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Orphan: "Please Get Us Out of Aleppo"; Trump Ally: Russia Sanctions "in Place Long Enough"; Role of Trump's Children Sparks Conflict Questions; Closing Arguments Underway This Hour. Aired 10- 10:30a ET

Aired December 15, 2016 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:00:16]

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: That is the voice of an orphan in Aleppo and this is what he is saying, "this might be the last day you will hear my voice and see me. I am 10 years old. I have been living in an orphanage for the past two years. I lost my mom and dad two years ago from airstrikes. I am sending this message to those concerned with human rights and the rights of children and to the entire world. I hope you get us out of Aleppo. There are 47 children here and they are all my brothers and sisters. We all hope to get out of Aleppo and eat and drink. We love peace. We cannot go outside because of the airstrikes and shelling. We can't go outside because of that. Please get us out of Aleppo."

Let's bring in CNN senior international correspondent Frederik Pleitgen. He has more. Hi, Fred.

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Carol. Yes, you're right, those evacuations are now finally underway but they didn't start without a major hitch. You know, early this morning, the first convoy was supposed to leave those rebel-held areas and what happens then is that they go through government-controlled territory and then go back into other rebel-held areas in Syria, where hopefully then those people who are coming out will then be safe. Well, that first convoy that tried to get out, they came under fire at the checkpoint right between the rebel territory and the government-held territory. Apparently was some sort of pro-government militia that opened fire on that convoy. One person was killed, several others were wounded. And that almost derailed the entire process that's going on right now.

But now that process is back on track. And we know that there have been several convoys that have made it out so far. It's usually a mix of ambulances and buses and the reason for that is that right now, it's the most vulnerable, who are the first who are going to be evacuated, people who are very sick, people who are wounded, people who need immediate medical attention. And this is going to go on for several days. These evacuations because there are so many people, who are inside, still inside that small rebel enclave that it's just a huge logistical feat to try to get them out. So that is going to take some time.

And at the same time, of course, Carol, all of this is happening in front of a background with the situation on the ground remaining very, very fragile and very volatile as well. Of course, the people there around there, many of them have been fighting each other for a very long time. They are very trigger-happy. Folks on the opposition side, of course, very scared as well, and then having to take that leap of faith where they get on the bus, they are very vulnerable when they're on their buses, someone could open fire on those any time, and yet it's their only route out of those besieged areas that they have been living in for such a long time. Carol?

COSTELLO: All right, Frederik Pleitgen reporting live for us this morning.

In the world of politics, the Trump administration and its ties to Russia raising eyebrows again this morning. "NPR" is reporting that a former Trump surrogate, Congressman Jack Kingston, a former congressman, has been spotted in Moscow this week. He is reportedly briefing American business people in Moscow on what they can expect from a Trump White House. U.S. sanctions may be at the center of those changes. For more now, let's bring in CNN senior political reporter Manu Raju. Good morning.

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER: Good morning, Carol. Yes, the questions remain about what Donald Trump will do as president on his policy towards Russia and how his - will his choice of Secretary of State, Rex Tillerson, deal with the issue of sanctions imposed by the country, imposed by Washington on Russia, I should say. Now, in a sign this week that Trump may try to ease those sanctions, Kingston, a former Georgia congressman, a very visible Trump surrogate, was in Moscow this week briefing American businesses, discussing the possibility that Trump could water down those sanctions.

Now, he later told "NPR" that he did not meet with any officials from the Russian government, but this comes as perhaps this post-election detente between the White House and Donald Trump could be over, because of this Russia issue. Yesterday, the White House Press Secretary Josh Earnest said that Trump was, "obviously aware of Russia's involvement in the elections because Trump urged Russia to hack Hillary Clinton, the last press conference that he had which was nearly five months ago.

Now, Trump fired back this morning in a tweet, saying this. "If Russia, or some other entity, was hacking, why did the White House wait so long to act? Why did they only complain after Hillary lost?" Now, -- a top Trump campaign adviser, Kellyanne Conway, attacked the White House Press Secretary early this morning, saying this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KELLYANNE CONWAY, TRUMP SENIOR ADVISER: That is breathtaking. I guess he's auditioning to be a political pundit after his job is over. So that is incredibly disappointing to hear from the podium of the White House Press Secretary because he is -- he basically -- he essentially stated that the president-elect had knowledge of this, maybe even fanned the flames. It's incredibly irresponsible and I wonder if his boss, President Obama, agrees.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: While Trump continues to question if Russia was involved in the cyberattacks, a lot of Republicans are perplexed by those comments, that's because the Intelligence Community released on October 7th an assessment saying very clearly, that it is confident that the Russian government hacked into American

[10:05:16] political organizations, something that the government here in the U.S. believes was authorized by the, "senior most officials in Russia."

Now, this comes as Lindsey Graham, the Republican senator from South Carolina, who ran for president last year, revealed that he too had been hacked.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM, (R) SOUTH CAROLINA: I do believe that the Russians hacked into the DNC. I do believe they hacked into Podesta's e-mail account. They hacked into my campaign account. I do believe that all the information released publicly hurt Clinton, didn't hurt Trump, but I don't think the outcome of the election is in doubt. What we should do is not turn on each other but work as one people to push back against Russia.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: Now, when Congress returns this will be a major issue and these four committees are planning on holding hearings on Russia, Russia's involvement in the elections. But in the sign of some tension between Congress and the administration, the House Intelligence Committee's chairman, Devin Nunes, the Republican from California, criticizing the Intelligence Community for canceling a Thursday briefing. The reason why that briefing was canceled is because the White House ordering a top-down review of what exactly happened. Something that we can learn more about by the time president Obama leaves office. Carol?

COSTELLO: All right, Manu Raju reporting live for us, this morning. Thank you. So, let's dive deeper into the relationship between the United States, Mr. Trump and Russia. With me now is Evelyn Farkas, she's the former U.S. Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense for Russia, Ukraine and Eurasia. She served from 2012 to 2015. Welcome.

EVELYN FARKAS, FORMER U.S. DEPUTY ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF DEFENSE FOR RUSSIA/UKRAINE/EURASIA (2012-2015): Thanks Carol.

COSTELLO: So, there's going to be more than one hearing on Capitol Hill about whether Russia tried to tilt a U.S. election. And at the same time, actually before this happened, but we are talking about it, right? A Trump surrogate, Congressman Kingston, is in Russia talking about lifting sanctions. How does that strike you?

FARKAS: Well, I think this is the problem. I mean, you heard Manu say, there's a lot of information that we expect the Obama administration to get out to the public. We want to know what the Intelligence Community knows and not just about what the Russians did, but the Trump campaign's involvement. Because it's not just, you know, Congressman Kingston being in Moscow right now, but there were reporters calling me over the summer saying, hey, we have reports of Carter Page going to Moscow, meeting with Russian officials and you know, giving them the wink and the nod indicating that they should release the documents that they hacked -- to "WikiLeaks," and of course, that happened. So, I mean, the release happened.

Now, the question is whether Trump people were involved, whether they knew, whether President-elect Trump knew what the Russians were up to. So, those are all very important questions coupled with the fact that we still don't know the extent of his financial involvement with Russians, Russian oligarchs, Russian banks to the President-elect Trump. --

COSTELLO: And I want to get into that right now, because you did point this out in an op-ed you recently wrote but we got the direct quote from "The Washington Post." This is what Donald Trump Jr. said to "The Washington Post" in 2008 about the Trump company investments from Russians. And he said this at a real estate conference. Trump Jr. said, "Russia's make up a pretty disproportionate cross section of a lot of our assets." He added, "We see a lot of money pouring in from Russia."

FARKAS: Right. So what does that mean? Does that mean that President- elect Trump is no longer in debt because Russians gave him loans or because they guaranteed loans that other banks gave him? So these things are all unanswered questions and I think the American people deserve to know. If they think it's OK that their president-elect is now essentially doing the bidding of the Russian government because he's in debt to them, that's up to the American people. But they deserve to know. It's really problematic to me that we don't have a good grip on this relationship.

COSTELLO: Phil Mudd, CNN's counterterrorism analyst, he's a former CIA operative, right? He's worked for the CIA for a long time before retiring. He said, since Mr. Trump is discounting what our Intelligence Agencies are saying, namely the CIA, as far as Russia tilting the election to Hillary Clinton, and he's believing the Kremlin instead, Phil Mudd says, that Russia's sitting back and laughing and jumping up for joy because they won.

FARKAS: Right, right. I mean, this is the thing. I think we can expect a reset like we have never seen before. And what do I mean by that? I mean when President Obama came in, and when President Bush came in before him, you know they all said OK, let's start with a fresh page with Russia. Let's see if we can cooperate. But with Trump, it's going to go even beyond normal cooperation, where the danger is in lifting sanctions, for example, that we are actually, would be doing something counter to U.S. interests, counter to the interests of our allies in Europe, and frankly, counter to our values.

And on Syria, I want to say, you know, before I run out of time, President Trump should be calling President Putin and saying

[10:10:16] what are you doing killing those innocent civilians, stop the bombing, let the people stay in their cities where they belong. You know, I mean, there are almost 200,000 people who need to leave Aleppo is my understanding from those areas they're bombing. -- Sorry. I could go on.

COSTELLO: Point taken. You could go on. Just one last question about sanctions and Russia because I don't think most people really like are up to date about the what effect these sanctions are having on the Russian economy and how the United States business community might benefit if those sanctions are lifted.

FARKAS: Right. So the sanctions are pretty pointed. You know, they are not directed towards all of the Russian people. The Russian people think -- that the sanctions are hurting them because oil prices fell. But our sanctions basically prevent Russians from traveling to the United States or Europe, in as much as our sanctions are linked with the Europeans, and they prevent the Russians from doing business with us in high end tech areas where their defense industry might benefit and in the energy sector. And that's where this new Trump - issue comes --

COSTELLO: -- and oil, right?

FARKAS: Yes, exactly, comes into play.

COSTELLO: Thank you for make it so clear. Evelyn Farkas, thank you so much for joining me this morning.

Coming up in the NEWSROOM, President-elect Trump calls a meeting but it's his children who steal the spotlight. Conflict of interest taking shape even before Mr. Trump takes office?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:15:16] COSTELLO: Donald Trump's team is rejecting questions about conflicts of interest but those concerns are growing louder after the president-elect called a meeting of tech industry giants and guess what? His children and son-in-law had a prominent seat at the table. Trump, as you may recall, is handing control of his companies to his eldest sons and yes, his eldest sons were part of this meeting and more. CNN's Sara Murray is here with a closer look. Hi, Sara.

SARA MURRAY, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: Good morning, Carol. Well, look, Donald Trump's team is saying there's no conflict here. We told you that the kids were part of the transition effort and so it's no surprise that they may be in meetings. And yes, yesterday they were transparent. We saw that Ivanka Trump, Eric Trump, Don Jr., and even Jared Kushner were all in this meeting but what's happening behind the scenes, what sources are telling us privately, is what's more interesting. And that is the fact that Ivanka Trump appears to be headed to the east wing, this is normally where the Office of the First Lady is, but under Donald Trump's administration, it's expected to become the Office of the First Family to allow Ivanka Trump to assume some of the duties we have seen from past first ladies, acting as a hostess and even advising her father on a variety of issues from family leave to climate change. As for Jared Kushner, he appears bound for the west wing which would be pretty unprecedented to see someone's son-in-law in a position like that. Now, sources say their titles have not been finalized and a spokeswoman for the transition said that it's not finalized what Ivanka Trump's role is going to be but it is clear that their prominent role is going to continue. As for the two sons, they are expected to take over the business. Now, they haven't exactly been separating themselves from transition efforts in the meantime. Don Jr. helped to interview candidates for Interior Secretary and Eric Trump sat in on a meeting with Mitt Romney as he was under consideration for Secretary of State.

Donald Trump, though, is getting a little bit defensive about all of this attention on his children and about his attempts to unwind his business interests with his political and White House interests. He took to Twitter, to express that frustration saying, "The media tries so hard to make my move to the White House, as it pertains to my business, so complex - when actually, it isn't!"

But in fact, it is complex. He was supposed to hold a press conference today where he was going to explain how he was going to disentangle what was happening with his business so he could focus solely on the presidency. He and his team have now put that off until January. It appears, because it is complicated, Carol. It is not easy to unwind Donald Trump from the many properties, from the many holdings he has, and many of which we are not entirely sure, you know, where they are, what's going on with those.

COSTELLO: And supposedly he's going to hold another news conference to explain about -

MURRAY: Supposedly.

COSTELLO: -- in January.

MURRAY: -- in January. So we will wait until then. And I'm sure more conflicts than questions about potential conflicts will arise.

COSTELLO: Sara Murray, many thanks. Plenty of questions, as you just heard, still unanswered. Just 36 days before Trump is sworn in as the next President of the United States. So let's talk -- about all of that. I'm joined by former Trump campaign advisor, Steve Cortes. Welcome, Steve.

STEVE CORTES, FORMER TRUMP CAMPAIGN ADVISOR: Thanks. Thanks for having me, Carol.

COSTELLO: Are you ready?

CORTES: Yes.

COSTELLO: I have a lot of questions to ask you.

CORTES: Yes, you mean for the interview?

COSTELLO: Yes, exactly.

CORTES: -- or you mean for the new administration -- or both? COSTELLO: No, no, for the interview. I have a lot of questions to ask you. So the first question of course is this and it's an obvious one. If Mr. Trump's sons are going to run his businesses, why are they taking part in these interviews of potential cabinet members?

CORTES: Right. Well, Carol, I would say this. First of all, we have a very unique situation here. We have never elected a citizen President of the United States. All of our presidents have either been already in political office or in the military. So this presents -- and by the way, I think it's one of the reasons that we won, was our campaign was so much about the outsiders that were going to Washington, D.C., not to tinker around the edges but to smash the rigged system there. But that presents some challenges clearly. --

COSTELLO: But it was also about getting any sort of criminality or wrongdoing out of government as well. And you know, you just kind of like, there's a lot of a thing that people are confused about that might point to that. So why take a chance? Why involve your children if there's any question at all? Is it worth it?

CORTES: Well, you know Carol listen, you bring up a great point because as a campaign, we certainly hammered team Clinton on the conflicts of interest between the state department and the foundation. We don't want to go anywhere near that in a Trump presidency, even the appearance of it. And so that's why, by the way, press conference was supposed to be today, was delayed I think for very good reason which is that team Trump, the transition team, the lawyers, they want to get this exactly correct. And by the way, they are under no obligation to do so. President-elect Trump could actually run his businesses legally. Now, he doesn't want to at all.

COSTELLO: I know legally he has no obligation but wait a minute. He has an obligation to the American people, doesn't he? -

CORTES: Of course.

COSTELLO: -- or don't they count?

CORTES: -- No, and he was -- of course, he was not elected to run his businesses and he was very clear about that. By the way, if this was a business decision, I think that's -- what's the underlying sort of suspicion here. And say, he's going to use the White House somehow to enhance his business organization. I just think that that really is completely illogical. If this was a business decision to run for president, that it was the worst decision of his entire career. He spent over -

COSTELLO: OK -- this is why some people think that. This is why. So, in 2008, Donald Trump Jr. told "The Washington Post" he was at a real estate conference, right?

[10:20:16] Trump Jr. said this, "Russians make up a pretty disproportionate cross section of a lot of our assets." He added, "We see a lot of money pouring in from Russia." Just today we found out that a Trump surrogate, a former Georgia Congressman went to Russia, to Moscow, to talk to American businessmen there doing business in Moscow and talking about possibly raising sanctions. So don't you get why people are kind of suspicious about this stuff?

CORTES: Carol, again, we want to avoid even the appearance of impropriety. And by the way, that's why team Trump is taking its time to come out with the very clear delineations of what will be in the best interests of the Trump organization and what will be in the best interests of America. But the president-elect has made it very clear that he does not -- he doesn't even care about his organization at this point. He spent decades building an incredible business, employing tens of thousands of people, but he wants his last great act of his life to be doing that for America, building this company of the United States. --

COSTELLO: And I believe -- he's a patriot and I believe he wants to "Make America Great Again," no question about that, but there's also a suspicion that he wants to maintain his many businesses and doesn't want to interfere with that. He wants it both ways, in other words. So he postpones this news conference until January. His children don't even have definite roles within his administration. We don't know exactly what they're going to do. We know, though, he said that his sons are going to run his businesses, right? But they are taking part in interviews for cabinet positions.

CORTES: Well, Carol, but they do have an official role in transition. They do.

COSTELLO: What Mr. Trump says doesn't quite wash, does it?

CORTES: No, it does. Because look, they have official roles in the transition and we know too, these are more than just his children. They have also been his most trusted executives, his confidants, his advisers both in his business life and in the campaign. So I don't think we can expect him to then just immediately punt them from the scene. And they do have all of them official roles on the executive committee of transition.

COSTELLO: But -- if his sons are going to run his businesses, he already has said that, so why are they taking part in these interviews?

CORTES: Because he values their counsel and because they are an official part of the transition team and because he's already pledged to us that he's going to make it very clear what the structure will be. He will tell us in January exactly and hold a press conference to answer these kinds of questions himself, about what the structure will be going forward. But I think it's clear that --

COSTELLO: OK. -- When he holds that press conference, will we know any financial dealings that his companies have in Russia? And will he release his tax returns?

CORTES: I don't know about the tax returns. I don't think so because as far as I know they are still under audit. As far as Russia goes, you know, and I -- the left, really is trying to turn Russia suddenly into this boogeyman of this campaign. - I think Russia has --

COSTELLO: Not just the left. -- No, no, no, no. Senator Lindsey Graham is not the left. Senator John McCain is not the left. Senator Mitch McConnell is not the left. They are Republicans.

CORTES: OK. But you know what else? There's not even agreement within the national security structure, Clapper man, FBI director Comey -

COSTELLO: There's a great - no, no, no. See, I want to make this clear because you are muddying the waters. There's no -- there's no disagreement over whether Russia hacked into the DNC. The only disagreement between the FBI and the CIA is motive.

CORTES: No, there is disagreement, though, over the Podesta e-mails. There absolutely is and we don't know. But look, also, I don't think it mattered either way. Even if Russia had been the primary hack, that doesn't mean that tipped the election. What tipped the election is the fact that Americans don't feel secure and don't enjoy economic growth anywhere near to the degree they should. That's what put the election in our favor and the fact that we were lucky enough to have a candidate who was both incredibly unlikable and incredibly corrupt. And again, we are not going - come anywhere near -

COSTELLO: -- All of that may be true, but still, isn't it a little disturbing that Russia is interfering in an American election? Isn't that disturbing to you? Doesn't that kind of frighten you because it could happen to the Republicans the next time?

CORTES: Sure, of course. Look, we don't want to be hacked by anybody. For instance, we are being hacked constantly by the Chinese into our private companies. I think that's something President-elect Trump is going to address very quickly.

COSTELLO: So that's important and Russia's hacking is not?

CORTES: No, hold on. That's also, look, we don't want to be hacked by anyone. Of course it's a national security risk. It's an economic risk and I think it needs to be investigated and addressed. Mr. Trump -- President-elect Trump certainly won't get in the way of any Congressional investigation. In fact, I think would encourage it. But I would also say this, by the way. You make yourself vulnerable when you do and say things in private e-mails and scheming for instance to rig the Democratic primary, you make yourself - vulnerable.

COSTELLO: So you're blaming the victim now?

CORTES: So, we don't want anybody to be hacked. But also, don't do and say things that make you vulnerable.

COSTELLO: Well, that is good advice. Thank you so much for joining me this morning, Steve Cortes.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, closing arguments underway right now for Dylann Roof, the man who confessed to the Charleston church massacre, what's at stake, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:28:39] COSTELLO: And good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me. Closing arguments underway right now in the trial of Dylann Roof, he's the man accused of carrying out the Charleston church massacre. On Wednesday, jurors got a first-hand account of what unfolded during that night of terror from one of the only survivors. Her name is Polly Sheppard. She recalled diving under a table when bullets started flying. She says Roof pointed the gun at her and then asked her a chilling question. Did I shoot you yet? Sheppard's tearful 911-call was played out in court. Warning, some of you might find it disturbing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

POLLY SHEPPARD, CHARLESTON CHURCH MASSACRE SURVIVOR: Please answer. Oh, God.

OPERATOR: 911. What's the address of the emergency?

SHEPPARD: Please. Emanuel Church. There's plenty people shot down here. Please send somebody right away.

OPERATOR: Emanuel Church?

SHEPPARD: Emanuel A.M.E 110 Calhoun.

OPERATOR: And there's people shot?

SHEPPARD: Yeah. He shot the pastor. He shot all the men in the. Please come right away.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: CNN senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin is with me now. Hi, Jeff. It's just so hard to listen to.

JEFF TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Hey. It really -- like the worst. This case, I mean, you know, -- we all cover, you know, terrible crimes all the time but if there is a case that is more about pure evil in the world, I don't think I have ever seen one than this one.

COSTELLO: I would have to agree with you there. Still, the defense and the prosecution have rested. Closing arguments will take place. The case will go to the jury, presumably they will find --