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Average Daily U.S. Infections at 51,000, Virus Killing 700+ Americans a Day; Tonight, Biden, Trump Appear in Competing Town Halls; Germany Reports Record Daily Increase in New Coronavirus Cases. Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired October 15, 2020 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:00:00]

POPPY HARLOW, CNN NEWSROOM: Good morning, everyone. I'm Poppy Harlow.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN NEWSROOM: And I'm Jim Sciutto.

The breaking news this hour, day four of confirmation hearings for President Trump's Supreme Court pick, Amy Coney Barrett, they're under way. Moments ago, the Senate Judiciary Republicans rejected Democrats' call for a delay on the nomination vote. The committee's vote is now set for next Thursday, less than two weeks before the presidential election. We'll bring you any more major developments.

Also new, as new coronavirus cases and, crucially, hospitalizations are surging across the nation, Dr. Anthony Fauci is warning Americans this, now is not the time to let up.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: Well, it's concerning, George, because, as you just mentioned, we have a baseline of daily infections of approximately 45,000, 50,000 per day.

The issue is that, as we enter, as we are now, in the cooler season of the fall and ultimately the colder season of the winter, you don't want to be in that compromised position where your baseline daily infection is high and you are increasing as opposed to going in the other direction.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Dr. Fauci this morning also pushing back at those promoting herd immunity as a solution, as well as the idea of lifting restrictions. And now just 19 days until Election Day, imagine that, later tonight, President Trump and Joe Biden will have their dueling town halls. More on that in a moment.

First, let's start with breaking news on Democratic Vice Presidential Nominee Kamala Harris who is now off the campaign trail after a staffer tested positive for COVID-19. CNN's Jessica Dean joins us now. JESSICA DEAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to both of you. We are being told by the Biden campaign that two people tested positive for COVID, Kamala Harris' communications director and a non-staff flight crewmember who was on one of planes. We are told Harris did ride on a plane with these two individuals on October 8th but was wearing an N95 mask, as they all were, and was never within six feet of them for longer than 15 minutes.

Still, out of an abundance of caution, the campaign is pulling Harris off the campaign trail. She was scheduled to be in North Carolina today. She will not travel today or over the weekend, but resume travel on Monday, again, out of an abundance of caution.

We're told that the campaign testing protocol caught this in so much that these two individuals went to personal events and then were tested on their return into the campaign bubble, as it were, and that that's when it was caught.

We're told that Kamala Harris has since had two PCR tests, remember, that's the gold standard of COVID testing, both of those have tested negative. The most recent of which was yesterday. So you can imagine she will be tested again.

As for Vice President Biden, we're told this will not impact his travel. He is scheduled to continue to travel and, of course, have a town hall later tonight in Philadelphia. We're told those things will all proceed as normal because he was never in close contact with any of these individuals.

But, again, two people affiliated with the Biden/Harris campaign who were traveling with Kamala Harris did test positive. She was never in close contact with them. But out of an abundance of caution, the campaign is pulling her off the trail, Jim and Poppy, for the next few days.

HARLOW: Okay. Jess, thank you for that reporting.

At the same time more than 30 states across the country are seeing a surge in cases, among them, Colorado. The governor there is warning the state is now in a, quote, critical juncture in the effort to slow the spread of the virus.

Our Correspondent, Lucy Kafanov, is in Denver this morning. Again, with Colorado, why is it happening there? Is it Denver, the college down, or is it broader?

LUCY KAFANOV, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Denver is leading the spike but Colorado officials are describing this as a third wave of coronavirus across the state with hospitalizations and cases continuing to rise. They are reporting 274 active outbreaks in the state this week, setting a new record. These are largely limited to schools, daycare facilities, churches, restaurants and grocery stores.

Also, Colorado reported its first day of over 1,000 new cases in a day, and the positivity rate has jumped to above 5 percent. The World Health Organization says it needs to be below that threshold in order to get the virus under control.

And, finally, more than 315 -- a total, actually, of 317 confirmed COVID-19 patients in Colorado hospitals and that is nearly a 60 percent jump since the start of the month. 77 percent of the state's ICU beds currently in use, and that's leading to a lot of concerns about hospital capacity in the coming weeks.

And, of course, unfortunately, as you pointed out in the intro, the negative trend is not limited to Colorado.

[10:05:02]

35 states across America now seeing a rise in COVID-19 cases. I want to highlight some of them. South Dakota reporting its highest single day increase with 876 new cases. Missouri, record number of COVID-19 hospitalizations, Pennsylvania reporting at least 1,000 new cases a day, and that's nine days in a row. And the governor of Kentucky now warning about a third escalation of the virus, all this, guys, as we head into the colder months, the flu season, a lot of things to be concerned about with these trends on the rise.

HARLOW: Lucy, thanks for the reporting.

Let's talk about these trends with Dr. Leana Wen. She is an emergency room physician at George Washington University and a former Balitmore Health Commissioner. Good morning, Dr. Wen.

So, are the few states we see on that map that are yellow and green, green being moving in the right direction, are those going to be red soon too, as there are higher viral loads coupled with the colder weather?

DR. LEANA WEN, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: Well, this is the trend that we've seen in the past, Poppy, that there may be, initially, that states may be doing well when it comes to the number of infections. But if we're not careful as reopening is occurring, as people are experiencing quarantine fatigue, this is a virus that's highly contagious and these states could very well be next.

And I think this should be a warning for all of us. We have seen this trend in the last couple of months in particular, that it's the small, informal gatherings that's really driving the COVID-19 surges. And so we should remember the CDC estimates 50 percent of individuals who are contributing to the spread could be those who are asymptomatic.

And that could very well be our family members and our friends, it doesn't just have to be strangers who could have COVID-19 and we should be on our guard and do everything we can to prevent the surge in our own families and those around us and in our communities.

SCIUTTO: So, Dr. Wen, in the middle of the surge, we're going to have an election. So in less than three week's time, you either have a second Trump term or a new president, chance for a reset, right, in terms of the national approach to this. If you were invited into the White House, asked to give advice on what to do differently to get this country -- this outbreak in this country under control, what would be the first thing you would say?

WEN: I think there are three critical things that need to be done. The first is to have a national coordinated strategy. We've seen that this piecemeal whack-a-mole approach is just not going to work. And it cannot be on one element, it has to be everything. We need a testing strategy, a vaccine strategy, all these elements have to be in place.

The second is to make sure that there is clear, consistent messaging. There can't be this mixed messages that pits public health versus the economy and we certainly cannot have elected officials undermining somehow public health at every turn.

And the third is to let science lead. Because this is a public health crisis, we need to have public health at the forefront of the response.

HARLOW: We heard Dr. Fauci say it's likely that we'll have a vaccine that a lot of folks can take in April, that would be great. But what about our kids? I mean, the fact that Pfizer just, this week, announced they're starting trials on children as young as 12. I think this week, for the near term, it's just 16 and 17 year olds and then it goes down. So are we like a year or more away from our kids getting vaccinated?

WEN: Probably. Even by the most conservative or most optimistic, rather, estimates, we are looking at the approval for adults being early 2021. And for kids, it's certainly going to be after that, maybe in the spring or summer for approval of the vaccine, much less distribution.

And so I do think that it's important for us to set the expectation that we could be a year off from all of our kids getting the COVID-19 vaccine. But we also want to make sure, especially for our kids, that the vaccine that's approved is safe and that it actually has the effect that we intend it to.

SCIUTTO: No question.

All right, so herd immunity, this is something that one of the new members of the president's task force, Dr. Atlas, has raised. An open letter to the medical journal, Lancet, signed by 80 scientists, has called this a dangerous fallacy unsupported by scientific evidence. I wonder, what's your view? Is that a possible approach to handling this?

WEN: So I've also signed this letter, and so I'm in the group of the vast majority of public health experts who believe that herd immunity, if you are doing vaccination, that's a public health strategy. But in our entire history, we have never used herd immunity as a strategy for natural infection, just letting it rip, basically, throughout our communities. That's not a public health strategy. Public health is protecting people's health.

And knowingly, purposefully letting people get infected and die, that is not good for the public's health.

[10:10:01]

If we estimate that in this country, we're going to need 60 to 80 percent of people to get infected before we get to herd immunity, that's 200 million Americans who will have to get COVID-19. Even at a fatality rate of 1 percent, that's 2 million Americans who would have to die.

And, by the way, we don't even know that immunity even lasts for something like COVID-19. So that's millions of people who may have to die every year. That's just not a strategy. That is actually the worst case scenario. And we know what we need to do to avoid getting there.

SCIUTTO: Imagine if one of those people, someone close to you, right, one way to look at it. Dr. Leana Wen, thanks so much, as always.

WEN: Thank you.

SCIUTTO: Well, tonight will really be America's choice. President Trump and former Vice President Biden, they will have town halls at the same time, dueling town halls. We're going to talk strategy for both campaigns.

HARLOW: Also, it is not just the United States, Europe is seeing virus cases surge. And now, leaders there are cracking down. Is it enough and is it soon enough?

Also, California's Republican Party is defying a state order to remove those unofficial ballot drop boxes. So then what?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:15:00]

SCIUTTO: Welcome back.

Today, President Trump on the trail in North Carolina holding a rally there before heading to Miami for his town hall tonight. Joe Biden will hold his own competing town hall at the same time, all this happening during what would have been the second face-to-face presidential debate.

Joining me to discuss, Virginia Senator Tim Kaine, of course, the Democratic vice presidential nominee in 2016. Senator, thank you for taking the time this morning.

SEN. TIM KAINE (D-VA): Absolutely, Jim, glad to be with you.

SCIUTTO: So, instead of a presidential debate, you have these dueling town halls basically giving people a choice of who they want to tune in to. But we still have a third debate scheduled for next week. Given the performance in the first one, are these debates, in your view, still useful for voters?

KAINE: Jim, I think they are. I'm not sure they change anybody's mind at this point. I think maybe this race uniquely is one where folks have their minds made up. But I'll tell why you debates are useful, even if that's true, because you get people on the record on things and later on you can hold them to their promises. Wait, you said you would do this, so do it.

And I think voters are entitled to hear people make their case and then hold them to what they say later. So I'm glad that we're going forward with the debate next week. I'm sorry that the one tonight was canceled by the president. But next week, we'll do another one, and that's good.

SCIUTTO: All right, state of race. I have spoken to both Democrats and Republicans, frankly, who believe that this race is now Vice President Biden's to lose. You've been there. As you know, there was a similar feeling around this time in 2016. I wonder given your experience, do you have any words of warning for folks who might think this election is already done?

KAINE: You know, here is what I think, Jim. You don't see any complacency on the Democratic side. I think the polls look good but, boy, if you're looking at early vote trends in Virginia, and I know other states too, you're seeing dramatic Democratic early turnout, because people are afraid are we overconfident, we saw a poll that looked good but we can't count on that.

So we can't be overconfident. I don't take those polls at face value at all, national polls don't mean that much, it's about the states. I like the position that Joe Biden is in, but, yes, no complacency. The good news is the early vote is telling us that there isn't complacency on the Democratic side.

SCIUTTO: As you know, in multiple states, Republicans have gone to court to, among other things, limit the number of drop boxes, we saw that in Texas, place restrictions on mail-in voting. Do you believe -- and even, I should note, conservative commentators, George Will has written about this a number of weeks ago, do you believe the GOP is deliberating attempting to suppress votes?

KAINE: Absolutely. I think the GOP, Jim, has figured out that the more people participate, the more likely is that they'll lose. And so they've embarked on a number of strategies, not reauthorizing the Voting Rights Act, these challenges in courts, purging voter roles, they are trying to winnow down the number of people who participate.

Sometimes I get asked by foreign visitors to the U.S., well, tell me the difference between Democrats And Republicans in 30 seconds. And if I have to do it in 30 seconds, I'd say, one party wants more people to participate, one party wants fewer people to participate. And if you know just that, you know an awful lot about the character of the two American parties these days.

SCIUTTO: All right. Supreme Court, you're going to have a vote to make. You voted to confirm Amy Coney Barrett to the seventh circuit court, at the time you praised her as having a distinguished record.

KAINE: Yes.

SCIUTTO: Will you vote up or down for her confirmation of the Supreme Court?

KAINE: Before she was nominated, I said that I was holding the Republican to their promise. They promised us, their colleagues and the American public in 2016, that if there was a vacancy in a presidential year, the new rule is let the people decide, wait and see what happens in the presidential and Senate elections and don't rush a nominee. They're breaking their promise to rush a nominee to try to kill the Affordable Care Act.

And I announced before Judge Barrett was nominated, I'm voting against anybody who is put up on the floor to break the Republicans' word. It's an illegitimate process. So, no, I'm not going to vote for her.

If we get after the election and the Republicans rethink rushing it, we can see how the dust settles on election. And then I would entertain the qualifications of any nominee. But I view it as a sham process and I'm not going to be part into it.

[10:20:002]

SCIUTTO: Should the current Democratic candidate, former Vice President Joe Biden, say definitely, yes or no, whether he will seek to pack the court after, as president, if he were to win and if you get a majority in the Senate as well? Does he need to say, yes or no, definitively? I know he said more recently he's not a fan of the idea but should he be explicit here?

KAINE: I think Joe has said both as a senator and as a candidate, he's not a fan of the idea. But here is why if you look on the campaign website, there's nothing about changing the court, or if you go to Democratic luncheons in the Senate, we don't talk about changing the court.

We are laser-focused on one goal right now, Republicans, keep your word. if they don't break their word, the whole question of the court composition is not even going to come up. Just keep your word. You said to the American public you'd let the people decide in presidential election year.

So the only reason this question even gets raised is people say, well, I guess the Republicans are going to break their words, so what should Democrats do? Maybe I'm naive but I'm still holding that hope that some Republicans will honor their word. Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski have said they will. If two more do, then we don't even get to the question of court composition.

SCIUTTO: Final question. Governor of Virginia, Ralph Northam targeted with an extremist plot against him, as the Michigan Governor was. Northam has said, and you were governor of Virginia, I should note to our viewers as well, said that the president's tweet, liberate Virginia and other comments have encouraged groups like this. Do you agree with that?

KAINE: I absolutely do. And I warned the administration about this, Jim, that the day of that tweet, liberate Virginia, liberate Michigan, I think there was a third state, I might have been Minnesota, just coincidentally, the Democratic senators had a phone call with Vice President Pence to talk about COVID relief. And I said to him, why is the president, in the midst of this pandemic that already has everybody so worried, sending out these incendiary messages? They could be incitement to violence.

And when you see a group of militia members have a meeting in Ohio and for some reason they decide to target the Michigan and Virginia governors, that just strikes me as odd. The messages that the president is sending don't incite everyone, most people are reasonable and they're going kind of to discount that kind of talk, but there are a lot of dangerous people out there, sadly. And you don't have to incite a lot of people, you can incite a few, and they can do grave, grave harm. We need a president who is uniter, not a divider.

SCIUTTO: Okay. I've got to leave it there. Senator Tim Kaine, thanks so much for joining us this morning.

KAINE: Absolutely, Jim. Glad to be with you.

HARLOW: European leaders are issuing new restrictions as coronavirus cases surge and fears grow that the second wave may have already arrived there. We're going to take you live there, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:25:00]

HARLOW: Welcome back.

So we've been talking a lot about what has been happening, especially in the past few days across Europe with COVID. Germany just hit a single-day record of new COVID cases reporting the most since late March.

SCIUTTO: And now, European leaders are implementing fresh restrictions as several nations at the same time struggle to contain new outbreaks.

CNN's Scott McLean, he is in Berlin. Scott, what's behind the spike? We're seeing it here in the U.S. What are they blaming there?

SCOTT MCLEAN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Jim, that is precisely the riddle that lawmakers here in Germany are trying to solve, especially since the second wave of the virus has now officially eclipsed the first one.

And like many other European countries, young people are taking a lot of blame for spreading the virus here. In fact, the chancellor, Angela Merkel, had a message for them yesterday, saying, it is better to miss out on a few parties today so that you can have a better future tomorrow.

Merkel, yesterday, met with the premiers from Germany's 16 federal states to try to hash out a more unified response to this resurgence of the virus, to replace the patchwork of different restrictions in different German states. That meeting stretched well into the evening. When it was finished though, Merkel announced that in virus hot spots, which right now include most large German cities, bars and restaurants would have to close early. There will also be restrictions on social gatherings both in public places and in private homes as well.

They're going to see how things go over the next ten days or so. But if these measures can't help to flatten the curve of new infections, the chancellor said that she is prepared to bring in more stringent ones. Jim, Poppy?

SCIUTTO: We'll watch closely. Scott, thanks very much.

To France now. Paris and several other French cities are imposing curfews in an attempt now to slow the spread of COVID-19.

SCIUTTO: Let's go to Melissa Bell. She joins us in Bordeaux. Good morning, Melissa.

What is the thinking behind a curfew and how widespread is it across the country?

MELISSA BELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, essentially, Poppy, that authorities want to avoid a second lockdown as much as they can, given how difficult it's been economically to try and get back on its feet. This is an economy that was hard-hit. So everything they can do to try and prevent that second lockdown is what they're doing.

Hence, this curfew system, greater Paris region, plus eight other cities from Saturday beyond 9:00 P.M., you're not going to be allowed to be out on the street, and not until 6:00 A.M.

[10:30:04]

And that is because the figures here have been spiraling out of control. And that is having an incidence on ICU.