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Professor Shot Dead on Campus, Gunman on Loose; Trump Soars in New Poll, Hitting New High; Debate Coach on Prepping Candidates for a Debate. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired September 14, 2015 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:18] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: All right. Here we go. I'm Brooke Baldwin live here in beautiful Simi Valley, California. Live pictures here of the Reagan Library. We are thrilled to be here. We are geeking out, if I may, to be here for this upcoming Super Bowl of politics.

Folks, we are 48 hours away from the biggest moment. I mean, it's been a surprising race, it's been unconventional, it's been mighty tested me personal really the last several days here. All of these 11 people who we'll see on that stage on Wednesday night, all fighting for the party's nomination. Of course gearing up for the big debate here on CNN Wednesday evening. The smaller debate at 6:00 Eastern and then the biggie at 8:00.

First, though, before we talk politics, we have to turn our attention into some breaking news out of Mississippi. Cleveland, Mississippi, that campus now on lockdown. The shooter is still on the loose. Folks there are being told to stay indoors, stay away from windows. This is an active situation.

I have Alina Machado, she's gathering the latest developments here on what's happening.

Alina, so they are still looking for this shooter.

ALINA MACHADO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Brooke, they're still looking for the shooter and we now know the identity of the professor who was shot and killed this morning on the campus of Delta State University. His name is Ethan Schmidt and he was a history professor. This is all according to the Coroner's Office. The deputy coroner tells CNN Schmidt was shot in the head at least once.

Now according to authorities this is still an active, ongoing situation on the campus of Delta State University, which is located in Cleveland, Mississippi, that's some two hours north of Jackson, Mississippi.

Now we first heard about an active shooter situation on the campus just before noon Eastern in a tweet from the school's official Twitter page saying that a shooter had been spotted near Jobe Hall on campus. The campus was immediately placed on lockdown. The students and faculty have been asked to stay indoors and to stay away from windows until they are given the all clear. Now the deputy coroner has told CNN that the professor who was killed

was in his office at the time of the shooting. The Coroner's Office also says no gun was found at the scene, but authorities did find two empty shell casings.

Again, authorities believe the shooter responsible for this is still at large. We have learned that all the schools in the Cleveland school can district are also on lockdown because of the shooting. Several law enforcement agencies are now involved. They include the campus police, the Mississippi Highway Patrol, the sheriff's office and even the ATF.

And again the search for this person continues. The person who killed this Delta State University professor, there is no word, Brooke, of any other injuries, but we'll keep monitoring the information that's coming out of Cleveland, Mississippi, for any updates.

BALDWIN: Quickly can I just follow up with you on this professor? What more do we know?

MACHADO: The information on him is very limited, but again, we know that his name is Ethan Schmidt and that he was a history professor at Delta State University.

BALDWIN: OK.

MACHADO: We'll be looking to see what more we can learn about him -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: Great. Alina Machado, for now, thank you so much.

Let's move along and talk politics back here live at the Reagan Presidential Library in beautiful Simi Valley, California.

Listen, the main stage come Wednesday night, it will be a crowded one. The top 11 candidates will battle it out in primetime, as I mentioned, 8:00 Eastern proceeded by that first round debate featuring four of the Republican hopefuls at 6:00 Eastern. Remember now four, not five, Rick Perry dropping out.

The men -- look at all these faces. They will all be squeezing in and sharing space. I can tell you, I've walked behind the podiums, they are inches apart, folks. The guy in the middle, in the spotlight, Donald Trump. But a couple others obviously we're going to talk about Carly Fiorina, she's making her debut on the main debate. She was in the JV debate in Cleveland. She's already trying to put Trump on the defensive. We'll talk about her ad and how she's using Trump's words against him in a moment.

Meantime, Trump, new numbers climb to a new high in the latest poll. He now sits 33 percent in this latest "Washington Post"-ABC poll. The number two here, the only other in double digits, Dr. Ben Carson. Another political outsider polling at 20 percent. And as you can see, the rest of the field in single digits.

Let's begin with my colleague here with in Simi Valley, California, Athena Jones. She is inside the debate hall where they are still building, still working, still laying out -- down carpet. We'll get to a little behind-the-scenes look in just a moment.

[14:05:11] But, first, Athena, we know Trump still leading, you know, and setting the tone for the race, also makes him a target. I mean, listen, this is the kind of man who is like, bring it.

ATHENA JONES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Donald Trump says, look, my whole life has been preparation for a debate, so I'm going to guess he's ready. He knows that he is going to be a main target. Perhaps more than he was in that first debate because in that first debate you hadn't seen all these polls, several more polls that have come out, whether they have been national polls or state-by-state polls like in Iowa or New Hampshire showing him with a solid lead. He's also of course attacked a bunch of his rivals. And so he knows he's going to be under fire on Wednesday night and I'm going to guess he's ready to attack back -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: We'll talk about how others choose to counterpunch in a minute, but first I want you to show everyone where you are because just for folks to fully appreciate, I mean, CNN has entirely built this set, built this stage, and these candidates will be flanked by President Reagan's Air Force One.

JONES: Yes, take a look. I want to show you, this right here is what you're talking about. This is the Air Force One that President Reagan flew. It's going to be right behind serving as the backdrop for the candidates on this stage. As you mentioned, CNN crews have spent days, weeks even, building this stage so that they could put it right next to that airplane.

Now if you can see behind me, these clear podiums laid out. You mentioned they're only going to be inches apart. Donald Trump in the middle there. But then keep looking. I believe you can see some of the rest of the setup. It's relatively intimate compared to that first debate on FOX that was held in a stadium, in an arena, where thousands of people were in the audience. Here we're talking about 500 people. These are guests that are invitees of the Reagan Library here also from the national -- from the Republican National Committee and a few of the folks in the audience will be people who were invited by the campaigns.

But a much more intimate setting. You can see all of the work still going on. There are going to be 13 cameras here on Wednesday night. But I got to tell you, Brooke, this intimate setting, the fact the podiums are so close together, it might shape how they the candidates act towards one another. They are not going to be able to draw, for instance, on this huge amount of energy from a big crowd oohing and aahings, so it will be interesting to see whether they pull back at all in their attacks against one another and how they end up interacting. But we're looking forward to it on Wednesday night.

BALDWIN: How they use the audience to perhaps his or her advantage, based upon the fact that where you're standing -- that front row, that is feet from where the candidates are standing.

Thank you so much, Athena Jones, for us inside that debate hall here at the library.

Now this debate Wednesday night, this is -- the site is essential. It's this part of the story because the nation's 40th president definitely, you know, shines over this campaign virtually every candidate in this race wants to convince Republican voters here that he or she deserves to inherit the mantle of Ronald Reagan, if I may. He's like the 12th man on stage come Wednesday.

And among the subplots here, the narratives playing out is this recent back-and-forth between Donald Trump and Carly Fiorina. Trump criticized Carly Fiorina in this recent "Rolling Stone" saying, in part, quote, "Look at that face. Would anyone vote for that? Can you imagine that? The face of our next president?" We should also point out he was on the phone with Chris Cuomo the next morning saying he wasn't talking specifically about her face. He said he was referencing her persona. And now a super PAC that is supporting Fiorina is firing back.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CARLY FIORINA (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We are not a special interest group. We are the majority of the nation. This is the face of the 61-year-old woman I am proud of every year and every wrinkle.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Let's talk about that. I want Carly Fiorina to kick off our discussion. Here with me at the Reagan Library I have CNN political commentators Van Jones and Ana Navarro.

Awesome seeing both of you.

VAN JONES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Let's just begin with the Fiorina ad. And Ana, to you first, I mean, here she is, I think, pretty effectively using Trump's words in that "Rolling Stone" piece totally to her advantage using all of these female faces, knowing she's the only woman on stage come Wednesday. How does she continue with the momentum and attack back?

ANA NAVARRO, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: You know, I think -- I think she needs no advice on that. Carly has proven to be incredibly effective in landing a punch. And she does it with class. She does it with elegance, she does it without losing her cool, with poise and grace. But let me tell you, she cuts through like a knife. A lot of those attacks have been frankly gone to Hillary Clinton.

But this time I think it's going to be very interesting to see that interaction between her and Trump. I think Trump stepped into a hornet's nest on that one.

[14:10:07] BALDWIN: So if -- let me just follow up on that. To either of you. By stepping in a hornet's nest, and you have to assume she will punch back, you know, she keeps calling him the entertainer. How does he -- it's delicate, right?

JONES: Yes.

BALDWIN: How does he -- she being the only woman, how does he punch back?

JONES: Well, first of all, you always knew that if Trump was going to get in trouble, it was going to be with Carly because of his record and reputation of being such a chauvinist. I mean, there's no other way to describe it.

BALDWIN: But the back-and-forth with Megyn Kelly in the last debate, that did not ding him at all.

JONES: It did not hurt him at all, but it's still out there as a problem for him. And -- but guess what? He got one pass. He didn't get two.

BALDWIN: OK.

JONES: Carly is a different kind of opponent than any of them have faced. First of all look how she dealt with it. When he made the mistake, she holds back. The first thing she does she shows poise. She shows she can take a punch without being flustered. Number two, she lets her super PAC come out with the best ad of the cycle so far. And now everybody's eyes are going to be on her. What is going to happen? So she's massively used his mistake to give herself the spotlight and she is going to take him to the cleaners when it's time for her to talk.

BALDWIN: OK. We watch for Carly Fiorina. We're also watching and I'm looking at the numbers and Trump is rise, rise, rising, as is Dr. Ben Carson. You look at the latest numbers here, ABC-"Washington Post" poll, we'll throw them up on the screen. And you can see again Trump at the highest he's been, 33 percent, Ben Carson at 20 percent.

Also a new Monmouth University poll from New Hampshire shows Carson is gaining on Trump. We saw the whole tete-a-tete this past week with regard to faith and then, you know, Trump questioning his medical record. You know, Ben Carson said that he doesn't want to get involved in this gladiator fight, but how does he? These are the two guys, zero political experience. I mean, both -- you know, Carson big with evangelicals, although in the latest CNN-ORC poll Trump was leading in that. How does Carson separate himself from Trump on that stage?

NAVARRO: You know, I think he does it by using his experience. We saw him do that in the first debate. Bring in his experience as a brain surgeon. He did it very, very well with memorable lines in debate one. I think he does it being Ben Carson. Soft spoken, calm --

BALDWIN: Even though Trump says he doesn't have the juice.

NAVARRO: Even keeled.

JONES: Yes.

NAVARRO: Doesn't matter. I mean, he doesn't -- you know, look, what is having the juice mean in Donald Trump language? It means --

(LAUGHTER)

NAVARRO: It means -- it means being able to insult. You know, you've got a guy in Jeb Bush, who I remember as governor used to work 12, 15 hour days, seven days a week.

BALDWIN: Yes.

NAVARRO: Ben Carson has done surgeries that last 15, 20 hours separating conjoined twins.

BALDWIN: First conjoined twin separation on the head. Right.

NAVARRO: You want to ask Ben Carson about energy on that stage? And on the other hand, you've got Donald Trump who, like, pulls in to TV interviews in New York where he lives. So, you know, I think --

BALDWIN: There are advantages of doing that.

JONES: Yes.

BALDWIN: That's just scrappy. Final thought from you.

JONES: Well, look, I think that, first of all, he can't out-trump Trump and he should not.

BALDWIN: Right.

JONES: But don't underestimate the quiet guy on the stage. You see, trump can make a mistake and try to run over him. And often it's that little quiet guy in the corner --

BALDWIN: Rising about it.

JONES: Who can rise above it. Also there's a guy named David and a guy named Goliath. I think you're going to have from Carson, a moment. He's great with those moments that separates him from Trump. If I were Trump, I would leave Carson alone. That's the one guy I don't think he knows how to fight.

BALDWIN: Watch out for the quiet man on stage.

JONES: Watch out for the quiet.

BALDWIN: Van Jones, Ana Navarro.

JONES: Yes.

BALDWIN: Thank you both so much.

And let me remind you, which I will be doing over the course of the next 48 hours. You have to tune into the Republican presidential debate here in the Reagan Library Wednesday night. It all starts at 6:00 Eastern here on CNN. And of course the biggie at 8:00 Eastern, all 11 on stage. Coming up next, how will this work? They're seated so close to one

another. We mentioned the lay of the land. Let's talk to a debate coach and actually see how the shear physicality of the podiums and the audience, how that could really play and how having that one woman on stage can affect everything, everything matters come Wednesday.

Plus safe to say, my next two guests most definitely disagree. One a Trump supporter, the other also a conservative who was with me the other day on TV and called him an idiot. But are their views really that much different?

And also this story out of Kentucky, my goodness, that clerk who did not want to sign those same-sex marriage licenses in Rowan County. You know what? You see all the media there. What does that mean? She's back at work. See what happened when a same-sex couple showed up to get their license, and how this issue in rural Kentucky could be center stage Wednesday night here in California.

I'm Brooke Baldwin. This is CNN's special live coverage.

[14:14:42]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: I'm Brooke Baldwin live here in Simi Valley, California, the home of the 40th president's library here. None other than President Ronald Reagan, where in 48 hours from now CNN is set to host this mega debate featuring 11 of the top tier candidates for the Republican nomination for president.

And if I may, this race is so hot even pageant contestants are getting into presidential politics. Yes. During last night's Miss America competition, Miss Alabama had this to say when she was asked to weigh in on Donald Trump.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MEG MCGUFFIN, MISS ALABAMA AND 4TH RUNNER UP IN MISS AMERICA PAGEANT: I think Donald Trump is an entertainer. And I think he says what's on a the lot of people's minds. But I think that the Republican Party should be absolutely terrified of all the attention that he is taking from incredible candidates like Jeb Bush and Chris Christie who could absolutely do the job of president of the United States. And if I were a Republican, I would absolutely be terrified of that. Thank you. Thank you so much.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Will a Chris Christie or a Jeb Bush finally breakthrough that Donald Trump dominance this coming Wednesday night? What about as we were just talking Carly Fiorina? Can she breakthrough? You've seen her super PAC ad. She did it certainly once before, but Donald Trump was not on the stage then. So this is a game changer.

[14:20:10] Just how does a candidate competing as a frontrunner, who talks off the cuff, gives few specifics, and can commit a string of stumbles without losing a simple percentage point in the polls?

Joining me now Todd Graham, director of debate at Southern Illinois University. I should also mention his teams have done pretty well winning a national championship for the last three years.

So, Todd, great to have you on.

TODD GRAHAM, DIRECTOR OF DEBATE, SOUTHERN ILLINOIS UNIVERSITY: Good to be back, Brooke.

BALDWIN: So let's just rip the Trump band-aid off and let me ask you about him first because I know you wrote this opinion piece basically saying, you know, he did not come to play the last massive arena debate in Cleveland. You know, how do you say he didn't do well when he's been surging ever since? How does he -- how does he really -- I don't know. Knock it out of the park Wednesday night?

GRAHAM: I'm not backing up the debate. What I do is I watch the debates in a vacuum. And so if you don't know anything about Donald Trump before the debate, you watch that debate, he wouldn't have had 5 percentage points. He was that bad in the debate. But here's the thing, his supporters --

BALDWIN: Tell me why, be specific.

GRAHAM: Well, his supporters -- well, here's how he's bad. First off, he really was sort of anti-woman in the debate. But he also came off very petty and sort of mean. When he didn't like the questions, he attacks the questioner, the reporter, rather than just answering the question. He also was unable to get specifics.

Donald Trump is a billionaire. Yet he couldn't give any specifics on how he would actually help the economy when he was asked about his bankruptcies, he had nothing to say except well, those were mean people I took the money from. That sort of thing. So he did not come across --

BALDWIN: But how much, how much, Todd, is this about specifics and policy versus personality, and for some of these folks really introducing themselves to the millions who are watching?

GRAHAM: Well, that's the difference between the debates and the post debates, Brooke. Post debate, Trump rules the airways. So he's able to make up for anything that people don't understand about him in the debates by doing things after the debate. But the debates are supposed to be about policy. This is supposed to be about when we test people about their actual opinions as to how they will govern. That's what makes the difference in a debate. And that's why he was so utterly disappointing in the first debate.

But now remember, his supporters don't really care about that. So a friend of mine from Los Angeles actually said, you know, he can't lose those supporters no matter what he does. That in fact, Donald Trump could punch a baby in the face and his supporters would go, you know, that kid had it coming. So there's no way that he'll lose supporters. BALDWIN: My goodness. Let's hope not. The biggest difference from

the last debate is this debate, this stage here, there will be 11, not just 10 candidates. And that 11th is a woman. How will Carly Fiorina's presence, do you think, change the calculus, if I may, for anyone else on stage?

GRAHAM: Eleven versus 10 doesn't make much of a difference. It's still way too many people on a stage. So the -- but the actual person who will make a difference in that Carly Fiorina is both a woman and she's surging a little bit in the polls. And so this will make a difference. I have a lot of ideas about the ways that she could change the debate. And perhaps actually in her favor. She can use humor in her favor and she's been proven to do that.

And I've always studied humor in debates and let me tell you, humor is very, very popular in debates. And it can definitely help you in the polls if you use it wisely.

BALDWIN: Here's what I'm fascinated with just having walked around the podiums where -- I mean, you are inches from the next person you're standing with. This is a much more intimate setting. And I'm wondering how you would if you were advising or coaching any of these candidates knowing that you're so close to one another, I'm thinking about attacks and jabs, but also the fact how do you advise them to use the audience that is sitting feet away?

GRAHAM: Well, the first thing is you have to make sure and not get the audience to get in your head. As you'll recall, in many of these Republican primary debates, especially in the last cycle, the audience is very much energetic and they're very much keen. And so you can't let them affect you one way or another. That's always what I told my teams when we're debating around and the audience is generally against us. I say don't let that bother you. You still make the same arguments you were going to make regardless of the personal audience.

But as far as them sitting and standing -- I'm sorry, standing right next to one another, it's harder to be aggressive towards someone when you're very close to them. Because it makes you look incredibly bad. So I'll give you an example --

BALDWIN: Well, do you remember the Mitt Romney -- remember when Mitt Romney put his arm over on Rick Perry?

GRAHAM: I do.

BALDWIN: And the camera cuts to Rick Perry, and you thought he was going to clock him? I

GRAHAM: I do.

BALDWIN: I mean, that's how close they are.

GRAHAM: I do. And it's a very awkward circumstance. And what it does, though, is it brings them a little bit. It makes them not want to be aggressive because it's difficult to call somebody the same name, except for maybe Trump, which he could probably do. But it's difficult to do that when you're standing right next to them that you did in a campaign ad. So I think that maybe the aggression might be a little bit less. But if it's not less, let me tell you that could make for some really good television debate.

[14:25:01] BALDWIN: That will absolutely translate for all the people watching on TV back at home.

Todd Graham, thank you so much.

GRAHAM: You're welcome.

BALDWIN: Wednesday night here at the Reagan Library, 6:00 and 8:00 Eastern.

Coming up next, though, the clerk against same-sex marriage. You know what? She is back at work today. And a gay couple showed up. They wanted a marriage license. We will show you what happened. You're watching CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: I'm Brooke Baldwin here live at the Reagan Library. We'll take you back to our special coverage ahead of the big debate this Wednesday night in a moment. But first we have to talk about what's been going on in Kentucky. It is an issue that surely to come up this Wednesday night at the debate.

You have this Rowan County, Kentucky, clerk, Kim Davis, today she's officially back on the job after spending six days in jail for denying marriage licenses to same-sex couples. Davis returned to her office with the promise not to interfere with the law. And with that, the first same-sex couple wanted to get married and they stepped up to the front of the line this morning.