Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

One Person Shot and Killed During Portland Protests; White House Chief of Staff Calls Trump "Law & Order" President Despite Violence in Multiple U.S. Cities; Kenosha Officials Voice Concerns with Trump's Upcoming Visit. Aired 1-2p ET

Aired August 30, 2020 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:15]

BIANNA GOLODRYGA, CNN HOST: Hi, everyone. Thank you so much for joining me. I'm Bianna Golodryga, in for FredrickaWhitfield.

And we begin this hour with America in crisis. With just 65 days until the presidential election, bitter divisions and racial reckonings boil over once again into deadly violence.

A warning, some of the video you're about to see is disturbing. The latest incident in Portland, Oregon. One man was killed amid protest there. So far there have been no arrests.

"The New York Times" reports the victim was wearing a hat from a far- right group called Patriot Prayer. That group was part of hundreds who participated in a caravan in support of President Trump. Their motorcade rode through the streets of Portland which has seen demonstrations for 94 straight days.

Overnight, President Trump praised those activists as patriots. And this morning, his chief of staff said that the administration is prepared to put an end to the violence.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARK MEADOWS, WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF: I can tell you that we are ready -- in fact the president is ready to make sure that we provide whatever law enforcement and support that we can. And it's not this president who has said let's defund the police. What we always must do is make sure that the rule of law is there not just because it's a rule of law but because it creates a safer community whether it's in Kenosha or Wisconsin or anywhere else.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GOLODRYGA: All of this as we learned that the president is planning to make a trip to Kenosha, Wisconsin on Tuesday.

It was just days ago that two people were shot during protest there. The 17-year-old is now charged in those shootings. The president will speak with law enforcement and survey some of the damage from the protests. Well, let's begin with that deadly shooting in Portland. Mike Baker is a correspondent for "The New York Times" and was on the scene of the shooting.

Mike, thank you so much for joining us. I've been following your tweets throughout the night and day this morning. Walk us through this because not only were you documenting it, you were actually hit by paintballs from Trump supporters.

MIKE BAKER, NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": Yes. It really started out in the suburbs. There was a huge rally of Trump supporters gathering there, a lot of people with trucks and flags on their trucks gathering. And their plan was to drive around the city - on the city's highways, sort of not really get into downtown, but drive on the city's highways. But a lot of that crowd broke off and did go downtown. And when they did, when got there, there was a growing crowd of protesters who were opposed to the presence of this large Trump rally in the city, and it really devolved from there.

GOLODRYGA: And we're looking at that video that you filmed last night. Did you see any violence between these two groups escalate as the night went on? Was there any indication that it could end in gunfire?

BAKER: Yes. I mean, really as soon as the - both groups sort of got together, it was increasingly volatile throughout the night. I mean, we saw a video there of paintballs being fired from the back of pickup trucks. And people in the crowd throwing things back. There were at times cars or vehicles that were blocked and people getting out and fist fights happening in the streets.

I mean, there was growing tension tensions there. And also, this is scattered throughout downtown with a lot of these vehicles driving through down different streets, up and down different streets. And you had protesters sort of pursuing them in different parts of downtown.

And so, the - well, police showed up a few times to sort of redirect traffic or to keep the groups apart. They really, you know, so dispersed throughout downtown that it really became something that they couldn't handle.

GOLODRYGA: And talk about the police presence. How present was it? Was it visible? And what role were they playing, if any?

BAKER: Yes. I mean, really, when the -- when the first part of the caravan showed up downtown, there were some protesters that went on one of the bridges to block - block the caravan from coming through, and the police showed up then to clear the streets. And then they were sort of in and out throughout the night, sort of trying to keep the caravan off in one direction and the protesters away from them. But it's -- and then after - they were downtown throughout the night and were there on scene of the shooting pretty soon after it happened.

GOLODRYGA: But they were outnumbered, obviously.

BAKER: I mean, there's -- we're talking about hundreds of counter- protesters and hundreds of trucks with Trump flags on them going in all different directions. And so, it was -- it seemed like they didn't have the capacity to sort of spend the entire time period in downtown keeping all those different sorts of factions apart from each other.

[13:05:01]

GOLODRYGA: And it is my understanding that you followed this motorcade that was showing support for President Trump. What did you hear from them? You can hear some people exchanging verbal, I guess, assaults at each other, but what was their goal in holding this event during such a volatile time in the city.

BAKER: In talking to them, they really wanted to just show their presence. They felt like, you know, Portland has been a place that has been controlled by the protesters over the last few months. And you know they're supporting the president and wanting to go into Portland to demonstrate that. And some -- I think, for some demonstrate there wasn't a fear of going into downtown Portland and having their say.

You know, certainly, you could see some people who had already brought guns to the protests, even out in the suburbs. They were open carrying. They were you know shouting down some of the activists who had come up to demonstrate against the protests. And then you know driving through downtown they had you know the paintball guns at the back of the truck. They were ready for some sort of conflict in one arose.

GOLODRYGA: And Mike, now, knowing that the president will be there Tuesday, do you anticipate that these groups, both those who are supporting Trump and those who are not will only increase their presence with the president there on the ground?

BAKER: I mean, this has basically been the third consecutive weekend where we've had some sort of right-wing conflict with left-wing groups that has involved guns. It was two weeks ago, one of the right-wing demonstrators fired two gunshots out of his vehicle, according to authorities, and has been charged in that case.

Last weekend we saw open fighting in the streets between some far- right activists who were in town and the same left-wing protesters. And in that case, you had one of the right-wing folks brandishing a gun. So, you know, this has been three consecutive weekends of this happening, and certainly some violence like we saw last night that doesn't seem like it's going to be -- seems to be not ending.

GOLODRYGA: Yes. And then given the president's actions and statements on Twitter and in interviews, it doesn't appear that this will be diffused once he arrives later - later on in this week.

Mike Baker, thank you so much for your reporting. It's really important for our viewers to see. Thank you.

BAKER: Thank you.

GOLODRYGA: And I also want to mention that CNN has reached out to Portland police for details on the victim, and any additional suspect information. Portland police have not released further details on either.

Now, all of this comes as President Trump continues his so-called law and order campaign in the run up to November.

CNN's Sarah Westwood is at the White House. So, Sarah, what is the White House saying about all of this latest outbreak of violence? We followed the president's tweet. He tweeted nearly 100 times or nearly 100 times, I would say, this morning, either retweeting or tweeting on his own. What is the White House saying officially, though?

SARAH WESTWOOD, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yes, Bianna, the president response really concentrated on Twitter. This morning, he has been retweeting clips of protests. He seems calling for order on Twitter. But the theme of the response that we've seen from the president and his aides today has been to blame Democratic leaders, as they decry the violence that despite the president's law and order message is unfolding on his watch. But they say that Democratic mayors, Democratic governors, are standing in the way of the Trump administration's ability to go in and handle the violence as they want to. So, they're pointing the finger at those local leaders.

Here's White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows making that argument this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MEADOWS: We've had over 200 anarchists. And they're not peaceful protesters, these are people that every single night, conduct violent acts, and it is in Democrat cities. You know you want to talk about Donald Trump's America, most of Donald Trump's America is peaceful. It is a Democrat-led city in Portland that we're talking about this morning, who just yesterday denied help once again from the federal government. And so, listen, we need to get to the bottom of this. We need to make sure that we hold people accountable.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WESTWOOD: Now Trump and his allies have been particularly critical of Portland's Democratic Mayor Ted Wheeler. On Friday, Wheeler published a letter to Trump that said, stay away, please. Don't send the feds to Portland.

In just a couple hours later, the president tweeted this. "If the incompetent mayor of Portland, Ted Wheeler, doesn't get control of his city and stop the anarchists, agitators, rioters and looters, causing great danger to innocent people, we will go in and take care of the matters the way they should have been taken care of 100 days ago!"

And in that letter, the Portland's mayor said the administration's earlier dispatch of the feds to Portland back in July, actually made matters worse in the city. Bianna?

GOLODRYGA: Follow up on what Mark Meadows said there, last I checked, the president is the president of every city in this country, not just those that are led by Republican mayors. But we also know the president is preparing to visit the scene of another deadly protest shooting in Kenosha, Wisconsin. What are you learning about that trip?

[13:10:03]

WESTWOOD: Bianna, the president heading to Kenosha, Wisconsin tomorrow. He's expected to meet with law enforcement officers while he's there, survey some of the damage that occurred over the last week of protests. But Wisconsin's lieutenant governor is saying the president's visit right now, given his statements, just won't be helpful.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LT. GOV. MANDELA BARNES (D-WI): You look at the incendiary remarks that the president has made, they centered an entire convention around creating more animosity and creating more division around what's going on in Kenosha. So, I don't know how given any of the previous statements that the president made that he intends to come here and be helpful. And we absolutely don't need that right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WESTWOOD: Now it's unclear whether the president will be meeting with the family of Jacob Blake while he's in Kenosha. The White House, when asked about that, said that the president's schedule at this moment, so fluid. Bianna?

GOLODRYGA: All right. Sarah Westwood at the White House for us. Thank you so much.

President Trump is set to visit Kenosha under volatile circumstances as activists call on the White House to denounce the actions of a 17- year-old Trump supporter charged with killing two protesters there.

Listen to what Wisconsin Senator Ron Johnson told Dana Bash this morning when asked if he condemns the shooting.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: The 17-year-old accused of committing those two mohr murders was a Trump supporter.

SEN. RON JOHNSON (R-WI): It is a tragedy.

BASH: Do you -- do you condemn that?

JOHNSON: It is a tragedy.

BASH: Do you condemn it?

JOHNSON: It is a tragedy. It is -- it's a tragedy.

BASH: It is a tragedy, but do you condemn it?

JOHNSON: The entire situation is a tragedy.

Listen, I don't want to see any loss of life. It is a tragedy. And the way you prevent these tragedies is, you support law enforcement...

BASH: But a tragedy could be a car accident.

JOHNSON: ... you calm the situation.

BASH: A tragedy could be a car accident or something happening that is not...

JOHNSON: But you don't allow peaceful...

BASH: ... based on fault.

JOHNSON: You don't allow...

BASH: Do you condemn this?

JOHNSON: You don't allow peaceful protest to turn siege -- into siege.

Listen, I don't want to see anybody lose their life. I don't want to see the violence continue. I don't want to see businesses burned down. I don't want to see economic destruction. I condemn it all.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GOLODRYGA: That condemnation took 45 seconds.

CNN's Shimon Prokupecz joins me now from Kenosha. And Shimon, what are local officials saying about the president's planned visit this week?

SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN CRIME AND JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: There are some that are very unhappy certainly that is coming here. They feel that there have been days of peacefulness here, people coming together. And as you can see behind me here, much of the people here walking around, murals, painting murals on a lot of the walls. A lot of the stores have been boarded up. And that's been the scene here for several days now.

The concern is, of course, is that with the president coming here, it could incite people to act. There is concern here by the local council member who told or colleague Sara Sidner that it will provide further divisiveness in Kenosha, Andy Berg, the local council member, said. And he said, it's just not what Kenosha needs right now.

I spoke to a local resident here on the street moments before I came on live here who said, he was indifferent to it. So there's, of course, mixed feelings about it.

But anytime the president goes somewhere, there's always concern, specifically with this president, with President Trump, that perhaps it can aggravate situations. Of course, he said at this point he's only meeting with law enforcement. So, we don't know if the family of Jacob Blake is actually going to meet with him.

Just to put all of this into context, Bianna. Remember, Trump won this state by less than 23,000 votes, and he was the first Republican to win this county, Kenosha County, in 44 years. And of course, all of this playing out ahead of the November election.

So, we'll see what happens here. He's supposed to be here on Tuesday. As we said, the city is certainly preparing, the Secret Service will be here preparing. But we'll see. I think the next few days are going to really tell us how people are going to react to this. Bianna?

GOLODRYGA: Clearly, things in that city are still very tense. And the president wanting to ride on this law and order theme heading into the election. Shimon Prokupecz, thank you so much.

And coming up, her father was brutally beaten by police decades ago igniting a firestorm in the streets. Now one of Rodney King's daughters is joining forces with a major league baseball star to fight for change.

Plus, a battle brewing over how Congress is informed over election threats. Will Democrats subpoena the nation's top spy chief to testify?

Then later, fighting back against coronavirus. A great-grandmother reunited with her family after five months in the hospital and in rehab. She joins me live to discuss. That's straight ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:19:02]

GOLODRYGA: A top House Democrat says it's possible the House may subpoena intelligence officials to testify before Congress on election security issues. The threat comes one day after the nation's top intelligence office informed Congress that it will no longer deliver in-person briefings on election security issues. It's a decision sparking outrage among many Democrats including House Intelligence Chairman Adam Schiff who was asked about the controversy today on CNN.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: Will you subpoena intelligence officials to appear in public in a hearing before the election?

REP. ADAM SCHIFF (D-CA): That is certainly one of the tools that we may use.

I can't speak for what decision ultimately, we will make. That's a decision that will have to go to the speaker.

But we will compel the intelligence community to give Congress the information that we need. We will compel the Intelligence Community also to speak plainly to the American people, because, Dana, this information, this intelligence, paid for by taxpayers, doesn't belong to Donald Trump. It doesn't belong to the intelligence agencies. It belongs to the American people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[13:20:05] GOLODRYGA: For more on this, let's bring in CNN national security correspondent Vivian Salama. Vivian, thank you so much for joining us. Great to see you. So why are Democrats so upset about the end of these in-person briefings, aside from just bringing another -- bringing another norm that's broken. And what is the Intel director saying about that decision?

VIVIAN SALAMA, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Bianna, this certainly shatters precedent in the past. Obviously, the Office of Director of National Intelligence insisting that Congress is still going to get some level of briefings. At least the House Intelligence and Senate Intelligence Committees will receive a written and not in- person briefings.

Now, traditionally, you would hear from the briefer in person and Congress would then have the chance to ask questions and really grill them about some of the issues to ensure essentially that the administration is doing what it can, everything that it can to protect the integrity of the electoral process. And that is the issue at stake here.

And so, today, you had Chairman Schiff, the House Intelligence Committee, and Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe, stating their arguments on morning - morning Sunday shows to essentially say that this is an issue that is becoming subject to partisan politics.

Now, Adam Schiff, of course arguing for in-person briefings and saying that that is really the best approach to take. Here's -- take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SCHIFF: You can make a written report, and you can state things in a written report that are not correct. And you can't be subject to questioning about it. This is the problem we've had.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SALAMA: Now, Ratcliffe was on Fox News this morning and he said that he assures transparency in the process despite the fact that there only going to be written briefings. And he said that essentially, at the heart of this are leaks that were a big problem, particularly with classified information. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN RATCLIFFE, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE: I reiterated to Congress, look, I'm going to keep you fully and currently informed, as required by the law. But I also said we're not going to do a repeat of what happened a month ago, when I did more than what was required at the request of Congress, to brief not just the Oversight Committees but every member of Congress.

When I did that, Maria, I said, my only condition is that you treat this information with the respect that it deserves, and you keep it private. And yet, within minutes of that -- one of those briefings, a number of members of Congress went to a number of different publications and leaked classified information again for political purposes, to create a narrative that simply isn't true, that somehow Russia is a greater national security threat than China.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SALAMA: Now, Bianna, I don't need to tell you that the intelligence has been well established at this point, that not only did Russia interfere in the 2016 election, but that several countries, including Russia, China and possibly Iran are looking to somehow tip the scale for the upcoming election in two months.

And so, Democrats are essentially saying, this is a real concern. And if the administration shares this concern, we should be doing more, not less to really understand the problem.

GOLODRYGA: Of course, in Russia it is much more sophisticated to doing this and has been doing it for decades and had just done it four years ago in the previous election. What doesn't really make sense in Ratcliffe's argument though is with regards to leaks, wouldn't the leak be even more prevalent and easier to make given that something is coming in written form as opposed to verbal?

SALAMA: That's absolutely right. And so, there's really absolutely no way of assuring that this would change that calculus in any way. Leaks are entirely possible. And of course, Adam Schiff coming out today and saying that it's not only Democrats that may be responsible for leaks. He actually pointed the finger at some Republican officials as well, saying that they are also responsible for these situations.

And so, it's really hard to tell at this point whether this is going to change anything in terms of that outcome of the leaks being prevented, but what we do know is right now Congress is unable to ask questions to the briefer, and that does compromise their ability to really make informed decisions which is two months to go until the election.

GOLODRYGA: It's hard not to see this as yet again another victory for Vladimir Putin as we have another election cycle approaching and more division within or government over that.

Vivian Salama, great reporting as always. Thank you so much.

Well, just ahead, is the family of Breonna Taylor any step closer to seeing charges brought against the police officers involved in her shooting? The Kentucky attorney general takes us inside the investigation.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:29:05]

GOLODRYGA: It was a historic week across sports in America as athletes united by sitting out games in response to the police shooting of Jacob Blake. Major league baseball player Yasiel Puig is one of many answering the call to action, announcing that his foundation is now partnering with the Rodney King Foundation to promote social justice.

Joining me now to discuss is Lora King, one of Rodney King's daughters and the founder and director of the Rodney King Foundation. Lora, thank you so much for joining us to talk about this really important cause here. I know it's dear to your heart. Tell us about this partnership and the work the foundation is doing to make a difference.

LORA KING, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, RODNEY KING FOUNDATION: Sure. Thanks for having me. It's a pleasure.

We're honored to be working with Yasiel and the Wild Horse Foundation as well as tranquility counseling services of Long Beach. We all have this - this, you know big thing that we have to answer to America on what's going on, and the work that they're doing. It's been an honor to work with them. They're doing amazing things - him and his whole team.

[13:30:03]

So, we just wanted to jump board and just create change, create legislative laws that will force America to prosecute police on police brutality and you know the whole movement as far as black lives and you know valuing them.

GOLODRYGA: And to go back and see the change that has occurred throughout the country since the time your father became a household name. Former NBA champion, Craig Hodges wanted the Chicago Bulls and the L.A. Lakers to protest the game 1 of the 1991 finals in response to his beating. And he says that he was called crazy and too extreme at the time, and here we are today nearly 30 years later. What does it mean to you to see NBA players, league professional athletes in standing in solidarity with people like you who are working to inspire change especially at a time of a pandemic and other national strife that we're seeing.

KING: You know it's a big act of courage. Because nowadays you see more and more people speaking up as to when he did, it was like he was considered crazy and things to that nature. But again, here we are in the same position which we shouldn't be. We're here in America, yet we're still here.

So that's why the Rodney King joint forces with you know, the Wild Horse Foundation so that we could create change because we know that in unity, in working together, we create change. And you know, legislative laws and things of that nature. Otherwise, it will never get anywhere. We're still be riding and protesting and yet we'll still be in the same position.

GOLODRYGA: And this is when leadership is really crucial at times like these, divisive times like this people in a country. And I want to read a portion of the nationally televised address that President George H.W. Bush delivered following the acquittal of the man who beat your father and then the subsequent riots that ensued.

He said, let's talk about the beatings of Rodney King because beyond the urgent need to restore order is the second issue, the question of justice, whether Rodney King's federal civil rights were violated. What you saw and what I saw in the TV video was revolting. I felt anger. I felt pain. I thought how can I explain this to my grandchildren? What impact did that address, and those words have on trying to bring the country together to heal, and what do you make of how President Trump's approach today is playing out?

KING: You know I think that those are pretty powerful words because it's true. We live in a world that speaks volumes on, you know, peace, but yet we're watching -- literally watching African American men being slaughtered on national TV. And we have to explain that -- we still have to explain that to our children.

I have a 1-year-old son. And he's innocent, but yet some look at him as not. I have to consider that one day his life may you know even the thought of speaking that is sickening to me. Like we shouldn't be where we're at. That's why we need to push legislative laws to prevent this, to prosecute police officers, because they're not above the law you know. So, that's why it's important for us to unify, and we're together. So that we could create change. So that way it's not just protesting and looting. It's literally prosecuting these officers and getting them put in jail, and not just for show. Like literally for what they're accountable for. They need to be held accountable.

GOLODRYGA: And there does seem to be a false binary choice, one is either for law and order and civil obedience, and respecting police, versus focusing on injustice and inequality in this country and racial division. There is a great deal of mistrust between the police departments and communities they serve across America. I know you partnered with the LAPD in the past to bridge to the divide and to try to inspire unity. What needs to happen to make this trust national now, aside from just Los Angeles?

KING: We need to have these uncomfortable conversations. We need to have these meetings of law like I spoke before. It needs to be a law. It doesn't need to be pushed out every time somebody propose a law that prosecutes police. It needs to be considered a state of emergency, like the looting and things like that. Like it needs to be -- it's just sickening where we are today. So, that's why it's imperative that we join forces with right minded people. Our people that are open to solutions because that's the main ingredient. It's solutions for we can forward. Otherwise, we're still going to be where we're at today. Nowhere.

GOLODRYGA: It's been eight years now since your father has passed. And of course, we all remember his famous words, can't we all get along? And I know that's a message you're trying to portray and send throughout the country through this initiative and this foundation and the work that you're doing.

Lora King, thank you so much.

[13:35:00]

KING: Thank you. Thank you for having me.

GOLODRYGA: We're going to talk to the Attorney General Daniel Cameron. He says that his office has received an FBI ballistics report tied to the police shooting death of Breonna Taylor.

Taylor was shot and killed in her home by officers in Louisville during a flawed force entry raid back in March. The AG's office is working to determine if the officers involved should be charged.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DANIEL CAMERON (R), KENTUCKY ATTORNEY GENERAL: We have received that ballistics report. Again, that is a critical piece of this investigation. It's not the end all/be all. There is still some witness testimony, interviews that have to be conducted. But we do have that ballistics report. We will be meeting with the FBI the beginning of this upcoming week to have a painstaking review of that information.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GOLODRYGA: Ben Crump, who was representing the Taylor family, says he hopes the ballistics report leads to a speedy conclusion to the investigation.

Up next, the FDA is reportedly considering fast tracking a coronavirus vaccine before a critical step. Is that a dangerous move?

Plus, 1,200 cases and counting at the University of Alabama. We'll hear from students about how campus life has changed.

And coming up tonight on CNN, tune in early for special back-to-back, all-new episodes of "United Shades of America." W. Kamau Bell challenges misconceptions about Iranians living in America at 9:00 p.m., and then explores the communities of skid row in Los Angeles at 10:00 p.m.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:40:49]

GOLODRYGA: As the U.S. nears another grim milestone of almost 6 million coronavirus cases, the head of the Food and Drug Administration is telling the "Financial Times" that the agency may consider fast tracking a potential vaccine before phase three trials are complete. Here with me now is Doctor James Phillips, a physician and assistant professor at George Washington University Hospital. Doctor, thank you so much for joining us.

First of all, tell us what do these phase three trials usually consist of and how concerned are you that there could be a vaccine available to the public without these trials.

DR. JAMES PHILLIPS, PHYSICIAN AND ASST. PROFESSOR, GEORGE WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY HOSPITAL: Good afternoon, Bianna. It's good to see you.

You know I'm quite concerned. So, the explanation of a phase three trial typically is one, that around usually for a vaccine 30,000 people or so are in row. And half of those will receive the vaccine and the other half will receive the placebo. But they'll - they'll believe that they received the vaccine. They'll be sent out to live their lives and they'll be tracked. And then the scientists who are conducting that trial will then determine the number of people that have become infected by that particular disease following the vaccine. That usually takes months, if not, more than a year to be able to tell who's at risk and how much protection you get from this vaccine.

Now, if we're rushing that, we're not going to have that data that we typically would use. There's been some discussion about whether or not you can actually expose people to the virus intentionally, calling them a challenge study. But there's ethical issues behind that which is why it's never been done here.

So whenever we take a look at shortening that time period of a phase three trial, all we can really believe is that we're - we may be missing out on data that we would have otherwise if we look at long term. So, I'm quite concerned that I don't think that it's a very good idea to shorten that time period. We're already going at literally work speed to get this vaccine done. And performing an e-way to get it done before that data is available for scientific study, I find it very concerning.

GOLODRYGA: So, let me ask. If we do bypass phase three, how does that differ from what Russia did? When it rolled out their vaccine and received worldwide condonation from medical community leaders.

PHILLIPS: All right. Well, you know I do want to differentiate the safety and the belief that I have in our safety system here within the FDA. And you know co-joined with the CDC and the NIAID compared to Russia. So, there is definitely a difference there. However, the point is, are we going to be pushing out an unproven vaccine to the public. And by unproven that doesn't just mean whether or not it's efficacious against disease prevention. Whether or not we've given sufficient time to discover if there's safety issues.

There's an entire network setup for vaccines where adverse events are reported over a period of time to determine that level of safety. And I think one of the biggest issues we're dealing with right now as we approach vaccine distribution is public trust. And we only have one chance to get this right.

GOLODRYGA: Right. Yes.

PHILLIPS: If we rush out a vaccine, and the public doesn't trust it, already on top of the amount of vaccine currently existing in the United States, we're going to lose. We're going to lose. We have to get this right the first time and we have to get the public trust to make it happen.

GOLODRYGA: Yes, I believe it was Dr. Ashish Jha who said it's not a vaccine that saves lives. It's vaccinations. And we have a lot of Americans who potentially may not trust that. That raises a big question as for the efficacy of it.

As you know, at least 36 states have now reported outbreaks, colleges and university adding more than 8,700 cases to the country's tally. The University of Alabama just the latest, it started class just over a week ago. Already we have 1,200 students that have tested positive for the virus. How many outbreaks are too many on your opinion on college campuses? What should be the threshold for schools. We know that there are going to be some but at what point do you determine whether or not in-person classes should resume.

PHILLIPS: You know this is completely predictable. We, in the scientific community, and amongst physicians have known that these outbreaks would occur the second schools restarted. It will happen in high schools and elementary schools as well. Difference between K-12 schools and colleges, however, is that after class, social atmosphere. K-12 environment is much easier to control. As far as the interactions, spacing and you can make those, those classrooms and those interactions safe if you have the political will to do so. And the funding for your school to make it happen.

[13:50:01]

However, when it comes to colleges, no matter how safe you make that classroom, are those hallways. What matters is what happens after classes over. And people are going to party at houses. Living in houses and dorms and going to the bars. We've already seen a number of schools with videos in the internet of bars being packed on opening week. That's where that virus is going to transmit. So there's danger that I don't know if we can get around.

GOLODRYGA: No doubt that students play a role in this as well. Dr. James Phillips, thank you so much for your time. We appreciate it. Have a great weekend.

PHILLIPS: My pleasure. Thank you.

GOLODRYGA: College life has been disrupted because of the coronavirus so we have asked some students to take us inside their new reality. Here's what they had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ZACH BERMAN, JUNIOR, UNIVERSITY OF MISSOURI: Normally, it would be syllabus week. It would be packed. And right now, both the quads and campuses are filled with this eerie aura of just silence. Yes, it was opened, and I was filled with a sense of excitement, but also dread. How would they handle the fact that the whole reason we shut down to begin with was because of this crazy contagious global pandemic.

JESSA REID BOLLING, GRADUATE STUDENT, UNIVERSITY OF ALABAMA: Personally, I did not think that University of Alabama would have in- person classes for the fall semester. I've seen some students on campus not wearing mask, not really prioritizing social distancing, anything like that. I only have one class that requires me to go to campus. I was given a designated entrance to go into the building I was supposed to have that class in. The desk were all six feet apart. I wear my mask as well as my face shield before I go in, because I'm extremely nervous of getting sick.

RONALD YOUNG, SENIOR, UNIVERSITY OF TENNESSEE: With the way U.T. is handling it, compared to some of our other institution such as the University of Alabama who has over 500 cases right now. When you come to campus, most students are socially distancing. I mean if you go to classes, the desks are spread out. Most people are wearing their masks. And the truth of it is the campus is truly empty right now.

BETHANY VILLARUZ, FRESHMAN, PRINCETON UNIVERSITY: I had my first online lecture today. And it was a little bit weird to have my first college class not being in person and meeting other students and be sitting in a lecture hall listening to a college professor for the first time. And it was a little bit sad. At the end of the day it is what it is and we're just kind of trying to make the best of it.

GOLODRYGA: A whole new world on college campuses from around the country.

Just ahead, an amazing good news story. We need one. A great- grandmother spent three months in a hospital fighting the coronavirus, only to have to learn to walk and talk again during another two months of rehab, but she's OK. And I'll ask her what kept her going. Coming up, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:51:57]

GOLODRYGA: I want to tell you about an amazing coronavirus survival story. There haven't been too many of those these days that we bring you and that's why this is important. Marie Jeanne-Pierre a mother, grandmother and great-grandmother got the chance to take the trip of a lifetime when she went Spain in early March. But less than two weeks after returning home she was in the hospital after testing positive for COVID-19 and developing breathing problems. For three months she fought the virus in the hospital not giving up, not letting it win despite being placed on a ventilator at one point and finally after two more months of rehabilitation, she was released and allowed to see her family again.

And I'm happy to say Marie Jeanne-Pierre joins me now from Brooklyn. Marie, thank you so much for coming on with us today. Your story is an inspiring one, it is something that your daughter has been sending out to all of us to tell us about the strength you have exhibited as a fighter. What has this experience been like? How are you feeling right now?

MARIE JEAN-PIERRE, SURVIVED COVID-19 AFTER 5 MONTHS IN THE HOSPITAL AND REHAB: I'm feeling fine. Thank you.

GOLODRYGA: What kept you going?

JEAN-PIERRE: Oh, my children and a lot of prayer. And therapies. You know? The doctors. They help me really. They really help me. They don't let me lay down and give up. They talk to me and they make sure I do everything, the exercise and everything was very good.

GOLODRYGA: These doctors and medical staff were just amazing and they are heroes. That is true. I know that you were transferred to a facility where you had to learn to walk and talk again. Can you tell us about that and how difficult that was?

JEAN-PIERRE: Oh my God. I cried all night because it was so bad. It was hurting me and I couldn't breathe and they come to me and check me and see what's going on with me. But they put a trach in my throat and that thing is painful. I don't want nobody go through that thing. Very painful. But I learn how to talk because my speech therapy, she is so sweet and I work with my physical therapy because they said get up, get up, let's go. You won't lay down.

GOLODRYGA: They pushed you. They push you because they knew you had the strength.

JEAN-PIERRE: Yeah. Sometimes I don't want to let go. I say leave me alone.

GOLODRYGA: That's what we call tough love I guess, right?

JEAN-PIERRE: Yes.

GOLODRYGA: We just saw an image of your family. If we can put that back up. You got six children, 11 grandchildren I believe, 9 great grandchildren.

JEAN-PIERRE: Yes.

GOLODRYGA: But the whole time you were sick, you couldn't see any of them except from behind the glass. How difficult was that?

JEAN-PIERRE: Very difficult. I be crying. It was difficult because I could not touch them. They could not touch me. It was very bad.

[13:55:00]

GOLODRYGA: Now you're home and we see you with them and you were crying when you were reunited. We want to hear about how it felt when you left. We can see your emotions there in the video. You were crying on the outside. What did it feel like on the inside?

JEAN-PIERRE: Happy, I was so happy to see everybody.

GOLODRYGA: Marie Jean-Pierre, you are an inspiration for anybody who's going through what you went through and watching this right now you're sending a message that they can be fighters and fight through this as well. Thank you so much for joining us. And we're so happy you're OK and you're reunited with your loving family.

JEAN-PIERRE: Thank you. Thank you very much.

GOLODRYGA: All the best. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)