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Unredacted E-Mail Now Shows What Republicans Say Democrats Had Been Missing; Sanders Leads Democratic Rivals With $34 million Haul in the Fourth Quarter; New Images of the Destruction inside the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired January 02, 2020 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: One State Trooper calling it "tumblegeddon" and saying he had never seen anything like it in more than in 20 years on the job.

That is it for me, NEWSROOM with Brooke Baldwin fresh off her always entertaining New Year's Eve coverage, starts right now.

[14:00:19]

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN HOST: All right, Brianna, thank you so much. Hi there, I'm Brooke Baldwin. Happy New Year, to you. It is good to be back. Let's start this hour with some explosive new developments in the impeachment case against President Trump.

Less than 24 hours before the Senate returns from winter break, an unredacted e-mail now shows what Republicans say Democrats had been missing -- direct evidence that President Trump personally directed and continued this freeze on Ukraine aid despite growing panic within the White House, and it's critical timing.

So right now, we still don't know when an impeachment trial over on the Senate side will begin and these new e-mails could impact whether we hear from any more witnesses.

So with me now CNN political correspondent Sara Murray and CNN legal analyst Elie Hoenig.

So Sara just first to you on this new reporting. Tell me what the substance of this is and what exactly do these e-mails say?

SARA MURRAY, CNN POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Sure, well, these are e- mails that we got in a redacted form. The Center for Public Integrity, won them in a FOIA lawsuit, and now Just Security has managed to review unredacted versions of them and they basically show that in the wake of all of these concerns at the Pentagon about whether it was illegal to withhold this Ukraine money, whether it was going to disappear entirely because they were going to hit the end of the fiscal year, the demand to keep this hold in place came from the top.

And so here is an e-mail from O.M.B. official, Michael Duffy saying, "Clear direction from POTUS to continue to hold," and that is on August 30th. And this is already after there are a bunch of e-mail exchanges between Michael Duffy at O.M.B. and Elaine McCusker, she is the comptroller at the Defense Department about her concerns that we're not going to get this money out the door in time, we can't guarantee that if you continue to hold this, we will have time to spend it.

And then in another e-mail she writes to Mark Esper's Chief of Staff saying, "Recognizing the importance of decision space, but the situation is really unworkable made particularly difficult because O.M.B. lawyers continue to consistently mischaracterize the process and the information we have provided. They keep repeating that this pause will not impact DoD's ability to execute on time."

So that is her basically saying, the Office of Management and Budget is not taking our concerns seriously, that this could violate the law, or that we are not going to be able to spend this money in time and get it to Ukraine if they continue to sit on it.

BALDWIN: OK, so just again, and Elie to you, highlighting the line of the email that Sara highlighted off the top, clear directive from POTUS to hold -- to continue to hold this frozen aid. What strikes you the most about what she just reported out? And how might this impact just the Senate trial looking ahead to this month.

ELIE HONIG, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: So Brooke, this is Exhibit A for why we need a real trial in the Senate with real facts, real documents and real witnesses, and not just some empty political exercise, it's so important.

And look, let's remember, the House Democrats served 71 subpoenas and information requests and got zero -- not a single page.

BALDWIN: And look at what these journalists did through FOIA.

HONIG: The journalists got this through FOIA. We get the smallest glimpse of what's missing, and it's so explosive as Sara just laid out. Order came from the top.

You see White House and administration officials scrambling to try to paper this over. This is the kind of key stuff that is out there, but it's being withheld by the administration.

BALDWIN: What are these new e-mails do you think for Team Trump's defense?

HONIG: Oh, they hurt the defense. I mean, if you look at those e- mails, all the various defenses we've seen out there are undermined by these e-mails. No mention of hey, he's really concerned about corruption, right? No mention of he is really concerned about who is paying their fair share of foreign aid.

It really undermines a lot of the narratives that the defense team has tried to put in place here and I think really strengthens the Democrats' case here.

BALDWIN: Sara, can you just also -- just underscoring Elie's kind of penultimate point, if I may have, you know, think of all the subpoenas, all the documents have been blocked, and it's journalists, right, intrepid journalists in this FOIA, this Freedom of Information request to get this information pointing the finger back to the President.

MURRAY: Well, the Freedom of Information request, I mean, even in that, the Justice Department handed over highly redacted versions and it was Just Security that managed to somehow review unredacted versions.

You know, they haven't said, you know, exactly where this is coming from. And so it does give you -- it does give you pause about why the administration decided to make such heavy redactions.

I know the Center for Public Integrity is challenging those redactions in court right now and trying to get the judge to push the government to reveal even more, but we're already seeing, you know, we saw Senator Chuck Schumer just tweeting today that these e-mails are explosive, that they do add credence to the idea that we need documents and that we need witnesses if we're going to move it forward in an impeachment trial.

Obviously, you know, Mitch McConnell is not very open to that, but I think the documents do shed more light on the contemporaneous conversations about who was making decisions on holding the money and what kind of concerns there were within the ranks of the Trump administration.

[14:05:10]

BALDWIN: You mentioned Senator Schumer, the Minority Leader over on the Senate side, and we'll get to him in just a second. But Elie, this is what we have from Pam Brown. Her reporting is that there are active discussions among the President's aides and members of his legal team about procedural moves that would be appropriate if Speaker Pelosi, right?

So we know that as we left on break, she'd held up these Articles of Impeachment if she continues to do so. Does the President have a legal leg to stand on there? Or does Speaker Pelosi truly hold the power?

HONIG: Yes, I don't think she holds the power. I don't think this idea of withholding the Articles of Impeachment is going to get very far.

BALDWIN: OK.

HONIG: What I think she's trying to do is focus the conversation on exactly what we've just been talking about, the need to have real evidence at this Senate trial. And I think what this does is it strengthens Chuck Schumer's play here politically, and I think it puts Mitch McConnell in a tough spot because the more that comes out, the more the public is saying, well, there's all these facts that are being kept out of the trial.

Mitch McConnell has got to be careful because this stuff is coming out somehow, some way, someday. And if it comes out later, then people are going to see the real extent of the cover up here.

BALDWIN: But we're supposed to hear from him tomorrow morning, right from the Senate floor. Sara, and I mean, who knows if he mentions any of this. My last question is this, House Judiciary Committee lawyers and the D.O.J. have each filed briefs in the appeals case over whether the former White House Counsel Don McGahn should be forced to testify before Congress. The case is scheduled to be heard by a Federal Appeals Court tomorrow, didn't you -- weren't you in court for --

HONIG: Yes. Round one in the District Court.

BALDWIN: Round one of this.

HONIG: This is round two in the Court of Appeals.

BALDWIN: So how do you think this will go and how significant will this decision be?

HONIG: I think the Court of Appeals will agree with the District Court that McGahn must testify. This is a legitimate subpoena. The District Court ruling here was a smack down.

They said that the Trump argument was a fiction. They said Presidents are not kings. That's where that quote came from this decision.

BALDWIN: Yes.

HONIG: The Court of Appeals that will hear it tomorrow, I think, it is steady. I think this District Court opinion is very well grounded. I think they're going to say Don McGahn has to testify and then the next question will be, does the Supreme Court agree to take the case or not?

BALDWIN: OK, Elie Honig, thank you very much. Sara Murray with all of that reporting there, Sara, thank you.

To the campaign trail where former Vice President Joe Biden has just released his fundraising numbers. We will take you to Iowa. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:11:42]

BALDWIN: Welcome back. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin. And for those of you keeping score, today marks one month and one day until the Iowa caucuses, but for the Democrats who would like to be President, there is another number and focus and that is 34 as in, $34.5 million to be exact. That is how much money Bernie Sanders raked in during the last three months of 2019, a staggering haul that puts the Vermont senator well above his Democratic rivals in the 2020 money race.

A group that includes former Vice President Joe Biden, who moments ago dropped his total for the quarter coming in just under $23 million. So CNN is on the campaign trail in Iowa with both of these candidates; Jeff Zelney is with Team Sanders and Arlette Saenz is with Team Biden and Arlette, to you first, because we now have these numbers from the former Vice President. How does the campaign feel about that number?

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: Well, Brooke, this is certainly welcome news for Joe Biden's campaign as he is now posting his highest fundraising haul yet. It is $22.7 million that his campaign raised in the final three months.

This comes after the third fundraising quarter where Biden had posted $15.7 million, so there had been some concern about his ability to fundraise. In his first quarter in the race, he had raised $21.5 million.

Now, Biden recently has seen a major uptick when it comes to online donation campaign announcing today that they have doubled online contributions since the last quarter.

Now Biden is kicking things off here in Iowa in just a short while. We're at the National Motorcycle Museum, you can probably tell right behind me where he is going to be holding events.

But this fundraising haul puts him behind Bernie Sanders and Pete Buttigieg. But it makes clear that Biden does have sustainable money to be able to continue into this race, potentially for the long haul.

BALDWIN: And then Jeff, to you. I mean, that's a big, big number that Bernie Sanders just posted. How did they get there? How are they feeling?

JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Well Brooke, there's no question. It's a big number. And it's largely because of small donations. The Sanders campaign as it did, four years ago is thriving on, you know, his core supporters, sending in checks again and again, and again.

The average donation, some $18.00 and some odd cents here, so they can keep going back to that well of supporters, but they hit a benchmark of hitting five million individual contributions more than any other candidate. Again, it's those small dollars that they are relying on. In the month of December alone, $18 million Bernie Sanders raised.

So Brooke, this is what this all means. It means that Bernie Sanders and Joe Biden have the money to go the distance, it means that they will be fighting it out for as long as this Democratic primary goes on.

We are here in Iowa as well, as you know the early voting in New Hampshire we keep an eye on. Elizabeth Warren is there today, and then Nevada and South Carolina, but the money will be spent starting on Super Tuesday in a very big way.

So this money from Bernie Sanders, $34 million, he has raised $96 million all year long. That means he'll be on TV advertising so much in those expensive states like California.

So Brooke, it certainly is impressive, the Biden number as Arlette was saying. There are some people raising eyebrows in other campaigns I've spoken to who were surprised by the number, but Brooke, it shows that he is starting the year as he started the last year as the nominal front runner, but boy, these are competitive and this race will go on and on.

[14:15:10]

ZELENY: They both have the money and others do as well, Buttigieg does as well to stay in as long as they can -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: A month and a day until those Iowa caucuses. Thank you so much to both of you in that state.

Let's have a broader conversation. With me now M.J. Lee, she's a CNN political correspondent. Shane Goldmacher is a national political reporter for "The New York Times" and so guys, we just saw the Biden numbers, right?

So here's a look at just how everything stands. Overall, you can take a look, Sanders is on top with $34.5 million, about $10 million more than Pete Buttigieg. Next up, you have former Vice President Joe Biden in third which is just under $23 million, followed by Andrew Yang at $16.5 million. Tulsi Gabbard with $3.4 million and the man they all want to replace, President Trump, eh has raked in $46 million.

And earlier on CNN, Sanders campaign manager was talking to us that when it comes to the general election, don't expect his candidate to go knocking on the doors and big donors to beat President Trump. Here he was.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FAIZ SHAKIR, CAMPAIGN MANAGER FOR SEN. BERNIE SANDERS: We will not change a damn thing that is working. If you have Pete Buttigieg and Joe Biden telling you that they need to go kowtow at the altar of the rich to fundraise for the general election. They're wrong. We are upending those notions. You can't fund this totally in a grassroots way.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: So M.J., my question to you, is that a vow that let's say Bernie Sanders becomes the nominee, is that something his campaign can realistically do? Keep that promise?

M.J. LEE, CNN POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: I mean, this is not the kind of promise that Bernie Sanders could easily take back. You know, you think back on 2016 and you think on, you know, about this campaign this time around.

This sort of grassroots focus, small donors only kind of campaigning -- that is really the hallmark of the Bernie Sanders campaign, right? This has become his brand and if you think about that $34.5 million raised over the course of three months, I mean, it is even more stunning as we just heard Jeff Zeleny saying. When you think about the fact that he raised that much money without

doing the traditional fundraisers, without asking for those high dollar checks, and I think after 2020, regardless of what happens, it is going to be the campaign that I think really change the way we think about how money is raised in presidential elections.

And I think Bernie Sanders goes into 2020, with a lot of its fundamentals being incredibly strong, whether it's the money, the poll numbers, having him at the top tier, whether nationally or in the early states, and then just having this base that is very, very loyal to him.

BALDWIN: So let's say, Shane, he doesn't win Iowa. Let's say he doesn't even come in second, maybe third, but he is rolling in the dough, right, as we have pointed out, and you think back to -- and I mean, I think you were even saying before we came on TV, you know, he does well if he's winning. He does well, even if he's not winning, which is so true.

Do we see shades of 2016 where he just keeps rolling along, staying in this race until late, late in the game?

SHANE GOLDMACHER, NATIONAL POLITICS REPORTER, THE NEW YORK TIMES: That's absolutely possible. Look, not only did he raise the most money in this most recent quarter, he started the quarter with the most recent money. So that's the stat that campaigns haven't released yet, what is their cash on hand?

So Bernie Sanders isn't just raising the most, he started with the most, right? That could be the challenge for Joe Biden. He recovered $22.7 million as a huge uptick from the $15.7 million he raised the previous quarter.

But he spent more money than he raised last quarter, right? So he doesn't have the same cash on hand. So an early loss, Bernie Sanders is going to have a cash reserve and donors giving back to them. Other candidates like Biden, they don't have that kind of cushion.

BALDWIN: Right. Which means, you know, back to my question, he could stay and stay and stay. The question is, do you think he will?

GOLDMACHER: You know, this is their least favorite questions you've ever had -- the Sanders folks -- because they say we're going to win so why not?

BALDWIN: Yes, yes.

GOLDMACHER: But look, they absolutely have that flexibility. And they have supporters, so they're going to let him do it if he wants to.

BALDWIN: On the Joe Biden news today. He got his first endorsement from a member of Iowa's congressional delegation. So tell me about who this person is.

LEE: Yes. Joe Biden just endorsed this morning by Congresswoman Abby Finkenauer. She one of the delegates in the Iowa delegation, only a couple of House Democrats in the House.

And you know, the image of Abby Finkenauer sort of campaigning with Joe Biden out on the trail, that is so valuable for the Biden campaign, particularly as they're sort of trying to show that they can reach out to this younger generation.

And I think on top of that, the fact that they are getting pretty good fundraising news for the last quarter of the last year, that is good news, a news that the campaign needed, because the previous quarters fundraising was not so strong, it was actually quite poor.

And I think they really needed to go into this year, showing that they have momentum including endorsements and the money.

BALDWIN: Let's talk Shane about the Yang gang. They are mighty especially on online so in a tweet, Andrew Yang claims that his campaign is attracting new donors. Just yesterday, the "Des Moines Register" reported that many caucus goers are still undecided. So, I mean, I know we can't predict the future here, but what -- does that set the stage for a potential huge surprise in Iowa?

And if so, who? Who is the best person to capitalize on this air of uncertainty?

[14:20:17]

GOLDMACHER: Well, look, Andrew Yang has more money than almost anyone would have expected. And let's put that $16.5 million in perspective, that's more money than Joe Biden raised the previous quarter.

Andrew Yang is raising lots of money and already airing lots of TV ads in these early states. What he hasn't shown is an ability to break through with the broader electorate. He has found deep supporters among his support, but not the kind of coalition that Joe Biden has and that some of the other candidates seem to have a better potential to make.

Now, he is trying, but it hasn't happened yet.

BALDWIN: OK. And then to both of you, just setting aside the money raised here for a second, the Democratic field shrunk by one today. Julian Castro announced he is dropping out, so this is part of what he said about his decision.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JULIAN CASTRO (D), FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE We have shaped the conversation on so many important issues in this race, stood up for the most vulnerable people and given a voice to those were often forgotten.

But with only a month until the Iowa caucuses, and given the circumstances of this campaign season, I've determined that it simply isn't our time.

(END VIDEO CLIP) BALDWIN: So we have gone from the most diverse presidential field in

the U.S. history to one that is largely white, not a single vote has been cast. Cory Booker is now fundraising off of this saying his voice is needed more than ever.

So what do you two think happened with regard to, you know, not just the Castro campaign, but this most diverse field ever on the Democratic side? What happened?

LEE: I mean, I'm always going to be a supporter of seeing more diversity in politics and in other platforms. I do think it is important to sort of take stock of the historic diversity that we already have seen in the 2020 election regardless of where we are today. I mean, this is a field that started out with some half dozen women, multiple candidates of color, including two black senators, one Latino, former HUD Secretary.

All of this does make an impact and leave an impact on the race, even if some of these folks are no longer in the race. But you're very right that the reality right now is that the top tier candidates in the Democratic field --

BALDWIN: Is very white.

LEE: A field that was very big. It's very white now.

BALDWIN: Thank you, two, very much. Just a head here on CNN, to Iraq, where we are getting new images of the destruction inside the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad, plus what U.S. Defense Secretary Mark Esper just said about the situation there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:27:01]

BALDWIN: We're now getting an inside look at the destruction at the U.S. Embassy in Baghdad, and you'll see here the burned out buildings, smashed windows with rubble littering the ground days after pro- Iranian protesters stormed the heavily fortified compound.

Security Forces have since regained control of the area ending the immediate threat to Americans there. But this morning, the Iranian- backed militia behind that attack issued a demand to Iraq's Parliament: Kick U.S. forces out of the country or they may take further action.

Meantime, U.S. Defense Secretary Mark Esper is echoing President Trump and warns Iran is playing a risky game.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARK ESPER, U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY: He is absolutely correct that if anybody challenges us, they will be -- they will be met with a severe response, a strong response by U.S. forces.

QUESTION: What does that severe strong response look like? ESPER: I'm not going to -- I'm not going to telegraph what we're

going to do. But people know that we have vast capability to do any number of things. We will act in response to actions by Iran or its proxies, and we will act to preempt any attacks on our forces to our personnel by Iran or its proxy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: For more, let me turn to CNN global affairs analyst Aaron David Miller and Aaron, you know, your resume also includes a stint as a Middle East negotiator for the State Department, so I know you have intimate experience in this part of the world.

So you wrote this piece for cnn.com. You write that the U.S. had little choice but to respond to the attack at the embassy, which left one American contractor dead. Do you though think when you look at the U.S.'s response to that, was the response proportionate?

AARON DAVID MILLER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: I mean, I think the answer that is no. The kill ratio was 25 to one, plus, quote unquote, "scores as many as 50 wounded," and in many respects, the Trump administration is caught in mine, because what's happening in Iraq is derivative of the absence of a policy on Iran.

And as long as there is no policy in Iran, the Iranians will play with us in Iraq, on a playground that is dangerously tilted against the United States and in their favor.

And the Sec Def is right. Yes, I mean, we could blow a lot of things up. But the point is, what it in fact is the point? 5,200 American forces, the vulnerability of the embassy and the destruction, not even penetrating the building is apparent.

We're supposed to be allied with the Iraqi government training assisting against the Islamic State. So no, I think the Iranians and the Iranians will play this out. They have no stake right now in pushing the Americans out of Iraq or getting Iraqi parliament to do so.

They've changed the channel, Brooke. It is longer focused on them. It's now all about us. And I think it's going to be increasingly fraught in 2020 in Iraq.

BALDWIN: But you also make this point that, you know, you look at the mixed messages that the Americans are sending, right? It's the pulling out of the Iran Nuclear Deal. It's slapping all the sanctions, yet it is President Trump saying, hey, Rouhani, I'd like to sit down with you.

So there's that which I thought was a great point. How does the U.S. --

[14:30:09]