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COVID Cases, Hospitalization Surge As Nation Nears Critical Election; CNN Reports, More Than 27 Million Ballots Have Already Been Cast; Fauci, Gov. Gretchen Whitmer (D-MI) Get Death Threats As Trump Attacks Continue. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired October 19, 2020 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:03]

SELINA WANG, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: China's growth also faces risks from high unemployment in further trade tensions with the U.S.

Selina Wang, CNN, Hong Kong

JOHN KING, CNN HOST: I hope to see you tomorrow. Brianna Keilar picks up our coverage right now.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: HI there. I'm Brianna Keilar and, I want to welcome viewers here in the United States and around the world.

We are just over two weeks until Election Day and the pandemic is getting worse just as experts predicted it would. 40 million cases now worldwide, and the U.S. is currently averaging more than 56,000 cases a day. That's about a 60 percent increase from September's low.

Ten states just set new records with their highest number of cases reported in a single day since the pandemic started, according to Johns Hopkins data. Overall, 27 states are showing a rising trend in infections.

And all of this is happening after weeks of warnings from scientists and doctors to get the case numbers down before flu season hits and the cold weather drives people inside.

Now, unlike past spikes, this one is happening as this colder weather is upon us. Indoors is riskier setting for the spread. This outcome was predictable and preventable, but is it unstoppable? Top experts worry that, yes, one even saying, quote, the next 6 to 12 weeks are going to be the darkest of the entire pandemic.

Moment ago, Dr. Anthony Fauci, the nation's top infectious disease expert, also stressed that much of the country is still at risk for having severe sickness from coronavirus.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: In the United States, about 40 percent of U.S. adults are susceptible to severe COVID-19 disease, on the basis of underlying conditions as well as aging in individuals, even those with overlapping compromised conditions.

So the idea of being able to just let this infection go through the community and only be concerned about those in nursing homes clearly is flawed, because there are so many people generally in the community who are susceptible to severe disease.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Nine months since the first U.S. cases, there is still no cohesive federal plan to control this virus. And, in fact, the president is heading to Arizona tonight to headline another large rally there.

And as he does that, he has launched another attack against Dr. Fauci just as the nation is about to enter this, quote, dark time in the pandemic.

I want to turn now to CNN's Kaitlan Collins. Kaitlan, the president called Fauci a disaster and an idiot. Tell us about this.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes. And this comes after that 60 Minutes interview last night that Fauci did where he was talking about things like the president's rallies and dismissing the president's idea that the coronavirus, we're rounding the corner on it, things like that.

And now the president unprompted in a call that was meant to rally campaign staff in these last 15 days until the election, went after Dr. Anthony Fauci, calling him a disaster, and saying, quote, people are -- he was saying people tired of hearing about the pandemic, saying people are saying whatever, just leave us alone. They're tired of it. People are tired of hearing Fauci and all these idiots. Fauci is a nice guy, he has been here for 500 years.

Then he went on with attacks against Fauci saying that Fauci is a disaster. If I listened to him, we would have 500,000 deaths. And later, Brianna, he said it would be 700,000 or 800,000. And even as the president was saying these things, this was a call with campaign staff, reporters were given access to it, including myself. And the president acknowledged that reporters could be listening and said if they're on, I could not care less.

And so the president not trying to keep attacks on Fauci private as he has done in the past, now he doesn't mind them coming out into the public view as this tension between the two of them has been building for months. But we should note, this comes as, of course, the Trump campaign is still airing an ad that features Fauci where it seems to be implying that he is endorsing the president's handling of the pandemic, something that Fauci has disputed and said actually in that quote that he was using, he was praising the work of the task force.

But, Brianna, as the president is saying that people don't care about coronavirus any more, you really have got to look at the polls for that. Because some CNN polls that were done about two weeks ago, you see that actually voters nationwide rank it as their number two priority, but that changes when you look at if they're likely Biden voters or likely Trump voters. It is 60 about percent Biden voters think it is a number two priority, when it comes to Trumpers, only like 22 percent, I believe, according to our latest numbers, think that the pandemic is a priority when it comes to voting this fall.

KEILAR: It is very illuminating, as you point out. Kaitlan, thank you so much for that update.

In the midst of all of this, Dr. Scott Atlas, President Trump's handpicked adviser on the White House coronavirus task force, is pedaling disinformation again, this time about masks. This weekend, he tweeted extensively and erroneously about how they don't work, which is refuted by CDC guidelines that are based on science.

[13:05:03]

Twitter took down that tweet. They said it violated the rule that bans sharing false or misleading content on COVID-19 that could lead to harm.

Just a reminder now of exactly who Scott Atlas is. He is a neuroradiologist, though notably not an epidemiologist, but his resume looks pretty good at first glance. He attended University of Chicago School of Medicine, he is the former chief of neuroradiology at Stanford University Medical Center.

But as I've said before, on paper, his credentials may sing, but anti- science blathering blows. He is a conservative media darling. He is going on the president's favorite cable news channel to say the things the president likes to hear, like touting herd immunity as a solution to the coronavirus from early days of the pandemic to as recently as last week.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. SCOTT ATLAS, WHITE HOUSE CORONAVIRUS ADVISER: We can allow a lot of people to get infected, those who are not at risk to be -- to die or have a serious hospital requiring illness. We should be fine with letting them get infected, generating immunity on their own, and the more I am immunity in the community, the better we can eradicate the threat of the virus, including the threat to people who are vulnerable. That's what herd immunity is.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: The problem is you can't do that without killing people. Remember, herd immunity is not a public health strategy. Just letting coronavirus rip through the population is, quote, mass murder, according to Harvard Medical School Professor William Haseltine, which might be why Atlas doesn't want to be caught outright pushing herd immunity.

In an interview with CNN's Michael Smerconish, Atlas called claims that he urged President Trump or anyone to adopt herd immunity an overt lie. But I would direct you to the previous that I just played of Atlas urging the adoption of herd immunity.

And in that same interview, Atlas downplayed the number of deaths estimated by an influential model the White House uses.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ATLAS: The IHME model and all these other models have been so wrong so many times. Just think about the common sense here. Why do we have to keep changing a model every three to five days, every week?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: The IHME model the White House cites is wrong only and that it consistently underestimates the death toll. A CNN fact check showed the IHME largely lines up with the virus progression in the U.S., and these projections are updated because they're projections, just like weather maps or economic outlooks are updated as real-time data comes in, allowing projections based on real-time data, right, just like presidential polls.

And speaking of, when it comes to his boss' recent bout of COVID, Atlas told Fox News there was no need to worry because President Trump is, according to Atlas, a very, very healthy guy and that he's never seen anyone with more energy and vigor at any age, but particularly at his age.

The president is 74 years old, he is obese by medical standards, and he's been treated for high cholesterol, factors that put him at elevated risk with the coronavirus, no matter how much Dr. Atlas wants you to believe otherwise.

Figuratively speaking, Dr. Atlas puts on his MAGA hat well before putting on his white coat. He is a sycophant more concerned with pleasing the president than making good on his oath as a doctor. He has competing priorities here and they are dangerously at odds.

With me now is Josh Dawsey, Washington Post White House Reporter and CNN Political Analyst.

And, Josh, I know that you have some new reporting here that there's actually a top coronavirus task force official, Dr. Deborah Birx, who is very much at odds with Atlas. So tell us what you've discovered.

JOSH DAWSEY, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Right. We'll start out with just consolidated power among the coronavirus response at the White House. He now is meeting with the president regularly while Dr. Birx and Dr. Anthony Fauci are not. Dr. Birx has been so disputed by Dr. Atlas' comments, as she eventually went to the vice president and said that she didn't think Dr. Atlas should be on the task force and did not trust his data and analysis. The vice president basically told the two of them to settle it themselves.

But the range of alarm among other doctors on the COVID task force, Dr. Birx, Dr. Fauci, Jerome Adams, the surgeon general, towards Dr. Scott Atlas is quite high.

KEILAR: So, in a way, the vice president is allowing Scott Atlas to continue doing what he is doing, saying what he is saying on the task force. He is not taking any action here? DAWSEY: No, the vice president has not. The vice president has essentially let the task force be a place where various medical experts can argue it out. Dr. Birx and Fauci though, they believe that Dr. Atlas is not arguing in good faith he is using faulty scientific models and projections.

KEILAR: So, Dr. Atlas has only been an adviser on the task force for two months. He kind of came in, and he was lauded by the president's allies as a counter to Fauci. You write though that he has managed to sideline other doctors while gaining power.

[13:10:03]

How has that happened?

DAWSEY: Well, he has been more aligned with the president's position on COVID that it is going to spread, that most people will be fine and healthy, and he reiterates that to the president. He's not a fan of masks. He's not a fan of additional testing. He basically shares a lot of positions that the president holds in many of these cases, and the president has liked that perspective and that opinion.

The president said publicly, as he said earlier today, that he does not agree with Dr. Fauci, he called him a disaster on a call with campaign staff earlier today, and he likes that Dr. Atlas brings the perspective he would prefer on the virus.

KEILAR: Josh Dawsey, thank you so much for sharing reporting with us. We really appreciate it.

DAWSEY: Thank you.

KEILAR: I want to bring in CNN Medical Analyst Dr. Jonathan Reiner. He is a professor of medicine at George Washington University. And, Dr. Reiner, how alarming is it to you that the president's preferred coronavirus adviser concerning is tweeting stuff that is so erroneous, Twitter doesn't even let it stand?

DR. JONATHAN REINER, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: Right. When I first saw that tweet, I thought that his account must have been hacked or that he was in some sort of a personal health crisis. It's like having some random passenger invited to the cockpit to land aircraft except we are all riding on that airplane.

There is no question -- let me just say this again, there is no question that wearing masks will reduce transmission of the virus. The science is not in doubt. On a countrywide level, look at the countries around the world who have almost universal mask adherence, places in Asia, like Japan, that had a total of 90,000 cases. That's a day-and- a-half of cases in the United States. Taiwan, very, very early, universal mask adherence, they had seven deaths.

So this administration brought in basically a libertarian radiologist to tell the president what he wanted to hear. And if you look at the professionals on the coronavirus task force, people like Anthony Fauci and Deborah Birx and Robert Redfield, none of them line up with Scott Atlas. He is an unwelcome, unqualified voice basically shouting out all of the other reasonable voices in this administration.

KEILAR: And there was a phone call with his campaign and President Trump said people are tired of hearing Dr. Fauci and, quote, all these idiots. He called Dr. Fauci a disaster. What is your reaction to that?

REINER: You know, having a quarter of million people dead is the disaster. I think what Americans are tired of is the death and the suffering. You know, we have this new misery index. The new misery index is the unemployment in this country and death rate and case rate from COVID. That's our new misery index. And it is amongst highest in the world. We're tired of that. We're not tired of hearing about COVID. We're tired of the toll the COVID is taking.

And when I see the president make a statement like that, it tells me that he is tired of dealing with it. And the one response to somebody who is tired of dealing with it is to bring in a new team.

KEILAR: Dr. Reiner, thank you so much for joining us. We really appreciate it.

REINER: My pleasure.

KEILAR: Just ahead, Johnson & Johnson paused vaccine trial, but why is the company silent over details.

Plus, more than 27 million Americans have already voted this year. What that record breaking number tells us about this race.

And the president continues to attack the governor of Michigan after the FBI thwarted a kidnapping plot against her as we see new video of the domestic terror group's training.

This is CNN's special live coverage.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:15:00]

KEILAR: Election Day is only 15 days away, and already a record setting more than 27 million ballots have been cast. Voters that have already cast ballots in 45 states and Washington, D.C. represent almost 20 percent of the more than 136 million total ballots that were cast in the 2016 presidential election.

In Georgia, for example, early in-person voting is up 152 percent from 2016. Today, early voting begins in Alaska, Arkansas, Colorado, Idaho and North Dakota, and early voting will start in some Florida counties, which includes Broward, Miami-Dade, Duval and Palm Beach. Experts are predicting even higher turnout this year.

We have CNN's Dana Bash, our Chief Political Correspondent, with us on this. So despite the numbers, Dana, the president told his campaign staff that he is suddenly feeling pretty good about his re-election chances. Tell us about this.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, because the president is trying to make it so that the people who are working for him aren't completely depressed and despondent over obviously what they're seeing in polls, but also a slew of stories over the weekend and today that suggest that there is some infighting, which often happens with losing campaigns.

I know you know this from, Bri, from covering politics for so long, and that they're kind of rudderless inside the Trump campaign. That seems to be the reason why the guy at the top of the ticket made this move to have a call, not just have a call, but, obviously, as you heard from Kaitlan at the beginning of the program, make it so that reporters knew what he was saying, not just about the comments about Anthony Fauci, but also about where he is right now in polls, trying to buck everybody up, remind them that people kind of ruled him out, wrote him off four years ago and surprised everybody.

[13:20:15]

That was clearly the purpose.

But as you said, the numbers of early voting numbers are astonishing, really astonishing. Maybe between -- it was 10 percent of what experts expect the complete voting electorate to be. And now, it is pushing 20 percent.

And I just saw a new story from our election team saying in Florida, for example, younger voters are turning out more than they expected, which in a place like Florida, and given how we know younger voters tend to turn, that's another good sign for Joe Biden, not necessarily a good one for Donald Trump. Brianna?

KEILAR: Yes. It is just such a different election. It's hard to know. It's so much early voting. And the fact that it's obviously there are reasons why people are doing that. It is also hard to sort out here.

I want to ask you about something that Senator John Cornyn, who is Republican from Texas, and he is up for re-election, something he said. He seemed to knock President Trump in an interview with a local newspaper when he was asked about the White House coronavirus response and about the president's controversial political stances.

The senator suggested that there's no use in debating Trump or trying to change his mind because he is who he is.

BASH: Yes. Let me actually read the quote from a newspaper in Fort Worth, where he is from in Texas. He said, according to the newspaper, maybe like a lot of women who get married and think they are going to change their spouse, and that doesn't usually work out very well, and then he said, I think what we found is that we are not going to change President Trump. He is who he is. You either love him or hate him and there's not much in between.

Okay. So take aside that very awkward comment about women and spouses, which we can kind of try to dissect maybe offline, I'll text you later, but let's talk about what matters here most, which is that this is an influential Republican on the ballot in a state that should be very solidly, comfortably red for him, the senator, John Cornyn, but more importantly for the president saying that you just kind of have to navigate this guy because you're not going to change him. And you're not going to change the people who support him. And he knows what he's talking about being in Texas.

I spoke to somebody who knows the senator well before coming on with you who said that this is actually something that John Cornyn has said a lot in private, maybe even a little bit more in public than we realize because people are paying attention more now, but that he early on kind of understood that going up against President Trump on things that he disagrees with him on, and I'm sure there were lots of things, like other Republicans that he disagreed with President Trump on, wasn't going to get him anywhere with either the president or the people who he needs to vote for both of them in Texas.

So this was the saying the quiet part out loud of how Republicans across the board have had to navigate the president, even those who, you know, wish he would just be quiet and get off his Twitter feed every once in a while.

KEILAR: Well, I am looking forward to your text, Dana Bash. We'll talk about that later. Thank you so much for coming on.

BASH: Bye, Bri.

KEILAR: Bye-bye.

So, both Dr. Fauci and the governor of Michigan are getting death threats as the president ups his attacks on them.

And now an arrest in the alleged kidnapping plot of the Wichita mayo over a mask mandate, he is going to join us live.

And writer of the movie, Contagion, will join me on his response to America's dangerous pandemic behavior.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:25:00]

KEILAR: Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer and the nation's top infectious disease expert, Dr. Anthony Fauci, are responding to recent death threats made against them because of their efforts to curve the coronavirus pandemic. The governor who was at the target of an alleged foiled kidnapping plot is calling out the president for, quote, inciting domestic terrorism with his rhetoric. And Dr. Fauci, who now travels with federal security agents, says his entire family is being harassed.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FAUCI: That's sad. The very fact that a public health message to save lives triggers such venom and animosity to me that it results in real, incredibly threats to my life and my safety, but it bothers me less than the hassling of my wife and children.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They have been threatened? FAUCI: Yes. I mean, like give me a break.

GOV. GRETCHEN WHITMER (D-MI): It falls on deaf ears every time. They haven't done a darn thing. And, in fact, ten days after a plot to kidnap, to put me on trial, and then to murder me, ten days later, they're back in Michigan using the same rhetoric I have been asking them to turn the heat down.

[13:30:00]

It is dangerous.

(END VIDEO CLIP)