Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Rubio Files for New Hampshire Primary; Bush 41 Blasts Cheney, Rumsfeld in New Book; Russia Pushes Back Against Bomb Claims; U.S. Intelligence Suggests ISIS Bombed Down Russian Plane; UK And Egyptian Leaders Meet in London. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired November 05, 2015 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:01] CUOMO: So he fired him. No. Gary agreed to train Colin completely gratis. That was a year --

CAMEROTA: Gosh, look at the before and after. That was a year.

CUOMO: -- and 60 pounds ago.

CAMEROTA: That's great.

CUOMO: He slimmed up to build up. Look at him. Look at how good he looks. Look at the symmetry.

PEREIRA: Wow.

CAMEROTA: That's great.

PEREIRA: And look how happy, too.

CAMEROTA: Wow.

PEREIRA: Dedication. Focus. Amazing. Well done, fella.

CUOMO: His competition is 10 days from now. Look him up online. Gary, you're a good man for helping him out. You look awesome, my man. Get after it.

CAMEROTA: Time now for "NEWSROOM" and Carol Costello.

CUOMO: You too, Carol. Give them a double biceps.

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Yes.

CUOMO: There it is.

COSTELLO: You guys have a great day. NEWSROOM starts now.

And good morning, I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me. The mystery deepens and the divisions grow in the investigation of that Russian airliner crash that killed all 224 people on board. Both U.S. and British officials say intelligence suggests that ISIS or one of its affiliates planted a bomb on board that plane and that terrorists may have had inside help at the Egyptian airport. Russia and Egypt are pushing back saying there is no hard evidence as

of now to support those suspicions. U.S. government sources tell us that ISIS chatter after the crash is fortifying the belief that it was indeed a bomb. The ISIS affiliate in the Sinai where the plane crashed repeats its claims of responsibility and taunts its doubters, "die with your rage."

The United Kingdom is suspending all of its flights in and out of the Sharma el Sheikh Airport where that doomed flight had left just some 20 some minutes before the crash. That strands some 3500 Brits who were due to fly out just today.

CNN's Ian Lee is in Sharma el Sheikh with the security concerns there and our Clarissa Ward is outside 10 Downing Street where Britain's prime minister spoke just a short time ago. But we begin in Sharma el Sheikh with Ian Lee.

Hi, Ian.

IAN LEE, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Carol. Yes, I traveled through the airport this morning. And I noticed there was not a lot of passengers waiting to get on board their flights. They're trying to get a new connection. The two people I did talk to expressed frustration with the airlines' decisions. They wanted to know more details. They said they felt like they were still left in the dark. And what they were trying to do was trying to find other flights that haven't been canceled so that they can get back home.

But what we also noticed at the airport this morning, there was a bit of increased insecurity there. More police officers we saw. But this really are two conflicting narratives here. You do have the United Kingdom and the United States saying that there is a high possibility that this was a bomb that took down the Russian jet. And where you have the Egyptians and the Russians saying no, wait on this. That it's too early to jump to conclusions. There is nothing they say that indicates that a bomb has taken down this plane.

But we are hearing that from U.K. officials that their team on the ground here is getting good cooperation with the Egyptians. They do not have a timeline on when they will resume flights. We are told that 20,000 U.K. nationals are in Sharma el Sheikh, now 3500 tried to leave. But as those vacations, those holidays end we'll expect more of them trying to get out.

COSTELLO: All right, Ian Lee live from Sharma el Sheikh. Now let's head to London and CNN's Clarissa Ward. As I said she's outside the prime minister's office where David Cameron has been meeting with Egypt's president.

What are they talking about? What do they say?

CLARISSA WARD, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol. Well, it's really a pretty awkward situation. Just over an hour ago Egypt's president, Abdel Fattah el-Sisi arrived here at 10 Downing Street. This was supposed to be a three-day state visit about trade, about security, but of course now topping the agenda is the U.K.'s decision to temporarily halt all flights to and from Sharma el Sheikh Airport.

Now the British prime minister before President Sisi's arrival had an emergency meeting with his government and then afterwards he reiterated that he believes there is probable cause to believe that a bomb did bring down this passenger jet. Let's take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID CAMERON, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: We don't know for certain that it was a terrorist bomb. There is still an investigation taking place in Egypt. We need to see the results of that investigation. The reason we've acted before that is because of intelligence and information we had that gave us the concern that it was more likely than not it was a terrorist bomb.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WARD: The prime minister also said that he would be reaching out to President Putin of Russia to give further details of some of the intelligence behind the British decision to suspend those flight.

And, Carol, now the emphasis here in the U.K. is really on trying to get all those stranded tourists, allegedly up to 20,000 of them, back from Sharma el Sheikh. That effort could begin as early as tomorrow morning.

[09:05:11] COSTELLO: All right, Clarissa Ward reporting live from London. Thank you.

And while Egypt refuses to say a bomb was on board that plane a U.S. official telling CNN someone at the Sharma el Sheikh Airport may be involved. The big question now, was it an inside job?

Well, let's talk about that with CNN contributor and co-author of "ISIS: Inside the Army of Terror," Michael Weiss. He's also senior editor at the "Daily Beast. I'm also joined by Rafi Ron, he's the former director of security at the Tel Aviv Ben Gurion airport which has some of the toughest airport security in the world.

Welcome to you both.

Michael, I want to start with you. The Russians have these black boxes. They have chatter that points to a bomb. We have passengers with shrapnel in their body. Why don't we know for sure right now that a bomb tore apart that plane?

MICHAEL WEISS, CO-AUTHOR, "ISIS: INSIDE THE ARMY OF TERROR": Well, I mean, doing a kind of forensic investigation of a crash site can take weeks or months. I mean, look at the MH 17, the Dutch tribunal. I mean, that took almost a year. Right?

What I suspect and given that it's the U.S. and the U.K. coming out sort of aggressively and saying we think now there's likelihood that this was indeed an explosive device, it probably has signals intelligence intercepts. So chatter either internally by Wilayat Sinai, which is the ISIS affiliate in the Sinai Peninsula, or perhaps between Wilayat Sinai and ISIS central command in Raqqa saying, we did it, this is how we did. They may even be putting together -- keep in mind this terrorist organization is very good at their propaganda and their media. They may be putting together a sort of video how we achieved this great spectacular and took down the crusader Russians, you know, in the skies of the Middle East.

COSTELLO: Why haven't they done that already? Because they've been putting out these messages, right?

WEISS: This is -- yes. And this is the key question. I mean, usually they are much more out front about this. You know. And they plan -- they plan their media, you know, weeks before the actual atrocity or attack takes placement. We saw this with the beheadings of Western hostages a year ago. Yes? We saw with the Malaysian (INAUDIBLE), with the Jordanian airman who was burnt almost a month before the video had been released.

So the question is, was this perhaps an operation where they got lucky? They didn't expect to get -- to be successful here. Indeed, if it was an inside job as the U.S. is suggesting that is completely plausible. A lot of the people who populate ISIS came from state institutions in the Middle East. The Iraqi government of the Saddam Hussein foremost, principally and foremost. But also the Assad regime military defectors from the Syrian army. Why not somebody who may have worked once for the Egyptian Transport Ministry, worked for the Sharma el Sheikh airport or for, you know, any kind of border guard.

COSTELLO: Right.

WEISS: This happens in Russia all the time. Suicide bombers board planes because they bribe corrupt FSP officials to let them through with some TEC dust or hexogen explosives on their person.

COSTELLO: Well, the interesting thing -- we lost Rafi, by the way. And I apologize to Rafi for that. Hopefully we get to talk to you a little later. But one more question to you, Michael. So Egypt and Russia, while not totally discounting the notion of a bomb, they seem to be distancing themselves from it. Why would that be?

WEISS: Two reasons. Let's take Egypt first. They have -- their tourism industry is sort of the principal driver of their economy. This has been buffeted for the last several years. First the overthrow of Mubarak. The -- you know the election of an Islamist government, then the coup of the Sisi regime. For this -- for a terrorist attack of this scale to be perpetrated in the peninsula which is a major -- certainly a European tourism hub, and this is why the Brits and the Irish have cancelled flight for the time being. This would be a huge embarrassment and a severe blow to their economy.

With respect to Russia, Putin has claimed to be sort of one of the foremost counterterrorism mavens and leaders of the world. You know, the war that he has now perpetrated in Syria, at the very beginning the Russian people were not really behind this. In fact there's evidence Russian soldiers, contract soldiers, were risking charges of treason because they said we don't want to be deployed in another kind of dirty or, you know, unpopular campaign, this one in the Middle East fighting, I mean, it could be ISIS or it could be the rebel, it could be al Qaeda. We don't even know who. So for him this would be a blow to the sort of image and prestige of him wrapping up this one as terrorism.

COSTELLO: Michael Weiss, thanks for your insight.

WEISS: Sure.

COSTELLO: I go take our viewers now to New Hampshire because Marco Rubio is about to file papers to run in the New Hampshire primary. So let's head out to New Hampshire right now, and check in with Dana Bash.

Hi, Dana.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: This is the state house where Marco Rubio just walked in order to file his paperwork to be a candidate officially for the New Hampshire primary. We're going to talk about that and more after the break.

[09:10:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Donald Trump is back where he likes to be, out front and on top. Releasing his first radio ad as a new nationwide poll returns him to frontrunner status. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'll take care of our veterans and make our military so strong that nobody will mess with us. I'll secure our borders and yes, we will have a wall. You can't have a country without borders. And I'll make sure that the Second Amendment and our religious liberties are protected.

Obamacare is a total disaster. It will be repealed and replaced with something much better. If the people of Iowa vote for me, you'll never been disappointed. I don't disappointment people. I produce. Together we're going to make America great again.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: OK. So that ad and one other debuting as this new poll for FOX News puts Trump back on top of the GOP candidates, besting Ben Carson 26 percent to 23 percent. Well ahead of Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio who are tied with 11 percent.

[09:15:05] Still, Marco Rubio is riding higher. But with better poll numbers comes increased scrutiny -- and for Rubio that means attacks over his finances.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE (via telephone): For years, I've heard about Marco and his credit cards. And I'll be honest with you. I think that he's got a problem there. You know, he had to put money back. He -- they found things and maybe he made amends, maybe he didn't. But how are you aloud to make amends at a later date? There are a lot of things going on with his credit card.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: OK. So, Trump is talking about Rubio's time as the Florida senator when he used his Republican Party-issued American Express charge card for personal expenses. According to "The Tampa Bay Times", that included $25.76 at Everglades Lumber for supplies, $53.49 at Winn-Dixie for wood, $68.33 at Happy Wine in Miami for beverages and meals, and $78.10 for groceries at Farm Stores in Miami.

"The Tampa Bay Times" says Rubio's campaign cannot find records to explain many of those expenses, although Rubio insists he repaid the Republican Party for personal items and will pony up more information very soon.

Our chief political correspondent Dana Bash is in Concord, New Hampshire, where Rubio is officially now filing for the primary.

Tell us more, Dana.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right. He is in the building behind me. Putting his John Hancock on the piece of paper he needs to official be on the ballot for this first in the nation primary here in New Hampshire. And he certainly is doing much, much better here.

In fact during your show yesterday, Carol. You remember Donald Trump arrived. He became the first major candidate to file here. Just as a new poll came out showing that Marco Rubio jumped pretty significantly to third place here.

But as you said that does bring scrutiny. And Trump stood right on those steps yesterday and went after Rubio on his credit card.

So, I had a chance to catch up with Rubio at a town hall he had here in New Hampshire last night to ask him to respond. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MARCO RUBIO (R-FL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: That's Donald being Donald. Whenever there is a bad poll he kind of gets weird and does these sorts of things. He doesn't know what he's talking about. Bottom line, what people need to understand is there was an American Express card. If there were personal expenses on there, I paid them directly to American Express at the time. If they were political, the Republican Party paid them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Now, he also told me his campaign will be releasing the records to prove what he says. I asked him when that is going to happen. He said, soon, that it takes a while because these are credit card records and receipts that are several years old. And, you know, he also reminded me and a couple other reporters throughout the day here yesterday that there was an issue in his Senate race. At the time, he was in a Republican primary and that he believes that his Republican opponent released some of the credit card information to try to embarrass him.

So, he says, look, it's been out there a long time. Still the question is if it has been out there, why didn't they have this paperwork ready to go try to kind of get rid of it as soon as they could, knowing that if he rose in the polls that then he would be attacked on this once again, Carol.

COSTELLO: Gotcha. OK. So Rubio has just signed the paperwork. I'm watching him because we have cameras inside that building behind you.

I couldn't help but notice yesterday when Donald Trump signed he had this huge crowd of people surrounding him. Like dozens of reporters and it doesn't look that way for Marco Rubio today.

BASH: I have to say, you heard me I talked to just probably moments after Rubio went in the door. And he didn't go in this door. He went in a side door.

And there were I would say maybe a couple of dozen supporters here with signs. And you know, we thought he was going to have a nice entrance with his supporters. And he kind of ducked in the side door which was a little bit odd. It wasn't certainly the stage craft that Donald Trump was part of and made happen when he came yesterday. It was very different. You are exactly right.

COSTELLO: OK. So hopefully he'll pop out that front door and we'll get back to you. And just in case you run on him and ask him a few questions. Dana Bash, reporting live from New Hampshire.

Harsh words in a new biography of former President George H.W. Bush. He slams two key figures from his son's administration. The elder Bush told his biographer that as vice president, Dick Cheney built his own empire inside the White House and that the former Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld was, quote, "arrogant". This characterization was echoed by analysts in 2003, especially after Rumsfeld's address over looting after Saddam Hussein's regime fell to U.S. forces.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[09:20:02] DONALD RUMSFELD, FORMER DEFENSE SECRETARY: Does that mean you can't go in there and take a picture of something that was imperfect, untidy? I could do that in any city in America. Think about what's happened in our cities when we've had riots and problems and looting. Stuff happens.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: And, of course, you might remember that moment after the Saddam Hussein regime fell that, you know, there was massive looting within Iraq, especially the museums and especially the banks.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: I was there. I remember it very well.

COSTELLO: You were there. You remember it very well. But Donald Rumsfeld said, ah, it's not happening. But it really was.

But let's get back to that biography because -- I don't know, it surprised me George Bush was so frank.

BERMAN: It's fascinating. You have the inside of a father who also happens to be a former president himself here, George H.W. Bush criticizes then Vice President Dick Cheney saying Cheney built his own empire and asserting too much hard line influence, pushing for force after the September 11th attacks.

Bush's biographer Jon Meacham quotes as saying that Dick Cheney is "just iron-ass. His seem knuckling under to the real hard-charging guy whose want to fight about everything use force to get our way in the Middle East."

Also, the elder Bush goes after his son's secretary of defense, Donald Rumsfeld, as you said, calling him an arrogant fellow who served the president badly.

The book quotes him as saying, "There's a lack of humility, a lack of seeing what the other guy thinks. He's more kick ass and take names, take numbers."

Now, George W. Bush responded to his father's words about his administration. According to "The New York Times" he says, quote, "I disagree with his characterization of what was going on. I made the decisions. This was my philosophy."

Dick Cheney also responded to all of this on FOX News.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DICK CHENEY, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT: I fully admit that after 9/11 I saw my role as being a tough and aggressive as needed to be to carry out the president's policy, 43's policy to make sure we didn't get hit again.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: So, Dick Cheney essentially says yes.

COSTELLO: I was iron ass. Exactly.

I can't help but wonder though how this might affect Jeb Bush, right? Because here is his own father saying George W. Bush didn't have it completely together when he served as president. And there is Jeb Bush always having to stand up for his brother.

BERMAN: There's a criticism of George W. Bush's and now you could say even your own father says there were problems there. How do you respond to that?

I suspect though that Jeb Bush will have a standard response to saying I love both my father. I love both my brother.

COSTELLO: Let's hope he does that this time.

BERMAN: There was love there. Even as they were being critical I didn't find anything that was out of line.

COSTELLO: OK, I want to ask about gay marriage. Because what Georgia H.W. Bush said about gay rights was also surprising.

BERMAN: It changed over time. He describes an evolution in his biography on the issue of same sex marriage. In 1988 during the campaign, Bush said in his audio diary that Americans, quote, "don't want homosexual marriages codified." He now strikes a little bit of a different tune.

He told his biographer Jon Meacham, quote, "People should be able to do what they want to do without discrimination. People have a right to be happy. I guess you could say I have mellowed."

So 91 years old, 91 years old. George H.W. Bush saying he has mellowed. You could say he's changed his position on same-sex marriage.

COSTELLO: John Berman, thanks for stopping by.

Still to come in THE NEWSROOM: a major twist sparks new questions about what caused a Russian plane crash. Up next, why the plane's data recorders could reveal critical clues about the plane's final moments.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:27:54] COSTELLO: Major developments in that Russian plane crash that killed more than 200 people. A U.S. official telling CNN intelligence suggests a bomb planted by ISIS or one of its affiliates may have been on that plane, even worse, there is a possibility it was an inside job.

This morning though, Moscow is pushing back hard, insisting that any claims about what caused the crash are based on, quote, "unconfirmed information".

In the meantime, a major reversal after Russia orders all MetroJet to ground all A321s to conduct additional safety checks.

Let's get more on this from CNN's Nic Robertson. He's outside the St. Petersburg airport in Russia.

Hi, Nic.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yes. Hi, Carol.

It's kind of interesting that we are now hearing from the Federal Aviation Authority now grounding MetroJet's two A321s, because only earlier in the week, they had been re-inspected and passed for service. It certainly does seem to cast the question over MetroJet. On the other hand, you have the Russian authorities saying -- the same

federal aviation authorities saying that they are going to investigate for the possibility of terrorism. They say that they will examine wreckage from the aircraft and bodies for any indication of explosive device, explosive residue on board the aircraft. They will also look at security at Sharm el-Sheikh airport.

However, you also have the Kremlin further muddying the water on what sort of Russia believes was behind this aircraft crash. You have the spokesman at the Kremlin saying that that any versions regarding the incident and its causes may only be voiced by the investigation -- that being Egypt of course. We have not heard any statements from the investigators so far. Any other statements are either unverified information or some type of speculation.

So, what you have from the Russian authorities here on the one hand is casting doubt over the airline itself, technical capabilities. On the other hand saying they will investigate the avenue of terrorism, and on the other hand essentially pouring cold water on the notion that perhaps a bomb was put on board the aircraft.