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Bangkok Bombing at Popular Hindu Shrine; Trump Releases Immigration Plan; Dangerous Chemicals in Northern China After Blast; North Korea Makes Threats Over Joint Military Exercises; First Pro Baseball Player Comes Out as Gay. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired August 17, 2015 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:30:00] ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Breaking News.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.

And we do begin with breaking news out of Bangkok, Thailand. A terrible explosion at a Hindu shrine there. One very popular with tourists. It's called the Erawan Shrine. It's a Hindu shrine. Some sort of huge bomb blast going on. In fact, we have video of the moment of impact. Let's watch.

Oh, you can see that bright flash of light. And CNN has confirmed at least five people died because of this blast, but there may be -- there may be many, many more casualties and many more dead. In fact, we've just had a reporter on the scene tell us that there's body parts scattered around the scene. In fact, some of the pictures are so gruesome, we just cannot show them on television.

This is a shrine that's well attended by tourists. There are dance troops there. A lot of people go to, you know, to look at the shrine and to see it. It's usually a peaceful place. This is right in the middle of a very touristy area near a five-star hotel. There is also many upscale shops around. Also, this shrine, interestingly enough, is attended by many Buddhists. Now, I don't know if that has anything to do with anything. That's why I want to bring in global affairs analyst Bobby Ghosh. He's well educated in this area of the world.

So, Bobby, just your initial reaction to this.

BOBBY GHOSH, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST (via telephone): Well, Carol, this -- whoever did this has done this for maximum damage and maximum terror. This is the equivalent of setting off a bomb in New York's Times Square. This is a tourist attraction of that kind of scale. Everybody who goes to Bangkok goes to Erawan. I've been there a couple of times myself. You go there. It's a beautiful temple. Right next to it is an Intercontinental Hotel. There's a Renaissance Hotel. There's a Holiday Inn. As you said, there are malls and shops nearby. This is a very, very heavily trafficked place. A bomb goes off at 7:00 in the evening. It is timed and placed for maximum damage.

There's also been reports that there's another -- police have found another bomb in -- near a shopping center in another part of town. That, too, suggests that whoever did this was looking for -- looking to maximize both the visibility of what they're doing, as well as the number of victims that they could possibly kill.

It is really hard to wrap my head around this. I mean Thailand is not the place for this kind of violence. There is an insurgency in southern Thailand, but that is a very localized thing. We have not seen this kind of scale of violence in Bangkok or more generally in that country.

COSTELLO: Well -- well, I was just trying -- it is hard to wrap your head around this. It's a Hindu shrine. You don't hear -- you don't hear many stories about Hindu shrines or temples being targeted by terrorists. So do you think it's -- it was more a targeting of this area, not the temple?

GHOSH: I would have to get a better sense of where exactly the bomb was. I understand it was placed in a motorcycle. But, yes, my initial instinct would be that this is -- the fact that it is a Hindu shrine is perhaps of secondary importance. I think it is more important that it is a big, big terrorist -- sorry, beg your pardon, a big tourist spot and that there's a dense population of people around. At 7:00 in the evening, there would be a lot of people hanging out there enjoying the shops and restaurants. I think that would be it. I mean it is a Hindu shrine. But as you pointed out, Bangkok -- Thailand is a mostly Buddhist country. And it is a shrine that is visited by predominately, I would think, by Buddhists and by foreign tourists who are neither Buddhists nor are Hindu. It's -- in some sense, as a tourist attraction, it is almost a secular one. And I suspect --

COSTELLO: All right. Bobby -- Bobby hang on for just a minute --

GHOSH: Yes.

COSTELLO: Because we have new pictures coming in and I just want to explain to people what these new pictures are. These are pictures from hospitals around the area. And we do expect the number of casualties to rise, as I said. At least five confirmed dead right now, Bobby, but we've heard that, you know, body parts are scattered throughout the area and many, many people are injured. And it's just -- it's truly heartbreaking because these people were visiting a temple, you know, number one, and they're visiting a beautiful country in a beautiful city of Bangkok.

GHOSH: Yes, and one that has very little track record of this kind of terrorist activity. Southeast Asia, in general, is a peaceful part of the world. And Bangkok is, you know, celebrates itself for being a place where people from around the world can come and enjoy lots of different cultural activities, great food, loving, loving people, very warm, very friendly to tourists in general. So whoever did this was sort of putting a knife through the heart, not only of Bangkok, but of Thailand and the Thai people. I'm sure we will learn very soon who was responsible, but it is -- it is a big, big shock.

COSTELLO: Oh, Bobby Ghosh, thanks so much.

I'll be right back. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:37:03] COSTELLO: Finally, Republican frontrunner Donald Trump reveals how he'd fight illegal immigration if he is elected president. One of his top priorities, to end birthright citizenship which allows children who are born in the United States to be granted citizenship, even if their parents came here illegally. To do so, however, would require a change in the U.S. Constitution. Here's how Trump responded when he was pressed on the issue by NBC's Chuck Todd.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We have to make a whole new set of standards. And when people come in, they have to come in --

CHUCK TODD, NBC: So you're going split up families?

TRUMP: Chuck --

TODD: You're going to deport children?

TRUMP: Chuck. No, no, we're going to keep the families together. We have to keep the families together.

TODD: But you're going to keep them together out?

TRUMP: But they have to go. But -- they have to go.

TODD: What if they have no place to go?

TRUMP: We will work with them. They have to go. Chuck, we have a country or we don't have a country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Among some of the other highlights of Trump's plan, make Mexico pay for that border wall, deport criminal aliens, suspend new green card issuances, and triple immigration agents along the border, although Mr. Trump did not say how he would exactly pay for that. Critics warn Trump's plan is dangerous and would result in a policed state.

So let's talk about that. Trump supporter Terra Grant is back with me.

Welcome, Terra.

And Republican strategist Rick Wilson --

TERRA GRANT, DONALD TRUMP SUPPORTER: Good morning.

COSTELLO: Good morning.

Rick Wilson is with us, too.

RICK WILSON, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Good morning.

COSTELLO: He's a Republican strategies.

So, Terra, I want to start with you. Trump's plan, is it music to your ears?

GRANT: I definitely agree with the plan. Of course, I do. Of course, as an American citizens, I have some questions about how -- of course, how are we going to fund it? But I also have faith that, you know, his policies -- everyone said, well, he doesn't have any policies. We have no policies in place. So now he's rolling out his policies. And especially on immigration, I do believe we have a huge problem with the border. We've got to get a border up. We've got to get a wall. And if the Mexican government is pushed to make that happen, well, we have a lot of illegal immigrants who come into this country, they work illegally, they make American money and then they send it back to Mexico to support their families. So that money is going back to Mexico. So the money is there to make that happen, I do believe.

COSTELLO: Terra -- Terra, are you for -- are you for changing the Constitution?

GRANT: You know, I think we get into a slippery slope when we start changing the Constitution. I do. Birthright citizenship, I'm not, you know, I don't necessarily think that -- I don't necessarily know that I agree whole heartedly with changing the Constitution. I don't. I'm still up in the air. It's definitely one of those things that it is definitely a slippery slope, Carol. Absolutely.

COSTELLO: At lot of people would agree with you.

So, Rick Wilson, you have worked on behalf of very conservative Republican candidates, Dick Cheney among them. So what do you think about Donald Trump's plan?

WILSON: Well, look, I think that this -- this plan represents a really strong dichotomy between limited government and status nationalism. And I think that there are a lot of the details here that are going to be very, very popular among both the Trump base and other people because no one's dismissing that immigration is an enormous problem. No one's dismissing we have a problem with sanctuary cities, with criminal illegals. There are a whole panoply of things that are wrong with our immigration system.

[09:40:23] However, I think that Trump has promised some things that are going to be very, very difficult to deliver. First off, the birthright citizens question is a constitutional alteration that is a very, very large and meaningful redefinition of what it is to be an American. The second thing that I think is very, very problematic is, he is talking about deporting between 11 and 20 million people. In order to do that, you're going to have to build an apparatus so enormous and so -- and so intrusive into American life that I think there are a lot of unintended consequences to that. I am very skeptical of limited --

COSTELLO: But explain that -- explain that more. Rick, I want you to get into that more because you have said it --

WILSON: Sure.

COSTELLO: Trump's plan would create a policed state. What do you mean by that?

WILSON: You're going to -- if you're going to deport up to 20 million people, he's talking about deporting them. They are -- they are being rounded up and shipped over the border. OK. Now, no one disagrees that if you're a criminal illegal, you ought to be shipped back. In fact, that's in most every single Republican candidate's plan. Very few people are as direct about this as Trump has been of saying he's going deport 20 million people. You know the people that are happiest about this are Trump's most fanatical supporters and Hillary Clinton, because this is a -- this is a sweeping and enormous expansion of police power at the federal level.

He's talking about preempting local law enforcement, taking state and local law enforcement out of the picture, and using it some sort of nonexistent federal force right now. you know, he is talking about tripling the I.C.E. budget. But you're going -- talked about deporting 20 million people. I mean, whether it's a great idea or not, if it's -- let's just say all 20 million were illegal criminals, horrible people. Trying to deport that many people is an enormous logistical question that we are not grapple -- we have never grappled with something of that scope and scale. And it is an expansion of government power that just like I think the TSA and Obamacare and the Department of Homeland Security, it will grow and metastasize and become something that people do not like at the end of the day.

COSTELLO: Terra, what do you think about what Rick just said?

WILSON: It's not -- it's not an excuse for illegals. It --

COSTELLO: Right. Well, I'd like to get Terra's thoughts on what you just said, Rick.

GRANT: I -- I -- I really do, I agree whole heartily with Rick. I think a huge amount of infrastructure is going to have to be put in place to make something of this -- I mean it's huge. It's a huge plan. So how do we make that happen?

I think his heart, I think his mind is in the right place. I think a lot of people -- my question is, how does this affect our economy? Yes, a lot of illegal immigrants are in this country. They are making money, but from America. They send it back. But they also do spend a lot of their money here in the United States. So, economically, how will it affect the United States of America?

And I really do, I love the plan. I love the idea that, hey, let's get some of these illegal immigrants out of the country. Let's get them out of -- out of here. So maybe more whites who have not been able to acquire jobs, maybe they can get into jobs. Some of the blacks, he -- he -- he --

COSTELLO: So -- so, Terra -- Terra, just an -- just an added question for you.

GRANT: Yes, of course.

COSTELLO: So I hear what you're saying, right. So why didn't Donald Trump come out and say, you know what, every company that hires an illegal alien -- and that's a terrible term, so an illegal immigrant, right, will be fined.

GRANT: (INAUDIBLE).

COSTELLO: We're going to come down hard on corporations who do that. Why didn't he say that?

GRANT: You know, that's -- that's a very good question. I mean, I even asked myself that. The only thing that I can think of he's a businessman. He's a big thinker. He's a company guy. And so instead of coming down on big companies, let's come down on, hey, let's put a plan in place that we can wrangle them all up, send them back.

And we are. We do deport. This country has deported. I had a good friend of mine, he was here illegally, unfortunately, but he got deported back to his country. But he went back to South America. And I think that's one of the big things. You know, we're so focused on the border between Mexico and the United States --

COSTELLO: Right.

GRANT: But we have a lot of illegal immigrants coming from South America making that trek. And now my friend, I mean he did, he went back to his home country and we do, we FaceBook each other and we talk to each other. But, right now, I mean he's on a 10-year waiting list and he has to pay fines and he has to pay those fees. And I am all for --

COSTELLO: I'm going to have to stop you there, Terra, because your satellite window is just about to run out.

GRANT: OK.

COSTELLO: I'm just going to be honest, so you're going to just disappear and I don't want that to seem like we did that on purpose, because we haven't.

GRANT: Thank you.

COSTELLO: But, Terra, thank you very much.

GRANT: Thank you, Carol.

COSTELLO: So, Rick, just -- just button this up for us. So you heard Terra, she -- she likes Trump's plan but she's not totally sold on it.

[09:45:03] So what does that mean for the presidential race?

WILSON: Well, I think what you've got here is like a lot of other things about Donald Trump. There is a lot of anger and anxiety in the culture and the society right now. He's tapping into some of that. And he doesn't feel the need to have a plan that is thought through or robust. It's a very emotional, very visceral, very atavistic reaction to the kind of things that he says by people who believe they have been betrayed by the evil establishment or what have you.

And so they're looking for a sort of release, a sort of venting function with Trump, and they're getting it in a plan like this, that we -- that when you look at it and start peeling back the details of it both economically and politically and in terms of the policy itself, you know, the details are a little shaky and the things are much more complicated and much more consequential than the "send them all back, build the wall" rhetoric that is very popular.

Like I said, the plan will be enormously popular with his base and with Hillary Clinton. She wll love this. This is the policy that launched a thousand ads in the fall of next year.

COSTELLO: All right. Rick Wilson, thanks for your insight. I appreciate it, as always.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, in the wake of those deadly explosions in China, safety conditions in the country are under scrutiny. And guess what? It ain't pretty.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Two thousand Chinese soldiers are searching around the site of those enormous blasts in Northern China. They're looking for anymore dangerous chemicals. And we've been wondering about the intense explosions in China and the dangers they present. Because we still don't know what kind of chemicals are involved or what kind of chemicals could cause such violent blasts. And also, what is the next step? Is the air too toxic to breathe in Northern China?

Let's bring in David Leggett right now. He's a chemical risk expert. Hi David, thanks for being with me this morning.

DAVID LEGGETT, CHEMICAL RISK ANALYST: Good morning.

COSTELLO: So do you have any idea what these chemicals were that caused such a violent explosion?

LEGGETT: The chemicals that -- specifically to your question, actually, no, we don't. But we do have four confirmed chemicals that have caused (INAUDIBLE). And two of those, sodium cyanide and calcium carbide, are problematic. The other two are strong oxidizers but would not directly give rise to such explosions. However--

COSTELLO: Before you go on, sir,

Before you go on, sir, what is sodium -- what did you say? Sodium cyanide.

[09:50:02] LEGGETT: Yes, the sodium cyanide and calcium carbide.

COSTELLO: What are they? What do they do? What are they used for?

LEGGETT: OK. Sodium cyanide is used industrially most often as electroplating chemical, used in electroplating business, to plate golds over zinc, things like that. It is extremely toxic. About a quarter of a teaspoon if you ingest it will kill you in about two minutes. Carbon carbide is used to make plastics, some certain plastics, and it's water reactive. And when it reacts with water, you get acetylene, which is a very flammable and very explosive gas.

COSTELLO: Wow. OK. So "The Christian Science Monitor" described the force of the blast best. It said, "The force of the initial blast equaled that of three tons of TNT. The second explosion was seven times stronger, the equivalent of 21 tons of explosives. The explosions were so large they were seen by satellites in space."

So when Chinese firefighters first arrived on the scene, they used water to try to put out the fire. Did that make the explosions worse?

LEGGETT: It is an entirely a plausible scenario, and obviously we need to be careful at this point, but it's a very plausible scenario to say, yes, they were not aware that the calcium carbide was present in the fire and, therefore, putting water on the fire with calcium carbide present would really have made this a bad situation. And I should say we don't yet know what other chemicals were in that warehouse that also would become explosive under strong heating such as in a fire.

COSTELLO: Do you think the air is safe to breathe in northern CHINA?

LEGGETT: I don't know. I've never been there, but from what I read, you know, you don't want to be there for too long. Let's put it that way.

COSTELLO: All right, David Leggett, thanks for your insight. I appreciate it. Really scary.

North Korea is threatening an attack on U.S. soil. This is because of military drills in South Korea this morning. Threatening military action over the war games is nothing new for the North Korean regime, but some say this year's rhetoric seems particularly amped up. The state-run Korean Central News agency warns, quote, "IF the United States want their mainland to be safe, then the Ulchi Freedom Guardian training exercises should stop immediately."

CNN's Brian Todd has been following all things North Korean. Brian, what moe can you tell us about this?

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Carol, this morning a State Department official has told us they are aware of this threat. This official stressed that these exercises between the U.S. and South Korea are defensive in nature, they are transparent, and they are designed to basically increase the readiness of South Korean forces in that region.

Threats are not new, as you mentioned, from Kim Jong-Un when these exercises take place. The exercises take place every year. The U.S. and South Korea are very transparent about them.

But as far as -- there are a couple things that we have to say this morning about this threat. No. 1, as far as North Korea's threat to strike at the U.S. mainland is concerned, U.S. officials and all the weapons experts we talk to are pretty much on the same page about this: North Korea does not have the capability right now to strike at the U.S. mainland with nuclear weapons or ballistic missiles or anything else. Now they're working on it but right now they don't have that capability.

Another thing though that is concerning, Carol, is that in these exercises there are 50,000 South Korean troops participating. There are 30,000 American troops participating. If Kim Jong-Un decides to provoke something, those troops could be at risk right there in the region,, right there where those exercises are taking place.

And one very important thing to think about this morning, Carol, very recently Kim Jong-Un for the first time since he took power actually launched an attack outside of his own borders. North Korean troops, according to South Korean officials, crossed the demilitarized zone, crossed the demarcation line recently, and planted land mines which badly injured two South Korean soldiers. They almost were killed. Both of them had to have parts of their legs amputated. South Korean officials say there's no other entity that could have done this except for North Korean troops, that they crossed the demilitarized zone and planted those mines. So that's the first time that Kim Jong-Un has launched an attack across his own borders since he's taken power. That could be a sign that he's becoming a little bit more aggressive. Those are things to watch out for this morning.

COSTELLO: All right. Brian Todd, many thanks to you. And Brian will be on "THE SITUATION ROOM" with Wolf Blitzer with the latest on North Korea's threats. You can catch it tonight, 5:00 p.m. Eastern on CNN.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, an historic moment in professional sports. The first ever active baseball player says he's gay.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:56:54] COSTELLO: Checking some top stories for you at 56 minutes past. Tragedy in the family of actor Morgan Freeman. Police found Morgan's step granddaughter fatally stabbed outside her New York City apartment. Her boyfriend has been charged. A witness described what he saw.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I go to the window, and I see him on top of a woman, and I couldn't really see what was going on, but then the police came, like two police cars came and arrested the guy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: E'dena Hines, who was 33 years old, recently moved to New York to pursue acting. Morgan Freeman said in a statement, "Her star continues to shine bright in our hearts, thoughts, and prayers. May she rest in peace."

In South Africa, former Olympian Oscar Pistorius could soon be released from prison. He's only served ten months of a five-year sentence for fatally shooting his girlfriend Reeva Steenkamp. If released, Pistorius will spend the rest of his sentence under house arrest. Steenkamp's family opposes the move, saying ten months behind bars for taking a life is not enough.

For the first time ever, an active baseball player affiliated with a Major League team has come out as gay. CNN's Andy Scholes joins us now with more on Milwaukee Brewers prospect David Denson. Good morning, Andy.

ANDY SCHOLES, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: And good morning, Carol. David Denson, he's a member of the Brewers organization. He plays for a minor league team in Helena, Montana, and over the weekend he reached out to "The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel" to announce that he is, in fact, gay.

Now, in the past two years we have seen this in pretty much every major word. Robbie Rogers in Major League Soccer, Jason Collins in the NBA, Michael Sam in the NFL, and now Denson is the first active professional baseball player playing for a team affiliated with a Major League club.

Now the way Denson actually came out to his teammates is pretty unique. According to "The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel", one of Denson's teammates jokingly referred to him using a derogatory term for a gay male and Denson, well, he responded with a smile saying, well, be careful what you say, you never know.

Denson then went on to make the announcement to everyone on the team, and Denson said the outcome was amazing and that everyone was very supportive of him. And Brewers superstar Ryan Braun recently talked about this. He applauded the move and he added that a gay player would be accepted at the Major League level.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIIP)

RYAN BRAUN, BREWERS OUTFIELDER: It's a courageous move on his part. It's never easy to be the first one, first active player to come out in a situation like that. It's definitely a big step for baseball, I think a big step for sports, and hopefully people judge him based on his ability and not his race, religion, ethnicity, or sexuality.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHOLES: Throughout this process, Denson has had some help. He's been consulting with Billy Beane, who is a former Major Leaguer who came out as gay after his playing career, and last year Beane was named Major League Baseball's first ambassador for inclusion.

Now, it's been a pretty tough process for Denson though. At one point, he said he was depressed about keeping this inside and it was really affecting his performance on the field. But, Carol, since revealing he is gay, Denson said it's been a huge relief and now he can just go out there and concentrate on playing baseball.

[10:00:00] COSTELLO: And, you know, a couple years ago I interviewed Justin Verlander and Max Scherzer on whether they would accept a gay player on their teams and both said they'd be perfectly fine with it. So that's great, right?

SCHOLES: It seems like locker rooms now, these days, Carol, very accepting of this.

COSTELLO: I hope so. Andy Scholes reporting life. Thanks so much.

The next hour of CNN NEWSROOM starts now.