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GOP Insider and Insurgent to Have Trump's Ears; Trump Taps Firebrand Media Figure for Key Role; Trump Taps RNC Chair as Chief of Staff; Laura Ingraham Considered for Press Secretary; Trump Keeping Parts of Obamacare; Trump Vows to Appoint Pro-life Justices. Aired 12- 12:30p ET

Aired November 14, 2016 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:00:32] BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN ANCHOR: Hi there and welcome to CNN NEWSROOM. Thank you so much for joining me. I'm Brianna Keilar.

And we have 67 days before the transfer of power in Washington. We now have some idea of who will be wielding that power alongside the president-election, and what they might plan to do with it.

On your left, Donald Trump's campaign chair and soon to be senior counselor, Steve Bannon. On your right, the long serving chairman of the Republican National Committee and Donald Trump's pick for White House chief of staff, Reince Priebus. The latter representing the party establishment. The former representing not just the outsiders, but the fringe, really. These hires leaving Donald Trump with just under 4,000 executive branch positions to fill, but over the weekend he took time out to talk to "60 Minutes" about a range of issues, including, yes, the wall.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LESLEY STAHL, "60 MINUTES": Are you really going to build a wall?

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT-ELECT: Yes.

STAHL: They're talking about a fence in the Republican Congress.

TRUMP: Sure.

STAHL: Would you accept a fence?

TRUMP: For certain areas I would, but for certain areas a wall is more appropriate. I'm very good at this. It's called construction. But a fence would be --

STAHL: So, part wall, part fence.

TRUMP: Yes, it could be -- yes, there could be some fencing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: My CNN colleague, Phil Mattingly, joining me now from Washington.

And tell us first, Phil, what the president-elect is doing today.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's all about transition. Brianna, you know and said in jest, he's only got about 4,000 more positions to fill. That's a very real issue and, frankly, a very real problem for any transition team coming off an election they expected to win. Now try being one that they weren't sure about winning.

It is a full-on blitz right now. We've been talking about the two premiere positions named last night, chief of staff and chief strategist, but now it's time to go up and down the list, both inside the White House in terms of internal positions, deputy chiefs of staffs, senior advisers all across the board. And then you start move into the cabinets. Each different cabinet with a transition team assigned to it. What they're going through right now.

And, Brianna, you can look at the people that are walking inside and out of Trump Tower. People like Steve Mnuchin, the finance chairman of the Trump campaign, who is rumored and sources say is definitely under consideration for perhaps the Treasury secretary. You also have people like Kellyanne Conway, obviously his campaign manager, who's in the running for a number of different positions. That's the focus right now, filling those positions. Once you get that done, you can move on to bigger issues. But until you get that done, you're really restricted in what you can actually do, Brianna.

KEILAR: What's the react to these big appointments? You have Steve Bannon and many folks say, look, this is going to be Donald Trump's Karl Rove, his David Axelrod. And then you have Reince Priebus. And I remember when President-elect Obama chose Rahm Emanuel to be his chief of staff. It signified what you wanted to get done with Congress. So what's the reaction here?

MATTINGLY: Well, take Reince Priebus first and I think you're not going to find a lot of people who are opposed to or upset about this pick in both parties, and that's because there's a recognition that Reince Priebus, while he's never held elected office, understands how Washington works, understands the importance of negotiating with Congress and talking to lawmakers and talking to leaders and understands kind of the reality of how to get things done in this town. That's important. Even though Donald Trump ran an outsider campaign, having that individual at his right hand is extremely important.

Now talk about Steve Bannon. Less so in terms of the enthusiasm both on the left and, frankly, if you talk to Republicans and they're being honest with you, Republicans as well. Establishment Republicans have long been a target for Steve Bannon. Paul Ryan first among them. His influence inside the White House is drawing a lot of concern, ringing a lot of alarm bells, but it's also something that is being defended by Trump advisers. Take a listen to what Kellyanne Conway had to say today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) KELLYANNE CONWAY, TRUMP TRANSITION TEAM SENIOR ADVISER: I've worked closely with both of them. I think it's a great team. And I'll continue to work closely with them in some capacity to be decided. They complement each other as they both have the most important thing, which is the ear of the boss.

QUESTION: There's been some criticism of Steve Bannon because of Breitbart and some of its articles and headlines. What's your response to that?

CONWAY: My response to that is that I worked very closely with Steve Bannon. He's been the general of this campaign. And, frankly, people should look at the full resume. He's got a Harvard business degree, he's a Naval officer, he has success in entertainment. I don't know if you're aware of that. And he certainly was a Goldman Sachs managing partner. A brilliant tactician.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Brianna, that's the defense you're hearing from all of the Trump advisors. The reality is this. It was an extremely tight-knit group that led Donald Trump to a campaign victory. A very unexpected campaign victory. There was every expectation those individuals would be joining him in the White House. That includes Steve Bannon, no matter how controversial he's been.

KEILAR: All right, Phil Mattingly, thank you so much.

We have a lot more to talk about on this. Those who have followed this election closely are pretty familiar with Steve Bannon, but he's not exactly a household name. Many probably heard it for the first time back in August when Donald Trump hired him to help turn around his campaign. And this was a pick that really raised eyebrows because of Bannon's ties to Breitbart, a far right news organization.

[12:05:14] Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid was quick to sound the alarm. His spokesman says, quote, "President-elect Trump's choice of Steve Bannon as his top aide signals that white supremacists will be represented at the highest levels in Trump's White House."

We have CNN's senior media correspondent Brian Stelter with us now.

And this is the concern because, Brian, you have people who say Breitbart is this forum -- it is -- well, Breitbart has become a forum for the quote/unquote alt-right, which is a term for sort of I guess newvo (ph) or maybe old school, but still just repackaged white supremacists, white nationalists, and there are many people concerned with what Harry Reid is saying, that now there is that voice in the White House.

BRIAN STELTER, CNN SENIOR MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: This is not a normal presidential appointment. And sometimes on cable news and newspapers, all of these sorts of things seem alike. They all seem similar. This is not. This is not a normal presidential appointment.

Steve Bannon is not someone who would have been comfortable or fitting in, in a Bush white House or an Obama White House. He wouldn't have fit into a Republican or a Democratic administration. But it just goes to show how unusual this Trump administration is.

He's got Reince Priebus on the one hand, but he's got Bannon on the other hand. And Kellyanne Conway today said people should look at Bannon's full resume. That's true. People should keep an open mind. But there's no doubt about it, you know, Bannon talked about Breitbart, his website, as being a platform for the alt-right. And some of what the alt-right stands for is despicable. So I think it's important as we go along, as we talk about Bannon, to recognize, this is not normal.

KEILAR: And there -- I mean there are a lot of people who are not going to know who he is. And a big reason for that is because he stayed out of the spotlight so much.

STELTER: Yes, on purpose, yes.

KEILAR: But there was a moment where we saw him, not talking, but we just saw him at a key moment in the campaign. This is right before the second debate.

STELTER: Oh, right.

KEILAR: When Donald Trump had a press conference. There you see him right there. He had a press conference with Bill Clinton's accusers. This was seen as a big political stunt. It was also very unsettling, and I think -- I remember even the Clinton folks were surprised that this happened. And you saw him there to witness this. And he's normally -- I mean almost reclusive for someone who was an aide at the level that he was at in the campaign.

STELTER: Yes.

KEILAR: How does he message, especially when you look at this event, that clearly he had a big part of, how does he message in the White House now?

STELTER: Yes, a political dirty trickster. And that Clinton accusers event was an example of that. The fact that we have, you know, video of him from there goes to show, he does not do interviews. He normally is not accessible. The one time I was able to speak with him during the campaign was because we were on the same plane landing at one of the debates and we talked about, you know, how the campaign was going, talked about the rallies, that I had to go to the rallies to understand what Americans were thinking. Well, that was one subset of America. And I think what we're going to see from Bannon is he's going to be representing that audience. The audience that went to Trump's rallies. He'll be in Trump's ear trying to ensure that Trump's base is happy with the decisions that are made in a Trump administration.

KEILAR: He was right, though, the rallies did tell us even more than we knew, than many people knew, than even perhaps Donald Trump's aides knew.

STELTER: Right. KEILAR: All right, Brian Stelter, thank you so much for that.

STELTER: Thanks.

KEILAR: And we have, of course, a lot to discuss with our political panel as well. We have Jackie Kucinich. She is Washington bureau chief for "The Daily Beast." And we have Alex Burns, national political reporter for "The New York Times." Both of them are CNN analysts for us.

And, Jackie, you have Reince Priebus and he's defending Bannon. Bannon is someone who's very different, of course, than Reince Priebus, but here's what Priebus said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REINCE PRIEBUS, INCOMING WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF: The White House chief of staff is always generally responsible for the day to day operation of the White House. It's a -- it's an operations role but it's also an advisory role to the president. You know, the way that we've operated the last few months is Steve and I have formed a great partnership in advising President-elect Trump together, and that's what it really is. I think you've seen, especially over the last few months, that Donald Trump's been very disciplined and he's also been very comfortable and on message and clear-minded.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: So what -- you look at these hires. Do they bridge the party divide? Do they aggravate it? Do they do both?

JACKIE KUCINICH, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: I think the greatest way you could see that reflected is to the extent that the establishment Republicans, the elected Republicans, are ignoring the fact that Bannon is a part of this administration. Last night when we all started getting press releases saying -- reacting to this selection of Reince Priebus and Steve Bannon, Steve Bannon's name was suspiciously left off a lot of the congratulations. The emphasis was on Reince Priebus. And I think a lot of Republicans would like to see, you know, Bannon maybe sink further into the background, perhaps out of the White House, but they're not going to have that chance.

But at the same time, I mean, you've seen Republican leaders today struggling to answer why Steve Bannon, someone who does have such a checkered history, is a part of this White House and they're going to have to continue doing that until they have a good answer, frankly.

[12:10:10] KEILAR: But, Alex, he's part of the White House because he was such an essential part of the campaign. I mean you look at transition that this campaign made after Donald Trump jettison (ph) Paul Manafort. Steve Bannon was a big part of that. He's a big part of Donald Trump's success.

ALEX BURNS, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, that's absolutely right. And in some respect he's the kind of figure where the exact title probably matters less than it does for somebody like Reince Priebus, who does need a certain kind of institutional legitimacy and sort of explicit authority to operate the machine of government in order to perform his role. If someone like Steve Bannon, and there are a number of people in the Trump universe who sort of fall into this category. If someone like Steve Bannon, frankly, were exiled from the White House, I think a lot of people still feel like he would have Donald Trump's ear, he'd be influential.

And to Jackie's point, you know, the reaction from establishment Republicans, folks on The Hill who are really concerned about passing a traditional conservative agenda, they look at these two appointments as sort of the equivalent of having an arsonist and a firefighter in the White House together and calling that balance. They're very concerned about what this kind of cocktail of personalities is going to look like.

KEILAR: That is some kind of metaphor.

Jackie, I know that you listened to Donald Trump on "60 Minutes." I thought it was a fascinating interview because he signaled a lot about where -- and kept some things kind of secret as well. But he signaled a lot about where he wants to go. And when he talked about Obamacare, he talked about the wall, it seemed like he was adding details that sort of back him off of these signature issues.

KUCINICH: Well, I think at this point you have to -- you really do have to start talking about policy. You can't take away certain parts of Obamacare that fund other parts of Obamacare that you agree with. And so, I mean, his people are going to have to start digging into this, along with, you know, House Republicans and Senate Republicans.

In terms of the wall, there are realities there. You do have to fund this thing. And can't just move money around that's already been appropriated because it's not going to be enough. So the fact that he's sort of dialing back expectations, I mean, listen, this is someone who fashions himself a master negotiator. So it seems like, and he said this at some point along the campaign trail, this -- what he was saying was a start and there might be some room to maneuver, you know, within what he's already said.

KEILAR: It's all about, Alex, what his supporters give him room to do. Are they going to give him room to do this or are they going to see this as walking back promises?

BURNS: Oh, I think Trump probably has far more maneuvering space within his base than a president whose normally elected, particularly one who's normally elected with -- by a really, really small margin, actually losing the popular vote. Under normal circumstances, either party, an incoming president would really feel like I'm on really, really thin ice, can't afford to lose even a sliver of support from my base. What we've seen, Brianna, from the last year and a half, really, is that Trump can do an awful lot without losing much support from within his base of voter support.

KEILAR: All right, Alex and Jackie, stick around with me because we're going to have more ahead with you. We'll be talking about Obamacare. Repeal and replace or amend it. What parts of the Affordable Care Act does Donald Trump want to keep? Jackie was talking about that. What's probably going away? And who is directly affected by the overhaul?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [12:17:18] KEILAR: The Trump administration is taking shape in Washington actually before our very eyes and ears. I want to bring back our panel now, Jackie Kucinich and Alex Burns.

And this is something I want to talk to you guys about that we have in now. Radio host Laura Ingraham under serious consideration for White House press secretary. This was something that had been discussed here in recent days. And there had also been, we were hearing from sources, a need for a woman to be prominently placed in the administration. This is one of the more visible positions.

So, Jackie, when you look at this, what do you think about a pick like that, and, you know, what are you hearing about how much in the running she is?

KUCINICH: You know, you're hearing a lot of names at this point, but she certainly has been a vocal supporter of Trump. And not only that, but kind of the conservative underdog. Remember -- I remember she was really behind David Bratt (ph) when he was facing off against Eric Cantor. She has, really, you know, taken some risks in backing these folks. So it would be -- it would be a really interesting choice by the Trump administration. Certainly someone who wouldn't be afraid to take it to those of us in the media as the White House press secretary.

KEILAR: Certainly would not be.

And, Alex, you look at the people who are being discussed for a number of these positions. It's very guy-heavy when you look -- especially when we don't know whether Kellyanne Conway is going to be a part of the administration or if she's going to stay as an outside adviser.

BURNS: That's right. And, you know, we haven't heard from this transition or from the president-elect the kind of rhetoric that we typically heard from incoming presidents for the last 20 years, that you want to put together an administration that looks like America, or you want to put together an administration where women and minorities are really well represented. I think you can imagine a number of the other Republicans who ran for president making that a priority. Clearly, that would have been an important, symbolic gesture for Hillary Clinton if she had won.

You do have sort of this unusual phenomenon unfolding now where you have a president who is elected by an overwhelmingly white coalition who will probably want to be building bridges outside of that coalition if he wants to, you know, get out of the pit that his poll numbers, his favorability numbers are in. We haven't really seen any sign that he plans to do that through appointments just yet.

KEILAR: Let's talk about some of his policy proposals. Obamacare, for instance. How much does he really plan to change? He was asked that by "60 Minutes." Here what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) LESLEY STAHL, "60 MINUTES": When you replace it, are you going to make sure that people with preconditions are still covered?

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT-ELECT: Yes, because it happens to be one of the strongest assets.

STAHL: You're going to keep that?

TRUMP: Also with the children living with their parents for an extended period, we're going to --

STAHL: You're going to keep that?

TRUMP: Very much try and keep that. Adds cost, but it's very much something we're going to try and keep.

[12:20:06] STAHL: And there's going to be a period, if you repeal it, and before you replace it, when millions of people could lose --

TRUMP: Look --

STAHL: No?

TRUMP: We're going to do it simultaneously. It will be just fine.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: And, Jackie, you've also heard surrogates say another possible change would be opening up across state lines the ability to purchase insurance. You talk to Democrats and they say, hey, that sounds fine to us. So what's really going on here because this doesn't sound like -- this doesn't sound like a repeal. It sounds like tinkering around the edges, keeping things that are certainly very popular and there's nothing he's saying that is very alarming at this point to Democrats?

KUCINICH: But the thing is, is that it's very hard to unring the bell that is Obamacare. He talked about wanting to keep people who -- the preexisting conditions, the children who -- on their parents' health insurance until 26. Some of these things are paid for by the fact there's an individual mandate. So it really is. And then, you know, how the insurance system is structured right now has been changed because of Obamacare. So they're -- this is a very, very complicated sort of thing to unwind. And we haven't really seen a grasp of that anywhere within the Trump administration.

Now, if they sort of throw a lifeline out to House Republicans and they help them figure out the policy ins and outs of this, that's something that, you know, remains to be seen. But, you know, simply cutting off one thing without a way to pay for it, that's not how this works. It's too ingrained already in the health care system.

KEILAR: But what does that mean, Alex, for supporters of Donald Trump, for a number of -- I mean I just think of Tea Party Republicans who came into power in Congress on the promise that they were going to combat Obamacare. This has been their goal to repeal this. So if they cannot deliver that, is that acceptable to them and also to Republicans across the country?

BURNS: You know, I don't -- I don't think we know the answer to that. And, Brianna, you know, if you thought it was sloppy and messy and unsightly to get this law passed in the first place, as Jackie was saying, try unwinding it. This is going to be one of these places where you might see real friction between Donald Trump and his distinctive base of support and traditional ideological conservatives. That a lot of those people in the Midwest, who crossed party lines or who are just economically displaced, blue collar, white voters, these are not necessarily people who are eager to see government benefits go away.

So you potentially do have really different, short-term political priorities between someone like Trump, who does want to keep that coalition together, and frankly has never really shown any particular enthusiasm for cutting government spending, and people like Paul Ryan and Ted Cruz, who, as you said, this has been their animating cause for most of the decade now.

KEILAR: Jackie, let's talk about abortion, because Donald Trump is such a different president-elect, or soon to be president. He has been for abortion rights in the past. He now says that he is pro-life, or anti-abortion. He's saying that he's going to pick, what he says, quote, "pro-life Supreme Court nominees." But at the same time in this interview, I thought it was really interesting that he said there's also a long, long way to go when you're talking about overturning Roe versus Wade. You could almost read that as, he doesn't have a tremendous appetite for that to happen. But I also think, isn't that he's giving himself just so much wiggle room here?

KUCINICH: I think he's trying to make everyone happy at this point, particularly with his a supporters. He also saying that the gay marriage ruling was settled law but Roe v. Wade somehow isn't. It really is -- it's him trying to navigate this new terrain that frankly he didn't really think he was going to have to navigate at the end of the day. So we'll -- I mean I have no doubt that he's going to appoint conservative justices. There is nothing that we've seen that -- that would indicate otherwise. But, you know, how that ends up shaking out at the day of the day, it's still an open question with someone -- this is the thing, he hasn't been a politician before. So we really don't have anything to look back on to see, you know, how he might act going forward.

KEILAR: We'll know soon because this is about to get real very fast, you guys.

Jackie Kucinich, Alex Burns, thanks to you both.

And up next, gay marriage. The law of the land for nearly a year and a half now. Legalized abortion on the books for more than four decades. Could that change once Donald Trump's nominee or nominees take the seat on the Supreme Court?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:28:59] KEILAR: In his first televised sit-down interview since becoming president-elect, Donald Trump made it known where he stands on same-sex marriage. Listen to what he told CBS on "60 Minutes."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LESLEY STAHL, "60 MINUTES": Do you support marriage equality?

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT-ELECT: I -- I -- it's irrelevant because it was already settled. It's law. It was settled in the Supreme Court. I mean it's done.

STAHL: So even if you appoint a judge that --

TRUMP: It's done. You have -- these cases have gone to the Supreme Court. They've been settled. And I think -- and I'm -- I'm fine with that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: So he's fine with that law, but Roe v. Wade, that is another story.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STAHL: Will you appoint -- are you looking to appoint a justice who wants to overturn Roe v. Wade?

TRUMP: So, here's what's going to happen. I'm going to -- I'm pro- life. The judges will be pro-life. If it ever were overturned, it would go back to the states. So it would go back to the states and the states --

STAHL: But then some women won't be able to get an abortion.

TRUMP: No, it will go back to the states.

STAHL: By state. No some --

TRUMP: Yes. Well, you know, perhaps they have to go to another --

STAHL: But do you want --

TRUMP: They'll have to go to another state.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[12:30:00] KEILAR: CNN's senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin joining me now.

That was pretty fascinating, where instead of saying it should -- he's saying, well, they could go to another state. He's not -- although, of course, Democrats would say that's unacceptable, this should be a right, but he's not talking like a Republican