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Dr. Anthony Fauci Warns Against Premature Authorization of Vaccine; Florida Judge Blocks State Order Requiring Schools to Reopen for In-Person Classes; GOP Makes Case for Trump, Paints Dark Picture Under Biden; Protests Across U.S. After Wisconsin Police Shoots a Black Man; Hurricane Laura Heads for Texas and Louisiana Coasts; Futures Up After China And U.S. Had Constructive Trade Talks. Aired 9- 9:30a ET

Aired August 25, 2020 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:24]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Good Tuesday morning to you. I'm Jim Sciutto.

New words of caution from Dr. Anthony Fauci this morning as the nation races for a vaccine. His words, don't rush the science, as Trump administration officials raise the possibility of doing just that. But Fauci says that could damage efforts to develop other vaccines and get people to come out and take it.

And when it comes to cases in the U.S., there is some good news and some bad news as well. Some places across the south are seeing signs of improvement. Officials are, though, raising concerns about America's heartland.

Everyone has to stay on top of this. We are following all of those headlines. Plus, on the first night of the Republican National Convention the party looks to tear up the dismal picture of Democrats have painted of Trump's presidency. An example, speakers touting his response to the pandemic, but they made no mention of the more than 170,000 lives lost in this country.

What was mentioned? Plenty of attacks on Joe Biden as well as doom and gloom scenarios if Biden wins in November.

And on the same night Republicans backed the president's handling of racial matters in this country, there are more protests in Wisconsin after a black man is shot by police in the back in front of his children.

We're going to be live in Kenosha. But first, CNN's senior medical correspondent, Elizabeth Cohen, joins me now.

Elizabeth, so with some new information about how soon a potential vaccine could be in the hand of regulators, of course the concern here is any push to let the politics infect the science here, how soon are we talking about here and what are those concerns exactly? ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, to be clear,

Jim, this is just talk. I want to be very clear about that. So folks at the University of Oxford who sort of historically -- well, this year have -- they like to talk a lot about when they're going to get things done. More so than a lot of the other companies. So take it for what it's worth.

They say that they think they will have data before regulators like the FDA by the end of the year. That is not shocking. That is actually pretty much on -- in keeping with the timeline that Tony Fauci has put out there. We will note that they did not say they think they can get it to the FDA by election day, they said by the end of the year, and that is noteworthy.

SCIUTTO: OK. So there was a lot of fanfare on Sunday night. New emergency approval of a plasma treatment. The president getting involved here. The FDA chief is -- I don't know if walking back is the word, but tempering his comments about how effective this is. Tell us what he said and why this is important.

COHEN: Yes. So it looks like the FDA chief got a little bit confused about statistics and that's why he's walking this back. Let's take a listen to what he said on CBS this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. STEPHEN HAHN, FDA COMMISSIONER: First thing I'd like to say is that I personally could have done a better job and should have done a better job at that press conference explaining what the data show regarding convalescent plasma. And I can assure the American people that this decision was made based upon sound science and data.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COHEN: So let's take a look specifically -- let's talk about specifically what he said on Sunday night. He said if 100 people had coronavirus, 35 of them would survive because of convalescent plasma. That is absolutely incorrect. Let's take a look at what is correct and we talked about this, Jim, yesterday. Exactly 24 hours ago. If people were -- in the study that was done at the Mayo Clinic and other places, people who were treated within three days, who got convalescent plasma within three days of diagnosis, 8.7 percent of them died when you watched them for seven days.

But if they were treated more than four days after diagnosis, in other words, later in their hospitalization, that death rate was 11.9 percent. That is about a 35 percent difference. That's what he was trying to say. Not nearly as dramatic as what he did say.

SCIUTTO: That's an enormous difference for the chief of the Food and Drug Administration to make.

COHEN: It is.

SCIUTTO: I mean that is -- is that a deliberate fudging of the numbers here? I mean, the president ran with those figures, too. COHEN: You know, I have to say that I always want to give people the

benefit of the doubt. This is actually a kind of a rookie public health school, first year, 101 mistake that people make all the time. And I have to just think that that was what he did, that it wasn't intentional. People make this error frequently.

SCIUTTO: Yes, I mean, that's an enormous difference.

[09:05:02]

COHEN: It is.

SCIUTTO: Which seems affected -- do we believe this affected the decision to fast track this treatment?

COHEN: No. You know, I have to say that I don't think it did. I have talked to the authors of this study and there is a difference. I mean, you can see this difference here. It is a difference. I have talked to doctors who were as skeptical as they come, and they said, Elizabeth, if I had coronavirus I would want convalescent plasma. Not 100 sure that it works, but I would want it. And so --

SCIUTTO: Right.

COHEN: So is it possible that he intentionally lied in order to make this look better? That's possible. But look, why would he have done that if the next day he was just going to have to go and walk it back?

SCIUTTO: Well, regardless it is not true to say that 35 people out of 100 would survive with this. I mean, that -- anyway, remarkable mistake to make.

Elizabeth Cohen, thanks very much.

COHEN: It is. Thanks.

SCIUTTO: This morning, Florida Education officials are appealing after a judge blocked a state order requiring schools to reopen for in- person classes five days a week.

CNN's Randi Kaye joins us now from Palm Beach County.

Randi, so this is remarkable. I mean, the state has been pressuring schools here to reopen and a judge said you can't force the schools because of safety concerns. Tell us how this plays out and what happens next.

RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Jim. So the battle over the schools here in Florida continues. Late yesterday, a Florida judge did block the order to reopen the brick and mortar schools. So that would be holding in-person classes five days a week by August 31st. And a lot of the districts, Jim, complied because they didn't want to lose their funding. Well, the judge says that order is no longer valid. The judge said that the Florida Education commissioner, Richard Corcoran, chose reopening over safety and over the advice of health experts. Florida's largest teachers' union, the Florida Education Association,

sued the governor, sued the Department of Education, and the commissioner saying that they should not open schools until it was safe so they consider this a big win. But the governor's office says, well, hold on a second. This isn't over. They do plan to appeal. The governor's office just telling me yesterday that they are confident in the governor's position and authority to do what is best for students. So we'll have to see where that goes. That's the situation here in Florida.

Meanwhile, across the country, schools, and I'm talking about colleges and universities, they are a mess when it comes to this coronavirus and the number of cases. The University of Alabama has seen more than 500 new cases. The University of Missouri has 159 positive cases in students. The University of North Carolina Chapel Hill seeing their positivity rate double in the past week to more than 31 percent. Well above what they wanted it to be.

Ohio State University also seeing students, more than 200 of them, have been disciplined for ignoring social distancing guidelines and the University of Kansas disciplining two fraternities for holding parties in the midst of a pandemic -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: So many challenges there in those colleges. Randi Kaye, thanks very much.

Well, tonight, the First Lady Melania Trump headlines day two of the Republican National Convention. Day one was not filled with the hope many Republicans had promised. Instead, the GOP painted something of a dark, almost apocalyptic picture of a nation led by Joe Biden. There was no mention, we should note, of the more than 177,000 lives lost to this pandemic, rather a celebration of the president's response.

Joining me now conservative blogger and CNN political commentator Mary Katharine Ham and former RNC communications director and Republican strategist Doug Heye.

Good to have you both on this morning. And a lot to run through from last night. First of all, ahead of the convention the president and his advisers did say, listen, the DNC convention was all about doom and gloom, we're going to have a much more hopeful view.

A little sampling, we cut together some of the quotes last night. Have a listen to this, I want to get your reaction.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, NATIONAL CHAIR, TRUMP VICTORY FINANCE COMMITTEE: They want to destroy this country and everything that we have fought for and hold dear.

REP. STEVE SCALISE (R-LA): This is an election between a party that wants to burn down the foundations of our country to the ground and a party that wants to rebuild and protect our great nation.

GUILFOYLE: They want to steal your liberty, your freedom. They want to control what you see and think.

DONALD TRUMP JR., PRESIDENT TRUMP'S SON: The very principles on which our nation was founded, freedom of thought, freedom of speech, freedom of religion, the rule of law.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: So tell me which of voters this is aimed at, Mary Katharine Ham? Is that a get out the base or is it to try to bring over some independents?

MARY KATHARINE HAM, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Frankly, I think a lot of it is aimed at the base and certainly many of those clips are. But I do think there is a segment of voters that many frankly in media and in political elite circles maybe don't believe exists and it is a perhaps a persuader voter that during this year of great turmoil, the RNC is attempting to -- the GOP is attempting to jump into a gap left by the things unmentioned last week.

[09:10:07]

There's sort of a mirror omission here. 170,000 lives lost. Huge omission. The omission for the Democrats, the mirror omission is rising violent crime rates and they're trying to jump into the gap and say we could do something about this.

The problem is for an incumbent that he's the one on watch right now. Right? But I think it's something that's rising in polling. If you look at the Pew numbers from this week. It's a fifth concern right behind coronavirus for some 59 percent of voters. So it's something they can speak to that is relevant. I think they're trying to reach people on that.

The other part is the cancel culture part of this, which you saw mentioned many times. I think that's largely a base issue but it expands beyond that as well. And that speaks to freedom of speech and the ability for people to go to church which is something that people are seeing and concerned about right now.

SCIUTTO: I get that. I get that particularly the crime issue has resonance there.

But, Doug Heye, I mean, they're talking about the end of America, burning down the foundations of this country. Hyperbole perhaps. It's not the first time we've seen that at national political conventions. What's your review of the overall message last night?

DOUG HEYE, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes, last night I saw basically a tale of two parties. And one was the doom and gloom, overpromising and things that don't really connect with voters like saving western civilization and then I saw a real lights of hope from Nikki Haley and from Tim Scott, and being a North Carolinian as Mary Katharine is as well, I usually am loathed to compliment South Carolina, but the South Carolina former governor and current senator both laid an optimistic vision. Sure they supported Donald Trump, talked about what they agreed with

him on, but they did a lot more than that. And those were two real signs that there are opportunities for Republicans to connect with independent voters who might otherwise be unpersuadable.

SCIUTTO: Mary Katharine Ham, the pandemic, loads of videos depicting a nation recovering from the pandemic and really frankly a glossing over of the administration's record here, right? I mean, the number of deaths, et cetera, painting it not -- I mean, not even glossing over, right? But turning it over and saying that the president had an enormously successful response to this. Is that a case that folks are open to hearing from this president two months from the election?

HAM: I mean, I think it's his greatest weakness so he simply must make it and people attach it to his greatest strength which is his numbers on the economy which have remained surprisingly strong throughout his term, even after coronavirus. So people connect to those two things.

Now nobody called it a metaphor which is a plus for the GOP last night but I do think they have to make this argument. Whether people are reachable on it is a whole another issue. But I think they have to make it because it connects to his greatest strength.

Now, the trick of all of this for both parties is that people are having a traumatic year. It is so hard for so many people and in very deep ways and to express optimism and hope while also acknowledging that, and saying that you have policies that can fix these very unprecedented problems, is very hard. And neither one is walking the line super well.

Last night I noticed that the school choice thing kept coming up in GOP speeches which I think is something that could directly connect to people's problems right in the moment but it doesn't quite get there. They don't talk about moms who've been on a Zoom call with their children for six hours and don't -- can't work at the same time. That is a real present problem that people aren't addressing in the moment.

SCIUTTO: No. I noted that was school is clearly something parents are concerned about, frustrated now. So the idea of school choice I can see how that resonates.

I wonder, though, where, Doug Heye, is the president's economic message right now. He does still rate higher than Joe Biden. It's actually the one category he rates higher than Joe Biden on. Bit, you know, many millions of people out of work, concerns about many of those jobs coming back, and he touts the stock market. The fact is, fewer and fewer Americans actually have a stake in the stock market. What is the substance of the president's economic message?

HEYE: Yes, I think the real challenge for Republicans here is there isn't much substance in the platform or policy proscriptions that we've seen. I'm surprised having worked on the party platform in the past that we don't really have one in 2020 which is something I never thought.

SCIUTTO: Yes. HEYE: This is an opportunity, though, for Donald Trump to talk about

what he has done with the economy, where his numbers if we were having this conversation in January, Democrats were scared to death of Donald Trump and a strong economy. And to talk about what he can do, look, I would be the first to say that we haven't brought back a million jobs, you know, in a given month based on what we've seen.

There isn't really a V-curve but there may be glimmers of hope there for the president to talk about where he can do that with specific policy proposals and what he has done and provide some optimism for people who are looking for some light at the end of this awful tunnel that we've all been in. That would bode well for the president. Unfortunately, it's just not what we've seen from him and really from leaders in his administration. Kind of any time that they do an interview.

SCIUTTO: Yes. And notable as you said there is no platform, no specific policy prescriptions and that is unique, this party, this convention, this cycle. Mary Katharine Ham, Doug Heye, thanks to both of you.

HAM: Good to --

HEYE: Thank you --

SCIUTTO: Still to come, protests across the country overnight. This after a black man was shot in the back by police in front of his children in this case. That man's uncle is now speaking out. Plus, Laura has now been upgraded to a hurricane, it is heading right for the United States, the coast of Texas and Louisiana, on alert as it approaches, we're going to have the latest track ahead. And China has faced harsh criticism for its handling of the coronavirus outbreak.

Now a Chinese company is behind one of the world's leading vaccine candidates. CNN got exclusive access to the lab conducting those trials. We're going to be live in Beijing, is there a potential here?

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[09:20:00]

SCIUTTO: Welcome back. Right now, there are growing demands for police in Kenosha, Wisconsin, to explain why a black man was shot several times in the back with his kids just feet away. What were the circumstances here?

Protests stirred by video of that shooting, those protests turned violent in Kenosha overnight. Officials there calling in the National Guard as some protesters defied curfews and set fires. CNN's Sara Sidner is there. And Sara, the man who was shot, Jacob Blake, he survived remarkably. He's in a hospital now fighting for his life. You spoke to his father, I'm curious what he told you.

SARA SIDNER, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, a couple of things. We are learning from Jacob Blake's father, Jacob Blake Sr., that his son is paralyzed from the waist down. We talked about that and what that might mean, whether or not this paralysis is temporary or whether or not this paralysis is indeed something that will last his entire life.

And that's all being sorted out, but yes, at this moment, his father saying that yes, indeed, Jacob Blake is paralyzed. When we talk about this and you see the video, he also says it's a miracle that his son is still alive at this point in time, and they are hoping that he gets through all of these surgeries that he has had.

So far, he is expected to survive. A lot of times you don't think about what happens when we hear someone say, oh, this person survived, and everyone takes a collective breath, but the truth of the matter is that, this could change his life forever in many different ways, both physically, obviously, emotionally and mentally. And also the lives of his three children, a 3-year-old, a 5-year-old, an 8- year-old, we're told were in the car when police opened fire on him, shooting him there in front of them.

I talked to the uncle of Jacob Blake, Justin Blake, who said that the children are traumatized obviously, and they are with family who are loving on them as he put it. But he knows that they will need some help to get through this because it was an extremely traumatic moment for these three children, not expecting anything like this to happen and certainly not happen in front of them.

I also want to give you some idea of what's been happening here. We are now about an hour or so outside of the curfew. The curfew ended at 7:00 a.m., and we have seen nothing but some clean-up here where there have been the majority of the protests where police lines and the National Guard have been standing in front of the courthouse and the protesters on the other side. That does not mean that, that won't change later this afternoon. Jim?

SCIUTTO: Sara Sidner, we know you'll be on top of it, thanks very much. With me now is Cedric Alexander; he's former president of the National Organization of Black Law Enforcement Executives. Mr. Alexander, thanks so much, it's good to have you back. You know the circumstances of this now, you've seen the video, shot seven times in the back at point-blank range. As a police officer, when you look at this, what is your view of the police officers' behavior here, how they reacted to this situation?

CEDRIC ALEXANDER, FORMER PRESIDENT, NATIONAL ORGANIZATION OF BLACK LAW ENFORCEMENT EXECUTIVES: Let me say good morning, Jim, and unfortunately, here we are in the same place we've been many times before. But let me start by saying this.

When I look at that video, first thing that comes to mind to me is how a gun is ever drawn in the beginning is certainly is going to be important for us, us being that community and across this country to know why gun's pointed. They follow him around the side of the car, and from that point of where they followed him, it appears they could have grabbed him at some point even before he got inside his vehicle.

But I find it very interesting to the point where he opened the door and just as he appeared to be getting inside, he was shot. Unless those officers can really articulate, and there's some evidence there to suggest that there was some weapon in which he was going to, that could have been a threat to them and they saw they're going to have a very difficult time trying to explain it. And certainly --

SCIUTTO: Right --

ALEXANDER: It's very difficult trying to explain this to the community right at large. But one of the most important things, that agency, that city, those investigative bodies can do is as the evidence comes in, is they begin to be as transparent in sharing that evidence with the community there and across this country as quickly --

SCIUTTO: Yes --

ALEXANDER: As they can. The more that stays secret, it becomes a problem.

SCIUTTO: To your point, and that question remains open as to whether there was a weapon, they believe there was a weapon there. The Kenosha Professional Police Association says the following -- "the video currently circulating does not capture all the intricacies of a highly dynamic incident.

We ask that you withhold from passing judgment until all the facts are known and released." I do want to ask you though because whenever I see a situation like this, I wonder what the training is. We know that de-escalation is an essential part, even more so today than it was years ago in police officers' training there. And when you look at that -- and again, you weren't there, I know that.

[09:25:00]

But when you look at that, did you see opportunities for de- escalation, separating from the vehicle, tackling him as opposed to shooting him? Were there opportunities in your view based, you know, with the caveat, based on what you can see there?

ALEXANDER: Well, just as I have articulated, there appear there could have been opportunities for someone to host there. There were several officers around. They could have tackled him or done something before he got inside that vehicle. Because that appears as to where the threat was to them because once they opened -- he opened the door -- yet again, that's where they shot him. Look, we know that there's a lot of evidence that still has to be discovered and has to be --

SCIUTTO: Yes --

ALEXANDER: Talked about. But I think the most important thing here to remember here again when we talk about training, Jim -- and I have been saying this for years and I will continue to say it, probably one of the most important things that police officers across this country is going to have to -- regular and constant basis, is training. But for that community at this very moment, as they continue the investigation, I encourage them to be as transparent, move this investigation fairly, but at the same time, they need to move to it in a way that does not --

SCIUTTO: Yes -- ALEXANDER: Hold up information from the public which is so critically

important in this point of this issue.

SCIUTTO: Yes, that's a good point. I wonder just briefly before we go, that because now you're in a situation where you have yet another city blowing up right in reaction to this. What do police, what do local leaders need to communicate right to give confidence to people, right, that they're looking at this fairly, critically. What do they need to get out there now so that folks have some confidence there will be hard answers?

ALEXANDER: Well, the leadership, number one, that elected mayor, that chief, that governor, I think we've heard from all of them at this point, they need to make it a constant every day, as often as they can, as information comes in that they're able to share without compromising the integrity of the investigation.

But sharing with that community and the rest of the country, here we are, here's where we're going, here's what need to be done next because we can say to the community, let's wait until all the evidence is in before we pass a judgment.

That's a standard line we hear all the time. But when people see these types of things as frequently as they do, whether they're a legal shooting or not, what the public is saying, we want to know about what happened because this video and perception is everything here, Jim. Looks like so many other types of shootings --

SCIUTTO: Yes --

ALEXANDER: That has caused a great deal of unrest in --

SCIUTTO: Yes --

ALEXANDER: This country.

SCIUTTO: It's sad to see for sure. Cedric Alexander, always good to have you on, thanks so much.

ALEXANDER: Thank you, Jim, good seeing you.

SCIUTTO: Well, evacuations have now been ordered for parts of the Gulf Coast as residents brace for yet one more major hurricane forecast to bring flooding, strong winds, we're going to be live with the latest.

And we're moments away from the opening bell on Wall Street, U.S. futures are up after reports that China and the U.S. had what China called construction -- constructive talks on trade. Stocks rallied Monday after the Trump administration approved a potential COVID-19 treatment, both the S&P 500 and the Nasdaq Composite finished at all- time highs. We'll be keeping an eye on the markets, stay with us.

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