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New York Times Breaks Trump Tax Returns; Biden: Barrett Nomination "Abuse Of Power"; U.S. Voting Under Siege; Belarusians Protest Secret Inauguration; Coronavirus Continues Toll On India; NYT: Trump Taxes Show Losses, Tax Avoidance; Trump Calls on Biden to Take Drug Test Ahead of Debate; Supreme Court Pick Draws Attention to Religious Group. Aired 1-2a ET

Aired September 28, 2020 - 01:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[01:00:00]

MELINDA GATES, CO-CHAIR, BILL & MELINDA GATES FOUNDATION: And I think once it starts to be delivered and people start to see other people taking it and being able to go back on with their normal daily life, then you'll see the vaccine rate start to rise again.

What we know is, though, is to get out of a crisis like this takes absolutely global cooperation.

I think the right thing for us to do is to continue to talk about our values and talk about science and where the truth is.

VOICE OVER: This is CNN breaking news.

KIM BRUNHUBER, CNN ANCHOR: And welcome to you, our viewers from around the world. I'm Kim Brunhuber and we start with major breaking news.

A bombshell "New York Times" report says Donald Trump didn't pay any federal income taxes for 10 out of 15 years before his election.

The report coming two days before the first presidential debate details years of financial losses and hundreds of millions of dollars in debts that he has to repay in the next few years.

It also lists specific examples of business deals at his properties with lobbyists and foreign officials that are in potential conflict with Mr. Trump's position as president.

In a news conference Sunday he dismissed the report.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It's fake news, it's totally fake news. Made up, fake. We went through the same stories.

You could've asked me the same questions four years ago I had to litigate this and talk about it. Totally fake news. No -- actually, I paid tax. And you'll see as soon as my tax returns -- it's under audit, they've been under audit for a long time. The IRS does not treat me well.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRUNHUBER: Now being under audit doesn't preclude a person from releasing tax returns publicly.

John harbaugh would has the details on the report.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN HARWOOD, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: On the eve of the first presidential debate between Donald Trump and Joe Biden, a bombshell report in the "New York Times" reporting that the president paid only $750 in taxes the first year he was president.

And a broader picture of a president under financial pressure who was relying on his status as president to keep himself afloat financially.

This New York Times report says that in ten of the previous 15 years before he became president, Donald Trump paid no income taxes.

It says that he has $300 million in loans that he has personally guaranteed coming due within the next four years. Potential loss of another $100 million from a disputed tax refund that he received from the IRS.

It paints a picture of a president who is therefore using his properties to attract business from lobbyists, from the U.S. Government, from foreign officials all because of the tightening financial squeeze that they depict him as being under right now.

Now this is a president, of course, who sold himself to the American people as a highly successful businessman and said his success was the reason why they should hire him as president, to turn the country around.

This report casts doubt on whether he had that success at all, whether he's a billionaire as he has claimed. And whether or not it shakes his own voters, many of those small donors, those blue collar voters, who support the president, they may not defect from him.

But this report takes away time which is the one commodity the president doesn't have very much. He just has a few weeks left in the general election, he's trailing significantly nationally and in battleground states to Joe Biden.

And the more time he had to spend defending himself against this charge the more difficult it is for him to come back. And you can bet that he's going to be defending it on that debate stage with Joe Biden on Tuesday night.

John Harwood, CNN, the White House.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BRUNHUBER: Let's bring in CNN contributor, John Dean. He served, of course, as President Richard Nixon's White House counsel and he's co- author of the new book "Authoritarian Nightmare: Trump And His Followers."

Thanks for this. First, just want to get your reaction to what we learned about President Trump's taxes and his businesses. What were the most important revelations to you?

JOHN DEAN, FORMER NIXON WHITE HOUSE COUNSEL: Kim, I think overall it confirmed our suspicion. I thought that Brian Stelter of CNN, our media reporter, put it well.

He said that it showed that the emperor has no clothes. And it confirmed that, there's no question about that. So that was what it nailed down.

I think, buried in the story, are lots of revelations. And it appears that the "Times" has just started, they're going to have follow up reporting on this.

BRUNHUBER: Some people might make light of the $70,000 claimed for haircuts, even the extent to which he constantly boasts about an empire that's financially a mirage, as you say.

But there are so many serious questions raised here including to whom he owes money, and how far he might go to get himself out of debt.

[01:05:00]

DEAN: Well, the "Times" did note in their overview that they saw no evidence that the Russians were the money behind Trump. So they sort of dismissed that.

But obviously, he does owe somebody a lot of money.

To me, the most interesting revelation buried in the story was the fact that he's under audit and has been unable to get out of that audit for the last almost 10 years is because he got back over $70 million in a refund. And when you get a refund that large, the IRS has the right to audit it.

And when it's over two million dollars, the joint tax committee of congress has the right to review it. They're right in the middle of this. This is five members of the Senate, five members of the House who are right involved in this.

And this is new to me, I didn't know this at all. And you've got to believe, they're taking a close look at it.

BRUNHUBER: Absolutely. The Biden Campaign also taking a very close and interested look at this.

They just released their first ad showing how much basically the average worker in different industries pays annually in taxes and then shows Donald Trump, $750.

I spoke to a few Republicans that I know who support the president on various levels, they either didn't believe this, or didn't care.

Now you've written about his followers. I don't expect this to change their minds necessarily but do you think this will resonate with undecided voters out there?

DEAN: It could affect the undecided voters, those are very few right now. Most people are committed on Trump.

When I looked at his followers -- and that's the reason I did the book -- was to try and understand why the media, for one, had not covered a large body of science that's been looking at the kind of people who are attracted to Donald Trump. The authoritarian figure that attracts a certain type of follower.

And they're not going to be affected at all, Kim. They're going to stay with him. This is just another revelation, they will reject it, they'll take his word for whatever he says, and move on.

But I think there are a few people on the fence that this could affect.

BRUNHUBER: Well, before we let you go, I want to go back to your former boss, President Nixon.

Back then presidents didn't release their tax returns and then, I think in 1973, it was reported that Nixon only paid some $800 or so in taxes. So take us through that scandal and then the precedent it set.

DEAN: Well, that's actually mentioned in the "Times" story. They made -- they allude to it.

And what happened is that Nixon donated -- he had $200,000 worth of income and he donated his vice presidential papers and came up with a nominal less than $1,000 tax liability as a result of it.

When they audited it, what happened they found he had not donated the papers in a timely fashion, that congress also then removed after Trump -- or after Nixon had done this, the right to use personal presidential and vice presidential papers as a gift that was deductible.

Which was used by a lot of people -- Lyndon Johnson actually recommended to him to do that when they were doing the transition between the Johnson presidency and the Nixon presidency.

But anyway, Nixon did turn over his returns and he volunteered them. The joint tax committee, that I just mentioned, is the committee that did the audit on him. And they're the ones that came up with the deficit if you -- particularly the dubious nature of the write off he had taken.

So he indeed ended up paying some taxes on that.

BRUNHUBER: And then that set the precedent. To this day, presidential nominees giving in their tax returns until Donald Trump.

Listen, thank you so much for speaking to us, John Dean. We appreciate it.

DEAN: Thanks, Kim.

BRUNHUBER: All of this, of course, coming right in the middle of a fiercely contentious debate about the president's ultra-conservative pick to replace Ruth Bader Ginsburg on the Supreme Court.

On Sunday, Democratic presidential nominee Joe Biden called the rush to seat Judge Amy Coney Barrett an abuse of power.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, FMR. VICE PRESIDENT AND DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: The Senate has to stand strong for our democracy. They must not act on this nomination until the American people finish the process they've already begun of selecting the president and their congress.

And the voters, in my view, are not going to stand for this abuse of power. And if we're to call ourselves a democracy, their voices must be heard.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[01:10:00]

BRUNHUBER: The senate judiciary committee is expected to approve Judge Barrett's nomination in less than a month setting up a full senate vote by the end of October.

Meanwhile, the president keeps pushing false rhetoric about widespread mail-in ballot fraud telling the media on Sunday that he hopes Judge Amy Coney Barrett is paying attention to potential cases.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I do -- I'm sure she is. I think everybody is, I think everyone in the country -- I think we've made it a very big issue. And it's an issue that the Democrats tried to get away with. I don't think they're getting away -- I mean, so many reports now of phony ballots.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRUNHUBER: And anticipating President Trump will contest the election, U.S. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi sent a letter to her democratic colleagues urging them to focus on winning state delegates.

She wrote: "How many state delegations the Democrats win in this upcoming election could determine who our next president is."

With me to talk about how all of this can legally play out is vice dean of the UFC Law School, Franita Tolson. Thank you so much for doing this. I appreciate it. So I want to put aside the largely made up issue of mail-in ballot fraud. But there are real voting issues that could crop up, long delays, even access to ballots.

We've seen the Trump Campaign asking -- I'm quoting here, what is it? Every doable -- "every able bodied man to join army for Trump's election security operation." We've already seen people physically blocking access to polling places.

How much litigation do you expect to see in the days and weeks before and after the election?

FRANITA TOLSON, CNN ELECTION LAW ANALYST: I would just point out there will be a lot of litigation. In any normal presidential election cycle, you already have a lot of litigation. People sue over various issues, access issues. You have lawsuits on election day.

And so i think this year will be a little bit unusual just in the volume of lawsuits. So we'll see a lot of litigation over various issues because people are voting by mail in unprecedented numbers.

BRUNHUBER: Now President Trump has said, basically, he needs a new supreme court pick in case the election results end up before the courts.

Democrats are now calling for Amy Coney Barrett to recuse herself should she be confirmed and that election scenario play out. Is that a real possibility, and would you expect her to recuse herself?

TOLSON: Well, it's hard to say. I do think because of the politics and the partisanship it overshadows any discussion of the merits. The timeline calls everything into question with respect to her being confirmed. And so I think it's a difficult political situation.

But you have to remember, the lineup of the court as it now stands, there are five conservative justices and three so-called liberal justices.

And so, functionally, there's nothing magical about the number nine, right? So even if we had eight justices just as we had in 2016 there is some dispute that could end up before the court. And if Judge Barrett is confirmed, she could recuse but I don't think that is required.

But it could sort of overshadow her appointment. Because she could be painted as partisan, particularly if it comes down to her vote, and she rules in favor of an election dispute that favors the president.

It could call into question the legitimacy of the court in a way that's problematic and sort of undermines its standing in our system.

BRUNHUBER: You've written that the supreme court has been horrible on voting rights this year. Presumably, with a larger conservative majority, that won't improve?

TOLSON: No. So it's likely that'll just further cement a conservative majority that has been downright hostile to voting rights and to access. And to making it easier for people to vote, especially since we're in the middle of a once-in-a-lifetime global pandemic.

So I don't anticipate that adding Judge Barrett to the court will make that any better.

BRUNHUBER: What specifically do you think has been so egregious in the last year or so that we have seen from the court?

TOLSON: So during the primary season there was quite a bit of litigation. What stands out is the RNC versus DNC decision from this past April. Where a lot of voters in Wisconsin did not receive their absentee ballots in time to vote for election day.

And the court basically made it difficult for the lower court to adopt a remedy that would make it easier for those voters to cast their ballots. And so people had to show up on election day in the middle of a pandemic in order to cast a ballot.

And so the court has also issued shorter opinions where they have upheld decisions by lower courts that make it difficult for people to vote.

So just in the last five or six months the court has really shown that it has not viewed the pandemic as a good excuse to make it easier for people to vote.

[01:15:00]

BRUNHUBER: All right. So many issues to wade through in the coming weeks and we look forward to getting your take on many of them.

Thank you so much, Franita Olsen [sic] in Los Angeles. Appreciate it.

TOLSON: Thank you.

BRUNHUBER: Coming up on CNN NEWSROOM. It's been less than a year since the coronavirus began spreading around the world and already we're approaching a horrible milestone. We'll talk about that.

Plus fighting breaks out between Armenia and Azerbaijan with both sides reporting casualties. We'll explain what's behind the unrest. Stay with us.

0356

BRUNHUBER: New clashes between Azerbaijan and Armenia over the disputed region of Nagorno-Karabakh has reportedly left several people dead.

The two countries have long been at odds over the area which sits inside Azerbaijan but it is controlled by ethnic Armenians. Both sides are now blaming each other for the latest fighting.

Here are the details.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

One of the world's oldest conflicts has re-erupted.

Tensions between Armenia and Azerbaijan flared up in the contested Nagorno Karabakh region Sunday with each side blaming the other for attacking civilians.

CNN has been unable to independently verify claims by either side.

While Armenia says it was responding to missile attacks launched by its neighbor --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANNA NAGHDALYAN, FOREIGN MINISTRY SPOKESWOMAN, ARMENIA: Azerbaijani forces launched a large-scale aggression including missile attacks along the line of contact with Artsakh, Nagorno-Karabakh.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRUNHUBER: Azerbaijan claims it was Armenia who struck first.

[01:20:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ILHAM ALIYEV, PRESIDENT OF AZERBAIJAN (Through translator): It is no secret that the first fire, including artillery fire, was opened by Armenia. And the first to die were Azerbaijani servicemen.

Azerbaijan gave a decent response to the enemy and the enemy could not move an inch.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRUNHUBER: Meanwhile, Armenia's prime minister says his country has responded by destroying three tanks and shooting down a couple of helicopters and three drones.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

IBRAHIM KALIN, PRESIDENTIAL SPOKESMAN, TURKEY: Turkey remains fully in solidarity with --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRUNHUBER: And after Turkey, Armenia's long-standing foe, reaffirmed its solitary with Azerbaijan following the clashes, he warned that any possible in interference by Turkey from Turkey will destabilize the situation in the region.

The neighboring former Soviet republics have long been at odds over the territory which is situated within the borders of Azerbaijan and fought a war over it that finished in 1944. As a result of Sunday's escalating tensions, both countries imposed

martial law with Armenia calling for a general mobilization to confront its neighbor.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We expected Azerbaijan to start a war. Lately they've been talking about it all the time with their war rhetoric. And we are gathered here to help, to go and support our neighbor.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRUNHUBER: Fearing the worst, the U.N., E.U. and NATO have all issued statements calling on both sides to immediately stop fighting.

A clear sign that the international community doesn't want to see a repeat of the 1990s.

It was the first weekend since the secret inauguration of Belarus president, Alexander Lukashenko, and it was a quite one.

In Minsk, the country's capital, tens of thousands of people took part in demonstrations against his elections saying the results weren't legitimate.

It's the fiftieth day of such protests which have gained international support. The European Union and the United States say they also don't recognize Lukashenko as the country's legitimate leader.

But police were out in force across the country detaining dozens of people and using tear gas in at least one city to clear the streets.

Protesters have been turning out by the thousands each week to support an opposition candidate now living in exile and demand an end to Lukashenko's regime.

And some say they won't stop until there is real change in the country.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (Through translator): To be honest, we want peace not violence. So that the authorities finally understand that there is no longer the old Belarus which was scared and patient.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRUNHUBER: Global coronavirus deaths will soon reach one million. Still, the U.S. president keeps insisting that the pandemic is winding down. But that's simply not true.

Cases are trending up across much of the U.S. It had two days this past week with more than 50,000 new cases and just Friday, New York saw daily cases above 1,000 for the first time since June.

Florida just surpassed 700,000 infections. And turning to India now. India just announced that it's topped six

million confirmed cases; that's the second highest in the world after, of course, the United States.

Let's go to now our Vedika Sud who's live in New Delhi.

Vedika, we knew that this was coming as the totals increased inexorably. But even so, it's a staggering number and still climbing. How worried is the government, are they still going ahead with reopening as we've been seeing for the past several weeks?

VEDIKA SUD, CNN REPORTER: Absolutely, Kim. They are going ahead with the unlocking down of India. Remember this is the 2nd week of June.

Now what the government has been saying is it's very difficult not to let people move out at this point in time, given the economy. So the government has been saying this over and over again, we need to coexist with COVID-19.

Now just a few numbers for you and our viewers. The last million has been achieved in 12 days here in India and in September itself we've added over two million positive cases of COVID-19.

Now the death toll stands at over 95,500 here in India and in the last one month, practically, or less rather -- from September 2nd to date, India's added over 1,000 deaths per day to its tally. So those are worrying numbers.

But here's a slight ray of hope. Over 81 percent of the positive cases of COVID-19 across India have recovered according to the Health Ministry of India.

Now yes, there is this reopening of the systems here in India. You've had the metro services re-open in September, you've also had gatherings of less than 100 people take place, be it for political, social or religious reasons. So that is also underway.

And at this point in time, the prime minister, Narendra Modi, has repeatedly reached out to people through video conferences and through other functions that he's been attending asking them to maintain social distancing and wearing masks. While the scientists find a vaccine to end this huge pandemic that has trapped not only India but the world. Kim.

[01:25:00]

BRUNHUBER: A very worrisome situation there. Thank you very much, Vedika Sud. Appreciate it.

Well, President Trump built his image on being a hugely successful businessman. So we'll look at how that squares with the new bombshell report on his tax returns.

And President Trump makes an unusual request as he prepares to debate Joe Biden this week. Why he keeps calling on his political rival to get tested for drugs. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BRUNHUBER: And welcome back to you, our viewers in the United States, Canada and around the world. I'm Kim Brunhuber and you're watching CNN NEWSROOM.

The "New York Times" report on President Trump's income taxes comes with only weeks to go before the election and just ahead of the first presidential debate with his Democratic rival, Joe Biden.

The report chronicles years of substantial losses and tax avoidance. It says he didn't pay any taxes for 10 of the 15 years before his election and then only $750 for 2016 and 2017.

President Trump dismissed the report as fake news and insisted he has paid taxes.

CNN's chief media correspondent, Brian Stelter, spoke with Ana Cabrera about the impact of that report.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIAN SETTLER, CNN CHIEF MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: Americans are already voted [ph] in some states and most Americans minds are made up.

[01:29:42]

But Anna this is one of the most important stories of the past five years. Not one of the most important stories of this year but one of the most important stories of the past five years because as a candidate Donald Trump fought hard to shield his tax returns. And as president, he has fought even harder to shield his tax returns from public scrutiny.

So this is the kind of information that we are going to be hearing about for days and weeks to come and including on the debate stage in front of 60, 70, 80 million people on Tuesday night.

No doubt Joe Biden will be studying this "New York Times" story and thinking about how to bring it up to the debate. But I think this goes even deeper than that. "The New York Times" quoting here, Mr. Trump has been more successful playing a business mogul than being one in real life.

This gets to the heart of the president's campaign five years ago, four years ago, that he was the star of "The Apprentice" who knew how to bailout America.

Well, "The New York Times" story cuts to the heart of that. And by the way "The Times" says this is only the beginning. They say other articles are in the works in the coming weeks. And there's an important context here from "The New York Times" saying all of the information they have obtained was provided by sources with legal access to it. Mos of this has not been public before but "The Times" was able to verify it in various ways. So the president might try to scream fake news but the documents are in the hands of reporters who are able to independently verify it and that is a very big deal.

And look we're going to see the president throw up smoke bombs. He's going to turn on his fog machine, try to distract from the story, try to lie to the public about other events to try to distract from these revelations but the story is right there for all to read. And it gets to the heart of his entire presidency.

That's why I think it's one of the most important stories of the last five years.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KIM BRUNHUBER, CNN ANCHOR: Catherine Rampell is a CNN commentator and "Washington Post" opinion columnist. And she joins me now from New York. Thanks for doing this.

First of all what did we find out that we didn't already know?

CATHERINE RAMPELL, CNN COMMENTATOR: Well, there were a lot of things that we suspected to be the case, right. Trump in contravention of decades of norms had not voluntarily released his tax returns. A lot of people suspected that that meant either he wasn't as rich as he said he was, maybe he was paying little to nothing in tax liabilities, and maybe he was cheating on his taxes.

What "The New York Times" has reported suggests all three of those things are true. While they do not directly measure -- the tax returns would not show what his net worth is, they do show that Trump at least reported to the IRS enormous losses. That's how he was able to have minimal if not zero tax liabilities in many of the years for which they had tax returns.

And how was he able to report those huge losses? Some combination of potentially bad business decisions, businesses that lost money, as well as what I might call suspect deductions that would reduce his tax liability. Deducting things like criminal defense attorney expenses for his son or the real estate taxes paid for what appears to be a vacation home claiming that that was in fact a business expense et cetera.

So what we have learned is that there's a little bit more flesh to put on the suspicions that many had already had about what he was keeping so close to the chest.

BRUNHUBER: But his narrative essentially has just been that he is successfully gaming the system, winning in other words.

RAMPELL: Right. He has said for years -- he's given many reasons about why he would not give -- why he would not release his tax returns but he did say look if you find out that I didn't pay very much and in previously tax returns that showed the same thing that's because I am smart. Now it is true that we have a phenomenally complicated tax system. That there are plenty of loopholes that are perfectly legal to take advantage of.

However there's a lot of relatively dodgy things that he seems to have done over the years. And again, you know, I haven't seen the tax returns myself. I'm just going off of what was reported by "The New York Times" reporters and a lot of it looks like fraud. Or at least could be red flags for fraud. One could understand why the IRS has been auditing him repeatedly for many years because at the very least he's done very aggressive things, at worst they may be on the wrong side of the law.

BRUNHUBER: Most worrying I suppose for voters is the potential for conflict of interest because of his reliance on those properties and groups seeking favors with him, paying vast sums to stay there, and also the huge debts coming due and questions about to whom he might be beholden.

RAMPELL: Right. One of the key questions, one of the reasons why so many of us wanted to see his tax returns wasn't just, you know, to embarrass him. Maybe he's not as rich as he says he is et cetera. But because there is a legitimate question about whether he has been running the executive branch in the public's interest or his own.

[01:34:58]

RAMPELL: And these returns again to the extent that we have returns, or there is material from "The Times" around when he ran for office and since he was inaugurated and became president reveal that he's been getting a lot of money from foreign sources.

There was a huge rush of new memberships at his clubs like Mar-A-Lago. Potentially it seems at the very least seeking access to the president. You know, a much bigger increase in new initiation fees even before the fees themselves went up. He was getting a lot more revenues from that.

And the reporting also revealed as you point out that Trump owes a ton of money. Not only is he getting money from people who potentially may want to have some influence on policy, but he potentially owes a lot of money to people who could twist his arm in some way.

Now we don't know exactly who he owes that money too. We know that somewhere north of $300 million potentially or over $400 million that he owes within the next several years.

Now if he were to win reelection it might be very could be very difficult for those creditors to collect on those hundreds of millions of dollars that he owes. If he loses reelection of course it might be a bit easier.

So that is one substantial financial incentive for him to stay in office and potentially of course, that could shade his views of various kinds of policies but we just don't know enough about the details of who he owes that money to, to make a sound judgment about how it's influencing his decisions.

BRUNHUBER: Right. I mean you tweeted in part, I can't imagine these numbers will sit well with most Americans. We will have to see. you know, Donald Trump as whether the account was, you know, scandals that would torpedo other people. Do we'll have to see how this plays out.

Thank you so much, Catherine Rampell, appreciate It.

RAMPELL: Thank you

BRUNHUBER: Well, President Trump is claiming again without proof that his political rival, Joe Biden, has been using performance enhancing drugs and he again called on the Democratic presidential Democratic nominee to take a drug test ahead of Tuesday's presidential debate.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: A lot of people have said that. A lot of people in Britain.

(CROSSTALK)

TRUMP: Take a look. Why don't you just check out -- you can check out the Internet. You'll see, -- plenty of people say it. And whether he is or not doesn't matter but I would love to take a test and he can take a test, too.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRUNHUBER: Joe Biden's campaign has mocked Mr. Trump's unusual request and responded by saying the former vice president intends to deliver his debate answers in words.

CNN's Arlette Saenz has more on how both men are preparing for Tuesday's debate.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Joe Biden and President Trump will face off here for the first time in Cleveland as they're heading into first general election, the presidential debate. And each of the candidates has been preparing in their own ways.

Joe Biden spending the weekend in Wilmington, Delaware, and he has been meeting with his top advisers as he strategizes how to take on President Trump and the president has also said that he has prepared a little bit but ultimately says that the job of the presidency is what has given him preparation heading into this debate

Now this debate will look completely different from past general elections, presidential debates, due to the coronavirus pandemic. There will be no handshake between President Trump and Joe Biden as they take the stage, one of the precautions that is being taken because of COVID-19. Sometimes these can have up to 900 hundred even 1,200 people depending on the venue.

This one we're told will have between 60 and 70 audience members. Everyone who is on hand will be tested for COVID-19, as the debate commission has really adapted to ensure that the candidates and the audience is safe and healthy in the middle of this pandemic.

But this will be the first time that Biden and Trump will be onstage face to face, making their case to general election voters. Biden has said that he expects a lot of the president's attacks to turn personal as they are both preparing to make their case to voters on Tuesday.

Arlette Saenz, CNN -- Cleveland, Ohio.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BRUNHUBER: And tune in Tuesday night for CNN's live coverage of that long-awaited showdown. Our special coverage begins at 7:00 p.m. Eastern time. That's 7:00 a.m. in Hong Kong. And 3:00 a.m. in Abu Dhabi.

A federal judge says TikTok will still be available in U.S. app stores for now. It's a temporary win for the social media giant which was set to be banned from the U.S. just hours before the ruling. TikTok's Chinese parent company is working to sell parts of its U.S. operations to American companies in order to appease the Trump administration. White House claims TikTok's ownership poses a national security risk.

[01:39:51]

BRUNHUBER: Well, President Trump's Supreme Court pick has met with a lot of controversy. Why some of her critics are drawing attention to her faith and her ties to a little-known religious group.

And later, a business leader in the United Arab Emirates talks to us about what the Abraham Accords with Israel will mean for the region at large.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BRUNHUBER: President Trump's nomination of Amy Coney Barrett to the Supreme Court marks the latest instance where a Republican president has picked a Catholic to sit on the bench.

So far a lot has been made about Barrett's faith especially her association with the religious community, People of Praise, which has been criticize for its purported authoritarian structure.

Massimo Faggioli is a professor of historical theology at Villanova University and he joins me now in Philadelphia. Thanks so much for making the time to speak to us.

So Republicans are saying Barrett's religious beliefs should be off limits. You're a Catholic scholar and you don't agree. Why not?

MASSIMO FAGGIOLI, PROFESSOR OF HISTORICAL THEOLOGY, VILLANOVA UNIVERSITY: The question is not about her beliefs, because what we know is that the group that she belongs to has fairly mainstream beliefs.

The problem could be what kind of internal structures are in the group she belongs to because there's literature known to experts that these groups -- these charismatic group tend to have quite particular kind of internal hierarchical relations that tend to limit the personal freedom of members.

It's a well-known problem so it's not a problem of orthodoxy or dogmatic beliefs, but of the freedom of the members of this particular group.

[01:44:49]

BRUNHUBER: But many of those charges about you know that it has an authoritarian structure, they are hard to confirm. So, you know, it's a fairly opaque group, so how can we be sure we're not smearing reputations here based on hearsay?

FAGGIOLI: You are right. It's always very difficult to verify that. It's a problem that is very well known to scholars that investigate these groups. The most important source usually are the accounts and memoirs of those who leave those groups because the official documents and statements, they don't say much.

But it's not really a problem of necessarily bad things happening in these groups. It is that the members of these groups are usually a particular kind of Catholics with oaths or vows or lifelong commitments to a community, or other members of the communities which makes them quite particular kind of Catholic different from other Catholics that have been very present in politics in this last century and a half.

BRUNHUBER: But on that vow, I mean I looked up, you know, on the group's Web site. It reads, "Our covenant is neither an oath nor a vow, but it is an important personal commitment. We teach the People of Praise members should always follow their consciences as formed by the light of reason and by the experience and the teachings of their churches."

So, you know, what do we make of that?

FAGGIOLI: Well, we make of that that one of the typical features of these charismatic groups is that they are public statements. They are not necessarily, saying the whole truth about what happens in these groups. Not because they lie necessarily, but because these groups being charismatic herbs, they are governed by the spirit, and by a certain kind of spiritual environment that is much more important than any written document.

This is a well-known problem, first of, all to church authorities that -- in ways that aren't always public. But they have a problem in knowing what happens in these groups and governing them and knowing that what happens there is respectful of the individual, personal and spiritual freedom of members.

BRUNHUBER: Thank you so much, Massimo Faggioli, we appreciate your time.

FAGGIOLI: Thank you.

BRUNHUBER: Access to Dubai's ports played a large part in the historic agreement between the U.A.E. and Israel, to normalize relations.

And we'll talk to an Emirati business leader who says it's a win-win situation for the Middle East.

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BRUNHUBER: Access to a port in Dubai was a critical part of the agreement between Israel and the United Arab Emirates to normalize relations. The Abraham Accords as they're known will impact multiple economic sectors. Now the chairman of international logistics company in Dubai Ports World says it will make the entire region more secure.

Let's bring in CNN's John Defterios in Dubai to explain all of this. John, how vital is this link for normalization between the U.A.E. and Israel especially when it comes to trade?

JOHN DEFTERIOS, CNN EMERGING MARKETS EDITOR: Well, particularly, this port alone, Kim, is very important. It is, by far, the biggest one in the Middle East and North Africa. Handling a third of container traffic throughout the wider region, which is extraordinary here.

And it gives access to the Israelis to the Asian sub-continent, and the Horn of Africa. If you think about it, a wider market of 400 million Arabs, which they've not been able to tap officially because they weren't acknowledged as a country before.

And what we're talking about here, is a much bigger picture. What's the motivation, where business can actually drive peace, the U.A.E. is a trading nation, and they're eager to get this moving, as you can see, in a number of different sectors.

Here's the chairman and CEO of DP World which owns this port.

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SULTAN AHMED BIN SULAYEN, GROUP CHAIRMAN AND CEO, DP WORLD: We have been wasting our time in confrontation. And we've had cold war, hot war and it never worked. For us at least. And we believe that this is going to strengthen their position in resolving this issue.

In the meantime, as the U.A.E., we are looking at an opportunity that can come out of this that help both.

DEFTERIOUS: Many believe that you signed a number of MOUs and it's, as we say in English, window dressing. A lots of show, nothing in sight. What's the kind of argument to that. What's been signed so far?

BIN SULAYEN: Not at all. Actually one thing you know, in U.A.E., we don't waste our time in MOUs. MOU is just a kind of a document to set a pace for what we are going to do. What we know we have to do. We know the business, and we know how we can get that business.

It's about technology, adaption, it's about logistics, it's about connection, it's about ability of both to trade and do business.

We need something from them, in technology. They need something from us. They need our market. They need our location. They need to learn how we do business in the U.A.E. Because the way we do our business is totally different. They've been in isolation for a long time.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEFTERIOS: Isolated no more because this is moving so swiftly, Kim.

And also the position of the chairman is that they can advance by sitting at the table the Palestinian cause, because there is some criticism that the U.A.E. was swift to move ahead with this deal. But there's other transactions in the pipeline, if you will. They are looking at defense right now, energy because Israel has major gas deposits there in the eastern Mediterranean, they're specialists here in Abu Dhabi here when it comes to that.

[01:54:52]

DEFTERIOS: Food security is an important issue for both sides. And finally, they are even looking at the tourism sector. And to give you a signal of what is happening already, Emirates Airline announced in the last week that it is setting up catering division to handle kosher meals. They are really eager to get Israeli tourists to come into the country, and vice versa on property development as well.

BRUNHUBER: Interesting. All right. So on a parallel track, the Chinese are investing in a terminal at the Haifa Port in Israel. Does the U.A.E. have any interest in that port?

DEFTERIOS: I'm glad you flagged it because this is a very sensitive issue with the United States. The Haifa port because you have a Chinese port operator has signed an agreement with the Israelis and Secretary of State, Mike Pompeo, tried to block that back in May with a special trip to do so.

It looks like that's going to proceed, but from this side, with DP World, they are eager to take existing infrastructure, and improve it. They are applying, right now, for a tender to try to get that with an Israeli partner. So, again, two-way trade and investment on the other side as well, Kim.

BRUNHUBER: All right. John Defterios in Dubai, appreciate it.

And well, that wraps this hour of CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Kim Brunhuber. My scintillating colleague, Rosemary Church is seated at the desk and will be back with more in a moment.

Stay with us.

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