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New Details in Istanbul Airport Attack; Political Chaos in U.K.; British M.P. Talks Brexit, New Referendum; Trump Struggles with Lead Republican Support; New Details in Istanbul Airport Attack; U.S.- Led Coalition Airstrikes on ISIS; New Trial for Adnen Syed; Political Chaos in U.K. Aired 2-3a ET
Aired July 01, 2016 - 02:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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[02:00:13] HALA GORANI, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Hala Gorani. It's 9:00 a.m. here at Istanbul's airport. We're getting new details about the men who blew themselves up here a few days ago.
JOHN VAUSE, CNN ANCHOR: I'm John Vause, at Number 10 Downing Street. There's betrayal, anger and outrage in the next race for the prime minister. AMARA WALKER, CNN ANCHOR: And in the U.S. presidential campaign, why
the presumptive Republican nominee is saying his party is not standing by him.
It's 11:00 p.m. in Los Angeles. I'm Amara Walker. We want to welcome our viewers in the United States and around the world. This is CNN.
GORANI: Investigators here in Istanbul are trying to connect the dots between this triple suicide bombing at this airport Tuesday and ISIS. The death toll stands at 44. The funerals are heartbreaking. They are taking place throughout the city.
New surveillance video shows one of the attackers running through the airport with his gun. Turkish officials and state media say the militants were from Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan and Dagestan. Officials are trying to find out if anyone else is involved, help them make the vests. They raided houses and arrested at least 22 people.
CNN's senior international correspondent, Nima Elbagir, visited the apartment apparently rented by the suspects for the past month. Here's what she found.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NIMA ELBAGIR, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This is a typical street in Istanbul. But the estate agent who manages this property, told us he was brought in to confirm that the men they showed him on CCTV footage, they had rented this property from him.
Up, just one flight of stairs, this is it. This is where Turkish authorities have told us they believe the three attackers holed up for a month. The attackers, they say, came from Raqqa and all evidence the Turkish authorities currently have in their possession, points towards the ISIS leadership's direct involvement in the planning, the commissioning and the execution of the attack on Ataturk Airport.
We've been trying to discover what, if anything, anyone saw. And the garage is overlooked by the attackers. He's agreed to speak to us.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translation): Sometimes I would see them when they opened the window to smoke and to get some fresh air. But they never opened the curtains. We have been anxious as locals here. You can never ask who are you to someone. It's not our duty. There are police and other officials in this country who should be dealing with it.
ELBAGIR: People are feeling worried. They're feeling tense. And few of the neighbors in this building agreed to speak on camera. But one woman described to us on Sunday, two days before the attack was launched, smelling something chemicals, a strong chemical smell emanating from the flat rented by the attackers. She said it filled the entire building.
(voice-over): Turkish security forces say it was here the men flagged down the taxi that would take them to Ataturk Airport where horror would soon unfold.
Today, in the same square, life seems almost normal.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GORANI: While Nima Elbagir is reporter there, we are learning more, now, about the innocent victims killed Tuesday. One of the youngest is 3, seen here behind his sister. He tied from his injuries on Thursday. His mother died a day earlier. The father and sister were wounded in the attack. It was a Palestinian family who had come to Turkey on vacation.
A Tunisian doctor, who was in Turkey, trying to rescue his own son from ISIS in Iraq died. He was a humanitarian missions veteran.
An 8-year-old and three of the aunts were laid to rest on Wednesday. The sisters were just 24, 16 and 14. They had arrived to visit family.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[02:05:07] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Before she goes, she hugged me and said, come with us. I told her that I will come.
UNIDENTIFIED CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: He wanted someone -- he wanted people to know something about your daughter, what would you want people to know about her?
UNIDENTIFIED CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: She was a very lovely.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Very lovely.
UNIDENTIFIED CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Very lovely.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I loved her.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: We'll have much more from Istanbul ahead, including what the U.S.-led coalition is doing the fight is in the self-proclaimed capitol, Raqqa, Syria.
On that sad note, back to you, John.
VAUSE: Hala, thank you.
It's been a week since the U.K. voted to leave the European Union, a week that's been wild, to say the least. David Cameron walked out of the door behind me and resigned.
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DAVID CAMERON, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: I will do everything I can, as prime minister, to steady the ship over the coming weeks and months. But I do not think it would be right for me to try to be the captain that steers our country to its next destination.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: After that, many were thinking that the next leader would be Boris Johnson. He was the Leave Campaigners' loudest advocate. Now, everything else, a surprise. Johnson shocked and angered supporters on Thursday, saying he doesn't want the job. Justice Secretary Michael Gove, one of the front runners to replace David Cameron. He said that Johnson could provide the leadership they need. Home Secretary Theresa May is also considered a front runner.
We're experiencing a downpour.
Robin Oakley joining me here.
I'm going to get under your umbrella, Robin. It's a bit wet at the moment.
This is an incredible thing when you think of what's happened in the past 24 hours. In some ways, maybe Boris Johnson should have expected it. The Conservatives have a history of backstopping and betraying the front runners.
ROBIN OAKLEY, CNN POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: A long history of it. I've never seen so much turmoil across all of the parties we're seeing now. The assassin rarely inherits the crown, as they say. It will be interesting to see what this brings about for Michael Gove.
But remember, the reason we had a referendum in Britain is to heal the divisions in the ruling Conservative Party.
(CROSSTALK)
VAUSE: It's done the opposite.
OAKLEY: It's done completely the opposite.
VAUSE: And many are doing a comparison with Michael Gove and the TV series "House of Cards." There was a mockup. We can show the viewers. It has Gove sitting in the Abe Lincoln chair, a la Kevin Spacey. You know, the U.K. has never seen anything like this. And t original "House of Cards" was British, was much better.
OAKLEY: "House of Cards" and "Game of Thrones." There's plenty of blood about on the political street at the moment.
VAUSE: They say a week is a long politics. But these days, 24 hours is a lifetime.
OAKLEY: You turn the page, and something else has changed, somebody else resigned. What it will do to the future of the Conservative Party, you begin to wonder. The only person who is looking like a safe pair of hands is Theresa May. And she can only be strengthened by Michael Gove putting out. There's people saying, he's -- Theresa May supported Remain in the campaign, although not enthusiastically.
VAUSE: She has played it smart.
OAKLEY: She has.
VAUSE: Michael Gove, he has the distinction, in the eyes of many, betrayed his friend, David Cameron, and now, betraying his friend, Boris Johnson.
OAKLEY: He's the smiler with the knife. He's done down two of them. Where does it stop? Of course, there's a lot of anger against Michael Gove, within the party for doing this. Not just among Boris Johnson supporters. They're accusing him of playing student politics. One M.P. went so far to say, there's a pit in hell for people like him. That's the bitterness we're going to see for a long time to come.
VAUSE: Compared to the Labour Party, the Conservatives looked like everything was orderly until yesterday. And now, we have a political instability, in the both major parties here, against a back trap of the economic uncertainty. And both parties seem to be leaderless.
OAKLEY: We shouldn't forget that the Labour leadership conference, Angela Eagle, expected to stand against him. She pulled back because there was such chaos it didn't seem her to step forward and challenge him. We're expecting to see the challenge to the Labour leader some time today. It is chaos at the top of both major parties.
[02:10:11] VAUSE: Robin Oakley, so much to talk about. You'll be with us in the coming hours. We appreciate it.
Days after members of the Labour Party voted no confidence in Jeremy Corbyn, he's sparked another controversy, and the Labour leader appeared to compare the Israeli government to ISIS.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JEREMY CORBYN, LABOUR PARTY LEADER: Our Jewish friends are no more responsible than our Muslim friends are for the Islamic States.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: Jewish leaders in Britain and Israel were quick to slam his remarks. He later told the "Independent" newspaper he was not equating Israel with is. Corbyn is under fire for his hard-hearted campaign in the E.U. He was already under fire.
Much more Brexit coverage on CNN coming up. When we come back, we will talk to a British M.P. about the wild political week, and the possibility of another E.U. referendum.
And later, Donald Trump says he is running against two parties, including his own. What some Republicans say they need before they endorse him.
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(SPORTS REPORT)
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[02:15:21] VAUSE: Welcome back, everybody. I'm John Vause in London, outside of the prime minister's residence, 10 Downing Street.
The Conservative Party is scrambling looking for a new leader. Boris Johnson says he does not want to be prime minister. He was considered to be the leading candidate. There are five Conservatives competing right now. The front runners are the Justice Secretary Michael Gove, and Home Secretary Theresa May.
Sir William Cash, a British member of parliament and Leave Supporter joins me in our dry, climate-controlled studios across town.
Sir William, did Michael Gove stab Boris Johnson in the back?
SIR WILLIAM CASH, BRITISH M.P. & LEAVE SUPPORTER: I don't have the whole picture, but it didn't look too good. What I can say, there's a loft talk about who is the front runner and the rest of it. I think this must be my seventh or eighth leadership contest. What I believe strongly is that people need to think about what has happened in the past. Front runners at the beginning do end up not being able to carry it out to the end. There's a disaggregation of votes as people drop out. That's really important at this stage.
VAUSE: Could you support Theresa May, as the next leader, even though she was part of the Remain Camp. Yesterday, he was very firm. Brexit means Brexit.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
THERESA MAY, BRITISH HOME SECRETARY: The campaign was fought. The vote was held turnout was high. And the public gave their verdict. There must be no attempts to remain inside the E.U. No attempts to rejoin it in the back door and no second referendum.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VAUSE: Is that the kind of thing you want to hear from the next leader of the Conservatives? The next prime minister?
CASH: I think it's realistic for all of the candidates, actually. After all, the British people are giving their verdict. The Labour Party is saying the result has to be respected. Who is the best person to deliver it? And what is their mindset? The movement towards exit has to be from Number 10 Downing Street. And that means whoever is doing it has got to completely understand the situation. Actually, my opinion, has got to have a Brexit mindset. And you also have to deal with a whole question of the civil service. All of the laws are being reversed. I'm chairman of a congressional committee that deals with these matters. And actually, I've had enormous amount of difficulty with Theresa May over the last few years in relation to justice and home affairs. Her track record in these matters has not been good at all. That's going to be a fact they're will come in as the voter system continues in the next couple of weeks.
VAUSE: I'd like to get your reaction to an opinion piece in the "Independent." This is what was written: "The whole charade has been a sham chimpanzee's tea party. This china's all smashed. There's cake everywhere. These cheerful imbeciles no not what they do."
There seems to be utter turmoil within the Conservative Party and Labour Party when the country is facing one of the biggest challenges in a generation.
CASH: They want to get the issue back to the reason why the verdict of the British people was correct. Why, in fact, it is essential, that we leave the European Union. Not necessarily on this program. Talking about the campaign, it's one thing to compete for the leadership. But somebody like Angela Ledsome (ph) who has an enormous amount of knowledge, track record, and has really substantial experience of working in the city of London and I'm talking about serious players, are actually putting more and more emphasis on her. You're bound to have -- I've been through all of the leadership elections over the last 30 years. For example, the assassination of Margaret Thatcher was very similar in certain respects. There's going to be a short period of chaos. When the voting starts to sort its way through, and then people begin to realign themselves, as people drop out, so the thing will calm down substantially. And this is unlike choosing a prime minister for general election because this is what the whole future of who governs Britain or not. And we can deliver a really successful Brexit.
[02:20:32] VAUSE: On the issue of Boris Johnson and delivering a successful Brexit, one of the criticisms being made is here is a man without a plan. He latched on to the campaign as of getting into Number 10. But he never thought that the referendum would go the way it did. When it did turn out, with a vote to leave, he just didn't know what to do.
CASH: I can't read his mind, I have to admit. And all I can say, is stories abound at the moment. Rumors are like bats that fly in the night, they say. And actually, the truth to how it all happened, I can't tell you I know. But what I do know, I think he made the right decision because, in practice, I don't think he would have been a details man, someone able to see the whole landscape and the arguments to deliver the Brexit from within Number 10. I think that's an important point. I will come back to that.
This is going to have to be a new administration of competence, competence to deal with the civil service, who are going to have to go into complete reverse, competence to explain to people why the verdict was the right one, and competence to deal with the European institutions, which, the chairman of the committee, I do the whole time, because I'm chairman of the committee that has corresponding committees, and the other member states. This is an important but nonetheless exacting task. But there's no doubt at all it is in British interest to do it. It's about democracy, which I know your viewers in America will understand, because who governs you is crucial. And Americans wouldn't conceive having the American people governed by other member states, which has been in practice so far, nor, for that matter, to have the Supreme Court overridden by another Supreme Court. It's unthinkable. So, I think the American people of the realities. It's what people fought and died for. It's called democracy.
VAUSE: There's a lot of support for Britain leaving the E.U., among many Americans.
We'll leave it there. Thank you for being with us.
CASH: Thank you very much, indeed. Thank you.
VAUSE: Let's go back to Los Angeles, where it's not raining -- Amara?
WALKER: It is not raining. It is dry here.
John, thank you for that.
Donald Trump is the presumptive Republican presidential nominee. But he is struggling with the problem he's been facing since his campaign started, which is gaining the support of key leaders from his own party.
Our senior White House correspondent, Jim Acosta, has that.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Just weeks before he's set to become the Republican nominee, Donald Trump isn't feeling like the life of the party.
DONALD TRUMP, (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE & CEO, TRUMP ORGANIZATION (voice-over): It's almost like in some ways I'm running against two parties.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): No kidding.
TRUMP: I'm not sure it matters because I think we're going to win. ACOSTA: Trump is openly complaining about his past rivals refusing to
endorse him, despite signing a GOP loyalty pledge, a document Trump agreed to himself.
TRUMP: They broke their word. In my opinion, they should never be allowed to run for public office again because what they did was disgraceful.
(CHEERING)
ACOSTA: But it's not just his opponents from the primaries. GOP Senators are hesitant to get onboard.
SEN. SUSAN COLLINS, (R), MAINE: He was not my second choice. He was not my third choice. And I'm going to see what happens at the convention. It's going to be very important to me whom Donald Trump chooses as his running mate. That is arguably the most important decision a candidate can make.
ACOSTA: Chris Christie is being vetted by the campaign. Utah Senator Mike Lee is urging Trump to consider Texas Senator Ted Cruz. But Mike Lee is still furious that Trump once floated a bogus conspiracy theory about Cruz's father.
SEN. MIKE LEE, (R), UTAH: He accused my best friend's father of conspiring to kill JFK.
ACOSTA: Cruz hasn't endorsed Trump. Trump's top message on trade remains a worry for Republicans. Consider his latest assault on Mexico, a key U.S. Trading partner.
TRUMP: The leaders are so much smarter, so much sharper. And it's incredible. In fact, that could be a Mexican plane up there, ready to attack.
[02:25:16] ACOSTA (on camera): A little more than half of Republicans would like to vote for somebody else, besides Trump. That's a lot of ground the make up, with the GOP convention only three weeks away.
Jim Acosta, CNN, Manchester.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WALKER: In the meantime, the U.S. attorney general is facing criticism after meeting with Bill Clinton. Loretta Lynch said she spoke briefly with the former president on Monday, after they realized they were on the same airport tarmac in Phoenix. Some Democrats and Republicans are calling the meeting a conflict of interests. Now Lynch is overseeing ongoing investigation into Hillary Clinton's private e-mail server.
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TRUMP: You see a thing like this and, even in terms of judgment, how bad of judgment is it for him or for her to do this. Who would do this?
LORETTA LYNCH, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: I was leaving and he --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WALKER: Lynch is reassuring that the investigation has not been compromised or politicized.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LYNCH: He did come over and said hello and speak to my husband and myself. He talked about his grandchildren and his travels and things like that. That was the extent of that. No discussions were held of cases. And he didn't raise anything about that either.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WALKER: U.S. federal safety regulators are urging the owners of Hondas and Acuras to stop driving their cars immediately. They say new tests show the air bags have a higher risk of exploding and killing passengers or the driver. Regulators call the risk grave. And say the owners should have the air bags replaced right away. You'll find a list of the affected cars online at "CNN Money."
U.S. investigators are investigating the autopilot on Tesla cars after a fatal crash. The car is supposed to steer, change lanes and adjust the speed. A driver in Florida died when his Tesla collided with a truck. The autopilot could not tell the white side of the truck from the brightly lit sky. And the brake was not applied.
We'll get back to Istanbul next and Turkish media reports about the Chechnyan commanders that may have planned the vicious airport attack.
Plus, we go back to London to hear what the pollsters have to say about who could replace David Cameron as prime minister.
You're with CNN.
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[02:31:00] HALA GORANI, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Hala Gorani at Ataturk Airport in Istanbul. Another person has succumbed to injuries from Tuesday's triple-suicide bombing, bringing the death toll to 44.
Police have been showing people in one neighborhood a picture of the three men who they believe carried out the attack. Turkish officials say they have strong evidence that they were directed by is. Another new surveillance video has emerged. It shows one of the suicide bombers, running through the airport, brandishing his gun as you see there.
Turkish officials say Tuesday's attack was well-planned. And sources are revealing new details bout who might have been behind it.
CNN's Brian Todd has that story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The three men crossed into Turkey with their suicide vests last month, according to a Turkish government source. They came from the ISIS stronghold of Raqqa, where it's believe ISIS leaders help them plan the operation. One attacker is from Dagestan, one from Uzbekistan, one from Kyrgyzstan.
Analysts say the Asian connection isn't surprising.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When ISIS looks for places to recruit, they look for places where people are battle. Hardened by local insurgencies or participation in criminal networks. Two of the places within the former Soviet Union, are right here between Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan, and Tajikistan, bordering Afghanistan, and Dagestan, boarding Chechnya.
TODD: Experts say ISIS operatives from the Asian regions could have moved inside Turkey more freely than Arabs.
JAMES JEFFREY, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO TURKEY: Many of the people from that area, the former Soviet Union, language, culture and ethnic identifying factors are similar to those of Turks. They would blend in better than someone from Tunisia or Libya.
TODD: Turkish media report on a mastermind, a Chechen, his whereabouts are unknown. The U.S. Treasury Department has designated one ISIS commander of Chechen origin, who is missing a hand and a leg, saying he has been planning attacks against facilities.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They come to terrorism from crime. That experience being involved in transnational trafficking, of weapons, people, money, hardens them in a way that some of the recruits from Western Europe just aren't hardened.
TODD: Analysts say ISIS already had an extended network of cells inside Turkey. Would the airport attackers have coordinated with them?
JEFFREY: Those people have limited contract with the local cell by chance rolled up somebody in the local cell they were watching, the high-value assets have been trained and prepared, would be caught, as well. Probably, they would have gone into quasi isolation.
TODD (on camera): The airport attackers might have operated an isolated cell. But they did leave clues. A government source saying one of the attackers left behind his passport in an apartment they rented in Istanbul.
Brian Todd, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GORANI: Despite the ISIS attacks we saw in Paris last November, and Brussels in March, and Istanbul this week, the terrorist group is losing ground on the battlefield itself in Iraq and Syria. The U.S. government says territory under ISIS control has shrunk since 2014. It is the area you see in green on the map. It is much harder to pick out the orange in this traffic. And it shows the gains made by ISIS. This, as the U.S. says fleeing ISIS fighters were hammered by air strikes in Fallujah, the key city.
Barbara Starr has that story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
[02:35:03] BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): ISIS fighters, under cover of darkness, trying to outrun U.S. and Iraqi warplanes. South of Fallujah, hundreds of is operators and 200 vehicles, trying to escape the Iraqi government liberation of the city. Warplanes swooped in. The U.S. destroyed up to 50 vehicles. Iraqi forces, bombing dozens more. One military estimate, more than 300 ISIS dead.
The stakes are accelerating at the Pentagon, with eyes quickly turning towards the ISIS capitol city.
ASH CARTER, U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY: We want to get Raqqa, as soon as we can.
STARR: Ash Carter bluntly signaling the next move to ISIS leaders by U.S. aircraft and anti-ISIS fighters in northern Syria.
CARTER: We are going to position to, again, envelop and collapse the cont l of Raqqa. The reason I want to do that as soon as possible is Raqqa is the self-proclaimed capitol of the self-proclaimed caliphate of ISIL.
STARR: Getting to Raqqa is urgent. The attackers in the Istanbul airport assault traveled from Raqqa.
And the CIA director is warning more may be headed to Europe.
JOHN BRENNAN, CIA DIRECTOR: ISIL is training and attempting to deploy operators for further attacks. ISIL has a large cadre Western fighters who could serve as operatives for attacks in the West.
STARR: It comes as Washington is discussing with Moscow whether the two militaries can cooperate more in Syria, a more urgent concern with Raqqa, now in the crosshairs.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The U.S. starts to put in ground troop advisers to assist U.S.-backed rebels on the ground. That's something we have to do to communicate to the Russians, here's where our people are, so Russians aren't bombing our troop s on the ground.
STARR (on camera): Why might Ash Carter start talking about the next steps in the war against ISIS, putting them on notice about what might be coming? Well, look at what happened in Fallujah. If they want to make a run for it outside of Raqqa, it might make it easier for U.S. warplanes to target them.
Barbara Starr, CNN, the Pentagon. (END VIDEOTAPE)
GORANI: Let's go back to London and John Vause.
I'll be back at the top of the hour -- John?
JOHN VAUSE, CNN ANCHOR: Thank you, Hala.
We will try and read some tea leaves in a moment. Who has the running on winning the leadership of the Conservative Party and be Britain's next prime minister. We will talk to a pollster after the break.
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[02:41:11] AMARA WALKER, CNN ANCHOR: Turning, now, to the West Bank, where a funeral has been a teenager stabbed to death on Thursday. Hundreds came to mourn and pay their respects for the duel U.S.- Israeli citizen and only 13 years old. She was killed in an Israeli settlement outside of Hebron. A 17-year-old Palestinian stabbed her as she slept in her bedroom, seen here in this footage. Security guards shot the suspect when they found him still inside the home. The U.S. and Israel have condemned the killing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER (through translation): The entire people identify with the horrible pain of the family. We tell the murderers you will not break us. We will continue to act decisively and steadfastly against terror anywhere, anytime. The entire world should condemn this murder just as it condemns the murders in Istanbul and Brussels and Orlando or anywhere else.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WALKER: Hong Kong is marking the 19th anniversary of the British handover of the territory to China. Hong Kong's top leader called for greater cooperation with Beijing. The former British colony has been ruled under a one system, two systems formula. But activist say Beijing is violating that agreement by enforcing its laws in Hong Kong. Also, pro-democracy protesters scuffled with police on Friday. Demonstrators are blaming Beijing for the abduction of book sellers who were critical of Chinese leaders. More protests are planned for Friday.
A man whose story was told in popular podcast "Serial" is getting a new murder trial. He is serving a life sentence right now in Maryland. Adnan Syed was convicted in the 1999 death of his girlfriend. On Thursday, the judge granted a new trial for Syed because of some cell phone records. Millions of people around the world listened to the podcast "Serial," which investigated the case.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
WALKER: Joining me is an attorney and legal affairs commentator, Areva Martin. She is joining us here in studio.
We appreciate you taking the time.
I want to get your reaction to this. Were you surprised that the judge granted this motion where they were saying -- placing the blame on the defense attorneys?
AREVA MARTIN, ATTORNEY & LEGAL AFFAIRS COMMENTATOR: The motions are filed all the time when there is a conviction. Defendants tend to blame their lawyers but the motions are hard to win. First you have to prove there was something deficient about the defense that was presented by your attorney and then you have to prove that but for that deficient defense the outcome would have been different. That is a high burden of proof on the part of the defendant. I was surprised by the ruling in the case.
WALKER: This podcast broke records.
MARTIN: A hundred million times.
WALKER: So public opinion is not supposed to play a role but you think it did?
MARTIN: You know, judges are supposed to make rulings based on the facts and the law. But they are human too. This is a really difficult case. I think what the investigative reporter did was raise questions about the guilt of the man. She talked about the fact there was no eyewitness to the murder and no physical evidence and the case from the prosecution's standpoint centered on placing him at the burial scene based on his cell phone and there was questions about how the defense attorney treated that evidence and what the judge says is she did not cross-examine the expert on the cell phone evidence.
WALKER: That cell phone tower data the jury was not told that data was unreliable.
[02:45:02] MARTIN: There was a question if you get an incoming call versus an outgoing call how reliable is that in determining your whereabouts. There was an instruction that was given that should have been used by the defense attorney to question the credibility of that evidence and it may have impacted the outcome of the case.
WALKER: This was not part of the judge's ruling, but this alibi witness, Asia Champion, I mean, she was apparently, she was with this convicted murderer when the girlfriend was killed. Yet, she was never called to testify.
MARTIN: That was another big part of the defense's motion. They said, look, this witness came forward and she wrote two letters to the defendant while he was in jail and he gave the letters to his attorney and she was never on the witness stand and her alibi was never part of the defense for the defendant. And the judge said that fell below the standard of care but not prejudicial. What the judges have to do in a case like this is give deference to the strategy of the defense attorney. You don't want to second guess the decisions made. Maybe the lawyer looked at the letters and didn't believe she was credible. There could have been at lot of reasons she wasn't put on. That is some of the reasons that are used by defendants in seeking new trials based on ineffective assistance of counsel.
WALKER: Quickly, we're running out of time, but where do things go from here? Now he has a new defense team you think they may be effective this time around?
MARTIN: The prosecution's ball's in their court. Will they appeal or let him walk out of jail and start looking for who murdered this young girl. And the family is saying that justice was served by the conviction.
WALKER: A hard time for the family as well.
Areva Martin, good to have you.
MARTIN: Thank you.
WALKER: Thank you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WALKER: We're going to take a short break. From here, John Vause will be back with more from London and the Brexit fallout. Stay with us.
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(WEATHER REPORT)
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[02:51:01] VAUSE: Welcome back, everybody. I'm John Vause in London, outside of the prime minister's residence, one week after the U.K.'s vote to leave the E.U.
The country's leadership is in flux after David Cameron's resignation. Boris Johnson was considered to be the top pick, but now he's out. There are five Conservative contenders for the post, including Johnson's closest campaign ally.
Joe Twyman is the director of political polling for YouGov. He joins me live with more on this.
Joe, with Boris Johnson out, does that open the way for Theresa May?
JOE TWYMAN, DIRECTOR, POLITICAL POLLING, YOUGOV: Before Boris announced the fact that Boris announced he was no longer running for the leadership, we conducted a poll among Conservative Party members, the people who of course vote for this, and we found that Theresa May was by some distance the favored candidate. And it seems that despite the fact that she campaigned albeit lightly to remain as part of the European Union, it seems that her position as a unity candidate is what's appealing most to the Conservative Party. Having said that, it's early in the morning here in London, and the advantage of doing an interview now is her likelihood of being overtaken by events is reduced.
VAUSE: Yeah, it's 10 to eight. This could all change in the next 30 minutes or so the way things have been going lately.
TWYMAN: Absolutely.
VAUSE: You mentioned about Theresa May being the unity candidate. She's played this very smart. She kept her head down during the campaign. Even though she was sort of for the Remain, she wasn't advocating it. And even some of her critics now have said that she's looking like the adult in the room.
TWYMAN: Well, if you look at the history of Conservative Party leadership contests, you find that actually the favorite very rarely wins. And Boris was the overwhelming favorite with bookmakers and, indeed, with many pundits for some time. Instead, what you often find, be it John Major, Ian Duncan Smith, many others, is a unity candidate, someone who can bring the party together is the preferred option. Often the reason for that is the Conservative Party and its members does quite often what is ever necessary to win elections, to win public support. They tend not to be as ideological and as driven by positions on particular issues as, for instance, the Labour Party have been in recent times.
VAUSE: Well, Michael Gove, who was Boris Johnson's deputy, if you like, he was running the campaign for him. He's now come out and said he's standing for the leadership as well. Would he have been betting he would get all those Leave supporters who were planning to back Boris Johnson? Does that seem likely at this point?
TWYMAN: Two possible explanations. One is that Michael Gove thought he could win by presenting himself as the Leave candidate, knowing full well that a majority of Conservative members support leaving the European Union. The alternative is that he simply wished to stop Boris, working on the assumption that if the final two -- because the list of M.P.s has whittled down to just two that are put to the members. His thinking may have been that if Boris were put to the members, he would win, and he didn't want that. So it simply may have been an attempt to neutralize Johnson.
VAUSE: There's kind of conspiracy theories out there. One of the headlines in the papers this morning had a story that there was a deal between Theresa May and Boris Johnson, and the reason why he dropped out, expecting Theresa May to win, and she'll step down before the next election. Would this country go through something like this again after Tony Blair?
TWYMAN: I think it's impossible to predict what we might or might not go through. It has just been the most crazy time. There are lots of theories bandied around about the fact that maybe it's a deal between George Osborne and Michael Gove or Michael Gove and Theresa May. We just don't know. I'm sure there will be lots of speculation and, indeed, we may never know the true story of what went on behind the scenes both yesterday and moving forward.
[02:55:11] VAUSE: Moving forward, let's look at the Labour side very quickly. Angela Eagle, I think she's holding off on a challenge because the Labour parliamentary party are trying to work out who would have the best chance at defeating Jeremy Corbyn. Is there anybody who really stands out?
TWYMAN: Well, in terms of public opinion, so when you ask the general public, none of the candidates really stand out particularly strongly. Among Labour Party members, again, the people that select this leader, Angela Eagle is certainly popular, as is Dan Jarvis, but neither of them are overwhelmingly popular. There's not one candidate that stands out. Was going to announce her candidacy yesterday. That didn't happen. That may have been due to events at the Conservative Party. Who knows? But it's clear that Jeremy Corbyn still holds a lot of support among the membership and particularly among those people that voted for him last time. But that is reduced from where he was back prior to the European referendum and prior to the local elections and London mayoral elections of last month. So is position is weakened but it still remains positive.
VAUSE: Joe, interesting times, as they say. Thanks for being with us. Joe Twyman, from YouGov.
You're watching CNN. After the break, we'll have more on the political jockeying here in London. We'll also have the latest on the Istanbul terror investigation from Hala Gorani.
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