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Hastert Abuse Claims; Federal Workers Hacked; Colorado Shootings. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired June 05, 2015 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:07] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Wolf Blitzer, thank you so much.

Great to be with you on this Friday. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Got to start with these shocking allegations here of hush money, child molestation, and abuse of power by a D.C. heavy weight. I'm talking about the man to the right here of then-President Bill Clinton here. This is former Speaker of the House Dennis Hastert. And I can now tell you a woman has come forward saying her brother, her now deceased brother, Steven Reinboldt, on the right side of your screen, endured years and years of sexual abuse in high school at the hands of the wrestling team coach, Dennis Hastert, there on the left.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOLENE BURDGE, SISTER OF EX-SPEAKER'S ALLEGED ABUSE VICTIM: And I asked, Stevie, when was your first same-sex experience? And he just looked at me and said, it was with Dennis Hastert. And I just - I know I was stunned. I said, why didn't you ever tell anybody, Stevie? I mean, he was your teacher. Why didn't you ever tell anybody? And he just looked at me and said, who is ever going to believe me? In this town, who is ever going to believe me?

BRIAN ROSS, ABC NEWS: And was it your sense this happened more than once?

BURDGE: Uh-huh. I said, you know, was it all through high school? And he said, yes. He said, you know, all through high school. I mean here was the mentor, the man who was, you know, basically his friend, who was the one that was abusing him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: This stunning ABC interview, this is the first name of an alleged abuse victim to emerge here since Hastert was indicted for lying to the FBI about trying to pay out some $3.5 million in so- called hush money. Although Steven Reinboldt's sister insisted that money was not given to her or her brother before he died.

Joining me now, Scott Viau, a reporter for "The Yorkville Patch."

And, Scott, I want to talk to you obviously about how this is resonating in Yorkville. But first, just to be clear, we still do not definitively know who "Individual A" is.

SCOTT VIAU, REPORTER, "YORKVILLE PATCH": No, we don't. When Steven Reinboldt's sister, Jolene, came forward, you know, she made it clear that Steven was not "Individual A." So we still don't know who that is and we don't know if that will ever actually come forward.

BALDWIN: And, again, just to also be clear on, you know, the charges he's facing as per this indictment, this is all related to the fact that he was taking out, you know, more than $10,000 in cash out of banks, which is a no-no. And there are no, you know, charges whatsoever involving any kind of sexual abuse.

VIAU: No, there are not. I mean the statute of limitations has passed on that. So even if Steven was still alive, unfortunately he wouldn't be able to press any charges against Hastert due to it taking place so long ago.

BALDWIN: OK. You know, here you are. You're in Yorkville, you know, reading about just sort of the color in the town and how, you know, Dennis Hastert, you know, you walk around Yorkville and he's just - he's known as Denny. He's beloved.

VIAU: Yes.

BALDWIN: How are people reacting to this bombshell?

VIAU: You know, people are - people are pretty reticent to talk about it. It's definitely a sensitive subject for the - for the people of Yorkville. I spoke to the mayor of Yorkville, Gary Golinski, and he said that he had been contacted by "The New York Times" and many news organizations and even he didn't necessarily want to speak about it. It's definitely a sensitive subject for everybody in Yorkville.

BALDWIN: Scott Viau, thank you so much for joining me. I really appreciate it.

I want to push this forward with Mark Geragos, defense attorney and CNN legal analyst.

So, Mark Geragos, again, you know, we don't know who "Individual A" is in this indictment. Will - do you think we'll ever know who "Individual A" is?

MARK GERAGOS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yes, we'll know who "Individual A" is shortly. He's going to be arraigned. Once he's arraigned, he's going to get the discovery. "Individual A" will be revealed in the discovery. And that will leak out within a matter of days. So I would predict by this time next week, by next Friday, you'll know who "Individual A" is.

BALDWIN: All right. So let's go with your prediction. And if that happens, come this time next week, whether it's with that individual or we just heard from the sister of the man who's now deceased who is this alleged victim, apparently enduring this abuse as Dennis Hastert was his wrestling coach. I mean given all of that - and, again, as that reporter just pointed out, statute of limitations on that case has run out - could there be new charges?

GERAGOS: Well, look, the - if you believe that this is what happened, and if you believe what the allegations are, there's no way that this is somebody who just stopped abruptly back in the '80s and then nothing else happened. You may have yourself a Bill Cosby type situation where people start to come forward.

BALDWIN: Meaning multiple people coming forward.

GERAGOS: Multiple accusers coming forward. And if it is, in fact, that there's a predilection for youth or people who are underage, you don't have to worry about somebody who is, unfortunately, passed away. There likely could be somebody more recent. I don't know if that's the case or not, but certainly in everything - the way this has unfolded has not been surprising in - to those of us who are in the criminal justice system. This is a story often told with people in the community who seem to be these kinds of upstanding youth leaders and then all of a sudden you see that there is a different or a darker side. And I also will predict that there are going to be more people coming out very soon.

[14:05:42] BALDWIN: So, you know, it takes me back to Dennis Hastert, the fact that we know he'll be in court Tuesday. There really hasn't been a peep from him, not a statement, nothing. How will he, how should he, if you were advising him, respond to this, speak about this?

GERAGOS: He's doing exactly what he should do. There's no - there's absolutely nothing that is going to help him at this point from a legal standpoint by having him come out and do any kind of spin or damage control or anything else. He needs to just put his head down and shoulder through this. The criminal defense lawyers are going to be running this ship. He is not in a crisis management mode because, frankly, this is not something - I mean he's been thrown overboard by his law firm and they're not - they're not dealing with him or are going to deal with him. There's not much he can do until he gets through the criminal action because he's at great peril and in great jeopardy here. Any time you're indicted for lying to the FBI, and any time you're indicted for the kinds of financial shenanigans that he's involved with, you're facing substantial time, number one, and at his age, substantial time with his life expectancy. So he doesn't have -

BALDWIN: How much are we talking?

GERAGOS: He doesn't have an interest. And I would tell him - well, I mean, this is somebody who could be looking at 50 to 75 months. And, you know, with his life expectancy, that's - that's potentially almost the rest of his life.

BALDWIN: We - we'll see if your prediction is true, Mark Geragos. Let's look back this time next week, shall we? Mark Geragos, thank you so much.

GERAGOS: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Coming up next, it could be the biggest cyber-attack against the United States government, ever. The United States blaming China. Is this another chapter in a very quiet war?

Also ahead, police shoot a man who was wearing headphones at one point. The family now releasing the entire police body cam video. You will see it. We'll speak with members of this family live. You're watching CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:11:51] BALDWIN: You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

The federal government today scrambling to determine the scope and reach of what's being called possibly the biggest cyber-attack in U.S. history. Hackers infiltrated a server, swiping personal information of 4 million current and former federal workers. The culprit, according to the feds, is China. The information stolen is believed to include Social Security numbers, names of government agents and addresses.

Joining me now to discuss the damage and the fallout, Rob Knake. He is the senior fellow for cyber policy at the Council on Foreign Relations.

Rob, great to have you on.

ROB KNAKE, SENIOR FELLOW FOR CYBER POLICY, COUNCIL ON FOREIGN RELATIONS: Happy to be here.

BALDWIN: So, you know, you were at the White House. You're responsible for the development of presidential policy on cyber security, the National Security Council. You know a lot about this stuff that we plebeians do not. So with what you know, what surprised you most about the hack?

KNAKE: What surprised me most about the hack is the fact that it was so quickly attributed to China and to the Chinese government specifically.

BALDWIN: You're skeptical.

KNAKE: I am deeply skeptical. I think the first thing to be clear about is, this is not official attribution coming out of the U.S. government. This is information that's been leaked to the press by government officials. But that's very different than the government coming out and saying, we know this is China, which is what happened with North Korea back in December with the Sony incident.

BALDWIN: So then the obvious follow-up is, if not China, then who?

KNAKE: Well, if you look at the information that was targeted, and from what we know so far it's personally identifiable information. It's Social Security numbers, birth dates, addresses. It's the kind of information that criminals want to commit fraud. It's what was stolen from Anthem. It's what was stolen from Blue Cross and Blue Shield in recent data hacks. So given that, my first suspect is that it's a criminal organization who wants to use this for tax fraud or insurance fraud or to take out credit cards. BALDWIN: You really - I mean, I'm talking to someone else next hour

and he said to me, Brooke, this is so much bigger than getting information to take out a credit card, you know, in some FBI agent's name given their information. You don't think it's bigger than that? Again, we're talking 4 million people here with incredibly personal information.

KNAKE: So, let's think about what a Chinese intelligence agency would want to do with that information. What good is it to them to know the Social Security number of a clerk at the Commerce Department?

BALDWIN: You got me.

KNAKE: What they want is intelligence. They want information that they can use that will tell them what the United States is thinking and what the United States is doing. This information isn't that. It also doesn't help them get to that.

BALDWIN: So then what would it help them get to?

KNAKE: Well, I mean, I think the most obvious answer is, unless China is looking to engage massively in credit card fraud, it probably wasn't the Chinese government. It probably is some group that wants us to think it was the Chinese government. It's probably a criminal group whose intention is to throw off the trail and get law enforcement led down a rabbit hole that they'll never come out of in mainland China.

BALDWIN: OK. So then lift the veil for me. Behind the scenes at the White House, what's being done about this right now? What's being said?

KNAKE: What's going on is a very slow, very careful process to go through the forensics, to trace the attack back from where it was first discovered to the first computer that contacted the compromised system to get the logs from that compromised computer to go to the next one to see where it leads. And then what will happen at a certain point, when they've got enough evidence through law enforcement and through intelligence, they might go to China if that's where it leads and they might say, we've got this evidence, it leads here. Will you help us with our investigation?

[14:15:34] At that point, if the Chinese government says, yes, we will help you with the investigation, here are the log files, this looks like it was a criminal group, then we would know, in fact, that the Chinese government were not behind it. If, on the other hand, they stall and they're unhelpful, that would be a good indication that, in fact, it might be the Chinese government. But that process is probably going to take months to play out. So I think it's far too soon to conclude definitively that the Chinese government was behind this.

BALDWIN: OK. Rob Knake at the Council of Foreign Relations, thank you so much, sir. I appreciate your expertise.

KNAKE: Thank you, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Coming up next, this is incredibly difficult video to watch. Just be forewarned. This man in Utah wearing headphones was shot by police when apparently he didn't hear their call for him to turn around. The officer has been cleared of any wrongdoing and now the family has released the full video from this police body cam. We're going to speak with this man's aunt and his brother live after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:20:40] BALDWIN: Fears of a possible serial sniper has put people in northern Colorado on edge. Three shootings since April, two of them deadly. Authorities say at least two of these shootings are connected, but they have not said if this latest victim here, 65-year-old William Roger Connole (ph), is linked to the others, but people are frightened.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SAMANTHA CADWELL, FORT COLLINS, COLORADO, RESIDENT: It's pretty scary. Everybody that I've talked to, especially at work and my friends, we're very scared. I avoid I-25 as much as I can. And my kids, I make sure that they're in the backseat of the car. And we - actually we try not to ride our bikes in the morning or we avoid being out late at night.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: This case here in Colorado certainly brings back memories of the 2002 D.C. sniper case that terrorized that region for three excruciating long weeks. Ten people there were killed. Convicted were John Allen Muhammad and his teen accomplice, Lee Boyd Malvo. Muhammad was executed in 2009. Malvo is currently serving life in prison.

And joining me now is a former member of that task force team that worked that D.C. sniper case, former ATF assistant director Mike Bouchard.

So, Mike, thank you so much for coming on.

MIKE BOUCHARD, FORMER TASK FORCE COMMANDER IN DC SNIPER CASE: Thank you, Brooke.

BALDWIN: I mean I think in order to understand what could be happening in Colorado, let - take me back in D.C. and at what point did you all start to realize that those shootings were connected?

BOUCHARD: In the D.C. case, when we were able to connect the ballistics from the different cases, we knew all the shootings had been linked. A lot of the victims were certainly different, and a lot of the things that they were doing at the time they were shot were different. So the key was the ballistics.

BALDWIN: And how do you? Explain that process of taking a look at the ballistics to connect all of them.

BOUCHARD: Well, what we looked at is the trajectory analysis to figure out where the shots were coming from, what distance, what angle, to try and find out where the shots were taken from to see if there was any spent shell cases that would also be evidentiary in nature. And then from the victims, we took the projectile that was fired from the gun and through ballistics we were able to determine what (INAUDIBLE) came from, unique characteristics every time a gun - a bullet fires through a barrel. So we were able to keep those and match them with every subsequent shooting and link them all together.

BALDWIN: Wow. So that was D.C. Here we are with this situation in northern Colorado. And I know you're not, you know, on the inside of this investigation, but based upon what you've read, what you know, what does it appear to look like in your opinion?

BOUCHARD: I don't think they would call this a serial sniper case. Right now they've only got two shootings that have been linked together. They're very - being close cold about what the - how they're able to link those shootings. And that's probably smart on their part. It's just everyone needs to be - increase their awareness, be a little more vigilant about their surroundings, report any strange activity of anyone that they know of that's not acting right or has talked or shown a lot more interest about this shooting so that the authorities can look into it.

BALDWIN: I mean, you heard the woman that we just heard from where she was saying, she tries to avoid this highway, I-25, as much as she can. She puts her kids in the back of the car. They try not to ride bikes late at night. I mean this is affecting, you know, day-to-day activities of some of these folks who live in these parts of Colorado.

So here you have this city on edge. I'll never forget, you know, I lived outside of D.C. during the serial sniper case. I mean it was frightening. How do you manage? What do you, as an authority, tell the community to keep living your lives?

BOUCHARD: And that's key. Law enforcement needs to keep reinforcing to people that, you know, these are isolated incidents. They need to go about living their lives. A lot of the times when people do serial shootings, they're living off the notoriety. They thrive on it. So the more it's reported, the more attention they get, the better off they feel, which makes them do more. So it's kind of a catch 22.

But people just need to be very vigilant. Law enforcement will talk to them, reinforce all the things that they're doing, how much closer they're coming to solving the case, and always seeking the public's attention and input.

BALDWIN: Which is just, again, so sick what they're doing and loving the notoriety of it all.

Mike Bouchard, thank you so much for joining me.

(INAUDIBLE).

[14:25:05] BALDWIN: Coming up next, this (INAUDIBLE) man had his headphones on. Here he was at this gas station. He was shot and killed by police when he didn't hear their call for him to turn around. The full video of this full incident has now been released. Will it shed new light on the case? We'll talk to members of the family next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Bottom of the hour. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

An unarmed man was shot and killed by police. The officer has since been cleared, but this 2014 case out of Utah is now facing renewed outrage because the man's aunt took it upon herself to upload this entire police body cam video of the encounter on to YouTube. And so we're going to play you much of that footage in just a second, but it had to be heavily edited because it is incredibly graphic in nature. So just to give you a warning.

[14:30:10] We first told you the story about Dylan Taylor back in August of last year.