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Trump Defends Shooter Charged with Killing Two Protesters; Mysteries about Coronavirus Remain Months into Pandemic; Trump Ramps up Disinformation Campaign against Biden. Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired September 01, 2020 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:00:00]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN NEWSROOM: Is there any place in America today for self-appointed members law enforcement?

TOM RIDGE, FORMER HOMELAND SECURITY SECRETARY: No. We've got 700,000 men and women, Republicans and Democrats, who go to work every day to keep our streets safe. And I think all Americans admire and are grateful for that service. But there's no places for vigilante justice in the United States of America, period. Let the men and women in blue throughout our country do their jobs and don't encourage these armed protesters to go in and disrupt the communities.

And I would also say to you, Mr. President, the mayor of Kenosha very respectfully said you're welcome, but right now the situation is kind of hot. Wait a week. It's too bad that he didn't respect the request of the mayor at this time.

SCIUTTO: Tom Ridge, thanks so much.

RIDGE: A great pleasure to be with you. Thanks, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Good morning to you. I'm Jim Sciutto.

Just moments from now, President Trump, despite pleas from local leaders, is going to leave for Kenosha, Wisconsin, a city shaken after deadly protest and violence, vigilante justice in response to the police shooting of Jacob Blake. The president moved forward with his visit despite calls to stay away from both the governor and the mayor. He will not, we should note, be meeting with Jacob Blake's family.

But he has defended a teen, there he is there, accused of killing two protesters in Kenosha. He now faces charges of homicide and compared the actions of police officers in shooting Blake to choking on a golf swing.

We're watching to see if the president speaks before he heads to Wisconsin.

Also this morning, the Midwest is seeing a spike in coronavirus cases as fears growing coming this holiday weekend could look like the past two holiday weekends when many Americans let their guard down and we saw that in the numbers, spread the virus, contributed to a summer surge.

New reporting as well, as the president pushed four states to reopen in recent weeks, his own coronavirus task force was giving him dire information, dire warnings, about what that would mean for the spread of the virus.

Let's begin though this morning -- there's a lot of news -- with CNN's Shimon Prokupecz. He is in Kenosha, Wisconsin for more on what to expect.

I mean, we should note, I think, you noted this yesterday, Sara Sidner said this earlier this morning, the streets there actually in recent days have been notably calm and peaceful. What is the president's visit expected to do to the situation on the ground there, from the point of view of local leaders and residents?

SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN CRIME AND JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: For local leaders, certainly, a lot of them don't see any point in this, in him coming here. You know, president has said he's coming here to support law enforcement and sort of to try, in some way, uplift this community, but most of the people here are kind of feeling that they would rather the president not come here.

On the streets here, it has been peaceful. This morning, there are pro-Trump supporters out and about just over my view here. There's a couple of people standing there with an American flag cheering. We've seen some people drive through this strip, this area here with the American flag. We've seen anti-Trump protesters, and we've even seen a plane in the air that's flying an anti-Trump banner which says reject Trump's violence and vote November.

So there are mixed feelings here from certainly the people that are living here. The community leaders, a lot of them outspoken, the mayor said he would prefer that the president not come here today.

The big concern, obviously, is for later on. Are there going to be any outside agitators, people who don't live in this community that are going to try to come here and start trouble, which we saw in the days after the shooting of Jacob Blake. That is the big concern still for law enforcement here, and, really, community leaders here. They are concerned that these people are going to come back here and perhaps start some violence.

SCIUTTO: And we've seen the result of that, two people dead. Shimon Prokupecz, thanks very much.

Also more, we're learning more about the man shot and killed during violent clashes in Portland between protesters and Trump supporters over the weekend. CNN's Josh Campbell is in Portland.

What more do we know not just about him but the circumstances of the shooting?

JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Jim. It remains under investigation. Police have not released details on the shooter. We do know that they don't have anyone in custody at this moment. But we are learning from police, again, the identity of the person who was shot and killed. This is 39-year-old Aaron Danielson.

Now, a far right group here in the Portland area, Patriot Prayer, posted a statement of condolences, saying that that person was a member, again, mourning his loss. One thing that that shooting death is really doing here for law enforcement is raising questions about whether either group members or those who are far-right, seeking retribution, may try to come into this city to engage in some type of violence, again, an act of vengeance.

[10:05:02]

Police remain on edge for that, but, so far, we haven't seen that kind of activity. Jim?

SCIUTTO: Well, I spoke to a police commissioner last hour who said let the police do their job. Josh Campbell, thanks very much.

The head of the FDA says the agency could issue emergency use authorization for COVID-19 vaccine before crucial phase three clinical trials, those that involve thousands of people to make sure a vaccine is safe, are complete. But Dr. Stephen Hahn insists that decision will not be influenced by the White House to get it done by Election Day. In fact, Hahn says he leaves open the possibility of resigning if there's any political pressure to approve the vaccine before he believes it's ready.

With me now Senior Medical Correspondent Elizabeth Cohen. Elizabeth, this morning, Dr. Anthony Fauci said a vaccine should not be available widely to the American public unless it's been shown to be safe and effective. I mean, that's not an outlier position. That's how this country has done vaccines for generations. So what is Dr. Hahn suggesting here, how unusual would that be?

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: What Dr. Hahn and Dr. Fauci are saying is, really, they would say the same thing. They would both say, we're not going to put a vaccine out there unless it's been shown to be safe and effective. But, Jim, the devil is in the details. It is possible that this vaccine will have such great early results that both doctors would agree, let's put it on the market. But the chances of that are so small, as one doctor told me that it's ludicrous.

So the bottom line here is that two experts, Dr. Hahn, Dr. Fauci and others could look at same set of data and Dr. Fauci might say, you know what, this isn't looking good at this point. Let's keep going, let's keep enrolling more people, let's keep trying, and Dr. Hahn could say, this data looks great to me, let's put the vaccine out there now.

That's the worry that I'm hearing from doctors, is that Dr. Hahn is going to get, as one person put, it mushy. He's going to get mushy about the data.

SCIUTTO: That's a worry, a concerning one. So, more than one pharmaceutical company are now in phase three clinical trials. What do we know about them? Is there a frontrunner? Where do we stand? COHEN: So, AstraZeneca just announced that they're going to be starting their phase three clinical trial in the U.S. with 30,000 people. It is a two-dose vaccine. The doses are given about four weeks apart. This phase three trial is funded by the U.S. government.

Let's take a look at where other companies are standing all around the world. If we take a look in China, there is CanSino, Sinovac, Wuhan Institute and Beijing Institute. So, all four of those are in phase three trials. In the U.S., we already have Moderna and Pfizer, their phase three trials are under way. In the U.K., we have AstraZeneca, as we just mentioned, and AstraZeneca is also doing trials with Oxford, With the University of Oxford and other countries as well. And in Russia, we have the Gamaleya Institute.

So, this is now the third phase three study funded by the U.S. government, Jim, and the hope is that one of these vaccines will turn out to work well and be safe.

SCIUTTO: Yes. I mean, listen, the progress is good. The question is do you disrupt the normal process for ensuring that it's safe? Elizabeth Cohen, thanks very much.

COHEN: Thanks.

SCIUTTO: We're joined by the CNN Medical Analyst Dr. Amy Compton- Phillips. She is Chief Clinical Officer at Providence Health System. Doctor, always good to have you on.

DR. AMY COMPTON-PHILLIPS, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: Thanks so much, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Elizabeth's line there, I thought, kind of got to the root of it, concerns that Dr. Hahn will get mushy on the data. And it wouldn't be the first time that we've seen that. You know, there was an exaggeration of the benefits, for instance, of convalescent plasma by a factor of seven, according to our Sanjay Gupta.

Here is the big question. Should Americans trust that this vaccine decision, an important one for this country, will be based on medicine and science rather than politics?

COMPTON-PHILLIPS: Well, of course, Americans should be able to trust that, and the problem is with the mixed messaging coming from this administration, including from leaders in the administration at HHS and FDA and CDC, we've started eroding the trust that we've always had in these otherwise incredibly professional institutions.

And so the fact that you're hearing misstatements and conflicting information coming out has made it so that, you know, even if we do get the vaccine approved, we have a large percentage of the population unwilling to get the vaccination. And that's the critical thing. You can't just have the vaccine. You've got to get it into people for it work. So, trust is a critical element to make that happen.

SCIUTTO: No question. And the thing is the polling shows there's already a trust problem on this. CNN had a poll just last month and found that 40 percent of Americans would not get a COVID-19 vaccine, already questions. What happens if the perception is or the reality is that the approval process is rushed? Does that, in your view, increase the skepticism and then decrease the efficacy of any vaccine?

[10:10:01]

COMPTON-PHILLIPS: It absolutely does, and, in fact, the conversations we've been having out here are people are very worried about the process and very worried that the process will be subverted for political reasons. And it's why you've had large contentions of physicians advocating to have an independent commission of physicians, and scientists and evidence methodologists to be able to decide whether or not that evidence is strong enough to make it so that we can justifiably look patients in the eye and say, this is safe and this is effective and we vouch for it. We need to have that clarity.

SCIUTTO: Before we go, a big question for a lot of folks, I'm sure, watching this broadcast, probably with their kids upstairs or in the backroom doing distance learning. We've had schools around the country for young people, older kids, college students, you know, reopen in different forms. I mean, have we -- it's early, I know. Have we learned anything yet about whether this is fundamentally dangerous, whether there's a safe way to do it? What is your view as you look at the data?

COMPTON-PHILLIPS: So, one of the problems is we don't have fantastic data that actually looks at what different school systems are doing and how well it's working. And so that is one of the critical elements is that we need to be learning from all these natural experiments that are happening.

What they did at the University of Arizona with wastewater identification of an early infection in a dorm and then being able to shut down the infection, absolutely brilliant. Schools that are putting in air handling systems to minimize transmission when, because it's always when, not if, that a child comes in that has the germ, absolutely brilliant.

And so how do we aggregate everything we're learning so that we can get kids back to school, which is really critical, but do it in a way that keeps everybody safe, kids, teachers, parents, everybody?

SCIUTTO: Yes. We've got a big holiday weekend coming up here, of course, Labor Day weekend, end of summer, and the data has shown that the Memorial Day and weekend and July 4th weekend, listen, folks travel, they go out, go to fireworks, et cetera, and you see an uptick. Do you expect the same after this weekend? And for folks listening at home, what should they do to help avoid that?

COMPTON-PHILLIPS: One thing that we have to do is we have to stick it out. You know, the whole Winston Churchill concept of never ever, ever, ever, ever surrender. Don't give up, right? Don't gather with big groups. Do wear your mask. Do stay outside. Do wash your hands, because they matter. And we, right now, have 180,000 people in this country who aren't able to celebrate Labor Day with their family, whose family is missing them, and don't continue to pass this on. Don't have us get to 200,000 because it's 200,000 too many. SCIUTTO: Yes, no question, and we're so close already. Dr. Amy Compton-Phillips, thanks so much.

COMPTON-PHILLIPS: Thank you.

SCIUTTO: It has been seven months now since the coronavirus first hit the U.S. Can you imagine that? It's gone quickly. What have we really learned since then? Dr. Sanjay Gupta, he's going to break down the lessons so far.

Plus, President Trump and his allies are turning to deception and disinformation in their efforts to beat Joe Biden in November, straight up false stuff. We're going to fact check the latest claims, some of them from another planet.

And a shocking revelation from a new book about the Trump White House that Vice President Pence was put on standby to temporarily assume the powers of the presidency last year as the president went to a hospital visit. Why? What happened? Why haven't we heard the facts?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:15:00]

SCIUTTO: Welcome back.

Well, can you believe it? We're seven months into this pandemic and the U.S. has now passed 6 million coronavirus cases. So far, more than 183,000 Americans have died from COVID-19, and yet, there's still no national strategy to bring this public crisis under control, in fact, something of a resistance from the White House.

So in all this time, what have we, as a country, learned about the virus and its impact on Americans? CNN Chief Medical Correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta takes a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: A disease we hadn't even imagined a year ago is now the third leading cause of death in the United States. And as much as we've learned about it, so many mysteries still remain.

Yes, we better understand the risk factors, and there are stark, people 85 and older, 20 times more likely to die than people in their 50s, 60 times more likely to die than people in their 40s. Add in cancer, in the largest review to-date, 13 percent of those with cancer and COVID-19 died within a month. Obesity, increasing risk of death three to four times relative to those of normal weight, and those with diabetes were three times more likely to be hospitalized.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The hospital is on lockdown.

GUPTA: And yet there are still too many stories like this.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, that was it. I never got to say I love you, nothing.

GUPTA: Nicole Buchanan's husband, Conrad, was just 39 years old, healthy, in the prime of his life.

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: You know, you get so many people who do well and then some people who just bingo, they are on a respirator, they're on ECMO and they are dead.

GUPTA: Through it all, the virus has been pretty constant, but how we react to is has considerably changed.

[10:20:00]

MELISSA MCKINLAY, PALM BEACH COUNTY COMMISSIONER: We've just got a lot of young people that were ready to get back out, want to go to restaurants, want to go to bars.

GUPTA: Here is the part that makes little sense. When there were fewer than 5,000 confirmed cases back in March, we started to shut things down.

DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: We'd much rather be ahead of the curve than behind it.

GUPTA: But now, there are more than 6 million people who have been infected and we are pushing to open things back up. And even though we've been told nearly 70,000 Americans could possibly be saved by the end of the year if we just wore masks in public --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Please wear masks.

GUPTA: -- it seems too much to ask. And that's why models now estimate that 1,000 people will die every day for the rest of the year. That's an American losing their life to this disease every minute.

And sometimes there are those truly stuck in the middle.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I've been treated as COVID for 97 days.

GUPTA: They even have a name now, the long haulers.

The most basic question is still unclear. If you get this disease, how likely are you to die? Researchers estimate that likelihood is about 0.6 percent. That's still six times more than the flu.

We have made incremental strides with therapeutics, the antiviral, remdesivir, the steroid, dexamethasone, most recently, the FDA granted emergency use authorization for convalescent plasma, that's donated antibodies from people who have been previously infected and, of course, we all wait for a vaccine which most say won't be available for the general public until next spring.

You made a list the other day and I'll just rattle them off for the audience. If we wore masks, if we kept physical distance, if we shut down bars or at least indoor, closely crowded situations, large gatherings and washed hands often, those five things.

FAUCI: Outdoors much better than indoors, always. That's the point.

GUPTA: If we did just that, within a few weeks, we could be looking at the backside of this curve. But, astonishingly, disturbingly, it doesn't look like we're going to lean into the basics.

I often wonder what the history books will tell our great grandchildren of this time. We didn't learn the lessons quickly 100 years ago during the flu pandemic and 675,000 people died in the United States. We have to apply the lessons we've learned quickly so that we can do better this time around.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GUPTA: And, Jim, I'll tell you, you know, everyone has been talking about the vaccine, understandably. But it's worth pointing out that in so many countries around the world, the same thing that they want out of the vaccine, which is some return to normalcy, many countries have already been able to get there without the vaccine just from those basic public health measures.

I know you and I have been talking about this for months, but it really does work.

SCIUTTO: Yes, that's the thing, and yet some folks still describe those simple measures as some sort infringement. It's good to have you on, Sanjay. Sometimes we need that long look at where we stand after all of this.

GUPTA: Thanks, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Well, President Trump is intensifying his disinformation, that is to say, false attacks, against Joe Biden. We're going to walk you through what's true and what isn't. There are a lot of specious claims, outright false claims. A CNN fact-check coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:25:00]

SCIUTTO: The president is once again using disinformation in an attempt to discredit Joe Biden. Last night, he made several claims without evidence, including this one about who is operating the Biden campaign.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LAURA INGRAHAM, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Who do you think is pulling Biden's strings? Is it former Obama people?

TRUMP: People that you've never heard of, people that are in the dark shadows. People that --

INGRAHAM: And what does that mean? That sound like conspiracy theory, dark shadows. What is that said? TRUMP: No, people that you haven't heard of. They are people that are on the streets. They are people that are controlling the streets.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: I mean, you've got to shake your head there, Daniel Dale. You're great at fact-checking this. The president offered no evidence. Tell us your reaction to the dark shadow claims.

DANIEL DALE, CNN REPORTER: It's almost too stupid to fact-check. I mean, when you have Fox's Laura Ingraham telling you it sounds like a conspiracy theory, it's probably a conspiracy theory. Joe Biden is his own man. His campaign is run by Democrats, many of them conventional Democrats for many decades, and there are no shadowy figures, you know, on the streets wearing dark clothing pulling Joe Biden's strings. This is another dishonest attempt by Trump to try to foment fear about a candidate who has been in the public eye for many years.

SCIUTTO: It follows a pattern, right? Amanda Carpenter, who wrote a book on gaslighting, it talks about how it fits this pattern of I have this secret to reveal here. At some point in the future, I'm going to show you all the evidence of it. That never comes, and yet, you know, he propagates this kind of stuff. I mean, it's a pattern, is it not, with the president?

DALE: It's a long president. This president is a conspiracy theorist. He essentially entered Republican life promoting this racist conspiracy theory about Barack Obama's birthplace. He's promoted conspiracy theories about windmills supposedly causing cancer. He's repeatedly uttered conspiracy theories about millions of people voting illegally in California.

[10:30:03]

He had a conspiracy theory about Ted Cruz's father being involved in an assassination. So, he just does this.