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Gov. Andy Beshear (D-KY) is Interviewed about Mail-in Voting, Education, Stimulus; Bruit Hit by Huge Explosion; Defense Officials Dispute Trump's Claim of Beirut Attack; Arizona Pushes for Schools to Reopen. Aired 9:30-10a

Aired August 05, 2020 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:30:00]

GOV. ANDY BESHEAR (D-KY): Because we did it right, we did it through a secure method. But I think we're at the point in time with all of the different tools that we have that we can do this safely and without fraud.

And, again, it worked.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Yes.

BESHEAR: We had more people vote in the primary than all but one primary in our past. Why would we move backwards?

SCIUTTO: Yes.

BESHEAR: This is the way that we're going to vote in the future. It's easy. We'll have more people vote. That's good for democracy.

SCIUTTO: So what do you say then to the secretary of state and other Republicans in Kentucky who don't want to have the same availability of mail-in voting in the general election?

BESHEAR: Well, that's currently under discussion. We've just gotten our first set of recommendations that includes a significant piece of absentee ballots, no excuse absentee ballots. It actually includes a longer period of time for early voting.

So now I'm going to get a formal recommendation from the secretary of state and we're going to sit down and work it out. And I'm still confident that we can come to an agreement that will expand the availability of voting while making sure it's safe in the middle of Covid.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

BESHEAR: I want as large of a turnout as possible with everybody being healthy and safe.

SCIUTTO: Yes. You think that's something that everyone could agree on. I want to talk about Covid-19. Yesterday you said that there had been

18 new cases that including children under the age of five. And you said this last month, which caught our attention. Just want to remind our viewers of it and then ask you something.

Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BESHEAR: I don't want to be a state where a doctor has to look at ten young people knowing they have three ventilators and make a decision in possibly who lives and who dies.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: The president said this morning that children are basically immune to this. Is that what you're seeing in Kentucky?

BESHEAR: Well, we're seeing a very concerning trend in Kentucky with more of our kids 18 and under, but really more kids five and under coming down with the virus. And while kids seem more resilient, while they have significantly fewer negative outcomes, there are still negative outcomes.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

BESHEAR: So the more kids who get the virus times whatever percentage have that negative outcome means we're having kids being put in harm's way. And I don't just come at this as a governor, I come at this as a dad.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Right.

BESHEAR: I have a 10 and an 11-year-old and their safety is so critical. We've got to understand that kids are getting this virus. We don't understand all of the long term impacts of it. We look at mortality, but there are other potential long term impacts and we've got to protect our kids.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Yes.

And to your point, yes, it's a smaller percentage than people who are older. I just wonder as you make a decision about reopening schools, do you believe it's therefore unsafe to begin with in-person instruction?

BESHEAR: When we look at in-person instruction, we've got to look at the health of our children, also of our teachers, our administrators. Every school is almost a living organism where you have people coming from different counties that work there, you have the different vendors, those that stock the cafeterias. You have a lot of different interactions that we've got to think through.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

BESHEAR: And so I just want to make sure that we are careful. Do I think that there is a path for in-person instruction? Yes, but you have to get control of the virus first.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

BESHEAR: And we are working very hard on that in Kentucky. But I recommended that we push back in-person instruction in the very least a couple weeks to make sure that we could get ahold of where we are right now.

SCIUTTO: On May 20th you told me that every state needs funding to help with budget shortfalls and that states cannot go bankrupt. As you know, lawmakers still debating aid to states, among other things, in the next stimulus bill.

Is Kentucky in danger of possibility going bankrupt without federal help?

BESHEAR: Kentucky is in danger of having the largest budget cuts in our history. We're looking at about a $1.1 billion shortfall. And in context of our budget, that would result in the most significant cuts, not just of my lifetime, but as which can go back in our history.

It is absolutely essential in the next CARES Act funding, whether it's the HEROES Act or the HEALS Act that they do two things. Number one, state and local, because local governments are in the same situation. There must be budget stabilization. If we did it during the Great Recession, why would we not do it now in the middle of an international health pandemic where we are also facing even greater economic uncertainty and difficulty.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

BESHEAR: And, second, we have to continue to have that additional unemployment help.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

BESHEAR: It is significantly helping our economy here. And those two things are going to be the key in how long this recession lasts.

SCIUTTO: Just for --

BESHEAR: I believe we can bounce back, but let's do the smart thing.

SCIUTTO: OK, great.

And just very quickly, Kentucky Derby, already delayed. Are the horses going to run?

BESHEAR: Well, we know the horses are going to run. But we hope that it will be an experience that can also have some level of fans that are there.

[09:35:02]

We're watching it very closely. Churchill Downs, who hosts the Derby, wants it to be a safe experience. They're watching it very closely too.

And we're doing to see especially after this week exactly where we are. We have a mask mandate in Kentucky. Our folks are masking up. We call it Mask Up KY. They're doing a great job. And so we hope that this is the tool, along with some others, to get us in a place where we can do a lot of what we used to.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

BESHEAR: But it requires all of us to put that mask on and to be safe.

SCIUTTO: Let's hope we hear "My Old Kentucky Home" before they race.

Governor Andy Beshear, thanks very much.

BESHEAR: Thank you, Jim.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Well, now to the devastation in Beirut. Entire streets wiped out and hundreds of people are still missing this morning after that deadly explosion in the city. The latest on the rescue efforts and what happened, next.

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[09:40:14]

SCIUTTO: As we speak, a huge rescue effort is underway in Beirut after that just massive explosions that witnesses say whipped out entire streets. Look at this new drone video. Goodness. Looks like Dresden after bombing in World War II. I mean just shocking.

Hundreds of people are still missing in that rubble there. At least 100 killed. Thousands injured. Officials feel the number of dead, sadly, will rise dramatically and you can imagine why looking at that.

HARLOW: Yes, it's hard to see a city, Jim, you and I have both spent time in.

Our senior international correspondent, Ben Wedeman, has lived there for years and joins us now.

Ben, your recounting of this is harrowing. I mean you said it's like nothing you've ever felt before.

BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I've -- I've been in Lebanon for the civil war, wars with Israel, political assassinations, but what happened yesterday, one massive explosion was something I've never seen before here. And nobody else I've spoken with has either.

At this point, in addition to the dead and the wounded, the mayor -- the governor of Beirut is saying that at least 300,000 people have been made homeless by this explosion.

We're not far from the port where that explosion took place. Behind me is (SPEAKING IN A FOREIGN LANGUAGE), the Lebanese state electricity company. Almost every window there has been knocked out. And when you walk down this street here, you see cars that have been smashed, buildings that have simply collapsed.

And throughout the day we've seen an incredible effort by hundreds -- probably thousands throughout Beirut, volunteers, young people coming in to help people who have been displaced, to move their property out. And others are helping just to clean up the streets, clear out the rubble and just try to get order in this city that is right now in complete disorder.

We've got young people with brooms trying to clean up the street. And, of course, Poppy, Jim, there is continued demands on the government to get to the bottom of that explosion yesterday which supposedly was caused by the ignition of 2,750 tons of a highly explosive chemical substance that apparently had been in the port for years. We'll see what that investigation comes up with.

Poppy. Jim.

HARLOW: Ben -- Ben, it's a tragedy. I have a very close friend who lives there and she is just -- she is just devastated. We're so glad you're OK, Ben. Thank you very, very much.

So Defense Department officials tell CNN there's no indication in the explosion that anything was planned, that there was a planned attack. No indication. Though the president called it that just yesterday in a briefing.

Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: This was not a -- some kind of a manufacturing explosion type of event. This was a -- seems to be, according to them, they would know better than I would, but they seem to think it was an attack. It was a bomb of some kind.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Yes, it's not clear what the president's referring to there.

Three officials pointed out to CNN that if it had been an attack, there would have been an increase of protection, security for U.S. assets, personnel, locations, in the region. That hasn't happened.

CNN national security reporter Ryan Browne at the Pentagon with more.

What are officials there telling you?

RYAN BROWNE, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER: Well, Jim, officially the Pentagon is choosing not to comment on the president's comments, referring everything back to the White House. But defense sources are telling us that despite President Trump saying that it was the assessment of his generals that this was an attack, a bomb of some kind, every indication that the U.S. military has received at this time indicates that it was, in fact, an accident, that there was not an attack or an explosion.

And that matches much more closely with what Lebanese officials are saying about what took place with the storage of that explosive material and some kind of accident. Defense -- multiple defense officials, including senior officials, telling CNN that there's no evidence at this time to indicate that there was any kind of attack, any kind of a bomb.

Now, of course, they will continue to assess this and will continue looking at it. It's always possible that some new evidence will emerge. But despite President Trump saying that it was the assessment of his generals, that this was an attack or some kind of bomb, there doesn't seem to be anyone here at the Pentagon who agrees with that assessment.

Jim. Poppy.

[09:45:00]

HARLOW: Ryan Browne, thank you very, very much for that impotent reporting.

BROWNE: You bet.

HARLOW: Arizona's governor wants schools -- has been pushing for schools to reopen in person in less than two weeks. One superintendent in the state calls that plan a fantasy. He's here to explain why.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: Arizona's governor is ramping up his push to try to reopen schools physically in the next two weeks. Governor Ducey wants students back in the classrooms by August 17th. He is expected to meet with the president this afternoon.

Our next guest is a superintendent in a small Arizona town that calls the governor's plan a, quote, fantasy, and he writes this in a very moving "Washington Post" op-ed.

[09:50:04]

Quote, every time I start to play out what that looks like on August 17th, I get stick to my stomach. More than a quarter of our students live with their grandparents. These kids could easily catch the virus, spread it and bring it back home. It's not safe. There's no way it can be safe. If you think anything else, I'm sorry, but it's a fantasy. Kids will get sick or worse. Family members will die. Teachers will die.

I am joined now on the phone by Jeff Gregorich, superintendent at Hayden-Winkelman School District. It's about hundred miles east of Phoenix.

Good morning, Mr. Superintendent. I appreciate you being with us.

JEFF GREGORICH, SUPERINTENDENT, HAYDEN-WINKELMAN SCHOOL DISTRICT IN ARIZONA (via telephone): Good morning. Glad I could be here.

HARLOW: I do not envy your position. You've been a superintendent for 20 years and you write, this is my choice, but I'm starting to wish that it wasn't. I don't feel qualified.

To give people a sense of what you're going through, when you wrote this you hadn't received for the school the Plexiglas barriers for safety, you guys were cutting up shower curtains to add as protective measures for the students. I understand there is a board meeting tonight. Do you think you're going to open the doors to your school in less than two weeks?

GREGORICH: I'm not going to recommend that we do. I know we risk losing some funding, but I think it's far more important that we keep the health and safety of our community, our children, our teachers, our staff. And that weighs into the equation. And I -- surely I'm going to recommend that we wait until there's more data that supports opening the schools. And I don't --

HARLOW: Is it up -- it's up to you, right? I mean, ultimately, you're -- you're going to be -- you're going to have to make a decision. You, yourself, say you don't think you're qualified to make. I mean it's just such an impossible choice.

GREGORICH: Well, I'm not a health expert and most of our superintendents aren't. And that's what makes this really a difficult and frustrating that we don't have any clear data that would support that we could open safely on the 17th.

You know, in the foreseeable future, kids are -- kids can catch the Covid. We know that. And they can transfer it to their families. And many of our children live with their grandparents and many are being raised by their grandparents. There's no one else if these children take it home and their grandparents were to pass away.

HARLOW: Yes.

GREGORICH: It's just too hard. And we're such a small, remote, rural community. We're close knit. And it would be devastating to our families. And it has already hit us hard with the loss of Mrs. Byrd (ph) and --

HARLOW: I know.

Well, let's tell -- Mr. Superintendent, let's show people these images of her because you do bring up one of your beloved teachers of 38 years. We're looking at her fishing now, her favorite -- her favorite thing to do. And her name is Kimberly Chavez Byrd Lopez (ph).

GREGORICH: Right.

HARLOW: As I understand it, she was teaching in your schools with -- in a classroom with two other teachers. So three of them in the same room over the summer. Remotely teaching the children. And the -- and you say they were doing everything right. They were wearing masks. They were staying six feet apart. And still they contracted Covid and this teacher died.

Do you think more teachers will die if your school begins in person?

GREGORICH: Yes. I'm going to -- I'm going to say this, I hope no more teachers die or would have to die, but I feel that if we open schools that there are -- there are going to be some teachers that will die from Covid and there will be some instructional staff, there will be some bus drivers and cafeteria workers. That worries me very much. And I, you know, I wish I didn't feel that way.

HARLOW: Yes.

GREGORICH: But having going through what I've lost with Kim -- and they were trained to do everything right.

HARLOW: I know. We did -- we did -- sorry to interrupt, sorry, just -- I do want to let you know, we did reach out to the governor's office of Arizona and did get a response from them to specifically to your comments and your op-ed because the state is now offering a 5 percent increase in funding per student for opening the doors to schools, really trying to get you to do this. And that matters to your district where 90 percent of your students rely on free or reduced lunch. So many, many are in great economic need.

Here's what the governor's office says. Quote, superintendents have asked for the tools and flexibility to be able to make data-informed decisions that are best for their students and families. The governor's plan provides that while ensuring parents have options. The department of health services is working diligently for finalizing benchmarks for the safe return of in-person, teacher-led instruction.

Does the government's guidance so far -- does the governor's guidance to you so far provide everything you need?

[09:55:03]

GREGORICH: I just haven't seen it. I've seen nothing that would really make me feel comfortable sending kids back into the classroom at this time. And I have seen some of the efforts and I commend them for trying to come up with some guidance, but I haven't seen anything that makes me comfortable with the guidance that I've seen so far from the -- from the -- from the state, I want to say.

HARLOW: OK. We are thinking about you. Good luck with the board meeting tonight.

Again, as I said, I don't envy your position. It's such a tough one. Good luck, superintendent.

GREGORICH: Thank you.

HARLOW: Of course.

GREGORICH: Bye-bye.

HARLOW: Jim. SCIUTTO: Well, we're getting new details from inside President Trump's closed-door meeting with the coronavirus task force. A source telling CNN the president still not grasping the severity of the pandemic and still doesn't have a plan.

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