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U.S. Vet Talks Iraq Crisis; Pentagon Briefing on Iraq/ISIS; Hillary Clinton Distancing Herself from Obama.

Aired August 11, 2014 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Just past the bottom of the hour. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

As U.S. war planes are dropping bombs on ISIS militants in northern Iraq, I want you to keep in mind, 2003, the United States overthrew Iraq's Saddam Hussein. Then got stuck in a years'-long war that cost billions of dollars and close to 5,000 American lives. Fast forward to 2011, the U.S. withdrew amid worries that without the American presence, Iraq might collapse. Today, Iraq's close to the brink of precisely that.

With me now, from San Francisco, a soldier who served in northern Iraq and Mosul, in fact, that major second-largest city controlled by ISIS. Colby Buzzell blogged from the battle front, came home and wrote the book called "My War: Killing Time in Iraq."

Colby, welcome.

COLBY BUZZELL, U.S. ARMY VETERAN & AUTHOR: Hello.

BALDWIN: Listen, reading your piece, you didn't mince words when it came to these U.S. air strikes. You wrote, "It's about f'ing time." Can you explain that?

BUZZELL: Correct. I mean, for -- seeing all these videos of ISIS just going into Mosul and hearing what took place today, the humanitarian missions going on in the mountains, I think we should be dropping bombs on them, and I think they should be exterminated.

BALDWIN: You fought against deadly, well-trained, well-equipped insurgents during your time in Iraq. Do you think what you know, what you read about ISIS, this ISIS, is it a stronger fighting force than the enemy you once knew?

BUZZELL: I think they definitely have the will to fight, just like the enemy I knew when I was there. I don't think that they're receiving any -- real opposition. They seem like they're just totally fearlessly tearing Iraq apart. And --

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Colby, I apologize for jumping in. I need to go quickly to the Pentagon briefing. Stand by. Want to bring you in, out of it. Here we go, live at the Pentagon.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: -- our logistical hubs, for example, Halracka (ph) in Syria, going to be targeted?

LT. GEN. WILLIAM MAYVILLE JR, DIRECTOR OF OPERATIONS, JOINT CHIEFS OF STAFF, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE: Yeah, first to the threat posed by ISIL, we have been clear about the threat of ISIL forces to Iraq and to the region. Our principle task to date, and what we are doing right now, is to protect the U.S. facilities and the citizens -- American citizens at those facilities, to protect U.S. aircraft that are supporting H.A., humanitarian, assistance, around Mt. Sinjar and to target those ISIL positions that are laying siege to Mt. Sinjar. There are no plans to expand the current air campaign beyond the current self-defense activities.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Arming the Kurds. It's been reported the U.S. government is directly arming the Kurds. Is the DOD playing in a role in that operation or will it at some point?

MAYVILLE: Yeah, I saw that report in the media and open source, as well. Over the weekend, it was the government of Iraq and Iraqi security forces that actually provided immediate resupplies to Kurdish forces. We are looking at how we can help them. And studying the challenges they have, and with the team that we have in Baghdad, providing some assistance, we are looking at plans at how we can expand that support.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: General, over the weekend, President Obama said that he was considering creating some kind of safe corridor to assist those, some 15,000, I guess, Yazidi refugees on top of the mountains there, Mt. Sinjar. And he said he talked to the British and French about that possibility. He also called it complicated. Just how complicated would it be? Would it require boots on the ground? Would there be U.S. boots on the ground?

MAYVILLE: That -- you raise the challenge that we're facing right now. We're credible assessing what we can and can't do, and trying to understand, for example, the numbers on the mountain itself. The numbers vary. I've seen reports of numbers in the thousands and I've seen reports in the numbers in the tens of thousands. What is most important right now is that we deliver the much-needed water, shelter and food to those stranded on the mountain. And as for what we might do next, we'll have to wait and see and get a better assessment on the ground before we can offer some options to the president.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: But is creating a safe corridor, under those conditions, without American boots on the ground, as the president has vowed, is that even possible to do?

MAYVILLE: Yeah, that's a little bit too speculative for me, for where we are right now.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: But there is planning under way. Or looking at it, aren't you? MAYVILLE: We are right now gripped by the immediacy of the crisis.

And our focus right now is to provide immediate relief to those that are suffering. We are looking at the effect that we're having on those fixed sites, those ISIL sites that laying in siege and we are trying to reduce that threat. And for the near term, that's going to be our focus.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: So you don't have a plan to get them off the mountain, to bring them back to Sinjar or to some other refugee camp at this point? You don't have a plan to bring them down?

MAYVILLE: What we're going to need is a better understanding of what's going on out there. But we are assessing the situation. We're -- look, in terms of the support that we have received over the weekend, we have been contacted by many of our friends. As I mentioned in my opening remarks, the French and U.K. have already started helping and others have joined. And we're enjoying the support from the region for overflight and for basing. And so increasingly, we are expanding the number of folks that are involved with this immediate crisis. It's a little bit too early to sit -- to stand here today and give you very specific plans.

Sir?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Can you talk a little bit about the level of effort right now with the air campaign, we were told over the last week it was 50 ISR sorties. My understanding now, you have ratcheted it up to something like 100 sorties overall. The preponderance in northern Iraq, but also ISR strike zones and cargos. Is it about 100 sorties a day now, up from 50?

MAYVILLE: The sorties themselves vary. A ballpark figure is between 50 and 60 is what we have been doing. Now we have been -- our most immediate task is to understand what's happening at the mountain. To understand the complexity of the challenge, humanitarian assistance in dealing with this huge crisis is going to require. We're also trying to assess the security of our key facilities, both in Baghdad and Erbil. And we continue to use our intelligence to characterize the threat posed by ISIL forces in the region.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Effectiveness, in layman's language for those watching, how are you looking at your effectiveness? Pieces of equipment you have destroyed? You said interrupted operational tempo. What does that mean in layman's language for those watching?

MAYVILLE: We really -- the number of vehicles we strike, the exact BDA, is less important than the battle damage assessments, the number of things we hit. It is less important than the effects we see, which is to reduce the threats that could impact our facilities and our citizens and to make sure that we reduce the effects of those laying siege to Mt. Sinjar themselves.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Are you seeing signs of retreat or picking up chatter they're panicking or wondering --

(CROSSTALK) MAYVILLE: You're talking about ISIL forces? Look, I think in the immediate areas where we have focused our strikes, we've had a very temporary effect. And we may have blunted some tactical decisions to move in those directions and move further east to I believe Erbil. What I expect the ISIL to do is to look for other things to do, to pick up and move else where. I don't want to suggest we have effectively contained or are breaking the momentum of the threat posed by ISIL.

Barbara?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Can we come back to security on the mountain? Fundamentally, what is your assessment while you look at all of this and try and see what you're dealing with? How much time do these people have before they run out of time? Question number one. How are you assessing -- we understand that you're flying drones over the mountain to try and get a picture. But even today, a CNN crew was on board an Iraqi Kurdish helicopter going in to bring in relief. They got shot at by ISIS on the way in. They got shot at by ISIS on the way out. So clearly ISIS still has some capability to attack that mountain. Why not more air strikes against them there?

MAYVILLE: Well, in terms of time, we have offered -- afforded a little more time to the crisis just with the success of our humanitarian assistance thus far. But the urgency of the crisis has not gone away and it is very important that we find a solution for those that are stranded up there.

STARR: Within days, within weeks?

MAYVILLE: It's hard for me today to tell you exactly that timeline. Only that -- but you do point to what I think is very important. We need to continue to assess the situation. We need to continue to sustain the humanitarian assistance. And we need to be able to protect that effort.

With regard to the targets, one of the things we have seen with the ISIL forces is that where they have been in the open, they are now starting to dissipate and to hide amongst the people. So the targeting of this is of those forces that are trying to affect a siege around the mountain. The targeting is going to become more difficult. It does not surprise me that an Iraqi security force attempting to resupply, which in and of itself is no small task, and shows you as well I think that the Iraqi security forces are very much involved in this effort, but it does not surprise me that they'll be small arms fire during the ingress of those aircraft or the egress of those aircraft, just because of the way that ISIL formations are moving around.

STARR: Do you expect more targeting, even though it may become more difficult, more targeting --

(CROSSTALK)

MAYVILLE: We're going to do what we need to do to protect our facilities, protect our embassy, to protect our American citizens, and to reduce the siege, as well as protect those aircraft that are providing support to Mt. Sinjar.

Yes, sir?

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: What kind of weapons are you looking at possibly getting the Kurds? And why is there a shift in policy here? Why can't the government of Baghdad do that resupply?

MAYVILLE: The government of Baghdad has been doing that resupply. They have done resupplies over the weekend, and the latter half of last week they did, as well. But they -- the equipment and the ammunition that -- small arms ammunition chiefly that the Peshmerga and Kurdish security forces need is pretty substantial, so we want to help them with that effort.

In terms of what they need, principally, they need weaponry that can meet -- there's technical vehicles out there, so there's some weaponry that they need to have that can reduce the technical vehicles. Some of the ISIL forces have a longer-range weapons system. So we need to make sure that the government of Iraq and the Iraqi security forces are providing longer-range weapons themselves to the Kurdish forces.

Yes, sir.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Sir, how much have we been spending on these attacks, and from what accounts is that money coming from?

MAYVILLE: I can't speak to the accounting of that effort. But I will say that we have been able to provide support and meet these tasks with the forces already in Iraq.

One or two more questions.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Beyond the limited scope of this operation, how do you assess the military capabilities of ISIL throughout Iraq and Syria? And also, are you concerned about the political -- internal political conflict in Baghdad? As you may know, there is a new prime minister, and the current prime minister, Maliki, has refused to step down. Do you think this conflict could affect your mission in Iraq?

MAYVILLE: Yeah, I'm very concerned about the threat posed by ISIL in Iraq and in the region. They're very well-organized. They are very well-equipped. They coordinate their operations. And they have thus far shown the ability to attack on multiple axes.

I've got time for one more question.

Yes, ma'am.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Thank you.

I'm sorry, go ahead.

MAYVILLE: You're ceding your question? (CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: OK. I'll do my question first.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: What about the political conflict? You didn't answer that.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: OK, my question is, some news reports suggest the White House was caught off guard by ISIS' advance in northern Iraq. With 50-plus surveillance flights over Iraq every day and assessors on the ground in Erbil, why wasn't more advanced notice provided?

MAYVILLE: Look, we have been very, very clear about the threat posed by ISIL. And we have been very consistent about that threat in the region and in Iraq. What happened last week was that Iraqi security forces simply did not have the equipment and the supplies and the ammunition to sustain their defensive positions around the Mosul Dam and in and around Mt. Sinjar. And it is for that reason that the ISIL forces were as effective as they were.

With that, I thank you all very much.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thanks, guys.

BALDWIN: All right, some pretty important questions and answers there at the Pentagon. That was Lieutenant General William Mayville, with the DOD, getting questions about ISIS and U.S. air strikes, sorties. We heard Barbara Starr, our own Pentagon correspondent, throwing out two questions. And as I sum that up for you, let me throw up the picture.

Guys, throw the picture up.

We know the president is away. He is on Martha's Vineyard. And here he is sitting with Susan Rice, national security adviser, being updated. Obviously, he is president no matter where he goes. He's with the first family on the vineyard. But still obviously very in the loop to what's happening in Iraq.

And just quickly, one of the headlines from one of the responses from Barbara Starr to the lieutenant general. He was talking about ISIS' momentum and saying, despite some of these targeted air strikes and hitting those ISIS targets, the momentum has not been broken. That was his word. Has not been broken. And timetable? And we listened to the president before he left for the vineyard on Saturday. You know, we don't have any specific amount of time. He just said this campaign would be protracted, long-term. So that's what we have from the president and from the Pentagon today.

Colby Buzzell, let me bring you back in.

My apologies, but that was important information we needed to get to.

But as an Iraq war veteran, I guess my final question to you, just listening to all of that, to think this is a pretty brutal, sophisticated group of members of this, you know, far-extremist terrorist organization taking over much of Iraq. Who can take them out? If you say, you know, as a veteran, your boots are too worn, no boots on the ground, with air strikes from the U.S., what else? What can destroy them?

BUZZELL: A world of fight by the Iraqi people. That's what's needed to take out ISIL, is the will to fight.

BALDWIN: When will the Iraqis step up? How do you get the Iraqis --

BUZZELL: Hopefully, now.

BALDWIN: -- to step up and take them on?

BUZZELL: Hopefully, now. I mean, the best humanitarian aid we can give now is just bomb ISIL and eliminate them as much as we can.

BALDWIN: Colby, thank you for your time, your service to this country. And thank you for taking a couple minutes with me.

Colby Buzzell, I appreciate you, from San Francisco, and your perspective.

And as the Pentagon spoke about the president's actions in Iraq, Hillary Clinton says the White House shorthand for its foreign policy, don't do stupid stuff, doesn't cut it when it comes to real-world policies. President Obama's former secretary of state is now taking some new steps to distance herself from her former boss. And in the new edition of "The Atlantic," she makes a clean break on the issue of arming Syria's rebels. In her words, this is what she said: "The failure to help build up a credible fighting force of the people who were the originators of the protest against Assad. There were Islamists. There were secularists. There was everything in the middle. The failure to do that left a big vacuum, which the jihadists have now filled."

Michael Smerconish, let me bring you in, host of CNN's "Smerconish" on Sirius XM radio.

OK, so we knew Hillary Clinton and the president disagreed on arming Syrian rebels. She wrote about that in her memoir. Now she is really highlighting the differences there. Is she worried the mess in the Mideast is going to taint her own legacy and possibly her future?

MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN HOST, SMERCONISH: I think she probably is. Although, Brooke, I don't interpret this interview the way that some others have, that there was a calculated decision on the former secretary's part that this was going to be the moment she was going to define herself in terms different than President Obama. I think that --

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BALDWIN: You don't.

SMERCONISH: -- been dealing with Jeffrey Goldberg from -- no, I don't. I look at the illustration of the front page of the "New York Post" today where they put "Stupid Policy" in half quotation marks. And I think it's very misleading. Because to the casual observer, you would look and you would say, I guess she called President Obama's policy stupid. And, of course, you know that was a play on words that he had used.

BALDWIN: Right.

SMERCONISH: I think this is the nature of what you get in "The Atlantic." This is not sound bite journalism. This is a very substantive conversation. And she was underscoring elements of where she disagreed with the president. But I don't think it was as calculated as some others have opined.

BALDWIN: OK. That's your take. Certainly others are saying this is the beginning of maybe her breaking from the president, and seeing something ahead for the future for her. The president and his team have often used the line "don't do stupid stuff" as a way to describe their foreign policy. But Hillary Clinton tells "The Atlantic" -- let me go on and quote more of it. She says: "Great nations need organizing principles and 'don't do stupid stuff' is not an organizing principle."

Is she implying that the White House has let politics get in the way of policy? How do you read that?

SMERCONISH: I read it as her saying that it's far more cumbersome and far more complicated in the world in which we live than just a sound bite. In fact, the first line, she said that's a good lesson. But it's more complicated than that. That was her initial response. And I think that -- I just think that the underscored point to be made from the totality of the interview, at least in my opinion, is that she is as hawkish as John McCain and Lindsey Graham. And to me, as I read it, I said, she has zero fear of taking any opposition from within her own party from the left. That's how I read this.

I said, this is -- this is someone running for president, and she even intimates that in one particular exchange. She is not thinking Elizabeth Warren. She is not thinking any of the others whose names have been mentioned. Because she would have toned down, I think, some of the rhetoric of this interview if she had that concern. So I say she's running, and she has zero concern about anyone within her party, from her left taking her on.

(LAUGHTER)

BALDWIN: Michael Smerconish, thank you very much.

And we'll watch your show Saturday mornings, 9:00 a.m. eastern, "Smerconish" on CNN. I appreciate it.

And you just heard, in that Pentagon briefing, our own correspondent there, Barbara Starr, asking Lieutenant General William Mayville about this breath-taking new video from CNN. Our crew, our photojournalist, correspondent in the helicopter, taking part in this daring rescue over this Sinjar Mountain where these tens of thousands of Yazidis, the religious minorities have been trapped by the ISIS militants, the siege just below the mountain. Ivan was on board. He'll join me live to walk me through the risks, the explosion of tears, as he described. That's coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: The numbers are absolutely staggering. The department of veterans' affairs says every single day, 22 American veterans take their own life. And this new documentary aims to tackle the issue head-on. It follows these two veterans who came home from the wars in both Iraq and Afghanistan, ready to resume the lives they left behind. But they were met with the reality that their lives were crumbling around them.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My squad leader was the one who took the RPG, basically, square in the chest. My friends were, like, just walking past me. Dazed. And when we did the head count, we realized that we were missing one person. And it was really -- it broke my faith, man. It broke my faith in something good coming of what we were doing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Alcohol helped suppress my feelings. I was having a lot of suicidal ideation. I was having a lot of homicidal ideation, too. And it was getting really scary. I was afraid of what I was going to do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: And let me bring her in, back to CNN, Soledad O'Brien.

Good to see you.

SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, HOST, THE WAR COMES HOME: Good to see you, too.

BALDWIN: Host of the documentary. It's called "The War Comes Home." And so where do we begin? I mean, you met these people.

O'BRIEN: The numbers. The numbers are staggering.

(CROSSTALK)

O'BRIEN: When you look at 22 a day, and that really doesn't give you an actual look at the real numbers, right? Because that doesn't calculate how many people have death by cop. That doesn't calculate how many people O.D. That doesn't calculate how many people drive their car off a bridge or something. That's a look at the suicide numbers. So many people think -- and many states don't even keep track of the numbers of suicides. So many people think that number is actually a little bit low.

BALDWIN: I had parents on my show a couple times now, Howard and Jean Selmers, lost their son who had served. Came back, committed suicide in 2013. I'll never forget the interview. And they wept as they read part of the note. And part of it was issues with the V.A., and you feature this place in California called Save a Warrior where you found these veterans. Tell me about that.

O'BRIEN: Yeah, I know, I think we wanted to take a look at something outside of the V.A.