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Fighting ISIS; Russia Investigation; Desperation in Syria. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired December 14, 2016 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:01]

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Pro-government forces said to be dropping another round of bombs and renewing a four-year-long battle for Aleppo. The future for some 50,000 people trapped inside the city remains unclear.

Here's what we do know, is that after the bombs fall, all that's left are the muffled cries for help below the rubble. Some run from the chaos. Others run toward it, these people documented in a new film. These are "The White Helmets."

When the saints go marching in, the white helmets there in Syria.

Two people behind this documentary film now join me.

Orlando von Einsiedel is the director of "The White Helmets" and Joanna Natasegara is the producer.

Thank you so much just for this film and for joining me today, as we so far away try to understand and help what's happening.

Joanna, first to you. I understand you're still in contact with some of the White Helmets. As we're getting reports of increased shelling there, what are they telling you about the situation on the ground?

JOANNA NATASEGARA, PRODUCER, "THE WHITE HELMETS": They're very frightened, Brooke.

The situation is incredibly difficult on the ground. And you're right, the cease-fire has failed to produce any results. Really, what we're dealing with now is people who are afraid for their own lives. People who have spent the last few years digging out, saving other people are now afraid for their own lives.

BALDWIN: We know -- we read the latest tweet from the White Helmets posting -- quote -- "The regime has been trying to kill us for five years."

Since 2013, more than the 130 of these White Helmets have been killed.

And, Orlando, in your film we saw they're former blacksmiths, teachers, they're tailors. These are the volunteers. But what sort of person chooses to put him or her self in this kind of danger? ORLANDO VON EINSIEDEL, DIRECTOR, "THE WHITE HELMETS": I mean, they are a truly extraordinary people. We spent five weeks living with about 30 White Helmets.

And during that period, the film team, we would often ask ourselves, could we do what they do? These are normal people just like me or you. And everyday they're out risking their lives and saving strangers. And I think the answer we came to at the end is, I don't know if we could do that.

BALDWIN: In the film, you see one of these White Helmets actually finds out that his own brother is trapped under the rubble at a hospital and then later finds out that his brother was killed in that airstrike.

These are the men who are seeing, witnessing with their own eyes the horror we only watch through a TV screen, and a lot of these rescues in their own neighborhoods.

Joanna, from what you saw, how were these brave rescuers coping with all of this just emotionally?

NATASEGARA: Yes, in an incredible way.

They have such strength, such strength of character. And actually the character that you mentioned who loses his brother in that hospital, his brother, to be clear, is not a patient. His brother actually was a worker for MSF, the Doctors Without Borders. He was also working as a humanitarian and was killed in a targeted attack on that hospital.

These are the best of people. And it's really important, we feel, that they must be protected in the end of a siege, that they must be able to get out and safely.

BALDWIN: And even just to have cameras in this part of the world, it's only a fraction of what has actually happened. I know one of you wrote: "We could only show a tiny percentage of the horror these people witnessed without making the whole film completely unwatchable."

Orlando, tell me more about that and then how you struck some sort of balance?

VON EINSIEDEL: I mean, yes, absolutely.

The material of what these guys see on daily basis is truly, truly shocking. And we clearly had to strike a balance between showing what was appropriate, so that viewers understood enough about the context of what civilians are experiencing every day, but also making the film feel hopeful, in a sense, because we believe that what the White Helmets are, is they do represent hope.

[15:05:00]

Theirs is a story which cuts through the politics. You can't argue with people that risk their lives to save strangers on a daily basis. BALDWIN: Final question just for either of you. I was talking to

Clarissa Ward, who's our international correspondent. She's been in these parts of Syria. And she knows some of these Syrians who don't know if they will live to see another day.

She told me last hour that she's now receiving messages from them, saying, thank you for your work and goodbye.

Are you getting any of those messages?

NATASEGARA: I mean, if I can jump in, we aren't quite receiving that level, but we are receiving certainly very sad, very tired messages from people that are both still inside or have made it just out.

This is a desperate time. And all the White Helmets are calling for safe passage. I think it's very important that humanitarian law is upheld at this point and those pleas are heard.

BALDWIN: The film is on Netflix. It's called "The White Helmets."

Orlando and Joanna, thank you so much for the time and this piece of journalism.

VON EINSIEDEL: Thank you very much.

BALDWIN: Thank you.

We have more breaking news today, this historic financial milestone. The Federal Reserve just raised its key interest rate for just the second time the last 10 years. And this is happening as the Dow -- we will take a look at the Big Board -- it is encroaching upon that 20000 number, which would be record-breaking.

We will keep a close eye on Wall Street, got about less than an hour to go before that closing bell.

But with me now, Richard Quest, host of "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" and CNN Money editor at large.

Hello.

RICHARD QUEST, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hello.

BALDWIN: So, 0.25 percent, not a mega-surprise, you did you think it would be more?

QUEST: Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no, absolutely not. We're toe in the water business here. You don't want to scare the horses. And this is literally -- remember, rates are very low. This is crucial to understand. What we are talking about here is just taking a bit of the froth off the top.

We are not talking about a massive tightening so far. You're talking about the first rate rise that happened post-crisis a year ago, a year to the day just about, in fact, exactly a year to the day. And now you are taking another quarter-point off, taking the fed funds rates to three-quarters.

BALDWIN: So with credit cards and people buying homes and that sort of thing, cars...

QUEST: Well, some will go up. Certainly, the short-term rates related to the credit cards, bank loans, yes, because of possible future economic policies by President Trump, long-term rates, which are not linked to the fed funds, but to bonds, they're also going to get up.

But the thing to remember about this is, this is a sign of economic success.

BALDWIN: Jobs, growth, right.

QUEST: And 4.6 percent is the unemployment rate. Inflation is at 1.6 percent.

And I will tell you what they're really going to be watching now, the Fed, because they do believe rates will go up a bit faster than they have been believing. What they will watch is Donald Trump's policies, how fast they increase the growth of the economy, and do they need to move a little bit faster to keep inflation under control?

BALDWIN: Speaking of Donald Trump, we have some sound. He's been sitting in Trump Tower with these tech giants. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT-ELECT: I'm here to help you folks do well and you're doing well right now and I'm very honored by the bounce.

They're all talking about the bounce. So right now everybody in this room has to like me at least a little bit, but we're going to try to have that bounce continue. And perhaps even more importantly, we want you to keep going with the incredible innovation. There's nobody like you in the world. There's nobody like the people in this room.

And anything we can do to help this go along, and we're going to be there for you. And you will call my people, you will call me. It doesn't make any difference. We have no formal chain of command around here.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: So, we see the vice president-elect. We saw his adult children, but many of the other people in the room not big fans of candidate Donald Trump.

QUEST: No. You're being polite. You're being polite.

They politicked, campaigned and electioneered against him in some very brutal terms. But the election is over. The election is over. And tech, which has been suffering, and tech, which stands to suffer because of Trump's policies or potential policies creating a war -- a trade conflict with China. Remember, all those tech CEOs rely on Asia for a supply chain that goes deep from the Midwest of the U.S. to deep in the middle of China. If there's any disruption there, they suffer, which is why you have seen Apple, you have seen Facebook, and you have seen all the big tech stocks be nowhere near as ebullient as you have on the old-fashioned stocks.

I will tell one other thing you will be fascinated by, by those pictures, real serious conflict of interest questions. You know, he says the sons and the daughters are going to be the executives. What are they doing at that meeting? Simple question.

[15:10:04]

What are they doing with the president-elect of the United States discussing policy with CEOs, when they are also in business?

BALDWIN: Tomorrow was supposed to be the news conference when he would explain it all.

(CROSSTALK)

QUEST: It's a new world, Brooke. It's a new world.

BALDWIN: Richard Quest, come back more. Richard Quest, thank you so much.

He mentioned that key point, Trump's adult children at the meeting. News today involving Mr. Trump's sons, their involvement in the administration. Sources are telling CNN that Don Jr. personally interviewed candidates for secretary of interior. That nomination pick has now gone to a Montana congressman.

And Eric Trump, according to one of Trump's top aides, was present during at least one meeting between the president-elect and Governor Mitt Romney. Romney had been in the running for secretary of state. Remember, just two days ago, the president-elect called out his sons by name, tweeting that he, Donald Trump, would be leaving his businesses and -- quote -- "Two of my children, Don and Eric, plus executives, will manage them."

So let's begin there with CNN chief political analyst Gloria Borger and David Fahrenthold is with us from "The Washington Post."

David, just first to you, your reaction to seeing the adult children in the room just now?

DAVID FAHRENTHOLD, "THE WASHINGTON POST": Well, as Richard said, we're talking about people that are going to be running Trump's business.

And the reason this matters is because if those folks are going to be running the business, they are going to have access and also involved in the governing of the country. They will have access to a huge number of -- a huge amount of information they could use to help their business. And also there is going to be questions throughout about whether Trump or they are acting in the interest of the Trump Organization or in the interest of the country, asking sort of which comes first?

BALDWIN: Gloria, let me add to that. A source says Ivanka Trump will be moving into the space used by the first lady in the White House. What do you make of that and what does that tell us about the role of the actual first lady, Melania Trump?

GLORIA BORGER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, it will be sort of the family wing of the White House. Perhaps Melania will have an office and Ivanka will have an office.

Look, I think what it tells you about Ivanka Trump is that she is going to be very involved in terms of policy, particularly in terms of policy that she cares about, which is women's issues, children's issues, perhaps the environment, and that given their relationship and given the president's relationship with all of his children, you can expect that there's going to be a lot of cross-pollination there.

And the question that David raises that even if the two boys recuse themselves and leave the White House grounds, how much information will they get? How do you know that they would not be privy to a lot of information that they can then use to further their businesses?

And so it's a very tricky thing both with keeping Ivanka inside in a policy role and keeping the boys outside.

BALDWIN: Well, down the road from the White House is the new Trump hotel and we have to talk about that, David, because the GSA, the General Services Administration, say essentially, if things stay status quo, that Trump will be in violation of the lease when he's sworn in on Inauguration Day.

It sits on federal property and there's a provision in the deal that essentially prevents any elected official, president of the United States, from having a piece of the lease. What do you think Trump should do?

FAHRENTHOLD: Well, what the lease says is that he should get out of his involvement with that hotel. And there's a good reason for that, both for the government and also for Trump.

If Trump had created a giant conflict of interest literally three blocks away from the White House, that's a bad thing for the country and it's a bad thing for him, because all the time he will be faced with questions about whether he's acting to promote his hotel, whether he's helping people more who paid for rooms in the hotel, who paid to use the ballrooms in the hotel.

He's going to have that question overlaid on anything he does, especially as foreign governments figure out that's a way to influence him. So I think it's a good thing for him to comply with the lease just to comply with the law. But it's also important for him to get that obvious blazing conflict of interest a couple of blocks away off the table. Yes, it's a nice hotel, yes, I know he likes running it, but he's

president now. That has to take precedence.

BALDWIN: OK.

What about, Gloria -- sources are telling CNN that Sean Spicer of the RNC and Trump transition spokesperson now favored to become the White House press secretary. We learned that as Reince Priebus has opened the door to changing the White House daily briefing, maybe taking away some TV seats. How would that work? What could they do?

[15:15:00]

BORGER: First of all, it's not surprising.

Secondly, the TV seats, as they're assigned in the White House Briefing Room, is determined by the White House Correspondents Association. It's not determined by the president of the United States or his emissaries who say, you know, I like this news organization or I like that news organization.

So this is between the White House Correspondents Association and the incoming administration and the press secretary. I think they can decide not to do as many briefings, but there are going to be questions of transparency that are raised. And I also believe that it's a way for a White House to get out its take on a story.

Now, if you have a president who continually tweets his own takes on the story, maybe you don't need those briefings everyday if you're looking at it from the Trump administration point of view, because they have the president tweeting.

But I think these are things that have really to be worked out. And if there's a controversy between the media and the Trump folks, that's not going to be new. We saw that continuing day in and day out during the campaign. All we want to be able to do is cover the administration in the best ways that we know how.

BALDWIN: That's right. That's right and we should be able to do that. David Fahrenthold, Gloria Borger, thank you.

BORGER: Thanks.

BALDWIN: Did a typo lead to the breach of Hillary Clinton's campaign? Stunning new details from "The New York Times" about Russia's alleged hacking, we will talk through that.

Also, a college professor in hiding after this clip has surfaced showing her ripping Donald Trump in her class. We will discuss that and how students on both sides of the spectrum feel.

And a chilling statement from the president of the Philippines. He says he killed people in cold blood to set an example. Stay with me. You're watching CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [15:20:15]

BALDWIN: Welcome back. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

We are learning stunning new details in the investigation into Russia's interference with the U.S. election, where it began, how they broke in and the moment someone realized something was wrong.

"The New York Times" is reporting for the first time the FBI notified the DNC a computer system had been compromised. The DNC staffer on the other end of the phone thought it might have been a prank call. Furthermore, we now know how the hackers accessed the e-mail of Clinton's top aide, Hillary Clinton's top aide, John Podesta, which apparently started with a typo.

Hackers sent a phishing e-mail which a staffer then forwarded to Podesta with the message -- quote -- "This is a legitimate e-mail." And now that all that is said and done, the staffer says actually meant to type requests this is an illegitimate e-mail. Big difference.

Joining me to talking about this, one of the reporters who broke the story, David Sanger, national security correspondent for "The New York Times."

David, welcome.

DAVID SANGER, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": Thanks, Brooke.

BALDWIN: So the way the whole story unfolds, how you begin it, with essentially -- I kept thinking you mean to tell me this DNC hack started with an FBI phone call and fears from some I.T. person that this was a prank caller?

SANGER: Well, Brooke, what we were trying to do in our story in "The Times" today, which we have to warn your viewers is 7,000-words long on sort of a narrative that takes you from the beginning of the discovery of the hack through to the responses in the White House as recently as a few weeks ago and what happened in between, is that at the beginning there were many missteps.

The DNC under-reacted, didn't tell its top leadership, or the young cyber-security people who heard this warning from the FBI that they didn't believe fully at the beginning. Didn't tell anybody senior at the DNC until April of this year. And that is the period of time that allowed the Russian hackers to actually go wild, not only inside the DNC systems, but then to move on and attack Mr. Podesta's private Gmail account.

So there was a lot of lost time. The FBI didn't escalate it.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Can I stop you there? Because that's what also -- just the bit on the FBI -- and, listen, I understand they have a massive job to do, but we're talking about the presidential election. We're talking about the DNC. Why didn't someone show up and bang on the door and say, hey, listen up, something is awry?

SANGER: Especially because the doors aren't that far apart. You could walk between the FBI headquarters and the DNC headquarters sort of on your way to get a cup of coffee.

So it's not as if this was a distant target. It's a great question, because the FBI didn't escalate it. They get a lot of cyber-related information and intelligence, and they try to warn the people who are being attacked. They're overwhelmed.

But in this case, there are certain things that they knew. It's the Dean and there's a presidential election coming up. President Obama when he was running in 2008, you will recall, Brooke, had his campaign e-mails cleaned out by the Chinese, as did Senator John McCain, who was running against him.

So it's not as if it's the first time we have seen campaigns be targets.

BALDWIN: But what about then specifically on John Podesta? You point out he had written a memo to the president on cyber-security. This is someone who's been in Washington a long time. How did he fall victim?

SANGER: He fell victim the way many of us have for a sophisticated phishing e-mail. There were many people in the Clinton campaign who received this e-mail. He was one of the few who did not have on his system what's called two-factor authentification, which is that method where, before you sign in, a code is sent back to your cell phone or some other way of assuring that it's really you.

And I would say to your viewers that if there's one lesson out of our 7,000-word thing...

BALDWIN: I just did it recently myself.

(CROSSTALK)

SANGER: After they're done watching you on CNN, make sure that they get the two-factor authentication.

BALDWIN: Why do you think the White House didn't do more to sound the alarm?

SANGER: This was complicated for the White House.

In the Sony hack two years ago, the president came down into the press room. He announced that it was the North Koreans who did the hack. He vowed retaliation. He never publicly talked very much about the Russians in this case. He didn't vow retaliation.

And the reasons were complex. First is they have a lot of other interests in Russia, including trying to get a settlement in Syria. Secondly, they were concerned about getting on an escalation ladder they couldn't get off of.

[15:25:03] So, if they responded to the Russians, and the Russians decided to

strike back during -- on Election Day, you remember how many concerns there were about the security of the polling system.

Thirdly, they were concerned that a big public announcement from the White House would undercut public confidence in the credibility of the voting system.

BALDWIN: David Sanger, you and your 7,000 words, thank you. Thanks for the time.

SANGER: Thank you very much.

BALDWIN: Thank you.

Next here on CNN, a major headline in the war against ISIS. After two years of U.S.-led airstrikes, why the U.S. says it is closer than ever to defeating the terror group -- back in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:29:08]

BALDWIN: A U.S. official says at least 75 percent of ISIS fighters have been killed during the U.S.-led airstrikes and they believe ISIS now has roughly 15,000 -- quote, unquote -- "battle-ready fighters," adding that the terror group is no longer able to replenish its ranks.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRETT MCGURK, U.S. DEPUTY ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF STATE: We're having tremendous success against this enemy. It's accelerating. We're now putting pressure on its two so-called capitals of Mosul and Raqqa, but this remains an unprecedented threat. The fight isn't over. This will remain a multiyear effort.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Joining me now, CNN military analyst retired Major General James "Spider" Marks.

General Marks, good to see you, sir.

BRIG. GEN. JAMES "SPIDER" MARKS (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Thank you, Brooke. Happy holidays.

BALDWIN: Thank you. Same to you.

Quickly, just on the number, 75 percent...

MARKS: Right.

BALDWIN: Yes, I want to say it's huge and significant, but how do they know 75 percent vs. 15 percent, or how ever many fighters are still on the battlefield?

SANGER: Yes.

Well, first of all, don't celebrate.

BALDWIN: OK.

SANGER: Yes.

The attrition of 75 percent is -- very much, it's a qualitative estimate. It has some science behind it.