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Ex-Trump Adviser: No One Left in White House Willing to Stand Up to Trump; Trump Official Who Advised about Nuking Afghanistan Now at State Department; "Free, Melania" Offers New Details about Private 1st Lady; Police: Passenger Faked Illness to Get Better Seat on Flight. Aired 2:30-3p ET
Aired December 02, 2019 - 14:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[14:30:00]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GARY COHN, FORMER CHIEF ECONOMIC ADVISOR TO PRESIDENT TRUMP (voice- over): So I am concerned that the atmosphere in the White House is no longer conducive or no one has the personality to stand up and tell the president what he doesn't want to hear.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: What did you think of that, David, because he's not the first former administration official to say something like that. We've heard something similar from former Chief of Staff Kelly.
DAVID AXELROD, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR & CNN HOST, "AXE FILES": Yes, and that's what prompted him to give that answer, because I asked him about what Kelly said. Kelly told the president, if you get a yes person in here, you're going to get impeached. In fact, that's what happened then. So Cohn was really adding to that argument. So I was struck by that.
He described himself and some others in the White House as kind of guardrails that prevented the president from doing bad things,, doing things that are unwise.
But I also thought, as I listened to him, I asked him, you signed up knowing he was against trade, he was against immigration, he was skeptical about climate change. These were three of your big issues. He said, I thought I could persuade him.
What strikes me, a lot of these people around the president thought they could prevail with their views over the views that he espoused in the campaign.
And so the president's supporters would argue, yes, he -- you have the globalists in there, who are trying to manipulate policy, and the president threw him out. And he's in control of his own agenda. And his agenda projects his priorities and not their priorities. And there's something to that.
Whether those priorities are the right priorities for the country is another question.
KEILAR: I want to listen to this other part of your interview with Gary Cohn. He was pretty candid about his relationship with the president.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COHEN (voice-over): I thought I could potentially sway him.
AXELROD (voice-over): Yes.
COHN: And I know, historically, sometimes what you run on is not exactly what you mean when you come to govern. In my mind, having a seat on the inside, and trying to influence was better than being on the outside and trying to get to a more positive outcome on climate, on trade, on immigration.
I come from a fact-based world. If I can show you facts and I can show you reality, that's supposed to win the day. I went in overly prepared with factual analysis and, in many respects, it may not have ended up where I wanted it to end up. But he's the ultimate decision maker.
AXELROD: Yes.
COHEN: I'm supposed to do my job and make sure that he understands the impact of that decision.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: That speaks to what you were saying before. He thought he could sway the president. In retrospect, that was something that was very difficult --
(CROSSTALK)
AXELROD: What's interesting, he leaned into it, Brianna, he leaned to the facts -- I come from a fact-based world there.
KEILAR: Yes.
AXELROD: He basically said, I gave him the facts, he decided on another basis. But at least I told him what the ramifications were of making those decisions.
And so, you really got to kind of window into how the White House was operating at that time and how it may be operating now, and people aren't going in and making factual arguments to the president about how his whims may play out.
He is more in control of his own ship here, but where that ship is headed is a big question.
KEILAR: It is -- it's almost a stunning interview to listen to. So I'm -- we're all looking forward to check the entire thing out, David.
AXELROD: Thanks.
KEILAR: Thank you so much, David Axelrod.
AXELROD: Thanks, Brianna.
KEILAR: There's a new gig for a controversial Trump adviser. The administration official who once suggested dropping nuclear bombs on Afghanistan is now at the State Department.
[14:33:51]
Plus, new reporting on how first lady, Melania Trump, and the president spend time in the White House, including when they're apart.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KEILAR: A former conservative radio host, who promoted fringe conspiracy theories and even suggested dropping nuclear bombs on Afghanistan, is now working as a senior adviser in the State Department in the Arms Control Bureau. These new details about Frank Wuco were first reported in the "Washington Post."
And we have Kylie Atwood with us, our CNN national security reporter.
Tell us exactly what Wuco did, what did he say, when did he say this?
KYLIE ATWOOD, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER: Frank Wuco was at DHS. Now he's at the State Department as a senior adviser in the Arm's Control Bureau.
The problem is he has an impressive resume in some sense. He was a naval intelligence officer. He had a conservative radio talk show. He has made comments, as you said, about dropping nuclear weapons on Afghanistan. And the thing is, now he's at the State Department as a senior adviser in the exact bureau that works on those things.
He made those comments in 2016. He said after 9/11, he would have been supportive of dropping nuclear weapons on Afghanistan to send a message that they messed up.
He is also someone who has made a number of conspiracy theory statements and promoted those statements. We don't even want to get into the nitty-gritty on that, because they're debunked theories.
He's a senior official at the State Department traveling with them on a number of trips. We know exactly when he started there officially. But he is there and he is working to essentially control the arms of the United States.
[14:40:08]
KEILAR: It's interesting that he has this job at the State Department. We should keep in mind this is a president who has talked about wiping Afghanistan off the face of the earth.
ATWOOD: Exactly. KEILAR: But did anyone question whether he was suitable for this? Were they fully aware of his positions?
ATWOOD: The State Department hasn't gotten back to us with any comment with regard to questions about when he started there, what the vetting process looked like.
But when a number of these comments came out when he joined DHS previously in this administration, they said they were cherry picked comments that he had made, and they didn't give a full breath of the picture of the person that he was.
But the other thing to consider here is, nuclear arms in this administration, are sort of at this pivotal moment, because New START, which is one of the arms control freezes between the U.S. and Russia for all of their nuclear weapons, is set to expire in 2021.
Next year is a huge year for the Trump administration in charting a path forehead in terms of, if they're going to continue with that treaty or move away from it.
KEILAR: Kylie, thank you so much. Kylie Atwood.
There are new details now that we're looking at about the first lady, Melania Trump. Still a bit of a mystery. But a new book uncovers new details about how she spends her time at the White House.
Plus, why the mayor of Chicago just fired the city's police superintendent. And it involves, quote, "intolerable actions."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:46:32]
KEILAR: President Trump and first lady, Melania, are on their way to London right now for a NATO leaders meeting and the 70th anniversary of the military alliance. What kind of welcome will the president receive?
Just before his trip, the Trump administration moved to substantially reduce the U.S. financial contribution to the NATO budget. He has long insisted other NATO members are not paying their fair share.
Trump is also arriving as Britain gears up for its high-stakes election in just 12 days. The U.S. president is, to say the least, controversial in Britain.
And Prime Minister Boris Johnson, who wants to hang onto his job, is not taking chances. He's keeping his distance from Trump and warning the president not to get involved in the U.K. election campaign.,
Let's talk about Melania Trump. Ever since she became first lady, she's upended expectations of the role. She's rarely in the public spotlight compared to other first ladies. And she's largely an enigma.
We have CNN White House reporter, Kate Bennett, the author of a book, "Free, Melania," out tomorrow.
It's "Free, Melania." This is an importantly places comma on this idea that she's trapped, "Free, Melania."
KATE BENNETT, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: T "Free, Melania" meme first came about with the hash tag. I happen to think she's the most-free person in the Trump administration.
And as -- watching that video of them getting off Marine One today, where he walked ahead of her with the umbrella, this is a marriage and a first couple that are doing things differently, and they certainly -- she's expressed her independence, learned how to live with Donald Trump the last 20 years or so.
And she's handling the role of first lady differently than her predecessors.
KEILAR: You have a revelation in the book. The Trump's do have separate bedrooms at the White House.
BENNETT: They do.
I don't think it's that uncommon for them or many couples. We never know what's going on inside a marriage. But it is a revealing note of their personal lives.
But certainly, she is very different that other first ladies we've seen before.
KEILAR: And you put together a great story on this. Let's watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BENNETT (voice-over): First ladies are often judged by their public image, despite what they may actually be like in private.
Barbara Bush, though frequently opinionated --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: America loves Barbara Bush.
BENNETT: -- was beloved for her grandmotherly persona.
Hillary Clinton privately engaged in cultural improvements at the White House but dubbed a meddler in American policy.
HILLARY CLINTON, (D), FORMER SECRETARY OF STATE & FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'm here as an American citizen concerned about the health of her family and the health of her nation.
BENNETT: Michelle Obama, not necessarily in love with the restrictions of White House life.
MICHELLE OBAMA, FORMER FIRST LADY OF THE UNITED STATES: Turn up for what?
(MUSIC) BENNETT: But publicly viewed as an open and friendly first lady.
(MUSIC)
But Melania Trump, almost three years in, remains something of a mystery. From the start, an ambiguous participant. It was clear she had to fend for herself. A reluctant entrance to public life.
MELANIA TRUMP, FIRST LADY OF THE UNITED STATES: Hello, Iowa.
BENNETT: Fewer events, a smaller staff and a lower profile.
(APPLAUSE)
BENNETT: However, with Melania Trump, the flares of independence crossed from private to public, unique to a modern first lady, defining her as a spouse not joined at the hip with President Trump, as her spokeswoman once described her to CNN.
[14:50:07]
She tweeted and released statements on her own, without Trump's approval, sometimes in direct opposition to his.
(SIRENS)
BENNETT: Taking her own motorcades, cancelling a joint trip when headlines about alleged infidelities arose.
With more rumors about how she lives and where she lives.
UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: There are persistent rumors that Mrs. Trump does not live in this White House.
SARAH SANDERS, FORMER WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: That is an outrageous and ridiculous claim.
BENNETT: Melania and President Trump are a rare first couple, living in separate bedrooms, according to source familiar, while Melania resides on a different floor in the White House residence.
At times, also expressing a differing opinion from her husband, Donald Trump.
MELANIA TRUMP: We are two independent people thinking on our own and have a very open conversation.
BENNETT: She has faltered. That jacket.
MELANIA TRUMP: I wish people would focus on what I do, not what I wear.
BENNETT: She has also found some footing. Learned how to steal the spotlight, wield her significance influence. Remember that call for the firing of a West Wing aide --
(CROSSTALK)
MELANIA TRUMP: -- and find her professional comfort zone.
Detached, aloof? Possibly. Always with little regard for how first ladies before her have handled the job.
MELANIA TRUMP: I don't feel like a prisoner, no. I'm enjoying it. And this will not last forever. And it's a very special time.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BENNETT: One thing she does do really well, the holiday decorations. I saw them this morning at the White House. It's certainly a special set up this year for sure.
KEILAR: We're going to be taking a look at that today as well.
Kate Bennett, thank you so much.
BENNETT: You're welcome.
KEILAR: Great report.
Joe Biden launching a no-malarkey bus tour as we get closer to the Iowa caucuses.
Plus, a woman is accused of faking being sick to get a better seat on her flight. Hear what happened there.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:56:45]
KEILAR: The mayor of Chicago has fired the city's top cop for what she calls intolerable actions and misleading the public. This all stems from an incident in October where a passerby called 911 to report that the police superintendent, Eddie Johnson, was sleeping in his car at a stop sign.
He drove himself home after officers responded and determined he was not impaired. Johnson told reporters he felt like his blood pressure was rising and felt ill when he decided to park the care.
But the mayor says that was not the case.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LORI LIGHTFOOT, (D), CHICAGO MAYOR: Johnson intentionally misled the public in a press conference he called on October 17, 2019. He was not caught off guard, and he had plenty of time to choose his words. The choice he made was to communicate a narrative replete with false statements, all seemingly intended to hide the true nature of the conduct from the evening before.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: Johnson was thrust into the spotlight for his department's handling of the 2014 police shooting of La Quan McDonald.
Everyone complains about the shrinking size of seats on an airplane, but a Florida woman tried to get a better seat by pretending to be sick, forcing the pilot to turn around and go back to the Pensacola airport. Police then took her into custody.
We have Rene Marsh with us, CNN's aviation and government regulation correspondent.
Tell us what happened. This is so bizarre.
RENE MARSH, CNN AVIATION & GOVERNMENT REGULATION CORRESPONDENT: This was an American Airlines flight that was going to Miami. About an hour into the flight, she complains she wants a larger seat, a better seat. She's informed there are no other accommodations. Then she talks about a medical issue she has. At that point, the pilot makes the decision to divert this plane and return to Pensacola airport.
Once on the ground, police realized she didn't have a medical issue. She simply said that because she wanted a better seat. But keep in mind, according to the airline, she was sitting in 1-A. She was sitting the front of the plane. There was no first class on this smaller plane.
It became very evident once this woman was taken into custody this, in fact, was an issue of mental illness, because, at this point, they realize there was no first class, there was no larger seat for this woman to essentially be seated in.
KEILAR: That's bizarre. So They took her into custody?
MARSH: We just got off the phone with the police department. No criminal charges have been filed against this lady. She was admitted to a medical facility. She's been released, now back in Miami. Obviously, her identity not released due to sensitives around her medical condition. But she's OK.
And the airline, it doesn't appear they'll choose to press any charges against her for the costs associated with diverting a plane either.
KEILAR: Rene, thank you so much. Rene Marsh.
We have a programming note now. Join Anderson Cooper and Kelly Ripa live as they name the 2019 "CNN Hero" of the year. An "CNN HEROES, AN ALL-STAR TRIBUTE" will air Sunday night at 8:00 eastern on CNN.
A special edition of "THE LEAD" with Jake Tapper starts right now.
[15:00:04]
JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Welcome to the two-hour edition of THE LEAD, White House in crisis. I'm Jake Tapper, in Washington.
President Trump today attacked Wednesday's House Judiciary hearing on impeachment, calling it a hoax.
