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Interview with Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz (D-FL); Sen. Mitch McConnell (R-KY) and Sen. Chuck Schumer (D-NY) to Issue Statements on Impeachment Today; World Leaders React to Soleimani Assassination. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired January 03, 2020 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:30:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: This morning, four senior congressional Democrats, all part of the so-called Gang of Eight -- these are congressional leaders of both parties on the relevant committees -- say they were not notified before these strikes that killed Qasem Soleimani, something that is protocol with -- requirement to inform Congress.

Joining me now to discuss is Democrat Congresswoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz of Florida. She's on the Oversight and Reform Committee. She's the former DNC chairwoman, we should note as well.

Good morning to you. Thanks so much for taking the time this morning.

REP. DEBBIE WASSERMAN SCHULTZ (D-FL): Good morning, Jim. Happy New Year.

SCIUTTO: To you as well. As you know, Soleimani killed hundreds of U.S. servicemembers in Iraq -- 603 by the Pentagon's count -- injured thousands more. This morning, do you welcome the killing of Soleimani?

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: There is no question, Jim, that Soleimani was a vicious terrorist whose death I and no one should mourn, but this is an administration -- Donald Trump, really, with his national security policy, appears to shoot first and then possibly the vital questions that lead up to action are asked later.

That is a foreign policy and a national security policy run amok. He pulled out of Syria without much of his national security leadership even knowing he was going to do that. Now, he assassinated, clearly, a vicious killer who -- who certainly killed and engaged and led terrorist acts by the terrorist regime of Iran.

But we have to make sure that our laws are followed. And the reason that we require the consultation with Congress when the president takes an action like this, a military action that puts Americans in harm's way, is because we have to make sure that we don't have one branch of government, one individual --

SCIUTTO: Right. WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: -- engaging in military acts without consultation

with Congress. That's what the system of checks and balances is all about.

SCIUTTO: But didn't that phenomenon long precede President Trump? I mean, previous presidents -- President Obama acted without congressional permission on a number of strikes, as did President George W. Bush, going back to Clinton. I mean, this is not a new phenomenon here.

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: It is the responsibility of the Congress and the executive branch to make sure that when military action is taken, that consultation occurs and the laws are followed. There is no authorization of use of military force against Iran.

When we have an action, if the president believed that we had our American interests in imminent danger, which, frankly, Secretary Pompeo really had a pretty weak statement this morning on your network where, when asked directly whether there was imminent jeopardy to our U.S. homeland, the best he could come up with was that there was imminent threat in the region. What does that mean? Does that mean oil interests were jeopardized?

SCIUTTO: Yes.

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: There needs to be more clarity and Congress needs to be briefed. But we needed to have our Gang of Eight briefed before he took this action. Because --

SCIUTTO: John Bolton --

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: -- that way, we could be more prepared to respond.

SCIUTTO: Understood. John Bolton, who until, of course, recently, was the president's national security advisor, he tweeted, welcoming this killing. But also saying, in his words, that it was long in the making. And then said that he hopes that this is the first step towards regime change in Iran.

TEXT: John Bolton: Congratulations to all involved in eliminating Qasem Soleimani. Long in the making, this was a decisive blow against Iran's malign Quds Force activities worldwide. Hope this is the first step to regime change in Tehran.

SCIUTTO: Do you believe that that's the administration's intention here?

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: Well, that's certainly the bellicose track record of John Bolton.

What I think is going on here, frankly, is that this action was taken more in President Trump's self-interest rather than our national interest. We had, you know, damning developments in just the last day, where e-mails came out that made it very clear that they covered up the real reason behind the withholding of hundreds of millions of dollars to Ukraine. Donald Trump was just impeached a week and a half ago, and we need to

get to the bottom of how and who helped him carry out this illegal cover-up to -- to allow him to withhold aid to help him politically and personally, allowing (ph) Ukraine to interfere --

SCIUTTO: Right.

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: -- in the presidential election in 2020. That's outrageous, and I think that has a lot to do with what this attack was about (ph).

(CROSSTALK)

SCIUTTO: I want to ask you about those e-mails as regards to the impeachment inquiry, because now, written in plain sight, I mean, they're e-mails saying that --

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: Correct.

SCIUTTO: -- from the OMB to DOD, saying explicitly that this order came from the president, to withhold the aid.

But I wonder what this says about the Democrats' strategy and schedule here, with the impeachment hearing. That had you waited, you would have had evidence like this to present to Americans, but also to present to Republican lawmakers. Do you think you should have waited longer, not just to get documents like this but to get witnesses?

[10:35:11]

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: Look, as a member of the Appropriations Committee, Jim, what is -- what I find outrageous is that the exchange between the Department of Defense officials and OMB officials was very clear and DOD officials were sounding the alarm bells, concerned that this was an illegal action, concerned that they would violated the Impoundment Act if the funds were not able to be spent by the end of the fiscal year.

And the Senate, now, the ball is in the Senate's court. They have the ability to subpoena witnesses, to subpoena documents, these documents specifically. If Mitch McConnell doesn't, then he's essentially acting like a capo that will enable the continued cover-up that the administration is engaged in, in what was really going on, which is Donald Trump tried to get Ukraine to investigate his political rival and interfere in the 2020 presidential election.

And that's why he is an impeached president. Now the Senate needs to do their job fully and make sure that there is a fair trial and review of the evidence.

SCIUTTO: Well, we'll be hearing from Senator Mitch McConnell shortly. Congresswoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz, we thank you for taking the time and a Happy New Year to you and your family.

WASSERMAN SCHULTZ: You as well. SCIUTTO: Well, as I said, the Senate majority leader, set to speak

during the impeachment standoff, which continues. We're going to head to Capitol Hill to hear what he might say about the upcoming Senate trial. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:41:06]

SCIUTTO: For the first time this new year, Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, set to speak on the Senate floor. He will likely talk about the impeachment standoff; what comes next in a Senate trial of a sitting president. This comes as new documents highlight Trump's direct role in the hold on military aid to Ukraine.

CNN's senior congressional correspondent Manu Raju, on Capitol Hill with details. Do we know what plan, if any, McConnell's going to lay out? Let me just ask, in light of events in the Middle East, I mean, is it possible he says too much going on overseas, can't do this now?

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I don't think he'll go that far, but he probably will refer to the attack that occurred. The president has not -- the Senate majority leader has not yet weighed in about exactly what happened here. We don't even know if he got briefed on the attack that killed that top Iranian leader.

But we do know that McConnell will come to the floor and will talk about the year ahead, and make clear that he will -- that the Senate will move forward on other matters while they wait for those articles of impeachment to be delivered from the House to the Senate.

He's going to indicate that they are not going to move on that until Nancy Pelosi acts on providing those articles of impeachment. Now, she has not provided those articles of impeachment because she said she wants to understand what the Senate process is.

And Chuck Schumer, the Senate Democrat leader, and Mitch McConnell have not reached a deal on what the Senate process will look like because Mitch McConnell does not want to have an orderly (ph) agreement on witnesses and documents that have been demanded by Democrats. He says put those decisions off until later.

So expect him to reiterate that message, going forward, saying, we are -- need to move forward on this trial, but we're not going to do essentially what the Democrats want. So expect the impeachment standoff to remain despite weeks of this happening, and weeks of not talking.

Chuck Schumer and Mitch McConnell have not had discussions behind the scenes, but they will make these public remarks today at noon eastern when the Senate opens up this session for the new year. Mitch McConnell will speak, followed by Chuck Schumer. So expect that standoff to be pretty clear when these two leaders talk -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: Manu, the essential Republican defense, during the House impeachment inquiry, was that there was no direct evidence of a direct order from the president to withhold this aid, despite the fact that Gordon Sondland and others said there was a quid pro quo, everybody knew about it.

But what's key about these documents is that they seem to establish that very directly. I mean, there's an e-mail from OMB to the Pentagon, saying, clear direction from POTUS to continue the hold. How impactful are these documents, which we should note the White House attempted to block.

TEXT: August 30, 2019; From Michael Duffey, Office of Management and Budget to Elaine McCusker, Defense Department: "Clear direction from POTUS to continue to hold."

RAJU: Yes, and Democrats believe they're significant. Chuck Schumer said this is a, quote, "devastating blow" to that defense, saying that this -- this e-mail that has been revealed, suggesting that the -- this top official said, from the Office of Management and Budget, that the aid had been withheld at the instruction of the president.

Now, we'd heard witness testimony that also said that the direction had come through Mick Mulvaney, and that aid should be withheld. And the president had made that order through Mick Mulvaney. But we're seeing this now in writing.

What the Democrats are saying is that they want all these documents provided to Capitol Hill as part of the Senate trial. Recall that the Senate, the administration withheld these documents from the House. The House subpoenaed these documents, Democrats chose not to go to court because they did not want to get dragged into a court fight.

Now, this information is coming out because of a separate lawsuit, a third-party organization under the Freedom of Information Act, suing for these records and reporting, showing what's happening behind those black lines.

So Democrats believe they'll fuel their arguments. And Republicans are saying, at the moment --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

RAJU: -- that should have been fought out in court.

SCIUTTO: I mean, it's remarkable. You have news organizations, getting -- recovering -- uncovering some things that the House investigation itself could not uncover. Manu Raju, thanks very much.

[10:44:50]

Well, there are calls for calm now and great concern from foreign leaders. Coming up, how countries around the world, reacting to the killing of the Iranian general Qasem Soleimani.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: We have new reporting in to CNN from myself and my colleague Dana Bash. We are learning that the Iranian general who the U.S. killed in last night's air strike was planning specific attacks on the interests of the U.S. around the region. This includes U.S. personnel in the region.

This comes from a congressional source briefed by the Trump administration, as well as another official familiar with the intelligence behind this attack, suggesting that these plans were maturing and it became a strategic time to take out Soleimani.

[10:50:12]

We should note, as well, that a source with knowledge says the attacks on U.S. personnel were being plotted in the region, and described that concern as being beyond the normal chatter in the region about such plots. In other words, they were moving forward to a direction and a degree that concerned U.S. officials that attacks would be imminent.

Joining me now to discuss this, the seriousness of this, Major General Spider Marks. So we're getting a sense here now, with Dana and my reporting, here, of why the president and his advisors felt the need to attack now, that these were in the latter stages and that they were targeting U.S. interests, but also U.S. personnel in the region.

JAMES "SPIDER" MARKS, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Yes, Jim. I think what we're seeing -- and, clearly, we don't have the intelligence and it's starting to flow in and I know Secretary Pompeo indicated earlier today that he would release what he could release without putting anyone else at risk -- is that what you're probably seeing is that the IRGV had plans in place for multiple targets, some degree of either sequence or simultaneity of attacks.

Therefore, you have the initial report of increased chatter. What that means is that there's probably a lot of code discussion, there's a lot of talk. Things are lighting up in a way that they've not seen before, but is within a certain level of norms. It's probably a greater volume, that A is talking to B and now B is talking to C in a way that we haven't seen before, which really indicates to me --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

MARKS: -- there was requirement for coordination in order for attacks to take place with some degree of coordination.

SCIUTTO: Yes. And oftentimes, there will always be chatter out there. But as I was told here, there was something different, beyond what they normally see, that added to the urgency of action here. Major General Spider Marks, good to have your expertise there. He's of course commanded forces in Iraq.

World leaders are now responding to the U.S. killing of a top Iranian general, and there is concern. Oren Liebermann, standing by near the Israeli-Lebanon border. Lebanon, where Iran has enormous presence. First, let's go to Matthew Chance in Moscow. Moscow -- Matthew, Russia, condemning this attack.

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Not surprisingly, because Russia has a uniquely close relationship with Iran. It's a diplomatic supporter of it, provides, you know, economic aid and of course military equipment to the regime.

And that's why it's been so critical of this targeted killing of that senior Iranian figure. The Russian Foreign Ministry issued a statement earlier -- even though it's a public holiday here -- saying the news of the death of the commander of the Quds force is alarming.

TEXT: "The news of the death of the commander of IRGC's Quds Force Qasem Soleimani in a strike launched by the U.S. armed forces at Baghdad airport are alarming... Washington's move is fraught with grave consequences in terms of regional peace and stability."

CHANCE: Washington's move, it says, is fraught with grave consequences in terms of regional peace and stability. There's also been a statement from the Russian Defense Ministry, calling the targeted killing "short-sighted act which will bring serious negative consequences for the entire international security system" -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: Of course, not surprising. Russia is aligned with Iran and the war in Syria there. Let's go to Oren Liebermann. Oren, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, of course one of the president's staunchest allies, he's praising the U.S. for this attack.

OREN LIEBERMANN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: And we've heard similar praise from nearly all across the political spectrum. In Israel from Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, to members of the opposition. There are very few who have expressed any sort of concern or doubt about the decision of President Donald Trump or the killing of Qasem Soleimani.

Most statements have sounded much like this one from Netanyahu, where he said, "Just as Israel has the right of self-defense, the United States has exactly the same right. Qasem Soleimani is responsible for the death of American citizens and many other innocent people. He was planning more such attacks. President Trump deserves all the credit for acting swiftly, forcefully and decisively."

It's worth noting the defense minister and the foreign minister have been quiet, as have other senior government officials. Perhaps they don't want to be seen provoking Iran or its proxies in the region because they're well aware that Iran may not respond against the U.S. Instead, it may respond against the U.S.' strongest ally in the region, which would be Israel.

And it could use its strongest proxy in the region, Hezbollah, who is based right next to us in Lebanon, to carry out that response. Or it could be Iranian proxies in Syria, or even Iranian influence with Islamic Jihad in Gaza. All of those are options for Iran, and Israel knows that very well.

One strategic analyst points out here that Israel might not be the easiest target; U.S. forces in Iraq are much closer; Saudi Arabia's much more vulnerable and Israel responds with force. But that, perhaps, makes it a more tempting target. At this stage, there are no limitations or restrictions on Israeli civilians in the north, but the IDF is certainly keeping an eye on this situation.

SCIUTTO: Of course, Israel went to war, in effect, with Hezbollah a number of years ago on that common shared border with Lebanon. And Israel itself has not been hesitant to carry out its own strikes, has it not, Oren, in Iraq and elsewhere? Oren Liebermann, on the ground. Matthew Chance in Moscow, thanks very much to you both.

[10:54:55]

We are continuing to follow the breaking news this morning. The U.S. kills the top Iranian general; Iran now vowing revenge. Will it act on those threats of revenge? Where and how? New reporting from CNN, saying they were targeting U.S. personnel in the region. We'll have more. Stay with us.

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WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR, AT THIS HOUR: Hello, I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. We want to welcome our viewers here in the United States and around the world. We're following major --

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