Return to Transcripts main page
CNN Newsroom
Victory Rally Underway in Baltimore; Thousands Call for Justice In Baltimore; Powerful Women Leading the Charge. Aired 4-5p ET
Aired May 02, 2015 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: ... speaking community leaders, members of the community, religious leaders joining us. Let's listen in for a minute to hear what they're saying. Let's take a look at these aerial shots that are gathering here at city hall. Let's take a moment to listen in and then we'll continue our coverage.
UNIDENTIFED MALE: A lot of them out here and we stood on the front line. And we help put the city back together. The truth be told the city was already messed up before the riots.
We've been coming outside. We got high poverty rate. They don't want to help us. We let outsiders come in just tell us anything. We know what it's like to be from here. Don't let these people fool you, man. They've been fooling us how we going to eat. How we going to eat? Less jails, more jobs. Less jails -
HARLOW: As we continue to watch -
UNIDENTIFED MALE: Save our sons.
HARLOW: All right. As we continue to watch this rally outside of city hall, thousands who have gathered here demanding justice, wanting their voices to be heard.
Actors from "The Wire," a famous series shot in this city. Some of them pleading for peace and calm. The acclaimed HBO show depicted fictional battles between Baltimore's drug lords and police.
Joining me now, Anwan Glover. He played a character named Slim Charles. He's been very vocal about what's been happening in Baltimore. Thanks for being with me, sir.
ANWAN GLOVER, ACTOR, "THE WIRE": Thank you for having me.
HARLOW: I appreciate it. I was reading what some of you said in the wake of this. We'll get to that in a moment but I just want your reaction to what unfolded on the street this weekend and what we're seeing here today.
GLOVER: We're just speaking on the Freddie Gray thing. The kids are crying out, (INAUDIBLE) the community all the time. What you have our city officials and leaders call the youth thugs and animals, they take that to heart. Because they are working so hard in the community trying. You're going to have some bad and you're going to have some good. But just like on the show, we showed the school system. We showed (INAUDIBLE) what kids do when parents are not around.
HARLOW: Are you encouraged to see what we're seeing next to us today, that is a really completely peaceful gathering?
GLOVER: Beautiful, peaceful. It's peaceful. Everybody's grouping together. And it's more youth than ever coming together because they're tired of seeing our young black brothers incarcerated and getting murdered.
HARLOW: You have written a lot about this, talking about it. You said you want to see President Obama more involved. In what way?
GLOVER: I think in more ways of getting more recreation in Baltimore. Still tore down since '68 here. There's no opportunity for the youth. No jobs. It's still abandoned buildings. The neighbourhoods are crushed. It's beautiful at the harbor. But if you go in the inner city, it's still tore up.
HARLOW: You know, it's interesting you bring up the harbour, right? That's a lot like the city of Detroit where you got this beautiful water front built out. But not far from that - I spent a lot of time in Detroit, not far from that you have areas in great need. Your son, you have a 20-year-old son. A few years ago your son was shot.
GLOVER: Yes.
HARLOW: And you wrote extensively about that just talking about youth violence.
GLOVER: Yes.
HARLOW: What's the biggest preventive measure that is needed?
GLOVER: We just need more programs in the neighborhoods. We just need to like - when things like this happen, we need to push it and push it harder. But we don't need to just do it when things happen.
HARLOW: Let me ask you this - someone pushed back and they would say, you know, the money needs to be used effectively. And sometimes you pour money into areas and resources and it becomes a waste because it's not used effectively.
GLOVER: Then they put the people in the neighborhoods that really don't know the youth. They can't relate to them. You have to put somebody in there that really knows what they talking about and was a product of the hood "ghetto" and grew up in poverty and they know how to deal with the youth. You can't just throw them away and call them thugs and lock them up. Because we are somebody too.
And we see the officers just getting away with it, so they're retaliating in that way. The more we talk to them, the more stuff happening. That's just like giving a kid a piece of candy to keep them quiet.
HARLOW: I keep hearing this, and (INAUDIBLE) people saying, you know, the officers, grouping all police officers into one. GLOVER: (INAUDIBLE).
HARLOW: I know you don't but moving forward -
GLOVER: Yes.
HARLOW: Because one kid told me yesterday, when I sat down with a group of kids - they said, I know most of the police officers are good. I know that most of them are there to protect us. There are some bad apples.
How does that conversation happen between the community here, the kids, so that they can get to the point where they feel protected by the police and where the police can make them feel that way, frankly, and not make them like you said?
16:05:01
GLOVER: Well, I think our leaders need to push for it more instead of waiting for something like this happen. We need to get them in the community more. Because they really don't know them. Like they said, they don't know the officers.
Some are good and some are bad, just like you got some bad kids and some good kids. We have the preacher that keeps hammering and hammering. Just like they have all this big advertisement on subways and on cable and, you know, we have to push it. The kids want to know. They want to know. They're curious.
HARLOW: Anwan Glover, thank you for joining me, sir.
GLOVER: Thanks.
HARLOW: Thanks, Anwan for being in the program. Good to meet you too.
GLOVER: Nice to meet you too.
HARLOW: Thank you very much.
I want to go straight to our Nick Valencia who has been with the crowds all day marching with them here to the rally. Nick, let me go to you. What are you hearing from the people about why they're here today and what they want to see happen?
NICK VALENCIA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's after Friday, after Marilyn Mosby's announcement that charges would be levelled against the six officers. I've been told it's almost as if the city collectively took a deep breath and sort of reset. We've seen a different narrative today. We've seen people come out of town far and wide. One of those demonstrators is joining me right now, Daudi Henderson, all the way from New York. Why did you show up here?
DAUDI HENDERSON, PROTESTOR: Well, I just wanted to be in solidarity with my sisters and brothers here in Baltimore. I love Baltimore. I visit here a couple times and I love the city, I love the people here. I think it's important for us to show solidarity and show that all around the country we're paying attention and we're with them.
VALENCIA: I wanted to have you on air because you were with the crowd marching from where Freddie Gray was arrested. That's six miles that brought you here to city hall. How did you perceive that march? What really did you sort of reflecting on it now, after you did it, what do you think about that march going from Freddie Gray's arrest site to here?
HENDERSON: I think it was beautiful. It was - I was really touched just even being in the area where he was killed.
VALENCIA: Explain that to me. What was that like?
HENDERSON: I mean just seeing the mural. Seeing people coming up to me and telling me about the area and just - just talking to - just talking to the people in the neighborhood. That was very touching to me.
VALENCIA: You've also showed up here at this rally, we've seen a number of speakers with different messages. What message resonates with you the most? What should people at home watching this - what should they takeaway?
HENDERSON: What really touched me was hearing the youth speak and telling America that they are not thugs because I would want America to know that none of us want to be out here. I don't think that those young people that were in the streets wanted to be out there. I think we all prefer to be at home with our families, you know, with our friends. I'm pretty sure most of those youth would rather be at playing 2K or you know, XBOX. But the conditions have forced us into the streets.
VALENCIA: What do you mean by that? What do you mean by that? Explain.
HENDERSON: I think, you know, we have high youth unemployment. So a lot of youth can't even afford to buy things that we see in commercials. So it's putting pressure on them. And we can't demonize them, we can't demonize the victim.
VALENCIA: Well we hope that you are achieving something. I can tell this by looking at you in your eyes that you feel like you're part of something special.
HENDERSON: Thank you.
VALENCIA: Thank you, Daudi Henderson, all the way from New York City. You heard Daudi say, this is a very passionate moment for so many people here that came far and wide to be part of this. Poppy, we'll send it back to you.
HARLOW: Hey, Nick, thanks to much. It's always great to hear from the people out there. I appreciate you doing that for us.
Let me bring in a young woman who just spoke at the podium, Tanara Cullens. 24 years old. About to graduate from Johns Hopkins with your master's in environmental -
TANARA CULLENS, STUDENT: -- environmental science and policy.
HARLOW: And I need to correct something when I saw you speaking on the podium, I said let's go to this young girl who's speaking. Youth is on your side, my friend. You're always going to look young. You're going to love that when you're a bit older. Thank you for being with me. Tell me what you said and why you're here.
CULLENS: I'm here because I support this cause. I believe that there are many unjust things that happen in these communities were there are many disenfranchised people. And it's important that we stand together not just as black people, but black people and their allies to do great things and positive things in our community.
HARLOW: You grew up in the same neighborhood as Freddie Gray, in the same neighborhood where he was arrested. And look at all you've achieved. Because another kid from that neighborhood told me yesterday education is my way out. Clearly education has taken you to Johns Hopkins where you're about to get your masters. How can more kids have the opportunity to achieve what you've achieved?
16:10:02
CULLENS: What I spoke about earlier, the mentorship programs, the education programs - those are essential for children to be able to rise above their circumstances. I was blessed because my parents are educated people. My father works with people who are having a change of life, they are coming from negative backgrounds and he brings them around to do positive things in their community.
My mother is a professor at (INAUDIBLE) State University. So I was raised to value my education. And so many people don't have that opportunity. But with mentorship programs and educational programs, they can rise above that.
HARLOW: What can people who are watching now do to help?
CULLENS: So if you live here, if you live in Baltimore or close by, you can come and help. I mean, there are children here, we have all the same charities that they have in any other major city. You can come and give your time and help the youth. Many people have seen the youth on television doing negative things.
If you want to see them doing positive things, they have to be helped in that direction. So come here with a positive attitude. If you can't come here, you can donate your money to any of those charities that are here. We have boys and girls clubs. We have after-school programs that need support.
HARLOW: Finally, before I let you go, the mayor here has been talking about One Baltimore. But some of the folks here told me there are two Baltimores, two very different Baltimores. The Baltimore of the haves and the Baltimore of the have-not. Can you become one?
CULLENS: You can. You can - you can move beyond that - that line of monetary, whatever. I mean, I came here with my two friends. We're all from different backgrounds. Some of them have money. I don't have a lot of money. I wasn't raised to think of money as this thing that puts value on you as a person. So I think that the haves and the have-nots can come together and they can work together. It's clear because there's so many people here who are all from different backgrounds. They're all from different walks of life and we can come together and do positive together.
HARLOW: Tanara Cullens, I have no doubt you are going to do extraordinary things. Thank you so much for joining me. It's a pleasure and honor to have you on the show. Good luck to you. We appreciate it.
CULLENS: Thank you.
HARLOW: Quick break here in Baltimore. I'll be back with you in just a minute.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
16:15:00
HARLOW: You're looking at live coverage of the rally that is gathered at city hall in downtown Baltimore. Let's take a moment to listen in.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... that one mission is to rebuild Baltimore. Revitalize Baltimore. With that one mission, everybody needs to come together at the same roundtable and put your skill sets together, stay in your lane, do what you do best, but to collectively for the same mission (INAUDIBLE) let's get one unified roundtable together for the same mission.
What's your product, bring it to the table and let's grow. Let's build our family, our people and let's revitalize our city. Thank you.
HARLOW: All right. I want to go to our Ryan Young who is in the crowd with some of the people who have come here. I'm interested, Ryan, in what they're telling you about why they're here today and their impression so far.
RYAN YOUNG, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: You know you can hear a lot of passion in the speakers' voices, some people have been carrying this on since before 1:00 when we arrived here. A lot of college student have walked over from campuses to be here. They said they wanted to be a part of the celebration. But we also see a lot of mothers coming with their sons. Look, I asked you before, why does this impact you so much that you wanted to be here to experience all this?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is just so important. The city itself needs to be healed. There are a lot of problems here, but there's also a lot of love here. I wanted to share that love with my son and at the same time, I wanted him to know how important it is to be around people of all colors, of all races, of all classes and just see the unity and the love that is here in this community, Baltimore as a community.
YOUNG: People are taking this really personally in terms of just how Baltimore is portrayed. Talk about your hope for Baltimore in the future.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I want us to be more. That's what I want.
YOUNG: And you're here, how old are you, first of all?
UNIDENTIFED MALE: I'm 16.
YOUNG: How's this week been for you, watching everything that's happened here?
UNIDENTIFED MALE: Well, it's been really emotional. Because I feel like this impacts me personally. This has been a really stressful week, especially with the riots that happened on Monday. And we were supposed to have SATs today. It was really stressful.
YOUNG: When you see all the National Guard (INAUDIBLE) describe your city when you see it like this.
UNIDENTIFED MALE: I feel like it's not really necessary. Like I feel like on Monday people got all their anger out and now we're uniting together as one. So I think they need to leave. We don't need a curfew.
YOUNG: All right. Appreciate it. Thank you so much for sharing that with us.
You know, we've actually seen police officers walking through this crowd. Had a gentleman come up - actually two of them, with their badges. They showed them to me off the side. Look, they understand there's anger towards police officers. One thing they wanted to say is as a community, if they're going to heal, they need to come together totally. So they want this to be an anti-police city. They want to make sure that they're out here working with people and talk with them on a constant (INAUDIBLE).
Poppy, a lot of people are talking about healing today. That's something that was great to hear throughout the message. As you can hear people screaming and yelling as speakers take the stage.
HARLOW: Ryan Young for us out in the crowd as you see aerial views. Let's listen in for a moment to what the next speaker is going to have to say.
UNIDENTIFED MALE: Let me tell y'all something. It is women that gave birth to this country. It is woman that gave birth to Freddie Gray. It is woman that gave birth to (INAUDIBLE). Justice for (INAUDIBLE)! Say it can me, women. Justice for Rakia! Justice for Rakia! Justice for her, she is Baltimore's own. Justice for (INAUDIBLE) we cannot forget them. They are humans. They are people too. We will not have men dictate.
16:20:00
This country has always told women, we cannot be angry. We cannot express our rage. We cannot express our pain. But damn it America, I'm hurt! I'm hurt! I'm hurt! My blood runs through their veins. My ancestors fought for this country too. Rakia did not get an indictment. Women are murdered just as men. Men need to acknowledge us.
HARLOW: All right. I want to bring in our guests right now. Two people who have been watching the unrest in Baltimore very closely. Retired NYPD detective Harry Houck joins me from New York, also Michael Daly, special correspondent for "The Daily Beast" who's written extensively about this.
Let me begin with you, Harry, because we've heard a lot at today's rally on the protest here in Baltimore from some of our guests about police officers. And a lot of anger towards police officers in this city. You are a former NYPD officer, a former detective, what is that like from your perspective right now?
HARRY HOUCK, FMR. NYPD OFFICER: Well, basically it's a little disturbing to me, although the people do have a right to demonstrate and go out there. We don't know all the facts in this case yet. Although the officers have all been charged, we still haven't seen the evidence, all right?
I'm hearing a lot of things - you had a guest on before that said something like the biggest terrorist in that neighborhood are police officers when we know that's not true. There's five murders a week in Baltimore and it's usually black-on-black crime. That doesn't help the discussion, people making comments like that and writing articles like that.
HARLOW: Let me ask you that as a follow-up because it's an important discussion to have, Harry, right? I mean, we have a -
HOUCK: Of course it is.
HARLOW: -- union saying - sorry, trying to get your picture back up here on screen, sir, as I ask you this. The police union coming out yesterday and saying, "as tragic as this situation is, none of the officers involved are responsible for the death of Freddie Gray." They think that the prosecutor, Marilyn Mosby, has rushed to judgment here. Your reaction to that?
HOUCK: Well, I agree with them. Their job is to back the police officers, all right. Apparently to them, there isn't enough evidence to even charge them. Now, the state attorney in this case, I believe she did rush to judgment because just on Thursday, even the state attorney herself said that nothing would be coming out on Friday. Now all of a sudden on Friday, these officers are charged.
The fact also they even said the investigation is not completed yet. How can you charge these officers, all right, on a day when the investigation is not completed yet? Now myself as a detective, I waited until my investigation was completed before I made an arrest and I made a charge here. Because you can find new evidence between now and tomorrow and the next day after these guys have been charged and find out, well, -- hey, you know what? Maybe we should have charged these officers with these crimes because now we've found new evidence in the case.
HARLOW: Michael Daily, to you, not only have you written extensively about what we've seen in the streets of Baltimore, you've written extensively about this prosecutor Marilyn Mosby. You have a lot of friends in New York who are NYPD officers. You have said it is wrong to call this prosecutor an enemy of the police. Tell us more.
MICHAEL DALY, SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT "THE DAILY BEAST": Well, first of all, she grew up in a house that was known in her neighbourhood in Boston as the police house. Her father, a mother, a grandfather and several uncles, all police officers. She went into law enforcement, she says, because her 17-year-old cousin was murdered on her doorstep when she was 14 years old.
I don't think she's anti-police. You might note that the day after she took office, she brought charges against a female Episcopal bishop for manslaughter in a vehicular homicide case. If you're going to say she's anti-cop, I guess you'd have to say she's anti-bishop too. I think that for her what she said when she charged the bishop is exactly what she said when she charged these police officers is that no one is above the law. Now, did she go a little fast as a rookie might? That's possible.
HOUCK: Poppy, you know, I don't think that she's a bad district attorney or that she's anti-cop. I think there's a lot of political pressure going on here to prevent a riot on Friday. All right. I think that's maybe why they've rushed to judgment. I can't say that for sure but I think that's what the (INAUDIBLE) is saying and that's what I'm thinking myself.
16:25:00
HARLOW: There have been some calls for an independent prosecutor from the police union in this case. That has not happened at this point in time.
Michael Daly, to you, a young man here, a 17-year-old high school student who I was speaking with yesterday said to me, "I know the majority of the cops are good officers, that they are here to protect us, but there are some corrupt ones." What do you think can best be done to bring the communities that these police officers police and the people - the residents of the communities together?
DALY: Poppy, you know, all the noise behind you, it's really hard to hear what you're saying. Can you repeat the question?
HARLOW: Absolutely. And I apologize for that. This is from Michael Daly, I said to you, sir, a young man who I was speaking with yesterday, a 17-year-old high school junior told me, "I know that most officers are good officers. We have good police officers in our neighborhood, but there are some bad apples and there are some that do not treat us in the right way." My question to you, sir, how can the community and the officers come together most? DALY: What has to happen is that people such as the district attorney
and such as the mayor have to make clear that while in this instance it seems that officers did not behave appropriately, there are many officers who do. I think you - in the same way you highlight the brutality, you have to highlight the efforts of the officers and talk about why they're needed.
I think, you know, if I was the mayor and I heard some guy saying that the worst terrorists out in the streets are the police, I would feel obligated to stand up for the police. And it's interesting when the district attorney was running for office, she talked about we have to stop the terrorists in the streets. She was not talking about the police. She was talking about the guys walking around with guns.
HARLOW: Guys, thank you very much for joining me. It's an important conversation to have. We're absolutely going to continue it on this program. Thanks for being with me. Harry Houck, Michael Daly, back in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:31:06] HARLOW: You're looking at aerial shots of a big, big rally that is still underway here in its second hour at city hall in downtown Baltimore. We're keeping an eye on what the speakers of the rally are saying, but we're also talking about the bigger picture here in Baltimore, specifically for the businesses.
You've got a 10:00 p.m. curfew here that has meant a lot of businesses closing early all week. It means a lot of people not working as much as they want to be working. And you've also got the other side of the curfew, which is keeping calm on the streets of Baltimore.
Let's talk about it. Joining me now, Ron Busby, he's the president and CEO of the U.S. Black Chamber.
Thanks for being here, sir.
RON BUSBY, SR., PRESIDENT/CEO, US BLACK CHAMBERS: Thank you.
HARLOW: Look, you've got a city trying to manage after some of the violence that broke out on Monday and installing the curfew, and you've also got a city where these jobs really matter because you've got unemployment that is too high, especially for African-American youth.
Is the curfew a good idea given that all the businesses are closing early, but it's also keeping the calm?
BUSBY: Yes, it's a combination of safety for the city, safety for its residents, but also a revenue stream to bring back the city.
Many of the businesses that have been here have been here for years. Folks are now looking to make sure they have the chance to rebound. We start that by businesses being able to reopen. A lot of our restaurants are being forced to be closed at 9:00 p.m. And a lot of the restaurant business go on until 10:00, 11:00 evening, especially on a weekend. So, they are definitely --
(CROSSTALK)
HARLOW: You know, we were trying to go out to dinner later last night, couldn't find places open. But, look, bigger picture than that, when the world sees images of the CVS burning down, right, and that -- what does that do to businesses wanting to build here or considering building, especially in that neighborhood?
BUSBY: It's very much a concern. We want to make sure we have the resources for our communities. We want to make sure that corporations are not just spending money on us, but spending money with us. So, we want CVS to be there, and we want to make sure CVS is reinvesting in our community. We're also interested in making sure that the local and the black-owned businesses have the opportunity to start, grow, and expand and that's --
HARLOW: What does that mean policy-wise?
BUSBY: Yes. Well, one of the things we're proud of is the fact that Baltimore is a new Promise Zone city, which means that all the resources are going to be brought together to best fix the inefficiencies, the inaccuracies that are going on in this community. And we feel like that's one way that the policy could definitely start to affect us.
HARLOW: Specifically what is needed for some -- you know, to encourage minority-owned businesses, right, and for people to take the plunge in owning their own businesses? Are we talking about grants, easier access to loans? What is it?
BUSBY: All of the above. If you asked the number one concern in our community, it's going to be two things. Access to capital because the SBA and so many other banks and financial institutions have really removed themselves from this community. And so, for folks that want to start businesses, it's very difficult.
The second thing is for my own community, we have to make sure that we're spending money in our communities. The average African-American is spending less than 3 percent of their dollars back in our community. We can change that.
Unemployment being the number one concern, but across the country, we have 1.9 African-American owned business, and 1.9 million unemployed African-Americans. Simple math says, that if I can have each one of those business hire unemployed African-American, we no longer have an unemployment conversation in our communities.
HARLOW: Well, let's talk about some of the numbers here. When you look at the numbers of the economic disparity, it's pretty stunning. In terms of median household income, white residents in Baltimore make almost twice as much as black residents, roughly $60,000 for whites, $33,000 for African-American residents. In addition to that, when you look at young black men, between the age of 20 and 24, the unemployment rate in 2013 in the city was 37 percent for African- American young men, 10 percent for white young men. [16:35:08] You know, we look at how to address this. One young woman
in Philadelphia rallying, marching on Thursday told me she would do something that is controversial, but she would mandate hiring, she said, for minorities. Do you think that is the answer?
BUSBY: I don't know if it's a mandate question. If you look at the statistics, African-Americans hire African-Americans. I think it's an opportunity for African-Americans to start opening up new businesses, and we will hire from within our own community. It's about giving us the opportunity to create businesses so that we can hire. We need both. We need corporate America to invest in the community and we need our own community to invest in our community.
HARLOW: One of your jobs is to encourage business growth, and you have to court businesses to bring them into certain cities. How will you be talking to businesses, large corporations and smaller companies that may want to open a branch in Baltimore for example, how do you tell them that this city is where they should be?
BUSBY: It's not just a Baltimore concern. This is an American concern. The folks in Baltimore have money that they want to spend f. You look at the African-American community, we have a trillion dollars of spend power. That's an opportunity that corporate America understands and that money is coming from our community.
We need to make sure that corporate America isn't turning their back on us. We want them to make sure that they're investing because it's a good deal for both them, as well as for us.
HARLOW: Ron, it's good to have you in the program. So, thank you very much.
BUSBY: Thank you so much for having me on.
HARLOW: Appreciate you joining me.
We're going to take a quick break. When we return, much more from here in downtown Baltimore.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:40:07] HARLOW: Welcome back to our continuing live coverage this weekend from Baltimore. I'm joining you from city hall, right in the center of downtown Baltimore. It's a beautiful Saturday afternoon here. What we've seen is a big gathering, a big gathering of people for the last two hours here, completely peaceful, a lot of people voicing their opinions.
I want to get to Ryan Young, our correspondent who's out with the people. He marched with them here.
Ryan, what are they telling you about why they're here today?
RYAN YOUNG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Poppy, you have a lot of reasons here, talk about police officers, we're talking about people in the communities, they want to see a change. Of course, we've been here since Tuesday covering this. I ran into
college students from Howard University, which is really just the backyard of this area.
Look, you talk about the idea being out here in the streets mentoring children, why is it important to not only have this rally, but to get out there and talk to the youth? Because you said that's what you're here for.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The youth is definitely our future. They are what's going to progress on, what's going to move us forward. So, being out there not only standing here for this moment, but continuously educating them, giving them a foundation to learn from.
This is a learning experience. It's beyond important that we stand and we understand that they are our future and we continue to instill that in them, the greatness they do have, the potential they do have.
YOUNG: These young people have been talking about the idea of discussing things with young people. You said you wanted to be here as well. You're here with the people from Howard.
Look, tell me, what touched you about today so far?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What really touched me about it was being that we did our spring break not too long ago. We took it to come down here to try to make a difference, try to change as much as we can. This happened so currently just really touched each and every one of us who did attend (INAUDIBLE) the spring break. So, that's the reason why I'm down here.
YOUNG: You said you were scared that people were going to rally are going to leave and not help. Are you still worried about that?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I am worried. Sometimes people just get so tied into it being a trend, just being a hashtag. But I need people to know, and that's everyone, that this is life. Like, you know, Baltimore is still going to be here, once this Black Lives Matter movement moves away from Baltimore. So, we need to stay in tune, we need to keep our organizations moving and keep them in our cities and in our counties, you know? So, there -- that is one of my concerns.
YOUNG: Thank you so very much.
Obviously, you can see the people spread out through here. We've been here since before 12:00. You can see the crowd has really stayed at a swelling point. People all have different reasons for being here. We've seen ever one wearing shirts talking about all lives matter, a system change.
Poppy, you felt the energy from where you're standing. There are people here with a lot of passion who are speaking forward, who are talking about not only today, but the idea they want to get involved in the system and start voting.
HARLOW: Ryan Young joining us, thanks so much, Ryan. I appreciate it.
I do want to bring in Tom Fuentes, former FBI assistant director, also a former police officer.
Tom, you were talking to me about your concern about some of the things that are being said at this rally.
TOM FUENTES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: What I'm concerned about, Poppy, is for the last two hours I have listened to this screaming over here in front of several thousand people. They're not saying some police are good, some are bad, let's work together in the community and fix the problems we have.
They are saying all police are bad. Everybody that's been locked up is good and should be released right now. And, you know, basically advocating anarchy in a town that averages five black kids being murdered a week here is unbelievable. And the whole crowd is buying it and cheering it on. And I just think it's ridiculous and enough is enough.
HARLOW: So, what do you -- how can it change, Tom?
FUENTES: I think if they want -- this community needs to work with the police. They have -- you have a black mayor, a black commissioner of police, 50 percent of the department's black. The last commissioner was black.
Now, if they can't work together to try to fix what's going on in this town and do something about the unbelievably high crime rate here and murder rate in Baltimore, then I don't know. I think it's almost going to be hopeless if they can't work together.
What's being said out here at this podium is nothing about working together. It's ranting and raving, advocating anarchy. It's wrong.
HARLOW: Let's say -- you are a former police officer. Let's say you were the police commissioner here, OK? Once you step back a little bit, what do you do to take charge and facilitate the conversation a bit more? And yes, it is incumbent on the community as well.
FUENTES: It's true. If you're the commissioner, you want to work with the community. You want to have your police officers go to school groups, church groups, recreation groups, and try to create a relationship with the police. But if the community rejects it out of hand, I don't know what you do.
[16:45:01] And when you had last year, 225 murders in this city, the year before 333, and then tell the police do something about that, but don't be aggressive, you know that means is, that if the police are going to stop murders, there are going to be times when they're going to use stop and frisk, there are going to be times when they're going to have hands on people.
And the narrative is becoming across the country, you don't have to comply with the police officer's request to arrest. Now, whether you run, whether you fight, whatever you do, you don't have to comply. And we're asking our police officers now to become professional wrestlers and debaters when they try to arrest somebody. It's wrong.
Now, if it's a false arrest -- and they can be charged like in this case with false imprisonment and other criminal acts. But that's where to address it, in the legal system. Not on the street hand to hand combat with cops.
HARLOW: So you're saying that they need to separate -- residents need to separate what the charges are in this specific case with every case, that they are not all the same?
FUENTES: There are a group of people around this country in minority communities begging for more police.
In my hometown Chicago after the murder of Hadiya Pendleton, and her mother and others were interesting interviewed by Chicago reporters, Chicago TV stations and they were saying, we can't send our kids to school safely. We have bullets coming through the walls of our house killing our people. We want the police. They're all assigned downtown to protect tourists and business. We want the police in our community.
Now, those mothers, single moms, aren't out marching at midnight. They're home with their kids and their voices aren't being heard either.
HARLOW: Tom Fuentes, thank you so much. It's forepart of this discussion. I'm glad you're here with me. Thank you very much.
Quick break. We're back live from Baltimore in just a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARLOW: As we continue to monitor a huge rally that has gathered outside of city hall here in downtown Baltimore, I do also want to talk about the news that came out of this city yesterday that the state's attorney here, Marilyn Mosby has brought charges against six Baltimore police officers in the death of 25-year-old Freddie Gray.
[16:50:00] Those officers charged with everything from misconduct in office, to assault in the second degree to manslaughter all the way up to depraved heart second degree murder.
Let's talk about the charges and the case going forward here with CNN legal analyst Danny Cevallos.
Danny, thanks for being with me here.
Let's talk first about the charges here. I mean, you have a big range. I'm looking at all the different charges. But you do have Officer Caesar Goodson, the driver of the van that Freddie Gray was in, charged with second-degree depraved heart murder. What is that?
DANNY CEVALLOS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: The highest lead charge in this case is depraved heart murder. And as I said before, it's a bit of a misnomer. There are several kinds of murder. There's the intentional "I intended to kill somebody". And then there's depraved heart murder which is a murder done so recklessly that even if you did not intend to kill the person, the decedent, the law says that what you did was so reckless that it brings a wanton and reckless disregard for human life. It's a very high degree of recklessness.
HARLOW: Let me also be very clear here, and bring in the other side. And that is the union representing these police officers says there is no merit in these charges. And these officers did not contribute in any way to the death of Freddie Gray.
I want to read you part of a statement. They're calling for an independent special prosecutor, instead of Marilyn Mosby in this case, and they wrote this, quote, "Most importantly, it is clear that your husband's political future will be directly impacted for better or worse by the outcome of your investigation. In order to avoid any appearance of impropriety or the violation of the Professional Rules of Professional Responsibility, I ask that you appoint a special prosecutor to determine whether or not there should be -- any charges should be filed."
Her husband is a city council member here. And they're saying, look, it is just too much of a conflict of interest. Do you agree that this is a case where perhaps there should be a special prosecutor?
CEVALLOS: Whether you're trying to get a judge removed from a case or a prosecutor, the standard nationwide is basically the same. Even given that that person may have a connection to the case, can they act fairly and impartially? And you see it all the time from large cities like Baltimore all the way down to sleepy little villages, where there's two or three people in the entire law enforcement division.
So, the real -- the question is always the same, given your connection with other people in this case, can you be fair and impartial? And, of course, the prosecutor in this case is going to maintain that she can. The union is going to say, instead, this is the kind of case that should be given to a special prosecutor.
HARLOW: Remember, this is a prosecutor that comes from a family of police officers. You know, many would say, look -- you have to look at her history here. This is someone that is a member of the African- American community here and also a member of a family of police officers.
CEVALLOS: But to that I would say, Poppy, if you look at prosecutors and police officers, it's a family business. Lots of people in law enforcement on the prosecution side have someone in the family -- now, there are many people who don't. But it -- when you have that sort of family business atmosphere, it's no surprise. People are inspired in their youth by an uncle who's a cop and they go onto be a prosecutor. It's not that unusual.
HARLOW: Danny Cevallos, thank you so much for being with me. I appreciate it.
And, you know, the Baltimore community really is looking to rebuild and needs help, especially for the parts that were torn apart by some of the rioting here. If you'd like to help, you can go to CNN.com/impact. Again, that's CNN.com/impact.
We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARLOW: You're looking at aerial shots of a big rally here, downtown Baltimore at city hall just wrapping up. We're hearing potentially some of the people who gathered here may march on the streets of Baltimore. We'll keep an eye on it for you.
But it has been a peaceful protest, with different people taking the podium, community members, religious leaders, community members, throughout the afternoon. But again, they're dispersing now, and we'll keep an eye on it, you know, if they're going to march in the streets of Baltimore.
But also, in the wake of the death of Freddie Gray in this city, four powerful African-American women are becoming a face of this city. Here's Stephanie Elam.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This may be the popular image of a powerful woman in Baltimore, but the real battle for peace, justice and civil rights is being waged by these women.
MAYOR STEPHANIE RAWLINGS-BLAKE (D), BALTIMORE: If with the nation watching, three black women at three different levels can't get justice and healing for this community, you tell me where we're going to get it.
ELAM: That's right -- the mayor, the state's attorney and the head of Maryland's military are all black women.
RAWLINGS-BLAKE: I love this city and I know we can be better than what we have seen.
ELAM: Perhaps the face of Baltimore politics, Stephanie Rawlings- Blake is the city's mayor. A former public defender, Rawlings-Blake walked away with nearly 90 percent of the general vote in 2011 to win her first full term. A Baltimore native, she was first elected to the city council when she was just 25 years old, the youngest person ever to be elected to the Baltimore City Council. A graduate of Overland College and the University of Maryland School of Law, the 45-year-old is married and has a daughter.
MARILYN MOSBY, BALTIMORE CITY STATE'S ATTORNEY: To the people of Baltimore and the demonstrators across America, I heard your call for no justice, no peace. Your peace is sincerely needed a as I work to deliver justice on behalf of this young man.
ELAM: Entering the spotlight, Marilyn Mosby, the compelling 35-year- old is Baltimore's newly elected state's attorney and the one to make the call to charge six police officers in the death of Freddie Gray. Mosby was the first in her family to earn a college degree, graduating with honors from Tuskegee University and from Boston College Law School. She then joined the Baltimore City state's attorney's office before becoming a prosecutor.
Raised in inner city Boston, Mosby says she learned the value of public service from her grandfather.
MOSBY: He was a founding member of the black police organization in Massachusetts. He was a police officer. My uncles were police officers. My mother was, my father was.
ELAM: And despite criticism from the police union for what it calls a rush to press charges, Mosby says she's sympathetic to officers called to duty.
MOSBY: I understand the time, the commitment, the sacrifice that these police officers make. And I'm not saying in particularly with this case, those officers usurped their authority, you have to be able to hold them accountable because it does a disservice to the really hardworking police officers.
ELAM: She has two daughters with her husband, Baltimore City Councilman Nick Mosby.
When asked if her marriage presented a conflict of interest, Mosby said.
MOSBY: He works on the legislative side. I'm a prosecutor. I'm also a public servant. I uphold the law, he makes the laws. And I will prosecute any case within my jurisdiction.
MAJOR GENERAL LINDA SINGH, U.S. ARMY: I did not have any racial issues coming through all of my career. I would have to say it's been more about me being a female versus, you know, being a male.
ELAM: As the adjutant general for Maryland, Linda Singh is in charge of the state's military department, including its national guard. Having just taken the helm in February, Singh is the first black person and the first woman to hold the post. She's also a member of the governor's cabinet.
SINGH: I just hope that we remember that trying to culture, trying to change habits does not happen overnight.
