just how wounding guns can be in the hands of the wrong people.

It's appropriate that the pressroom is named after Jim and the White House and the West Wing. And it was less the idea that he revolutionized it, but he stood for the best of what the press corps was. And President Reagan always treasured and thanked him. And I think generations have remembered him well.

BALDWIN: I'm glad you brought up his wife, Sarah. I would have asked you about that. They too -- it wasn't just Jim Brady, but he and his wife both crusaders when it comes to guns in this country.

And just quickly, we have gotten a statement from the campaign: "We're heartbroken over the passing of James Brady. We offer our deepest condolences to his wife, Sarah, and the rest of his family as we mourn the loss of our dear friend and true American hero."

David Gergen, thank you so much.

And, Brian Stelter, stick around. We have another conversation after this break.

Again, a reminder, James Brady, former press secretary to Ronald Reagan, passing away at the age of 73.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Israel and Hamas agree on virtually nothing. But both sides say the world's news media are portraying them unfairly. We heard a few minutes ago from the political leader of Hamas sitting down with Nic Robertson, accusing reporters of adopting what he called the Israeli narrative. But on the flip side, supporters of Israel couldn't disagree more. They say the lack of context skews the public's perception of what's really going on.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEE HABEEB, COLUMNIST, NATIONAL REVIEW ONLINE: Look, where I think the media is complicit is in context contextualizing this entire problem. There is a monster in the room, not an elephant. It's Hamas and it's radical jihad, it's ISIS.

In Mosul, for the first time in 1600 years, there is not a Christian mass. Christians are being driven all over the Middle East away from their homes, killed, executed, asked to renounce their faith.

And I think presenting this story as a story of the Hatfields and McCoys, as a moral equivalence between Israel and Hamas is a tragedy and fatal error by the media. These are Nazis, Hamas. They're making live miserable for the people of Gaza.

I think the world will know, ultimately, down the road, that radical Islam is the problem, whether it's Hamas, whether it's ISIS, whether it's al Qaeda. And presenting this is a case of moral equivalence is a tragedy. And I just wonder in the newsrooms of America and the world, are you wondering, are you pausing to reflect, upon the idea that maybe you're being used as dupes by very evil regimes to make the case that Israel and Hamas are the same, that they have the same world vision, that they have the same visions for their citizens and their people?

I'd ask this. Where would you rather be a woman or someone who is gay, Israel or anywhere else in the Middle East?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: So he penned that column, for "National Review." And we wanted to use the column as a spring board to this discussion.

Bringing back Brian Stelter, our CNN senior media correspondent, host of "Reliable Sources"; also we have Ben Wallace-Wells, a contributor at "New York" magazine.

Gentlemen, welcome to both of you.

Ben, let me begin with you.

To his point, he was very blunt in his ways, saying we, members of Western media, are complicit in the murder of these women, of these children, in Gaza. But I have to say, as a member of the media, we are not going to stop covering civilian deaths.

BENJAMIN WALLACE-WELLS, CONTRIBUTING EDITOR, NEW YORK MAGAZINE: Right. I think that there's a kind of displacement problem. He's using an argument about the media to make a broader argument about the Middle East, that, you know, maybe has some place somewhere. But not here. Look, the reason that the coverage has looked so stark from an Israeli

point of view is that the war looks pretty stark. You know, the iconic images that we have seen from this war over the last three, three-and-a-half weeks now, they're all more or less the same thing. They're all of Palestinian civilians being killed by Israeli attacks. They're all of the aftermath of that. That is -- you know, you can blame the media for that. The fact of the matter is that, you know, there are way, way, way many times more civilian casualties on the Palestinian side than overall Israeli casualties. Barely any Israeli casualties at all. So I think it's possible to make an argument about the media here. But what that guy was doing was not making an argument about the media. He was making an argument about the Middle East.

BALDWIN: I think -- Stelter, looking at you, we try to do our due diligence and point out that when we report the different numbers, both on the Israeli side and within Gaza, we try to say, OK, this number of civilians and this number -- members of Hamas killed. I'm wondering at the same time even if in general coverage of this war is different. I don't know if it's H.D. cameras, more correspondence on the ground in Gaza City, showing the bloodshed. But it seems, comparing this to previous conflicts, it's a tad different.

STELTER: I think the number of correspondents in Gaza is significant. And I think the even more significant factor is social media. Even if those correspondents weren't there, Palestinians themselves can and are telling their own story. The #Gazaunderattack is on Twitter to see these images. Oftentimes, much gorier than we would show on television, because we think about young and older viewers at home. On Twitter, Facebook, on the web in general, you can see images so raw from their perspective.

What you can't see in these pictures and where I think these columnists sometimes are raising -- important points, is that we don't know, and we can't see the reasons for those attacks. What we're not seeing are the Hamas militants that are killed in these attacks. Those images are very, very hard, if not impossible to get, because they're either underground or in other places in hiding. That's what we're not seeing.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: -- mosques and schools.

STELTER: Schools, even. We're not seeing. And that makes it so hard to cover. And that's why I have a lot of sympathy for reporters who are there, not to mention the danger they're in. It's a very hard story to cover because of what we can't see.

BALDWIN: Could it be, though, Ben -- multiple people I've talked to on this show using the -- making the point that it is -- Hamas using Western media to help with their P.R. strategy for lack of a better way of putting it. At the same time, you could say Israel. Look at all the different -- there is a spokesperson for every single different department, you know, always ready, willing and able to come on TV. Not to mention, IDF releasing -- because we know it's visual media on TV -- the air strikes. So it's -- it goes both ways, in a different way.

WALLACE-WELLS: Israel -- yeah, no. I mean, you just follow the IDF spokesperson, Twitter feed, which is extraordinarily active, and you can see their case laid out in full. Not only can you see the actual strikes, video of missiles going into buildings, you can also see some of the terror, some of the fear that Hamas creates on the Israeli side. Israeli school children being taken into -- into safe places. One place --

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: The infiltration of tunnels.

WALLACE-WELLS: The infiltration of tunnels. One place, though, where I think that all of that access that -- to social media, that unfiltered look at Gaza, that Brian was talking about a second ago, matters is that the Israeli attacks look a lot less surgical and pinpoint than the IDF would like. You know, what we see is not these kinds of clean images of a missile going into a building. What we see is the whole aftermath. And in the attacks, particularly on the U.N. shelters in schools, which have been very broadly covered, you see a far messier and dirtier view and more intimate view of what war actually looks like for people on the receiving end of these attacks.

BALDWIN: "Indiscriminate," that was a word used by the U.N.

STELTER: War has always been held, but it may be a much more clearer and visual and observable hell than decades ago.

BALDWIN: Brian Stelter and Ben Wallace-Wells, thank you all.

And sadly, I think we'll continue this conversation. I think the point about social media and the difference in generations and perceiving this war has really evolved over the last couple years.

Gentlemen, thank you very much.

STELTER: Thanks.

BALDWIN: We do have information on how you can help these civilians on both sides of this conflict. Just go to CNN.com/impact. That's CNN.com/impact, if you would like to help.

Coming up next, torrential rain and mudslides stranding thousands, and at one point, trapping hundreds of children at this church camp. We have just gotten an update on those kids. Stay right here.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Talk about a frantic 24 hours in southern California, San Bernardino County -- take a look. Heavy rains followed by quick- moving mudslides shut this town down. One person was killed after floodwaters swept a car off a road into a creek. And more than 500 kids and several adults have been trapped at a church camp. We can tell you now, they are safe. Crews are trying to reach them.

So let's go straight to Ted Rowlands in San Bernardino County with someone to give us an update on all those kids.

Ted, what are we learning?

TED ROWLANDS, CNN INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brooke, we've been talking about this church camp that was isolated, that is now open. They have opened the roads. But look at the mess. It's unbelievable, the amount of mud and dirt they are now cleaning up. There are cars, dozens of them, around this area that have just been engulfed in mud.

You mentioned that fatality. That was because of mud taking over somebody's vehicle and pushing it into the creek.

A good sign of how -- no pun intended, how deep this mud is, that handicap sign usually about six feet off the ground, now you can barely see it. And here's an example of the damage that has been done to outbuildings and buildings here. This camp has a number of buildings, and there's about five -- four to five feet of mud along here. It completely covered the floor inside that building.

This is Gary Wingere, he runs Forest Home.

And you've got five camps, two still operational. But the other three are down for now. A lot of kids had to go home. But everybody was safe.

Give us a sense, were the kids experiencing anxiety, were they scared? I mean, you were cut off from civilization there for a while.

GARY WINGERE, PRESIDENT, FOREST HOME CAMP: Yeah. The kids are all safe. They -- they were -- when I came up here in our main dining room facility in a safe facility, singing camp songs, having a great time. So there wasn't a feeling of anxiety or disaster. They were well cared for, and well communicated with.

ROWLANDS: And, again, Brooke, they -- everybody was fine except for the one fatality. But a lot of cleanup yet. Not only here, but around this entire area in San Bernardino County. The rain came down four to five inches within a couple of hours, and it left a big mess -- Brooke?

BALDWIN: Glad to know the kids will be OK. But just showing us that handicap sign, that really shows just how thick and deep that mud is.

Ted Rowlands, thank you so much.

ROWLANDS: Yeah.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEE MCCALLUM JR, STUDENT FEATURED IN "CHICAGOLAND": I have two worries in life are not making it and not being successful. And the second, I want to be a father to provide for their family.

(END VIDEO CLIP) BALDWIN: You probably recognize his face. This is a student featured in CNN's series called "Chicagoland." He went from gang member to prom king. He was turning his life around, but now he is recovering from being shot on his way to work. Coming up next, I'll talk live to the principal who knows him well, who helped him get on the right track. Don't miss this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Tiger Woods could play in this weekend's PGA championship, despite pain so painful he couldn't play over the weekend. His agent says it's too soon to know if Woods can play. He had to miss two tournaments after back surgery in March. It's been more than six years since he last won a major.

The CNN documentary called "Chicagoland" introduced us to Lee McCallum Jr, a young man from a troubled neighborhood. He turned his back on gangs and violence to become a high school graduate and a leader. And in this TV program, he talked about specifically the cycle of violence, one in which his father was involved, as well.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Fenger High School senior, Lee McCallum, may be headed for college next year, but when you live in Rosalyn, that's a long way off. Lee's dad went to the Fenger High School in the '80s with Eric Wilkins, both veterans of the brutal gang wars and have survived shootouts. Lee Senior lost his leg.

MCCALLUM: I remember the first day he got shot. Our mother, she is screaming, get up, get up. Your daddy is shot, your daddy is shot.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Here he was, prominently featured on "Chicagoland," and Friday night, Lee became another victim of Chicago's horrendous violence, shot not once, twice in the leg in a drive-by shooting with one bullet smashing a bone. Doctors hope he will recover and be able to keep his leg.

Liz Dozier is the principal at the high school, prominently featured in the high school where Lee graduated from.

And, Liz Dozier, have you talked to Lee? How is he doing?

LIZ DOZIER, PRINCIPAL, FENGER ACADEMY HIGH SCHOOL: I actually just talked to him this morning, not even a few hours ago. He's doing well. He's recovering. In some pain, but on pain medication. Unfortunately, he's -- he as well as I think other people have become so desensitized to the violence that his biggest concern at this point was not having a pair of gym shoes to wear because there was blood all over his gym shoes. That was his biggest concern this morning. That speaks a lot to the desensitization of the violence.

BALDWIN: Of the violence. Yeah. Remind me, he was on his way to work? When he was shot? DOZIER: Yes. From what I understand, he was -- it was early in the

morning on Saturday morning. He was on his way to work, had just stepped outside of his grandmother's front door. He and another friend and were getting ready to walk and go to work.

BALDWIN: I mean, you talk about the --

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: You talk about the desensitization of these young people. I've seen the program. You're a tough cookie, Ms. Dozier, as a principal of this high school and you have to be to perform the incredible work that you do. But just to see this happen to kids, especially those who turn -- seem to turn it around, that has to be tough for you.

DOZIER: It is. I think it's tough for us as a community. I mean, at the end of the day, people can say what they want to say. But these are children we're talking about. I mean, Lee is not even 20 years old yet. And so we think about children being shot and killed across -- not only -- really our country and especially in our urban centers, it's just completely unfortunate. Because this really speaks to the fate of our country and our cities, what's happening in our small community as well as Rosalyn.

BALDWIN: Liz Dozier, keep doing what you're doing and give Lee our best.

Thank you so much, in Chicago for us.