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Obama Renews Push for Paid Leave, Sick Days; Pope Francis Speaks Out on Paris Terror Attacks; French Police Seek New Suspect; Terror Attacks Could Have Been Prevented

Aired January 15, 2015 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning, I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.

A worker's right, not a privilege -- that's the idea behind President Obama's renewed push to expand paid sick days and family leave to U.S. employees who don't have it. The Healthy Families act would apply to about 40 percent of the private sector workforce. That's more than 40 million people. It would require companies to offer seven paid sick days, and it offers $2.2 billion to help states and cities develop paid family leave programs.

The President is also expected to sign a memorandum granting six weeks of paid leave to federal employees to care for a new child or sick family members. In an interview with CNN, President Obama's senior advisor Valerie Jarrett talked about a potential showdown with Congress over the issue.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you anticipate any pushback from Congress on the President signing the presidential memorandum on this initiative?

VALERIE JARRETT, SENIOR ADVISOR TO PRESIDENT OBAMA: Well, I think clearly it's well within his authority to sign the presidential memorandum. I think what we would really call on them is to recognize the fact that with these changing demographics in the workplace, if our U.S. employers want to be globally competitive, they're going to have to offer the kind of benefits that will allow them to compete for, to attract and retain the best talent.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: So let's talk about this idea. CNN political commentator and Republican strategist Tara Setmayer is with me and CNN political commentator and Democratic strategist Donna Brazile is here, too. Welcome to both of you.

DONNA BRAZILE, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Happy New Year.

COSTELLO: Happy New Year to both.

So Tara, is paid sick leave a right or a privilege? TARA SETMAYER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: No. This is not a right.

It's a privilege. I mean you know, when we start calling everything a right, it diminishes what are actually God-given rights, like right to religion and things like that. I mean this is just another political ploy. It sounds great. It's a populist type of policy. Who doesn't want paid sick leave? Everybody wants it. That sounds great.

But the practicality of that, applying that in real life has real life consequences for small businesses and employers. So who is going to pay for this? Most employers, major companies anyway, they have some type of sick leave policy already. You don't need the government coming in and micromanaging what our businesses do, particularly small businesses who are already drowning under almost $2 trillion worth of federal regulations already, not counting Obamacare and what that's doing to small businesses.

I mean it's choking the lifeblood out of our small businesses in this country every time the government puts on another regulation like this. This is not the way to do it. Let the free market decide.

COSTELLO: Ok. So Donna, is it like choking -- would it choke the lifeblood out of small business owners? Because they would have a problem paying sick leave.

BRAZILE: Well, we're talking about employers that, you know, hire 11 or more people. Look, this is a moral, this is a moral issue. Earned paid sick leave is the right thing to do. We live in a competitive global society, and the United States is the only nation in the world that does not offer this to their employees. So I think it's a moral imperative that we do it.

Look, just this past week, my oldest sister had to take time out of her day because her employer offers earned paid sick leave to take care of her grandchild because her daughter didn't have paid sick leave. This is important. And I don't see why we're focused on who it will hurt rather than the millions of Americans who will benefit when someone is sick or when someone is taking time out to give birth to their child.

COSTELLO: And it is difficult, Tara, for especially women, right, who have to take care of sick children to take off days and know they're not going to be paid. So usually what moms do is they take off when they're healthy and they go to work sick.

SETMAYER: Right. Well, look, this again, this is an example where a well-intentioned policy prescription, the results don't bear out the well intentioned. What happens here is that businesses have to either cut them if it's two employees -- it has to be paid for. I mean these things will just come out of thin air. In supply and demand, in economics and businesses you have to pay for the increased cost. If you're paying for workers who are not putting out, then there's a cost -- added cost to the business.

COSTELLO: Is there room for compromise?

(CROSSTALK) BRAZILE: Tara, I mean you're earning this. Nobody is giving this to you. You're earning this as part of working, and this is something that employees -- employers are offering to their employees as an incentive to work at their companies. I think the (inaudible) -- will embrace it.

(CROSSTALK)

SETMAYER: But many employers already do this. And it's up to what's for the health of their business, and what business owners should be able to decide what's best for their workers, not the government forcing them to do. I mean in states like New Jersey, Massachusetts, California that have already instituted this, they are the least friendly business states. Businesses are --

BRAZILE: You have not heard -- that is not true. You have not --

SETMAYER: That is absolutely true.

BRAZILE: That is not true, Tara.

SETMAYER: Yes, it is.

BRAZILE: There's no evidence that businesses are going to shut their doors -- look, every time the Republicans and some people who oppose progress, whether it's paid sick leave, family medical leave, you constantly say, oh, the jobs are going to depart. It's like with the health care initiative. The jobs, that's not true.

We're just trying to have programs in the 21st century that enable workers to be able to earn a living, take care of their families. If something, God forbid it, something happens, they won't lose their job because they're taking care of their families. There's nothing immoral or wrong about that.

SETMAYER: But Donna, most employers -- again, most employers already do this and to say that we're the only country in the civilized world that doesn't do it, that's also --

BRAZILE: That's true.

SETMAYER: -- well, we also have to --

(CROSSTALK)

BRAZILE: Paid maternity leave? Paid maternity leave? Come on.

SETMAYER: But there are by products of that that actually make it more difficult for women because then employers don't want to hire women because they're going to be forced to have to bring on this mandate.

BRAZILE: And that's discrimination. That's a form of discrimination, as you well know.

SETMAYER: No. And how about you give employers incentives to expand their businesses, give them tax breaks, do other things to make it better for their employees instead of a regulatory burden, up to $2 trillion. That's not the way to do it.

COSTELLO: Ok. We're going to have to leave it there. We'll watch and see what happens.

BRAZILE: If you want to be competitive in the 21st century, you better start looking like the 21st century.

COSTELLO: Well, I've got to leave it there.

(CROSSTALK)

BRAZILE: It's a good initiative -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Thank you both.

All right. Tara and Donna, thanks so much. I appreciate it.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, Pope Francis weighs in on the Paris terror attack. He's also getting a rousing welcome from cheering crowds in the Philippines. We'll take you to Manila next.

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COSTELLO: Pope Francis is speaking out about the terror attacks in France. On his way to the Philippines today he told reporters that, quote, "One cannot kill in the name of God." But he also added, "One cannot provoke, one cannot insult other people's faiths."

The Pope is getting a tremendous welcome in Manila, which is the capital of the Philippines. Our senior Vatican analyst John Allen is there. What else did the Pope say, John?

JOHN ALLEN, CNN SENIOR VATICAN ANALYST: Hey there Carol. Well, the Pope had a lot to say actually. This was a 50-minute in-flight press conference. This is one of the unique features of the Francis papacy -- Carol. We did not use to get this kind of access to a pontiff. These always used to be carefully choreographed and very carefully scripted affairs.

Francis instead is a more let-it-all-hang-out Pope. So he came back and spent almost an hour with us. We heard from him as you said in the "Charlie Hebdo" attacks in Paris where he said that nothing can justify violence. But at the same time, he said there are limits to free speech. And if you deliberately insult the religious convictions of somebody else, you shouldn't necessarily be surprised if they lash out.

I mean he used this home-spun analogy, Carol. He said that "I don't care if the guy is my best friend. If he insults my mom, I'm going to punch him in the nose." And so that was his analogy.

We also heard from him on climate change saying that he believes that the major part of damage to the environment, the dramatic change to the climate is because of human activity. He says human beings have a tendency to slap nature around and it needs to stop.

We heard from him in his own personal safety. He said he knows there are threats out there but he has a kind of what he described as "healthy obliviousness" to it all.

And finally, he revealed when he comes to United States in September, he plans to declare a new American saint. Junipero Serra who is an 18th century Spanish Franciscan who helped build up the Catholic presence in California.

So Carol -- a veritable Pope-pourri (ph) of insight and commentary from Pope Francis today.

COSTELLO: Oh John.

There was a touching -- well not a touching moment but, I don't know, a charming moment. Didn't the Pope's hat blow off at one point in the Philippines?

ALLEN: Yes. When he arrived today in Manila, it was a somewhat blustery afternoon when the papal plane touched down from Sri Lanka. You see the video there. But, you know, as we all know about Pope Francis by now, he's not the kind of guy to let something like that get in his way. You see he just sort of shrugged it off and continued down the staircase.

And of course, his humanity and his ability to react in situations like that, like an ordinary person would, is obviously part of this Pope's charm. That charm, Carol, is going to be on display in a phenomenal fashion this week in the Philippines. This is one of the most intensely Catholic cultures on earth.

When Pope Francis celebrates that final mass on Sunday, some predictions say he could surpass Pope John Paul II's all-time record for attendance at a papal even which was set here in the Philippines, five million people for John Paul in 1995. Some people think we could see more than six million for Pope Francis this time around -- Carol.

COSTELLO: I wouldn't be surprised.

John Allen -- thanks for your insight. I appreciate it.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM French officials are on the hunt for a new suspect in the Paris terror al attacks. What does he know and was he involved in the brutal massacre?

Plus, new questions about whether the Kouachi brothers may have been secretly communicating with terrorists before the attack.

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JIM SCIUTTO, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Welcome back. I'm Jim Sciutto in Paris.

Right now intelligence officials are trying to track down a new suspect in the brutal "Charlie Hebdo" massacre which took place just behind me here. According to a new report in a French newspaper, the man is suspected of driving Amedy Coulibaly to the kosher supermarket where he gunned down four people.

Meanwhile, as al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula claims responsibility for last week's rampage here, many people are asking whether officials may have missed critical red flags.

I want to bring in CNN's Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr. Barbara -- really the question seems to be how big were those missed red flags, if there were any missed by authorities in the run-up to this?

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well Jim -- I think that's exactly right. Intelligence services around the world, especially, of course, the French and the United States are trying to do just that, figure out what they missed.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

STARR: Al Qaeda in Yemen's video claim of responsibility for the attack in Paris raises significant concern far beyond France, CNN has learned. U.S. and French intelligence services are urgently working to determine if al Qaeda in Yemen, AQAP, secretly communicated with the Kouachi brothers after one or both of them returned from Yemen in 2011.

If that communication happened, it was so secret, it wasn't detected despite the vast eavesdropping capabilities of the U.S. And that means the number one al Qaeda terrorist organization targeting the U.S. and threatening to bomb aircraft can plot and plan without the U.S. knowing about it.

MARIE HARF, STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESWOMAN: AQAP is the most dangerous affiliate associated with AQ Core particularly in terms of external plotting outside of their region where they're located.

STARR: It remains possible the Paris attackers had no direct orders from AQAP. But the U.S. believes that al Qaeda in Yemen is now using advanced encryption technology as just one method to keep their operations secret from U.S. spying. That alone gives AQAP huge room to maneuver.

THOMAS SANDERSON, CSIS: It could have seeded parts of Europe and other parts of the world with these individuals who have been trained and instructed to attack when they feel appropriate or they could have an ongoing cadre of individuals that come in and out of Yemen and set them off at a time of AQAP's choosing.

STARR: The U.S. calculates AQAP was already on the upswing in power for many reasons. Senior leaders like Nasser al-Wahishi and master bomb maker Ibrahim al-Asiri are all in secure locations in Yemen, all still very much in charge.

Its safe haven areas are large and secure. It's continuing to recruit foreign fighters -- all of this, raising questions about whether U.S. drone attacks in recent years have even made a dent in the group. SANDERSON: No one expected drones to have suffocated AQAP and put it

out of business.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

STARR: And of course, the bottom line here is intelligence services are most worried, they need to get an answer to this question because they need to figure out if al Qaeda in Yemen has maybe even more attacks planned -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: Barbara, AQAP considered the most or one of the most severe threats to the U.S. homeland as well.

You know, Carol, we think of the NSA as all seeing. This is an alarming possibility that one of those most threatening groups to the U.S. would have a way around that surveillance.

COSTELLO: Yes, certainly. Jim -- thank you so much.

I want to focus now more on the missed opportunities to prevent the attacks on the offices of "Charlie Hebdo".

Back in 2005 Cherif Kouachi was arrested along with an Islamist recruiter as he prepared to commit violent jihad. Kouachi was then convicted and given a sentence of ten years in prison, but he only served three years before he was released.

Kouachi then seemingly fell off the radar for French intelligence, only to be seen again when he and his brother Said committed one of the worst terror attacks France has ever experienced.

Let's talk about this. I'm joined by Mark Houser. He's a university editor at Robert Morris University. He met Cherif Kouachi's lawyer while reporting on counterterrorism in Europe back in 2005. Welcome.

MARK HOUSER, ROBERT MORRIS UNIVERSITY: Thanks form having me on the show -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Thanks for being here. We appreciate it. At the time you wrote you were surprised that Kouachi was let out of prison for only three years. Why did French authorities decide to do that?

HOUSER: Well, when I visited France and talked to authorities there in 2005 Kouachi had just been arrested and actually was going to be charged. I talked to France's -- one of its two top terrorism judges. Judge Riccard (ph) told me at the time that he believed that France certainly did not have very severe criminal sentences for terrorists. So he was aware of this and so were the French at the time.

And I've gone and looked at many of the terrorists that I wrote about then are also out. Not just Cherif Kouachi, but also Jim el-Begal (ph) who we heard about, also the imam that radicalized Kouachi or at least that he claimed to radicalize him. He's out too. In fact he was a nursing student at the hospital where the victims of the "Charlie Hebdo" shootings were brought. COSTELLO: You also wrote that Kouachi's lawyer convinced authorities,

the judge, that Kouachi had changed his mind about becoming a jihadist. Is that true?

HOUSER: Well, I don't know that he convinced them of that. He argued that, certainly. They convicted Kouachi, though. It's simply that, as I said, the sentences in Europe, once the investigators have broken up a ring, this pattern seems to continue to this day sadly. But the sentences are not very long and prisoners are eligible for early release or house arrest.

I just read about another Algerian convicted terrorist in France, Said Harif who is in house arrest and stole a car and fled and they know he's in Syria now. Members of the group the Hofstad Group in the Netherlands that were linked to the murder of Theo van Gogh, the filmmaker, which I wrote about those people, too. And they're released, other than Theo van Gogh's killer. He has a life sentence.

And even the head of al Qaeda in Spain a man known as Abu Dada who is convicted for helping our 9/11 plotters and also suspected of helping the Madrid bombing plotters, he's been released, too. I think it was 2013. I'm not sure where he is now.

COSTELLO: So, why the light sentences? Did they not take these convictions seriously?

HOUSER: It's hard to say. They certainly do take the threat of terrorism seriously. I've been told that -- I was told that when I was there many years ago, and I'm sure that's still the case. And when I talked to a Spanish prosecutor who was working on the 3/11 case, he pointed out to me that the first person ever arrested and convicted of Islamic terrorism in Spain, he got an appeal -- he got out on appeal, that is, and the next thing we know, the police had his apartment surrounded. He was one of the plotters of the Madrid bombings. They only identified him by his DNA because they blew themselves up.

So I think their focus in Europe tends to be on investigating and less on strict or long sentences that we're more accustomed to here.

COSTELLO: That's a shame. Mark Houser, thanks for your insight. I appreciate it.

Thank you for joining me today. I'm Carol Costello.

"@THIS HOUR WITH BERMAN AND MICHAELA" after a break.

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