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Second Republican presidential debate is set at Reagan presidential library; State of emergency has been declared in Northern California where two huge wildfires are quickly gaining ground; Kim Davis, the Kentucky county clerk who refused to sign same-sex marriage licenses will head back to work tomorrow; Refugee crisis unfolding in Europe; Marry Barra tops the "Fortune's" most powerful women list; 5- 6p ET
Aired September 13, 2015 - 17:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: All right, checking the top stories now, Austrian Federal Railway says Germany has stopped all train traffic to and from Austria until Monday morning local time. Thousands of Syrians have flooded train stations since the two countries opened their doors to refugees. Reuters is reporting a record number who were expected to enter Austria from Hungary today. And tomorrow, the Ferguson Commission will release its final report into what court system and police department changes should be made in that city in Missouri. The group pf local leaders came together last year before a grand jury chose not to indict a Ferguson, Missouri police officer in the shooting death of Michael Brown.
And three-time NBA MVP Moses Malone has died. He was the first player to come directly from high school to the NBA. Malone was just 60 years old. He died in his sleep. He played 20 seasons for the Philadelphia 76ers.
All right, thanks so much for spending the day with me and John Berman out in California. I'm Fredricka Whitfield. The next hour of the NEWSROOM begins right now.
[17:00:00] POPPY HARLOW, CNN HOST: Hi, everyone. Thank you so much for being with me. I'm Poppy Harlow in New York. It is 5:00 here this Sunday evening on the East Coast.
And up first tonight, presidential politics and the candidates out in full force ahead of a highly anticipated event in the race for the Republican nomination. In just three days, the Republican nominees will square off in scenic Simi Valley, California for the next GOP debate right here on CNN.
The setting, the Ronald Reagan presidential museum and library. Inside the library, crew members hard at work getting the stage ready right next to air force one, the retired presidential plane. Expect this debate to have plenty of fireworks. Fifteen candidates going out on the Sunday talk shows this morning on full attack mode.
First up, Donald Trump center stage and still dominating the polls.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, I'm a deal maker. I'll make great deals for this country. Ben can't do that. Ben's a doctor and he's not a deal maker.
BEN CARSON (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well. I'm gratified to see that so many people are actually starting to listen to what I'm saying and evaluating it on its merits as opposed to listening to what people have portrayed me as saying. It's make a big difference.
GOV. SCOTT WALKER (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We are convinced in the state were caucuses are the name of the game. And it's about five months out. We've got the time to make the grassroots connections and get that message out.
GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I have absolutely no doubt I could come down to Congress, not cave like other people have done, and get the job done.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: Just some of what we heard this morning. Over the next two hours, we have all the political angles covered ahead of the big debate, Wednesday. Thanks to the best political team in television, our correspondents, our contributors including debate moderator Jake Tapper.
Let's go straight to California. That's where we find Brooke Baldwin outside of the Reagan library with unarguably the best assignment of the week.
Hi, Brooke.
BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN HOST: I am full on geeking out right now. I don't know if you can tell. But I mean, I hit the ground here in California on Friday afternoon, Poppy. You would love this. I will enjoy this extra for you, my friend. But being here in Simi Valley, flanked by the Santa Susana mountain rage here to my left. This beautiful fountain. This massive museum and library.
I mean, I walked around the area where the debate stage is set. And let me just say just the history, walking through Air Force One, a little bit of Ronald Reagan trivia. He was a big birthday guy. So any time, anyone of member of the press, you know, was on Air Force One and have a birthday, he would always have a cake on the ready for them. And so, there is actually a replica cake. There is China, there is everything. Forgive me, I'm geeking.
Back to politics. Back to what's happening this coming Wednesday. One of the things we'll be watching for three days is the tone of the candidates. This morning on CNN's "STATE OF THE UNION" with Jake Tapper, RNC Reince Priebus was asked about that very same thing and whether he thought all the insults. Listen, this has gotten extraordinarily personal, all this negative rhetoric would hurt the party's chance to win the White House. Here's what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) REINCE PRIEBUS, CHAIRMAN, REPUBLICAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE: It is the way you communicate in tone is very important. Sometimes it's not what you say, but it's how you say it. I think all of our moms have told us that. But, look, you know, all these candidates are going to have to account for their own mouths and their own words.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: Listen, tone, not the only issue that could be problematic for some of these candidates come Wednesday night and another issue potentially for the RNC. Two candidates, former New York governor George Pataki and Louisiana governor Bobby Jindal, they have now come forward and they have said they will not support Donald Trump if he is the eventual nominee.
Pataki tweeting this this morning, let me read you Pataki's tweet, says, let me be very plain, I am not going to vote for Donald Trump. He is unfit to be president. He goes on, I would hope that every one of my fellow candidates will stand up and say our party cannot nominate Donald Trump to which Trump responded, he jumped on twitter this morning quoting "why is someone like George Pataki who did a terrible job as governor of New York and registered zero in the polls allowed on the debate stage. Trump went onto tout his record during an interview for CBS's "Face the Nation".
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I've created a tremendous company. I have some of the greatest assets in the world. And to be honest with you, that is the kind of mindset we have. I'm not saying that to brag. I'm just saying, John, that's the kind of mind set that our country needs.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: All this drama comes after the RNC got all the Republican candidates, remember, to sign this loyalty pledge stating they would not mount a third-party run if they lost out on the party's nomination.
One other note. We should mention here, there will be one fewer candidate on the stage on a couple buildings away from me for the so- called happy hour debate. Remember, that airs at 6:00 before the prime time debate two hours later at 8:00. That is Texas governor Rick Perry bowing out Friday because of flagging poll numbers and financial issues with his campaign. So that is some news we wanted to get to you.
But to CNN political director David Chalian who has been here in Simi Valley for the last couple of days. And I said, David, I know we're going to get to your cheat sheet, but we need to geek out again together. I mean, walking around, this is hallow ground, obviously. But just to see the setup, to see Air Force One, everything you guys have set up is truly phenomenal.
[17:05:40] DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: It's amazing. It will be no doubt a fantastic evening on Wednesday. And you are right to say this is hallowed ground.
Just before getting on set here with you, I went to go visit Ronald Reagan's grave site. And it's - because it is just out back here in the library. And you read his quotes there and you think, this really is the father of the modern Republican movement. And so, all the issues that are going to be debated here, he is the revered figure in the party. It's the perfect place to be for this debate.
BALDWIN: And sure, his name will be mentioned more than once. And so, with your cheat sheet, if we had to think of three things that you will definitely be watching for, what is number one?
CHALIAN: Number one is Trump versus the field, right. Everybody's mission, you were pointing to Governor Pataki and Bobby Jindal's tweets this morning. Every candidate has to figure out what is their approach vis-a-vis Donald Trump. Do they want to go on the attack against him? Do they want to sort of link arms with him, the way that we have seen Ted Cruz do. And they also have to prepare for the counter punch because Donald Trump has said that is what he does best. If you hit him, he but hits back even harder.
So I think everyone on that stage has to figure out how to have a moment connected to the conversation. And as you know, the entire conversation of this campaign right now is about Donald Trump.
BALDWIN: It's so true. Jeb Bush wished it weren't. We saw him with the superman move and the t-shirt on underneath. I don't know if that will be happening here Wednesday night. Amazing. But so, what we will be watching out, item number two?
CHALIAN: Jeb's fortitude. I mean, this is a big Jeb Bush debate. Because he's going to be tested for his own strength. Does he have the ability to stand up standing next to Donald Trump on that stage and take him on?
As you know Donald Trump has been relentless in his attacks against Jeb Bush. Jeb Bush shied away from really taking him on that first debate and that caused a lot of concern inside his land of supporters. In the last couple weeks of the campaign trail, Jeb Bush has been taking on Donald Trump rhetorically on the trail and in these campaigns. That's very different when you are standing next to each other.
BALDWIN: I mean, we're talking inches away. I was standing on the stage not 15 minutes ago.
CHALIAN: But he has got to prove that he is willing not just to advocate for his own candidacy, but actually take on the Trump attack.
BALDWIN: OK. Do you think they'll look each other in the eye?
CHALIAN: I don't know.
(CROSSTALK)
CHALIAN: The body language is amazing. BALDWIN: Item number three is?
CHALIAN: Item number three is the Fiorina factor. I mean, this is -- she's on the big stage. She had a superb debate last time in the undercard. It catapulted her up. And I think having the only woman on stage and a fierce political fighter. That is what Carly Fiorina is. She does not take it from anybody. And so, I think her energy, the fact that she's the only woman and the fact that she is the new element on the stage is like watch out for what the Carly Fiorina factor is. She and Donald Trump are the mix in the puzzle.
BALDWIN: And just to quickly add onto all of that, walking around this area, and specifically where the debate will be, this is not like the big Cleveland cavalier arena. This is much more intimate. You have, what, 500 people. It feels much smaller that even standing up there. And there are people who are sitting, what, five feet from those candidates, so intimate and quiet.
CHALIAN: It is intimate. It is quiet. Which doesn't necessarily match their goals in the moment of what they need to accomplish in what has been a pretty noisy campaign so far. And so, you are right. How to calibrate in that kind of intimate setting, the strength of argument that each of these candidates, these make, will be an interesting test for them.
BALDWIN: Pressure is on. We'll be here.
I should also mention, at the bottom of the hour, Jake Tapper, who, of course, is moderating this whole thing, takes us back inside the library for a look at how the stage, as we have been talking about that, the stage, how it's getting set for Wednesday night.
For the meantime, Poppy Harlow, let's send it back to you.
HARLOW: `You guys make a great geek out team, Brooke. I feel like you're going to just sleep at the Reagan library. You're so excited to be there. Enjoy it for all of us, guys.
BALDWIN: Totally.
HARLOW: Brooke is going to be live with me from the Reagan library tonight for the next two hours. We will get back to you in just a little bit.
But let's talk a little bit more about the debate, what's at stake, and the significant to the setting you heard a lot about just there.
Peter Beinart with me here in New York. He is a contributing editor of "the Atlantic" and "the National Journal." Also in Dallas, we have CNN political commentator Ben Ferguson, host of the "Ben Ferguson show."
Guys, thank you for being with me. These candidates, all of them praising Ronald Reagan. Really, every time they get a chance, they seem to want to be the next Reagan, not just to be the president, but to really embody him, right? Even down to Jeb Bush. Take a look at that who has tried to down play his family connections at times revealing that old Reagan Bush t-shirt from 1984 yesterday in Miami.
But is Donald Trump the candidate making the most obvious effort to align himself with Reagan jumping from Hollywood, really if you will, and to politics trying to reach the highest office in the land when critics, even Carly Fiorina now calling him an entertainer, not even calling him by name. Peter, is that a fair comparison? Is that a flawed comparison?
[17:10:27] PETER BEINART, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think it's a somewhat flawed comparison. Reagan was a stalwart of the conservative movement really going back to 1964 when he burst onto the scene.
HARLOW: Right.
BEINART: He was someone who was very align ideologically for a long time. Yes, he was an entertainer. But he had decades and decades of being in Republican politics. He ran for president in 1976. What makes Trump so unusual, he has no history really with the conservative movement? A whole Hodge fudge of different political issues.
HARLOW: Used to be --
BEINART: He used to be a Democrat. Even now, he is, you know, up until very recently he had a lot of liberal positions. And he is much less predictable. Reagan was a very scripted guy. He was terrific at leading a script. Trump is completely unscripted. No one has any idea what's going to come out of his mouth. Very different.
HARLOW: Which makes compelling television. I will say.
Ben, I do want to ask you specifically about this. You heard before with Brooke that sound bite from Reince Priebus, the chairman of the RNC this morning responding to Jake Tapper's question to him about, you know, the comments especially from Donald Trump about immigrants and about Hispanics in this country. And Priebus said, basically look, the candidates are going to have to be held accountable for their own words.
Are Republicans in danger at this point, Ben, do you think in the long term of not getting the traction they need with Hispanics?
BEN FERGUSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: No, I think Donald Trump is at risk with that specific question, but not the rest of the field. Donald Trump is his own guy in a very weird, unique way. He's not defining the Republican Party. He's not the center of the Republican Party. And he is speaking -- when he comes on stage, he doesn't even know I think half the time what he's going to say which is why it is so fun to watch and why people like him because he's so real, raw, and doesn't seem like a scripted politician.
It's played to his advantage. He's placed mastered that, I'm not your normal politician. But I don't think he's even getting -- I don't think anyone that's looking at Donald Trump is thinking, God, is it Donald Trump or these other nine people? You know, they're all so similar. They're not similar. You know what I mean? I mean, they're drastically different. HARLOW: Let me get --
FERGUSON: Ben Carson is a great example.
HARLOW: Sure, they are drastically different - Ben Carson, Donald Trump, topping the polls despite their differences.
Let me ask you about this. Peter, you wrote this fascinating article we pulled up from a few years ago. It was actually in 2012 for "the Daily Beast." And you argued that Ronald Reagan would have a tough time winning the Republican nomination today. Because as president he actually grew the federal government, he expanded the best that he raised taxes several times, pay for Social Security and Medicare. He also signed the 1986 immigration bill which essentially gave amnesty to 2.7 million immigrants in this country. Do you think Republicans have forgotten all of those key things that the Reagan presidency stood for?
BEINART: Yes. I think Republicans has forgotten how ideologically flexible and pragmatic Ronald Reagan was. Yes, he was a conservative. But he was not doctrine there in the way that Republicans are being forced to be now. He also nominated two of the three Supreme Court - (INAUDIBLE) was very unpopular among conservatives. And two of the three people he appointed voted to uphold abortion rights.
Reagan had a really great instinct for where the country was. And although he talks in very conservative ways, harkening back to a traditional 1950s America, Americans that many people liked, it was only very highly contrast that Social Security and Medicare, they didn't want the government to mess with it. They didn't want the government to get them into any new wars after Vietnam. And so, Reagan had an appreciation for where the country actually was. That I think some of these Republicans today who are so focused on pleasing certain identity groups, certain interest groups, they've lost that.
HARLOW: That maybe they could benefit from.
BEINART: Absolutely.
HARLOW: We'll be watching what happens. Ben, I need --
FERGUSON: They all want to be Reagan.
HARLOW: They all want to be Reagan. We will leave it at that.
Peter Beinart, Ben Ferguson, as always, gentlemen, thank you very much.
You will not want to miss, I know Peter and Ben will be watching, the GOP presidential debate. The candidates facing off in back-to-back debates. It is Wednesday night, September the 16th, 6:00 and 8:00 p.m. only right here on CNN. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[17:17:56] HARLOW: That is a stunning and troubling statistic. And it tells you why a state of emergency has been declared in Northern California where two huge wildfires are quickly gaining ground. So far, the fast-moving flames have scorched at least 100,000 acres shut down parts of the freeway and forced thousands of people out of their homes. Those are only two of the blazes that firefighters right now are up against. You see them dotted there on the map of California from the north to the south, really difficult. Take a look how tough this summer has been, a lingering drought. Extremely dry conditions. It is only expected to get worse.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LYNNE TOLMACHOFF, CAL FIRE SPOKESWOMAN: That is a very rapid rate of spread. Very dangerous situation obviously because you can see what has happened today. It's just a reminder, this is how the conditions are in California right now. And with the temperatures and low humidity, four years of a drought, the conditions are very extreme.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: The valley fire exploded in size to 40,000 acres in less than 24 hours. And evacuations have been ordered for several communities including the town of Middletown.
Stephanie Elam with us by phone from Napa County.
Describe what you are seeing, Steph.
STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT (via phone): Yes, Poppy. We are in northern Napa County. And just so you know that the state of emergency got have been declared by the governor affect Napa County and also Lake County. That up against each other here. And we are right at a road closure where they're telling people to turn around. You can't go any further because of these fires.
That valley fire you are talking about, Poppy, really, really exploded quite quickly going from 10,000 to 40,000 in just such a little bit of time. And because of that, of you got 5,000 people who are without power we do know about. There were four firefighters that were hurt. They are injured, in stable condition with second degree burns.
But we do know that between this fire and the street (ph) fire, which is 55,000 acres, there's a lot of damage up here, a lot of turmoil. They think of the few fire that there may have been 85 homes destroyed and another 6,100 that are threatened. They know that homes have been destroyed in the valley fire, but they're not confirming the numbers just yet.
This has been very fast-moving. It is still very warm up here. And I can tell you, Poppy, that as soon as we got off the plane in Sacramento, the first thing you smell is the fire. And we were still very many miles away from it. So it's all across this northern California area. You can see it in the sky. It's hazy everywhere and you can smell that smell. When you cover wildfires it's unmistakable that sense of a raging wildfire just all throughout the air.
[17:20:25] HARLOW: And the photos we're seeing as we are talking, Stephanie, are just really unbelievable and devastating especially for the thousands of people who have had to evacuate their homes.
Stephanie, thank you very much. We'll have more with Stephanie throughout the next two hours on those fires.
Still to come, though, Kim Davis is going back to work tomorrow. Will she do her job? Will she issue marriage licenses to same-sex couples? Ahead, the Kentucky clerk's lawyer speaking to my colleague, Fredricka Whitfield, about his client and her opposition to same-sex marriage next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[17:24:37] HARLOW: Kim Davis, the Kentucky county clerk who refused to sign same-sex marriage licenses will head back to work tomorrow. The question is, will she sign or approve new same-sex licenses? Her own defense attorney tells CNN he doesn't know what's going to happen come tomorrow. But he does say Davis has been put in an impossible position.
He spoke earlier today with my colleague, Fredricka Whitfield.
[17:25:00] MATTHEW STAVER, KIM DAVIS' ATTORNEY: But she is asking for something very simple. And that is just accommodate her by removing her name and her title off the lists certificates. Kind of like what you have with some of the other licenses in Kentucky, such as the vehicle registration licenses and many other licenses. They're issued not under the name or the authority of a particular clerk of a particular county, but under the authority of the commonwealth of Kentucky. And if the licenses were changed to do that, she could process them, she could give them out, she could file them in records just like she does other documents.
You talk to Kim Davis, and she's a humble woman. She's private. She's a quiet individual. She never wanted to be in this position. And in a heartbeat, she would go back to her previous quiet, tranquil life that she's done in this job and in this community for the beginning of her life in that county. She doesn't want to be thrust in the spotlight. And the last place she wants to be is to have this very, very difficult decision that no one wants to have. And that is choose your job or choose your faith.
WHITFIELD: Do you worry about any potential conflict tomorrow when she reports to work?
STAVER: Well, certainly I do worry about that. You know, we spent a lot of time with Kim, and she's an amazing individual. She is someone who loves people. She loves God. She doesn't want to be in this situation.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HARLOW: I should note under current Kentucky state law, the authority to issue marriage licenses rests solely with each of the states 120 county clerks. That means it would take an act of a legislature to transfer authority away from Kim Davis. That's her attorney is asking for. The legislature there not convening again until January 25th. A lot riding on Wednesday's GOP debate. Brooke Baldwin in Simi
Valley, California geeking out as she like to say at the Reagan library ahead of the debate. Hi, Brooke.
BALDWIN: How could you not when you are here.
Listen, we are three days away from a massive, massive show in a building just adjacent to me here at the Ronald Reagan library. And one as you are looking at, listen, the electorate has spoken. You look at the top two Republican front-runners, zero political experience. So how would a two-time elected governor of Wisconsin, Scott Walker, how is he faring especially when his numbers have been so down? What does he need to do Wednesday night to flip the script? We will talk to Mark Preston coming up.
You're watching CNN special live coverage from the Reagan library.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[17:30:36] HARLOW: Bottom of the hour now. 5:30 eastern. And the second Republican presidential debate is just three days away. CNN crews incredibly busy with the finishing touches ahead of Wednesday night. This debate will take place right there at the beautiful Ronald Reagan presidential library located 30 miles from Down Hill, Los Angeles, in California's stunning Simi Valley. Inside the library, the debate stage, take a look at that. Crews working hard around the clock setting it all up. And in the backdrop, something pretty amazing. The Boeing 707 that served as Air Force One during Ronald Reagan's term in office. Facing the candidates on that stage, will be our very own Jake Tapper will moderate the debate.
Brooke Baldwin is there and she is loving, loving every minute of it. Right, Brooke?
BALDWIN: Listen. You guys can make fun of me all you want, geeking out here at Reagan library and getting excited. We're three days away. We've been talking about it so much. It is like the super bowl politics here, the season. And just walking around, right, and seeing where all 11 candidates will be seated and much more intimate situation, 500 people seated. And I should mention, I mean, there are some of the front row seats. You're five feet from the candidates come Wednesday. So I think it will change the game, tone-wise. We'll be watching.
I have CNN politics executive editor Mark Preston who is with me now.
And just first and foremost, before we get into Scott Walker, I mean, impression impressions? This is incredible here.
MARK PRESTON, EXECUTIVE EDITOR, CNN POLITICS: Amazing. First of all, the weather is beautiful, but what a site to have a presidential library. Just amazing, on top of a hill just looking out. It's just gorgeous. And quite frankly, inside, just outdistances what we're seeing out here.
BALDWIN: That history running in the people who have come here, just to take in everything.
PRESTON: The Berlin Wall. I mean, everything. Amazing.
BALDWIN: So let's talk about Governor Scott Walker. Twice elected Republican governor of Wisconsin. This is typically a blue state. You know, union buster. And so, he's taken on the recall challenge and he is, you know, weathered through that. When you look at him in the polls, though, he's slipping. So he's sixth nationally. Ten when you look at how he's doing in Iowa. And he talked to us on "STATE OF THE UNION." He said, listen, yes, I have to step it up.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: This election seems to be at least right now about embracing outsiders, Republicans liking Donald Trump and Dr. Ben Carson and Carly Fiorina, people who have never before held elective office. We just saw Governor Rick Perry, the longest serving governor in Texas history drop out.
You have spent a lifetime working in politics and government. Why should voters and how are you going to convince them that you're the right choice when they're desperate for somebody who is not part of politics in government?
GOV. SCOTT WALKER (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Because they actually want someone who can get the job done. All these other folks can talk all they want. Remember, Barack Obama had never been in government before. And we see what a lousy president he has been, not just ideologically. But in terms of actually running things.
I've run things. I've actually got things done. If you want someone who will fight and win, not just win three elections in four years in a blue state like we did. But win and get results without compromising common sense conservative principles, then I'm the candidate.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: I want to loop back in a second to his point about, you know, listen, the electorate sort of has spoken thus far. When you look at Donald Trump and, you know, Ben Carson, zero political experience and that's what really resonating. But in terms of being aggressive, taking on let's just say it, Donald Trump directly, we see how other candidates have fair and thus their poll numbers. Should he do that, do you think?
PRESTON: Only if he's directing attacking him. And I would say that about any of this candidate right now because the bottom line is, I don't think Republican voters are looking for somebody to take on Donald Trump as they are to show some leadership and be forceful about it. We saw Carly Fiorina do it in the first debate back in August. She did so well. That's why she moved from the smaller debate up to the prime time debate on Wednesday night. She showed she had leadership and was forceful. And Donald Trump's candidacy, Brooke, has been fueled by his ability to try to be stronger than everyone else. BALDWIN: But since that last debate, let's be honest. I mean, it's
gotten totally nasty and personal in the back and forth. For the most part, they've played nice. Yes, I can recall, you know, Rand Paul a couple of times trying to jump in and gets and makes some headlines and jab at Donald Trump. But I think Wednesday will be a total flip of that.
PRESTON: So I think what you are see happen is there are going to be certain moments throughout the night where you're going to see the likes of Jeb Bush who has been just under a barrage of criticism of Donald Trump. Carly Fiorina has already said. She just said a few hours ago that she is going to go after Donald Trump.
So in some ways, you can do it. But I don't think you're going to be successful, certainly the likes of John Kasich and Scott Walker, to come out and just be critical of Donald Trump, you're going to lose.
[17:35:14] BALDWIN: Let me play a little bit more sounds from Governor Walker this morning talking to Tapper. And he, Jake Tapper, was asking about Governor Walker about appealing to the electorate. As I mentioned, you know, those polling the best right now are those who are really the outsiders and that's resonating. Here's what he told Jake.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WALKER: The biggest thing is just -- last time around I waited until questions came to us. I think we're going to step it up and be more aggressive this time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: Step it up. I mean, it's the same sort of theme of aggression.
PRESTON: Well, you know, what's interesting about the Donald Trump criticism, certainly of Jeb Bush. He said it about Ben Carson the other day, low energy. Scott Walker was low energy in the last debate. He is supposed to be the outsider politician. He is supposed to be the governor that or at least he portrayed himself to be, that would come to Washington and shake things up. If you are a conservative and you are looking for a horse to ride into this race, you look at Scott Walker and I think you walked away from that debate in August disappointed. So he needs a moment to show that he can push and promote and advocate conservative values.
BALDWIN: Mark Preston, thank you very much.
Again, do not forget this coming Wednesday night the Republican presidential candidates facing back-to-back debates. Make sure you watch here live from Simi Valley, the first debate at 6:00, and then the biggie at 8:00 eastern here on CNN.
We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [17:40:30] HARLOW: Turning now to the refugee crisis unfolding in Europe where Germany is now taking action to stop more migrants from entering the country, it is reintroducing what it describes as temporary border controls to stop the dramatic influx of refugees, many of them coming in through Austria.
Meanwhile, as Europe begins to absorb tens of thousands of refugees, many of them fleeing Syria, there is a growing debate in Israel about what should be done.
Oren Lieberman reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
OREN LIEBERMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Refugee loaded trains running again in Europe. A traumatic reminder of a nightmare childhood for one girl. She was born in Rumania in 1940.
COLLETTE AVITAL, HOLOCAUST SURVIVOR: We have been refugees ourselves because we in the '30s and in the '40s found all the gates closed in front of us. Because when you see the scenes of what has happened at the train station in Budapest, you can't forget the trains that led the Jews to their death.
LIEBERMAN: Avital remembers her family being forced from their home when she was a little girl and years of hiding in terror from the Nazis. She looks at pictures from 70 years ago and shutters. Avital is one of a growing number of holocaust survivors calling on Israel to take in refugees.
Why does the refugee crisis in Europe strike such a cord with holocaust survivors?
AVITAL: I think many of them have been traumatized by the kind of pictures they've seen, by the number of people on the roads with babies, certainly the picture of that baby dead on the beach is something which has been a wakeup call to many.
LIEBERMAN: There's been a growing debate within Israel about whether to take in any refugees since Israel and Syria share a tense border. But Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu says it would threaten Israel security.
BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER (through translator): Israel is a small country, a very small country that lacks demographic and geographic depth. Therefore we must control our borders both against illegal migrants and terrorism.
LIEBERMAN: When Jews speak of the holocaust, they often say never again. Avital says for that to mean something, never again has to apply to everyone.
Oren Lieberman, CNN, Tel-Aviv.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HARLOW: Oren, thank you for that report.
I want to bring in now a woman who came to this country as a refugee from Bosnia in 1998. Joining me from Cambridge, Massachusetts, Jasmina Chauvin. Thank you for being here.
JASMINA CHAUVIN, STARTED #ALSOWASREFUGEE CAMPAIGN: Thank you for having me, Poppy.
HARLOW: You are currently a doctoral student at Harvard, getting your PhD there. And you and your friends started this group, this twitter campaign, Facebook campaign that I saw actually traveling overseas last week. And the hash tag is, I was also a refugee. What is it about, what does it mean to you?
CHAUVIN: That's right, Poppy. So again, we also were inspired just about a week ago seeing those images coming from Europe to do something. And being three former refugees ourselves, you know, and knowing the stories of many other refugees in our communities, we thought that it's important to share our stories.
The reason being that often refugees are viewed as a burden, a potential burden on society, people who come to, you know, take something for free. And we just know from our experiences and our families' experiences that that's not the case. Surely many refugees need help in this beginning. But if given a chance, you know, these are people who work hard to build their livelihoods and their lives again.
HARLOW: I want to hear a little bit about your personal story coming from Bosnia after the war tore apart that country, coming here to Oakland, California in 1998. I mean, you talk about sort of your family coming over, getting off public assistance very quickly. Tell us what it was like for you personally.
CHAUVIN: That's right. You know, I came here as a teenager. I was 15 years old. And my mom came here with my brother and I and really just two bags full of clothing and nothing else. We had no family in the United States. We only knew one other Bosnian refugee family who have lived in Oakland which is why ended up there.
And so they housed us under their roof for the first couple of weeks and then, like you said, you know, we were on government food stamps and welfare, but that only lasted about six months or so. Soon after that, all three of us started to work. You know, my mother was working two jobs as a nurse assistant. My brother and I were both in high school at the time but working nights and weekends to make sure we made ends meet. And we didn't, you know, relay on freebies so much so that even within the first year or two, we even paid back the air fare that was sponsored for us by the U.N. agency that brought us here to the United States.
HARLOW: And now you're at Harvard. One of your friends that started this with you I believe working for NASA. But you make the point that you don't have to go to Harvard and be getting your doctorate and achieve all this. CHAUVIN: That's right, you know. There are many people former
refugees that I know, some of whom started small businesses either as, you know, electricians or contractors, as photographers. Others are contributing, you know, in science, in the arts, in sports. You know, others are just living happy, normal lives and are building their families.
I mean, I think that, again, you know, refugees just like any part of society come in many different flavors. But I think the main point is that almost none of them expect to get by for free and that many of these people work hard and often twice as hard because they really start from nothing to be able to -- and don't expect much, you know, to be given something for free, but rather to work for it.
HARLOW: Yes. It is so important to put a face to it, Jasmina. I mean, look at all that you have accomplished since coming to this country. Thank you so much. I appreciate you being with us, telling your personal story.
I do want to point people again to the Facebook page where they can learn more and hashtag on twitter, #ialsowasarefugee, on Facebook, on Twitter. Learn much more about this.
Jasmina, thank you.
Coming up next, fortune's list of the 50 most powerful women in business. We will tell you who made the cut, any surprises, and who was honored as the youngest on the list next.
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[17:51:16] HARLOW: Guess what it is out, Fortune's list of the most powerful women in business in the United States. The 27 CEOs on the list control $1 trillion in stock market value and the list is growing. There are 24 more women than last year on the list.
Joining me now Leigh Gallagher. She is assistant managing editor of Fortune. She helps run the "Fortune's" most powerful women conference. Let's look at the cover. We have it here?
Here is the cover. Great read. Talk about number one on the list, Mary Barra.
LEIGH GALLAGHER, ASSISTANT MANAGING EDITOR, FORTUNE: We have a new number one this year, Mary Barra, CEO of General Motors, GM. And really, we put her here for the way she dealt with this really pretty horrible crisis that GM has had in the past few year. She took over the job and then immediately after sort of inherited the crisis. So it wasn't under her watch but the way she led the company out of it, is still dealing with it, but the way she has dealt with the recall, the way she was immediately contrite and immediately took responsibility, really, kind of exemplary leadership.
HARLOW: And you talk about how so many of these women lead traditionally male-led business. I mean, you got IBM, (INAUDIBLE). Lockheed Martin, HP, General Motors, et cetera. And a lot of them steering the companies through crises.
GALLAGHER: They are, yes. I mean, it is funny. When we first started doing this lists, the women were largely in media or advertising or, you know, the beauty business. And those are very big businesses. But what we have seen over time is that now, they are running, as you said, Lockheed Martin, General Dynamics, IBM, HP, I mean, the biggest of the kind giant industrial companies. And many of them, as you say are leading them through incredible crises, especially this year. You look at Ellen Coleman of DuPont beating back after this investor Nelson Phelps (ph) and (INAUDIBLE) beating him back. Mary Barra, Pepsi.
HARLOW: That's true.
GALLAGHER: Exactly.
HARLOW: The youngest woman on the list is Taylor Swift. It is not because - I mean, you guys agonize over to make this list. It is not about her popularity. Is this because she took on Spotify? She took on Apple and she won. I mean, she actually changed Apple's policy.
GALLAGHER: Yes, that's right. I mean, nobody stands up to Apple. I watch the new documentary about Apple. And just thinking about this again today. We don't normally put an artist like that on the list because these are primarily business executives running billion dollars businesses. But because of the leadership, the stand she has taken and standing up against Spotify, forcing Apple's hand which doesn't happen and really kind of becoming the voice for taking back control, artists taking back control in the music industry.
HARLOW: Ata whole 25 years old.
GALLAGHER: Exactly. Wow.
HARLOW: Finally, of these women on the list, who do you see who might run for president? One day, not in 2016, per se.
GALLAGHER: You know what? Truth is any of them could do it. This the way these women lead is incredible. They are all running enormous businesses.
(CROSSTALK)
GALLAGHER: But OK, an obvious name is (INAUDIBLE) has long discussed as having huge political potential. Obviously, I think she is reassessing everything in the wake of her tremendously almost unimaginable loss of losing her husband this year. But she has the political chop. She worked in the Clinton administration. She was chief of staff to Larry Somers. She is incredibly connected in Silicon Valley but also beyond. She hosts world leaders all the time. And people really - and she has been an activist for the voice of women. So she's one name who's been much buzzed about for years to enter in the political sphere.
I really like a lot of their stories. I mean, I think Ursula Burns is an incredible leader. CEO of Xerox. She has incredible compelling personal story, raised by a single mother in the projects of New York City in public housing and has been aiding Obama on his export council. Running his stem initiative, things like that, so. But any of them could do it.
HARLOW: This is fascinating. Read the new edition of "Fortune." "Fortune's" most powerful women.
Leigh, thank you very much.
GALLAGHER: Thank you, Poppy.
HARLOW: We appreciate it.
Meantime, sticking with politics, 15 GOP presidential candidates have a chance to change their fortunes and help their party over the White House. Will they chain the negative tone of the debate or will we see them get even nastier? You heard Trump yesterday saying he is being nice. We'll talk about it next.
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DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): We are just a week away now to the Nautica Malibu triathlon. And the team is ready. The spent the last eight months swimming, biking, and running. All in preparation for this day.
Julie and Eugene Smookler, our first married couple to participate say they are ready to cross that finish line together.
JULIE SMOOKLER, FIR NATION PARTICIPANT: Overall the experience has been amazing. You know, eating habit and help each other out with that, a meal planning to be able to give each other the time.
GUPTA: 67-year-old Linda Garrett is overcoming the injury.
LINDA GARRETT, FIT NATION PARTICIPANTS: It is setback. It is an ongoing setback.
GUPTA: And while it still hurts, she's adapted to get the job done.
GARETT: I'll finish the race. I'll finish the race.
GUPTA: Robert Lara is still loving the ride and he is learning to cook healthier food.
ROBERT LARA, FIT NATION PARTICIPANT: It is a work in progress but nothing burned out so that is good.
GUPTA: 36-year-old Erica Moore has dropped weight, stopped drinking and has already signing up for more triathlons.
ERICA MOORE, FIT NATION TRIATHLON: I really gotten its own. And I really feel like I awaken the (INAUDIBLE).
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