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Mayor Brandon Whipple (D-Wichita) Discusses Man Accused of Threatening to Kidnap and Kill Him over Mask Mandate; Ex-Bush 43 Aides Endorse Biden with 15 Days to Go; Will George W. Bush Speak Out Before Election?; Trump's Long Pattern of "I know Nothing" Defenses. Aired 1:30-2p ET
Aired October 19, 2020 - 13:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[13:30:00]
GOV. GRETCHEN WHITMER (D-MICHIGAN): In fact, 10 days after a plot to kidnap, to put me on trial, and then to murder me. Ten days later, they're back in Michigan using the same rhetoric I have been asking them to turn the heat down. It is dangerous.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: And in Kansas, a man has been arrested for allegedly threatening to kidnap and kill the mayor of Wichita because he was upset about the coronavirus mask mandate that requires people to wear face covering in public spaces. Meredith Dowty is charged with making a criminal threat.
And the Wichita mayor threatened, Brandon Whipple, joins me now.
Mayor, thank you so much.
We're sorry you're going through this.
Give us some information about how all of this unfolded and exactly what this man allegedly was planning to do.
MAYOR BRANDON WHIPPLE (D-WICHITA, KS): Yes, thanks for having me.
Really, we were just alerted that this person was interested in causing harm to myself due to some of the precautions the city has done to protect our neighbors in our community.
KEILAR: You have received some threats before. You are a public official. There was something about this --
WHIPPLE: Right.
KEILAR: -- that felt different to you.
WHIPPLE: Yes. I signed up for this. This is my job. My job is to make sure the people of Wichita have the necessary information that they need to keep themselves and our community safe, even if that information is negative information, right?
So in the past, I think the type of threats that have come my way have been from folks who really couldn't probably pull them off.
This person -- there was a text message to someone that he thought would have my address and asked for my address so it could be carried out.
Luckily, we have incredible police officers that were able to get this person under arrest and also make sure my family was safe.
KEILAR: Yes. It is not just you. It is your family. We're hearing that from so many public officials feeling threatened.
To you, did it seem knowing that this was something happening right after we learned about the plot to kidnap the Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer over similar outrage, is this something that because of that you are even more concerned about?
Did that sort of up the worry that you would have as a public official about what someone might try to do?
WHIPPLE: I mean, to be honest, not really. Wichita has the greatest people in the country. We have the best police chief. We have incredible neighbors that look out for each other.
When I look at what happened to Governor Whitmer, that seems more planned out. Here, it seemed like someone that's obviously on the fringe.
And here in Wichita, voice of common sense always drowns out the fringe voices that just are loud but not common. So overall, I think the two cases are different.
And, again, I live in the best community in the world, so I am never afraid to be in Wichita.
KEILAR: Lara Trump, the president's daughter-in-law, speaking on behalf of the campaign this weekend, and this is what she said about the president's attacks on Governor Whitmer.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LARA TRUMP, PRESIDENT TRUMP'S DAUGHTER-IN-LAW: He wasn't doing anything to provoke or threaten this woman at all. He was having fun at a Trump rally.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: I mean, I hear folks in the president's corner downplaying some of the rhetoric.
What do you think of it being characterized as having fun? What do you think about what this rhetoric is doing? Do you think it is contributing to an environment where we are seeing
public officials coming under threat?
WHIPPLE: Listen, as a dad, I have three boys under the age of seven. I tell them it stops being fun when someone else isn't having fun, right? When someone is at risk of being hurt, that's when the fun stops.
I don't think it is so much what our president says as much as also the tone it is said in. And also the environment we're in now. We're in a highly partisan election cycle.
And also under a lot of stress. This, for our country, is one of the most difficult times in the last 100 years. We have to take that into account.
And elected leaders need to be responsible and set the example, not just the example to keep COVID at bay but the example when it comes to showing each other grace, ensuring we watch out for one another, even at times we disagree.
KEILAR: I like what you say to your kids. I'm going to steal that.
Mayor Brandon Whipple, thank you.
WHIPPLE: Doesn't always work.
Thanks a lot.
KEILAR: No, I hear you. We can try.
Thanks, Mayor.
It is now or not by the election. Speaker Pelosi sets a deadline to reach a stimulus deal as China's economy rebounds.
[13:34:48]
Plus, will George W. Bush break his silence, endorse someone before the election? We have new reporting next.
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KEILAR: A group of George W. Bush officials launched a new ad, saying most never voted for a Democrat in their lives. But now they say every last one of them is voting for Joe Biden.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Most of us never voted for a Democrat in our lives. Never thought about it. Because most of us are lifelong Republicans.
[13:40:09]
But we're Americans first. We understand the character and experience, and, frankly, empathy required for leadership because we've seen it firsthand when we all served with the 43rd president.
But come Election Day, every last one of us on this team is voting for Biden.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: The group is called 43 Alumni for Biden. And it says it, quote, "Seeks to unite and mobilize a community of historically Republican voters dismayed and disappointed by the damage done to our nation by Donald Trump's presidency."
Joining me now, CNN special correspondent, Jamie Gangel.
Jamie, when you see the ad and those behind it, is this significant? It is something that stands out. Is it significant?
JAMIE GANGEL, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: I think it is significant in this way. These are loyal Republican -- they may not be household names but these are party faithful.
What's interesting is they're not just going to stay home or leave the top of the ballot blank. They feel that they need to actively vote for Joe Biden.
I was also struck by the commercial because it is not the Lincoln Project, right? It has a very different feeling.
And I would say there are two groups of Bush 43 Republicans. There are some very familiar faces. Former Secretary of State Colin Powell has said he will endorse Biden, has endorsed him. Same for secretary of Homeland Security, Tom Ridge. He has endorsed Biden.
But what struck me about this group is you won't recognize most of their names but there are hundreds and hundreds of them.
And the sense is that they hope to reclaim the Republican Party down the road, that they really have to stand up and not just speak out now but vote.
KEILAR: Yes, I mean, they're part of a large group of Republicans, both campaign and in the policy world, who kind of feel they're Republicans without a party, that they feel they can hold onto right now.
And it is lending to some speculation which is what about former president George W. Bush, is he going to speak out.
GANGEL: When the ad posted this weekend, my phone blew up. I made some calls. There's not going to be an October surprise. I am told by officials very close to former President Bush that he is not going to endorse Biden.
This is really not a surprise because he has been saying for quite some time that he has retired from politics.
That said, it doesn't take a lot to read between the lines. Just for some context, Former President Bush did not vote for Donald Trump in 2016. We reported he left the top of the ballot blank.
He is the last Republican president before Trump. He is not endorsing Trump.
And just recently, he announced that he paints a lot now. We've seen the paintings he does. He did them of military soldiers. He has a new book and a new exhibit coming out.
And I can't help but think it wasn't exactly an accident when they announced it. It is called "Out of Many, One." And the subject of the new book, immigrants. So there's no building a wall. Quite the opposite.
And on a lighter note, Brianna, a former senior Bush administration official reminded me this morning, if you want to know how former President Bush feels about Donald Trump, you might remember that he was quoted after the inauguration in 2016.
I can't say the whole thing. But he was quoted as saying, "That's some weird blank." So we know where he stands.
KEILAR: Yes. I mean, that was direct sort of caught. We heard him unfiltered. Even the filtered version of him is clear, sub tweeting.
GANGEL: Yes.
KEILAR: Jamie Gangel, thank you so much.
GANGEL: Thank you.
KEILAR: Joe Biden and President Trump will face off one last time in the final presidential debate this Thursday. Special live coverage beginning at 7:00 p.m. Eastern right here on CNN.
[13:44:59]
Coming up, President Trump's know nothing defense. The president denying reality with two key words.
Then later, crowd surfing during the pandemic. And that's just the beginning. The writer of the movie "Contagion" will join me live to discuss.
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KEILAR: Recently, we showed you the president's "hardly know them" defense, a pattern of him denying he knows someone who is in trouble or at the center of controversy when he clearly knows of them or certainly knows of them.
Now he's peddling the "I know nothing" defense.
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DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I know nothing about QAnon. SAVANNAH GUTHRIE, NBC HOST & DEBATE MODERATOR: I just told you --
TRUMP: I know very little.
You told me. But what you tell me doesn't necessarily make it fact. I hate to see that.
I know nothing about it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[13:50:06]
KEILAR: It's hard to believe, for many reasons. First, the FBI has labeled the group a threat.
Second, Trump endorsed a QAnon supporter running for Congress. And it got a whole heck of a lot of attention on cable news, which the president consumes like air.
Third, he's been asked about it at multiple times at this point. So, yes, he knows.
But his feigned ignorance on QAnon mirrors the answer that he gave about the Proud Boys, the far-right group with a penchant for violence that has been showing up repeatedly at both protests and Trump rallies.
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TRUMP: I don't know who the Proud Boys are. You'll have to give me a definition because I really don't know who they are.
I can only say they have to stand down. Let law enforcement do their work.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: That was right after Trump failed to condemn white supremacy at the first presidential debate.
And like white supremacy, Trump has used both the "hardly know them" and the "don't know anything" defenses like during his last election when he said this about former KKK grand wizard, David Duke, who had made a competitive run for Louisiana governor in 1991.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I don't know anything about him. Somebody told me yesterday, whoever he is, he did endorse me.
Just so you understand I don't know anything about David Duke, OK? I don't even know what you're talking about with white supremacy or white supremacists.
So I don't know. I don't know. Did he endorse me, or what's going on? Because you know, I know nothing about David Duke. I know nothing about white supremacists.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: OK, let's just roll the tape.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LARRY KING, FORMER CNN HOST: Did the David Duke thing bother you? And 55 percent of the whites in Louisiana voted for him?
TRUMP: I hate --
(CROSSTALK)
KING: And 400 New Yorkers contributed?
TRUMP: I hate seeing what it represents. But I guess it shows a lot of hostility in this country. There's a tremendous amount of hostility in the United States.
UNIDENTIFIED NEWS HOST: What do you see as the biggest problem with the Reform Party right now?
TRUMP: Well, you have David Duke just joined, a bigot, a racist, a problem. This is not exactly the people you want in your party.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: Trump also uses the "I know nothing" defense on the reported Russian bounties on the heads of American troops. Serious and credible enough that it was included in his presidential intel briefing.
Tough to miss Russia paying to off American servicemembers.
But here's what he said, quote, "Nobody briefed or told me, Pence or Meadows, about the so-called attacks on our troops in Afghanistan by the Russians. Everybody is denying it. And there have not been many attacks on us."
But he seems to miss a lot, especially when it comes to the Kremlin.
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TRUMP: I know nothing about Russia. I know about Russia, but I know nothing about the inner workings of Russia.
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KEILAR: He also said he was unfamiliar with WikiLeaks, which Russia used to dump hacked e-mails damaging to Hillary Clinton in 2016.
But only after he said he was quite familiar with WikiLeaks.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I know nothing about WikiLeaks. WikiLeaks. I love WikiLeaks.
(CHEERING)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: When the House of Representatives impeached the president, his defenses about pressuring Ukraine's president to dig up dirt on Joe Biden included everything from, quote, "It is a perfect phone call," to this one, his reaction to acting U.S. ambassador to the Ukraine Bill Taylor's testimony that Trump was overheard asked about investigations a day after that call.
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TRUMP: I know nothing about that. First time I've heard it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: When Trump's former top political adviser, Steve Bannon, was charged with fraud over a border wall fundraising scam, the president claimed this:
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: I know nothing about the project, other I didn't like -- when I read about it, I didn't like it.
I think it's a very sad thing for Mr. Bannon.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: The problem is, before Bannon way arrested, Chris Kobach, Trump's anti-immigration ally, who also led his Voter Fraud Commission, that didn't find voter fraud, told the "New York Times" this:
Quote, "I talked with the president and the 'We Build the Wall' effort came up. The president said the project has my blessing and you can tell the media that."
Duly noted. Thank you.
Another time that the president's own officials contradicted one of his "I know nothing" defenses was when Geoffrey Berman, U.S. attorney for the Southern District of New York, a top Justice Department official, was fired after overseeing the prosecution of several of the president's allies.
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TRUMP: That's all up to the attorney general. Attorney General Barr is working on that. That's his department, not my department. But we have a very capable attorney general, so that's really up to him. I'm not involved.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: But it was also very much up to the president. Just before Trump's remarks, A.G. Barr told Geoffrey Berman in a letter that he had been fired by President Trump.
Finally, when it comes to the pandemic, the president was asked why his White House eliminated the office in charge of global pandemics within his National Security Council.
He blamed it on Dr. Fauci, who had nothing to do with disbanding that team.
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[13:55:05]
TRUMP: I could perhaps ask Tony about that. Because I don't know anything about it. I mean, you say -- you say we did that. I don't know anything about it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KEILAR: Now, we all remember a time when it was good for a president to be informed. Claiming ignorance all the time about all the things wasn't presidential.
It certainly wasn't smart. And it wasn't believable. I guess that, at least, hasn't changed.
The president is again trashing Dr. Fauci. This time, calling him a disaster and an idiot.
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