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Yemen Fighting Good for Terrorists?; Suspects Arrested in Turkey, U.K. and U.S.; $215,000 Reward Offered for Man Behind University Massacre in Kenya; Christianity Under Fire; Kentucky Player Apologizes for Racial Slur; Columbia Journalism Review Report on Botched "Rolling Stone" Story; Germanwings Crash Revives Interest in MH-370; Netanyahu Blasts Iran Deal; Turning Anger to Votes in Ferguson. Aired 5:00-6p ET

Aired April 05, 2015 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[17:00:07] POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Hi, everyone, thanks so much for joining me. It's 5:00 here on the East Coast. I'm Poppy Harlow in New York.

On this Easter Sunday, a prayer from the leader of the Catholic Church, a plea for peace in every corner of the world. Pope Francis mentioned the Palestinian-Israeli conflict in his Easter Sunday sermon, also Libya, the nuclear deal with Iran, Ukraine, South Sudan, and specifically the horrific college massacre by extremists in Kenya.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

POPE FRANCIS, CATHOLIC CHURCH LEADER (Through Translator): We ask peace above all for beloved Syria and Iraq, that the roar of arms may cease and that peaceful relations may be restored.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: He is talking about Syria and Iraq, where ISIS has managed with few exceptions to march through and claim control over large parts of both countries. Iraqi Security Forces finally pushed ISIS out of the city of Tikrit where they found buildings and vehicles rigged to explosive -- to explode as booby traps. The liberation of Tikrit comes a full year after it was first attacked by ISIS. But looting and violence by some Iraqi forces has now been reported within the city.

Meantime, Yemen has spun almost completely out of control. Houthi rebels there control the capital of Sana'a. They pushed the president out of power and out of his own country. Fighting for the port and coast is intense. And people who live in Yemen are fleeing that country by the tens of thousands. Others who remain there are running out of water, food and fuel.

Our Nic Robertson is just a few miles from the Yemeni border in Saudi Arabia, he joins me on the phone.

Nic, to you, Yemen has the really full attention of the U.N. Security Council right now. The Red Cross is demanding a stop to the fighting. But after days and days of being bombarded by the Saudi airstrikes it doesn't seem like the Houthis are responding at all.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: No, in fact the Houthis are really not being stopped by the Saudi air strikes. What the Saudi air strikes are continuing to do, they have the heaviest round of bombardment around the capital last night. They were targeting military bases, weapons dump, scud missiles that are still on the loose, Houthi command and control sites.

But the real fighting in the country is around the southern port city of Aden. That's where aide officials say the humanitarian situation is the most desperate. Local officials there say more than 100 people have died, more than 1,000 people have been wounded.

The reason it appears that the fighting around the port city of Aden is the most intense is because there are -- that is a stronghold at the moment of the southern separatists who are, if you will, fighting in support of the president, President Hadi, the internationally recognized president who was forced out of the country, forced to flee.

They have a stronghold there, and they can, if they control the port, get reinforcements into the deep water harbor there. And what the Houthis are trying to do at the moment is drive them out of that key strategic position so that they can essentially control that part of the very important coastline. And that's why the humanitarian situation in that town is at its worst, people there are running out of food and water.

One tiny piece of hope for the people in that town, the international committee for the Red Cross say that they have been given permission by Saudi authorities to land two aide planes, one will bring medical workers, one will bring 48 tons of much-needed medical equipment. But in the scale of what's happening across Yemen today, that's going to be a drop in the ocean -- Poppy.

HARLOW: Yes. And, Nic, one of the reasons why the international community is so focused and so worried about Yemen becoming a failed state is because of AQAP there, al Qaeda there. And I wonder how much al Qaeda has been taking advantage of this situation in Yemen, the chaos, to build up its training camps, to build back power there.

ROBERTSON: They are absolutely taking advantage. They have been springing al Qaeda members from jail. They sprung an important leader, Khalid al-Batarfi, just a couple of days ago from jail. He almost within hours was seen in photographs resting in a presidential palace close to the jail that he was liberated from.

So what al Qaeda's track record is -- in Yemen is to take control of provinces and towns in the country, to run them in the same way that ISIS runs areas in Iraq and Syria, you know, to have their own -- essentially to have their own shadow government in those areas. But to operate freely, to have training camps.

Their track record is the underpants bomber tried to bring a plane down over Detroit, Christmas Day 2009, Anwar al-Awlaki, the -- you know, the American-born Yemeni cleric, he was there fomenting -- you know, fomenting attacks on the United States.

[17:05:10] The "Charlie Hebdo" attackers, they have been in training in Yemen. So what it does is When Yemen gets in a state like this, al Qaeda takes advantage and the threat to the rest of the world grows, Poppy.

HARLOW: Nic Robertson reporting for us right there in Saudi Arabia on the border with Yemen.

Nic, thank you very, very much. We appreciate it.

Let's turn to Turkey now where officials say they have detained 20 people at the Syrian border over the weekend, all of them trying to cross into Syria, allegedly, to join ISIS. No official word yet on their nationalities. But add to that nine British citizens who were arrested in Turkey just a few days ago. Also accused of trying to get into Syria and join the fight. Some children were among them. One of them just 2 years old.

And then this, in northern England, two teenager arrested, age 14 and 16. Suspected of preparing separate acts of terrorism. Police say one of the teens had electronic devices that raised their terror alarm.

Also just a few days ago right here in New York City, two women, both U.S. citizens were arrested, accused of planning bomb attacks within the United States. They are being held this weekend without bond.

Kimberly Dozier joins me now, our global affairs analyst. Also Bob Baer is with us, former CIA operative.

Thank you both for being here. All of the people that I just mentioned are these potential foreign fighters that officials say is what is giving ISIS increasing power and increasing force within the region. The Iraqi prime minister went so far as to say that if ISIS continues to recruit these foreign fighters effectively, no regional army will be able to defeat them.

Bob, is there anything that can be done to at least slow this recruitment process down?

ROBERT BAER, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Well, Poppy, Turkey's obviously embarrassed that so many people have been crossing the border. They've closed the main crossings. But that border is still porous and there's always a question about how committed Turkey is to stopping these jihadists come in because they're -- really Turkey is behind a movement to overthrow Bashar al-Assad, the president of Syria.

But what Amadi said was alarming, and I've had this repeated by many Iraqis who live in the tribal areas next to ISIS that it's the foreigners that are causing the problems, they've been fighting the hardest and more and more are flowing in, and this is truly becoming an international caliphate rather than just a Syrian and Iraqi one, which is a phenomenon I've never seen ever in the Middle East.

HARLOW: Never seen ever, coming from a former CIA operative with a lot of experience in the region.

Kimberly, you've spent a lot of time on the ground reporting this out. Why do you think it is that Western nations are losing the recruitment fight? And do you -- do you point to Turkey as the key here as well?

KIMBERLY DOZIER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: Well, when you look at the people who are making that journey, many of them in the court documents posted in New York with the arrest of those two women, they talked about wanting to be significant, wanting to be part of something larger. That seems to be drawing these people, the chance to be part of this fight that they see as legitimate.

When you hear about the fact that among those 20 people arrested on the way in from Turkey, there was a 2-year-old, that 2-year-old wasn't coming in to be a fighter. That meant whoever wanted to be a fighter was bringing their whole family. They want to be part of this movement. That is the most disturbing part of that report for me. And with every report like the attack by Shabaab in Garissa to the reports of military successes on the ground inside Syria, which ISIS has had lately, that only increases their popularity.

HARLOW: Right. And there becomes this issue, how do you fight that not just -- with military force or with drone strikes, how do you fight that from the inception?

Bob, when you look at Kenya, right, and the horrific attack at the university in Kenya this week, 147 people killed, even after U.S. drone strikes took out the plotters from al-Shabaab that planned the Westgate Mall attack in Kenya, that clearly didn't do anything to spurn this attack. Is there a better way?

BAER: You know, there isn't a better way. I suppose you put troops on the ground but clearly we're not going to be doing that in Kenya and Somalia. These organizations you can decapitate but there's always a leadership which will rise up to take over. This is an idea, a virus, disease, call it whatever you want, but these people are still on the move. It doesn't matter where you look, whether in Damascus, ISIS has taken over a camp called Yarmouk, which is a huge milestone for this organization.

And you've got Boko Haram, it's not defeated. And they are really trying to separate the world. You know, this is east, they're trying to separate Christians from Muslims.

HARLOW: Yes.

BAER: And this message is working.

HARLOW: Yes. It's -- I mean, that's what they did at the university, they separated the non-Muslims from the Muslims and killed as many non-Muslims as they could.

[17:10:02] Kimberly, I do want to get your take on Yemen because we've had sort of repeated bombardment of airstrikes, Saudi airstrikes, against these Houthi rebels in Yemen. And you say people shouldn't be surprised that nine plus days of airstrikes have failed to even bring the Houthis to the negotiating table. I wonder what's their endgame.

DOZIER: Well, the airstrikes are weakening some parts of the organized Houthi assault, but the fact of the matter is the Houthis on the ground have just taken a number of Sunni politicians captive who might have formed the basis of a government that Saudi Arabia would have backed.

Generally wars are not won by airstrikes. They're won on the ground or through negotiations and at this point the Houthis are gaining too much territory. Also, they are now backed by the former president, Ali Abdul al-Saleh, and his security forces. Those security forces were trained by U.S. Special Operation Forces so they know where all the top weapons are in the country. They know where all the top U.S. operatives are in the country, the ones that used to work for us. So at this point, there's no reason for the Houthis to compromise.

HARLOW: Kimberly Dozier, Bob Baer, thank you both. Appreciate it.

Well, despite threats of violence, Christians in the Middle East and Kenya head to church to celebrate Easter while the Pope calls for peace in all of those countries. Will his message be heard? We'll discuss, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: A $215,000 reward has been posted in Kenya for this man. He is said to be the mastermind of Thursday's cold blooded slaughter of 147 people, mostly students, mostly Christians, in the town of Garissa. Identified as Mohamed Mohamud, Kenyan authorities say he's a former teacher at an Islamic school with an extensive terror network across Kenya.

In the aftermath of Thursday's bloodbath, security was very tight today as Christians in the town surged to Easter Sunday services.

[17:15:04] Garissa is known as a religious fault line where Christians worship on one side of the street and Muslims worship on the other.

The Pope used his traditional Easter address to pray for the Kenyan massacre victims, also for all oppressed people around the world. Easter mass was especially poignant at our Lady of Salvation Church in Baghdad, 50 people died there in 2010 when the church came under attack by militants. Some Christian communities in Iraq dating back 2,000 years have been wiped out by jihadists. Survivors now live as refugees.

The Cardinal Timothy Dolan, archbishop of New York, writes on CNN.com that Christianity in the Middle East is undergoing its worst period of persecution since 1 A.D.

Let's bring in CNN intelligence and security analyst, former CIA operative, Bob Baer.

Bob, thanks for staying with me. When you look at this, do you think that extremists can at all be expected to heed the message of the Pope, and also, I'd like to hear just from you on what we're seeing in terms of this fault line, if you will, in Kenya play out where you've got this coexistence of Christians and Muslims and Christians being very targeted in this latest attack.

BAER: Well, you know, Poppy, here's the thing, is that these Islamic countries have traditionally, for hundreds of years, protected the Christian communities, for thousands, you know, 1500 years. But now this is a new ideology, it arose in Saudi Arabia, it's called Wahhabi Islam. If anything to do with Christianity they want to efface from the side of the earth. This is -- call it ethnic cleansing, what you want, but they're moving these people out.

They think that the only way to purify Islam is to get rid of the Christian communities, and I think that's what we're seeing now. And they're certainly not going to pay any attention to what the Pope has to say or anybody else.

HARLOW: Do you believe that we're seeing, as Cardinal Dolan wrote in this op-ed on CNN.com, really a war against Christianity in some parts of the world?

BAER: I think the war against Christianity will be confined to the Islamic countries, North Africa, the Arabian Peninsula, Pakistan, places like that. I don't think it's a war on Christianity and Europe or the United States.

HARLOW: Right.

BAER: But certainly in the Middle East and these people believe, as crazy that they need to purify their civilization from Christianity, from Judaism, in any other religion, or sect, even Islamic sect that doesn't meet their standards.

HARLOW: They've also -- I mean, extremists have also shown that they're very willing to kill their own.

BAER: Exactly. Well, they think they've fallen away from Islam. It's apostasy. And they call them Mullhids in Arabic, and they could be put to the sword. I mean, this is a form of Islam that really predates the prophet in many ways, the cutting off the heads, burning prisoners and the rest of it. Why this started we can debate all we like but it is getting stronger and stronger.

HARLOW: But what can be done to fight it at the root level, right, when you talk about understanding of other religions. You know, it's something that is taught from an early age in this country. Right? When you talk about at that university that was just attacked in Garissa. You had Muslim students and Christian students studying, living together, side by side in peace, until this happens. What needs to happen at a fundamental level there, say, in Kenya?

BAER: You need to crush the Islamic State completely. You can have no remnant around. We need the Muslim countries to join a coalition to destroy this group. Whether it's al Qaeda, which is the Islamic state in so many ways, in Yemen. Whether it's in Syria and the rest of it. Until there's unity in the Middle East, we're not going to be able to destroy it. HARLOW: Bob Baer, thank you very much. Let's hope for the best this

Easter Sunday. I appreciate it.

We're going to switch gears now. You were all probably watching the games last night after an upset at the Final Four. Kentucky player caught on open mike directing a racial slur towards an opponent. What happened and what he's saying today, that's next.

[17:19:12]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: It was the latest upset to bust brackets all over the country, Wisconsin ending Kentucky's undefeated streak in the Final Four. Look at the Badgers celebrating there and some tears in the eyes of some of the Kentucky fans. The Badgers advancing to tomorrow's night national championship game against Duke.

Some of the behavior off the court, though, after the game is taking a lot of attention away from the spotlight right now.

CNN's sports analyst Christine Brennan has more on this open mike moment that has one player apologizing.

Christine, I mean, let's just run through what happened. You've got this 20-year-old Andrew Harrison, talking about Wisconsin standout who defeated them, Frank Kaminsky, saying the F-word and the N-word. I mean, what's your reaction to this?

CHRISTINE BRENNAN, CNN SPORTS ANALYST: Poppy, I of course was not there, but it's an open microphone, it's a press conference and he was caught -- Harrison was caught saying these things. And he has apologized on Twitter and he said he called Frank Kaminsky and apologized to him. I think that -- it sounds like he tamped it down and it's probably a big story that has been quieted.

But can you imagine if this were reversed? And the use of those words in another situation obviously thankfully it seems to have calmed down. But we don't need those kinds of things in sports or in our culture. But another example where an open microphone and ill advised words can really cause some trouble. And again I give them credit for understanding and immediately dealing with it and apologizing.

HARLOW: So you're saying -- so it's coming from an African-American to a white player and, yes, that is different, but you know, do you think -- the schools said they're assessing it, do you think there should be punishment here at all? Because, still, it is still use of that word, no matter who it's to -- you know, in a derogatory way.

BRENNAN: Absolutely, yes. And yes, I mean, I think they should look at it and if there's punishment, I certainly would be in favor of some kind of punishment. I mean, those kinds of things are just should be unacceptable in 2015, Poppy.

[17:25:06] I mean, that's just -- especially in an environment where we're talking about universities and athletes, student athletes, even though there are more athlete students than student athletes but absolutely. So I think that that can be discussed. I think it should be discussed. But I do think it's a good thing that the apology came quickly.

HARLOW: Right.

BRENNAN: It did not linger, they understood, and I think that's certainly going to help moving forward in terms of trying to get past this.

HARLOW: Yes. Yes. Absolutely. Look, I want to get your take on the fact that all people could talk about leading up to the Final Four wasn't really just the games. It was the fact that this was taking place in Indianapolis where that controversial religious freedom bill was signed into law by the governor, then amended this week, but it had many people fighting it, saying it was discriminatory against gays.

Obvious it changed. The law changed right ahead of the Final Four. But do you think the NCAA's reaction to it was the right one and was strong enough?

BRENNAN: I think it was strong after the fact. As my colleague LZ Granderson pointed out earlier today on "STATE OF THE UNION," we were both on there, and he said that they should have anticipated this months earlier. And I think that's a very good point. Nonetheless, they were in this position, and Mark Emmert, the president of the NCAA, spoke out loudly and strongly about not only this men's Final Four but also moving forward, other events that could be held in Indianapolis. And in fact, the very fact that the NCAA is headquartered in Indianapolis moving forward.

HARLOW: Yes.

BRENNAN: So I do think that this is another example Poppy where sports takes us to a national conversation. The fact that the men's Final Four was in Indianapolis, let's make no mistake about it, this law changed. The governor, Mike Pence, had to deal with this, because of the men's Final Four. That's how big a deal this was because of sports, this huge sports event going on in Indiana at the same time.

HARLOW: Yes. And the women's going to be there next year and the CEOs of huge businesses pressing on the state as well, all having a lot of influence certainly.

Christine, good to have you on the program. Thanks so much.

BRENNAN: Poppy, thank you.

HARLOW: Well, the headline, "Rape on Campus." The "Rolling Stone" article about a brutal rape at the University of Virginia sparks national outrage. It shut a fraternity down temporarily. Police, though, could not find any evidence to back up the claims. Tonight a critical new report on all of the flaws in that reporting. What went wrong and the consequences, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:30:28] HARLOW: The writer behind a controversial "Rolling Stone" article on rape at the University of Virginia is expected to release an apology tonight. Sabrina Rubin Erdely wrote about an alleged gang rape at a campus fraternity party at UVA last year but there were holes in that reporting. No one has heard from her since.

Charlottesville Police say they could not find any evidence that that actual gang rape happened, however, they do say that this young woman, known as Jackie, may have gone through a very traumatic experience.

In just a few hours, the magazine is expected to release the results of an independent review of the article by the Columbia Journalism Review.

Our Sara Ganim has been following the story from the beginning, she joins me now.

Where do we begin? I mean we know there's going to be an apology. I know you've been reporting on this since the beginning. Do we know what the review, the independent review has found was a miss here?

SARA GANIM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We don't, but we do know what they are looking for, right? They're looking for how this story fell apart, kind of the anatomy of the journalism of the story. And what's most interesting to me, after reporting this from the beginning, from before we knew that some of the facts were not correct, is that Jackie had friends, along the way, who had been told different versions of the story.

And you can kind of see the story change as you interview friends that she knew at different periods of her college career.

HARLOW: Right.

GANIM: And the ones that were with her that night are really the most fascinating to me.

HARLOW: And what are they saying?

GANIM: Because they're -- what they remember from that night is so different from when Jackie ended up telling "Rolling Stone" and those friends say that they were never contacted by "Rolling Stone." So if they had been interviewed and if they had been able to tell their side of the story, this could have turned out very differently because "Rolling Stone" would have known that there were inconsistencies.

HARLOW: One of the big problems is the impact that this lack of really editorial control over this, the fact that there were holes, that the fact-checking went wrong, the fact that the author of the article didn't even reach out to speak to any of the alleged perpetrators, right, that has had this huge impact on women who do get raped, one in five women on college campuses experience some kind of sexual assault. And this minimizes their -- them and their truth and that's really a detrimental effect of this, isn't it? GANIM: The fact that this story could be wrong, it will create a huge

chilling effect. And people -- women on the campus who have been raped told me that this was a fear of theirs from the beginning, before they even knew that this might be wrong, because most women who are raped are not raped the way that Jackie says she was raped. It's not a brutal, shocking, dramatic event.

It's typically an acquaintance situation, where -- especially on college campuses. It typically involves alcohol, someone you know, someone a lot of your friends know and trust. And so while the story might not be so shocking, that's the more realistic view of rape, and many women who were interviewed by the "Rolling Stone" said they were disappointed that that story wasn't told because that's much more typical.

HARLOW: Didn't get out there. UVA is now going to hold a class on this. What's that going to look like? What is it about? The editorial sort of, you know, judgment behind it.

GANIM: It's a journalism class. Brian Stelter, CNN's Brian Stelter reported that they're going to start a class. I think that's a great idea. You know, we've seen in other college campuses, where there have been scandal where Journalism Departments have stepped up and said, OK, we're going to own this and we're going to learn from this. And I think you know that's what UVA's going to do if they go through with that, that could be great.

There are still, Poppy, a lot of questions about UVA and how they responded because even before "Rolling Stone" they were aware of what Jackie was saying, and take Jackie completely out of the picture, there was a huge clunk of the "Rolling Stone" story that was about how UVA historically handled sexual assaults and whether they did that correctly. And that's probably going to get lost in this. And that's unfortunate.

There is still a state investigation into how that's going to go. We'll wait and see how that is.

HARLOW: I know you'll stay on that story for us.

GANIM: Yes, of course.

HARLOW: So it doesn't get lost.

Sara Ganim, thank you very much. Appreciate it.

Coming up next hour, we're going to discuss this with our senior media corner Brian Stelter. He has been speaking with his sources close to the investigation into this review of the "Rolling Stone" article, that's right at 6:00 Eastern right here.

As the investigation into the Germanwings crash continues, search crews off the coast of Australia still face the mammoth task of locating missing Malaysia Airlines Flight 370.

An update on both of those extraordinary investigations, next. [17:35:02]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: The crash of Germanwings Flight 9525 is bringing renewed attention to another tragedy that is remarkably still unsolved. For more than a year now, crews have been scouring the Indian Ocean for Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 with no success.

Our Anna Coren takes a closer look at how both disasters have been investigated.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANNA COREN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In the midst of this rugged steep terrain, high in the French Alps, the slow and painstaking search and recovery continues for the remains of Germanwings Flight 9525. Described by the chief investigator as emotionally very difficult, recovery teams rake through dirt and rubble to retrieve fragments of bodies and pieces of wreckage after co-pilot Andreas Lubitz is believed to have deliberately slammed the A-320 into a mountainside with 149 others on board.

And while the world grapples with how this could have happened, almost 9,000 miles away, in another hemisphere, a search even more challenging grinds on. In the remote southern Indian Ocean, a thousand nautical miles off the coast of Perth, western Australia, survey ships continue to scour the ocean floor for MH-370.

The Boeing 777 carrying 239 people disappeared more than a year ago. And according to satellite data, experts believe it's somewhere here, two and a half miles under water at the bottom of the ocean that's never been mapped before.

[17:40:12] JAMES KENT, DATA SUPERVISOR, DISCOVERY SEARCH VESSEL: You see Australia here. We've got the whole survey area where we started with the seventh arc. We're looking at this southern section down here.

COREN: After an initial search zone roughly half the size of the United States, it's being narrowed down to a priority area of 23,000 square miles. It's a slow and meticulous process that requires vessels traveling up and down strips of the search zone.

KENT: We're looking for small features similar to something like this pixel.

COREN: So far they've covered more than half the priority search area and authorities believe they are on target to complete it by May. The Malaysian government has remain tight-lipped on what will happen if nothing is found in that priority area by the end of next month.

Malaysia and Australia are sharing the costs for what has become the most expensive search in history. However, Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott has indicated his country is prepared to continue searching, allaying the fears of the traumatized families who so desperately want answers.

Anna Coren, CNN, Hong Kong.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HARLOW: Anna, thank you for that.

And joining me now to discuss both tragedies, Justin Green is an aviation attorney, he's representing some of the families of Flight MH-370. Also David Soucie, a former FAA inspector and author of "Malaysia Airlines Flight 370."

Thank you, gentlemen, for being here.

Justin, let me begin with you. When it comes to the families of those killed, how are the legal challenges for them different, families you're representing from MH-370 and the families of the Germanwings flight?

JUSTIN GREEN, AVIATION ATTORNEY: Well, I think what's most important it's only been about a week since the Germanwings flight went down. We already know what happened. We know the cause. We've identified the parties responsible. And over a year since the Boeing 777 that was used for Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 went missing we don't know why it went missing. So we don't know, was it a terrorist attack?

We don't know whether it was a mechanical problem. We don't know if in that case like this case, whether there was intentionally by one of the pilots. And that does complicate the legal situation.

HARLOW: But is it different for the families in terms of when they have to formally sue the airline, if they're going to, ask for compensation that they think is owed? Because you know about the intentional nature here. And frankly, you know that Lufthansa, the parent company of Germanwings, knew the mental state of Andreas Lubitz, the co-pilot, whereas in MH-370 there's just so many unknowns.

GREEN: Right. In MH-370, there's nothing either in the pilot's background that really cries out that it might be them. But the legal situation is the same. Whether it's Malaysia Airlines 370 or Germanwings, the families have two years to bring a claim. And unlike normally where the law actually -- you know, allows people to identify what happened before the statute of limitations starts running, under the Montreal Convention, it's two years, and there's no -- what we call tolling extension of the two-year limit.

HARLOW: Right.

David, what we do know the Germanwings crash led to a lot of airlines that didn't already have this rule mandating a two-pilot rule in the cockpit at all times. That's the result of Germanwings in terms of immediate change. What about any immediate change, reform after MH- 370?

DAVID SOUCIE, CNN SAFETY ANALYST: Well, actually there were some things that were done after MH-370 which both of these are unprecedented, really. The fact that the airlines and the regulators have taken steps forward to do something about it, to improve safety, before the results of the accident come out. So, for example, the second person in the cockpit rule, EASA, European authority, already put out rules and said we want you to do this now for all their European carriers.

And in the case of MH-370 the cockpit access -- cockpit access procedures were changed almost immediately just because there was a vulnerability identified.

HARLOW: But the real time tracking, every moment streaming data tracking of a plane to -- you know, back to the control tower has not changed. But that technology's available. There's an airline in Canada, First Air, that's using it. A lot of people want to know why hasn't that changed one year after MH-370?

SOUCIE: Well, not only one year after MH-370 but four or five years after Air France 447 when the same recommendation was made by the French government.

HARLOW: Right.

SOUCIE: So there is a stall in that and it's difficult to get that going. I do know that there's been some activity with the ICAO and IATA, which are international groups that oversee this, and they're going to meet again at the end of April here to discuss it. And the World Aviation Forum will be there as well to see if we can't move it forward.

[17:45:00] HARLOW: You know, Justin, a lot of the family members, I can imagine, say I don't care about the money, I don't just want money from the airline, I want change. I wonder if there's any legal recourse that can be taken to make things change like the real-time tracking of these planes that as David correctly points out has been asked for, for the last five years since Air France 447 went down.

Any legal --

GREEN: Well, the family groups are -- depending on the political situation in the country where they're going to try to do this. In the U.S., after the Colgan Air 2009 accident the family group actually went to Congress, lobbied Congress, got the law changed that required pilots coming into the industry to have much more experience.

HARLOW: OK.

GREEN: So they approached --

HARLOW: They could.

GREEN: They -- but they had to get the law changed. They can't go into court and require the FAA to do something because that's not in our legal system.

HARLOW: So the most effective way to lobby Congress to get this changed. GREEN: That's right. That's right.

HARLOW: Gentlemen, thank you both. Appreciate it very much.

GREEN: Thank you.

HARLOW: Good to have you on the program. David, to you as well.

Coming up next, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu continues his criticism of the nuclear deal with Iran. Not mincing any words. Today making the rounds on morning television shows and making his case to the American people. What did he say? That's next.

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HARLOW: Pope Francis today throwing his support behind the framework of a nuclear deal struck this week between Iran and six world powers.

[17:50:02] The Pope saying in his annual Easter message, quote, "We entrust the Merciful Lord the framework recently agreed to in Lausanne that it may be a definitive step toward a more secure and fraternal world."

Well, that optimism not shared by Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu who today continued to denounce the agreement as a bad deal.

Here's what he told our Jim Acosta on "STATE OF THE UNION".

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER: I think there is a third alternative and that is standing firm, ratcheting up the pressure until you get a better deal. And a better deal would roll back Iran's vast nuclear infrastructure and require Iran to stop its aggression in the region, its terror worldwide, and its cause and actions to annihilate the state of Israel. That's a better deal.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: CNN global affairs analyst Kimberly Dozier is with us again.

Let me ask you this. He also said, Kimberly, that Iran is a country of congenital cheating, that it cannot be trusted to abide by the framework of this deal to be truth worthy on the inspections.

You've spent time on the ground with those inspectors in Iraq doing similar missions. Is he right?

DOZIER: Well, what he is really lobbying for right now is if he can't stop this deal he is calling for tough measures within it to verify that it's actually -- that the Iranians are honoring it. Now in Iraq the inspectors there were able to inspect because Saddam Hussein had lost after the invasion of Kuwait. So that was a deal made with him on the back foot. It was terms of surrender. Those inspectors could operate from their own base inside Iraq. They had their own planes. They could fly anywhere. That's the kind of details that some critics of a deal with Iran would

like to see. They'd like the inspectors to have that kind of freedom. Those details haven't been worked out so this is the point between now and June 31st when they're working out the technical details that critics like Netanyahu can get in there and say, you know, this deal isn't good, and it better be tough if it goes through.

HARLOW: What about the fact that what's not being discussed in all of this is the fact that you've got Iran, you know, supporting the Houthi rebels in Yemen? That you've got Iran sort of fighting against U.S. interests in the battleground of -- across the Middle East right now, and that's just not been talked about in all of this. How much does that complicate things?

DOZIER: Well, the U.S. is giving up its lever of sanctions to keep Iran from meddling, in its words, in the situation in Yemen, the situation in Syria, but what administration officials will tell you is they've had those sanctions in place and that hasn't stopped Iran from supporting these various, different groups so they're trying this other tact, diplomacy, opening the -- both the banks of Iran and basically opening the borders through business deals and travel of Iranian citizens.

HARLOW: Right.

DOZIER: That is another way to empower the liberals within that country.

HARLOW: Let me ask you very quickly. I thought Dianne Feinstein made an interesting point on "STATE OF THE UNION" this morning saying look, when you look at the 77 million people in Iran, the economic sanctions really hurt the people that can least afford it. Hurt the poorest people and really have that impact, and that's not something you want either. Your response to that?

DOZIER: Absolutely. I last was in Iran in 1979 as a teenager being evacuated from there and I remember meeting the Iranian people and seeing them suffering under a tough economic situation then, and having no real ability to change what was happening at the top. If you keep the sanctions in place, that situation continues on the ground now -- Poppy.

HARLOW: Yes. Yes.

Kimberly Dozier, great to have you on the program this Sunday, thank you very much. I appreciate it.

DOZIER: Thank you.

HARLOW: Coming up next, we are going to talk about a big development that's going to happen tonight. The investigation into what could have gone wrong with this story about a gang rain on the campus of UVA. Columbia Journalism Review coming out in just a few hours and we're going to have details from our Brian Stelter. And we're also likely going to hear from the woman who wrote the article speaking out for the first time tonight. [17:54:21]

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HARLOW: It's a chance to turn anger into votes. For the first time since the death of Michael Brown and the protests that followed, residents of Ferguson, Missouri, will head to the polls to elect new members of the city council this week.

Kyung Lah reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WESLEY BELL, FERGUSON CITY COUNCIL CANDIDATE: My name is Wesley Bell, I'm running for city council.

KYUNG LAH, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Wesley Bell is part of a sea change in Ferguson, the first large group of African-Americans running for city government.

BELL: I'm running for city council.

LAH: A council that's traditionally been white, just like the police department while the city is mostly black. This election three of the council's six seats are vacant and for the first time in its history, Ferguson could see half its city government represented by African- Americans.

BELL: You've got to fold up or show up. And if you're going to be a part of the solution you have to put your foot out there and do it. Right now we are in Ward Three. In Ferguson. This is the ward where the tragedy occurred.

LAH: The tragedy. Less than a mile away where Ferguson police officer shot Michael Brown.

BELL: If you're not in office you're limited in what you can do, and I just felt helpless.

LAH: So did Adrienne Hawkins.

ADRIENNE HAWKINS, FERGUSON CITY COUNCIL CANDIDATE: I watched the buildings burn from my house.

LAH: Hawkins has no political past, but her resume is thick with a life lived in Ferguson and as a single working mother to 20-year-old twins.

HAWKINS: The thought of my child not returning home because he's black and walking down the street was something that I could even fathom. As I listen to the sounds of war, and I was, like, somebody has to do something.

LAH (on camera): Months after violent protests, the scars still litter West Florissant Avenue. This simple city council election, the next step in the long road to Ferguson's recovery. (Voice-over): This time from the inside out, candidate Bob Hudgins

who protested on the city streets now wants to represent them.

[18:00:05] BOB HUDGINS, FERGUSON CITY COUNCIL CANDIDATE: I'm the guy.

LAH: Part of his message, he's not what he looks like. Once married to a black woman, father to a biracial child.