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Will Trump Rush Coronavirus Vaccine Ahead of Election?; Joe Biden Visits Wisconsin. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired September 03, 2020 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:07]

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN HOST: All right, Brianna, thank you so much.

Hi there. I'm Brooke Baldwin. You are watching CNN. Thank you so much for being with me.

We have been watching the former vice president, Joe Biden, who is in Kenosha, Wisconsin, today. Here he is, live pictures, as he's sitting in this church holding this community gathering. This is after he has taken some time there meeting with the family of James Blake. So, we will take you to Kenosha and find out what exactly happened with that family conversation in just a moment.

But on to COVID, stay vigilant, take the necessary precautions, that is the message from the nation's top infectious disease expert, Dr. Anthony Fauci, ahead of this long holiday weekend.

During an interview on CNN this morning, Dr. Fauci pleaded with Americans to be safe while you're out and about enjoying Labor Day.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, NIAID DIRECTOR: We don't want to see a repeat of the surges that we have seen following other holiday weekends. We don't want to see a surge under any circumstances, but, particularly, as we go on the other side of Labor Day and enter into the fall, we want to go into that with a running start in the right direction.

We don't want to go into that with another surge that we have to turn around again.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Dr. Fauci's message comes as the United States surpasses 1,000 deaths in a day.

Cases are on the rise in 18 states, concentrated mostly in the Midwest and the Northeast. Iowa, as we have been talking about the last couple of days, that is still a major concern, averaging its highest average number of daily infections since this pandemic began.

And another state we're watching really closely here is Missouri. The White House Coronavirus Task Force says that that state is in a red zone, with high transmission and rural and urban communities, as well as major college towns.

And all of this is happening here as concerns grow that the Trump administration will put politics over public health by releasing a vaccine before it is deemed safe and effective.

Now, the CDC told states to prepare to distribute a vaccine as early as late October. That is despite the head of the NIH saying it is unlikely one can be ready by that time.

This morning, Pfizer says they could have enough data to know if their vaccine is effective by the end of October.

But all these conflicting headlines creating a lot of questions about the actual timeline for a vaccine, so let's start there.

CNN senior medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen is covering that angle for us today.

And so, Elizabeth, Dr. Fauci tried to clean up the confusion about vaccines this morning here on CNN. What did he say about the timeline?

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Before I get into what Dr. Fauci said, which is so important, I want to talk about why there's confusion.

There's confusion because a vaccine trial is unpredictable. Sometimes, you get results faster than other times. It has to do with how quickly the people who you gave shots to run into the virus in their daily life.

You might have vaccinated a bunch of people who are going to go out and go to bars and not wear masks to get sick quickly. I hate to say it, because it sounds perverse, but, for the sake of the trial, that would be great, because then you find out if the vaccine works.

But if you vaccinated a bunch of people who are going to stay home and work and maybe go out once a week and wear a mask, it's going to take a while for us to get answers in this trial.

So, Dr. Fauci sort of reflected all of that, all of that unknown. I have talked to him so many times over the years. He always says to me, Elizabeth, I don't have a crystal ball. That is basically what he's saying here. He is saying it is unlikely we will have it in October, but he wouldn't ever use the word impossible.

Let's take a listen to what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FAUCI: If you look at the projection of the enrollment and the kinds of things you will need to get a decision about whether the vaccine is safe and effective, most of us project that that's going to be by November, December by the end of the year. Could this be earlier? Sure. So, if someone comes out and says, I'm

going to shoot for the possibility that I'll get it by October, you can't argue strongly against that. That's unlikely, not impossible.

I think most of the people feel it's going to be November, December. But that does not mean that, if there are a number of infections within a particular trial that allows you to make a decision sooner, rather than later, it is conceivable that you could have it by October, though I don't think that that's likely.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COHEN: Now, I have spoken with numerous infectious disease experts, people who have run vaccine trials of their own. They say it's not unlikely that it will happen in October. They say it's very, very, very, you can add a few verys, very unlikely that it would happen in October.

But, again, we do have Pfizer predicting they think they will have the data by the end of October. So, at this point, there is a bit of mystery to this, but I think the general opinion is that Dr. Fauci is right -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: Gotcha.

Elizabeth Cohen, thank you.

And staying on COVID, really focusing on kids in college, the spread of the virus on college campuses still remains this huge problem. The latest example today, we have the University of Indiana in Bloomington, it just ordered 30 fraternity and sorority chapters to quarantine because of what officials there are calling an alarming increase of COVID cases within those houses.

[15:05:12]

And this comes, as you just heard, Dr. Fauci sounds the alarm about the ongoing surge of cases among young people.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FAUCI: We're seeing now, in certain states, particularly states, for example, like Montana, the Dakotas, Michigan, Minnesota, that there is an uptick in test positivity, particularly among young people 19 to 25.

That's predictive, Jim, that if there is -- and if they don't do the kinds of things we're talking about, we're going to see a surge.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Meantime, the White House Coronavirus Task Force is recommending that Missouri and Iowa immediately close bars and implement mask mandates because of the infection spikes in those states. But both states refuse to do so. And they're not alone. Look at this.

As of August 17, more than a dozen states, the ones you see in red, still do not have mask requirements, even though we know it is one of the easiest things we can all do to slow the spread of the virus.

So let's start there with Dr. Rob Davidson. He's an emergency room physician and executive director of the Committee to Protect Medicare.

So, Dr. Davidson, good to see you. Welcome back.

On the point of masks, there are, as we showed, large parts of this country where there is still resistance to wearing masks. Why do you think these states refuse to issue these mask mandates? And how big of a risk are these states taking by not doing so?

DR. ROB DAVIDSON, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, COMMITTEE TO PROTECT MEDICARE: Hey, Brooke.

I think what you said is exactly right. It is an easy thing to do. And that's why it's so baffling. It's simple. It does no harm. My kids wear them to school. I wear them at work. My wife's a doctor. She wears hers at work all day long.

I think, very early on, wearing a mask became a political statement -- or actually not wearing a mask became a political statement. The president specifically expressed this, that he thought people were wearing them to kind of speak out against him, and has refused to do that.

And so I think that the governors in these states, many of them are likely following down a path. They're very most vocal, base supporters that represent a significant minority of people, but they're very loud. And these governors don't want to cross them.

BALDWIN: So, politics, it seems, over public health.

DAVIDSON: Feels like it.

BALDWIN: How about looking ahead, Dr. Davidson, yes, to this upcoming weekend and the holiday, because we have talked all over the summer. We had the spike in cases because of Memorial Day, and then on to the Fourth of July.

How concerned are you that there could be a spike coming out of this next Labor Day weekend? And then what is your advice to Americans who want to be, understandably, out and about and hanging out with friends and family, but doing so safely?

DAVIDSON: Yes, this feels like Groundhog Day.

I mean, I remember being told by the vice president how wonderful it was that it was only young people getting the virus in Florida and Texas and Arizona at the early part of summer, and then all of those states became incredible hot spots, hospitals filling up, and deaths rising to unprecedented levels. And so that's obviously the concern. So I'm going to be outside

enjoying Labor Day, like many people. I will wear a mask if I'm around anyone that isn't in my immediate family. We will maintain distance of six feet. And, again, being outside is the key.

So, I think, if people stay outside, if they wear masks when they're around others besides their family, and they stay six feet apart, I think that the risk is pretty minimal.

BALDWIN: And, also, coming out of this Labor Day weekend, we know that AMC Theaters will be opening. We know more than 100 additional movie theaters this weekend, and states like California, New Jersey, Maryland are relaxing restrictions on movie theaters.

Theaters say they have implemented a series of safety measures. What would you tell people who want to go to the movies?

DAVIDSON: Well, listen, I don't want to get the movie industry against me, but I will not be going to a movie theater anytime soon.

BALDWIN: Tell me why.

(CROSSTALK)

DAVIDSON: Well, they can mandate masks when you walk in the door, but for two hours, and the lights are out, people are sitting in their seats, how do we know the people around us are still adhering to that mandate?

Even if they're a certain distance away, we know that there can be aerosolization of this virus. So, if you're sitting in a room for two hours, we don't know about ventilation. I think that just is an unnecessary risk that I'm not willing to take.

And if my patients ask me, I will advise them that as well.

BALDWIN: Dr. Rob Davidson not going to the movies, but indeed hanging out outdoors on Labor Day Monday.

Dr. Davidson, thank you so much for all of that. Nice to have you on.

And, by the way, to all of you, CNN.com has just awesome resources to help answer your questions about coronavirus. From masks, to schools, to the latest guidance from our favorite doctor, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, go to CNN.com/reopening.

Right now, as we showed you at the top of the show -- and here you go -- more live pictures from Kenosha, Wisconsin. The former vice president, Joe Biden, is there. He is holding a community meeting after talking to the family of Jacob Blake. So, we will take you to Wisconsin and tell that important story today.

[15:10:05]

Also ahead: Health experts are now warning that the United States is not ready for a COVID vaccine, even if we manage to get one this fall. So let's talk more about that.

And police making an arrest in cyberattacks that have derailed virtual learning in Miami for days. And, by the way, the suspect here is a 16- year-old student.

You don't want to miss this. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: We're back. You are watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Nearly two weeks ago, 29-year-old Jacob Blake was shot in the back seven times by a police officer in Kenosha, Wisconsin, rekindling protests and calls for racial justice across this country.

[15:15:00]

And, today, Blake's father and other family members met with former Vice President Joe Biden and his wife, Jill, as part of this trip the Democratic nominee says he hopes will help bring people together.

Arlette Saenz is traveling with the Biden campaign there, and Shimon Prokupecz is CNN's crime and justice reporter.

And so, Arlette, let me just begin with you.

And as we're looking at these pictures here on the right-hand side of the screen, let me just explain to the viewers, there's a community gathering happening. A lot of folks in the community are speaking. It's a great opportunity for the former vice president to listen in. And we can talk about that in a second.

But, first, can you just tell me a little bit more of the conversation he had with the Blake family?

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: Yes.

Well, Brooke, as soon as Joe Biden arrived here in Wisconsin, that was his first order of business. He met privately with the Blake family. His wife, Jill Biden, was also there. Jacob Blake's father, two of Jacob Blake's sisters, his brother were also there in person, as well as Jacob Blake's mother.

She spoke to the former vice president over the phone. And what Biden has said that he wanted to do here in Wisconsin today is offer some healing to the community as they're grappling with that police shooting of Jacob Blake and also the protests that stemmed from it here in the city.

And what we are seeing here today is also similar to what we have seen Joe Biden do in the wake of George Floyd's death. He traveled down to Houston and met with the Floyd family ahead of his funeral. Biden also held a listening session in Delaware with community leaders to hear people's concerns.

And that's what he's doing right now here inside a church in Kenosha, Wisconsin. Biden is seated there, wearing a mask, listening to community leaders as they are voicing their concerns.

And it gives you a bit of a glimpse of how Biden would approach leadership were he to become president. He has from the very start of his campaign stressed that he is a unifying figure that would try to bridge some of the divides in this country.

And that is something that he is hoping to portray here today and offer that contrast with President Trump.

BALDWIN: Now, given all of that, Shimon, I know that the former vice president says that the officer who shot Jacob Blake should be charged.

We know that a federal civil rights investigation has been launched. And then, yesterday, listening to Bill Barr on our air, without providing any evidence, saying that Blake was -- quote -- "in the midst of committing a felony."

Attorneys for the Blake family say Barr is misinformed. Where do things stand in this investigation?

SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN CRIME AND JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: They're still ongoing.

And that's the problem with what the attorney general did yesterday. It would seem, based on his interview that he did with our Wolf Blitzer, that the attorney general has already made up his mind about this investigation.

He used the word that Jacob Blake was armed and that Jacob Blake was in the midst, was in the act of committing a felony. Those are two key words that can basically tell investigators and prosecutors who are going to be looking at this investigation that these officers were justified in their actions.

And that very much is still an ongoing investigation by the local authorities here. The state attorney general, who's running an independent investigation, is then going to turn over his findings to the local DA, who's going to ultimately decide whether or not there was justification.

But the problem now is that you have the attorney general, who is running a parallel investigation, seems to already have made -- have made up his mind without having all the facts.

The family, of course, says that the attorney general is misinformed.

What we do know and what little information the attorney general here has released, the local attorney general, is that there was a knife, and that Mr. Blake admitted to possessing the knife. But we don't know where in the confrontation the threat of a possible use of a knife against the officers, if that ever occurred.

Where does that occur? And what happens in those seconds when the officers are in the doorway of the vehicle that Mr. Blake was in, and they're -- the one officer pulls on the shirt, and then there are several shots fired? What happens there? What leads into that?

It's not clear. And they haven't revealed, the investigators here, what they have found. And that is the key point. Those are the key moments that we need more information on, before anyone should be reaching any kind of conclusions here.

BALDWIN: We wait to get that information. All great questions.

Shimon, thank you.

Let's listen in now to Joe Biden.

(JOINED IN PROGRESS)

JOSEPH BIDEN (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: -- New York, that area. It goes right through my city.

And I used to interview clients down in the basement of that train station before they were arraigned.

And here I was thinking that -- and we have the eighth largest black population of any state in the nation, as a percent of population. And we were, to our great shame, a slave state, and although we were one of those border states who fought on the side of the North, thank God.

[15:20:04]

But, anyway, to make a long story short, what happened was, I thought black and whites would never be in my city talking to each other again.

And here I was then, literally, 40 years later to the month, on January 17, standing on a platform in that very same train station and looking out over what we call the East Side, which had been burned to the ground, literally. It had been completely leveled.

When things get burnt out, they come in and level everything. And then across the Christina River, they call the Third Street Bridge, was overwhelmingly 100 percent African-American community.

And I was standing on that platform on January 17, waiting for a black man to come 26 miles from Philadelphia to pick me up and take me on a train ride to Washington, D.C., with 10,000 people standing down below cheering.

And my son Beau was alive then. He was the attorney general of the state of Delaware at the time. And my daughter, who is a social worker, ran the largest criminal justice program in the state, and my son, my middle son, who was the -- running the world food health program, World Food Program USA, the largest program in the country -- in the world.

And I called them up, when, all of a sudden, it hit me. Here I was, and that whole area has been rebuilt. And the Third Street Bridge is still in a little bit of trouble, but things have moved.

And I said, don't tell me things can't change. And I told them about the story.

Am I violating social distance here in walking up? I guess I am. Sorry.

Yes.

And I said, don't tell me things can't change. And I told the story, and pointed, reminded them what it was when I was a young attorney.

And -- but I made a mistake about something. I thought you could defeat hate. Hate only hides. It only hides. And when someone in authority breathes oxygen under that rock, it legitimizes those folks to come on out, come out from under the rocks.

And I hadn't planned on running for anything again after my son had died, and I was a professor at a college and running another program in another college, until I saw those people come out in Charlottesville carrying torches, literally torches, coming out of the fields.

Close your eyes. Remember what you saw on television, their veins bulging, their hate-filled speech, chanting the same anti-Semitic bile that was chanted in the streets of Germany in the '30s, and on top of that, accompanied by white supremacists, Ku Klux Klan.

A young woman was killed protesting those folks. And the president of the United States was asked, he was asked, what do you think? And he said -- quote -- something no president has ever, ever said -- he said, "There are very fine people on both sides."

No president has ever said anything like that.

The generic point I'm making is, not all his fault, but it legitimizes, it legitimizes the dark side of human nature.

And what it did, though, it also exposed what had not been paid enough attention to, the underlying racism that is institutionalized in the United States, still exists, has existed for 400 years.

And so what's happened is that we end up in a circumstance like you had here in Kenosha and have here in Kenosha. But, you know, I am, as my -- I had a serious operation years ago. A neurosurgeon and I -- he gave me a relatively small chance of making it. After it was all over, I said, I'll be fine.

And he said: "Do you know what your problem is, Senator?" He said, "You're a congenital optimist."

(LAUGHTER)

BIDEN: Well, I think we have reached an inflection point in American history.

I, honest to God, believe we have an enormous opportunity, now that the screen, the Curtain has been pulled back, and just what's going on in the country, to do a lot of really positive things. As much as they say that, you know, Black Lives Matter has lost some

standing since the president has gone on this rant about, you know, law and order, et cetera, still, you have over 50 percent of the American people supporting it. It was up to 78. That's never happened before.

[15:25:07]

People are beginning to see, because of COVID, who the people are out and breaking their necks, risking their lives to keep them safe in their homes.

You know that old definition of a firefighter. God made man, and then he made a couple of firefighters. You're all crazy, thinks God.

I grew up in a neighborhood you either became a firefighter or a priest, and I wasn't qualified for either, so here I am.

(LAUGHTER)

BIDEN: But all kidding aside, think of what's happened. Think of all the people. Who are all those people?

You got over 6,000 young dreamers -- quote, unquote -- "dreamers," in the Hispanic community, who, in fact, are on the front lines dealing with COVID. You have all those folks working in the supermarket stacking the shelves, making five, six, seven bucks an hour.

In fact -- and they're mostly minorities, African-Americans, Latinos.

People are beginning to figure out who we are as a country. This is not who we are. This is not who we are.

So, the first point I want to make to you all is, I am not pessimistic. I'm optimistic about the opportunity, if we seize it.

And I'm going to respond to each one -- what each one of you had to say.

Tim, you talked about this a lot more than -- you have to put money behind the solutions. The country is ready to put that money behind the solutions now.

Here is what I'm proposing, and it's going to happen. You point out a 30 percent poverty rate among African-Americans. You have living wages that don't exist.

We're going to nationalize $15 an hour. No one should ever work -- have to work two jobs just to make it. That's not right in America. Just two jobs just to make the min -- just to be above the poverty rate, above the poverty level?

Prison reform, there's a whole lot of forms it takes, but my view is, we should turn prison reform -- and I have been preaching this for the last five years -- from prison punishment to reform. So, for example, anybody serves their time in prison, when they get

out, they should be entitled to every single program that exists under the federal government.

Why don't we want them getting a Pell Grant going to school? Why don't we want them getting a job and being able to get public housing, housing subsidies? Why don't we want them qualifying for what used to be called food stamps?

But, right now -- I wrote years ago with a guy named Specter, Senator from Pennsylvania, the Second Chance Act, because, right now, we're in a situation where you get out of prison -- and I think you all know this -- you get a bus ticket and 25 bucks.

By the way, 93 percent of everybody, 93 out of every 100 prisoners in prison are behind a city jail, a county jail, a state jail, not a federal prison.

Barack and I were able to reduce the prison population federally by 38,000 folks. Anybody who gets convicted of a drug crime, not one that is in terms of massive selling, but consumption, they shouldn't go to prison. They should go to mandatory rehabilitation.

Instead of building more prisons, I have been proposing for some time we build rehabilitation centers, mandatory. They have got to go to mandatory rehab.

But it's not part of their record when they get out, if they finish it, because the point you made, you get a record, and it stays with you. Sorry, you can't get the job because you had -- did the following, even if it's a misdemeanor.

We shouldn't be putting anybody in jail for that. We should find ourselves in a situation where housing -- right now, in the United States of America, we don't have the kind of housing funding we had back in our administration, and earlier before that, even in Republican administrations.

No one should have to pay more than 30 percent of their income to be able to live and not have -- have housing, including people on the street. That's why I proposed the $400 billion program to vastly increase available housing in America.

And, by the way, it's not a waste of money. Even the folks on Wall Street point out that would increase the GDP, make it grow. People will do better. People will do better.

Hard as the devil for any of your clients who are black to get an entrepreneurial business loan. All the studies show they're just as qualified to be able to succeed as anyone else is.

Barack and I put together a program that was $1.5 billion that brought $30 billion off the sidelines, and we provide that program for the local Small Business Association, so you can go and apply, because, guess what, if you get a loan, and then the private sector says, hey, he has government backing, and we're going to join him, we will get in the deal with him or her.

We're going to move that to $150 billion, just fundamentally changing where we go.

OK, I'm giving you too much. I can see you're about to stand up.

(LAUGHTER)

BIDEN: Mental health.

Mental health is a badly needed commodity right now.