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Sen. Mark Warner (D-VA) is Interviewed on Russia; AAP Updates is Guidance for Schools; Steven Bannon Indicted; Russian Opposition Leader Hospitalized. Aired 9:30-10a

Aired August 20, 2020 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[09:32:14]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Some Democratic lawmakers are calling for the immediate removal now of the postmaster general, Louis DeJoy. They say that despite his reversal on some recent changes, considerable damage has already been done ahead of the November election.

In the same week, the president is once again stoking unfounded fears about a rigged election. His press secretary, remarkably, will not say if he will accept November's results.

And this, a new intelligence report, a bipartisan one from the Senate, revealing new information about the frequency and level of contact between senior members of the Trump campaign and Russians tied to Russian intelligence during the 2016 election.

Intelligence Committee member, ranking member, Senator Mark Warner joins me now.

Senator, thanks for taking the time this morning.

SEN. MARK WARNER (D-VA): Thank you, Jim.

SCIUTTO: I want to ask you a big-picture question for folks voting now. Four years after 2016, after Russia interfered in the election to help Donald Trump, it's the assessment of the intelligence community, they're doing it again, is our election any safer from Russian interference today than it was four years ago?

WARNER: Well, we are safer. We've seen dramatic improvement in the security of our election system. Most states have got a paper ballot backup, for example. We've seen our social media companies get a little bit better, not as good as they should be, but a little bit better on taking down some of the bots and some of the Russian misinterpretation and disinformation efforts. And, clearly, the intelligence community has got literally hundreds of people working on this. So that's all to the good.

To the bad, we still have a White House that refuses to acknowledge this threat, that it is ongoing, that it's not only Russia but it's China and Iran as well. And the Congress has not passed a single law to try to put common sense restrictions in place. And this is because the Senate couldn't -- we never got a chance to vote on anything. So even something as basic as saying, if a foreign government tries to intervene in a presidential election, there ought to be an obligation to tell the FBI.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

WARNER: We haven't passed a single rule of the road. So I'm -- I'm -- I think that legislatively we get a failing grade, but the other parts of our system have tried to improve.

SCIUTTO: To that point there about foreign help, you know, this report -- and, folks, if you're watching at home, it bears reading -- it documents high-level contacts between the Trump campaign and Russia repeated. This is Paul Manafort, the president's campaign chairman, and repeated sharing of internal polling data with Russia. A whole host of contacts.

Do you have any way of knowing if those contacts are continuing right now between members of the Trump campaign and Russia? How would we know?

[09:35:00]

WARNER: Well, you know, our report, which was completely bipartisan, five volumes, very proud of the work. And, you know, I do urge Americans to read it. It's 1,000 pages long the last one, but it's worth -- it's worth the review.

And, you know, I'm not sure it's going to change anybody's mind about what happened in 2016. But when you see the extensive nature of the contacts and then when you have, as recently as ten days ago, the American intelligence community saying that Russia is back trying to spread a disinformation campaign about Joe Biden, you know, I think we should all be concerned about that.

And what I'm trying to push the intelligence community is, you know, they need to obviously protect sources and methods, but they need to help educate the American public about this disinformation campaign so that we can be better on guard.

SCIUTTO: Yes. I get --

WARNER: Americans ought to be deciding this election, not foreigners.

SCIUTTO: I get that. But we're two months to the election. The president still refuses to warn Russia from interfering again. And your colleagues, Senator Ron Johnson, is taking information on Joe Biden, sourced from a pro-Russian Ukrainian lawmaker, information that the intelligence community says is tainted and is, in effect, interference. By doing so, is the president inviting interference by not warning away -- is Senator Ron Johnson, are others aiding and abetting interference this time around?

WARNER: Well, -- SCIUTTO: I mean, that's the difference. You know, you have folks here who are welcoming it openly.

WARNER: I still think the president does a great disservice by not being willing to call out Vladimir Putin and his agents for not being friends of America. This guy, you know, Trump is willing to call out everyone other than Vladimir Putin. And people can reach their own conclusions on that.

And I do believe the intelligence community ought to fully brief -- fully brief, you know, members of Congress and others who I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt, may at this point be unknowingly promoting Russian disinformation. Once they're fully briefed at least we'll know it's not unknowingly promoting what is a false narrative.

SCIUTTO: But we're two months away, right? I mean it's late. They're already pursuing it. they're advertising -- the president is retweeting to his tens of millions of followers, right, a recording of Joe Biden, again, information that is viewed by the intel community as Russian disinformation. I mean it's happening right now.

WARNER: Well, that's again, when you've got the president, you know, that's not very connected to the truth on virtually any level, that's where I think it really is incumbent upon the intelligence community. So it's not just another elected official of a different party, but the FBI, the CIA, the director of national intelligence office needs to put this information out in a clear fashion.

One thing that we learned from 2016, if the Obama administration had been more forthcoming, their intelligence community forthcoming about the Russian interference in 2016 we might have stopped it earlier in it tracks. The one thing we've learned -- and -- because Russia's intervention, it's not just in America. They do it in every democracy. Countries that have best defended against the disinformation, like Sweden --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

WARNER: Like Lithuania, like Estonia, they're neighbors of Russia, they do a good job of educating their public so that the public can spot that disinformation.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

WARNER: We need to do that same kind of job here in this country.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Sadly, it's being amplified in this country right now.

Senator Mark Warner, we do appreciate you joining the broadcast this morning.

WARNER: Thanks, Jim.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Yes, really important interview.

As the pandemic has forced millions of students into virtual learning, a new study shows us that so many of them do not have the resources to even finish their school work at home. How do we fix this, next.

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[09:43:20]

HARLOW: Worried about sending your child back to school? Many people are. They don't know which move is right or safest or best. The American Academy of Pediatrics has just released an update in their guidance for school reopenings. They are calling for more federal funding regardless if schools are in person or online.

Joining us to discuss is Dr. Sally Goza, a pediatrician herself, and also the president of the AAP.

It's good to have you.

You know, often your guidance gets used in political debates over schools opening. So give it to us straight without the politics, what should schools across America be doing right now?

DR. SALLY GOZA, PRESIDENT, AMERICAN ACADEMY OF PEDIATRICS: So the American Academy of Pediatrics strongly advocates that we should be really working hard toward the goal of having students physically present in school. But it can only be done if it's safe. We have to get the spread of Covid-19 down in communities. If there's a high level, it is really probably not safe for those children to be in school.

And to do this, we need the federal government to help support schools throughout the U.S., whether they're open in person, whether they're doing hybrid learning or whether they're doing online learning. Schools need the resources to make this adequate for all children because we know there are disparities there.

SCIUTTO: And that's something that often gets lost in this, right? Dr. Fauci, of course, has been very forthright with the risks of this and said that schools can reopen if you meet certain standards, benchmarks, et cetera.

I do want to ask you this because seemingly every day there's a new headline, a new finding about the role of children in spreading this, about their vulnerability, about the differences between age groups, younger kids, kids as you get into adolescents and so on.

Have you learned something recently that gives you more pause about this, about, for instance, children's ability to act as spreaders of this?

[09:45:09]

GOZA: We know that children can get Covid-19. They are not immune to this disease. We are seeing some studies that show children have the virus in their noses at levels probably more than adults. But what we don't know is how easily that's spread. There's still more to come on that. there's -- they're looking at that. There's research going on, on that. And so more to come on that. What we do know is that we know stop and slow the spread by doing the

public health things that we've been talking about, having children over the age of two wear a mask at school, when they're out in public, making sure we're having that physical distancing, the six feet apart. And then also washing our hands and trying to stay inside and -- or go outside when we can, but also to try to stay home when we can so that we're not gathering in big crowds.

HARLOW: What's new this week is that you guys are pushing for additional federal funding for all schools, right, all public education outlets whether they're in class or whether they're doing remote learning. Can you talk about the consequences, particularly for minority students in low-income areas that are disproportionately affected.

They don't have as much access to online, they don't have as many laptops, et cetera. What are the consequence if Congress does not allocate that and if any funding is blocked by the White House as the president has threatened?

GOZA: You know, we've asked Congress, we've sent a letter asking for $175 billion for K-12, and that's to go to all schools, not just to those that are opening in person. We know that those schools that are doing remote learning have students who have no access to Internet or have no Internet or no computers at home and we need to be able to make sure those children have access to that.

They also need access to healthy meals. We need to make sure that children that rely on those school meals can access those meals when they're staying at home. And so those are things that we feel and why we feel that that funding should go to all schools and not just to those that are opening in person.

SCIUTTO: Doctor Goza, we've seen around the country school districts in places that don't -- that meet the standards, right, meet the benchmarks for getting the outbreak under control and have still decided to go to purely online classes. Do you think that's a mistake?

GOZA: I think schools have to look at what's going on in their community. They need to be talking to their public health officials and to their school officials and deciding what's right for them. Every place is different. It's not a one size fits all. And we have to trust that they are doing what's best in the interest of their communities.

SCIUTTO: Great.

HARLOW: Dr. Goza, thank you very, very much. This is important for every parent and school leader and teacher to hear. We appreciate you.

GOZA: Thank you for having me.

SCIUTTO: We have this breaking news into CNN.

Federal prosecutors in the Southern District of New York have indicted Steve Bannon, former strategist -- chief strategist to President Trump, for what they say is his role in defrauding hundreds of thousands of Americans. This is in connection with the crowd funding campaign sending money to build the president's desired border wall.

HARLOW: Elie Honig, our legal analyst, is on the phone.

Elie, so just reading this indictment that just came down from the SDNY, we're talking about, you know, raising of, I believe, about $25 million. What is being alleged here?

ELIE HONIG, CNN LEGAL ANALYST (via telephone): Yes, Poppy, so this is essentially a massive embezzlement that's being alleged here and a fraud. So the fraud, first of all, is in the way that the defendants, including Steve Bannon, who's one of the four charged defendants, marketed this build the wall operation.

They essentially marketed it as an operation where if you donated this money going to be used to build the border wall. But instead -- and this is the embezzlement part -- Bannon and the others defendants essentially pocketed that money. They used it to fund their own lavish lifestyle.

In a way, obviously, it's a sensational case involving, you know, very politically charged issues relating to the wall and a well-known person, Steve Bannon. But in a way it's really a straight-forward fraud and embezzlement case. And the evidence, looking at an indictment right now, looks quite strong to me.

SCIUTTO: Wow.

Let me ask you this. The prosecutors in the Southern District of New York, they often march to their own tune, right?

HONIG: Yes.

SCIUTTO: That said, they are under the Justice Department. We have Bill Barr, a strong advocate of the president. Would these charges need the attorney general's seal of approval to proceed?

HONIG: Yes, Jim, ordinarily with cases like this, that obviously have a potential political angle, the charges would have to be -- at least notified to main Justice, typically to the deputy attorney general, the number two person. But that person certainly would have notified Bill Barr.

So, yes, I think -- I think the most reasonable way to look at this is that this was approved.

Look, the SDNY, as you said, it's famously independent. People used to call us, they still call us, the sovereign district of New York because the SDNY is famously independent from politics.

That said, as you noted, SDNY is part of the United States Justice Department, is under the control or the supervision of the attorney general. And in a case like this, with potential political implications, this is not normally, according to the policies, that has to go up to main Justice to the attorney general. HARLOW: OK. That's interesting.

Elie, don't go anywhere.

Let's bring in our colleague Kara Scannell.

This is your wheelhouse, Kara. You're joining us on the phone.

This is a -- this is a big deal. These are serious allegations against Steve Bannon and others, of course, very close to the president. And we're talking about millions of dollars here.

What do you know?

KARA SCANNELL, CNN REPORTER (via telephone): Yes, that's right, Poppy. So these charges were just announced today, and we're told by the U.S. attorney's office that Steve Bannon is in custody.

HARLOW: Wow.

SCANNELL: That he has been arrested. He will be presented later today in court. All of these hearings have been done virtually, so it's unlikely that we will see him.

But, yes, these are serious charges against Steve Bannon and others, allegedly having stole hundreds of thousands of dollars. Prosecutors allege that Bannon had used some of that money to pay one of the other members of this fundraising group, but also to pay for a lot of his personal expenses. So these are some very serious charges.

And as Elie said, this would have had to have been known at main Justice that these -- that this case was being investigated and ultimately these charges being announced today. So no word yet from Bannon's attorney, though I'm sure we will hear something in some time.

SCIUTTO: He's been arrested. How does that proceed, Kara, from here? I imagine there will be a bail hearing at some point. What are the next steps for Steve Bannon, the president's former chief strategist?

SCANNELL: Right, Jim. So he'll be processed by the FBI where he'll be fingerprinted and then he will be presented today in court in New York. That, you know, hearing where they will deal initially with, you know, initial terms of his release. We don't know yet if there is any agreement about bail. It -- because it's not a violent crime, the U.S. attorney's office generally doesn't seek to detain someone, especially during the Covid crisis.

But -- but that -- but the first step will be this initial hearing today. Those are usually pretty brief and then there will be an arraignment where Bannon will enter a plea at some point in the near future.

Jim.

HARLOW: OK, Kara, thank you. Elie, thank you. Don't go far because this is a significant development.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HARLOW: Jim, as you said, the president's chief strategist, Steve Bannon, has been taken into custody, arrested for this alleged massive fraud.

We'll be right back.

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[09:57:10]

SCIUTTO: Just disturbing news here. A top Russian opposition leader, an outspoken critic of the Russia President Vladimir Putin, is in a coma this morning after a suspected poisoning. Alexei Novalny was flying to Moscow from Siberia. Before his trip, he drank a cup of tea in an airport cafe. During the flight he began to feel sick, lost consciousness, forcing the plane to make an emergency landing.

We should note, this is not the first time a suspected attempt was made on Navalny's life and it is also not the first time a critic of the Russian government has been poisoned, often under alarming circumstances.

CNN's senior international correspondent Matthew Chance is in Moscow with more.

Matthew, I was in London when Russia poisoned Alexander Litvinenko with a radioactive substance in his tea notably at a hotel in London.

What do we know about the circumstances of this and what is Navalny's health to our knowledge at this point?

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that's right, 2006, Alexander Litvinenko poisoning with polonium 210.

What we know about Alexei Navalny is that he is unconscious, is he's in an intensive care ward in the city of Onsk (ph), which is in the middle of Siberia, where his commercial airliner was forced to land after he became sick on board en route to Moscow.

Again, he's on a ventilator. The doctors at the hospital say that, look, you know, we're not ready to make a diagnoses yet. We're carrying out tests. But, you know, those people close to him, his supporters, his lawyers are saying that this absolutely another case of being -- of a Kremlin critic, an outspoken critic of Vladimir Putin being silenced with, in this case, a poisoning and they're calling for a police investigation into that to be launched. Something that has not happened at this point.

Now, you know, we don't know at this point what exactly the circumstances were. We know he didn't eat anything or drink anything on plane. He had that cup of tea before he got on the airliner. What we do know, though, is that, as you mentioned, Russia has this

incredibly, I suppose, patchy record of applying violence to silence its most prominent critics. You mentioned Alexander Litvinenko back in 2006. The Skripals, you know, Sergei Skripal and his daughter, the former spy, in Salisbury in 2018.

You know, Anna Politkovskaya, a prominent Russian journalist, the most famous of Russian journalists in this country, she was poisoned. She recovered and then she was assassinated with a gun outside of her building. And so, you know, the suspicion is this could be yet another example of that kind of thing.

SCIUTTO: Viktor Yushchenko, former president of Ukraine, poisoned as well. I mean the pattern here is concerning.

[10:00:01]

Matthew Chance, we know you'll stay on top of this story and we'll bring you the latest as we have it. We wish Navalny a recovery from this as well.