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W.H.O.: Infections Up in Roughly 80 Percent of European Countries; London, other Areas Moving to High Alert on Saturday; Italy and France Take Actions as COVID Cases Surge; Trump Misinterprets Data on Mask Wearing at Town Hall; NBC Network Under Fire for Booking Trump Town Hall; Comparing and Contrasting Dueling Town Halls; Some Seniors Who Backed Trump in 2016 Now Prefer Biden. Aired 4:30-5a ET

Aired October 16, 2020 - 04:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[04:30:00]

KIM BRUNHUBER, CNN ANCHOR: Europe is facing an alarming surge in COVID-19 with numerous counties posting record numbers of new cases. The World Health Organization says roughly 80 percent of European countries are seeing a rise in infections. Countries like Italy and France are seeing new cases increase by more than 50 percent compared to last week. And just compare Europe in the blue there with the U.S. a rise in new European cases is now much sharper compared to how things were during the summer.

And Russia's health ministry is among those reporting a record daily high, more than 15,000 new cases, as well as 232 deaths. We have reporters all across Europe covering these developments. I'm joined by CNN's Phil Black in London, and Salma Abdelaziz in Manchester with the latest from the U.K. So, Phil, let's begin with you, several regions, including London where you are moving to tier 2 lock downs. So exactly what does that mean?

PHIL BLACK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, they aren't locked down. Businesses aren't forced to close, not yet anyway. But for the 9 million or so people who in and around London, and other areas of England as well, they're going to suffer some pretty tough restrictions on their personal lives. The key change will be from tomorrow.

It'll become illegal for people who don't live together to spend time together indoors. So now hanging out with family or friends anywhere inside, homes, restaurants cafes, bars. Still possible to socialize outside in groups of up to 6. But that's going to become less practical as the days get shorter and colder, as winter deepens.

London's mayor says this was necessary. There was no choice because the virus was spreading, is spreading rapidly in all parts of the capital. All the key indicators are trending in the wrong direction. Here in London, you don't meet too many people who are surprised by this. They fear it could be just the beginning. Tougher restrictions could still come yet, but it confirms what many have long suspected what the politicians have been saying pretty frequently lately and that is that it's going to be a long difficult winter -- Kim. Ray, thanks so much. Just Now we'll go to Salma in Manchester there in

the north of England, the situation even worse, the government wants to make restrictions even tighter, but now I understand the local officials are fighting back?

SALMA ABDELAZIZ, CNN REPORTER: That's absolutely right, Kim, the mayor has outright rejected plans by the government to move this city to tier 3, very high risk, that's the highest level in England's new three-tier COVID alert system. Take a listen to how he justified his reasoning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDY BURNHAM, MAYOR OF GREATER MANCHESTER, ENGLAND: They are asking us to gamble our residents' jobs, homes, and businesses and a large chunk of our economy on a strategy that their own experts tell them might not work. We would never sign up for that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ABDELAZIZ: Now, the mayor is not Prime Minister Boris Johnson's only critic. There's a growing chorus of opposition voices that say Prime Minister Boris Johnson and his administration are taking the wrong strategy. Essentially, one side you have the government saying, look, the best way forward is small, limited regional lock downs. On the other hand, you have those backed by scientific advisers saying, no, we need what is called a circuit breaker. Which is a nationwide complete lock down for a short period of time to stem the rise in cases.

Now we have heard from the Foreign Secretary Dominic Rabb this morning. His response to the mayor was essentially saying that as a matter of last resort, we can proceed with the plans to move this city to that very high-level risk category. However, we would like to cooperate with the city as local authorities and while all of this political wrangling is going on, the virus continues to spread, and the clock is ticking -- Kim.

BRUNHUBER: All right, thank you so much, Salma Abdelaziz in Manchester, England, and Phil Black for us in London. Appreciate both of you.

A nighttime curfew is about to begin in Paris and other French cities, while Italy begins to close schools again. So, keeping track of this in Bordeaux, France and Rome are CNN's Melissa Bell and Ben Wedeman. So, let's start with you, Melissa. The curfew just over the horizon. What's the latest there?

[04:35:10]

MELISSA BELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Just over the horizon, and really the government authorities are going to be looking to see whether this makes the difference that it needs to make. Again, last night, just ahead of those curfews, we saw another record rise in terms of the number of new daily cases. So, the question is whether the curfew is going to be applied in nine cities from Saturday between 9:00 p.m. and 6:00 a.m. for at least four weeks is actually going to bring the numbers back down.

Because in cities like greater Paris there is already a serious strain on ICU units as a result of COVID-19 patients taking up a greater and greater proportion of the beds that are there. So, will the curfews be enough? That is one of the big questions that the government is facing. He continues to look at the number of new cases but also the positivity rate now nationally at 12.6 percent, Kim. On the first of September, it was three times less than that. It has risen very quickly indeed, and again, already in Paris, more than 45 percent of ICU beds taken by COVID-19 patients.

But Emmanuel Macron said on Wednesday, was that this second wave is looking to be even worse than the first in France. Because it's so spread out all over the country and because this time, he explained, there simply were no spare beds.

BRUNHUBER: All right, thank you so much for that. We'll go to Ben Wedeman in Rome. Ben, the U.K. just added Italy to its list of quarantined countries when visitors have to come back, I guess a sign of the worsening situation there in Italy?

BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, there's no question, Kim, that the situation is worsening here. We saw a number of new coronavirus cases reported yesterday, which was almost 2,000 higher than at its height. The height of the pandemic here in Italy earlier this year. So certainly, the expectation is things are going to get much worse.

At this point, people are particularly concerned about the situation in Campania, a region in the south where Naples is located. That area was spared from the pandemic earlier in the year when it really was concentrated in the north of the country. Now, however, we're seeing a surge of cases there.

The problem in Campania is that it's a much poorer part of the country. The medical, the public health infrastructure is much less prepared and it's also one of the most densely populated parts of Italy. And so, the concern is that with these rising numbers, the situation could get much worse.

Now we already know that the governor of the region has ordered schools and universities to be closed. All parties and public, and religious, civic festivities are now banned. Also, restaurants must close at 9:00, and there is serious consideration about imposing curfews along the line of what we heard Melissa talking about in France -- Kim.

BRUNHUBER: Thank you so much, Ben Wedeman in Rome. Melissa Bell in Bordeaux appreciate it.

Now earlier I spoke with Sterghios Moschos from Newcastle England. He's an associate professor of molecular virology at Northumbria University. And he told me children play an important role in the transmission of the virus, and he says in-person learning should stop for now. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

STERGHIOS MOSCHOS, ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR IN CELLULAR & MOLECULAR SCIENCES, NORTHUMBRIA UNIVERSITY: For the foreseeable future unless it's absolutely necessary. It's very clear that we cannot have face to face education. That involves both the academics the teachers at schools, and I would even hazard the primary schools and below nurseries not being open.

Because we now have data from Switzerland, from France, from Germany, from Italy, from Greece, you know, from everywhere, showing that transmission happens with children, and we do not know, still, and we won't know for years what is the developmental impact of this virus. So, we cannot take that risk.

Beyond that, we need to be able to sustain function of this society and the economy. And if we are allowing the virus to create to access bubbles of the sizes of schools and their associated families and workplace, well, we are not achieving that.

BRUNHUBER: Well, one thing that might help bring down those numbers, experts agree of course we have to wear masks. But even yesterday at a town hall with voters President Trump questioned the use of masks. Listen to this.

TRUMP: I am OK with masks. I tell people to wear masks. But just the other day they came with a statement that 85 percent of the people that wear masks catch it.

BRUNHUBER: All right. So, the president got the number right there, but the interpretation of the study was wrong. You know, the truth is, though, I mean, wearing mask, especially a cloth mask as we know isn't necessarily designed to protect the wearer, but how pervasive is this, you know, masks don't stop the spread claim? And how harmful is this misinformation giving -- given what we are seeing now with the rise in case numbers?

[04:40:00]

MOSCHOS: Yes, it's absolutely and totally harmful. I cannot emphasize in stronger words without being not appropriate for the time of day, that the lack of use of reasonable personal protective equipment, and by God, a cloth mask is a reasonable piece of protective personal equipment, put at risk everyone in your own immediate vicinity and everyone in your community.

The data is clear from the best universities of the United States, the best universities in the U.K. that face masks prevent the migration of aerosols. And we also have results showing that even the incoming aerosols can be contained to an extent by masks. So why shouldn't we not wear this?

(END VIDEOTAPE)

All right, thanks to Sterghios Moschos for his analysis there.

After the break -- (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There was a time I didn't like him at all. I loved him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRUNHUBER: Florida is flip flopping amid a tight U.S. presidential race in Florida. Some seniors who backed President Trump in 2016 say they will vote for Biden. We'll find out why. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BRUNHUBER: There's been a backlash against the dueling town halls involving Donald Trump and Joe Biden. Voters wanting to compare the candidates were forced to flip-flop back-and-forth on different TV networks. And NBC is coming under fire for letting the President take a competing time slot. Here's CNN chief media correspondent Brian Stelter.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN STELTER, CNN CHIEF MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: There these twin town halls were a poor substitute for an actual presidential debate. However, they were still worthwhile, and some of the critics who were complaining about the format and the scheduling of these town halls, started to change their tune about halfway through.

[04:45:00]

Of course, it was ABC that schedule a town hall with Joe Biden first. And then NBC that followed up with a town hall with President Trump. They were at the same time on the East Coast in United States. Some viewers did flip back and forth, but I think there is more interest in the Trump town hall, because he had not sat down with a journalist to interview, someone of the caliber of Savannah Guthrie, ever since he came down with coronavirus two weeks ago.

Trump has been calling in to Fox, calling his friends on the radio, but he had not sat down for a big rigorous interview. So, it is notable that Guthrie challenged him about his coronavirus testing history, as well as some other issues in the news. Like his comments in the past about QAnon. So, it was a very newsworthy town hall NBC, but there's still been a lot of criticism both internally and externally about why the network decided to host a town hall with Trump at the very same time that Biden was scheduled to appear on ABC.

In some ways, this was just about a petty network TV rivalry, but the stakes are very high which is just a few weeks left in this election, and with millions of people already voting. Over an ABC, Biden try to appear to be above the fray, above all the Trump noise. Trump, of course, as always in the fray, always making lots of news, always shocking people with lots of comments.

Biden, on the other hand, trying to play the decent statesman, suggesting to people, hey, look over at NBC. You want really four more years of that? It was definitely a split screen for the agents between these two networks. And, later on Friday, we will hear about the ratings. We will see if Trump or Biden had higher ratings, I suspect Trump will be the higher rated program, but of course ratings are not all that matters.

What matters in these town halls is, was there news made? Did we learn more about the candidate? And most importantly, where any minds change at all. Of course, this time next week, there is one more debate on the calendar. Trump and Biden are expected to meet for one more debate on October 22nd.

Brian Stelter, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BRUNHUBER: The swing state of Florida has been a big focus in this presidential race, and President Trump won Florida in the last election. But now the coronavirus pandemic is making some senior voters reconsider their stance. Jeff Zeleny reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

(CROWD CHANTING)

JEFF ZELENY, SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, CNN (voice-over): These Florida seniors are fired up for Joe Biden. But it's not only Democrats taking their stand. A bigger threat to President Trump's reelection may come from voters like Tommye and Rody Johnson. They are lifelong Republicans, who supported him 4 years ago, but won't again.

TOMMYE JOHNSON, REPUBLICAN BIDEN SUPPORTER: I feel he is responsible for thousands and thousands of deaths, because of his attitude about it. He's still dishonest about it, he keeps saying it's getting better and it never is, it's getting worse.

ZELENY: Their frustration at the President turned to fury with his handling of coronavirus.

RODY JOHNSON, REPUBLICAN BIDEN SUPPORTER: Dammit, we voted for him. And of course, the virus COVID has been terrible.

ZELENY: Three weeks ago, his son tested positive for COVID-19.

R. JOHNSON: I was mad because he had it, and it was, you know, and I kept thinking, it's Mr. Trump's fault, because this thing should never have gotten as far as it had.

ZELENY: Seniors were key to Trump's victory in 2016, yet falloff from this critical voting bloc had the President sounding the alarm this week at a rally here.

TRUMP: Biden's agenda would be a catastrophe for Florida seniors.

ZELENY: During his own Florida visit, Biden turned the subject back to coronavirus. JOE BIDEN, U.S. DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: So many lives have been lost unnecessarily because this president cares more about the stock market than he does about well-being of seniors.

ZELENY: Tobi Schelin is a nurse who is going door-to-door for Biden, where she hears the stories.

TOBI SCHELIN, BIDEN SUPPORTER, VOLUNTEER: They can't hug their grandkids, so it's been huge, that's been a huge factor. Let's go together.

ZELENY: The pandemic and the fear of a close election drives these senior volunteers.

MARY MCBEE, BIDEN VOLUNTEER: My precinct went to Trump by 4 votes, only 4 votes. That's maybe 2 houses, 3 houses. I don't want to wake up this year, the day after election and say, what more could I have done?

ZELENY: Signs of an exceedingly tight race are plentiful here, with passionate support for Trump on display, from flags to front yards.

ANN ALEKSINAS, TRUMP SUPPORTER: There's more people out supporting him now, because he has had so many people going against him. And I don't feel he's been treated fairly by the Democrats at all.

ZELENY: The question is just how many Trump voters have soured on the President.

The Johnson's live in a county that is still deep red, but they are no longer shy about showing their affirmative support for Biden.

R. JOHNSON: Mr. Biden is a nice man. And there was a time I didn't like him at all. I love him.

ZELENY: But it's Trump that is driving them, and this race.

[04:50:00]

T. JOHNSON: He is so dishonest. And the worst is that, whenever he is caught in a lie, he blames it on someone else. It's always somebody else. He is impossible.

ZELENY (on camera): On top of all of this, the TV air waves here are flooded with hundreds of millions of dollars worth in advertising about Social Security and taxes. Those of course are familiar issues. But it is the new political issue of coronavirus that also is front and center every time President Trump holds a rally. He spent three of five days this past week here in the state of Florida, certainly underscoring the importance of the 29 electoral votes. Now early voting begins in many Florida counties next week. Certainly, this state as critical as it ever is.

Jeff Zeleny, CNN, Vero Beach, Florida.

(END VIDEOTAPE) BRUNHUBER: Coming up, the Queen of England has emerged in public again, but something was noticeably missing from her royal attire. We'll have the details next. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BRUNHUBER: All around the world, the pandemic has made social distancing and face masks, U.S. Senate leader Mitch McConnell has been fairly strict about enforcing those rules in the Senate.

[04:55:00]

But on Thursday, a rare breach of protocol not seen in months in that chamber. Mask-less Senators, Lindsey Graham and Dianne Feinstein shook hands and hugged at the four days of confirmation hearings for Supreme Court nominee Amy Coney Barrett. It sparked a lot of criticism by those who expect political leaders to set a proper example.

And notably not wearing a mask either was Queen Elizabeth. It was the first time she had attended a public event since the pandemic started and although Buckingham Palace says precautions were taken, some are wondering if she should have worn one regardless. Anna Stewart reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANNA STEWART, CNN REPORTER: It was the Queen's first public engagement outside of Royal grounds since the pandemic began. The 94-year-old monarch opened a new research facility accompanied by her grandson Prince William. Now at these engagements there's always a lot of attention on what her majesty wears. But on this occasion, there was perhaps more focus on what she didn't, a face mask. Prince William didn't wear one either. Buckingham palace says the Queen decided not to wear a mask after consulting her own medic and those of the venue she was visiting. A royal source added that specific advice was sought, and all necessary precaution taken.

As you can see from the footage, the Queen and Prince William kept a clear distance from others throughout the visit. However, people are questioning whether the Queen should have worn a mask as an example. More regions in the U.K. face tighter restrictions as they battle the second wave of coronavirus.

Anna Stewart from outside Buckingham Palace in London.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BRUNHUBER: Thanks for putting up with me. I'm Kim Brunhuber, "EARLY START" is next, you're watching CNN.

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