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Charlotte, North Carolina Family Releases Cell Phone Video. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired September 23, 2016 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:00:08] ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Top of the hour. Breaking news just into CNN. We now have video of Keith Lamont Scott's final moments, a fatal encounter with police in Charlotte, North Carolina. To be clear, this is not the dash cam video or the body camera video from the police officers. That has yet to be released by the police. This video that you - we are about to show you is video that has been shot by Keith Scott's wife on her personal cell phone. And while the video doesn't show us the shooting itself, you will see and hear the lead-up to that shooting and hear the shots fired. I want to warn you first, as we show you this video in its entirety, what you about to see is graphic and disturbing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Don't shoot him. Don't shoot him. He has no weapon. He has no weapon. Don't shoot him.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (EXPLETIVE DELETED).

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Don't sot him. Don't shoot him.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He didn't do anything.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Drop the gun! Drop the gun!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He doesn't have a gun. He has a TBI. He's not going to do anything to you guys. He just took his medicine.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Drop the gun!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Keith, don't let them break the windows. Come on out the car.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Drop the gun!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Keith, don't do it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Drop the gun!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Keith, get out the car. Keith, Keith, don't you do it. Don't you do it. Keith! Keith! Keith! Don't you do it!

Did you shoot him? Did you shoot him? Did you shoot him? He better not be (EXPLETIVE DELETED) dead. He better not be (EXPLETIVE DELETED) dead. I know that (EXPLETIVE DELETED) much. I know that much, he better not be dead. I'm not going to come near you. I'm going to record, though. I'm not coming near you. I'm going to record though. He better be alive because I come - you'd better -

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: There you have it, that's the full video that - that we have received. And that video, again, shot by the wife of Keith Lamont Scott. His wife's name, Rakeyia Scott.

You heard police say repeatedly in that video "drop the gun." You also hear Scott's wife telling her husband to get out of the car and repeating the words "don't you do it." "Don't you do it." It is not clear if she is speaking to police or if she is speaking to her husband. Police say, and they've said this repeatedly, that Scott had a gun as he exited that vehicle.

We are now also waiting for a news conference this hour with the governor of North Carolina, Governor Pat McCrory. As soon as we have that, we will bring that to you live.

But joining me now on the phone we have the attorney for the Scott family, Eduardo Curry, who was just on with my colleague, Wolf Blitzer. We're going to continue that conversation now.

Thank you so much for being with me, sir.

EDUARDO CURRY, SCOTT FAMILY ATTORNEY (via telephone): You're welcome, Poppy.

HARLOW: I think it's important to clarify for our viewers, as we pull up some of this video on the screen for them to see as we talk, what TBI is. You hear Rakeyia Scott say he has a TBI. That is a traumatic brain injury.

CURRY: That is correct.

HARLOW: Can you tell - can you tell our viewers anything about that, why she was saying that to authorities?

CURRY: Well, my understanding that he had had an incident, an accident last year that was pretty traumatic and as a result made him part - at least disabled in some particular instances. So he's been taking medication for it and certainly you heard her in the video saying, he's been taking his medication. He is not going to hurt you. He's had a TBI, a traumatic brain injury.

HARLOW: Take us inside the decision that the family made, along with your guidance, I would assume, to release this video. Why did they release it and why did they release it now?

CURRY: Well, I think that the team of lawyers got together with the - the family and, as you notice, Mrs. Scott has not made, other than a written statement, any sort of public appearance. And she wanted the world to be able to see the video and see what it faced based on the facts. The video is not enhanced. It's not doctored. It's not cut. In fact, it's really kind of difficult to see some of the things, but that's what she took with her own cell phone. That's what she took when she was present there and she wants the world to actually see, this is what we have, this is what I know and we're being as transparent as we can because we want accountability to be had.

HARLOW: Has the Charlotte Police Department, have they viewed this video? Have you given it to them as well?

CURRY: We've sent it to them. I don't know if they've viewed it or not.

HARLOW: OK.

CURRY: They have dash cams and they have body cams and they have their film and so they haven't released that, but we're hopeful.

[14:05:06] HARLOW: The decision to release this video now, today, it comes, obviously, after the police department, up to this point, has not released their dash cam video, not released their body cam video, debating whether or not they're going to do that or not. Is this in an effort in part to push their hand on that? To say, look, we want the public to see everything you have?

CURRY: Well, we want the public to see everything that we have and we've - we don't object to the police department disseminating everything that they have. And so we want the facts to be clear and objective as we seek the truth.

HARLOW: The wife, you hear Rakeyia Scott in this video saying multiple times "don't do it, don't do it." Do you know or has she told you who she is speaking to? Is she speaking to the officers or is she speaking to her husband?

CURRY: Well, if you notice, if you listen to the conversation, she's saying, "Keith, don't let them break the windows. Don't do it." But there's so much going on that it's really hard to tell how she's speaking or who she is speaking with. But, you know, it's clear that she's telling them, he doesn't have a gun and he's not going to hurt you. And those things along the line. And so what we're waiting is for the truth to be ascertained. We're waiting - we're asking the world to look at what has been offered. A still photo has roamed around where allegedly they say there is a weapon or some object of which we still not definitively know what it is.

Look at the time frame by frame. See whether or not that appears where it's supposed to be. Why isn't it there in the beginning? Is it not there in the end? We leave that up for the public opinion when you look with your own eyes and can make your own judgment based on what you see, based on an undoctored, uncut, unenhanced video taken by an amateur, which just happens to be the deceased's wife.

HARLOW: Part of what you said to CNN moments ago is, quote, "we want the public to take a look at this tape and to see what was in the video before he was shot and what was there afterwards and ask how it got there." The question would be, are you referring to a gun? Is that the point you are making?

CURRY: The point I'm making is, I'm referring to the facts. And whatever the fact are between the videos, the witnesses and the evidence, once we can get all the facts out, someone can make a determination. And so that's what I'm asking you. I'm asking you to look at the facts. It is not clear - if it's not clear to you, it won't be clear. If it is clear to you, you'll look at the facts with your own two eyes based on the video, based on the evidence, based on the testimony, and then you'll make an opinion about what you see. And so we are releasing what we have because we want the public to see and know what we know.

HARLOW: You hear the police in that video saying multiple times "drop the gun, drop the gun." The dash cam video that the family has viewed, were you there with them when they viewed it? And, if so, what was your reaction to it?

CURRY: I was there. I saw the video. And there was nothing definitive that would show me that there was a weapon in the hands of Mr. Scott. In fact, it shows a confused man who's befuddled, surely scared, who's stepping back away from who he perceives to be a threat and then he was shot and killed with his hands down in a non-aggressive manner.

HARLOW: What is next, Mr. Curry? What is next for the family? What steps are they going to take? I guess there's two scenarios here. One scenario is that the public gets to see all the video that the officers have, and the other scenario is that they don't. What paths will you and the family take given both of those?

CURRY: To get - to be frank with you, Poppy, what' next is that this family needs a point to grieve. At some point they are going to be able to receive the remains of the deceased and they're going to need to have some privacy in order to try to bring some semblance of peace to their family. A young mother, 39, seven children that have lost a father. She's lost her soul mate. Extended family members that are tremendously hurt. A mother who's now left without a son. And so the next period of time is not going to be anything but a chance, an introspect and healing and morning and then from that I'm sure the family will make some decisions about where we go.

HARLOW: OK. And just to wrap it up here, yesterday they were going to hold a press conference during this show and one of their attorneys came out and said, look, the family is grieving. They are not ready to do so at that point. So are you saying we will not hear from Rakeyia Scott or the family - the larger family in a press conference anytime soon? CURRY: I'm not saying that. But what I am saying is that this is

extremely traumatic. Today is only the 23rd. This happened a mere three days ago.

[14:10:08] HARLOW: Yes.

CURRY: For most of us, we wouldn't have our sanity at all. And so what I'm asking the public and I'm asking you news people to do is give this family a chance to mourn and grieve and at some point obviously we will revisit it again.

HARLOW: Eduardo Curry, the attorney for the Scott family, thank you very much for joining me.

CURRY: You're ever so welcome. Bye-bye.

HARLOW: All right, we're going to take a quick break. Obviously there is a lot to get to. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

HARLOW: All right, back to our breaking news. The wife of Keith Lamont Scott, who was killed by a police officer on Tuesday in Charlotte, North Carolina, just released video to the media. It is her own cell phone video that she took of the moments before her husband was shot and killed by police. You do hear shots fired in this video. Now we're going to play for you again the full video that we've just received in the last hour.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Don't shoot him. Don't shoot him. He has no weapon. He has no weapon. Don't shoot him.

[14:15:06] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (EXPLETIVE DELETED).

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Don't sot him. Don't shoot him.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He didn't do anything.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Drop the gun! Drop the gun!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He doesn't have a gun. He has a TBI. He's not going to do anything to you guys. He just took his medicine.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Drop the gun!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE). UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Keith, don't let them break the windows. Come on out the car.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Drop the gun!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Keith, don't do it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Drop the gun!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Keith, get out the car. Keith, Keith, don't you do it. Don't you do it. Keith! Keith! Keith! Don't you do it!

Did you shoot him? Did you shoot him? Did you shoot him? He better not be (EXPLETIVE DELETED) dead. He better not be (EXPLETIVE DELETED) dead. I know that (EXPLETIVE DELETED) much. I know that much, he better not be dead. I'm not going to come near you. I'm going to record, though. I'm not coming near you. I'm going to record though. He better be alive because I come - you'd better -

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: The attorney for the Scott family just telling us the video not enhanced or edited or doctored, that according to Eduardo Curry.

A lot to discuss. Let's bring in our panel. David Klinger is a former LAPD police officer and author of "Into the Kill Zone," professor of criminology and criminal justice also at the University of Missouri. Also with me, Mark Geragos, defense attorney and CNN legal analyst. Here with me in New York, Paul Butler, a law professor at Georgetown Law School and a former prosecutor, and Laura Coates, CNN legal analyst and a former AUSA for the Justice Department's Civil Rights Division.

Thank you all for being here.

There are so many questions about this video. We just went through some of them. Let me begin with you, David, as a former police officer. You hear the officers saying multiple times "drop the gun, drop the gun." At the same time you have Rakeyia Scott, Keith Scott's wife, saying he doesn't have a gun, he doesn't have a gun, he has a TBI, a traumatic brain injury. Take us into the mind as an officer of a moment like this and also what you take away from the video.

DAVID KLINGER, FORMER OFFICER, LOS ANGELS POLICE: Sure. First of all, I mean it's a difficult video to watch because you know that a woman is watching an instant play out that her husband ends up dead from. And so I think we have to keep that in mind.

As a police officer, it's kind of difficult to know because I can't pin down where all the officers are and who's giving the commands. I think I've got more than one officer who's saying "drop the gun." I don't know if they have an arrest plan for this case. I don't know why officers are in the positions they are. So there's a lot of information I want to get.

But one thing that is really important that I learned from this, is this is not an extended standoff, but certainly a standoff. It lasts at least a minute from the time that the - the video starts until the gunfire happens, if I've got my wristwatch timing correct. And so there was an opportunity to try to get the suspect to drop the gun.

Now, are - do they know for sure he's got a gun? Do they think he's got a gun? Do they see a gun in his hand? All of those are very important questions. And the video is not dispositive. The video doesn't tell us answer to those questions. I think one thing for viewers to keep in mind is that oftentimes that's going to be the case. Even body cam and dash cam video will not give us all the relevant information. And so I think that this is a beginning point to understand that this was a - at least somewhat protractive encounter as opposed to officers walked up, there's a gun, they shoot, or there's something in the hand, they shoot. There was some time for at least one-way dialogue, if that makes any sense.

HARLOW: I understand.

And, Laura, I want you to weigh in on what you think this video helps the public glean because, you know, there's a lot that you can't see. We hear what the wife is saying and we hear what some - some of what the officers are saying. Who knows if we hear all that they're saying.

Because we don't have the dash cam video or the body cam video from the police department, does this further confuse the situation? That's how Tom Fuentes was putting it last hour.

LAURA COATES, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, what it does is suggest that the police chief's assessment that it was inconclusive is far more accurate than we thought it was. We have a lot of unanswered questions. We have the wife asking or saying, "don't you do it." What does that mean? What was she referring to? What did she see or not see?

You also have her saying a TBI and saying those words (ph). Did that mean to the officer that he - they knew that it was a traumatic brain injury, or was the acronym just alluding to them? And so I - you have questions about that. And what you - what you gather from this information as a prosecutor you say, look, I have to see eyewitness testimony that tells me, what does this all mean? Interview people to see, what - what - where are the gaps here and how can I go forward with the case, if any? It's just - it's very - very (INAUDIBLE) when you see the video, but it is illuminating to know that there are the gaps that the police chief says there were.

HARLOW: Mark Geragos, what is the biggest question to you in your mind after you've seen this video and known the facts of the case up until now because the police did say, you know, in their press conference this week that they said that he indeed did have a gun. What they also said is they spoke about fingerprints, his fingerprints being on the gun.

[14:20:17] MARK GERAGOS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, the biggest question to me, and what I don't understand in any of these cases - and this is not the only one - is, why haven't they released the dash cam or body cam? HARLOW: Right.

GERAGOS: By the way, that's paid for by the public with public tax dollars. That's not a personnel record of the police. It's not something that you would necessarily say, oh, there's a privilege about. It's there and it's designed and it's paid for by the public so that there is supposed to be transparency.

Now, the logical answer to that is, they don't want to release it because they know it's not going to show what the story is that they're telling. And that, I think, is a little patronizing on behalf of the police. I suppose they - maybe internally, my guess is, is that the police and whatever community leaders are there are saying, don't release it because that's going to antagonize the community because when they see that the police didn't see a gun or that you can see on the camera that there wasn't a gun, or that there didn't need to be this escalation to deadly force, that there was not a provocation that called for deadly force, that people are going to go crazy and maybe rightfully so. And that, I think, like I say, is patronizing. I think the public is entitled to it. They paid for it.

HARLOW: Paul, also just purely legal, leave opinion out, the law that was passed in the state that would allow legally the police department to withhold this video actually doesn't take effect for another week. It doesn't take effect until October 1st. So do they have any legal ground to stand on to not be releasing the dash cam and the body cam video?

PAUL BUTLER, LAW PROFESSOR, GEORGETOWN LAW SCHOOL: Not at all. They don't have any legal justification for it. They also don't have any justification in terms of their responsibilities to the citizens who they're supposed to serve and protect. That video needs to be released. If the police chief isn't willing to do it, he serves at the pleasure of the mayor. She needs to insist on the police being accountable.

HARLOW: So she can force - I ask because she said to my colleague Carol Costello this morning that she does want that - does think it would be good for the public to see the video. Does she have the power to force his hand on that?

BUTLER: At the end of the day, he works for her. And, you know, when I see that video, I have two questions. One is, where is the gun? When you see a photograph taken later, a gun suddenly appears in the frame. When we see that video of the encounter, including where Mr. Scott lay dying, there was no gun.

You know, as often the case, this video does not show what happened at the actual moment. It is ambiguous. Here's one thing that it does show, Poppy. It shows police negligence and the way that they responded to the scene. Every cop learns in the academy as a rookie, if you get a call for someone who has a gun, you don't roll up on that person, voluntarily expose yourself to fire, and then use that as an excuse to shoot. You're supposed to cover and communicate. Mr. Scott didn't have to die. At minimum it was the result of poor police training. COATES: Well -

HARLOW: And just to be clear, it - we, you know, do not know that that scenario that you just explained is the case here, that anyone called or said he had a gun. That is not this situation, right?

COATES: Right.

HARLOW: But let me ask, David, to you, because you're the only police officer in this conversation. One question that comes to my mind, and there's so much that we cannot see, is, when you're an officer, even if he - even if Mr. Scott did have a gun, are you trained to shoot to kill or are you trained to shoot to disable? And what I mean is by shooting him in the leg or something like that? I think that's a question that comes up so often in scenarios like this.

KLINGER: Right. Well, first of - right, first of all, you are not allowed to shoot somebody merely because they possess a gun. You're only allowed to shoot somebody if you have a reasonable belief that they are going to use that gun to harm you or someone else -

HARLOW: Again -

KLINGER: To cut it very simple.

But what police officers are trained to do is they are trained to shoot to stop whatever the threat is that they perceive that leads them to initiate gunfire. So it's not to kill, it's to stop.

Now, I just want to circle back on a couple of points. The gentleman immediately before me said he's already drawn a conclusion that this was negligent police behavior. Maybe, maybe not. And that was one of the points I was trying to make in terms of, I don't quite understand where the officers were in terms of their position, but that's a whole separate issue from the question of the use of deadly force.

HARLOW: So even if let's say you -

KLINGER: The second issue, I think the bigger -

HARLOW: Yes, go ahead, finish.

KLINGER: Go ahead.

HARLOW: No, no, no.

KLINGER: No, I was going to say the second issue is when - when to release the video. I think people need to remember, and I think the lawyers on the panel understand this, that that investigation and the integrity of that investigation is critical and you should not release video unless and until you've got all of the interviews done from every witness who was there.

HARLOW: Why?

[14:25:05] KLINGER: Because what's going to happen is, you could have tainted testimony. It is not what the individual perceived at the moment. It is something that's being informed by that video, just as you would not let witnesses talk to one another to get quote/unquote a story straight or figure out something in terms of a tail to tell. And if you want to be successful with the prosecution, in the end, if, in fact, it turns out that you want to move forward as a prosecutor, you want to make sure that you don't have a situation where the defense lawyer can step in, and Mark Geragos know this quite well, I'm sure, because I've seen him at work, and poke holes in the case.

HARLOW: All right, guys, I have breaking news. I have to leave it there. You will be - you will be - you will be back with me.

GERAGOS: But wouldn't you - wouldn't you - can I have a response to that?

HARLOW: Thirty seconds. Go ahead.

KLINGER: All I'm saying is wait - wait for a few days and then release it. Wait until all the interviews are done and then release it.

GERAGOS: But all I'm going say is, it's great - well, except, you know what the problem is, they're showing that same body cam to the officers before the officers give a statement. So that's a great - that's a great (INAUDIBLE) -

KLINGER: That's right. And I agree that should not be done.

HARLOW: All right, I have to live it - I have to leave it there.

GERAGOS: A thousand percent with you if they are not doing that.

HARLOW: You will be back with me. You will be back with me. We have a lot of news that we have to get to. Thank you all very much. Stay with us because we are expecting a news conference at any moment from the governor of North Carolina. He will talk obviously about this shooting and we'll get his reaction to whether or not he has seen this family video from the Scott family yet and what he has to say about it.

We are also monitoring another big breaking news story in the world of politics. Late word on who Ted Cruz is now expected to come out and endorse for president. We'll be right back.

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