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COVID-19 Now The Number Three Cause Of Death In The U.S.; Democrats Call On FBI To Investigate Postal Service Over Potential Crimes; Uproar As Large, Unmasked Crowds Gather Near Alabama Campus. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired August 17, 2020 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:00]

JOHN KING, CNN HOST: Anderson Cooper picks up our coverage right now. Have a good day.

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: I am Anderson Cooper and I want welcome viewers here in the U.S. and around the world.

For the 21st straight day, more than 1,000 Americans on average had died as a result from the coronavirus pandemic. It's now the number three cause of death in the United States as the nation sets grim new milestones at an alarming rate. At least 170,000 Americans have now died the virus. Just 18 days ago, that number was 150,000.

While new U.S. cases are at the lowest levels since late June, 13states are now showing an upward trend, all of that as a new school year ramps up with startling developments at some of the country's college campuses.

At the University of North Carolina in Chapel Hill, four coronavirus clusters were found just this weekend alone, three in dorms, the other in a fraternity houses. Classes have only been in session since last Monday.

This was the scene near the University of North Georgia where a large outdoor party was held in an off-campus housing area. Officials were saying they were aware of the party, expressed disappointment in the size of the gathering and the fact that face coverings were not worn. We should note that there is no mask mandate in the State of Georgia.

We'll have more on the spread in the U.S. in a moment. But, first, close ally to President Trump tells CNN that the president is enthusiastic about yet another unproven therapeutic for the coronavirus. This time from a plant that's highly toxic and can be fatal if consumed. Here is what the president said about this plant earlier today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I've heard of it, yes. Go ahead.

REPORTER: The FDA -- TRUMP: No, I haven't.

REPORTER: Is it something you would support?

TRUMP: It's something that people are talking about very strongly. We'll look at it. We'll look at it. We're looking at a lot of different things.

I will say, the FDA has been great. They are very close, we're very close to a vaccine, very close to a therapeutic. I have heard that name mentioned. We'll find out.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: CNN White House Correspondent Kaitlan Collins is with me now.

So this therapeutic is being pushed by Mike Lindell, the creator of My Pillow. How did it make its way to the White House?

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: So, he is actually pretty close to the president. They speak relatively often. We have seen him here at the White House. He used to come to those old coronavirus task force meetings that we had, the briefings that we got in the rose garden.

And so he had this July meeting with the president where he had shared these findings with not only several other officials but also the housing and urban development secretary, Dr. Ben Carson. And he said, Dr. Ben Carson looked at this data himself, they brought it to the president and that's when he confirmed to my colleague, Betsy Klein, today that the president had been, quote, enthusiastic about it.

But what we should note is that while we're discussing this, the president hasn't publicly brought this up. We're just reporting on these internal discussions that have been going on over this and Mike Lindell did say he's seen the president again since that July meeting. He said, the president did not bring it up then.

But what this is this botanical extract, as you noted, it comes from this highly toxic plant. But as it comes to coronavirus, and Mike Lindell pushing it as a possible treatment for coronavirus, there's no evidence and there has been no studies published in any peer review journals showing that it works to treat COVID-19.

It's just him pitching it to the president. They're hoping that the FDA will approve it as some kind of dietary supplement. Though, Anderson, we should be clear, that hasn't happened yet.

Now, when it comes to Mike Lindell, something to consider here, is that he was recently put on the board of this company that is making this botanical extract and, of course, he got a financial stake when he was placed on the board of that company.

So it's important to keep that in mind when you hear that he's pushing it. And he may see the president again today. He said he is expected to go to the president's event in Minnesota today, so we'll see if they bring it up there.

But, really, what this shows you is, even if the president isn't publicly pushing it in the way that we saw him do so vigorously with hydroxychloroquine, it shows that there are people who can get into the Oval Office, have a meeting with the president and pitch something like this that has not gone through the task force. Because as far as what we know from our reporting, it has not been brought up at any task force meetings, Anderson.

COOPER: And this is oleandrin, is what we're talking. Kaitlan Collins, thank you very much. We'll obviously have more on this. We have certainly been here before, an unscientific approach to coronavirus.

I'm joined by CNN Medical Analyst and Professor of Medicine at George Washington University, Dr. Jonathan Reiner. Dr. Reiner, what is this oleandrin?

DR. JONATHAN REINER, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: Oleandrin is a product of oleander, which is a toxic plant. It can produce something called a cardiac glycoside, which is similar to toxin (ph). And you can find online a pre-print non-peer reviewed paper that seems to suggest that, in vitro, so, in other words, in test tubes, there may be some anti- viral activity for this compound.

But I'll tell you that there are millions of compounds that when tested in vitro, in a test tube, appear to have some anti-viral capacity but are worthless in vivo, in humans.

[13:05:02]

A recent example of a compound like that is hydroxychloroquine, which, in vitro, appear to have anti-viral capabilities, but when tested in human beings, was worthless.

What's bothersome to me about this is less about this worthless botanical but more about the sidelining of scientists and the elevation of these sketchy characters who have access to the president and can tell the president that something is magic, you should approve it. It's incredibly disturbing to me.

COOPER: Right. I mean, when you hear proponents of this, people say things, well, I have seen it with my own eyes have incredible power, which, you know, is all well and good. It sounds great and maybe that person actually believes it but that is not actually how science works. Things are actually peer reviewed, there are actually studies done with thousands of people, control groups, placebos. It doesn't sound like that has been done with this product, as far as we know.

REINER: Not even the most basic study, not even the worst performed, you know, lousy clinical trial. Nothing has been done with this other than in vitro analysis of this compound. The highway is littered with drugs like this, which are failures, do not help patients and are distractions. And that's what this really is.

We need to focus on what we know works. We need focus on doing rigorously performed randomized clinical trials and show the way forward, prove in a scientific way what works and doesn't work. This is nonsense and a distraction.

COOPER: When it came to hydroxychloroquine, the president leaned on the FDA to have an emergency use of it to treat coronavirus, later revoked the authorization, the FDA did, after a large trial warned the drug could cause heart problems. I mean, can -- do you think the FDA could be pressured again? I mean, this is -- this is a supplement, this is not an actual like prescription medicine, right?

REINER: No. This is just a nutraceutical, basically. And --

COOPER: What is nutraceutical?

REINER: It's some an agent derived from a plant.

COOPER: Okay.

REINER: So, yes, I am concerned about that. Not only did the FDA issue an emergency use authorization for unproven hydroxychloroquine, the strategic reserves of this country acquired 60 million doses of it, so without any data for efficacy or safety. So when you hear that this has tickled the ear of the president who famously has been searching for a magic bullet, you know, to cure COVID-19, ordinarily, I would dismiss it but not with this president. His ears are very open to magic remedies.

COOPER: It also appears Dr. Ben Carson is helping push this.

REINER: Yes. Well, that's hard to understand. There is really no data to support this as any kind of serious therapeutic for COVID-19. We should focus on doing clinical trials for things like convalescent plasma. A lot of it is being used. We still don't have the data that proves that it's beneficial. We need to move synthetic antibodies forward. We need to move better testing forward, you know?

We have heard a lot of talk about the saliva direct, which is an advance but we need better tests, we need at-home tests, paper-based test. Let's have the FDA focus on getting these things forward. This is a terrible distraction.

COOPER: Dr. Reiner, I appreciate your expertise, thanks for being with us.

REINER: My pleasure.

COOPER: Large crowds gathering without masks at bars as college students return to campus.

Plus, the COVID vaccine may be delayed because trials don't yet include enough black and Latino participants.

And Democrats now asking for FBI -- the FBI -- to investigate the president's actions at the Postal Service. I'll speak live with the postal worker's president who says the U.S. Postal Service is being held hostage.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [13:10:00]

COOPER: Top House Democrats are asking the FBI to open a criminal investigation to the postmaster general and the Postal Service's board of governors over sweeping mail delays. Congressmen Ted Lieu and Hakeem Jeffries have written a letter to FBI Director Christopher Wray. They are urging him to look into mail slowdowns and operational changes by the postmaster general that have sparked public concern and fear to the election interference.

Speaker Nancy Pelosi is calling back the House early from its summer recess to deal with the crisis. Lawmakers may hold an unprecedented Saturday session in between the two presidential nominating conventions and congressional Democrats want Postmaster General Louis DeJoy to testify in an emergency hearing next Monday.

Mark Dimondstein is President of the American Postal Workers Union, joins me now. His union represents more than 200,000 employees in the Postal Service.

So, Mark, we have been hearing about the major changes at the post office slashing overtime, cutting hours, removing post office boxes and mail-sorting machines. What are you hearing from your union members about it?

MARK DIMONDSTEIN, PRESIDENT, AMERICAN POSTAL WORKERS UNION: Well, what we are hearing from our union members are two things. One, there's a lot of dismay. Postal workers are extremely dedicated to serving the people of this country and the prompt, reliable and efficient manner that the law demands and that's been underscored in this pandemic, where as much as the difficulties and the dangers we have faced, like other essential workers, we've been on the frontlines proudly carrying out that mission and connecting the people of the country.

[13:15:10]

So anything that slows down that service, that disrupts that service, that degrades that service, runs counter to everything that we stand for, get the mail to the customer on time, treat it as if it's their own. So, one, is postal workers are troubled.

Secondly, what we're hearing throughout the country, from postal workers and customers, is these changes in policy which we implemented soon after a new postmaster general came in from the outside of the post office without real knowledge of the inner workings and without consultation with the workers or the mailing community, that these policies are going to have a huge impact. Mail is being delayed. Mail is slowing down and, of course, to us, that drives business away, it drives more revenue away and it's troubling on every front.

So we have been very clear both in private discussions with this new PMG and publicly that these policies need to be reversed, people of the country support the post office and want good, solid, quick and prompt postal services and that's what they deserve and that's what they should get. COOPER: Supporters of the president say, look, these are just changes to try to make the post office more efficient, to try to save money, reduce overhead. Do you have evidence to the contrary? I mean, do you think the moves are actually intended to keep people from voting?

DIMONDSTEIN: Well, look, the fact of the matter is that Congress can really help in this situation. The post office is being hit hard by the economic impact of COVID. The Postal Service does project a huge loss of revenue over the next ten years, just as so with COVID. And it is a non-taxpayer-based independent quasi government agency. They had to have enough revenue to be able to do their job. That's falling off and there are concerns about running out of money.

But that doesn't mean that they should cut and slash services. It's not the United States Postal Business. It's the United States Postal Service. And so Congress needs to provide in this one case taxpayer appropriated emergency relief. In March, they took care of the private corporations to the tune over $500 billion. They have another opportunity. There's an ask by the Postal Board of Governors for at least $25 billion. That's what's in the House stimulus package now being -- that has moved over to the Senate. Congress really needs to get right and right by the people of the country.

And I would (INAUDIBLE) what's the cost if we need to do this and that? In terms of efficiency, it is an incredibly efficient (INAUDIBLE).

COOPER: What's happening with the mail sorting machines? Because the Trump administration says it won't remove any more of them before Election Day. How many have actually been taken offline? Do you know?

DIMONDSTEIN: I don't know. They have scheduled over 670 machines to be taken out. We're trying to find out how many have already been taken out of that number and how many are planned to be taken out.

But this just isn't the time. We are in a COVID world. Mail volume has dropped off but we're facing an election, we're facing another holiday season. Let's see what happens over the next period of time, and in terms of the mail volume

So it's very ill-timed at best. And when we combine it with all the other policies, it is troubling.

COOPER: The president also says the post office should raise prices for Amazon. That's been a long-running demand of his. I'm wondering what you make of that. Because, I mean, I know back, I think, 2006 with the law passed by Congress, I think there was a cap on pricing, wasn't there?

DIMONDSTEIN: There was a cap on pricing but the packages are what's called the competitive side. And the Postal Service has more flexibility with pricing there. But it's an interesting thing, Anderson. Here is a president that doesn't demand of airlines what they charge for ticket prices or hotel rooms, what they charge for hotels, or restaurants, what they charge for hamburgers or anything else in order to get any kind of stimulus relief in this economic crisis.

When it comes to the post office, he is trying to dictate that postal, package rate should raise four times. That will hurt every single person in this country, every single person and that uses ecommerce, every person that engages in ecommerce from the business point of view.

And, fundamentally, it would undermine the Postal Service because 30 percent of postal volume is in -- I'm sorry -- of revenue is in packages, the volume is growing, and it would just drive the Postal Service out of the package business, hurt the customers and undermine the finances that much further of the post office.

[13:20:01]

To us, it's just enough demand that would actually sabotage this wonderful national treasure for us (ph).

COOPER: Yes. Mark Dimondstein, I appreciate your time. Thank you very much.

DIMONDSTEIN: Thank you, Anderson.

COOPER: There's a new video shows packed party crowds near a college campus in Georgia. We'll have more on that.

Plus, bars also packed with students at the University of Alabama. The mayor says police are overwhelmed.

And the FDA approves a saliva test for COVID in what could be an important development.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COOPER: The State of Maryland created 24-hour hotline where people report potential coronavirus violations. Officials said that citizens were concerned about safety precautions being ignored can honestly call a toll free number. That information is then shared with local health departments, and some possibly reviewed by local law enforcement.

Here is a look other national coronavirus headlines.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I'm Rosa Flores in Miami. Another 13 school districts will be reopening in the State of Florida this week. This bring it is total number of school that have reopened to 26. We have learned about quarantines in at least two school districts, one in Bradford County, where the superintendent there says that at least five students and two teachers are under quarantine.

We also learned from a spokesperson in Martin County that 151 students there are under quarantine and 11 staff members are impacted.

ANDY SCHOLES, CNN SPORTS ANCHOR: I'm Andy Scholes in Milton, Georgia, where there are a lot of people not happy that the Big 10 is not going to have a football season this fall and many players, parents and fans aren't giving up without a fight.

Ohio State quarterback Justin Fields, who is of the favorites to win Heisman creating a petition on moveon.org to reinstate the fall football season. He shared it on social media, calling it a matter close to his heart.

The petition has more than 200,000 signatures since it was launched yesterday morning and Fields wants the conference to allow individual teams and players to choose whether or not to participate in the upcoming season. The Big 10 has not commented on the petition.

DIANNE GALLAGHER, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I'm Dianne Gallagher in Georgia. Pictures and videos from a large off-campus party near the University of North Georgia went viral over the weekend. You can see there aren't really any masks and very little, if any, social distancing happening.

Now, a spokesperson for the University of North Georgia told CNN they were, quote, disappointed, many of our students chose to ignore the COVID-19 public health guidance. On campus at the University of North Georgia, masks are required in classrooms and some public areas but not residence halls.

Still, in the State of Georgia, there is no statewide mask mandate.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COOPER: A quick roundup. Thanks.

Scenes of crowded bars near the University of Alabama's Tuscaloosa Campus has sparked outcries from the mayor and the school's athletic director. Pictures taken by the school's newspaper staff showed long lines of people not social distancing and many not wearing masks. Police issued about a dozen citations and arrested four others for violating COVID regulations.

The site even angered even one of the Crimson Tide's football players, lineman Chris Owens, begged his classmates on Twitter take safety guidelines seriously. He said, how about we social distance and have more than a literal handful of people wear a mask.

Tuscaloosa's mayor says he is desperately trying to protect the city but needs some help. Mayor Walt Maddox joins us now.

Mayor, thanks for being with us. Your city has been following the state's safer at home order, which I know expires at the end of the month, requires people to wear masks in public spaces when they can't social distance. There are some exceptions to it. I'm wondering, just judging from the photo, how hard has it been for law enforcement, for your officers to try to enforce these orders?

I don't know if you can hear me. How hard has it been for law enforcement to enforce these orders? MAYOR WALT MADDOX (D), TUSCALOOSA, AL: It's been extremely difficult because, like most places across the country, we're experiencing loss of force with COVID-19, or exposure to COVID-19. And then you put on the fact that being a large city, we are already stretched thin.

This is incredibly difficult for us to do right now because nobody wants to put law enforcement into an adversarial position but at the same time, we've got to protect our healthcare system and we've got to be able to protect our economy. We know fall will be modified but even a modified fall will save thousands of jobs. So it's both a healthcare and economic crisis for us.

COOPER: Do you find -- I mean, does it seem like most students are not adhering to masks or distance guidance?

MADDOX: I think the opposite is true. What I'm seeing is most students are. But what happened yesterday, to me, really, was a surprise because we have had instances where we have had to go in and enforce a little heavier. But yesterday was not only midday in Tuscaloosa, it was move-in day for a large number of people. And so, clearly, the message hasn't gotten out to those who are just arriving on campus.

We just completed a meeting with the university and we're going to work very hard with UAPD to ensure that everyone understands that we all have a role to play. If we want to protect the CH (ph) Regional Health Center and went to have fall, we've got to do our part by wearing a mask and by social distancing.

[13:30:02]

COOPER: Yes. I guess school starts Wednesday.