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More than 1,100 Former DOJ Officials Demand Attorney General Bill Barr to Resign; Candidates Target Bernie Sanders Ahead of Nevada Caucuses. Aired 8-9p ET

Aired February 16, 2020 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[20:00:00]

ANA CABRERA, CNN ANCHOR: Attorney General William Barr step down. That call coming from more than 1100 former officials of the Justice Department, career prosecutors, political appointees, people who worked in both Democratic and Republican administrations.

Their outrage is over how Barr handled the federal sentencing of Roger Stone, a close friend of President Trump's, convicted last year on charges that came out of the Mueller investigation. Federal prosecutors made a sentencing recommendation. William Barr, as attorney general, stepped in and reduced it just a few hours after President Trump's criticism on Twitter.

And these former Justice officials who signed this statement calling for Barr's resignation say Barr was not serving his office. Instead he was only serving the president's personal interests.

Let's get out to CNN's Jeremy Diamond at the White House tonight -- Jeremy.

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Well, a firestorm of controversy is continuing around Attorney General Bill Barr's decision to intervene in that politically sensitive case involving the president's long-time political adviser Roger Stone. Barr taking that extraordinary action to reverse a sentencing recommendation from career prosecutors. And now we are seeing more than 1100 career Department of Justice officials, former Justice Department officials, some of them prosecutors, career, some of them political appointees, but having served in both Democratic and Republican administrations.

And essentially what they say in this statement is that while it's all well and good for Barr to be coming out and criticizing the president's use of Twitter to talk about some of these cases, putting him in a difficult position, they are saying that ultimately Barr's actions are what really matter.

Here's what they say. "Mr. Barr's actions in doing the president's personal bidding unfortunately speak louder than his words. Those actions and the damage they have done to the Department of Justice's reputation for integrity and the rule of law require Mr. Barr to resign."

Now, the White House for its part has spent a couple of days insisting that the relationship between the president and the attorney general is on solid footing despite Barr's rebuke of the president's use of social media as it relates to the Department of Justice. What we are also seeing is the White House insisting that the president has confidence in Barr, but also a little bit of pushback on what Barr was saying.

Here's the vice president's chief of staff Marc Short making that point.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARC SHORT, CHIEF OF STAFF TO VICE PRESIDENT PENCE: I don't think that it's impossible to do his job. In fact, I think that Attorney General Barr is doing a great job. He has a lot of confidence inside the White House. I think that the president's frustration is one that a lot of Americans have, which feels like the scales of justice are not balanced anymore. There has been a bias inside the Department of Justice that Attorney General Barr is trying to correct.

I think, as he has said, that the president has not called him directly to say, please do this. He has acted independently to initiate these reviews and I think he's doing a fantastic job with it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DIAMOND: Now I asked the president on Sunday as he returned to the White House whether he would heed his attorney general's advice in terms of stopping his tweets about the Justice Department and Justice Department cases. The president did not answer my question as he walked back into the White House. And the president has already made it quite clear that he has no intention of changing his behavior.

In the wake of Barr's comments about the president's use of Twitter as it relates to the Justice Department, the president tweeted that while Barr said that he had not asked him to intervene in any criminal cases at the Justice Department, the president maintained that he has the right to do so.

Jeremy diamond, CNN, the White House.

CABRERA: Joining us now is former Nixon White House counsel, John Dean.

John, the fact that 1100 former prosecutors and DOJ officials, again, from both Democratic and Republican administrations, are coming out and they're calling for the AG's resignation. Have you ever seen anything like this?

JOHN DEAN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Not on that scale. It really is quite remarkable, and it's not unfounded, Ana. These people are loyal to the Department of Justice regardless of who is at the top of it. And they don't like what's going on. What happened with the Stone case, it's the straw that broke the camel's back, if you will. That's what prompted these people to put their signature out and tell Barr he's got to go.

CABRERA: What could people currently inside the Justice Department who may feel outrage do?

DEAN: Well, there are a couple of things they can do. First of all, and I think they're alert to this now because of the former inspector general alerted them that reminded them that they can indeed, if they see improper conduct, if they see political influence at play in Justice Department positions, they can go to the inspector general and file a complaint, and that has to be investigated by the inspector general. And if Barr is messing around with the process, that's going to come out. So that's one thing they can do.

The other thing is they can do what four prosecutors -- line prosecutors did in the U.S. attorney's office. They resigned.

[20:05:08]

They made a very strong statement, and that's what's prompted a lot of these other activities. If there's an en masse departure from the department, it will cripple the department. I think that's why Warr went on ABC and gave his interview that was really on sort of a preemptive effort to diffuse this situation that he saw coming. He probably was tipped off that this letter was circulating, that people were unhappy with his behavior. And so he tried to cut it off at the start.

CABRERA: I want to remind our viewers what Barr said this week during that ABC interview you've referenced. And he was specifically commenting on the president's tweets here. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WILLIAM BARR, ATTORNEY GENERAL: To have public statements and tweets made about the department, about our people in the department, our men and women here about cases pending in the department, and about judges before whom we have cases make it impossible for me to do my job and to assure the courts and the prosecutors in the department that we're doing our work with integrity.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CABRERA: A White House official told CNN that Trump was not upset with Barr after that interview. And we've learned the White House was actually given a heads up before that interview. So, who do you think Barr was really talking to?

DEAN: Well, as I say, I think he was talking to the line prosecutors and the rank in file in the Department of Justice that he had a feeling a mutiny might be brewing. And this was an effort to cut it off. I'm interested to hear your confirmations that there was a heads up and that he had, indeed, given them advance notice. I speculated that in the way things operate in a tweet when I said I thought this whole thing was just a show and there was little real sincerity. He was telling Trump back off, don't make my work harder, I'm doing the job for you that you want done.

CABRERA: So I want to read you part of a "Washington Post" op-ed by conservative lawyer George Conway and he writes, "Anticipating Trump's narcissistic whims and desires in just this fashion remains the key to survival in this administration. And outside the White House proper no one does it better than Barr. It's thus entirely believable as both Barr and Trump have said that Trump never gave Barr any instruction about Stone's case when it came to Stone's sentence. Barr likely knew what to do without ever being told."

John, what do you think of Conway's theory?

DEAN: I think George has nailed it. It's exactly right on. Michael Cohen said the same thing when he testified under oath a couple years ago before he went to jail that Trump gives signals and everybody knows how to read the signals. And if they don't read the signals they don't stay around Trump very long. Well, that's what George is saying here that he's throwing the signals, Barr reads them well. He has been Trump's Roy Cohen. And he will continue if Trump stops tweeting he will make his life easier.

CABRERA: The DOJ announced Friday it's dropping its criminal investigation of former FBI deputy director Andrew McCabe who is a CNN contributor now. But here's how McCabe reacted.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDREW MCCABE, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: I don't think I'll ever be free of this president and his maniacal rage that he's directed towards me and my wife since October of 2016. He's made it pretty clear in the way that he's conducted himself over the last week that he's, you know, high and mighty on the tour of retaliation against everyone who had anything to do with his impeachment inquiry. So he's a vindictive guy and I fully expect that he'll continue to hound me and my family.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CABRERA: John, in your assessment, are we seeing the Department of Justice become weaponized for political retribution?

DEAN: We sure are in that case with McCabe. That's a case, Ana, that most U.S. attorneys would never have even taken in. And the fact that it was two years sitting there and the report is at least one if not two grand juries turned it down. Now that's just incredible when a prosecutor cannot get a grand jury who they really lead every step of the way to not take an action they want taken. But there was no case there. And it was patently clear. So they were harassing him.

They were weaponizing the Department of Justice and make his life miserable, to hang a felony potential indictment over his head. It was really a very, very vile act.

[20:10:01]

CABRERA: Yesterday President Trump quoted a "New York Times" piece tweeting, "Ralph Waldo Emerson seemed to foresee the lesson of the Senate impeachment trial of President Trump. When you strike at the king, Emerson famously said, you must kill him."

John, what's your reaction to this tweet? DEAN: Well, I'm not sure it was Emerson.

(LAUGHTER)

DEAN: I think Shakespeare got there first. In fact, I had my lawyer say that very thing to me before I testified about Nixon. That was his advice.

CABRERA: Really? Really?

DEAN: It was. It was.

CABRERA: And why was that his advice?

DEAN: And I -- because he said, don't just kick him, kill him. And that's what I did. I put it all out there knowing he couldn't survive it.

CABRERA: So what do you think Trump means by tweeting this quote?

DEAN: I don't think Trump understands. You know, he -- first of all, he's putting himself in the position of being the king, which, theoretically, a president is. Maybe in his mind, maybe in the minds of others. But clearly Trump is saying, well, you didn't come up with enough to knock me off to kill me, so I'm still kicking and I'm going to kick back now.

It's a pretty pathetic thing for a president to say to analogize himself with being a monarch. Even Nixon didn't go there.

CABRERA: John Dean, I always appreciate our conversations. Thank you so much for being here.

DEAN: Likewise, Ana. Thank you.

CABRERA: Coming up, frontrunner under fire? Hear how the Democratic candidates are voicing concern about potentially having Bernie Sanders at the top of the ticket.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:15:50]

CABRERA: We are now days away from the next Democratic caucuses, this time in Nevada. And Joe Biden who is yet to land a win says he thinks he'll come in first or second. But it's not Biden other candidates are targeting in the lead-up to Nevada. Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHUCK TODD, NBC'S "MEET THE PRESS": If his supporters are attacking Culinary Union members, who is responsible for that?

JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Look, he may not be responsible for it, but he has some accountability. If any of my supporters did that, I'd disown them, flat disown them. PETE BUTTIGIEG (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Senator Sanders' plan, by

definition, abolishes private plans like what the Culinary workers and other workers across Nevada and America have. Mine does not.

SEN. AMY KLOBUCHAR (D-MN), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'm the only one on that debate stage when asked, do you have a problem with a socialist leading the Democratic ticket, that I said, yes. And that is despite the fact that Bernie and I are friends. We came in together.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CABRERA: With us now Democratic strategist Joe Trippi and CNN presidential historian, Douglas Brinkley.

Joe, the fact that multiple candidates are going after Sanders today, is that a sign they think he's going to do well in Nevada?

JOE TRIPPI, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Yes. More likely than not. He's won the first two or tied Buttigieg in Iowa and won New Hampshire outright. I think there are clear signs that he's in the lead and likely to win in Nevada as well. I don't think -- I think everybody's fighting for second, third place there from everything I'm seeing right now.

CABRERA: And yet Sanders didn't beat Hillary Clinton in the primary or in the caucus in Nevada last time around. So why are you so confident he would win there this time?

TRIPPI: Well, it's not going to take a whole lot with this large a field. It may only be 25 percent, 26 percent, 22 percent that wins it. That's what sustained him in the first two states. He's in the lead right now in terms of the -- you know, the performance in the first two states, maybe in Nevada. But the fact is there's a very low threshold. You're going to have to -- sooner or later one of these candidates is going to have to break out and get into the 30s, the 40s, and -- you know, and beyond.

And there's only been one candidate who's gone wire-to-wire and had the nomination outright at the convention in the last 20 years and that was John Kerry in 2004. Otherwise even Obama got there needing some other delegates to come aboard, Clinton in 2016 the same thing. So, look, it's going to be a long, long slog to get there, even for Bernie Sanders, if he can. And that's still a big question mark.

CABRERA: Joe Biden was asked how badly he needs to start seeing some wins, especially in South Carolina and listen to his answer.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TODD: South Carolina is it. Isn't it? I mean, you have to win that.

BIDEN: Well, I think I have to do really well in it. But --

TODD: Is there such a thing as doing well without winning for you?

BIDEN: Well, I think so. But look, it's -- look, right after that, within March of course we end up with going into all the sates which the polling data is now showing me doing incredibly well. Whether it's North Carolina or Georgia or Texas or any of these other places. So look, it's not an apt comparison, but Bill Clinton lost his first eight, 10, 12 primaries and caucuses before he won one.

I don't plan on taking that long. But we're just getting to the meat of getting to the number of delegates you need to be able to win this election. And I'm confident we're going to be in good shape.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CABRERA: Doug, what did you make of that comparison to Bill Clinton and his success early in the contest?

DOUGLAS BRINKLEY, CNN PRESIDENTIAL HISTORIAN: Well, Bill Clinton is the comeback kid. So whenever you're down a little bit, you want to evoke him or later Harry Truman for being able to win in 1948. I don't think Joe Biden has a path forward if he can't win in South Carolina. I agree with Joe. In Nevada, go with Bernie, Biden needs to come in second or third.

[20:20:03]

If he comes in fourth that's a problem. But if he can't win in South Carolina, then you're moving into Super Tuesday, and at that point Michael Bloomberg gets into the mix. And it's going to start feeling like either Klobuchar or Bloomberg are the moderate lane while Bernie Sanders is procuring the more progressive --

CABRERA: But to the point that Joe Biden was making, Bill Clinton didn't win those first four states. It wasn't until Super Tuesday that he got a win on the board. So why are you seeing it different in terms of his potential success?

BRINKLEY: Because his strength is with African-Americans, Joe Biden, and you know, South Carolina is 60 percent, you know, African-American voters in the Democratic Party. So Biden has got -- he is losing, he's dropping in South Carolina. It's not an upward arrow form right now. He needs a breakout moment.

CABRERA: OK.

BRINKLEY: He might get it in Nevada. I mean, the caucus first was born by Harry Reid kind of created it in 2008 in Nevada, and Hillary Clinton won in 2008. But Barack Obama goes on to be the nomination. I think Nevada is important this year because it is the first time with the meltdown in Iowa. What happened in New Hampshire put Buttigieg up and Klobuchar. This is a chance out there for Biden to make a say with Latino voters.

CABRERA: Right. And South Carolina, Joe, was supposed to be an absolute firewall for Biden. He again sort of downplaying his chances there? Much like he did in Iowa and New Hampshire? Do you read into that?

TRIPPI: Well, look, I agree with David. He needs to get a second or third in Nevada. But he has to win South Carolina to move forward I think to get that boost that he's going to need into Super Tuesday. I mean, David talked about Bill Clinton surged there --

CABRERA: Doug.

BRINKLEY: It's Doug.

CABRERA: It's Doug, sorry.

(LAUGHTER)

TRIPPI: I'm sorry, Doug. Yes. Yes. I'm sorry, but as Doug said, Bill Clinton surged in those Super Tuesday states, but his strength too was with African-Americans in those states. I mean, he won his fair share of white Democrats, obviously. But he just overpowered the rest of the field that year with African-Americans. And Joe Biden had that, it's slipping away. I think it's going to take a win in South Carolina to drive that forward into Super Tuesday for him. But if he does get that win, he could be the comeback kid.

CABRERA: President Obama hasn't endorsed anyone yet. He said he wouldn't. So it's not surprising he was going to wait until the primary process plays out. But in January of 2016 he did weigh in on the election saying, quote, "I've gotten to know Hillary really well, and she is a good, smart, tough person who cares deeply about this country, and she has been in the public eye for a long time. And in a culture in which new is always better, and, you know, you're always looking at the bright shiny object that people haven't seen before, that's a disadvantage to her."

Now he did go on to say some nice things about Sanders as well, and he said the more important contrast was between Democrats and Republicans. But Biden was Obama's Veep, Doug. I mean, why do you think he's choosing to not weigh in here? What is, I guess, the history of, you know, past precedents weighing in?

BRINKLEY; Well, I think Barack Obama's brand has changed. And a kind of a younger candidate, that's not Joe Biden. But make no mistake about it, Obama loves Joe Biden, they're close friends. But there's feeling is that Biden had to earn this on his own. What's wrong with the Obama strategy here is nobody thought Michael Bloomberg could come in and almost every five minutes put a commercial showing him next to Barack Obama.

CABRERA: Or using Obama's voice for the entire commercial.

BRINKLEY: Boy, you'd be forgiven if you'd thought that -- you know, watching those that you didn't think that somehow Obama was blocking Bloomberg. And he has that war chest, Bloomberg, where Joe Biden has been having a tough time on the fundraising. So Obama is the hero of the party, we are going to have a race to the White House tonight.

CABRERA: Yes.

BRINKLEY: Looking Alabama roads, yes, we can. Do you realize that the Democratic Party today, 44 percent of the people of the Democratic Party say no we can't, we're not going to be able to beat Trump? So the Democrats need a big morale boost, and instead you're creating all these lanes and seven candidates that have a shot at it. And it needs to get clarified pretty soon. But I don't think you'll have Barack Obama who's busy writing his two volumes of memoirs. You're not going to have him engaged at this stage in the game.

CABRERA: Well, gentlemen, thank you very much for being here and helping us through the primary process. Doug Brinkley and Joe Trippi, it's great to have both of you.

Be sure to join CNN. We have a series of town halls this week with the top 2020 Democratic candidates live from Las Vegas ahead of the caucuses. Tuesday and Thursday night at 8:00 Eastern only on CNN.

[20:25:07]

Still ahead this hour, hundreds of Americans quarantined for two weeks aboard a cruise ship because of coronavirus are now ready to head home. Plus, how fears about the coronavirus has set off a worldwide wave of racism.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CABRERA: More than 300 Americans are headed home from Japan after being stranded aboard a cruise ship during the coronavirus outbreak. They took off earlier today from Tokyo on two 747 jets chartered by the State Department and will be quarantined for 14 days once they touchdown in the U.S.

[20:30:00]

The numbers are growing in this outbreak but the fact is, the great majority of confirmed cases in all but five of the reported coronavirus deaths have been confined to mainland China.

Still, fears sparking a wave of bias and xenophobia across America, and anyone of Asian descent may find themselves a target. CNN's Natasha Chen has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NATASHA CHEN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Around the world, the coronavirus has elicited legitimate concern, but along with that, a dose of racism. This week in Plymouth, Indiana, this person at a Super 8 denied a room to the two Hmong men, filming this video.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you're from China, I need to know.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because why?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because of the coronavirus going around, and anyone from China, I am told, has to be picked up and quarantined for two weeks.

CHEN: Actually, it's people returning to the U.S. who have traveled to China's Hubei Province recently, not just anyone who may look Chinese. Wyndham Hotels who franchises Super 8 said they're deeply troubled and that there is no corporate policy denying rooms to guests who are Chinese. Aside from denial of service, people are reporting incidents of verbal abuse.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I said you dropped your coronavirus.

CHEN: And physical attacks. The New York Police Hate Crimes Task Force is asking the woman wearing the face mask in this video, to report it for a full investigation. The person who recorded this says before the camera started rolling, the man had hit the woman on the head, used expletives and called her diseased. She says the video then shows the woman chasing the man who turned around and attacked her.

She says the initial conflict seemed to be over face masks, commonly used in Asia long before the coronavirus, as a preventative measure, not a sign that the person is necessarily sick. On the L.A. subway line, this man was ranting.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Every disease has ever came from China, homie. Everything comes from China. Because they're [BLEEP] disgusting.

CHEN: Tanny Jiraprapasuke told CNN the man was looking at her before she started recording and believes she was the only person of Asian descent on the train.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They can be so smart and be like, oh yes, I developed this, I developed that. But like yes, you can't even wipe your ass.

CHEN: She said she went home that night and didn't realize until she looked online that around the world, there were other reported cases of racism connected with the coronavirus.

TANNY JIRAPRAPASUKE, RECORDED CORONAVIRUS RANT: Just touched me in a way. It made me realize how big this is and that what happened to me definitely is not unique. What happened to me is not the worst that it can be.

CHEN: Natasha Chen, CNN, Atlanta.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:35:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CABRERA: Frightening moments at London's Heathrow airport. A British Airways jet was forced to abort its landing due to high winds due to England's so-called storm of the century. In this footage, you can see the aircraft tipping from side to side in the air and then, watch. The tires eventually make contact with the runway, but then the plane bounces back into the air. Officials say the storm was packing winds of 60 miles per hour at the time. A big oops today from President Trump's campaign. Someone on the president's team tweeted this dramatic photo showing Air Force One above the grandstands at the Daytona 500 where the president served as the grand marshal today. Great photo, but there's only one problem, the picture is from 2004 when President George W. Bush attended the Daytona 500.

The photo stayed on the campaign's Twitter feed for about three hours. It was shared nearly 7,000 times before sharp-eyed users pointed out the mistake and the photo has since been deleted. We're back in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:40:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CABRERA: Tonight, Kobe Bryant is being honored at the NBA's All-Star game in Chicago. Singer Jennifer Hudson just performed a special pregame tribute to Bryant and his daughter, Gianna. And the league is unveiling a permanent change for the All-Star MVP trophy naming it the Kobe Bryant MVP Award.

All-Star team captains are also wearing jerseys with the number 2 for Gianna or the number 24 which Bryant wore. Members of both teams are wearing jersey patches displaying nine stars, one for each victim of the helicopter crash.

A stunning admission from Catherine, Duchess of Cambridge, about motherhood. The royal mom of three confessing she absolutely struggles with bouts of mommy guilt and sometimes questions her own parenting decisions. Catherine and Prince William are parents to three kids, 6- year-old Prince George, 4-year-old Princess Charlotte and toddler Prince Louie. And she opened up about being a mother on a British podcast.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GIOVANNA FLETCHER, HOST OF HAPPY MUM, HAPPY BABY PODCAST: Do you struggle with mum guilt?

CATHERINE, DUCHESS OF CAMBRIDGE: Yes, absolutely. I think anyone who doesn't as a mother is actually lying. Yes, all the time. Yes, and even this morning, coming to the nursery visit here, George and Charlotte were like, Mummy, how could you possibly not be dropping us off at school this morning? But off at school this morning. But know it's a constant challenge.

You hear it time and time again for mums, even mums who aren't necessarily working are pulled in, in the directions of having to juggle work life and family life --

FLETCHER: There's always something.

CATHERINE: There's always something. Exactly. And always sort of questioning your own decisions, and your own judgments and things like that. And I think that starts from the moment you have a baby.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CABRERA: Be sure to tune in tonight the all-new CNN Original Series, "THEWINDSORS: INSIDE THE ROYAL DYNASTY" premiers at 10:00 Eastern and Pacific, only on CNN.

If you look at Twitter, you might be convinced this is the craziest presidential campaign in history. But as CNN's new series shows, almost nothing is beyond belief in the high-stakes race for the Oval Office.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So, you want to be the leader of the free world? Just how far will you go to get what you want?

BARACK OBAMA, THEN-PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The hope of a skinny kid with a funny name who believed that America has a place for him, too.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He just got to the Senate. The general feeling was that was pretty audacious.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He said, I'm not getting in this to lose.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Lyndon Johnson, he's one of the most (INAUDIBLE) players in American politics and basically will do anything.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We figured out that we must be being bugged.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He put a black book on my desk. I probably should have said, where did you get this, Bill?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's impossible to overestimate how furious Ford was. You do not challenge the president of the United States when he's an incumbent.

[20:45:10]

OBAMA: I promise you, we as a people, will get there.

RONALD REAGAN, THEN-PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We'll make America great again.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: RACE FOR THE WHITE HOUSE, tonight at 9:00 on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:50:01]

CABRERA: With the 2020 primary season now in full swing, CNN's all new season of "RACE FOR THE WHITE HOUSE" is looking back at some of the most hard-fought presidential races in history, including the 2008 matchup between Barack Obama and John McCain.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: In Hillary Clinton's office is a photograph of the Obama family, a gift from the freshman's senator from Illinois.

OBAMA: People call me Alabamer. They call me yo mama. But the name's Obama.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Barack Obama really wasn't on our radar as a candidate in early 2006. I think the general feeling was, he just got to the senate, there is no way he's going to run for president. That would be pretty, you know, audacious.

DAVID AXELROD, FORMER SENIOR ADVISOR TO PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA: I got a call from Senator Obama in the spring of 2006, and he said, just had the most peculiar meeting. He said, Harry Reid and Chuck Schumer called me in.

ANNOUNCER: Senators Harry Reid and Chuck Schumer, top democratic dogs on the Hill.

AXELROD: And Harry said, you ought to think about running for president.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CABRERA: I had a chance to talk with that man you just saw, David Axelrod, the Former Senior Adviser to President Barack Obama and Charlie Black, Former Senior Strategist on the McCain campaign.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CABRERA: David, you know, when Obama started out, he wasn't the frontrunner. He wasn't even a household name. But he really embraced the power of social media to build his brand, and that famous hope poster. So many of us think of when we think of that campaign season. It became symbolic of his campaign. What do you remember most about all of that?

AXELROD: Oh my, there are a rush of memories from that campaign. And you're quite right, it was -- it was an audacious act to run when we first met to talk about the race, there were eight of us in the room, and that was the entire Obama for America organization. But we had a sense that through social media, we could quickly build an organization, nationally, particularly among young people. And that -- and that came to fruition.

But my other memory, Ana, probably one of my great memories in politics was not from our campaign, but was from the McCain campaign, when John McCain late in the campaign confronted a crowd of people in particular, questioners who were questioning Obama's citizenship and whether he could be trusted, and McCain really recoiled from that.

And I looked back at that then, and that was the beginnings of something that really unfurled over time. I mean, you saw in the room some of the roots of what has become Trumpism in this country.

CABRERA: Charlie, I want to play that moment that David Axelrod referenced there about, you know, confronting or rebuking supporters of his, who were feeding into that conspiracy theory about Barack Obama not being from this country or, you know, being Muslim. Let's watch that moment.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I can't trust Obama. I have read about him, and he's not -- he's not -- he's a -- he's an Arab. He is not --

JOHN MCCAIN, FORMER SENATOR OF ARIZONA: No, ma'am. No, ma'am.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No?

MCCAIN: No, ma'am. No, ma'am. He's a -- he's a -- he's a decent family man, citizen, that I just happen to have disagreements with on fundamental issues. And that's what this campaign is all about. He is not. Thank you.

CABRERA: Charlie, was it even a second thought for McCain to do that?

CHARLIE BLACK, CHIEF STRATEGIST, MCCAIN CAMPAIGN: Ana, it wasn't. That's just who John McCain was. And John believed in having a vigorous campaign fought on the issues. He believed in civility. He did not like personal attacks. I think the same could be said of then- Senator Obama. We actually had a tough hard-fought campaign. But most of the rules of civility were honored during the campaign.

CABRERA: McCain was trying to contend, you know, with the legacy of George W. Bush and some of the baggage that came with that. And he made a pretty big gamble in choosing the little-known governor of Alaska as his running mate. Let's watch another clip.

SARAH PALIN, FORMER GOVERNOR OF ALASKA: I was just your average hockey mom and signed up for the PTA. I love those hockey moms. You know they say, the difference between a hockey mom and a pitbull? Lipstick.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There was not another word to be breathed about Barack Obama on the evening news that night. It was all Sarah, all- week long.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was surprised and elated. She was known as a Conservative Republican, a solid conservative, outspoken.

[20:55:07]

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She's particularly popular with white working- class evangelical churchgoers.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She had a great impact on the ticket and boosted McCain's chances. She drew bigger crowds out in the country than McCain did.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: McCain had no real argument for why you should beat Barack Obama. But when he picked her, a significant slice of the country just lit up. CABRERA: She certainly had an impact on the ticket. She really excited conservatives, Charlie. But it was a bit of a double-edged sword, wasn't it?

BLACK: Well, it's true that she might've been too conservative for some suburban voters. But McCain was popular with a lot of them. The problem was, John was not the most conservative candidate in the party, and he had some conservative falloff among rank and file voters. And she did galvanize the conservatives. She helped our ticket. David will tell you we went up in the polls for about 10 days after that, and then all of a sudden, we had the financial crisis, which defined the race after that.

CABRERA: David, tell me about Obama's decision to pick Joe Biden as his running mate.

AXELROD: Yes. Well, it's interesting because it, sort of, relates to this Palin situation. Obama obviously knew Biden from the senate. He served on the Foreign Relations Committee, Foreign Affairs Committee. But he -- and he had known him as a candidate on the campaign. He, you know, Joe Biden ran against Barack Obama in 2007 and 2008. They were on the debate stage together. He was impressed by the way Biden handled himself there.

But he really felt it was an advantage, and obviously, Biden had other advantages. He had 36 years of experience in Washington, Obama didn't have that experience, experience with world leaders, a relationship with the voters of states like Pennsylvania that were going to be important in the election. But at the bottom line, Obama also wanted someone who had experienced the national campaign. And when -- because he said, you know, the maelstrom of a presidential campaign is such that you can't really be prepared for it. You can't learn -- he said it took me six months to learn how to deal with all of these. And when McCain picked Palin, Obama's reaction was, look, she may be the greatest politician since Ronald Reagan and she can handle all this, but I give this a month. And in a month, we'll know whether this pays off.

CABRERA: On the night that Obama won the election, you'll recall both men gave these speeches that weren't just gracious. They were aimed at really uniting the country. Let's just remember here with a clip.

MCCAIN: In a contest as long and difficult as this campaign has been, his success alone commands my respect for his ability and perseverance. But that he managed to do so by inspiring the hopes of so many millions of Americans who had once wrongly believed that they had little at stake or little influence in the election of an American president, is something I deeply admire and commend him for achieving.

OBAMA: As Lincoln said to a nation far more divided than ours, we are not enemies but friends. Though passion may have strained, it must not break our bonds of affection. And to those Americans whose support I have yet to earn, I may not have won your vote tonight, but I hear your voices. I need your help. And I will be your president too.

CABRERA: Charlie, we don't hear about decency in politics a lot these days. How do we get it back?

BLACK: Well, Ana, it really depends on the leadership of the candidates. Those two happen to be statesmen who believed in civility and who seriously meant it. They were friends even though they differed greatly on issues. So, we need more leaders who will take that same kind of attitude. There are some on the scene, but maybe not the right ones in the right places these days.

CABRERA: What are your thoughts, David?

AXELROD: Well, look, I think what's striking about those clips as you saw two people who understood that the responsibility of leadership and particularly at the presidential level, is to bring this big diverse disparate country together. And most presidents see that as part of their task, the thing that is unusual about the times in which we live, is that we have a president whose political project really relies on dividing the country and on speaking only to his political base.

And that has changed the tone of our politics. He's not entirely responsible for that, but he has the biggest megaphone and it's having an impact.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CABRERA: My thanks to David Axelrod and Charlie Black. I'm Ana Cabrera. The CNN Original Series, the "RACE FOR THE WHITE HOUSE" starts right now.