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Rep. James Clyburn (D-SC) is Interviewed about the Harris Pick; Big 10 and PAC-12 Won't Play this Fall; New Covid-19 Reporting System; Failed Stimulus Talks; Inflation Data Beats Expectations. Aired 9:30- 10a

Aired August 12, 2020 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:30:00]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Swing voters in swing states. As the party has moved left, Senator Harris, who had a relatively centrist record as attorney general of California, has moved left as well.

I wonder, are you concerned that that will damage the Democratic ticket among swing voters in swing states?

REP. JAMES CLYBURN (D-SC): No, I don't, because I really believe, as I have said often, this country goes like a pendulum on the clock. This country doesn't move in the millennial plane. It goes left for a while, it goes back right for a while. We saw this country go left and elect Barack Obama. It went right back and elected Donald Trump. This country is going back to the left.

Now, I tell people all the time, wherever it goes, it passes through the center. It's going left to right, it goes to the center. Right to left, it goes to the center. So this country camps out in the center twice as much as it does left or right.

And this country started moving back to the center within months of having some experiences with Donald Trump. And so I think that this ticket is right where the country is. That's why you see Jamie Harrison running ten points above Lindsey Graham among independents in South Carolina.

SCIUTTO: Right.

CLYBURN: Just think about that.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

CLYBURN: So I really believe that this team is right where the country is.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Congressman, you told NPR last night that Vice President Biden did ask you for your opinion on some of the candidates. I assume -- I'm going -- I think it's safe to assume here that Harris is one of them that he asked you about. And as I understand it, you found out before the rest of the country found out that she was his pick.

Tell us about that call and also tell us about his mindset. How did he finally come to this decision to choose Harris?

CLYBURN: Well, I haven't talked with the vice president throughout all of this time and I wanted really to keep a public position that did not detract from the independence of Joe Biden. And so I never discussed with the public what I was discussing with him. Yes, we had several conversations. He did ask my advice about most of the people he was considering.

And I told him what I felt about each and every one of them. I never gave one a choice over the other. I simply said to him that these are the pluses and these are the minuses. And I really believe that you have to let your heart and your head go to work here after you've heard from all of us who you think (ph) -- have confidence in.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

Congressman, in the primary, as a candidate for president, Kamala Harris, she underperformed at times among black voters, sometimes finished behind not just Biden and Sanders but also Elizabeth Warren. And I wonder why you believe that is and whether you think that will be different in the general election?

CLYBURN: Well, you know, it's kind of interesting, but throughout South Carolina, I was talking to people before I made my announcement, even before -- while she was still in the race. People were saying to me that to them the dream ticket would be Biden and Harris, Biden and Harris. They wanted to see her at the second spot on this ticket. And that's a reason that a lot of people were not supporting her because they wanted to see Biden as the nominee and wanted to see her where she is today.

And I can tell you -- I can't tell you how many times I've had tweets and texts since yesterday, since this announcement, telling me, didn't I tell you this was the ticket? Didn't I tell you? Yes, people told me that often.

So I think that's where she was seen and that's one reason why people did not rush to her to be tops on the ticket --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

CLYBURN: Because they really wanted to see her exactly where she is today.

HARLOW: Congressman James Clyburn, good to have you. Thanks so much.

CLYBURN: Thank you.

SCIUTTO: Yes, indeed.

CLYBURN: I appreciate it.

HARLOW: Well, watch CNN's special live coverage of the 2020 Democratic National Convention. All the big moments. The most important speeches and insights and what it all means for the future of the party. This all starts Monday night, 8:00 Eastern, right here on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:38:58]

HARLOW: So the Big Ten and the Pac-12 say no college football this year.

SCIUTTO: Yes, but it looks like a split decision with the other major conferences.

Andy Scholes, where does this leave us? I mean can you have some conferences play and not the others?

HARLOW: Right.

SCIUTTO: What's going to happen?

ANDY SCHOLES, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: It looks like that's the road we're headed down, Jim and Poppy. You know, unlike the Big Ten and Pac-12, the ACC and SEC's medical experts are right now are advising them that they can safely play college football this fall and according to ESPN and Yahoo Sports, the Big 12 conference plans on joining the ACC and SEC in playing football this fall.

Now, the Pac-12, meanwhile, it cited the number of positive cases and difficulty obtaining rapid, accurate testing where their schools are located as reasons why the conference decided to cancel all fall sports and Commissioner Larry Scott says if conditions improve, the league would consider a return to competition after January 1st.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LARRY SCOTT, PAC-12 COMMISSIONER: We cannot bubble our student athletes like pro sports can.

[09:40:01]

We're part of a broader campus communities. Student athletes are living with peer students on campus, interacting. The health, safety and well-being of our student athletes and all of those connected to Pac-12 sports has, from day one, been our top, top priority. And it was the top priority today.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHOLES: Now, the Big Ten, meanwhile, also pulling the plug on fall sports, including football yesterday. And Commissioner Kevin Warren says there's still too much unknown about the virus.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEVIN WARREN, BIG TEN COMMISSIONER: As things began to evolve, you look at the number of cases that are spiking, the number of deaths not only in our country, in our states where many of our schools are located, but worldwide. When you look at this decision, it just -- we just believe collectively there's too much uncertainty at this point in time in our country and to really -- to encourage our student athletes to participate in fall sports.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHOLES: Now, Notre Dame, meanwhile, is planning on playing this fall as a part of the ACC. And their head coach, Brian Kelly, was on the "Today" show and said, while it's a challenging environment he thinks, with the health and safety protocols in place, they can play safely.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIAN KELLY, NOTRE DAME HEAD COACH: We believe, based upon the medical information that we have, and we believe that we have some of the best that are advising us, and taking enhanced medical procedures as long as we have a committed group and our student athletes have been committed since day one.

DAELIN HAYES, NOTRE DAME LINEBACKER: I would rather take that risk playing the game that I love and fighting for my career once I leave Notre Dame. So, I mean, I think a lot of guys feel that way. I think a lot of people expressed that sentiment, especially players across the country in their last and/or junior year.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHOLES: Yes, so to recap, the Big Ten and Pac-12 not playing this fall with hopes of playing in the spring. While the SEC, ACC and Big 12 are planning to still move ahead as planned. And not only are the SEC moving ahead, Ed Orgeron telling ABC, the head coach at LSU, that he hopes to have the stadium half full by the time they start playing games, Jim and Poppy.

I mean it is just incredible the difference of approach between the one side of the country and the other.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HARLOW: Yes.

SCIUTTO: Andy, just quickly, what does that mean for the bowl games, the BCS? I mean if like half the leagues aren't playing until spring, you don't have the same competition for the national championship. I mean can you have one?

SCHOLES: We -- we have not heard yet from the playoff committee about what they plan on doing for this fall --

SCIUTTO: Right.

SCHOLES: Because they had put the games in place. We'll wait and see.

SCIUTTO: OK.

HARLOW: Andy, thanks. Appreciate it.

Let's talk about this and a lot more with Dr. Paul Sax, clinical director from the division of infectious disease from Brigham and Women's Hospital.

Good morning. Good to have you, Doctor.

DR. PAUL SAX, CLINICAL DIRECTOR, DIVISION OF INFECTIOUS DISEASES AT BRIGHAM AND WOMEN'S HOSPITAL: Good morning.

HARLOW: So when you look at professional sports, the NBA and WNBA seem to be the only ones that have really successfully done this, right, gone back to playing, and they're in bubbles.

So let's just take what we know from that and apply it here to college. What do you make of the fact that you've got Pac-12, Big Ten out now but the other conferences saying they're going to play and they can do so safely? Can they without a bubble?

SAX: Well, you know, as an infectious disease specialist, I have to say it worries me greatly to hear about these plans for sports in the college level to go forward without having good control of the virus in the communities that they're taking place in.

I think also a fundamental difference is that these are not paid athletes. Remember, these are college athletes. And I don't think it really is fair to put their health at risk regardless of whether they want to play or not.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Yes, interesting point there.

I mean, listen, it comes back to that same standard, you know, even with opening schools, if you have the outbreak under control in that community, that gives you the pathway. If you don't, it's another story.

I want to ask you about something else because to the surprise of everyone a few week ago, the administration started requiring that data -- key data on the outbreak, instead of being collected by the CDC, whose job it is, it's going to go through the HHS.

And "The Wall Street Journal" has a story this morning about how that's created confusion, delays, states can't keep track of how many people are being hospitalized, which is, of course, key to how they make decisions about reopening, et cetera.

How damaging is this in terms of the pandemic response?

SAX: One thing we've learned right from the start is that we're best at fighting this infection when we have the most accurate data. And this move away from the CDC, which has been sort of a theme from the start, really does concern us because the CDC, one of the top public health bodies in the world, really has been somewhat sidelined in this process.

And then moving these data, these critical hospital data to HHS, while that is feasible to do it right in the middle of the pandemic, it was very troubling and created some inconveniences and some delays in reporting. So the CDC was reporting three times a week before.

[09:45:02]

Now I think HHS is just reporting weekly. We have to have the data be as up to date and as accurate as possible.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HARLOW: Doctor, there was a really interesting op-ed at the beginning of the week by Dr. Paul Osterholm (ph) -- Professor Osterholm in Minnesota, along with the Minnesota Federal Reserve Chair Neel Kashkari. And they essentially argued that masking isn't enough, right? And they point to the example of California where the governor there issued a public mask mandate on June 18th when there were 3,700 Covid cases and then fast forward to July 25th with that mandate in place and there were over 10,230 cases in terms of the seven-day moving average.

Their point here is, they argue, we need a state by state up to six week shutdown, lockdown again, because they say evidence from California says even widespread masking is not enough. Do you think they're right?

SAX: Well, one thing that we've learned is the heterogeneity of the outbreaks in different regions. And so you -- you talk about the state of California, but the state of California actually has some areas, like the bay area, which have the outbreak very well under control with social distancing and masking and we have other areas, like certain sections of southern California, where that's not the case at all.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

SAX: So I think what we need are really accurate data about community incidents and prevalence of Covid-19. And then in those regions that have the highest rate of infection, that's the place to have the shutdowns. I doesn't necessarily need to be a nationwide shutdown.

We've learned a lot about how this virus is transmitted, shutting down hotspots, certainly bars and restaurants, places of worship that -- where people gather without masks. That would be the most important first step.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

So clear in the data.

Dr. Paul Sax, thanks so much.

SAX: Thank you for having me.

SCIUTTO: So it's a standoff in Washington, imagine that. No stimulus talks are set between the White House and Democratic leaders while struggling Americans, probably many of you, stuck in the middle and waiting.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:51:6]

SCIUTTO: Welcome back.

The president's top economic adviser, Larry Kudlow, says the White House is now backing off a key part of the president's executive action just a few days ago on unemployment. This as a group of freshman House Democrats expressed frustration over Congress' failure to reach a stimulus deal with the White House.

HARLOW: Manu Raju joins us from Capitol Hill.

I mean it does not look like lawmakers are getting any closer to a deal. So update us on that. But, also, be clear on what Larry Kudlow is saying here. I mean from what I read, he's saying the states no longer have to give $100 to have the federal government meet them to top up unemployment benefit, is that right?

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I mean, there's a lot of confusion about exactly what the White House is pushing for in this executive action, but it shows the concerns of a lot of members of Congress have that there is going to be confusion about what -- how this will be implemented and it could take some time to implement these enhanced unemployment benefits, which they want, which is why -- a reason why they want Congress to weigh in on this issue.

Now, we've been talking over last several days with a number of these House Democratic freshmen, people who are in tough races, people who powered Democrats back in the House majority in 2018 and many of whom were in districts that President Trump carried back in 2016 and a number of those Democrats want negotiations to resume. They want both their party leadership and the White House to compromise more. And just a few of them we talked to here, I'm going to read some quotes that they said to both me and my colleague Lauren Fox.

Max Rose from New York told me, I share the concerns that I'm hearing from my constituents. I am pissed. I'm angry. And at this point it's a middle finger to the American people. He's referring to the breakdown in the discussions.

Tom Malinowski of New Jersey said, I expect to be held accountable to what Congress does and doesn't do. That comes with the territory. He's in a very -- he's in a potentially difficult race come November.

And Dean Phillips of Minnesota told me, to me, no bill is not an option. That's not unique to this voice. I would argue that most members feel the same. The need is too great, the time too short and the risk of not doing too severe.

So, Nancy Pelosi is hearing these concerns. The question is, does that change anything? But, at the moment, as you mentioned it, no discussions between the leadership and the White House at the moment. Guys.

SCIUTTO: Yes, a lot of those -- a lot of those congressmen you cite in tough races in the fall. They know what needs to be done.

Manu Raju, thanks very much.

Also this morning, a welcome surprise for U.S. consumers, and that is that the cost of food actually is slightly down.

HARLOW: Our chief business correspondent Christine Romans is with us.

Good morning, Christine.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Good morning.

HARLOW: Why is this?

ROMANS: Well, you know, in the pandemic, in the lockdown, prices for just about everything collapsed except for food prices. Food prices rose because we were buying at the grocery store and eating at home. And now you're starting to see that change a little bit. So this is a welcome sign of the post-lockdown world that CPI actually rose. Prices started to rise again because overall prices because of demand. People came out of their homes and the economy started to reopen.

What kinds of prices? Gasoline really driving this because people are getting back in their cars and they're starting to get back to a more normal routine.

But look at food. Remember, food had soared during the pandemic because of our demand. Food prices fell a little bit. Food at home fell 1.1 percent and food prices at restaurants grew. So you're starting to see a reversal of the lockdown behavior.

Meat prices down a little bit. This is really important because this had been something that people were really feeling during the lockdown. We saw these prices soar. Now you're seeing meat, fish and eggs down a little bit and dairy down a little bit.

[09:55:01]

But then, on the flip side, look at apparel, look at used vehicles, those prices rose. Again, that's a sign of the economy healing and people getting back out and starting to buy those things.

Now, all of these things are below pre-pandemic levels, I should say, all these prices that are rising. But every single penny counts here. It shows an economy that's healing. It shows not too much inflation overall. And it really matters because we know that those jobless checks, the $600 jobless checks --

HARLOW: Yes.

ROMANS: They ended a couple weeks ago.

HARLOW: But --

ROMANS: The White House has now scaled back how much people are going to get, maybe $300 extra when they finally get that all said and done. So every penny matters here.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HARLOW: Romans, I would just say the -- the acting head of the Council of Economic Advisers at the White House said on Fox yesterday that these checks could be going out to people within two weeks. Is that true?

ROMANS: He is on the record, and we will hold him to that.

HARLOW: Yes, I heard it.

ROMANS: Two weeks. That's going to be -- that's going to be something here because you have employment law experts who have said, how are you going to get this money through the state systems. We saw how long it took to get the first round of extra checks through, you know, trying to figure out how to coordinate that. But Larry Kudlow says the Labor Department says they can have them out in two weeks. They'll be retroactive to August 1st.

But, remember, the president promised on Saturday, in front of everybody at Bedminster, $400 extra a week. Now it's going to be $300 extra. That's half of what people were getting. That still could be trouble for the economy.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HARLOW: Christine Romans, thank you.

ROMANS: You're welcome.

HARLOW: Dr. Anthony Fauci says he has, quote, serious doubts about the vaccine that Russia claims is, quote, safe and effective. Our Dr. Sanjay Gupta spoke with a Russian scientist about it. He's going to join us ahead.

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