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President Trump Talks Travel Ban, Putin, Mexico; Could Trump Pull Federal Funds from California?; Trump Says There Could Be Tax Cut By End of 2017. Aired 6-6:30p ET

Aired February 05, 2017 - 18:00   ET


[18:00:15] POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: It is 6:00 Eastern. You're live in the CNN NEWSROOM. So glad you're with us. I'm Poppy Harlow in New York.

We begin with this -- just before the Super Bowl kickoff, a new interview with the president. Mr. Trump discussing nearly every executive action he signed since taking office, including his controversial travel ban and his new Supreme Court nominee.



BILL O'REILLY, FOX NEWS HOST: So, another big week for the Trump administration. Judge Gorsuch, that rollout went very smoothly, I think.


O'REILLY: But the refugee deal, not so much.

TRUMP: I think it was very smooth. You had 109 people out of hundreds of thousands of travelers and all we did was vet those people very, very carefully.

O'REILLY: You wouldn't do anything differently if you had to do it all over again? Some people didn't know what the order was.

TRUMP: Well, that's not what General Kelly said. General Kelly who is now Secretary Kelly, he said he totally knew. He was aware of it and it was very smooth. It was 109 people.

O'REILLY: Let's talk about Iran, your assessment. Do you think we're on a collision course -- we being the United States -- with that country?

TRUMP: I think it was the worst deal I've ever seen negotiated. I think it was a deal that never should have been negotiated --

O'REILLY: The nuclear deal you're talking about?

TRUMP: Absolutely. The deal that was made by the Obama administration. I think it's a shame that we've had a deal like that and that we had to sign a deal like that and there was no reason to do it and if you're going to do it, have a good deal.

We gave them $1.7 billion in cash, which is unheard of, and we put the money up and we have really nothing to show for it.

O'REILLY: Possible you'll tear it up?

TRUMP: We'll see what happens. I mean, we're going to see what happens.

I can say this: They have total disregard for our country. They are the number one terrorist state, they are sending money all over the place, and weapons, and you can't do that.

O'REILLY: Sanctions, that's how you're going to start with them.

TRUMP: Just started.

O'REILLY: But you're moving a carrier right?

TRUMP: I never talk about military moves. I always criticized President Obama with having an announcement that they're going into Mosul, or they're going to someplace. And they give the name, the date, the time. I don't believe in that.

O'REILLY: So, you're not real bullish on Iran at this point?

TRUMP: No, I'm not bullish. I think they have total disrespect for our country and I understand. That deal, I would have lived with it if they said, "OK, we're all together now."

But it was just the opposite. It's like they're emboldened. They follow our planes, they circle our ships with their little boats and they lost respect because they can't believe anybody could be so stupid as to make a deal like that.

O'REILLY: You talked to Putin last week. You had a busy week last week.

TRUMP: Yes, I got a busy week. Busy week and a half.

O'REILLY: Do you respect Putin?

TRUMP: I do respect him but --

O'REILLY: Do you? Why?

TRUMP: Well, I respect a lot of people but that doesn't mean I'm going to get along with him. He's a leader of his country. I say it's better to get along with Russia than not. And if Russia helps us in the fight against ISIS, which is a major fight, and Islamic terrorism all over the world --

O'REILLY: Right.

TRUMP: Major fight -- that's a good thing.

Will I get along with him? I have no idea. It's possible I won't.

O'REILLY: But he's a killer though. Putin's a killer.

TRUMP: There are a lot of killers. We've got a lot of killers. What, do you think our country's so innocent? You think our country's so innocent?

O'REILLY: I don't know of any government leaders that are killers.

TRUMP: Well -- take a look at what we've done, too. We made a lot of mistakes. I've been against the war in Iraq from the beginning.

O'REILLY: Yes, mistakes are different than --

TRUMP: We made a lot of mistakes, OK, but a lot of people were killed. So, a lot of killers around, believe me.

O'REILLY: Let's talk about Mexico. There was a report that you talked to President Nieto and you told him -- this was the report, I want to know if it's true or not -- that if his army couldn't handle the drug cartels, that U.S. Army soldiers would. Did you say that?

TRUMP: We have to do something about the cartels. I did talk to him about it. I want to help him with it. I think he's a very good man. We have a very good relationship, as you probably know.

He seemed very willing to get help from us because he has got a problem.

O'REILLY: Got a problem.

TRUMP: And it's a real problem for us. Don't forget those cartels are operating in our country. And they're poisoning the youth of our country.

O'REILLY: At this point, do you consider Mexico a corrupt country? Because this stuff has been going on for decades.

TRUMP: I love the people. I really like this administration. I think he's a good man. We get along very well.

But they have problems controlling aspects of their country. There's no question about it, and I would say the drugs and the drug cartels, number one.

O'REILLY: Have you figured out what kind of a tariff you're going to levy on Mexico to pay for the wall?

TRUMP: Well, right now, it's very unfavorable. Right now, we're losing our jobs to Mexico. You look at the plants. You look at these massive plants.

Now, I have to tell you, I've turned it around already, I've turned it around. You see that. Ford has been phenomenal. [18:05:01] They cancelled a plant. They're building tremendous --

O'REILLY: Yes, you intimidated them. They're afraid of you.

TRUMP: No. General Motors, Mary Barra --

O'REILLY: They're afraid of you. You know these companies.

TRUMP: I don't know if they're afraid of me. No, no, they want to do what's right.

O'REILLY: They want to do what's right? Why didn't they do what was right in the past? They're afraid of you.

TRUMP: Because the wrong people spoke to them. But they're going to do what's right, and they're bringing jobs back to Michigan and Ohio and Pennsylvania and all the places that have lost their jobs.

So, that's already happening. I think you're going to see a tremendous job growth in this country.


HARLOW: We'll be watching those jobs numbers.

Let's talk about all this with my panel. Josh Rogin is with us, a CNN political analyst and columnist for "The Washington Post." Julian Zelizer joins us as well, historian at Princeton University.

Thank you both for being here. And I give you a pass for being on Skype only because it is Super Bowl Sunday. So, thank for joining before the big game.

And, Josh, let me begin with you.

The president's comments about Russia and Vladimir Putin really making a clear moral equivalence between Putin's Russia and the United States. Those remarks today being roundly criticized by some Republicans including Marco Rubio, who tweeted this, "When has a political activist been poisoned by the GOP or vice versa? We are not the same as Putin."

This as, you know, a number of Republicans stay quiet about the president's travel ban. Do you think, Josh, they see Russia as a sort of safe space where they can go after the president?

JOSH ROGIN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I think Republican lawmakers are in a tough position here. They know that Trump is going to do something that they like on foreign policy. They can get behind the Iran stuff. But this Russia stuff is just a red line for them. This is a party that has been for decades standing up for the principle that U.S. values and U.S. interests are not the same as Russian interest. They --

HARLOW: American exceptionalism, right? American exceptionalism. ROGIN: And especially when it comes to Russia, the country we're in a

Cold War with for 50 years, the country that oppresses its opposition, prosecutes journalists, threatens our allies in Europe. I mean, this is not small stuff. This is a big issue for Republicans.

And now, you have Democrats who are piling on because of Russian interference in the election and hacking of the DNC. What you're seeing is a huge push for a stronger Russia policy.

Now, Donald Trump, like most presidents, wants to try to reset relations with Russia, he won't use the word. He wants to make a deal. That's fine. That's all well and good. But while he's doing that, what Republicans are locking to make sure is that he doesn't lose sight of the prize, which is standing up for American values and standing for American allies.

HARLOW: One thing that the president tweeted today, Julian, about this federal judge in Washington who stayed his travel ban, he tweeted this. "Just cannot believe a judge would put our country in such peril. If something bad happens, blame him and the court system. People pouring in. Bad."

You're a presidential historian. Have we ever seen a sitting commander-in-chief criticized, attacked a sitting federal judge or justice in this way? Now, he's saying if this country gets attacked, it's your fault.

JULIAN ZELIZER, PRESIDENTIAL HISTORIAN: No, not like this. We have obviously had presidents critical of decisions that were made by courts and they challenged the decisions, they spoken about the decisions. But what's different is the tweet yesterday and the tweet today, he's really attacking the judge. First calling him a so-called judge, questioning his legitimacy, and today raising the argument that somehow he's responsible if something happens.

So, this is a different kind of political argument and political attack than we have seen from other presidents. And it's troubling because this is that area of separation of power that many people are watching carefully to see if President Trump responds.

HARLOW: And I would just note, Julian, and, Josh, weigh in on this. You know, he's being defiant in a face of a judge in terms of his language or verbiage, but he's not actually defying the court order.


HARLOW: He's not telling his agencies, no, don't listen to the judge.

ROGIN: There were reports today that the administration slow walked some of the stays in terms of implementation. As of today, the Department of Homeland Security has suspended any and all actions to implement the order. So that's that.

You know, the problem here is that the Trump White House is always in attack mode. And the president leads that attack at all times. They don't have any other style. And while that helps them a lot in the press, in a legal proceeding, that's risky because the things that he says can come into play down the road. This is the first bat until a long war over this. And the president's words matter.

HARLOW: You know, I just wonder, Julian. You know, look, the media got it wrong in the election in terms of who the pundits thought was going to win, what all the modeling showed and all the polling showed. When I'm out in it the field across the Rust Belt, when I'm in Kentucky, when I'm, you know, all over this country, Trump supporters say, look, you're flipping out about what he's saying and this is the kind of language that we like to hear.

[18:10:00] We might not agree with every statement, but he just says it like he sees it.

ZELIZER: Well, I think that's actually important. There's been a lot of talk about approval ratings for President Trump being historically low. When you look at national approval ratings, there was one out yesterday or the day before.

But when you look at support among Republicans, it's quite high right now. And I think this is a president who sees a divided country and he doesn't want to unify the country. He wants to in some ways play to the divisions. And some of what he does, both his policies and his attitudes, play very well with his supporters and frankly with had many Republicans who other than a few issues have not said much.

So, I think there is a strategy behind the chaos. And I think that's where Democrats shouldn't underestimate how weak or strong that he is based on some of this polling.

HARLOW: That's an important point.

Guys, stay with me. Josh Rogin, Julian Zelizer, thank you.

Still to come, we turn to issues in the United States. You're going to hear more of that exclusive interview with President Trump -- a brand new interview. What he said about repealing Obamacare and exactly how long a replacement could take a brand development, next.

You're live in the CNN NEWSROOM.


HARLOW: President Trump in a brand new interview taking aim at sanctuary cities, saying again that he may hold federal funding to use as a, quote, "weapon". He also said he does not want to defund, though, that he doesn't want to defund the whole state of California even though it's considering being a sanctuary state.

Here's more of his interview on FOX with Bill O'Reilly.


O'REILLY: Let's turn to domestic policy.

[18:15:00] I just spent the week in California. As you know, they are now voting on whether they should become a sanctuary state. So, California and the USA are on a collision course. How do you see it?

TRUMP: Well, I think it's ridiculous. Sanctuary cities -- as you know, I'm very much opposed to sanctuary cities. They breed crime. There's a lot of problems.

If we have to, we'll defund. We give tremendous amounts of money to California --

O'REILLY: So, you're going to defund --

TRUMP: California in many ways is out of control, as you know. Obviously, the voters agree. Otherwise, they wouldn't have voted for me.

O'REILLY: So, defunding is your weapon of choice?

TRUMP: Well it's a weapon. I don't want to defund a state or a city.

O'REILLY: But you're willing to do it?

TRUMP: I don't want to defund anyone. I want to give them the money they need to properly operate as a city or state. If they're going to have sanctuary cities, we may have to do that. Certainly that would be a weapon.

O'REILLY: Is there any validity to the criticism of you that you say things you can't back up factually, and as the president, if you say, for example, that there are 3 million illegal aliens who voted and then you don't have the data to back it up, some people are going to say that's irresponsible for a president to say that. Is there any validity to that?

TRUMP: Well, many people have come out and said I'm right. You know that.

O'REILLY: I know, but you've got to have data to back that up.

TRUMP: Let me just tell you. And it doesn't have to do with the vote, although that's the end result. It has to do with the registration. And when you look at the registration and you see dead people that have voted, when you see people that are registered in two states that voted in two states, when you see other things, when you see illegals, people that are not citizens, and they're on the registration rolls.

Look, Bill, we can be babies, but you take a look at the registration, you have illegals, you have dead people, you have this. It's really a bad situation. It's really bad. And --

O'REILLY: So, you think you're going to be proven correct in that statement?

TRUMP: Well, I think I already have. A lot of people have come out and said that I am correct.

O'REILLY: Yes, but the data has to show that 3 million illegals voted.

TRUMP: Look, forget that. Forget all of that. Just take a look at the registration, and we're going to do it, and I'm going to set up a commission, to be headed by Vice President Mike Pence, and we're gonna look at it very, very carefully.

O'REILLY: Well, that's good. Let's get to the bottom of this.

2017, can Americans expect a tax cut?

TRUMP: I think so, yes, and I think before the end of the year. I would like to say yes.

O'REILLY: OK. Can Americans in 2017 expect a new healthcare plan rolled out by the Trump administration, this year?

TRUMP: In the process, and maybe it will take until sometime into next year, but we are certainly going to be in the process.

Very complicated. Obamacare is a disaster. You have to remember, Obamacare doesn't work. So, we are putting in a wonderful plan. It statutorily takes a while to get.

We're going to be putting it in fairly soon. I think that, yes, I would like to say, by the end of the year, at least the rudiments, but we should have something within the year and the following year.


HARLOW: All right. We're going to dice through all of that next with economist Ben Stein, formerly a speechwriter for Presidents Nixon and Ford. What does he think of all of this? He weighs in, next.


[18:21:47] HARLOW: Before the break, we heard the president's latest interview. He talked about a lot, including Obamacare, sanctuary cities and tax cuts.

Let's discuss with Ben Stein. He's a Republican and a noted economist. Also, he was a speech writer for Presidents Nixon and Ford.

Nice to have you on.


HARLOW: So, the president said he thinks, yes, that there will be a tax cut by the end of 2017. He's promised to do this, Ben, as you know in a deficit neutral way. How is he going to make that happen?

STEIN: Well, he can't make it happen. So --


HARLOW: You're supposed to say here's how. STEIN: Oh, I'm sorry. Here's how. No, he can't make it happen.

There's no way he can make it happen.

We are already running gigantic deficits. There's no way to make those deficits smaller. Well, I mean, well, he says he's not going to increase the deficit. If he's going to cut taxes, he would have to cut spending fantastically and he can't. There's just no way --

HARLOW: No, no, no. He said, but, Ben, the economy is going to grow 4 to 5 percent.

STEIN: I know. But that can't happen either. I mean, that's just -- this is just fantasy land.

I mean, this -- I like Trump. He's a very amusing and engaging fellow. I like that he tries to keep his promises, but we cannot even remotely be sure that the economy will grow by 4 or 5 percent.

HARLOW: But the economy did grow that much back in the early '90s. I know it's not the dotcom boom. But he's saying, look, I'm getting all these companies to keep jobs here. The stock market is at a record high. Is it totally out of the question, Ben, to see growth like that?

STEIN: Yes, it's totally out of the question. You're talking about a growth rate on this one is roughly 1.9 percent. You're talking about doubling and more than doubling the growth rate. That would be almost impossible.

As for the stock market, it has nothing to do with how big the economy grows, how fast it grows.

As to the jobs he saved, they are a tiny handful in a labor force over 100 million, he saved a few thousand. I mean, it's a joke to say he can do this in a revenue neutral world. It's a joke to say he can make the economy grow at 5 percent.

It might grow at 4 or 5 percent, it's possible. It won't be because of anything Mr. Trump did. Let's hope it does, but it won't be because of anything Mr. Trump did.

I mean, I love him. God bless him. He's got a gorgeous house but -- down there in Florida. But I just don't think he can make it happen. I mean, I'm sorry. I wish he could.

HARLOW: All right. But he is seeming to believe the Bureau of Labor Statistics numbers on the jobs reports which is a thing.


HARLOW: Hey, California is considering whether or not, as you know, your state, whether it can become a sanctuary state. This is something the president opposes. We heard him tell Bill O'Reilly that. He has threatened to pull funding from the state.

What's your reaction? STEIN: He can't possibly pull funding from the state. The state

would go broke without it. I do think the state of California is acting illegally in trying to make itself into a sanctuary state. The state of California is not in charge of immigration status. That's clearly unequivocally a federal government subject under the Constitution.

Governor Brown cannot just make up law. I mean, he's not god. He is not James Madison. He can't just make it up.

HARLOW: An executive order signed by the president on Friday that I don't think is getting its due attention, right? This is basically saying, hey, we as an administration are going to chip away at Dodd- Frank, at the financial, you know, reform put in place after the crisis to put a check on Wall Street.

[18:25:07] What's interesting is you would expect this from a Republican president following President Obama. What's interesting, Ben, is that this is coming from the guy who ran on an anti-Wall Street, I'm for the little guy platform. How do you square the two?

STEIN: I say if you believe that -- if you believe that it either candidate, either Mrs. Clinton or Mr. Trump really was going to go against the wishes of Goldman Sachs, you're ready to believe quite a lot and ready sell your big bridge connecting Manhattan and Brooklyn. Nobody ever goes against Wall Street. There's too much money there. Nobody ever goes against it.

HARLOW: I don't think --


HARLOW: Hey, Ben, then why did Dodd-Frank pass?

STEIN: Ahh, because -- ahh, that's a very good question, because at that point we had a red hot bunch of people in Congress who were revved up about it. It was before Mr. Obama had learned where the real power lay.

And by the way, by the way, he was pretty good on this subject. Dodd- Frank, though, has been a mistake because it has definitely, as Trump said, crippled lending. But in terms of generally wanting to have a check on investment banks on Wall Street, we do want --


HARLOW: So, let me ask you this --

STEIN: That was a different America.


HARLOW: So, you're saying this matters a lot for everyone. And it matters a lot for Main Street and small businesses, this lending and not feeling choked off from being able to get the money you need to run your businesses. What would make Dodd-Frank better then? Because, you know, a lot of folks would say, you don't want to repeal,

say, the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. That's something even his treasury secretary nominee, Mnuchin, wants to see stick around.

But you do want to increase the lending, especially for the small businesses from these smaller community banks. What makes Dodd-Frank better for more people?

STEIN: Dodd-Frank is not necessarily better for more people. What we need is a more detailed case by case analysis of lending. At present, Dodd-Frank lays down blanket restrictions on lending, which are very difficult for small and medium size business. They don't affect Ford Motor. They don't affect General Motors, but for small and medium size businesses, they are blanket restrictions.

We need to get case by case -- what you might say extreme vetting of borrowers so we don't have a giant blanket choking them all off. Case by case analysis, hire a few more people to go over loan by loan.

HARLOW: Ben Stein, nice to have you on. Thank you.

STEIN: Always a pleasure.

HARLOW: All right. And before we go to break, I want to let you know about something new that we're working on. My new podcast, "Boss Files", I sit down with successful business leaders and CEOs all around the world. We ask them, of course, about their successes, but also where they failed most and their lessons learned. And we dive into the critical issue of America's growing income gap and solutions to it. Season kicks off February the 16th. You can subscribe on iTunes, on Stitcher and tune in on Amazon Echo.

Still to come here for us tonight, Education Secretary nominee Betsy DeVos facing a big hurdle this week, a final Senate vote that could end up 50-50 with the vice president being forced to cast a rare tie- breaking vote. Next, a former Obama campaign adviser who is a staunch supporter of DeVos explains why he believes she is the right person for this job.


[18:31:24] POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: The stage is set for a showdown on Capitol Hill, one that will be watched by teachers and parents all across the country. Betsy DeVos, President Trump's pick for Education Secretary, facing a final Senate vote on Tuesday that could result in a 50-50 split, forcing Vice President Pence to cast a rare tie- breaking vote.

Two Republican senators breaking with their party, saying they cannot get on board with the President's nominee.


SEN. SUSAN COLLINS (R), MAINE: I will not, I cannot vote to confirm her as our nation's next Secretary of Education. SEN. LISA MURKOWSKI (R), ALASKA: I have heard from thousands, truly

thousands, of Alaskans who shared their concerns about Mrs. DeVos as Secretary of Education. They contacted me by phone, by e-mail, in person, and their concerns center, as mine do, on Mrs. DeVos' lack of experience with public education and the lack of knowledge that she portrayed in her confirmation hearings.


HARLOW: Joining me now is Kevin Chavous. He's the executive counsel for the American Federation for Children. He's a Democrat and a former Obama campaign adviser and a staunch supporter of Betsy DeVos.

So nice to have you on.


HARLOW: So let's go through some of the criticism and get your reaction here. This is not just the two senators you just heard from, the two Republicans. The Senate phone system was so swamped with calls opposing DeVos this past week, it almost crashed.

A concern for some is that she would be the first person to head this department in its more than 35-year history who has not either attended a public school or sent her own children to them. What do you say to those who believes she preaches escape from public schools instead of understanding them and working to improve them?

CHAVOUS: Well, first of all, Poppy, I do understand the hype around Betsy's nomination. I mean, she was appointed by President Trump, who really has been the most polarizing figure we've had in politics in many years, so so much of this is about him.

But with respect to the specific criticism, I think what's most important, and unfortunately that's been lost in the hype around her nomination, is having a Secretary of Education who cares about kids, cares about parent empowerment, and is a consensus builder. And she is all those things. And yes, there are some terrific public schools, but one of the most tragic things about the demonization of Betsy DeVos is this notion she wants to privatize public education. Nothing further. If they know her in person --

HARLOW: They look at Michigan, sir, as an example.

CHAVOUS: Yes, and let me tell you about Michigan. I mean, first of all, you know, you have 40 years of bad policies and bad leadership in the state. In fact, several years ago, 80 percent of the Black and White boys in Detroit were dropping out, out of school. You can't hang that on the head of one person.

So, yes, Betsy supported charter schools. She supported choice initiative. And then she also supported accountability measures, so much so that once it was passed, over 100 charter schools did close. So I think there's been a whole lot of this hype really promoted by the status quo because they really don't want change. HARLOW: So let's play some of the concern from some of the senators

during her confirmation hearings. Rising student loan debt, this a huge issue facing a lot of Americans and a lot of families and the Department of Ed. Listen to this exchange between Betsy DeVos and Senator Elizabeth Warren.


SEN. ELIZABETH WARREN (D), MASSACHUSETTS: Mrs. DeVos, have you ever taken out a student loan from the federal government to help pay for college?


WARREN: Have any of your children had to borrow money in order to go to college?

DEVOS: They have been fortunate not to.

WARREN: Uh-huh. Have you had any personal experience with the Pell Grant?

DEVOS: Not personal experience, but certainly, friends and students with whom I've worked have had.

WARREN: So you have no personal experience with college financial aid or management of higher education.


HARLOW: OK. And obviously, she comes from a very wealthy family, and no one should hold that against her. She hasn't had to take loans. Her kids haven't had to take loans. But she also would be one of the few secretaries without any experience being a teacher or running a school system. Does that concern you at all?

CHAVOUS: No, and let me tell you why, Poppy. So much of this -- I mean, the Senate here, they play a lot of got you. I know that game, where it's answer yes or no, and they really don't want to have real conversation about her views. They really want to put questions out there to catch her and make her look bad. I mean, that's the nature of it. Both parties do it well.

But I don't have concern about that, and you know why? Because most of the opposition is centered around the fact that she really is promoting change. But guess what? The union and status quo, they came out strong against Arne Duncan and John King. John King's vote, Obama's last Education Secretary, was 49 to 40.

So anyone who talks about doing it differently, they are going to come after. And so, yes, I suspect that she would have answered questions differently if asked today, but the thing I'm most focused on, knowing her, is that she cares about kids. She believes in public education, but she also believes in making sure we give a lifeline to those kids we know are going to drop out tomorrow's school. Every 42 seconds, a kid drops out of school in America.


CHAVOUS: And I'm not OK with that, and neither is Betsy.

HARLOW: Yes, no one should be. It's a stunning statistic and a troubling statistic. Look, whoever holds the job, let's hope they do what is best for the children of this country. Kevin Chavous, it's nice to have you on.

CHAVOUS: Thank you it, Poppy. Appreciate it.

HARLOW: Thank you so much.

Coming up for us, it's business as usual at the nation's airports this weekend. Immigrants arriving as if the President's travel ban did not happen. The question now is in the hands of the courts because it is, for how long will it stay this way?

The next few days, we'll see legal challenges that will likely go all the way up to the Supreme Court. We'll have our legal experts on to debate it, next.


[18:41:00] HARLOW: The stay on President Trump's travel ban preventing those from seven Muslim majority countries from entering the United States is still in place for now. Early this morning, the Justice Department asked a federal appeals court to immediately reinstate that ban. The court did not do that.

Let's talk about where this fight goes from here. With me, law professor, Rory Little of the U.C. Hastings College of Law and CNN legal analyst and criminal defense attorney, Danny Cevallos.

Gentlemen, thank you for being here. Professor, let me begin with you because we're talking about two states that brought this originally -- Washington and Minnesota. And they say that this ban will do irreparable damage to their citizens.

Here's what the administration says in their emergency motion, quote, "Courts are particularly ill-equipped to second-guess the President's perspective judgment about future risks. Unlike the President, courts do not have access to classified information about the threat posed by terrorist organizations operating in particular nations."

How strong is that argument? I mean, they basically said, look, the courts, you don't have the classified information the President has so you can't make this call.

RORY LITTLE, PROFESSOR OF LAW, U.C. HASTINGS COLLEGE OF LAW: Well, I think there's two problems with it. I mean, it's not a bad argument, but first of all, the court below did not make any second-guessing about risks of terrorism. That court simply said there's other claims here that I need to think about. And second, why there's irreparable harm to the government from a three-day or four-day stay is sort of unclear.

HARLOW: Danny, how do you see it?

DANNY CEVALLOS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, in this case, you know, the lower court's opinion, it really does not have a lot of discussion about the merits of the plaintiffs' arguments. It recites the applicable standard for a temporary restraining order and simply concludes that there's irreparable harm, so it could go either way at the 9th Circuit.

HARLOW: So this will, Professor, very likely go to the Supreme Court. And you know what they'll be looking at in the law here is, first of all, statute 1182 on immigration, which gives the President sort of wide discretion when it comes to issues of immigration. But also, they have to look at the establishment clause and they have to look at the part of U.S. law that states that you cannot discriminate who can come into this country and refugees especially based on their nation of origin.

LITTLE: Well, that's absolutely right, but remember, this is just a stay. In other words, the merits are still with the court in Seattle and a number of other courts around the country. The Court of Appeals is simply going to be looking at, should we allow a stay to be in place while that process is unfolding? And the Supreme Court right now is very likely divided, 4 to 4.

HARLOW: Right.

LITTLE: Which means the Circuit Court opinion is probably the most important moment.

HARLOW: Danny, how does this complicate things for Judge Gorsuch, who will be facing these confirmation hearings in about six weeks? I mean, he's going to be asked about this.

CEVALLOS: It complicates things for him because this is going to be a major question, and it has the potential, as the Professor mentioned with the 4-4 split, of having -- remember, if there's a 4-4 split, the lower court appellate ruling stands. And if you have such a big circuit split, if by then you have more circuits that have been added to the split, then you have a bit of a constitutional crisis. So this will be a critical question for the nominated justice to be.

HARLOW: Gentlemen, thank you very much. I have a feeling I'm going to be seeing a lot more of you on our air in the days to come. We appreciate it.

Much more for us ahead after the break. But first, CNN's Cristina Alesci has this week's "BEFORE THE BELL."

Hi, Cristina.

CRISTINA ALESCI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Poppy. Investors are watching to see if the Trump rally picks up this week. Remember, stocks rose on Friday after a strong jobs report coupled with President Trump's plan to cut taxes and regulation. Now, tax reform is really key here. That's something that Wall Street

is eagerly awaiting. You saw stocks actually tumble early last week when the topic seemed to move off the front burner.

[18:45:00] Now, as far as this week is concerned, look for corporate earnings. That's going to help set the tone. General Motors, Disney, Twitter are among the companies reporting.

And now, we're about halfway through the earnings season and the results have been pretty decent. So far 65 percent of the S&P 500 companies have actually beaten profit estimates, and 52 percent have topped sales estimates. The current quarter could be a real test, though. The markets are anticipating double-digit earnings growth for the first quarter of 2017. Poppy.

HARLOW: Cristina, thank you. You will be on top of all of it for us this week, I know. We have much more ahead for us, live in the CNN NEWSROOM. Stay with us. Back in a moment.


HARLOW: Welcome back, now "Impact Your World." Lead exposure has affected families in Flint, Michigan. Now, one organization is raising money to help all of those impacted by the Flint water crisis.

Here's our Chris Cuomo with this week's "Impact Your World."


CHRIS CUOMO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Many people may have forgotten about the Flint water crisis. But for families like Lee- Anne Walters, her twin boys are a daily reminder of the effects of lead poisoning.

[18:50:02] LEE-ANNE WALTERS, SONS POISONED BY LEAD: They both have hand-eye coordination issues, and their speech is severely impaired. And they're being retaught all these things now.

CUOMO: Walters says people can't even tell her sons are twins anymore.

WALTERS: Gavin's not growing properly. He's 39 pounds and almost 6 years old.

CUOMO: But it's not just the physical and developmental effects. There's also an enormous emotional toll.

WALTERS: It clicked in their little heads, OK, we were poisoned, but are we going to die?

CUOMO: Kathi Horton is one of the leaders of the Flint Child Health and Development Fund. It focuses on the short and long-term needs of the city's children exposed to lead.

KATHI HORTON, PRESIDENT, COMMUNITY FOUNDATION OF GREATER FLINT: We have committed to raising money over the next 10 to 20 years to follow these children into adult hood because sometimes it takes years for the impact of lead exposure to manifest itself.

CUOMO: The Walters family still relies on bottled water for everything -- drinking, cooking, baths. Walters says they use about 10 cases of water a day.

WALTERS: What's happened to my children, to the children in my community, it's taken away their innocence. That's not OK. That's not something they can get back.



[18:55:07] JOHN BERMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Poppy, you know the only thing better than New England Patriots Super Bowl victory will be launching a brand new CNN show with you, Monday morning, 9:00 a.m. I could not humanly be more excited. I promise to get in early and to wear a tie.

Now, while I get to win because I get you beside me, there is a group of people who lose a little something here, and this is your weekend team that adores you. They've been with you since 2015, and they put together some of their favorite moments from over the last two years.



HARLOW: I'm Poppy Harlow in New York.

I'm Poppy Harlow in New York.

I'm Poppy Harlow in New York.


HARLOW: I hope you guys have the tap out in here.


HARLOW: Top of the hour, you are live in the CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Poppy Harlow in New York, so good to be with you.

What a week it will be. Welcome to Cleveland, everyone. In just two days, this city will play host to one of the biggest political events of the year, the Republican National Convention.

All right, top of the hour, 5:00 Eastern. I'm Poppy Harlow, live today in Philadelphia. You are watching CNN's special live coverage of the Democratic National Convention.

Hi, everyone, I'm Poppy Harlow.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Jake Tapper. We're joining you live from the Ben Franklin Parkway in beautiful Philadelphia. We're continuing coverage of Pope Francis' visit. HARLOW: I'm Poppy Harlow, 5:00 Eastern. Thank you so much for being

with me. We begin with breaking news this hour, just in to us at CNN.

Good evening, everyone. We want to welcome our viewers here in the United States and around the world. I am Poppy Harlow, joining you live from Paris with our special coverage of the terror attacks that have triggered a state of emergency throughout this country.

Hello, everyone. I'm Poppy Harlow, joining you live from Paris tonight. It is 9:00 in the evening. We want to welcome our viewers in the United States and around the world. We begin tonight in Brussels. It is a city on lockdown because of the, quote, "serious and imminent possibility of a Paris-style terror attack."

Welcome to our breaking news coverage of what has become an epic storm up and down the eastern seaboard. It is 3:00 here on the East Coast. I'm Poppy Harlow, joining you live from New York City.

You call gang involvement the lethal absence of hope.


HARLOW: What is that?

BOYLE: You know, not all choices are created equal.

HARLOW: One in five American children now rely on food stamps. Your kids are among them?

MERCEDES VELASCO, NORTH BRIDGEPORT, CONNECTICUT: Yes, food stamps is very helpful right now. It's a necessity. Being a woman with four kids, you have to be strong.

HARLOW: How can the city turn around if that doesn't get fixed fast? Can the people of Flint today, as we sit here, can they drink the water?

Now, the company has increased maternity leave from 12 weeks to 18 weeks paid for mothers. Fathers get up to 12 weeks paid.


HARLOW: I usually don't have a drink before 9:00. Usually only after 9:00.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Should we bring in the surprise right now?

HARLOW: We have a surprise for you.

LEMON: Come on. Come on in.

HARLOW: The light of my 2016.

LEMON: Besides me.

HARLOW: Not only my awesome husband, but our little nugget, Sienna. Hey, baby! Hey, baby!


HARLOW: Oh. Thank you, guys. What I love about this show is that they've let me bring my voice to it every weekend and tell stories that we all, as a team, think are really important and that we want you to hear. So thank you, guys, for that.

Here was my surprise to you. Before we go tonight, a personal note and a big thank you to all of you for spending your weekend evenings with us over the past few years. It has been an absolute joy for me.

And an immense thank you to these amazing people, my incredible team. They worked tirelessly to bring you this show. They are the muscle behind this program. They are talented. They are witty, fun, funny, but most importantly, they are kind. I will deeply miss spending each weekend as part of this team.

Starting tomorrow morning, I get to sit next to this guy, five days a week. And that is a pretty great gift. If you know John Berman or if you've ever watched him, you know there is no one like him. There is no one better than him.

So we really hope that you start your day with us from 9:00 to 11:00 a.m. Eastern, each morning, beginning tomorrow. And if you want Berman to show up smiling for our first show tomorrow, like that, with his Patriots' jersey, you better hope the Pats win point.

[19:00:03] Thank you all for everything. It's been a joy. Good night. Enjoy the game.