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Legal Cases to Suppress Voting Continue Around the Country; Interview with Association of Flight Attendants International President Sara Nelson; Interview with Commission on Presidential Debates Co-Chair Frank Fahrenkopf. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired October 07, 2020 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:30:00]

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Susan Collins slammed it, calling it the wrong decision. New York Republican Congressman John Katko said that it was -- he disagrees with the president. With lives at stake, we can't afford to not do this right now.

But let me show you "The Wall Street Journal" editorial board headline today. They write, "Pelosi's Taxpayer Ransom Demand" -- I think we have that -- and quote, "Republicans should educate voters abut Mrs. Pelosi's extortion play."

On the other side -- I know you probably don't agree with that headline, but on the other side of it, should Pelosi have given more earlier on to get a phase four deal as well?

JOHN AVLON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Look, it's -- they're in a protracted negotiation. Both have responsibilities as well as political needs. And you all give a little and you get a little and you meet in the middle. What you don't think is the president of the United States is going to take all his marbles and sort of storm home in a fit of pique a month out from an election.

So look, you know, partisans are going to argue in bad faith, there'll be a lot of deflection and projection and blaming the other guy. At the end of the day, the president pulled the plug on this unbeknownst to his own negotiators and his own team thought it was a bad decision.

And I think it just flows from actually something that Biden touched on in his Gettysburg Address speech -- and I'm a Lincoln nerd so give me, you know --

(LAUGHTER)

HARLOW: Are you writing a book on that?

AVLON: I am indeed. So you know, so I wrote a column about this.

But at the end of the day, Donald Trump is the anti-Lincoln. He believes -- to his core -- that might makes right. And so therefore he will try bullying tactics all day long, as opposed to a vision of trying to, you know, unite the country in the belief that a house divided does not -- cannot stand, and that we need to summon --

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Right.

AVLON: -- the better angels of our nature. That's not what Donald Trump does.

SCIUTTO: Francesca, there is no precedent -- there's no precedent -- for what we've seen from a whole host of former members of this administration, former long public servants to this country, saying not just that they disagree with Donald Trump, but that he's a danger to this country. The latest, retired General Michael Hayden, who released this video. We have a clip of it, and I just want to get your comment.

I believe we do. If we don't have a clip, I'll read it. "If there is another term for President Trump, I don't know what happens to America." I interviewed him as well, you saw it a few moments ago. That's quite a warning here, unprecedented. What does it mean?

FRANCESCA CHAMBERS, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, MCCLATCHY: Well, even beyond that, Republican after Republican that I've spoken to, even people who supported the president are warning that if this becomes a personality contest in this race between himself and Joe Biden. And that's something that President Trump is unlikely to win, that they have been -- for a long time, been concerned about the tone that he's taken in his tweets and some of the things that he says.

They really think that he needs to get back to focusing on substantive issues. They're hopeful that tonight in the debate between Vice President Mike Pence and Kamala Harris, that he can really drive that line and get this back on track here.

Because when it comes down to some of the things -- like you said -- that Joe Biden is saying and his personality, that's not an argument that they're convinced that President Trump can win.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Well, we've waited for a pivot for a number of years. John Avlon, Francesca Chambers, thanks very much to both of you.

AVLON: Thanks, guys.

HARLOW: Thanks, guys.

[10:33:26]

All right, so just hours after -- we just discussed -- the president pulls the plug on stimulus talks, he backtracks and then he says, OK, well I would, you know, back a smaller bill for airlines and other businesses. But what about all the airline workers hanging in the balance and the thousands furloughed because there's no deal? We'll talk to the head of the International Association of Flight Attendants, she's here.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: Every day, we are keeping a close eye on this 2020 race. This is your election, your vote is critical. We're going to follow all the news as it relates to your ability to vote. Here are the latest headlines.

Arizona, a key swing state, begins early voting today -- you could take advantage of that. A federal judge has rejected efforts by the Trump administration to curtail New Jersey's vote-by-mail plan. And some Republican voters are asking the Supreme Court to block a directive by Montana's governor that allows mail-in ballots to be sent to all registered voters.

These headlines, these moves, they matter to you and your vote.

HARLOW: A hundred percent. Let's talk more about this Kristen Holmes is back with us this morning to break it down. Good morning, Kristen.

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Poppy. And let's just do a quick dive into those cases so that our viewers are aware of what's going on around them.

Let's talk about New Jersey. Now, the Trump campaign was trying to stop several of these efforts, the new mail-in ballot rules, including one that would allow ballots to be counted up to two days after the election, even without a postmark. Now, a judge has shot that down, a big win for Democrats coming on the heels of two big losses for Democrats -- we talked about those yesterday in Georgia and South Carolina.

And in Montana, it will be very interesting to watch this, see what the Supreme Court does here. They gave us a message, and it was clear on South Carolina earlier in the week, they do not want to have any sweeping federal changes to the election system, to election law this close to November 3rd. So watch that case very closely.

I want to note, both of these are efforts here to suppress the vote, that's happening behind the scenes while we see President Trump being more up-front, continuing to tweet about the election, calling it rigged and fraud.

[10:40:09]

But take a look at this, look at these lines here. This is Ohio. We also have video here from Virginia. It is so clear that these voters are going beyond all of this. Anything that's happening in the background, they are out there, they want to get their voice heard. It is very imperative -- just to remind our viewers -- the most important thing they can do, no matter what the laws are, no matter what's going on behind the scenes, is get out there and cast their ballot.

SCIUTTO: No question. I mean, you said it, Kristen, it's an effort to suppress the vote. We're going to stay on top of this because it matters to you, watching at home. Thanks very much.

If you want to find your polling station, learn more about your voter registration status or get important information on absentee or early voting, don't believe what you read on Facebook or Twitter, get real information from bipartisan nonpartisan sites. You can go to CNN.com/vote. It'll take you to the places that will give you hard answers.

And new this morning, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi spokesperson says that talks between the speaker and Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin on airline aid did not seem to go well today. Mnuchin reached out following President Trump's tweet, something of a reversal about aid to that industry.

HARLOW: With us now, we're so glad to have Sara Nelson, she is the international president of the Association of Flight Attendants. Good morning, Sara.

SARA NELSON, INTERNATIONAL PRESIDENT, ASSOCIATION OF FLIGHT ATTENDANTS: Good morning.

HARLOW: What is the real impact of no deal? How many flight attendants are out of a job because of it this morning?

NELSON: Right now, there are over 100,000 aviation workers without a job, many more -- most of those without health care. And we are expecting more furloughs to come. So this is day seven of those furloughs, and people who have chronic illnesses and waiting to have a baby are looking at live without any health care, after having been essential workers and serving our country and keeping us connected, and risking their own lives in the process.

HARLOW: Wow.

SCIUTTO: A hundred thousand people. And it's important, as you note, Sara, that a lot of folks, they lose their health care like that too, right? And this, enormous impacts in the midst of a pandemic.

So now you have this reversal after a reversal, talk of a specific aid program for airlines, kind of slicing that out of a larger stimulus deal here. Hope from your end that that is possible, that Democrats and Republicans can reach some agreement on that?

NELSON: Well look, there's almost unanimous agreement across all of Congress from both parties, both chambers on this jobs and infrastructure package. I want to remind people that this money is only to keep people in their jobs, it requires no involuntary furloughs, it requires continued service to all of the communities that were getting that on March 1st, and that is starting to crumble as well. And it requires a cap on executive compensation and no stock buybacks or dividends.

So this has been the most successful jobs and infrastructure program of coronavirus relief, and we are hopeful that this can get done. What the president did yesterday was dash hopes for the whole country of getting relief that's needed, and that's what we had hoped our deal would spur since there's so much agreement around us. But if that cannot be done, we need to keep our airline industry intact and these jobs intact.

HARLOW: What's your message to Washington? They're the ones who have the power, the president, the Treasury secretary, the speaker of the House, McConnell in the Senate. I mean, these are the folks that we pay to do their job. So what is your message to them this morning?

NELSON: Get it done. And Congress has to act. So it doesn't -- the tweets and the back and forth yesterday don't matter, Congress needs to act. They tried to act a couple weeks ago and it's only because of procedural reasons that that didn't go through, so there is no reason that they should not take this action right now and get people out of this uncertainty. People's mental health is on the line, our whole country is hurting and they need to get this done.

SCIUTTO: Do you want to see both parties bend here? I mean, they got closer, they didn't get close enough -- to just over $2 trillion -- a lot of money, $1.6 trillion from the Republican side. Do you want to just see them say, hey, listen, let's just find a number that we could both agree on?

NELSON: Speaker Pelosi and Secretary Mnuchin were very close to getting that done, and that got blown up yesterday. Of course we want to see that. We want to see that for everyone. Our country needs it, Jay Powell begged Congress yesterday --

HARLOW: Yes.

NELSON: -- to do that, said nothing would go to waste. There could not be too much.

At this point in time, we need to make sure that we are locking in the things that we know there's agreement on. We need to get this airline relief in place, and that is something that can be done today.

HARLOW: Yes, you wonder if there's a fundamental understanding of basic economics if they're not going to listen to the Fed chair when he goes out on a limb and pleads with them. Sara Nelson, we're just really sorry for all the --

[10:45:04]

SCIUTTO: Yes.

HARLOW: -- hundred thousand people you just told us about, and thank you for being here this morning.

NELSON: Thank you very much.

SCIUTTO: Yes, please send them our best. This is a story we're going to stay on top because real actions with real consequences.

NELSON: Thank you.

SCIUTTO: Well, the second presidential debate is still scheduled to take place one week from tomorrow. Can it move forward with the president infected with COVID-19? We're going to speak to the co-chair for the Commission on Presidential Debates, live, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:50:00] SCIUTTO: Welcome back. A critical vice presidential debate tonight, the stakes made even higher as the coronavirus outbreak inside the White House grows, and as Joe Biden says his second debate with President Trump should be cancelled if the president still has the virus at that point.

With me now is Frank Fahrenkopf, he co-chair of the Commission on Presidential Debates. He's also a former chair of the Republican National Committee. Mr. Fahrenkopf, thanks so much for taking the time this morning.

FRANK FAHRENKOPF, CO-CHAIR, COMMISSION ON PRESIDENTIAL DEBATES: Good morning, Jim.

SCIUTTO: I want to begin, if I can with the testing protocol for tonight's debate, because it still has some commonalities with the first debate, a test within 72 hours, an honor system in effect. I just wonder, given the lingering questions about the first debate and the protocol, why should we be confident this protocol will work tonight?

FAHRENKOPF: Well, I think the doctors of the Cleveland Clinic have been in touch with both campaigns, and talking with them about what necessary testing has to be done. And they're satisfied, so that is -- you know, we're not doctors on the commission, we rely on those people who give us professional advice.

SCIUTTO: I understand it, but I suppose given that this administration has not been entirely forthcoming about the president's status and questions about his status last Tuesday, are you confident that the campaign is providing the most accurate, up-to-date information? I mean, after all, there is an outbreak within the White House, the staff of the vice president as well affected.

FAHRENKOPF: Well, listen, again, as I said, we've talked to both campaigns. Both campaigns have talked to representatives -- we have people from the Cleveland Clinic on the ground here in Salt Lake City, so we're on top of it as much as we can be and we must rely on our medical advisors as to whether or not they're satisfied.

SCIUTTO: OK, let's look ahead to the second debate. As you know and I mentioned, Joe Biden says that if the president is still positive for the virus next week -- which is possible -- there shouldn't be a debate. At this point, is the second presidential debate on?

FAHRENKOPF: Well, we're going forward with our planning for both the second and the final one in Nashville. But of course, it's all going to depend on the president's health. Now, he said yesterday, I understand from the newspapers, that he's ready, raring to go and will be in Miami and want (ph) to debate.

But it's going to depend on what the doctors say about his health, whether or not he -- not only will he be safe, but the people around him be safe. We're concerned about our staff, our workers who are here. You know, we have a crew of about 65 people who work on these things, so it's going to depend upon what the medical evidence is and what the advice we get as to whether or not it's safe to go forward.

But right now, we don't know the answer to those questions, not only for the second debate but even the last one. So we're going to proceed as if we're going to go forward with it. We'll make decisions and we'll spend some time after this one's in the can -- tonight -- as to what we're going to do for the next one once we get that advice.

SCIUTTO: If there's disagreement between the doctors and the president on the safety of that, who do you listen to? Will you listen to the doctors in that -- under those circumstances?

FAHRENKOPF: No, we have said from day one -- before even the first debate -- that with regard to medical advice, that's why the Cleveland Clinic has been brought in. They've just done a marvelous job. The American people have to be very proud that there is an institution like the Cleveland Clinic in Ohio and serving the world, they've done a great job. They will be our advisor and we will go forward with their advice.

SCIUTTO: Understood. OK, the other issue of course in the first debate -- I don't have to tell you -- was the issue -- non-health related -- of the frequent interruptions, breaking the rules agreed upon jointly by both campaigns. What's going to be done to keep that from happening in the second debate?

FAHRENKOPF: Well, we've got that under study right now. We haven't decided, we haven't made any decisions. There's been, as you can imagine, Jim, maybe 5,000 suggestions from people all over the country, experts and non-experts, as to what to do. We're going to sit down after this debate is over, we're going to look hard.

You know, the next debate's a little different because it's a town hall meeting, and it is in fact --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

FAHRENKOPF: -- the members of the audience, picked in Miami, who are going to ask the questions. It won't be much like the first one. But the final debate, scheduled for Nashville, is a replica of the first debate, and that's where any changes -- if we make them -- will probably be most prevalent.

SCIUTTO: Just quickly, will there be a mute button at next week's debate for the moderators?

FAHRENKOPF: That decision hasn't been made.

But I'll tell you one thing that's been made -- and it'll go for tonight too -- you have to have a mask to get in this hall, you must have been tested. If you get in the hall and you take the mask off, you will be approached and asked to put the mask back on. If you do not put the mask back on, you're going to be removed from the premises. And that'll be true for --

SCIUTTO: Understood.

FAHRENKOPF: -- all of the remaining debates.

SCIUTTO: Well, it's good to hear. Frank Fahrenkopf, we appreciate your time, we wish you good luck tonight and with the debates to come.

FAHRENKOPF: Thanks so much, Jim.

[10:55:00]

SCIUTTO: Well, CNN's special coverage of the only vice presidential debate of 2020 begins tonight, 7:00 Eastern time.

HARLOW: Thank you so much for joining us. We know you'll be up late watching the debate, we'll see you back here early tomorrow morning. I'm Poppy Harlow.

SCIUTTO: I think we'll be up late too. So if we look tired tomorrow, apologies in advance --

HARLOW: Forgive us.

SCIUTTO: -- I'm Jim Sciutto. NEWSROOM With John King starts after a short break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:00:07]