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Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg Passes Away; Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell Announces Intention To Confirm President Trump's Nominee To Replace Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg; Republican Senators Pronouncements From 2016 On Not Holding Hearings On President Obama's Supreme Court Nominee Due To Pending Election Examined; Package Containing Ricin Mailed To White House; Supreme Court Nomination Likely To have Significant Effect On 2020 Election; President Trump Claims 100 Million Coronavirus Vaccine Doses Will Be Ready By End of 2020. Aired 2-3p ET

Aired September 19, 2020 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[14:00:30]

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN HOST: Hello, everyone. Thank you so much for joining me. I'm Fredricka Whitfield.

Today a nation mourns the loss of a legal giant, a feminist hero, a cultural icon. U.S. Supreme Court justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg passed away on Friday at her home in Washington D.C. with her family at her side after a long battle with pancreatic cancer. Today crowds continue to hold a vigil near the steps of the U.S. Supreme Court. Live pictures right now. People leaving flowers, taking pictures, and flags are flying at half-staff at the White House, the U.S. Capitol, and of course at the Supreme Court.

The 87-year-old leaves behind a rich legacy and a powerful court seat. Her passing sets up a historic political battle over her replacement and the future of the nation's highest court. The battle lines already being drawn. Today the president tweeting that Republicans have an obligation to select a justice nominee without delay.

Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell vowing the president's pick will get a Senate vote. All of this despite Ginsburg's final wish that a new justice not be selected until after the election. With just 45 days until voters cast their ballots, the 2020 race has just intensified.

We have a team of correspondents and analysts covering all of these developments. Let's begin with the fierce political battle over Ginsburg's replacement. Lauren Fox is on Capitol Hill for us. Lauren, Minority Leader Chuck Schumer just spoke on a phone call with Democrats. And what was said?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL REPORTER: Well, his underlying message, Fred, this afternoon was that if Republicans move forward and rush this nomination through, he said, quote, nothing is off the table next year. Now, exactly what that means, whether it's changing to the filibuster that are coming, whether it is additional changes to the court in the future, it still remains to be seen.

But look, over the weekend the focus has really been on Majority Leader Mitch McConnell and what happens next in the fight. The big question, of course, whether or not McConnell moves forward with this nomination before the election or after the election. When will that vote take place? And there is basically a political calculation happening right now between which one is better and easier for the majority leader. The question, of course, whether or not vulnerable senators could be hurt about taking this vote ahead of the election.

The other calculus that is going through the minds of conservatives, I'm told, is that if you wait until after the election, what happens if Trump loses? Certainly, when lawmakers return in the lame duck session, Republicans would still control the Senate, but would moderate Republicans feel comfortable moving forward with the president's nominee if the voters had already spoken? Those are the big questions.

And, of course, there are key senators to watch. McConnell can only lose three Republican members. And of course, we're going to be looking at people like Susan Collins, a Republican from Maine, as well as Mitt Romney, a Republican from Utah who voted with Democrats on one of those counts of impeachment just in January.

So that's a little bit of the lay of the land at the moment, Fred. But things are going to be changing quickly, and McConnell, you can bet, is going to be having conversations with his members. Lawmakers are going to be meeting on Tuesday afternoon where Republicans will have their first in-person conference lunch. That's going to be something to watch for, Fred.

WHITFIELD: Yes, he wants the votes in order to cement his efforts to move ahead. Lauren Fox, thank you so much.

We're told the president could begin meeting with potential nominees as early as next week. In a tweet this morning President Trump says he plans to move forward without delay. For more on the president's thinking, let's go now to CNN's Boris Sanchez live at the White House. So Boris, what are you learning?

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Fred, last night one source close to the president told CNN that Trump has been salivating, awaiting this opportunity. It's clearly been on his mind for some time. Several sources telling us that the president earlier this summer was having private discussions with aides eager to potentially nominate a woman to the Supreme Court, in part because he believes it is going to boost his standing among female voters. Recent polling indicates that the president is struggling with female voters, largely because of his response to the coronavirus pandemic.

Now, if you recall, several weeks ago the president put out a list of some potential nominees to the Supreme Court, 20 names on that list, including some prominent ones, Senators Josh Hawley and Tom Cotton as well, and a name that we've seen before Amy Coney Barrett.

[14:05:13] Remember, her name came up previously after the retirement of Justice Anthony Kennedy, and the president met with her back in 2017, ultimately deciding to nominate Brett Kavanaugh, who wound up being confirmed to the Supreme Court. It was believed that because of her stance on abortion it would be very difficult to confirm her, that Democrats would latch onto her stance on Roe versus Wade and attack her.

Ultimately, though, according to sources, her meeting with the president remained on Trump's mind, specifically as a potential replacement for Ruth Bader Ginsburg. As you noted, officials at the White House saying that the president could meet with nominees as early as next week. No matter who he picks it will certainly be a difficult confirmation process moving forward given the current political climate, Fred.

WHITFIELD: Boris Sanchez at the White House, thanks so much.

So as messages of mourning and support flood in from across the country, people in Washington, D.C. are gathering on the U.S. Supreme Court Plaza and steps there to pay their respects to the late Justice Ginsburg. CNN's Suzanne Malveaux is at the court for us. So Suzanne, this is reminding me of the mountain of flowers that grew to huge proportions outside Buckingham Palace for Princess Diana, now this time for an American superhero.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Fred. If you look around, just thousands of people who have gathered outside of the Supreme Court from late last night to early this morning when the sun was just rising. It is a gorgeous day, but of course a bittersweet day as many tears have been shed here.

I've been talking to a lot of people this morning, balloons and flowers, as well as posters, a collage of chalk tributes right outside the sidewalk there of the Supreme Court as people recognize the extraordinary work that she did. She was called a tigress of civil procedure by the late Justice Antonin Scalia, her ideological foe, but also her best friend on the Supreme Court.

So many people have brought their families. They have brought their children. I've had a chance to talk to many of them, as well as D.C. Delegate Eleanor Holmes Norton who knew the justice for nearly 50 years. Here's just a sampling of some of the emotions that are coming out today.

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ELEANOR HOLMES NORTON (D), DELEGATE TO HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA: I miss her because of what she meant to me. I worked with her when I was a young lawyer at the American Civil Liberties Union, and she worked not for the American Civil Liberties Union, but she headed our women's rights project. And she argued six cases before this court, all about women's rights. She won five of them. If that wasn't a precursor to what her life would be, I don't know what was. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is my little boy, and I think it's important

for him to see the things that women can do, because he's going to grow up in a different generation, hopefully where there's more equality and these kinds of things will be normal for him. So it will be important when he grows up to know that on this day he was here, and he was honoring Ruth, seeing women achieve things that my mother and grandmother didn't imagine, and for him, like I said before, will be normal.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: And Fred, so many people acknowledging that the stakes are so, so high. We saw the Democratic vice presidential nominee, Kamala Harris, her husband and her were here earlier in the morning incognito, a quick trip. She tweeted out a photo later, saying that Justice Ginsburg was a titan and that the stakes could not be higher as we're seeing it play out on Capitol Hill and at the White House.

And Fred, I have to tell you, back in April of 2012 I had an opportunity and honor to interview Justice Ginsburg here at the Supreme Court for a think tank, and the main message she had as a spry 79-years-old was that she wasn't going anywhere, despite the fact that there was some pressure in 2012 before the reelection of President Barack Obama to retire just in case the Republican president would be able to go ahead and nominate someone. She made it very clear that, no, she had a lot of energy and fight still to go, Fred.

WHITFIELD: She did, indeed. Stamina, unbelievable. Suzanne Malveaux, thank you so much.

Next, the elephant in the room -- blatant hypocrisy as Republicans try to push through another Supreme Court nominee. Could it impact the 2020 election?

RBG's legacy will be remember for lifetimes to come as a champion for women's rights, a feminist icon. Here she is talking about the Me Too movement.

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[14:10:00]

RUTH BADER GINSBURG, SUPREME COURT JUSTICE: It's amazing to me that for the first time women are really listened to because sexual harassment had often been dismissed as, well, she made it up, or she's too thin-skinned. So I think it's a very healthy development.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

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WHITFIELD: With the election just 45 days away and a new vacancy on the U.S. Supreme Court, the stakes couldn't be higher. Already Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell is vowing to give the president's nominee a vote on the Senate floor. He and other Republican senators, though, had a much different tone back in 2016 when President Obama was in office. Watch.

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[14:15:00]

SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM (R-SC): I want you to use my words against me. If there's a Republican president in 2016 and a vacancy occurs in the last year of the first term, you can say, Lindsey Graham said let's let the next president, whoever it might be, make that nomination, and you could use my words against me and you would be absolutely right.

We are setting a precedent here today, Republicans are, that in the last year, at least of a lame duck eight-year term, I would say it's going to be a four-year term, that you're not going to fill a vacancy to the Supreme Court based on what we're doing here today. That's going to be the new rule.

MITCH MCCONNELL, (R-KY) SENATE MAJORITY LEADER: The next justice could fundamentally alter the direction of the Supreme Court and have a profound impact on our country. So, of course, of course, the American people should have a say in the court's direction.

SEN. MARCO RUBIO, (R-FL) SENATE INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: I don't think we should be moving forward on a nominee in the last year of this president's term. I would say that if it was a Republican president.

SEN. TED CRUZ, (R-TX): President Obama is eager to appoint Justice Scalia's replacement this year. But do you know in the last 80 years we have not once has the Senate confirmed a nomination made in an election year, and now is no year to start. This is for the people to decide. I intend to make 2016 a referendum on the U.S. Supreme Court.

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WHITFIELD: Here with me now to discuss, Matt Lewis, senior columnist for "The Daily Beast." Matt, good to see you. So how risky is this for these Republican senators to be so hypocritical?

MATT LEWIS, SENIOR COLUMNIST, "THE DAILY BEAST": I don't think it's very risky. They've been very hypocritical for a long time now on a lot of things, and this will not be a new development. I think they will be hypocrites on this, and I think they will vote for a nominee, and I don't think it's going to matter for most of them.

Ted Cruz in Texas, Marco Rubio, most of these folks aren't up. Lindsey Graham is up for reelection. I don't think this is going to hurt him in South Carolina. So basically, I think they skate on this. They look stupid. I don't think it actually hurts them.

WHITFIELD: Also joining us right now, Sabrina Siddiqui, national politics reporter for "The Wall Street Journal." I'm glad you could be with us. So Sabrina, this is a stark reminder that this doesn't only impact the presidential race. According to Manu Raju, GOP Senator Thom Tillis, who is seeking reelection in North Carolina had this to say about it. And he says, I'm quoting now, "There is a clear choice on the future of the Supreme Court between the well-qualified and conservative jurist President Trump will nominate and I will support, and the liberal activist Joe Biden will nominate." So what do you make of the senator endorsing President Trump's SCOTUS nominee before we even know who he or she is?

SABRINA SIDDIQUI, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: I think that what Senator Tillis is doing is effectively making his own reelection a referendum on the Supreme Court. And he was one of the most closely watched senators as news of Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg passing emerged last night.

When people are thinking about who the vulnerable Republican senators are on the ballot in November and whether there will be defections, they were looking at people like Senator Tillis who now has made clear he will support President Trump's nominee, whoever it is. But also all eyes are on people like Senator Susan Collins of Maine, Senator Lisa Murkowski of Alaska who had signaled that she would not support filling the vacancy based on the precedent that was set in the 2016 election. Cory Gardner in Colorado, another very closely watched senator.

And I think this really could play out two different ways. It could put those vulnerable Republican incumbents in a position where if there is a lot of public pressure not to fill fthis vacancy until after the election, then perhaps we could be looking at a couple of defections, or they could decide that this actually will -- supporting President Trump's nominee will galvanize the Republican base, and maybe it is in their interest to support that nominee because that's how they can shore up support in an election that also will hinge very much on turnout.

We really obviously don't know how what's going to happen and how this is all going to unfold in the next couple months, but Mitch McConnell has made it very clear he will put that nominee up for a vote, and he did tell Republican senators last night to keep their powder dry. He doesn't want them to lock themselves into any one position either way. But certainly, the Supreme Court has now directly been injected, not just, to your point, at the presidential level, but also in these down ballot races.

WHITFIELD: And Matt, barring Murkowski and Collins, do you see McConnell has the numbers to successfully push through a vote on a nominee?

LEWIS: I think he will. I think this is mostly good politics for Republicans, like we mentioned Thom Tillis. I think this helps Thom Tillis. It makes the race bigger than just Donald Trump. And especially there's the idea that Trump and McConnell might end up -- you could wait until the lame duck session to have the vote. And so it may be that this election takes on a bigger, even bigger than we thought importance that transcends Donald Trump.

[14:20:08]

If you're a conservative that doesn't like Donald Trump, this is a reason to now vote. This is a reason to now be engaged. So, look, Susan Collins in Maine, that's a tough one, Alaska, Murkowski. But I think, by and large, this is a good development. Obviously, it's a tragedy from a personal standpoint, but politically speaking I think this is a net positive for Republicans, both Donald Trump and in the Senate.

WHITFIELD: And Sabrina, we're hearing through our reporting that the interviewing process might begin within the next couple of weeks. The president has said he would want to seat a woman, largely to try to appeal to female voters. But it can't be just any woman, right? It's going to matter who that potential nominee is.

SIDDIQUI: Absolutely. And I think we can expect President Trump, if you look at the other two appointees under his watch, Justice Neil Gorsuch and Brett Kavanaugh, to choose someone who is a solid conservative. I think because Republicans can confirm that justice with a simple majority, and they have done that twice before, we're not exactly expecting someone who is going to be more of a moderate pick or an olive branch to Democrats in this era that we're in right now.

I think the real question looming over the presidential race, though, is can Democrats turn this into a galvanizing issue. If you think back to 2016 when a lot of Republicans were uncomfortable with then candidate Trump, the rallying cry at the ballot box was around the judiciary, the choice that Republicans put forward when they were justifying their support for then candidate Trump very much had to do with how he would remake the Supreme Court and the judiciary.

And so that's an argument you can very much expect Republicans to put forward once again for some of those voters who have, perhaps, soured on President Trump, whether they're suburban or independents or just, again, rallying the party behind him once more.

Can Vice President Biden do that on the Democratic side, which has seen a significant surge in fundraising in the last 18 hours alone, can they make the Democratic base more energized around the court, which they have struggled to do in past elections around issues like abortions, health care, the future of Obamacare, LGBT rights, a lot of base issues that will very much be at stake depending on the future makeup of the court? That's really going to be the challenge ahead for the Biden campaign and for Democrats down ballot.

WHITFIELD: Matt, does this take some of the heat off the president in terms of the focus of coronavirus, now the president in his reelection campaign just 45 days away gets to now focus on the Supreme Court?

LEWIS: Yes, I think so. Look, this changes the subject, and it changes the subject to something that I think, again, is a net positive for Republicans. First of all, it's a bit of a Rose Garden thing, Trump is the president, he is making a nomination, the Senate is going to take up that nomination.

But it's a huge news story, legitimately so, and it obviously changes the subject. What are we not talking about today? I think didn't we just hit 200,000 deaths from COVID? That would have probably been dominating the news today. So if nothing else, it changes the topic of conversation to an area that I think is more positive. But, look, I think Democrats are already so ginned up against Donald

Trump. It's hard to imagine that this is going to get them any more fired up. On the Republican side, I think this maybe brings home some conservatives who don't like Donald Trump but do care about conservative judges. And that's sort of why I think, at least for now, this looks like a net positive for Republicans.

WHITFIELD: We'll leave it there for now. Matt Lewis, Sabrina Siddiqui, good to see you both. Thank you so much.

SIDDIQUI: Thank you.

LEWIS: Thank you.

WHITFIELD: And this breaking news, a package containing ricin addressed to the White House has been intercepted. Evan Perez joining me now on the phone. What can you tell me, Evan? When and where was this intercepted?

EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Fred. This was intercepted in the last few days, and there was a mail facility that handles all mail that is addressed to the president, to the White House, and that's where this package was intercepted. The procedure is to essentially test this package at least twice to make sure that it is confirmed to be ricin. There's a lot of false positives in things that get sent there. This package was addressed to the president and has been tested enough times to confirm that it is this poison ricin.

And so now the investigation is being led by the FBI, by the Secret Service. Obviously, this is a dangerous situation. It's a poison, and it is something that they take very, very seriously. And so now the question is where did it come from, and whether this is the only package out there.

[14:25:00]

This is an investigation that obviously takes a high precedence given everything and all the tensions going around the election. They're on high alert for incidents like this.

WHITFIELD: Keep us posted on all that you learn. Evan Perez, thank you so much. Again, a package, now confirmation after testing several times, containing ricin, and that package being addressed to the White House as Evan was reporting there. We'll get back to more of that breaking news as we get any more information. Of course, and we'll continue our coverage on the death now of Ruth Bader Ginsburg right after this.

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[14:30:00]

RUTH BADER GINSBURG, SUPREME COURT JUSTICE: It was beyond my wildest imagination that I would one day become the notorious RBG. (LAUGHTER)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: That was Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg talking about the nickname that she never anticipated. Only the second woman appointed to the U.S. Supreme Court. She served as the most senior member of the court's liberal wing, delivering progressive votes on some of the divisive social issues. This earning her a rock star type status and the nickname Notorious RBG.

Joining me right now is Amanda Tyler, a law professor at the University of California Berkeley who clerked for Justice Ginsburg. And Amanda, I understand that you were working on a book with Justice Ginsburg in these final months. What was that like. What was the focus? And what were the roles that you two played in getting this book together?

AMANDA TYLER, FORMER LAW CLERK FOR JUSTICE RUTH BADER GINSBURG: Well, clerking for her was one of the greatest honors and privileges of my life. And what was really special about these last few months was getting to work with her again and getting to feel like I was her law clerk again, because I would send her drafts of things, and then they would come back completely covered in ink, as was the case when I used to send her draft opinions. They would come back, you could barely see the typed print.

So it was fun to be able to have that experience again, and it was really special to be able to collaborate with her. The book is based around a conversation that she and I had at Berkeley, at U.C. Berkeley last fall. It was a conversation in which I asked her about the whole arc of her life and her work, also, especially her work for fighting for gender equality.

And so what we have done is put together something that includes that conversation and includes materials that she chose from when she was an advocate, and includes her favorite opinions that she wrote as a justice, as well as the bench statements she read in those cases summarizing her opinions, and some other materials as well.

WHITFIELD: What did she see as some of the pivotal moments in the arc of her life? I am envisioning that it was almost like you were interviewing her in order to really dictate to potential viewers what her life had been like, what this journey has been like.

TYLER: When I think back about the whole story of her life, it is one of just tenacity, dedication, perseverance, and a word I really like to say about her, especially in these last few decades, is resilience. She had to overcome so much to accomplish what she did, and she always paid it forward. She spent her life paying it forward.

As an advocate, she completely changed the legal landscape of gender, and got the Supreme Court to recognize gender equality and start striking down outdated statutes, or I should say statutes that were based -- and laws that were based on outdated stereotypes about the roles that men and women should play. Her whole career in that respect, even when she became a judge as well, was about opening up opportunities for people, making sure that the Constitution was a document for all of us.

She talks in her VMI opinion about how the story of the Constitution is that it has grown to be ever more inclusive. And she talked a lot in her speeches, in her confirmation hearings, in the VMI opinion and the other places, about how important the work was to make ours a more perfect union. That's a phrase in the preamble of the Constitution. And that work will go on, and I hope people will be inspired by her legacy to keep doing that work.

WHITFIELD: Amanda Tyler, thank you so much for sharing your memories and our condolences to you. I know this is a really tough day and it was a tough evening in which to get through, especially given the kind of impact that she made on your life directly. And you're very fortunate for that, I know.

TYLER: Yes, I am.

WHITFIELD: Amanda Tyler, thank you so much.

TYLER: Thank you.

WHITFIELD: A 2020 election now, and now a U.S. Supreme Court seat up for grabs. How will the GOP's latest power play go over with voters? We'll break down the polling next.

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[14:38:48]

WHITFIELD: With just 45 days to go, the death of Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg now has the potential to reshape the 2020 election. President Trump has indicated he will put up a nominee quickly, and Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell has promised a vote on the Senate floor. Democratic candidate Joe Biden was quick to weigh in.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, (D) PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: There is no doubt, let me be clear, that the voters should pick the president, and the president should pick the justice for the Senate to consider.

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WHITFIELD: CNN's senior political writer and analyst Harry Enten joining me now. So what do polls tell us about whether voters support a Sente vote on a Supreme Court nominee?

HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL WRITER AND ANALYST: Fred, I should just point out, this is all preliminary, right? It's before Ginsburg passed away. But let's just take a look at the numbers, right. And I think they're a little bit surprising. Take a look here, better to pick a Supreme Court nominee among persuadable voters in some key swing states that "The New York Times" recently polled. And what you see is that Joe Biden is actually ahead in these swing states among those who say he's better to pick by a 49 percent to 31 percent margin.

[14:40:00]

But of course, let's also look at motivation, right. Is this a motivating factor for each side. And what's so important here is take a look here, compare 2020 to 2016, and what do you see? You see that right now among Biden supporters in 2020 who say that it's extremely important, nominees for the Supreme Court to their vote, it's actually more important to Biden supporters than it was to Trump supporters. That's a big switch from 2016, when we saw that Trump supporters were actually more motivated by a Supreme Court pick.

Now, of course, Trump says they're going to put forth the nomination, McConnell says they're going to try and get it through. How do voters necessarily feel about that? This is very interesting. What we do see is that Americans at large say that the Senate should in fact hold the hearings. I should point out that in 2016 they said the exact same thing, hold the hearings, and obviously the Senate Republicans didn't do so and it didn't hurt them in the polls.

The last thing I should note here, there's been this idea that Democrats have been pushing that they should expand the size of the Supreme Court. Joe Biden has mostly come out against that. At this particular point only 46 percent of Americans say that in fact they should add more justices. But to be honest with you, Fred, I was actually surprised that that number is so high given that I think there's a lot of thought that's a radical thing, but in fact it's up to 46 percent.

WHITFIELD: I'm surprised to see that number as well.

Then let's talk about early voting. It's already begun, four states. We saw the long lines yesterday in so many places. Are we getting any indication of whether Trump or Biden is ahead at this point, any way to read the people in line?

ENTEN: Yes, I'm not sure I can necessarily read the people in line. But you saw those lines. They were really, really long, right, in Virginia. It was incredible. And so, to me, this is just another indication that turnout is going to be really high this election. I've been predicting 150 million or more, the highest turnout in a generation percentage-wise, and those long lines did nothing to dispel my thoughts on that.

WHITFIELD: It's going to be some election season, 45 days, and a lot in between. Harry Enten, thank you so much.

ENTEN: Thank you, Fred.

WHITFIELD: I want to bring in now CNN politics reporter and editor at large Chris Cillizza.

So good to see you, Chris. What is the immediate impact on the election race?

CHRIS CILLIZZA, CNN POLITICS REPORTER: Well, I think it takes what was already an incredibly contentious election, one that was going to be one of the nastiest in recent memory, maybe ever, one that had stakes that were unmistakably high, and it pours about five gallons of lighter fluid on that. A Supreme Court nomination in any time is a very big deal. It is an even bigger deal in a moment like this when we are dealing with a pandemic, when we have a contested presidential race, when the Senate is up for grabs, the Senate majority potentially up for grabs with Republicans clinging on.

So you just have a lot of trains all arriving at the station at about the same time. Any one of which would be a big deal. When they're all coming together at once, to Harry's point, you get a lot of unpredictability.

WHITFIELD: Right, and just look at this issue of a pick possibly with 45 days to go before election versus 2016, you're talking about 10 months. So which candidate, when looking at that, which candidate has more to gain or to lose by this?

CILLIZZA: Well, from a purely political perspective, any change of subject from coronavirus and how he has handled it is beneficial to Donald Trump. His approval ratings on handling of coronavirus are in the high 30s, low 40s. That issue isn't getting better for him. He's not changing in any meaningful way. So any change is beneficial.

Now, that said, if the Democratic base was ever going to get more energized, which I don't know they would. Donald Trump is a big energizer of the Democratic base. But if they were going to get more energized, my gosh, the prospect of Republicans, who very clearly said with Merrick Garland we cannot do this in 2016, we're too close to an election.

As you point out, it was 10 months away. The idea that Lindsey Graham who said you can quote me, you can use this against me, we shouldn't do this in an election year, is now, as the chairman of the Judiciary Committee, saying we should do this, you're going to see a massive amount of money raised for Democratic Senate candidates.

Again, it's hard for me, if enthusiasm for Democrats was 10 out of 10, can you go to 11 out of 10? I don't know, but if it's a possibility, that's probably the likeliest outcome.

WHITFIELD: So is it your feeling that Lindsey Graham is able to say that because he has the confidence that his supporters are OK with the hypocrisy, or OK with whatever decision he makes on the matter?

CILLIZZA: I think he has the confidence to say it because it's what's politically expedient. He needs every Republican vote in South Carolina. Remember, he's in a Republican state, a state Donald Trump won easily in 2016, a state where Lindsey Graham faces a very serious race, a real race, a surprisingly real race against the former state Democratic Party Chair Jaime Harrison.

[14:45:02]

And in order to win, Lindsey Graham needs to find every Republican and get them out to vote. How do you do that? You make sure you're aligned with Donald Trump. You have a very high profile role in the Judiciary Committee chair hearing, confirmation hearing, in which you're the chairman.

And for those people like us who say you said the exact opposite four years ago or even two years ago to what you're saying now, I don't think he's terribly worried about them, because, again, it's a Republican state. You get your base out, you probably win, and that's what Lindsey Graham is focused on.

This is about power, and this is about the ability to do it. This is not -- there is no argument, Fred, no argument that Senate Republicans can make that this is consistent in any way with how they positioned themselves on Merrick Garland. It's clearly a hypocritical reversal. That doesn't mean they can't do it.

WHITFIELD: Chris Cillizza, we'll find out if voters care one way or another as well.

Coming up, much more on the implications of Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg for the election just 45 days away. But we're also following the coronavirus pandemic. The U.S. nearing the tragic milestone of 200,000 deaths from the virus. The latest on a potential vaccine as well, next.

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[14:50:41]

WHITFIELD: This breaking news into CNN, reaction to the death of Ruth Bader Ginsburg and a statement from a fellow former justice on the court, David H. Souter, saying this, "Ruth Ginsburg was one of the members on the court who achieved greatness before she became a great justice. I loved her to pieces."

The impact of the coronavirus now continuing to plague the nation as the U.S. is approaching nearly 200,000 deaths and more than 6.7 million testing positive for the disease. So who should be tested, when, and when will vaccines be available to all Americans? All of that is still unclear due in part to mixed messaging from this administration. Here now is CNN's Natasha Chen.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We'll have manufactured at least 100 million vaccine doses before the end of the year.

NATASHA CHEN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: President Trump made a jaw- dropping declaration from the White House on Friday.

TRUMP: And likely much more than that.

CHEN: Despite no proven vaccine yet. He even went further, promising enough for all Americans by April.

TRUMP: The vaccines are going through the gold standard of clinical trials, and very heavy emphasis placed on safety. Three vaccines are already in the final stage.

Joe Biden's anti-vaccine theories are putting a lot of lives at risk, and they're only doing it for political reasons. It's very foolish.

CHEN: Trump's timeline contradicts the one given earlier in the week by Dr. Robert Redfield, director of the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. Redfield said there wouldn't be widespread vaccination until late spring or summer of next year.

JOE BIDEN, (D) PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: I can't think of any president who has acted, in my view, so selfishly, about his own reelection, instead of a sworn obligation to protect and defend the American people.

CHEN: In the meantime, the U.S. will soon hit 200,000 deaths since the COVID-19 pandemic began, outpacing all other countries.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We grow numb to the numbers.

CHEN: And behind each number is a person and family struggling. Justin Vine recently woke up are a medically induced coma 56 days after being put on a ventilator.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It definitely changed my perspective on life. Now I see this in a more real way. I knew it was serious before, but this is a real -- it affects everybody differently. But my perspective on life, the time we have is precious.

CHEN: For nearly two months while he was in a coma, the seven-day average of new cases saw an overall decline around the country. But in recent days it has ticked slightly upward, along with the seven-day average of new deaths. This is happening in every region of the country, including the northeast, which had quashed its initial outbreak in the spring.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: People are being cautious, but probably a lot of kids coming back from all over the country to college has a little bit of an impact.

CHEN: Outbreaks among the college population in Boulder, Colorado, prompted new testing sites to be set up there, and two college football games this weekend have been postponed due to athletes testing positive. The Kansas City Chiefs, one of the few NFL teams to allow fans in the stadium in the first week, had a fan test positive after its September 10th game. Now 10 others who were in close contact have to quarantine. On Friday, the CDC updated its guidance to once again emphasize that anyone who has been in contact with an infected person should be tested, even if there are no symptoms.

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CHEN: But here's a bit of better news. A new estimate by the Institute of Health Metrics and Evaluation shows fewer deaths in the U.S. than originally projected by January 1st. But that still means that projection shows more than 378,000 people in this country may have died of COVID-19 by the end of 2020, Fred. WHITFIELD: All right, thank you so much, Natasha Chen.

Straight ahead, the political fight over who should name Ruth Bader Ginsburg's replacement already heating up, putting some vulnerable Republican senators up for reelection this year in a very tight spot. Can Democrats fight back? We're live next.

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RUTH BADER GINSBURG, SUPREME COURT JUSTICE: I love the work I do. I think I have the best job in the world for a lawyer.

I respect all of my colleagues and genuinely like most of them.

(LAUGHTER)

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