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Biden Answers Questions from Reporters in Delaware; White House Denies Trump Called War Dead "Losers" and "Suckers"; Trump's Long History of Attacking Military Members; Sen. Tammy Duckworth (D-IL) Discusses Trump Attacking Military Members. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired September 04, 2020 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:30:00]

JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: The Delaware National Guard had a pin made up that's a gold star that was made up for my son, Beau, who didn't die in the field.

And I always carry it with me. And I didn't carry it today because -- I was worried that if I focused too much on it that I would engage in some of the kind of language that the president's used.

But I just think it is sick. It is deplorable. It is so un-American. It is so unpatriotic.

And then watching him this morning? While I was shaving and the TV on. Talking about he never said anything like that. He honored John McCain. He's the reason why flags were flown at half-mast. Wasn't that noble on him?

He's the same guy that whether the ship went in the harbor he made sure the "USS McCain" was covered and you couldn't see it. He's the same guy that denigrated John.

He is the same guy who did a similar thing where he talked about George H.W. Bush, who was shot down in the Pacific.

I mean, but he just stands there. It's almost pathological.

I've never said anything like that. No one's been better to the military. I -- I just got to focus on what has to be done, not what he did, what I do from here, what gets done from here.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Thank you, sir.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Thank you, Mr. Vice president. If I could follow up on Ed's questions about voting. We know the president is attacking mail-in voting. He's even now suggesting his supporters vote twice. We also know Russia has been trying to sow doubt about the system.

Are you concerned at all that this messaging may be working, that your supporters may give up on voting by mail because they're concerned that it may be rigged? BIDEN: Yes, I am. That's why I try not to talk about it so much.

Because I'm playing into -- we're playing into it. The more we talk about it.

There's two things he wanted us to talk about. Is the election legitimate? And the whole country's up in flames. Everything's burning. Law and order.

Because he doesn't want to talk about anything, anything at all about the job he hasn't done. And so it is a conundrum.

There's a lot we could talk about in terms of the specifics that Russia is doing and not doing. But when you do, it just undermines what people think may be illegitimate.

What I don't want to have happen, I don't want people reaching the point you could understand sometimes it is not worth voting.

You know, it seems to me that one of the things that I keep trying to say to people is go to Iwillvote.com. Figure out -- Iwillvote.com.

And figure out where you can vote, how you can vote, what's available to you, where you can vote early. Where you can vote in person. Where it's going to be safe for you, et cetera. Plan now. Plan now.

But the more chaos that is sown here is going to disincline people to show up. And in a sense, every time, I speak about it I feel like I'm playing in his game.

Is that -- not that you agree with me but does that make sense what I'm saying? I think that's all part of the deal.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Thank you, Mr. Vice president. Going back to the jobless report from this morning, you had acknowledged that less than half of the 22 million jobs that were lost in the spring because of the pandemic have been recovered.

What do you think the 1.4 million added back in August says about just the general direction of the economy?

BIDEN: I think any job added back is positive. I think it matters to the people who got that job back.

You know, maybe you all were raised in households like I was where mom or dad was losing a job because of the economy, what's going on in your community, you could feel the tension, unease in the household, how it just everything. You know, worrying about whether you can provide for your family.

And along the way, also, look at the people who you have got, you know, a couple million people out there, close to, who are part-time workers who still can't make it but are listed as employed.

[13:35:09] And a lot of them also are in the process of wondering whether or not. I mean, there are a lot of people lining up in food lines, they're the people many of them who lost their health care. Their health care provided by the employer.

They're the same people out there worrying, if this president is able to win in court and wipe out the entire Affordable Care Act, and all the hundred million people with preexisting conditions won't be able to get insurance even if they had the money. And it is just -- the anxiety is enormous, is enormous.

Look, again, I'm not being solicitous. Among the brightest people I have dealt with my whole career have been the press. Not a joke. You all are extremely well educated, you're well read, you have significant backgrounds. And the vast majority have tried to report the news, not just opinion.

But I can't believe that you don't feel the same kind -- not Democrat/Republican. OK? You don't feel the same anxiety because you got a brother or sister, a mother, a father, a son or a daughter who's going through what you're not. What we're not.

We have jobs. I don't have a job now but we have jobs. And so, it's a real concern.

And I just think that this is moved beyond Democrat, Republican. I think it's moved to trying to put this country back together again so we can move.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: One more question --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you, guys. Thank you.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: One more --

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Can I ask --

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Mr. Vice president --

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Take one from FOX. You like to engage.

BIDEN: I like to engage.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: If I may ask, President Trump just announced that Serbia and Kosovo deal and President Trump just announced an economic normalization deal between Serbia and Kosovo. And part of that deal is Kosovo and Israel having diplomatic normalization.

You have stated that you support a two-state solution in the Middle East. Would you support more Muslim majority countries normalizing relations with Israel, even though it means that the Palestinians lose leverage in the fight towards a two-state solution?

BIDEN: First of all, I don't know what the deal is you're referring to. OK?

What I have argued relative to Serbia and Kosovo is that Kosovo should be an independent country, not a part of Serbia. I have spent a lot of time there.

And so I don't know how -- I assume that would reinforce that independence but I don't know based on what's being said.

I think normalization of relations among countries is a, by and large, and almost every instance, a good thing to have a Muslim-majority country normalizing relations with Israel in a generic sense seems positive to me.

But I have to know the detail of what's happening, what's going on. And I don't know that. And it may, you may be right, that that would cause the Palestinians to lose leverage in a decision on a two-state solution.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: In general, do you support more countries recognizing Israel?

BIDEN: I do. Absolutely, I do. I do. And I think that's the thing, recognizing Israel as an independent Jewish state. I think that's important.

And but also I believe that Israel has to be prepared to work toward a genuine two-state solution.

Thank you all very much.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Thank you, Mr. Vice president.

(CROSSTALK)

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: That was Democratic presidential nominee, Joe Biden.

I want to bring in my colleagues to discuss what we just saw. David Chalian, our CNN political director is with us, Dana Bash, CNN chief political correspondent, and Catherine Rampell, who is our CNN economics commentator.

Dana, to you first.

What were your takeaways from what appeared to be a very forceful Joe Biden in light of this "Atlantic" story of what President Trump said about troops who lost their lives or injured at war?

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: He's pissed off. And it was very clear that he decided to change the beginning of a speech billed as a reaction to the monthly jobs numbers and talk from the heart about how he felt about the comments that the president allegedly made, that the president is vehemently denying.

[13:40:18]

Which Joe Biden said flatly that he just doesn't believe him because they comport with other things that the president said out loud in front of a camera in the past about John McCain, et cetera.

I'm not sure that the substance of what the president allegedly said and the pushback on it is going to change any votes.

But the way that Joe Biden responded is the kind of fight and the kind of fire that a lot of Democrats have been waiting to see and hear from him, more of.

Not that he hasn't been doing it before. But this was genuine, this was anger. This was I'm ready to get in there and beat Donald Trump. And that was what he was telegraphing.

And it helped that it was clearly very genuine because, Brianna, as you know, he not only was a military father, he has spent so many years dealing with and getting to know so many members of the military not just as a two-perm vice president but as a foreign relations chair and a Senator from Delaware.

KEILAR: This was clearly personal for him because he's talking about his son, Beau. And I think he said he wasn't a sucker. And his friends that didn't make it back alive weren't losers in response to the remarks that the president made according to that article.

David, what do you think?

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: I don't think it's very hard for Joe Biden to take the moral high ground when the president of the United States is reportedly disparaging the American military.

But what Joe Biden did is just not take the moral high ground but, as Dana is saying, with a real personal passion. He just ran with it in responding back to this today.

And as Dana rightly noted, the president has denied saying this. But there are so many examples of the president on the record speaking in ways that make you question how he sees the service of those who serve that you don't just need this reporting in "The Atlantic."

I think this fills out a picture that Donald Trump has been painting himself over the last five years in the public political spotlight that he's been in.

Joe Biden, it would have been sort of political malpractice to let the comments go by the wayside. When your opponent gives you this kind of opportunity, you seize it.

And I will just note, this comes at the end of a week where, you will recall, Donald Trump tried to use the Republican National Convention last week to change the entire conversation about this campaign, to move it from what had been months and months about a referendum on Donald Trump to a real choice election between Donald Trump and Joe Biden.

Where are we now at the end of the week after the convention? It is a referendum on Donald Trump.

Joe Biden was answering questions about suggestions that people should and vote twice and test the system to see if vote-by-mail ballots are actually properly processed.

He was asked about the president of the United States ignoring scientists and mocking mask wearing.

And he's asked about these comments of the commander-in-chief disparaging the American military.

The election, right back to being all about Donald Trump and a referendum on him, which is not where he and the campaign wanted to be.

KEILAR: I want to talk about the mask moment and some of these other moments that Trump created this week that, like you said, just kind of served up the opportunities on a silver platter.

(CROSSTALK)

BASH: Sorry, but what you just said is so important, that Trump created.

KEILAR: Yes.

BASH: What you just said adding to what David just said is the key. This didn't happen to Donald Trump. He created those moments. Forgive me.

KEILAR: That's right.

Catherine, I want to talk to you about the economic side of this. Because that's what this was supposed to be about. And yet, of course, these other issues are very pressing and need to be dealt with, as well.

What was your takeaway?

CATHERINE RAMPELL, CNN ECONOMIC COMMENTATOR: There's plenty of material to talk about unrelated to the economy.

But the economy is, in fact, a very vulnerable spot for President Trump. It is the only issue on, which, so far, he has bested his opponent, Joe Biden, throughout this campaign and most polls.

However, if you look at the numbers themselves, it suggests two economies right now. And this is what Joe Biden was talking about.

There's the economy of white-collar, highly educated work-from-home families for whom they have recovered most if not all of the jobs lost earlier this year as a result of the pandemic.

[13:45:07]

And then there's the economy of the working class, which is the people whom Trump is supposed to represent, whom he champions. He came into office. He won the election in 2016 on a narrative that Washington elites were ignoring the struggles of the working class.

And meanwhile, you still have very high unemployment. You still have a lot of temporary layoffs converting into permanent layoffs at this point. You still have lots of small businesses, which obviously sustained many of those jobs, never reopening. They're still closed and many of which will permanently stay closed.

And this is a fruitful line of attack for Joe Biden. Because people perceive this as Trump's strength. And Trump certainly talks about himself as being the best -- what does he say? He's the greatest jobs president ever in history.

But as Biden pointed out, Trump may be the first president since modern economic data began to leave office with fewer jobs than existed when he was inaugurated.

I think Biden should keep pressing that. Of course, he has a wealth of other material he could be raising if he wants to make his case to the American voter.

KEILAR: And one of those things, Dana, the mask issue. It sort of defies belief. No, it doesn't defy belief. I'm not really in disbelief that the president did this. I wonder the logic and the gain politically.

But what the president said about him wearing a mask, what did you think about Joe Biden's answer?

BASH: You know, that was more cautious Joe Biden. He kind of felt like the whole notion of wearing a mask, for the most part, spoke for itself.

It was one of those moments we've seen from Joe Biden so many times, well, I shouldn't go there, but then he goes there a little bit.

This is, if you kind of look at the idea of suburban voters, suburban women, women in general, the remaining potential swing voters, the mask issue could be a really, really big determinative factor.

Because they're living it in their everyday lives. They are living it, trying to get masks on the little kids. They're living it trying to figure out this is kind of the tip of the spear and it goes down to schools and other real challenges that people are dealing with.

The flip side, though, is the president is clearly speaking to very real, very vocal, very passionate anti-maskers, who are out there, who are natural Trump voters.

And maybe even people who didn't vote in 2016, who they are mining, trying to find in key places like Pennsylvania.

And others who say, you know what, I'm so sick of people like Joe Biden telling me what to do. I won't wear a mask. And I'll listen to Donald Trump and go out and vote because of that.

That's not impossible that's a real place to get votes for Donald Trump. And that is part of it, aside from the fact he was just playing entertainer in chief last night.

KEILAR: I want to thank all of you, Catherine, Dana.

Thank you, David.

Appreciate your comments.

And I want to go back to this truly bombshell report from Jeffrey Goldberg at "The Atlantic" detailing how the president talks about and views our nation's veterans and servicemembers who have laid down the lives for their country or have been injured in service.

The report includes new details about President Trump's 2018 visit to France to mark 100 years since World War I.

Goldberg cites four different souses on President Trump's cancelation of a visit to the cemetery near Paris where American Marines were killed in World War I and buried there. It is sacred ground for military members and Marine in particular.

Goldberg writes, quote, "In a conversation with senior staff members on the morning of the scheduled visit, Trump said, 'Why should I go to the cemetery? It is filled with losers.'"

In a separate conversation on the same trip, Trump referred to the more than 1,800 Marines lost as "suckers" for getting killed.

And according to Goldberg, Trump, on that same trip, asked aides, "Who are the good guys in this war."

He also said he didn't understand why the United States would intervene on the side of allies.

And Goldberg said that Trump was fixated on Senator John McCain, who was held in captivity for more than five year as a prisoner of war in Vietnam.

He writes that when McCain died in August of 2018, Trump told the senior staff, according to three sources with direct knowledge, "We're not going to support that loser's funeral."

And he became furious, according to witnesses, when he saw flags lowered to half-staff. "What the bleep are we doing that for?" He said, "The guy was an F'g loser," according to this report. That's what the president told the aides. [13:50:00]

And Goldberg talks about a moment in 2017. On Memorial Day, Trump visited Arlington National Cemetery with General John Kelly, his future chief of staff.

And standing by the grave of John Kelly's son, Robert Kelly, who was killed in action in Afghanistan, "The Atlantic" reports that Trump turned to Kelly and said, "I don't get it. What was in it for them?"

Goldberg writes, "Trump has been, for the duration of his presidency, fixated on staging military parades but only of a certain sort. In a 2018 White House planning meeting for such an event, Trump asked his staff not to include wounded veterans on grounds that spectators would feel uncomfortable around amputees. "Nobody wants to see that" he said.

He also reports, after a White House briefing given by the then- chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, General Joe Dunford, Trump turned to aides and said, "That guy is smart. Why did he join the military?"

Here is Goldberg talking to CNN earlier about his reporting on Trump's cancelled visit to the cemetery.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JEFFREY GOLDBERG, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, "THE ATLANTIC": Donald Trump expressed directly to senior aides his lack of desire to go to the cemetery and not to risk 90 minutes in traffic.

Because he doesn't understand why one would go pay that level of respect to fallen American soldiers.

He also, by the way, expressed, directly, fear that the rain, which was quite heavy at times, would mess with his hair.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: The president is angrily denying this. He's declaring it's fake or from former disgruntled employees. He spoke just moments ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It's a fake story, written by a magazine, that's probably not going to be around much longer. But it was a totally fake story. And that was confirmed by many people who were actually there.

It was a terrible thing that somebody could say the kind of things. And especially for me because I've done more for the military more than almost anybody else.

There's nobody that considers the military, and especially people that have given their lives in the military. To me, they're heroes. To me, they're heroes. It's even hard to believe how they could do it. And I say that. The level of bravery. And to me, they are absolute heroes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Trump also went on Twitter earlier and he insisted in a flurry of tweets that, while he was never a fan of John McCain, he never called him a loser and approved his funeral without hesitation or complaint.

CNN has not independently confirmed the reporting that "The Atlantic" has.

But "The Washington Post" has. And an A.P. reporter who is a former Marine infantryman has as well.

The problem for the president here is that his comments about the war dead and injured are not out of character. Right? He's spoken ill of them before.

And he even lied in that denial about his comments about John McCain specifically. Because me did call McCain a loser. He did it twice, in a tweet and when he initially attacked him being a war hero.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I supported him. He lost. He let us down. So, I never liked him as much after that because I don't like losers.

(LAUGHTER)

(APPLAUSE)

TRUMP: But, but, Frank, let me get to it.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's not a war hero?

TRUMP: He hit me -- he's not a war hero.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's a war hero.

TRUMP: He's a war her

(CROSSTALK)

TRUMP: He's a war hero because he was captured. I like people that weren't captured, OK, I hate to tell you.

(LAUGHTER)

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO CLIP) KEILAR: John McCain could have been released from captivity in Vietnam. He was the son and the grandson of highly decorated admirals. And that afforded him privilege. But he refused early release and he stayed with his guys. Whatever his politics, whether you like him or not, he was a hero.

And when he died, the president was criticized for waiting to lower flags in honor of McCain's death. It took two days and tremendous pressure on President Trump.

And Trump was upset that he didn't get praise for approving McCain's funeral.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I gave him the kind of funeral that he wanted, which, as president, I had to approve. I don't care about this. I didn't get thank you. That's OK. We sent him on the way but I wasn't a fan of John McCain's.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: It's not just John McCain the president has targeted. He has a history of attacking members of the military and their families.

Around the time of when he first laid into McCain, he also attacked a Gold Star family, the Khans, who were critical of him.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: His wife, if you look at his wife, she was standing there. She had nothing to say. She probably -- maybe she wasn't allowed to have anything to say. You tell me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: She was too heartbroken. Their son was killed by a suicide bomber in Iraq in 2004. And he was posthumously awarded a Purple Heart and a Bronze Star.

Then more recently, the president smeared, mocked and eventually forced Army Lieutenant Colonel Alexander Vindman into early retirement.

Vindman received the Purple Heart for his service in Iraq. And he still had shrapnel from an IUD attack when he was testifying on the president's Ukraine actions in the impeachment trial.

[13:55:09]

TRUMP: I don't know, as he says, lieutenant colonel. I understand somebody had the misfortune of calling him Mister and he corrected them. I never saw the man. I understand now he wears his uniform when he goes in. No, I don't know Vindman at all.

When you look at Vindman's -- the person he reports to said horrible things. Avoided the chain of command, leaked, and did a lot of bad things. So, we sent him on his way to a much different location. And the military can handle him any way they want.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: The president's condolence call to the widow of a Green Beret killed in Niger in 2017, that caused a lot of controversy. When he spoke with LaDavid Johnson's widow, Myeshia, she said his tone made her cry. And that the president seemed to be grasping for her husband's name.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MYESHIA JOHNSON, WIDOW OF SGT. LADAVID JOHNSON: The president said that he knew what he signed up for but it hurts anyways. And I was -- it made me cry because I was very angry at the tone of his voice and how he said it.

He couldn't remember my husband's name. If my husband is out here fighting for our country and he risks his life for our country, why can't you remember his name?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: And this year, when Iran struck an Iraqi base where U.S. troops are housed, causing at least 34 American soldiers to sustain traumatic brain injuries, the president said this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: You said repeatedly to Americans that after Iran retaliated for the Soleimani strikes, no Americans were injured. We now know at least 11 U.S. servicemen were airlifted from Iraq. Can you explain the discrepancy?

TRUMP: No, I heard that they had headaches and a couple of other things. But I would say, and I can report, it is not very serious. It's not very serious.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: So, you don't think that potential traumatic brain injuries are serious?

TRUMP: No, I don't consider them very serious relative to other injuries I've seen.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: The president has also refused to condemn or even mention to Vladimir Putin the reported Russian bounties on the heads of U.S. troops in Afghanistan. Instead dismissing it as fake news. Saying the intelligence wasn't big enough to reach his desk, which is not true. He was briefed on it. He just ignored it.

I know some Americans are going to dismiss this "Atlantic" article as fake news but they shouldn't. Jeffrey Goldberg is a well-sourced, well-respected, and meticulous reporter by all accounts except the president's.

This report aside, the president has made his views on the military and their sacrifices incredibly clear. He doesn't get it. He doesn't get why people say, send me, or how much they love their country that they're willing to put it all on the line.

I am a military spouse. And I don't know what it is to go to war. I don't know what it's like to risk it all. But like other military family members, I have a view to it that a vast majority of Americans do not.

And after this report came out last night, I was thinking about a story my husband told me about one of his friends, a friend who he would alternate on patrols with. And who, to hear my husband tell it, was a total bad ass.

They were in Afghanistan during a particularly hairy time in the war. And on this day, it was his friend who went out on the patrol and he was killed. Because in war, it doesn't matter if you're squared away. Death is often random.

The ones that we have lost aren't losers. They're ordinary people who did an extraordinary thing. They answered the call.

And the ones who come back, they are survivors. And they're fighting for normal lives that many of us take for granted. They're dealing everyday with scars that you can see and scars that you cannot see.

Senator Tammy Duckworth knows full well the hardships and the sacrifices of serving in combat. She's an Iraq War veteran. She's a Purple Heart recipient. She lost both of her legs and partial use of her right arm from serving in Iraq where her Blackhawk helicopter was hit by an RPG.

Senator, thanks for joining us.

SEN. TAMMY DUCKWORTH (D-IL): Thank you for having me on.

And thank you for your comments just now. Our military families also serve in a way many Americans don't even understand.

KEILAR: I didn't understand until I was sitting in that role, I will tell you that for sure. And now I'm in awe of military families.

What did you think? I'm sure you saw this article very quickly last night where the president called America's war dead losers and military members suckers. And you've seen his denial.

What's your reaction?

DUCKWORTH: Oh, we all know this is exactly Donald Trump. This is who he is.

[14:00:01]

People know the story is accurate because he's consistently said these things over the years and continues to act in a way where he likes to use the military for his own personal ego.