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32-Year-Old Male Rushes Trump On Stage During Rally In Dayton, Ohio; Sanders Calls Trump "A Pathological Liar"; Trump Crisscrosses Ohio In Hopes Of Taking Its 66 Delegates; Rubio Lobbying Hard For Florida Votes; Obama Points Finger At GOP For Angry Rhetoric. Aired 6- 7p ET

Aired March 12, 2016 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:00:33] POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: 6:00 p.m. Eastern. I'm Poppy Harlow in New York.

So glad you're with us. We begin with politics this evening. Up first, the tense and scary few moments today for Donald Trump speaking on stage just days before the crucial winning take all primaries in both Ohio and Florida.

Here is brand-new video just in to us at CNN. Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I guess I have do it myself. I know it's not ...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: That is a 32-year-old man who jumped on stage, jumped a barrier, rushed towards Donald Trump while he was on stage speaking at this rally earlier today in Dayton, Ohio. The Secret Service as you can see, stepped in, dealt with the man. Trump was not injured.

The man is charged with disorderly conduct and inducing panic. Police in Montgomery County, Ohio, say the suspect is currently in the process of bonding out.

This happened less than a day after Trump's campaign canceled a planned event last night in Chicago after fights broke out in the crowds, to that rally that he had planned to attend and hold. Republican rivals are also coming out, some condemning Trump saying his rhetoric is part of what's to blame. Creating a combative intense atmosphere. Donald Trump points the finger at people who support Senator Bernie Sanders.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Look, it's a Bernie person. It's a Bernie. Hello, Bernie. Hey, Bernie. Get your people in line, Bernie. Get your people in line. Can you imagine Bernie saying Trump should get his people under control and they put in these people? (END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Sanders camp responded to that a written statement today saying, "As is the case virtually every day, Donald Trump is showing that the American people that he is a pathological liar. Obviously, while I appreciate that we had supporters at Trump's rally in Chicago, our campaign did not organize the protest." Security is a major concern. Tonight following those violent clashes last night in Chicago.

CNN correspondent Ryan Young is live for us outside a planned Trump rally in Kansas City. Big crowds there, a lot of security, a police barriers, but so far, all peaceful, right?

RYAN YOUNG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Big crowds, they are peaceful. I could tell you the crowds are a lot smaller what they were last night. But you can look at this crowd, put the Trump supporters that goes around this building. A lot of people are worried they're not going to be able to make it into the event because so many people are trying to get in.

This venue only sits about 3,000 people. We were told by the first guy in line he got here around 8:00 this morning. But Poppy when you talk about the protester, they are across the street and you can see the signs they have there is a barricade here and you can see the fact that the police officers have created a barrier. Across the street to make sure they keep these two groups separated.

Now, will I tell you this, the Trump supporters have been saying on their side of the street here. And they haven't been doing anything. We've actually seen some of the counter protesters on the other side throwing things from across that side over here. And chanting using colorful language to say the most. So most people over here have been maintaining themselves, just kind of paying attention and watching them. Folks over there have thrown a few things as well this.

Now we have seen officers go across the street and make a few arrests. Or detain a few people. They've been trying to maintain the peace. Now, as you can hear, there are people who drove by honking their horns. Kind of just depends on what's going on. This young man that's crossed the way here and he's decided to bring his Bernie Sanders across the way sign.

We've seen that happen a few times. Some people wanted to come across outside to see if they can engage people here in conversations and then it certainly happened. We've had people come over for Bernie Sanders, get in the face of Trump supporters and have a real face-to- face conversation. The police have been watching. No scuffles so far. Nothing like what we saw last night. People are just trying to get in this building, Poppy.

HARLOW: And making their voices heard. Ryan Young, thank you very much. In Kansas City, Missouri.

YOUNG: Absolutely. HARLOW: Donald Trump also crisscrossed Ohio today. He held rallies there three days before the state votes in the primary on Tuesday. Obviously, winner takes all-state, 66 delegates up for grabs. Dozens of protesters were booted from an event in Cleveland that Trump held today.

Our Martin Savidge has more.

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN REPORTER: Standing just outside the I-X Center as they call it here, you could see as they brought out the protesters and at times through door 27A. That's the door they were using to escort the man of the building. You see them coming in groups of five, sometimes groups of ten.

[18:05:03] They were cheering, they were apparently taking it as a real badge of honor that they got thrown out of a Donald Trump rally. They represented all different kinds of causes. But they said their treatment inside actually was good. But they were surrounded by Trump supporters to reach out. But there was no fighting, there was no ugliness like that. And so the authorities quickly moved in and you have to leave and then show up on the door.

Outside here when the event was over, some friction because there were protesters who were against Trump waiting for the supporters as they came out. A lot of loud shouts, but nothing beyond that. Cleveland has a reason that they want this to go well because of course coming up in the summer, they host the Republican national convention. This was a in a very minuscule way, a kind of a dry run for that. It seems to have gone fairly well here. Poppy.

HARLOW: Martin, thank you so much. Live for us in Cleveland tonight.

Donald Trump's rivals on both sides of the aisle are not mincing words. They are blaming the Republican front-runner for instigating violence at his rallies and holding him personally responsible for this chaotic scene in Chicago last night.

Our correspondent Jason Carroll is live in Florida. You're at a meet and greet with Senator Marco Rubio was a little bit earlier. What did he have to say about Donald Trump? Obviously, you know, he's neck and neck with him there. And really wants to take his home state. He's being beaten by Trump in the polls right now. What did he say about the Chicago incident?

JASON CARROLL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, he really does. And Senator Rubio basically saying Poppy that the Chicago incident is just another example of why he believes Donald Trump should not be the nominee. Donald Trump he say is not someone who can unite the party.

Senator Rubio has always said that he is the one who can really unite the party and bring the country together. He's been sort of going back and forth on the issue of whether or not if Donald Trump were to become the presumptive nominee, if he would support him.

Listen to what he had to say earlier today about that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... the nominee if he's the nominee?

SEN. MARCO RUBIO, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I don't know. I mean, I already talked about the fact that I think Hillary Clinton would be terrible for this country, but the fact that you're even asking me that question, I still at this moment continue to intend to support the Republican nominee, but its getting harder every day.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Senator ...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Senator ...

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CARROLL: Getting harder every day. Going forward, what Senator Rubio is doing is staying on message and doing everything that he can to get every vote that he can. You know, Poppy he is trailing behind Trump in the polls here in the state of Florida, his home state.

The Rubio camp believes that he is not trailing. They're not buying into those polls, but having said that, they are hitting the ground running, hitting at many stop here in this state throughout the day including one right here and telling voters get out there, tell people that you know. If they support me to get out and to vote early, he believes he can stop Trump right here in his home state. Poppy.

HARLOW: I thought it was really interesting Jason that he came out and he said that he is done with personal Trump attacks. That he will never, you know, go back into that. Basically the admission, that his change in strategy was wrong.

CARROLL: Yeah, you know, what's interesting about that, I remember attending a rally a few weeks ago in Houston where he addressed a very large crowd and he said look, I am not going to go negative against Trump. I don't want to run the type of campaign that my children would look back at and not be proud of.

And then, so strangely later on that night at that Republican debate that aired right on CNN, you remember that. He went right after him and did the exact to opposite. Thing he said he wasn't going to do.

Obviously, that did not play well. He admitted later that was not a strategy that worked out. That was not who he was as a candidate and as a person. And also didn't help him very much at all in the polls.

So, what he is doing now is, he is going after Trump on the issues. Pointing out the policy issues. Between himself and between Trump hoping that that will help him here in the polls here in his home state.

Once again, if he does not win here in his home state, there's going to be some very tough choices ahead for him.

HARLOW: Of course. The main one, what is that path to a nomination without those 99 delegates in Florida. Before I let you go, though Jason. I mean you've been in Florida for a long time. You've been with the Rubio camp reporting for a long time. What are people saying about why more in that state according to polling are supporting Donald Trump then Senator Rubio in his home state? What is it? Is it his voting record in the state? What is it?

CARROLL: Well, here's what I'm hearing. There are a number of Rubio supporters that I've spoken to, whether they be in south Florida or up here in Tampa in places like Jacksonville that supported him for the Senate. And there are on the fence now because they feel is though, once he got into the Senate, he department do the work he promised to do.

[18:10:03] And actually when I asked as Senator Rubio about that yesterday, he said he didn't believe that was the case. He believes that he got to the Senate and did what he needed to do, but I'm telling you, I spoken to voters here.

Some of those -- once again who supported Rubio when he was running for the Senate. They feel as though once he got there, he did not do the work that he was supposed to have done and I think that's why he's looking at some of the struggles that he seeing here in the state. But once again, Senator Rubio denies that.

HARLOW: Jason Carroll live for us in Tampa tonight, thank you, Jason.

Tomorrow morning, you will not want to miss Jake Tapper, state of the union. Look at that lineup. John Kasich, Donald Trump, Marco Rubio, Bernie Sanders, all live with Jake tomorrow morning. 9:00 a.m. eastern only right here on CNN.

Coming up next, some Republican candidates having second thoughts about backing Donald Trump if he is the party's nominee, we will talk about their so-called love hate relationship with the front-runner.

Also, Senator Ted Cruz slamming Trump over the tone of this presidential race, but does he bear some of the blame for what we have seen? We'll ask the surrogate and we are watching several events happening live this hour. Ted Cruz, Donald Trump, John Kasich all speaking live.

You'll see it right here. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:15:21] HARLOW: The Democratic candidates for president are seizing on the chaos that erupted at the Trump event in Chicago last night. Both Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders blasting the GOP front-runner Donald Trump today saying that he creates an environment for and even encourages some of these clashes.

Our Jeff Zeleny has more tonight from Chicago.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Poppy, those protesters here in Chicago are front and center on the Democratic side of the campaign trail today as well. Bernie Sanders was campaigning here in Chicago and later in Champaign, Illinois and Hillary Clinton was in Missouri. She took a forceful tone against what happened in Chicago against Donald Trump's rhetoric.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If you play with matches, you could start a fire. You can't control. That is not leadership, it is political arson.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ZELENY: Now, political arson, those are her words here, but it could be a preview of what's to come for the general election. If Donald Trump should become the Republican nominee and if she become the Democratic nominee, this could be for the framework of their argument going forward, but Donald Trump accused Bernie Sanders supporters of sort of instigating the protest in Chicago.

Now, I was at the rally last night outside the rally and saw several people holding Bernie Sanders signs. But Bernie Sanders issue a statement late today saying his campaign in no way organized this at all. He said -- some of the supporters were simply standing up to the, you know, divisive rhetoric from the Trump campaign that they didn't like, but Bernie Sanders says he does not responsible for organizing this counter protest.

But Poppy, certainly another day of Donald Trump dominating the conversation on both sides of the aisle. The Democratic candidates speaking pretty harshly against him. Poppy.

HARLOW: Jeff, thank you very much. After that chaos erupted last night at the rally in Chicago, Senator Marco Rubio is now hinting he may not support Donald Trump if he becomes the Republican nominee.

Let's listen to him.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If his voted as nominees -- if he's the nominee?

RUBIO: I don't know. I mean, I already talked about the fact that I think Hillary Clinton would be terrible for this country, but the fact you're even asking me that question, I still at this moment continue to intend to support the Republican nominee. But getting harder every day.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: He's not the only one. Governor John Kasich said today the quote toxic environment that Trump is creating makes it extremely difficult to support him.

Let's remember these are two of 17 candidates who all at one point signed a pledge vowing to back the GOP nominee.

Joining me now, Senior Political Analyst and adviser to for presidents, David Gergen, also with me our CNN Political Commentator Jeffrey Lord, who is a Trump supporter. Thank you both for being here. David, let me begin with you. Rubio says this. Kasich says this. Let's remember they all signed the pledge what has happened to the Republican Party? Are we seeing a fracturing of the Republican Party almost felt as if you could hear just exhaustion, despair. I don't know how you'd describe it in Marco Rubio's answer right there.

DAVID GERGEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Yeah. And we're going to be into a new chapter after Tuesday if Donald Trump runs the tables as John King has been reporting. He's going to have a very, very almost unstoppable lead coming out of that.

So, these things will continue to evolve as we go. I do think a lot of these candidates are preparing themselves if there's some another event as we had in Chicago last night, in somebody gets badly hurt. And again, lets pray that does not happen, then I think they're going to, they may jump.

And that's why I don't understand argument and Jeff, you can help me with this. You say he condemns violence, he doesn't condone violence, but why doesn't he go in front of supporters at the next rally and say, let's be clear about these things and do that two or three times so that the word is firmly out there. He does deserve to be heard. He does deserve a platform. He's mobilize millions of people.

I don't understand why it's such a big barrier to do something sounds so simple and so commonsensically. He says he's a common sense conservative.

HARLOW: Jeff, for you. I mean, let's get your answer to David's question and just what this does to the Republican Party. Is this a fracturing of the party?

JEFFREY LORD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, to David's question, let me start there. I mean, I think David, he has done it. I mean he put out a tweet or a statement here. Just today saying, you know, go in peace or something of that nature. I mean how much ...

HARLOW: But then he also took put out -- Jeffrey, he also put out a tweet that said the organized group of people many of them thugs, who shut down our First Amendment rights in Chicago, have totally energize America.

LORD: Yeah. Exactly. I mean, when you are acting, when thuggish behavior always gets Americans at the back of the American people up. I mean, they can't stand this. They don't like this kind of behavior.

[18:20:00] And this is what they've seen. I mean, I just don't want to rehash this all again, but they've seen this over the decades.

But let me get to the fracturing of the Republican Party. You know, listening to Governor Kasich and Senator Rubio reminds me of governor Romney's statement the other day and governor Romney, you know, his dad did exactly what Governor Romney did recently to Barry Goldwater in June of 1964. HARLOW: The difference is that was largely poll (ph). The difference

is between Goldwater and (inaudible) day is it that, that George Romney was talking about policy. He was talking about Goldwater stance on civil rights and this with Mitt Romney is largely an attack on Trump's personality.

LORD: But the point is Poppy, is that moderate Republicans do one thing. They always talk a good game about party unity when they think one of them is going to win a nomination for president, senator, or governor, congress, whatever it may be.

Then when they lose it to a Tea Party person or a conservative like Ronald Reagan in 1980 when John Anderson left the party and run as independent. They always play the spoiler. This is what they do. This is -- I'm convinced this is in their DNA. So, what you're hearing from Senator Rubio and Governor Kasich frankly is just typical of the breed and it's you know, I think it's disgraceful.

HARLOW: David Gergen, your response to that.

GERGEN: Well, I don't know why this is disgraceful for them to do it and Donald Trump in various times as him as he may still may leave and run as an independent. But I want to come back to this one question.

Listen Jeffrey. Donald Trump has claimed he's a unifier. He's made that a big, big point.

LORD: Right.

GERGEN: This is a real test of his leadership to unify and if he is simply going to double down and not acknowledge at anything he's ever said has helped to incite some of his punk people in the face kind of mentality. You know, I don't quite see how he's going to be improved this unified. This is a test of his leadership. We don't need history here. What we need is what he's going to do now.

HARLWO: David Gengen. Thank you. Jeffrey Lord, thank you. I have to leave it there. You're back with us, Jeffrey.

All right, stay with us. Thank you guys so much.

Coming up, three live events likely this hour. You're taking a look at them there. Ted Cruz in Missouri. Donald Trump in Kansas City. John Kasich in Ohio. Three candidates for the party's nomination. We will hear from them. How they're making their case to voters ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:26:37] HARLOW: The state of Ohio in play tonight and John Kasich wants every one of those 66 delegates up for grabs in this critical winner take all-state. It is critical state for him. Kasich has said if he doesn't win Ohio. Well, there's not really a path ahead. He is speaking now at a town hall in Mansfield. Let's listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) GOV. JOHN KASICH, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We have to lower the taxes, we have to control the overhead and frankly, we got to change the menu. So where are we today? Well, we were down those 350,000 jobs and now, we are up over 400,000 jobs. 400,000 families who are doing better in Ohio.

Our budget is balanced and we were 8 billion in the hole. 20 percent of our operating budget and now, we have a $2 billion surplus, which sends a message all across America and by the way, all across the world, that Ohio is open for business. And do you remember those people in New York who told me that we were dead?

They're singing a little different tune, now, ladies and gentlemen, because they know Ohio's back and they know we're growing. They know we're profitable. They know we're rising. And I've got to tell you, you know, how does this work? How does it work?

Well, I mean, I've learn over the years exactly how it does work. You have to have common sense regulations. You know, the entities that employ us increasingly are the small businesses.

Now, you know, Gorman-Rupp's a pretty good size, but I kind of think about them as a small business in a way. They certainly started that way and they've grown and gotten stronger and stronger, but you ask Jeff Gorman, is he here?

How do you like those regular Jeff? Is that helping you out?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just get rid of him John.

KASICH: You know, I've been here before, but I was so proud to pull up here with that big G.R. Gorman-Rupp pumps. Did you see how big it was and all the people that come to work here, give him a great round of applause for what he and his family have done.

So, he just shakes his head when the government comes in and pounds him. And they say, well, we got another rule.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: John Kasich speaking live this evening in Mansfield, Ohio, making his case to voters there to go to the polls for him come Tuesday. Also, this programming note. Join us for the CNN T.V. one Democratic presidential town hall in advance of Tuesday's critical primaries. Ohio voters will put questions directly to Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton. That is tomorrow night, 8:00 p.m. eastern only right here.

Coming up next, President Obama pointing the finger at the GOP for the angry rhetoric we've seen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[18:30:03] PRES. BARACK OBAMA, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: And what's been happening in our politics lately, it's not an accident.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: The President talking about the anger and anxiety we've seen saying it is not an accident. Who he blames and is he right? We'll debate it, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: Republican front-runner Donald Trump is in Kansas City, Missouri tonight a day after he canceled his rally in Chicago after fistfights broke out between Trump supporters and demonstrators. Trump held a rally in Ohio earlier today. He was surrounded by security.

See that's happening. This is when a man rushed the stage. He was quickly escorted out. That man was charged with disorderly conduct and also inducing panic. Trump was not injured.

Our Jim Acosta is at the rally where Trump is headed right now. That is in Kansas City, Missouri. Jim, you're inside. Now you were outside for much of the day seeing a lot of the protesters around et cetera. What are you seeing inside?

[18:35:00] JIM ACOSTA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Poppy, yes no, not as much of the tension that we saw outside of this theatre. You're right. Donald Trump is scheduled to speak within the next hour or so.

And what we saw outside earlier this afternoon was pretty indicative of what you're seeing at a lot of Trump rallies. Now you see on one side of the street, a lot of Trump protesters. And then just in front of the venue inside there was a long line of Trumps supporters.

And as I look around this treater and here Poppy I can tell this is a very different scene that what we saw in Chicago last night. I was inside that arena in Chicago and you saw hundreds if not thousands of protesters who were sort of, you know, primed and ready to go, to disrupt that rally. And that's essentially what took place last night. They stopped the rally from occurring. We're not seeing any indications of that now, so we should hear from the candidate at the top of this hour or shortly there after and there shouldn't be in problems.

I did talk to an official with the Kansas police department just before coming inside here. He told me that they don't have a larger number of officers of position here because of what happened in Chicago last night. They have their standard number of officers positioned here. But he did say we are certainly aware of what took place in Chicago. We're certainly aware of what took place in St. Louis. There was an incident in st. Louis as well. Not to the level of what we saw in Chicago.

Poppy, I think the lesson to be learned from Chicago last night, probably a lot of lessons to be learn, but strictly from a law enforcement standpoint, there wasn't the number of officers necessary to quite that disturbance and that's why it took 15, 20 minutes of scuffles for that to quiet down, but at this point, not seeing any indications of trouble like we saw last night. Poppy.

HARLOW: All right, that's good to hear. People making their voices as heard as they should, but without the violence, at least for now.

Thank you so much, Jim Acosta live for us in Kansas City. Of course, we'll bring you that Trump event as soon as it begins live.

Bernie Sanders is blaming Trump's promotion of "Hatred and division", his words for the fistfights that broke out at the Chicago rally yesterday. President Obama also weighing in on all of it. Here's what he said in Texas.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: And what's been happening in our politics lately, it's not an accident. For year, we've been told we should be angry about America. And that the economy's a disaster. And that we're weak. And that compromises weakness and that you can ignore science and you can ignore facts. And say whatever you want about the president. And feed suspicious about immigrants. And Muslims. And poor people. And people who aren't like us. And say that that, the reason America is in decline is because of those people. That didn't just happen last week that narrative has been promoted now for years.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: On our political commentators, Ben Ferguson and Marc Lamont Hill to weigh in on all of this. So nice to have you on gentlemen, I appreciate it. Let's dig into that. Let's dig to what the president said. He pointed out a number of examples, Ben, but he said this has been happening for years. This is not new. This climate has been foster. Your take.

BEN FERGUSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I think it's certainly new when it comes to Donald Trump and the way he's been voicing his opinions on how he likes to talk this tough talk and talk about bullying people and talk about, you know, calling people losers and stupid and idiot and incompetent. And that's the people that he's running against in the Republican primary.

When you're a protester, he talks about wanting to hit you in the face, he talks about the good old days when protesters were taken out on stretchers. He has been consistently ratcheting up this rhetoric to an entirely new level that no one else in the Republican field has been doing.

And when people starts to act out, like the 70 plus year old man that hit sucker punched a protester at his rally, what did you think was going to happen, I would say to Donald Trump. He built this fire. He didn't throw the match on it. I want to clear about that. Protesters went in there to do that. But he's responsible for bringing it to this level.

HARLOW: So, let's Marc weigh in here because what I wanted to at add on to what Ben said, But was the climate right for that?

MARC LAMONT HILL, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Absolutely. Donald Trump is the candidate that the Republican Party deserves. Donald Trump is the candidate that the Republican Party through its practice, through its policy, through its rhetoric, has almost called for and demanded and nominated.

So yes, Donald Trump is an extreme instance of this. He is an extreme example of this. I can't imagine any other Republican candidate who would have riots in streets who would have this kind of absurd violence at his or her rallies, but what I will say of the narrative of anti-immigrant sentiment, the narrative of disrespect against the president, the narrative of reducing compromise to a sign of weakness.

[18:40:07] All of these things are part of machine that has been going on for not just the Obama administration but really the last two decades. And so Trump is finally what happens, yeah.

HARLOW: To that point, David Gergen was saying earlier, to be fair, the President could have reached out much more in the early years of his presidency. He could have made more deals with the Republicans. He was part of fostering sort of climate of such division.

HILL: Find that and I love David Gergen, I think he's a brilliant analyst, but I find that stunning. I think many of us on the left would say President Obama conceited too much. That he almost had a naivety in the first two years. When he wasn't negotiating, the China comprised everything from the fiscal cliff to the debt ceiling to nuclear shields in Russia to Obamacare in the public option in particular. That he kept giving and giving. He was starting from a place of the middle. The Republicans were saying we're not giving you anything. I mean, he compromised too much.

HARLOW: Ben.

FERGUSON: Poppy, look, I think President Obama, he didn't even get along very well with his own party on Capitol Hill after Obamacare, much less the Republicans. That did allow an opening for people to be frustrated and sick and tired of Washington.

There are major things that the President did and said that made the other side Republicans say we need to find a very tough leader to go back after this administration and undue some of the things he's done. That is where Donald Trump jumped in. He saw a void and he said I'm going to fill it.

The problem is he is a guy who is a real TV show. That is a bully. He understands how to trash talk. We've seen the trash talk that he has done on stage. I mean, he's referred to people looking like child molesters. He's referred to, you know, females as you know, as dealing with bleeding out of where ever. We've seen him talk about other Clinton defense like Carly Fiorina.

HARLOW: Back to what the President said, Ben. You know, has this the environment for this been fostered, the president pointing to others in the party. In the Republican Party. Saying you should have allowed this to manifest.

FERGUSON: Well, here's the difference. Donald Trump is an uncontrollable individual. He has not been a part of the Republican Party. He's been more of a Democrat in his life than Republican. He built a populous void. More Republicans, let's not forget, I voted against Donald Trump in this primary than have voted for him. He has been winning around 30 percent of the vote on average.

There are people like Ted Cruz. There are people like Marco Rubio. There are people like John Kasich who are the complete opposite of this. You would never have seen this. In any one of the other rallies because they do not talk trash, but the main people the way Donald Trump does.

HARLOW: Final word, Marc.

HILL: For one, I mean, let's be clear here. Most people have not voted for John Kasich. Most have not voted for Ted Cruz. Most people have not voted for Marco Rubio. So let's not cherry pick Donald Trump.

FERGUSON: Well, that looks sense.

HILL: No, I know but I'm saying. What you're saying about Trump is true but it also true about the other three candidates and Ted Cruz inspires much of the same anti-immigrants sentiment, must as the same anti -- this sort of xenophobic rhetoric.

And they also have assign to this idea that America isn't decline because of change. This is not just a Trump problem. This isn't -- an honestly just a Republican problem because Democrats have been complicit through his vicious trade policies and economic beliefs. That also makes us in the condition to so economically desperate that they got radicalize who had Donald Trump.

It's not just people overseas that get radicalized. People get radicalized into white nationalism because Donald Trump is Americas bad, will make great again, a really white again through these crazy policies that he has no answer for. No explanation for.

FERGUSON: You're reaching now, Marc. This is not a KKK rally.

HILL: OK.

HARLOW: Ben, I got to leave it there. I have to leave it there. Thank you both.

HIM: It seemed like one, Ben.

HARLOW: I appreciate it. Important conversation, got to leave it there. Thank you, both.

Still to come, this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TED CRUZ, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: But I think a campaign bears responsibility for creating an environment. When the candidate urges supporters to engage in physical violence, to punch people in the face.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[18:44:15] HARLOW: Senator Ted Cruz speaking out about the violence at some of those Donald Trump events. Much more of that ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: Senator Ted Cruz called the violence last night at the canceled Chicago Trump rally a "Predictable consequence of Trump's posture towards protester at his events."

Let's talk about all of it and at lot more with the New Jersey State Director for the Cruz campaign Steve Lonegan, he is also former U.S. senate candidate from New Jersey. Thank you for being with me.

STEVE LONEGAN, NEW JERSEY STATE DIRECTOR, CRUZ CAMPAIGN: Poppy, thanks for having me.

HARLOW: Nice to have you. I know you're down in Miami.

LONEGAN: I am.

HARLOW: And let's just look at this for Senator Cruz had this to say, reacting to what happened at that Trump rally last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CRUZ: I think a campaign bears responsibility for creating an environment. When the candidate urges supporters to engage in physical violence, to punch people in the face. The predictable consequence of that is that it escalates and today is unlikely to be the last such instance. We saw earlier today in st. Louis, over 30 arrests. That's not how our politics should occur.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Here's the thing. Steve, this is coming from Senator Cruz who four months refused to criticize Donald's behavior for months and months and months. He didn't criticize his behavior. So I think some people look at this and say what gives him the ground to say what he just said now?

LONEGAN: Well, because he's running for president of the United States and he's a leader.

HARLOW: Well, he was running he didn't call out Donald Trump.

LONEGAN: Well, we're running right now, Poppy. But here's what's really fascinating.

[18:50:02] Donald Trump has done a wonderful job of taking a page out of the Barack Obama handbook on how to divide Americans and create this illusion that he's got his big massive enemies.

It's really fascinating because the police last night, the state county and local police told Donald Trump everything was fine. He didn't ask him if he should close down his so called protest and so called violent protest.

What happen is a group of MoveOn.org washed-up hippies, bunch of left wing liberals, college students and some Black Lives Matter (inaudible) should out.

HARLOW: Hey Steve, I just want to get back to the question that I asked you. I just -- I really want to get back to the question that asked you. And the question is does senator Ted Cruz played any role in this in terms of not calling Donald Trump out sooner? And now he is. Now he's saying basically how can we allow this behavior and these things?

LONEGAN: Poppy, thank you. That's a good point. But I think it's take time to realize just what sort of a divisive candidate Donald Trump is, and it took time to people to realize. Well, this guy is really creating division within our country. This is his technique for trying to win elections. He's the victim candidate. He's the guy who's the victim. His supporters are supporting Donald Trump because Donald Trump was the victim last night. The victim of what? Some washed-up MoveOn.org hippies?

If Ted Cruz was at that rally, Poppy, Ted Cruz at that rally he would have walked into that group, he would have engaged them, you brought them on that stage. He's not afraid.

HARLOW: I want you to listen to some sound from your candidate, Senator Ted Cruz. This was after the death of Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia just last month.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CRUZ: We've got 11 more months of watching damage to this country from a lawless and faithless president who's eager to travel to Cuba but unwilling to even show up at the funeral of Justice Scalia.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: So he called the President, "Lawless and faithless." Do words like those contribute to the angry tone of this election, contribute to the divisiveness?

LONEGAN: They contribute to perhaps throwing protesters out to one of Ted Cruz's rallies in which he will engage them on the issue, not shut down the rally because he's afraid of them.

HARLOW: So you're saying that it does contribute to divisiveness?

LONEGAN: Well, it contributes to the debate and the discussion over the current administration. It certainly you'll never go a Ted Cruz.

And by the way, Poppy, I've been to Donald Trump rallies. I've seen this in action. I was with Glenn Beck at Palo Verde High School in Nevada. When Glenn Beck was up speaking and Donald Trump barged into the meeting with supporters, they starting gyring and stomping. It was really disgraceful.

It looks like freaky scary, actually. This is what I've seen at Trump- style events. He does inspire hate. I don't care if people criticize me or not. I don't care if Donald Trump was the victim last night. I don't need a victim president. This guy has created this illusion. He did not have to cancel that rally last night, Poppy. He could have continued with that rally.

HARLOW: Let's talk more also about Ted Cruz. If you think back to September, there was a supporter at a Trump rally who called the president a Muslim. Everyone remembers that moment. And Senator Cruz was asked about it. He said he didn't want to speculate about the president's faith. Let's listen to his response then.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CRUZ: The president's faith is between him and god. I'm not going to speculate on the president's faith. What I will talk about is his policies. And his policies have been profoundly damaging to this country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: So he could have said, no, the President's not a Muslim but I'm not interested in that. What I'm interested in are the policies but he didn't. And I just wonder if you think that also again contributes to sort of the tone of the campaign that's taken us here?

LONEGAN: I don't think Ted Cruz is an expert on Barack Obama's faith so I don't think that's even a factor in what happened last night.

HARLOW: So you think he really questioned if he was a Muslim?

LONEGAN: Well, I think a lot of people have questioned, you know, the President's faith, but that's not an issue. Nor was it an issue at last night's rally. Nor is it an issue in this campaign for the Republican nomination.

HARLOW: But it an issue when you come down to tone and when you come down to division and divisiveness?

LONEGAN: Poppy, if you're trying to equate Ted Cruz to being a divisive candidate like Donald Trump, you're way off base. We all know that's not the case.

HARLOW: I am not. I'm asking you what role your candidate plays in the environment that surrounds this election.

LONEGAN: Our candidate has come across in every debate very presidential. He's come across with substantive answers to all the questions on issues and policy. He continues to articulate a profound message of constitutional leadership while Donald Trump stand there and says, Ted, you're a liar, Marco little Marco, and all his other, you know, disgraceful conduct that is really freaky and has lead to where we are today.

Ted Cruz has been a uniter. He's been a leader. He's been articulate. He's been a true constitutional conservative. That's the difference between him and Donald Trump, who is using that sort of Saul Alinsky, Barack Obama style of politics.

[18:55:04] If you saw it last night in St. Louis. Donald Trump -- one of two things happened in St. Louis last night, Poppy. Either Donald Trump was afraid of those protesters and ran in fear, which is what he did at CPAC, by the way, we had some conservative ...

HARLOW: I got 20 seconds left Steve. I got 20 seconds.

LONEGAN: Either he ran in fear or he staged that event. He did not have to shut down that rally. That was a fraud. Those one of many of Donald method.

HARLOW: There has been -- to be fair here there has been no evidence that anything was staged. Just don't want to put that out there. But Steve Lonegan, it's an important discussion. Come back ...

(CROSSTALK)

LONEGAN: Yes, there is evidence, Poppy. I disagree. There is evidence.

HARLOW: OK, thank you, Steve. We'll be back.

LONEGAN: Donald Trump did it. That's the evidence. He ended a event he didn't have to end.

HARLOW: Thank you very much. Appreciate the time.

LONEGAN: Thank you.

HARLOW: Coming up, tomorrow night, even honestly (ph) was not above dirty politics. Uncover the dark truths of Lincoln versus Douglas on the next episode of "Race for the White House." I have seen it. It is not to miss episode. Tomorrow night 10:00 p.m. eastern only right here.

Coming up, supporters and protesters waiting for Donald Trump to take stage in Kansas City, Missouri.

Live pictures of quite a line there waiting to get in and hear Donald Trump speak.

We will take you live there ahead.

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