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President Trump and First Lady Test Positive for Coronavirus; President Trump and First Lady Test Positive for Coronavirus. Markets Rattled After President Trump Tests Positive for COVID-19. Aired 9- 9:30a ET

Aired October 02, 2020 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:15]

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: A good and healthy and safe Friday morning to you. It is quite a day in our country. I'm Jim Sciutto.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Poppy Harlow.

This morning, the president and the first lady are in isolation after testing positive for coronavirus. The news came at about 1:00 in the morning when the president tweeted writing, quote, "We will begin our quarantine and recovery process immediately. We will get through this together." Overnight, the first lady tweeting that she and the president are feeling good. That is very good news.

This morning, the vice president Mike Pence and the second lady have both tested negative for the coronavirus. The stunning news from the White House comes just 32 days before the presidential election.

SCIUTTO: The Democratic nominee, Joe Biden, we have been told is going to take a test now as well. That of course following Tuesday's debate.

The president's diagnosis has thrown more uncertainty, very hard, very real, very important questions into this presidential race at a time that many Americans are already on edge. We are digging into the timeline and this is important. The international reaction including from U.S. adversaries who might sense weakness here. The impact on national security. The market reaction as well.

First, let's go straight to the White House. CNN's John Harwood is there.

John, an important question here is how did we find this out? Walk us through the timeline here. This started with the news that Hope Hicks, a close confidant of the president, had tested positive.

JOHN HARWOOD, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Jim, it's almost impossible to process how much has happened this week, but let's go back to the beginning of the week and walk through it. On Monday, September 28th, the president had an event on the South Lawn. He had a test -- coronavirus testing event in the afternoon then he did debate prep. On Tuesday, in the afternoon, he flew to the debate. Did a walkthrough at the debate hall, debated Joe Biden at 9:05 and then returned to the White House.

On Wednesday, he talked to the press before leaving the White House without wearing a mask. Went to a fundraiser at a private residence in Minnesota. Had a rally in Duluth. It wasn't a particularly long rally. And then he came home in the evening on Wednesday night. On Thursday, staffers for the White House learned at that point -- at some point during the day that Hope Hicks had tested positive.

The president nevertheless left the White House along with Hope Hicks and many close aides, flew on Marine One. Went to Bedminster at his golf club where he had a roundtable with supporters. We are told that he was feeling lethargic at that event.

He then returned to the White House at 6:00 p.m. The White House disclosed nothing about any of this until our colleague Jennifer Jacobs from Bloomberg reported around 8:00 that Hope Hicks had tested positive.

That was the trigger. Then it was confirmed by our colleagues at CNN. The president went on "Hannity." He said well, whether I have it, I don't know. I'm waiting for test results. Then after midnight he tweeted that he had tested positive and gone in to quarantine. That's how we got where we are now. We understand from our colleague Maggie Haberman, CNN political analyst as well as "New York Times" reporter, the president is having cold-like symptoms, is feeling lethargic.

We hope that that does not get any worse. We know that the Vice President Pence has tested negative this morning as has the treasury secretary, and we're all waiting to see what happens in the course of the president's onus and those close to him because a whole lot of people were close to the president without masks during the time when he may have been infectious.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HARLOW: The health is just everything this morning of them and of everyone around them.

John Harwood, we appreciate the reporting from the White House. Stay close as you get updates.

Let's go to our senior medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen.

Elizabeth, good morning to you. There are a number of complicating factors here for the president. He is 74 years old. He is technically deemed obese in terms of his weight. And that comes with increased risk. There are also things we do not know about his medical history. How at risk is the president?

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: There's much that we don't know about his medical history, Poppy. Let's go through those risk factors that you just mentioned one more time. As you mentioned he's 74 years old. So he is elderly. That is in the highest risk group by age. He weighs

244 pounds which makes him clinically obese. He has been treated for high cholesterol. At one point he took hydroxychloroquine when he was exposed to a different White House staffer who had COVID.

[09:05:05]

We don't know if he continued to take it or if he's started taking it again. Now I want to stress, this definitely puts him in a very high- risk category. Elderly and clinically obese. He's also male, and that doesn't help either. However, I will say that most people even if they're in this highest risk category do survive and do do OK with COVID-19. So that's important to remember. His risk is definitely higher than other people's, but still most people do OK.

SCIUTTO: Walk us through now the protocol for a positive COVID test when it comes to isolation. I think that's the correct word here. How long should the president remain out of contact now with others to prevent infecting them?

COHEN: Right. So that depends if he has symptoms or not. So let's take a look at what those rules are. If someone has symptoms, they should be isolated for 10 days after the symptoms improved -- after the symptoms appear, rather, and his symptoms should be improving during that time, not getting worse. And he has to be 24 hours without a fever. So all three those things have to happen for him to come out of isolation.

Now if he never had symptoms, if he's doing perfectly fine then he should be in isolation for 10 days after he had that positive test. If -- and we hope this isn't the case, if he becomes severely ill these rules are all off, you have to consult with the doctor to decide what to do in that case.

HARLOW: Elizabeth, help us understand what close contact is for all of those people and there were a lot of them as John reported that have been around the president in the past few days, not to mention the Supreme Court nominee, Amy Coney Barrett, who met with him with all her kids as well in the Oval on Saturday. What does close contact mean? For how long and how close?

SCIUTTO: Yes.

COHEN: Right. The CDC defines it very specifically, Poppy. Let's take a look. It means that you have been within six feet of someone with COVID for 15 minutes or more. Now the time period that we're looking back at is two days before the symptoms appeared.

If you never had symptoms, then two days before you got that positive test. So what public health workers, what doctors and others should be doing right now is making basically a chart. Who was the president in contact with during that time period? And then they should contact all those people and ask them to quarantine.

SCIUTTO: Elizabeth Cohen, thanks so much. The guidance is clear here and we appreciate you sharing that. And we're going to stay on that guidance as we go forward.

Let's bring in now our doctors, Dr. Leana Wen. She's an emergency room physician at George Washington University. Dr. Esther Choo, she's professor of emergency medicine at Oregon Health and Science University.

Thanks to both of you. Always good to have both you on.

Dr. Wen, if I could begin with you, just big picture, and then we'll dig down. This is the most serious known health threat to a sitting president in some time. It is not the flu, we know that. The president himself acknowledged that in conversations with Bob Woodward. It is more serious than the flu. Tell us how serious to a man of his age, given what little we know about his health conditions. How serious should people watching this program take the president being infected?

DR. LEANA WEN, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: It is very serious, Jim. I mean, chances are, and I want to begin with the good news here. Chances are, the president will make a complete recovery. We don't yet know if he has symptoms. We do know that 40 percent of people who contract coronavirus, this novel coronavirus, may not develop any symptoms at all and therefore may recover.

Even for someone who is older, like the president, in his 70s with chronic medical conditions like obesity and heart disease. Of course they are at higher risk for severe outcomes from COVID-19. But still, chances are he will make a complete recovery. But that said, we have a long road ahead of us potentially when it comes to seeing whether he develops symptoms and also whether he becomes severely ill.

The incubation period which is a time from exposure to developing symptoms is between two to 14 days with an average of about five to seven. And then after that, it still may take a week or even longer to develop a severe illness, and so it's going to take its time.

We should be -- it will be good news if he comes out and says that he feels fine, but we should not be reassured yet and we should also not be reassured if other people around him have initially negative tests because those negative tests may well turn positive in days to come.

SCIUTTO: Good point.

HARLOW: Right. So the vice president, for example, this morning we hope it remains negative but you make an important salient point on that.

Dr. Choo, what about treating the president if he does end up pretty symptomatic? What is available there in terms of treatments and therapies at this point?

DR. ESTHER CHOO, PROFESSOR OF EMERGENCY MEDICINE, OREGON HEALTH AND SCIENCE UNIVERSITY: I mean, the president should go by the evidence that's out there and typically the treatment is for people who become symptomatic and generally symptomatic enough to go into the hospital.

[09:10:11] So of course the president has endorsed a number of things including hydroxychloroquine where the evidence is not good and that's not good for him either. No matter where his faith is. So presumably he will be attended by outstanding medical staff who will make evidence-based decisions, but hopefully he will never get to the symptoms that require any sort of medical treatment. It would be supportive and symptomatic unless his symptoms progress.

And just to add on to what Dr. Wen said, you know, it's still very -- it sounds like but from the time course we have it's still very early in the course of their exposure and illness and the interesting thing about COVID is that you start -- it has an indolent course, you can start off very mild and then we'll see people actually have their symptoms kick in seven to 10 days into the disease. So we're just starting out in knowing what their trajectory is going to be.

SCIUTTO: Dr. Wen, here's the extent of what we know about the president's symptoms so far. That his staff said he appeared tired yesterday. Had a raspy voice. Now those could be other things. Lots of travel, right? I mean you get tired. People get tired sometimes. But it's also "The New York Times" reporting, Maggie Haberman, as John Harwood cited, that the president has cold-like symptoms.

Again, I'm not asking you to be -- to diagnose the president here, right, because we don't have the benefit of you being in the same room with him. But what do we know about early symptoms for others when they're infected? What should the American people be looking for here and what would his White House staff be looking for?

WEN: So, at the moment because his symptoms if they are there at all seem to be very mild and so there really isn't any specific treatment for that. We call this symptomatic treatment, that you treat the symptom. So if somebody is feeling unwell they get treatment for that.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

WEN: But there isn't a -- there's no antibiotic or antiviral that we could be taking at this time. There's not a pill that you could be taking. I think the American people should be looking to see what happens now in the days to come. Is the president going to be developing shortness of breath? Is his oxygen saturation going to be lower? Is he going to require further treatment in an inpatient setting in a hospital?

But I think we should also be asking the question of time course because it would be unusual for the president to just test positive now and to already have symptoms considering that he's been getting daily testing.

The testing should be picking up COVID-19 before someone starts having symptoms because he's having such regular testing. And so I would have a question about when those tests potentially first started becoming positive if he's actually already having symptoms now.

SCIUTTO: Interesting. HARLOW: Yes, but those symptoms could be of something else, like a

cold or a flu or something. Right? We've just learned that the Biden campaign was not contacted by the Trump campaign to alert them of the president's test results. Obviously it's germane given the proximity of them and the length of time they spent on the debate stage together.

So my question for you, Dr. Choo, is as Biden awaits his test results, he's getting a test this morning, should he be quarantining?

CHOO: Yes, probably to be on the safe side he should and not just the Biden campaign, but really anyone who was close to the president. And this is going to be -- it seems like as every hour goes by, there's more added to the list. And it's not just, you know, close staff and family members and other elected officials, but, you know, you think of just -- people that you might not think of. The crew that set up the stage at the debate, and waiters, and just staff on Air Force One.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

CHOO: I mean, there's going to be a whole mess of people, and the minute you have a positive test that contact tracing process needs to start all over again for all the close contact of that person in their homes and in their social lives. So this is going to mushroom out.

HARLOW: Yes.

SCIUTTO: There's a reason why, you know, if someone in your school or your church or your office or your family tested positive, there's a medical reason why there is a duty to inform others which the president did not appear to do to the former vice president.

CHOO: That's right.

HARLOW: Doctors, thank you both so very much. We appreciate it.

This breaking news is clearly also upending the presidential race. That was already one like we had never seen before. How both campaigns are reacting. That's ahead.

SCIUTTO: Also, here's a key question. How does the president's positive test for coronavirus impact our national security? We have just learned that the U.S. military has not changed its alert levels, but how are our adversaries, North Korea, Russia, China, Iran watching this?

And the markets are watching and they've been rattled this morning. The economic fallout. We're going to be following all the headlines.

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[09:15:00]

SCIUTTO: Markets are watching and they've been rattled this morning, the economic fallout, we're going to be following all the headlines.

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SCIUTTO: Listen, it's hard to underestimate the ramifications of this nationally, national security, but also politically, and it's important because we're just about a month away from an election. So, we want to discuss this. The president's positive test has upended what was intended to be the message of his campaign weeks before the election.

HARLOW: Let's get to our Ryan Nobles and Jessica Dean. They are both following the campaigns. Good morning to you both, thank you for being here. Ryan, let's start with you. What is the reaction that you're hearing?

RYAN NOBLES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, there are two big questions right now, Poppy, is what physically happens to the campaign, how do they handle the business of campaigning going forward? And then what if any campaign staffers are at the risk of exposure of coronavirus because they spend a lot of time around the president and his closest aides.

[09:20:00]

So far, the campaign this morning not saying what steps they're taking to make sure that their campaign staffers are not at risk for contracting coronavirus including Campaign Manager Bill Stepien who traveled with the president to the debate on Tuesday, and was in close contact with Hope Hicks at that time.

So far, the campaign not saying if any of the senior advisors have been tested and what those results were. Now, comes the second part of this question. How does this impact the campaign? Well, it's already having a very direct impact, in that the president was scheduled to hold rallies today, all this weekend and then into next week. Everything has been postponed at this point.

Essentially put on hold. And the campaign not saying how they plan to move forward. And then of course, there is the issue of debates. The president and the vice president having their first debate on Tuesday. There's another debate scheduled next week with the vice president. So far, the debate commission not saying how they plan to move forward, and if those debates will take place or if they will try and shift to some sort of a virtual format.

But it's important to point out that at the last debate on Tuesday where a potential exposure could have taken place, officials from the Cleveland Clinic actually went up to some of the guests that were there on behalf of the president, his family, close associates and actually offered them masks to wear during this debate to prevent the spread of coronavirus because there's the potential that someone at this debate could have had the coronavirus as we now know they did, and they refused to put those masks on.

So it just shows kind of the broad approach that the Trump campaign has had towards wearing masks, and of course, have been to many of these rallies, where of course, Jim and Poppy, very few people are wearing masks. SCIUTTO: And of course, at the debate the president mocked Joe Biden

for wearing the masks so regularly. Once again, Jessica, let's talk about the Biden campaign. We now know that he'll be tested out of an abundance of caution. Tell us about their reaction this morning, level of concern.

JESSICA DEAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, well, they're all still sorting that out as of right now, Jim. We have not heard officially from the Biden campaign, save for Vice President Biden tweeting that he was wishing the president and first lady a speedy recovery and that he was thinking of them. But right now, here's what we do know.

You mentioned that Vice President Biden is getting tested this morning, he is scheduled to travel here to Grand Rapids, Michigan this afternoon. It's unclear if he's going to go forward with those plans. Again, we're just waiting to see right now how that all plays out. Yesterday, the campaign announced that it would go forward with in- person canvassing, going door-to-door in all of the battle ground states.

This came after months of them avoiding doing this because of COVID concerns. So now today, with this news, it's unclear -- again, does that impact this decision at all? The campaign had said of course, all these safety precautions would be in place, but Poppy and Jim, you noted this as well.

We're also learning this morning that the Biden campaign was not alerted by the Trump campaign about any possible exposure. We're going to keep an eye on this and see how it develops and what we hear from them as the morning continues.

SCIUTTO: Which is not just a question of etiquette, right? Letting folks know of a positive test. It is a question of public health. Ryan Nobles, Jessica Dean, thanks very much.

HARLOW: Let's bring in assistant editor for "The Washington Post" and our political commentator David Swerdlick and senior White House correspondent for "The Huffington Post" SV Date. SV, you were on Air Force One with the president on Wednesday. You went to cover that rally in Duluth, Minnesota. When were you informed of this exposure?

SV DATE, SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, THE HUFFINGTON POST: Well, I was informed when I saw the "Bloomberg" story last night, pretty much like everybody else.

HARLOW: No one told you?

DATE: No, no one told me.

SCIUTTO: Yes --

DATE: And what's most amazing to me is that the president after finding out about his top aide testing positive, went and did a fundraiser in New Jersey at his own -- at his own resort and possibly infected people there. SCIUTTO: David Swerdlick, it was our understanding that the

president's message for the final stretch of the campaign was going to be two-fold. One, we're turning the corner. You've heard him use that language before on COVID frequently. But also it's time to reopen the economy, and he was going to have several big rallies, right? In- person rallies. How does that change? Do we know? Has the president and his campaign announced changes to that yet? What are the necessities at this point?

DAVID SWERDLICK, ASSISTANT EDITOR, THE WASHINGTON POST: Yes, Jim, I think it has to change. Let me first say, let's hope that the Trumps recover, let's be glad that the Pences --

SCIUTTO: Yes --

SWERDLICK: Have tested negative. Let's hope that the Bidens and the Harris-Emhoff family test negative later today. Our system doesn't work if there's not confidence that our leaders are safe. That's why we keep them bubble wrapped.

To answer your question, Jim, I think there's a situation here where debates were already taking an outsized role because there was less campaigning than you would have in a normal election year even though the president was proceeding with some of those rallies like the one SV attended.

[09:25:00]

So, I think now there's this question of how are the campaigns going to get their message out? And then to your point, for the Trump campaign, this is what they've been going for all year. The idea that this isn't as bad as it seems, we're going to easily get past this.

They've been saying it for months, and this was their closing argument going into election day, which is a month away. Now I think it's going to be a lot harder for them to get that message across and, you know, regardless of whether the president jumps back into the campaign fray soon or not, it's a situation where his campaign is going to have to address coronavirus in a more head-on way --

HARLOW: Yes --

SWERDLICK: And the Biden campaign is going to have to figure out how they respond to that.

HARLOW: There is a chance that this is an important wake-up call for those in America who do not believe that they can contract --

SCIUTTO: Yes --

HARLOW: COVID or do not believe how serious it is. There is that chance. If we could in the control room pull up some of this video we have, not just of the rally, SV, that you covered in Minnesota, but the way, you know, the crowds around the president when he got off the Air Force One and when he got back on that night to return. I think it's important for people to see the proximity here, and as they get that pulled up -- on the plane, as I understand it, Mark Meadows; the White House chief of staff came back to talk to you guys for more --

SCIUTTO: Yes --

HARLOW: Than just a minute. What happened and was he wearing a mask when he spoke with you?

DATE: Right, no, he came back for -- you know, I want to say at least 10 minutes, maybe 15. And this is not the first time. Mark Meadows likes to come to the back of the plane and talk with us. And a couple of trips ago, I remember asking him -- and others asked him, why are you not wearing a mask? And he said, well, you know, I get tested every day and I have it here with me, but you know, I don't feel like I'm a threat to anybody, and I would wear it of course if I did.

OK, so, again, this goes to the culture of the White House that masks are not good. And it's frowned upon to wear a mask in the White House. People don't wear them. Among the president's staff, we sure do in the press corps. But, you know, that starts at the top. There's zero reason for Mark Meadows or anybody else on that plane not to have been wearing a mask. You know, except for the times you're eating or drinking.

HARLOW: Yes --

SCIUTTO: SV, I just want to ask you, given the lack of a fulsome sharing of information here, but also habits in the White House, do you feel that was unfair to your health, the health of the staff around the president? And CNN is reporting that the staff is concerned this morning about this, the White House staff.

DATE: Well, it was absolutely unfair. Right, I mean, you know, beyond us, I mean, you know, I've done articles about this. I have it in my book. Had the president treated this pandemic the way, for example, Angela Merkel did in Germany, we could have as few as 40,000 deaths right now had we taken this seriously.

And we didn't take it seriously largely because the president of the United States didn't take it seriously. This continues to this day. I mean, we didn't even find out until it was leaked and people reported about this. We didn't get an adviser from the White House. I didn't get a call saying, hey, Mark Meadows came back, he was around Hope Hicks, maybe you should get tested. None of that happened, so, you know, here we are.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HARLOW: David, very briefly before we go, in what way do you believe that this most upends the next 32 days?

SWERDLICK: Well, I think everybody is going to have to look to the administration on whether or not they're more forthcoming, both about the events of the last 24 or 36 hours and also about if they're ever going to take the pandemic more seriously.

The president came out on March 11th and said all the right things in an Oval Office address, and then for the six months that followed didn't follow through on those right things. You know, it's anybody's guess whether they will change tune in the next month. But either way, President Trump is the president until at least January 20th at noon, and every day people's lives are in the balance.

SCIUTTO: It's a good point. David Swerdlick, SV Date, thanks to both of you.

SWERDLICK: Thanks.

HARLOW: So obviously, financial markets totally on edge over this breaking news as well. We saw declines across Europe and some of the Asian markets, Dow futures down ahead of the opening bell. We'll talk about that with the president's former head of the Council of Economic Advisors, next.

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