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Peter Navarro is Interviewed about the Jobs Numbers and White House News; Supreme Court to Hear Abortion Case; Ukraine To Review Investigations. Aired 9:30-10a ET
Aired October 04, 2019 - 09:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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[09:33:18]
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: This morning, my colleagues Gloria Borger, Jeremy Diamond, and I learning new details about President Trump promising the president of China that he would remain silent on pro- democracy protests in Hong Kong while the U.S. and China continue their trade talks.
As you know, widespread demonstrations have continued for months in Hong Kong, with some leading to violent clashes between protesters and police. One of those protesters shot in the chest just days ago by a police officer.
Joining me now, Peter Navarro, he's the director of the White House Office of Trade and Manufacturing Policy.
Before we get to those bigger issue, of course some big economic numbers out today, 136,000 jobs in September, a bit below the 145 that was expected, what does this indicate for the strength of the economy?
PETER NAVARRO, DIRECTOR, WHITE HOUSE OFFICE OF TRADE AND MANUFACTURING POLICY: You buried the lead, Jim, 3.5 percent unemployment rate --
SCIUTTO: A 3.5 unemployment rate, yes.
NAVARRO: The lowest --
SCIUTTO: In 50 years.
NAVARRO: Since we've put a man on the moon.
It was a -- it's a good number.
Here's the way to think about this. In order to maintain the unemployment rate where it is each month, we have to generate 95,000 jobs. So anything above that's gravy. So now we're at 3.5 percent. It's a beautiful thing. And every American who wants a job can get a job. And there's jobs begging out there to be filled. So --
SCIUTTO: OK. NAVARRO: The thing is, though, I want to make this point, which is
really important. This number, even though it's a very good number, should not deter the Federal Reserve from aggressively lowering their rates for one simple reason, not because the economy is slowing down, but because our dollar is so overvalued it's killing our exports.
SCIUTTO: OK, let's --
NAVARRO: And that's hurting manufacturing.
SCIUTTO: Let's get to that.
Job numbers, a good figure this week.
NAVARRO: A very good number.
SCIUTTO: Manufacturing number, you know, for the first time since 2009, indicating a contraction, that based on the Institute of Supply Management survey. Service sector as well growing at its weakest point in three years.
[09:35:06]
Is that an indication to you that the trade war is weighing on the economy?
NAVARRO: No, not at all. It's an indication to me that the Federal Reserve policy with the overvalued dollar is hurting our exports.
SCIUTTO: Well, it's not just that because you know the manufacturers also point to the trade tensions.
NAVARRO: Hang on, we -- we know that -- we know that from the data last -- the Q2 data was -- exports were down like two-thirds of a point.
On the ISM, I love that indicator, but there's a better one now, a more modern one, the market PMI. Basically it measures more domestic manufacturing and it was above 50. So, bottom line is like 3.5 percent unemployment. This economy's hitting on all cylinders. There's going to be some months where manufacturing is lower than others. Construction was strong. Transportation was strong, which is encouraging because that's a leading indicator.
This -- this economy, under the Trump tax cuts, deregulation, cheap energy and trade reform is a great thing.
SCIUTTO: OK, I want to get you to some -- to some international issues here. As you heard, we have new reporting this morning that President Trump, in a phone call with President Xi in June of this year, promised the Chinese president that he would stay silent on protests in Hong Kong while the trade talks continue. That's a remarkable position for a U.S. president to take considering our historic support for human rights and democracy. Hold on --
NAVARRO: You assert -- you assert that as a fact, though. And I read that story carefully. And, Jim, from a journalistic point of view --
SCIUTTO: Are you denying that the president made that -- that -- that promise?
NAVARRO: Hang on. Hang on. Hang on. Hang on. I wasn't privy to that phone call. But here's what I do know. That story had, what, sources, what, familiar with the thing. I -- who are these people? This is -- this is the issue.
SCIUTTO: Well, I know, but the frequent -- it's a frequent point to go to the sources.
We've spoken -- we've spoken to multiple sources.
NAVARRO: No, no. No, no, but it's --
SCIUTTO: And, by the way, the president's public comments --
NAVARRO: Yes.
SCIUTTO: After that call, he give China a pass.
NAVARRO: You can assert this.
SCIUTTO: He give China a pass on this.
NAVARRO: No, no, no. No.
SCIUTTO: He said it was an internal issue.
NAVARRO: You assert that, OK, but that's not a fact in evidence. That's based on anonymous sources who want to hurt this president.
SCIUTTO: We also -- we also spoke -- no, we also spoke -- we also spoke to the -- we spoke to people involved in the follow-up to this.
NAVARRO: Jim, Jim, that was bad journalism.
SCIUTTO: Let me give you an example.
NAVARRO: I read through that whole story.
SCIUTTO: That's not bad journalism.
NAVARRO: It was one assertion of fact after another, without sourcing.
SCIUTTO: We spoke to Kurt Kong (ph). We spoke to the U.S. Council for Hong Kong, who was told twice not to give speeches on Hong Kong --
NAVARRO: You had -- by whom? By whom?
SCIUTTO: By Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, following this order from the White House.
NAVARRO: Who facts in -- (INAUDIBLE) facts in evidence.
SCIUTTO: It's in the story.
NAVARRO: I read your story, Jim. My point is that you get two anonymous sources, right, who are these people?
SCIUTTO: Well, do you -- do you have contradictory evidence on the president making this pledge?
NAVARRO: Who are these people?
See, here's the thing. The media can't just right these -- these news stories based on anonymous sources and then expect the White House to confirm or deny. That's a game we won't play.
SCIUTTO: I could -- I could --
NAVARRO: U.S. -- the president --
I could list to you the number of stories that the news media broke that were later confirmed by public information.
NAVARRO: The only thing the president has said -- the only thing the -- the only thing --
SCIUTTO: Or, for instance, what we're seeing Kurt Volker say on The Hill now about text messages indicating --
NAVARRO: The only thing the president has said publicly, he said it repeatedly on Hong Kong, that he hopes that there will be a peaceful resolution, and he's very aware of the situation.
SCIUTTO: But, Peter --
NAVARRO: I've spoken publicly on this, that it's capitalism and freedom, battling communism, in the streets of Hong Kong.
SCIUTTO: I'm just surprised you -- I'm surprised you would take this position, because you, for instance, you said on Fox News --
NAVARRO: No, no, but you assert a fact that -- not an evidence.
SCIUTTO: You said --
NAVARRO: I will -- I will not sit here on the set of CNN and let you --
SCIUTTO: Well, you don't have contradictory evidence and we spoke to multiple officials.
NAVARRO: Yes, but you can't -- you don't have the fact in evidence.
SCIUTTO: Hmm?
NAVARRO: You can't assert that, Jim, based on anonymous sources. You just can't do that.
SCIUTTO: We spoke with sources with direct knowledge. NAVARRO: CNN has to stop doing that.
SCIUTTO: And I know that's a frequent -- I know that's a frequent -- I know that's a frequent or safe place for you to go.
NAVARRO: You guys got to stop doing that because -- because I know -- I know that --
SCIUTTO: Let me ask you this. You said on Fox Business --
NAVARRO: Hang on.
SCIUTTO: You praised Fox Business for covering the Hong Kong protests, as CNN has done. As CNN has done.
NAVARRO: I praised Maria Bartiromo, Lou Dobbs and Chris Reagan.
SCIUTTO: Are you disappointed the president -- are you disappointed the president hasn't made a public statement in support of the Hong Kong protests then?
NAVARRO: No, you're assuming -- you're assuming the fact not in evidence. He has said very --
SCIUTTO: Has the president made a public statement (INAUDIBLE)?
NAVARRO: He said very clearly that he wants a peaceful resolution to that.
SCIUTTO: He said it was an internal issue and he encouraged -- he encouraged both sides to refrain from --
NAVARRO: So -- so what's the point here, Jim?
SCIUTTO: I'm asking you, are you disappointed the president hasn't made a public statement in support of the -- of the protests?
NAVARRO: I'm never disappointed in my president. I'm never disappointed in my president.
SCIUTTO: OK.
When you heard the president yesterday call on China to investigate an American, you and I have spoken multiple times about how China breaks international law.
NAVARRO: I'm not here --
SCIUTTO: Well, is it OK for a U.S. president --
NAVARRO: Is this like -- is this like an interrogation here?
SCIUTTO: Is it OK --
NAVARRO: It's like I -- I feel like I'm in like Adam Schiff is sitting in front of me. And, by the way --
SCIUTTO: I'm a journalist. I ask questions of Democrats and Republicans every day.
NAVARRO: As -- I understand, but -- but -- but this is like an interrogation, right.
SCIUTTO: It's an interview.
NAVARRO: So here's the thing. Here's the thing. This is witch hunt part two, OK. I've had three -- I've sat here for three years --
SCIUTTO: The president said on the White House lawn yesterday, authoritarian China should -- should investigate an American.
NAVARRO: Can -- can I finish?
SCIUTTO: You have told me many times --
NAVARRO: Can I finish?
SCIUTTO: That China breaks international law.
Is it acceptable for a U.S. president to investigate an American?
NAVARRO: Do you want me -- do I get a chance to talk here?
SCIUTTO: I've asked the question. Time for you to answer.
NAVARRO: OK. So my point here is, I've been in this town now for three years.
[09:40:00]
We went through witch hunt part one for two and a half years. Adam Schiff, sociopath, looked you in the eye and the American people in the eye and said irrefutable evidence of a Russia hoax.
SCIUTTO: The president said on the White House lawn yesterday. It's not a secret.
NAVARRO: Now -- hang on. Let me just finish. You had -- you had your hectoring.
Now we have Adam Schiff saying that he doesn't know the whistleblower and everything. Now we find it was --
SCIUTTO: I'm asking you what the president said. I know that Adam Schiff has become a talking point for Republicans. The president said on the White House lawn yesterday, China should investigate an American.
NAVARRO: My point -- my point is a simple one, if you want to -- you talk to the president about this. What I'm telling you is that this is a witch hunt that's hurting the American people. I mean we have 3.5 percent unemployment rate. Impeach that.
SCIUTTO: Peter, you and I have talked about how China is a bad actor repeatedly.
NAVARRO: And we agree on that, right?
SCIUTTO: And you have I have both covered China -- we've covered China for years.
NAVARRO: And -- and would you -- would you grant me a fact that this president is the greatest president in history standing up to China?
SCIUTTO: No.
NAVARRO: Standing up to China.
SCIUTTO: Listen, I --
NAVARRO: Who else has stood up to China, Jim?
SCIUTTO: I have -- I have said --
NAVARRO: Would you -- would you admit that?
SCIUTTO: I have -- I have said publically that the president confronting China on trade of course is an issue. I'm just asking you --
NAVARRO: I -- the woman who was sitting in this chair -- the woman that was sitting in this chair says that the president's standing up to China for something other than the American people? I mean how ridiculous is that?
SCIUTTO: Before we go -- before we go, well, someone like you has called out China for breaking the law, will you -- will you comment at all on your president calling on authoritarian China to investigate an American citizen?
NAVARRO: No, I -- look, this is a --
SCIUTTO: You'll -- you'll let that stand?
NAVARRO: This is a witch hunt. No, I'm not letting it stand. I just -- I don't want to go into this. It's like, this is the problem here. We've got a great economy. This president is doing a great job and all you guys want to do is drag him down into some mud. It's -- with anonymous sources. Who are these anonymous sources, Jim? How come you never have them on the set? I'm here.
SCIUTTO: Do you have any contradictory information that the president made this pledge to the Chinese president?
NAVARRO: I was not -- I was not privy to that call, but what I can tell you is this.
SCIUTTO: Have you ever raised investigating Joe Biden with China during trade negotiations?
NAVARRO: What I can -- what I can tell you -- what I can tell you is this. Can I tell you this?
SCIUTTO: OK.
NAVARRO: OK. I've read probably over 100 stories in three years which were based on anonymous sources, which simply had fake news in them, and inaccurate information. So I -- I -- I saw that story break last night and I thought it was irresponsible journalism.
SCIUTTO: When we have longer time, we can go through the number of stories that were factual.
NAVARRO: I urge everybody to go read that story and see how many times you can find an actual source in there.
SCIUTTO: Have you ever raised investigating Joe Biden or his son during your contacts with Chinese officials?
NAVARRO: Me, personally?
SCIUTTO: Yes.
NAVARRO: Now, here's the thing, I will never talk about what happens inside the White House, OK? Not confirm or deny. Because that's the slippery slope.
SCIUTTO: OK.
NAVARRO: Let me ask you this, Jim. We know --
SCIUTTO: You won't -- you won't pledge that you didn't raise investigating a political opponent?
NAVARRO: Hang on. Hang on. Let me ask you this. Let me ask you this. No, see -- let me ask you this.
How is it that a U.S. president, going forward is ever going to be able to have a candid conversation with a foreign leader about any sensitive matter if the jackals are always wanting to get things revealed? You guys want every transcript revealed of everything. And, by the way, the president putting stuff --
SCIUTTO: Apparently the president's own advisers --
NAVARRO: The president putting stuff in a secure server now, based on all of the leaks that have come from that White House, I'd put everything in a secure server at this point.
SCIUTTO: Well, just before we go, just give me the opportunity, have you ever raised investigating Joe Biden or his son in Chinese negotiations?
NAVARRO: Have you ever -- have you ever given me a source that's other than anonymous for any of this crap? SCIUTTO: Listen --
NAVARRO: That's what I want to know, OK?
SCIUTTO: Read the story and tell me if you have contradictory information.
NAVARRO: A 3.5 percent unemployment rate. Impeach that. OK?
SCIUTTO: I'll give it up -- if you have contradictory information about Trump making that pledge, you're welcome back on the show any time.
NAVARRO: Yes, but what I'm asking you is like, stop writing these irresponsible stories that are single sourced from anonymous people.
SCIUTTO: Do you not single source, multiple sourced --
NAVARRO: Two sources, two anonymous sources that -- that have an axe to grind --
SCIUTTO: Peter, listen, it's always good to have you on.
NAVARRO: It's fun. All right.
SCIUTTO: When you have an answer to the questions, as opposed to attacking reporting, we'll welcome you back.
NAVARRO: I am -- I am answering the questions that I think are appropriate, Jim.
SCIUTTO: We'll welcome you back.
All right, appreciate you taking the time.
NAVARRO: You bet.
SCIUTTO: We'll be right back.
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[09:48:43]
SCIUTTO: Breaking news.
The U.S. Supreme Court has agreed to take on a controversial case involving abortion.
CNN justice correspondent Jessica Schneider, she's with me now.
Jessica, tell us what this case is, and what it could mean potentially.
JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, that is -- those are the big implications here, Jim. This is an abortion case that will be heard from the Supreme Court during the height of the 2020 election, and a decision on this would likely come down in June, just months before the 2020 election.
This is an abortion case that concerns a law out of Louisiana, and this law out of Louisiana requires that doctors have admitting privileges at hospitals within 30 miles of where an abortion is performed. The critics of this law have said that it's not necessary, it's not medically necessary, and that it would leave open in Louisiana only one abortion clinic if this law were to go into effect.
So this is actually the first abortion case that this court will hear since Justice Kavanaugh joined the bench just about a year ago making it a solidly conservative court here. And, of course, anti-abortion activists have been pushing these laws in states around the country to really force this issue to go before the Supreme Court to perhaps force the Supreme Court to reconsider its decision in Roe v. Wade back in the 1970s. So this is a crucial issue here.
[09:50:04]
What's interesting will be to watch the balance of the court here because this issue came before the court, Jim, in February and the Supreme Court actually put a hold on this law. It is not currently in effect. And Chief Justice John Roberts joined with the liberals, putting a hold on this law.
But the big question is, how will the chief justice come down on the merits of this case when the Supreme Court actually has to decide the entire case here. A lot of anti -- you know, pro-choice rights groups are fearful that the chief justice will in fact side with the conserves here.
SCIUTTO: Yes.
SCHNEIDER: So it's a lot at play at a very heightened time right before the to 2020 election.
Jim.
SCIUTTO: It's a major test. It would leaving another state with very few or even a single clinic that performs abortions.
SCHNEIDER: That's right. Just one.
SCIUTTO: We will stay on top of it. Jessica Schneider, thanks very much.
This just moments ago on Capitol Hill. This is Michael Atkinson. He is the inspector general for the office of the director of national intelligence, arriving for his closed door testimony on Capitol Hill. Of course this about the whistleblower complaint regarding the president's interactions with Ukraine. A story we're going to continue to cover. We'll give you updates as we hear more.
Meanwhile, Ukraine's prosecutor general today said the country will review all high profile cases handled by the previous prosecutor general. And that, crucially, could include the investigation of a natural gas company linked to Joe Biden's son Hunter. Of course, this comes as explosive new text messages show that U.S.
diplomats pressured Ukraine to investigate the Bidens, even though there was no evidence of any wrongdoing by either man. The prosecutor general says he's just trying to uphold the country's rule of law, not to grant political favors to the U.S.
Our senior international correspondent Sam Kiley, he was at that news conference this morning. He joins me now from Kiev.
And, Sam, there's an impression here that perhaps the pressure worked. That now Ukraine is doing what the Trump administration wanted. Is that what you're hearing on the ground there?
SAM KILEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think, Jim, to be fair to the Ukrainians, they insist that they've got a war on. Remember that the east of this country has been carve off effectively by rebels backed by Russia. Russian troops have invaded periodically. And that is their focus. They see this as very much a distraction.
But I did put it directly to the prosecutor general this morning. I asked him what his reaction was to Donald Trump's demands yesterday that the Bidens should be investigated. And this is how he responded, Jim.
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RUSLAN RIABOSHAPKA, PROSECUTOR GENERAL FOR UKRAINE (through translator): My reaction is calm and professional. The prosecutor office is outside of politics. We will audit and review all historical cases delivered by the previous prosecutor office. If we find that some decisions were illegal, we will review those cases.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KILEY: Now essentially what he's saying there, Jim is, yes, we're reviewing all of the corruption cases that relate to this office. And that may well include some cases that -- to which the Biden family may be connected, but they are not caving in, from their perspective, to any pressure coming out of D.C.
Jim.
SCIUTTO: Sam Kiley on the ground there. We know we'll continue to follow it.
And we'll be right back with more.
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[09:58:03]
SCIUTTO: Well, this morning, President Trump, again, taking shots at the whistleblower who claims the president used his power to pressure the Ukrainian president into investigating the Bidens. Earlier in hour, President Trump tweeted, quote, the whistleblower who had the facts wrong about the phone call reached out and more to the Democrat controlled House Intelligence Committee. Schiff never told us about this.
Remember, this is a government employee, formally expressing his or her concern about how the president was using his power. Part of that complaint reads, and we're quoting, in the course of my official duties, I have received information from multiple U.S. government officials that the president of the United States is using the power of his office to solicit interference from a foreign country in the 2020 U.S. election. This interference includes, among other things, pressuring a foreign country to investigate one of the president's main domestic political rivals. The president's personal lawyer, Mr. Rudolph Giuliani, is a central figure in this effort.
Any of that sound familiar from what you've learned the last few days. So we wanted to know how this statement and the newly released texts align. We're not 100 percent sure, but this much appear clears, the texts offer a glimpse into some of those complaints, allegations.
One text from former special envoy to Ukraine, Kurt Volker, to the U.S. ambassador to the EU, Gordon Sondland, reads, had breakfast with Rudy this morning -- presumably, of course, Rudy Giuliani -- teeing up call with Yarmak Monday -- he's the Ukrainian presidential adviser. The text continues, quote, must have helped. Most important is for Zelensky to say that he will help investigation and address specific personnel issue if there are any.
Here's another text from Volker. This time to Yarmak, that Ukrainian official.
Heard from the White House. Assuming President Z convinces Trump he will investigate, get to the bottom of what happened in 2016. We will nail down for visit to Washington.
Look at that connection there.
While both of these texts seemingly align with what the whistleblower learned from government officials, now we have to wait and see if they're exactly the same. That's certainly going to be the subject of questioning on The Hill today.
[10:00:04]
Well that was really --
A very good.
END
