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Trump Abruptly Ends White House Interview; Republican Groups Spending Millions against Trump; Race for a Vaccine; Coronavirus Pandemic Worldwide; U.S. Justice Department Files Antitrust Suit versus Google. Aired 2-2:45a ET

Aired October 21, 2020 - 02:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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JOHN VAUSE, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Hello and welcome to our viewers in the United States and around the world. I'm John Vause.

Coming up on CNN NEWSROOM, Donald Trump wants more rallies to turn around a faltering reelection campaign. It seems confrontation is in play. He abruptly ended a sit-down interview with CBS's "60 Minutes."

The U.K. is preparing an experimental coronavirus vaccine trial. One volunteer wants to be deliberately infected with the virus.

Also, desperate for immunity. People in China lining up, hoping to get a vaccine. It has still not been approved for mass release.

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VAUSE: With just 13 days until election in the United States, one day before the last presidential debate and Donald Trump's closing strategy seems to be lash out at anyone he can find. During a Tuesday night rally in Pennsylvania, he warned a Biden administration would end fracking and kill the American dream.

Earlier, he labeled Biden a criminal, urged an investigation by the attorney general but did not specify what should be investigated. He also abruptly ended an interview with the respected journalist Lesley Stahl, claiming she would not wear a mask on "60 Minutes."

During that rally, he taunted her online and in front of a huge crowd.

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TRUMP: And you have to watch what we do to "60 Minutes." You will get such a kick out of it. You are going to get a kick out of it. Lesley Stahl is not going to be happy.

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VAUSE: The president also lashed out at Dr. Anthony Fauci as Americans lined to vote in the middle of a pandemic. Wisconsin started early in-person voting on Tuesday, despite a surge in the number of cases, like 31 other states.

Meantime, former president Barack Obama released a video message on Twitter, urging young people to vote. He hits the campaign trail for his former vice president, Joe Biden, in Philadelphia on Wednesday. Trump heads to North Carolina for another rally. We get more on the visit to Pennsylvania from CNN's Kaitlan Collins.

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KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: As the president was rallying his supporters in Pennsylvania on Tuesday night with two weeks to go before the election, he had at one point seemed to recognize the dire position he's in when it comes to political polling. Because he said if it had been before the pandemic, he likely wouldn't have even been in Erie, Pennsylvania.

He basically told the crowd he had to show up given that his poll numbers right now are behind those of Joe Biden in Pennsylvania, a state that he carried in 2016.

That rally came just a few hours after the president had sat down with CBS's Lesley Stahl at the White House for an interview for "60 Minutes," at which we are told the president ended the interview before it was scheduled to be done, after about 45 minutes because he grew frustrated with the line of questioning from Stahl.

And we're told he left the room and did not come back to do what was supposed to be a taped portion of the interview with the Vice President, Mike Pence. And of course, then you saw the president go on Twitter. He taunted Lesley Stahl for at one point during the briefing -- or during the interview not wearing a mask.

And then he threatened to release the interview before CBS News airs it next Sunday. Of course whether or not he ultimately does still seems remains to be seen, but what you are seeing with these two weeks to go before the election is the president is making his closing message attacks on reporters like CBS News, attacks on other reporters as well, including the debate moderator for Thursday night for that final presidential debate, but also on Dr. Anthony Fauci, someone he has repeatedly gone after in recent days.

And this is not exactly the closing political message that aides had hoped he would have, given the fact that he is trailing Joe Biden in so many states with so few days left to go -- Kaitlan Collins, CNN, traveling with the president in Pennsylvania.

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VAUSE: Joining me now from Oakland, California, Tim Miller, political director for Republican Voters against Trump, host of the "Not My Party" on Snapchat.

Great to have you with us. I want to start with more from the Trump campaign rally, the likely superspreader event in Erie, Pennsylvania. Listen to this.

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TRUMP: He will massively raise your taxes, bury you in regulations, dismantle your police departments, dissolve our borders, confiscate your guns, Second Amendment. Oh, you're so lucky I'm president. You wouldn't have a second amendment. Eliminate private healthcare, terminate religious liberty, destroy the suburbs.

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VAUSE: In case you didn't pick it up, he's talking about Joe Biden, the antichrist. None of that is actually true.

Does it look to you like Trump kind of knows the reality TV presidency will not be renewed for a second season.

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VAUSE: And now he's moving on to this new role of Trump TV, an aggrieved old white man giving voice to aggrieved old white men across the U.S.?

TIM MILLER, POLITICAL DIRECTOR, REPUBLICAN VOTERS AGAINST TRUMP: Don't jinx it, John. I don't know. I can't get inside his head. This is a person that was told last time by the top people in his campaign that he was going to lose on Election Day. He thought he was going to lose in 2016.

They told him he needed to stop tweeting, behave better, soften himself and he didn't listen to them last time and he won anyway.

So I think that when you have that kind of experience, a narcissist like this president, it is hard to tell him to do anything other than what comes out of his natural id, which is that and all the other kind of weird grotesqueries and sidebars that he had today in Erie.

And I think that is putting a ceiling on his capability to add voters as we head down the final stretch. But I don't think we are seeing someone who has just given up.

VAUSE: Regardless of what happens in the next couple weeks, is this the end of the GOP?

Does it survive as a cult if the cult leader is no longer there at some point?

MILLER: First of all, with The Lincoln Project, what we are doing in our vetting, and we working together, I don't think either of us are trying to get the number down to zero supporters for Trump. We recognize that he has a very rabid fan base.

But I think there is a lack of appreciation for the fact that, last time, 15 percent that was unprecedented in American modern polling of his own voters said they had an unfavorable view of him.

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MILLER: So it was actually quite a big swath of swing voters that are gettable. I don't think there is an appreciation for that a lot of times in the media and among other pundits. That's what we are talking to.

As far as the future of the GOP is concerned, I wrote about this for "Rolling Stone" last week, I don't think the party is dead. I think the party is Trumpist. Because of the American system, the Republican Party could thrive as a minority party just doing well in the whitest states, the most rural states in the Midwest and South and across the Mountain West. The party could still have 48-50 senators by just focusing on those voters.

So I think that's the future of the party. It's not something I see The Lincoln Project or us going back to. But I don't think it will just magically go away either.

VAUSE: Thank you for being with, us we appreciate it.

MILLER: Anytime.

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VAUSE: The final presidential debate is scheduled Thursday night in the United States. CNN's official coverage begins at 7 pm Eastern. That's Friday morning around much of the world.

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VAUSE: The former head of the U.S. Food and Drug Administration has warned a rapid acceleration of coronavirus cases may be about a week away. In the past week, 14 states reported their highest number ever for hospital admissions of COVID-19.

All of this is a sign the experts say of a difficult northern winter on the horizon. Here's CNN's Brian Todd with more.

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BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: At this nursing home in northwestern Kansas, an unmitigated disaster. 100 percent of its residents, 62 people, have tested positive for the coronavirus, county health officials say. And 10 residents have died.

DR. LEANA WEN, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: In congregate settings like nursing homes, this is a disease that could spread like wildfire. And this in fact is what we have seen before in nursing homes and tragically what we are seeing in this nursing home in Kansas as well.

TODD: Kansas is one of 31 states trending upward in new coronavirus cases tonight, only one state, Hawaii is dropping and 16 states, nearly a third of the country, are experiencing their highest seven- day averages for new cases since the pandemic began. One expert says the next four or five month's maybe the worst period of the entire pandemic. DR. PETER HOTEZ, PROFESSOR AND DEAN OF TROPICAL MEDICINE, BAYLOR COLLEGE OF MEDICINE: We are at about 70,000 new cases a day. Probably by next week or the week after, we could be looking at a doubling of the number of deaths by the week after the inauguration.

TODD: Dr. Peter Hotez says things will get better by next summer, but that Americans have to get ready for some horrible numbers in the meantime and hang on. In Illinois, one of the states trending up in cases, officials say almost every region in the state has seen an increase in COVID related hospitalizations over the last week. And tighter restrictions on gatherings are coming.

STEVE BRANDY, SPOKESMAN, WILL COUNTY ILLINOIS HEALTH DEPARTMENT: It didn't happen by itself. People are being careless. People are getting cocky. People are thinking it's not going to happen to me. It's over. No, that is all wrong.

TODD: The Williamsburg section of Brooklyn in New York City is not in a so-called red zone of coronavirus hotspots there. But state officials barred a planned gathering in that neighborhood for the wedding of the grandson of an orthodox Jewish rabbi, a gathering where they say up to 10,000 people were expected to attend.

JUDITH HARRISON, ASSISTANT CHIEF, NEW YORK POLICE: We don't want to disrespect anybody. People are allowed to gather, but within reason. We want to make sure that there are no large gatherings in excess of 50 people.

TODD: As communities fight off outbreaks, the race for a vaccine gets more intense. The British government is planning to conduct the first so-called human challenge studies, where healthy volunteers are deliberately infected with the virus and some receive an experimental vaccine.

China says nearly 60,000 people have been injected with experimental vaccines during its phase three clinical trials.

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TODD (voice-over): While in the U.S., the Health and Human Services secretary says officials hope to have enough vaccine by late March or early April to vaccinate everyone in America who wants one. But a leading vaccine expert puts that timetable a bit later.

DR. PAUL OFFIT, CHILDREN'S HOSPITAL OF PHILADELPHIA: Early next year, you will start to see these vaccines rolling out to the highest risk group's first. And then by the middle of next year, the end of next year, hopefully we will then be getting more to the general public.

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VAUSE: Our thanks to Brian Todd there.

British prime minister Boris Johnson is imposing tough coronavirus restrictions in parts of northern England. This move comes after talks stalled on financial aid for the Greater Manchester region. The mayor wanted more financial aid to get through another lockdown, more than the government was willing to give.

Dominic Thomas spoke about whether the communities will just ignore these new restrictions being imposed by Westminster.

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DOMINIC THOMAS, CNN EUROPEAN AFFAIRS COMMENTATOR: We've seen all sorts of signs, on the other end of the political spectrum. It has to be with rights issues and wearing masks and so on and so forth.

But I think what we have here is once again, as I mentioned, you know 7 months plus being into this particular crisis, is essentially people frustrated with the lack of any real kind of coordinated government plan.

People are finding themselves with very little choice but to go to work. And they are unable to go back into lockdown. And I think, out of this particular failed negotiation and the imposition of tier 3 level on the Greater Manchester areas, I think we're likely to see examples of sheer civil disobedience, a lack of respect for the rules that are put in place. Not so much because people want to defy their government but because they are being left with very little option but to fight back in this particular way, without adequate government support, to keep these businesses going and to keep the people with proper safety nets.

VAUSE: How much of this is being driven by old animosity in the north country towards Westminster?

THOMAS: You know, John, it's probably not just even the north. I think the people who don't live in the southern part of England, if they're in Northern Ireland and Wales, Scotland, they feel this as well.

But it's clear that there is a long-standing animosity and Andy Burnham, as an MP, a member of the cabinet in the Labour Party, was very outspoken about these kinds of discrepancies that existed between the ways in which the north was treated by Westminster.

But I think the COVID has further exacerbated those tensions. And what we see here, is a mayor standing up for his city, who is 7 months into the COVID crisis, is struggling and cannot simply go through another round of lockdowns or tier 3 like levels, on businesses, without there being the proper safety nets from the government.

So I think that's as much of a factor, as it is to be positioned in some kind of longer historical track record as well.

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VAUSE: Boris Johnston is taking a localized approach on virus hotspots. Instead of ordering another nationwide lockdown.

Desperate times, desperate measures. One vaccine maker is about to begin challenge trials. A risky move will see volunteers exposed directly to the virus.

CNN's Becky Anderson spoke with the chief scientist for the company leading this trial.

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ANDREW CATCHPOLE, CHIEF SCIENTIFIC OFFICER, HVIVO: The main risk for any clinical trial are that the disease progresses further than we anticipate which is why we're doing a number of factors to minimize those risks.

Firstly, having an extremely low dose of virus, and then we're using only subjects which have minimal risk or no known risk factors to the disease as well as also using antiviral as a preemptive measure to further minimize the risk severe disease.

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VAUSE: We will have more on the human challenge trial later in the hour.

Meantime, across, Europe the number of fatalities also soaring. Leaders are reimposing closures, lockdowns and curfews. Ireland reported 13 deaths on Tuesday. The government is moving to the highest level of restrictions for the next 6 weeks, banning social gatherings in private homes.

Italy's Campagna region, home to Naples, will impose a curfew on Friday. The Lombardy region, once an epicenter of the outbreak, will see a new curfew on Thursday. CNN's Scott McLean is standing by with more on the situation across Europe. He is live in Berlin.

A rainy day there but what's the latest on these countries that seem to have everything under control and then they don't?

SCOTT MCLEAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: They have everything under control until they don't. Europe is throwing everything at this virus except the kitchen sink. The kitchen sink is full scale lockdowns and stay at home orders to the same degree that we saw in the spring.

The ones in the places we are seeing them are not nearly as strict as they were in the past.

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MCLEAN: Here in Germany, they are trying to target the virus hotspots. In Berlin, bars have to close early and there's limits on social gatherings. Those are familiar themes across the continent.

Once exception, a vacation spot in the mountains near the Austrian border, beginning yesterday a 2 week mandatory stay-at-home order but there's exceptions for work and essentials.

This graph illustrates the scale of the problem in Europe. You can see the second wave of the virus is really showing no signs of slowing. Some countries doing much worse, Netherlands and so is Belgium as

well, where the health minister called the number of new cases a tsunami. The Czech Republic has not only more new cases per capita than any other major country in Europe but on Earth.

But when you look at the number of deaths, you can perhaps see why there is hesitancy on the part of governments to impose the kind of draconian lockdowns we saw earlier on in the spring.

In the Czech Republic, they are bringing back an old policy today, one that requires you to wear a mask everywhere outside your home. The policy is nearly as strict as the one they had in the spring that made them so, so successful in tamping down the first wave of the virus.

But this is a big reversal. Despite the success in the spring, the government had resisted bringing back that policy because it wasn't terribly popular, even though it was quite effective. Here is what some people in Prague said about the mask rule yesterday.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The epidemic was contained with face masks. I think it makes sense to have the new measures.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Masks are important. It's coming a little too late.

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MCLEAN: With the health system in the Czech Republic starting to near its capacity, the government has started setting up a field hospital in Prague. The health minister told me last week they may need that that bed space as early as the end of the month.

He also told me last week that he expects the situation there to get worse until at least the end of October or the beginning of November. After, that it's a question mark. The mask mandate really worked well for them in the spring and set them apart from other European neighbors. They are crossing their fingers it will work again.

VAUSE: I guess that's a strategy at this point. Scott McLean, thank you in Berlin.

Cathay Pacific is the latest airline carrier to eliminate jobs because of the pandemic, 8,500 positions worldwide, cost cutting means an end to regional carrier Cathay Dragon. The outlook is bleak for next. Year the carrier is expected to operate well under passenger capacity.

China is starting phase 3 trials of four coronavirus vaccines with no serious issues so far. That's what they say. But even for those who qualify, they will have to find it first. That won't be easy.

Also thousands turnout to protest against police brutality in Nigeria. Witnesses say soldiers opened fire on demonstrators as night fell.

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VAUSE: In Lagos, Nigeria, protests against police brutality turned violent as eyewitnesses say soldiers opened fire on demonstrators.

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VAUSE (voice-over): Witnesses tell CNN multiple people were shot and gunfire lasted for at least 15 up to 30 minutes. CNN's Eleni Giokos is live in Johannesburg.

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VAUSE: What's the very latest that we have on the unrest there?

There was a curfew put in place on Tuesday to be a circuit breaker, to bring the unrest at least to a temporary end.

ELENI GIOKOS, CNNMONEY CORRESPONDENT: Exactly. When the curfew was announced yesterday, around 4 pm, people had already gathered at the Lekki toll gate. This is basically ground zero where the peaceful demonstrators had started around 2 weeks ago.

Then it spread throughout the country. Then you started to see localized violence playing out in certain parts of the country. The government has talked about private sectors as well as government buildings are vandalized.

That's why they decided on the curfew. What ensued yesterday at Lekki toll gate is harrowing experiences. We've spoken to so many eyewitnesses, talking about CCTV cameras being removed from the toll gate and lights being turned off.

After dark, that's when the national security forces opened fire to out witnesses say was a peaceful protest. Demonstrators are shot at and one witness was talking about bodies lying on the ground.

We are monitoring Instagram live broadcast yesterday by one Nigerian celebrity, DJ Switch. You saw pleas by the demonstrators to stop the shooting, asking for medical assistance. But they were barricaded in and ambulances were not able to enter the space.

The overall End SARS (ph) campaign started a few weeks ago. It was a fight against police brutality, harassment and kidnapping. The unit has been disbanded by the Nigerian government earlier in October but demonstrators say it is not enough. More needs to be done and people need to be prosecuted.

When we started to see the actual protests spreading throughout Nigeria, many say it's been a symptom of an overarching problem of disgruntled and upset and angry youth that aren't able to get jobs and a big problem of unemployment. I've had so many phone calls from friends and executives, business

people that I work with in Nigeria. They are angry and disappointed and scared and traumatized. The latest incident we saw playing out on Tuesday night in Lagos could be an important turning point, especially the news of probable fatalities at Amnesty International.

We will be hearing from the government later today. The big message from the government will be a vital one in terms of trying to allay fears of more police force and brutality.

But this is the very thing that protesters were fighting against. And just the scenes, the images, the sounds of ammunition that came through for 15-30 minutes, just show the Nigerian government is wanting to deal with protesters in a very aggressive way.

What's going to be interesting is to actually see how protesters will be able to be responding in the next couple of days.

VAUSE: Yes, 21 million people in the state under curfew. That's almost the size of Australia. It's a huge curfew. Eleni Giokos, thank you from Johannesburg.

The number of coronavirus cases worldwide has surged past 40 million. But for the first time in three months, India has recorded fewer than 50,000 daily infection. The country still has the second highest case count worldwide after the U.S.

Health experts say COVID-19 combined with rising levels of toxic air pollution in India means masks are more essential than ever.

Iraq is reported its highest ever daily number of new infections, more than 5,000 on Tuesday. Wearing masks in public has been mandatory in Tehran for the past week.

China reports about 60,000 people have received COVID-19 vaccines as part of phase 3 trials with no seniors reactions. One of four vaccines in phase 3 was available on a limited basis in one city in China over the weekend. CNN's David Culver with this report.

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DAVID CULVER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): They arrived early from all over China, folks lured to the international manufacturing hub of Yiwu city, specifically to this small community hospital.

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CULVER (voice-over): This is one of the first public locations where China's rolled out an experimental COVID-19 vaccine.

They began injecting people over the weekend. The cost, about $60 U.S. for two doses. Word spread quickly; some showed up Monday thinking they'd get a shot. Annie Koo (ph) among them.

"This is something really important to you, isn't it?" I asked her.

"Yes," she replied, adding, "because, well, if you have the vaccine, it's much safer to leave the country."

For more than 20 years, she has worked in import-export in Chile (ph) and returned home to China amidst the outbreak. She flew to Yiwu the night before we met her. It's a two-hour flight from her home in southern China, eager and admittedly a bit desperate for immunity.

CULVER: So they told you they don't have any and you have to find another place?

CULVER (voice-over): Hospital staff confirmed to CNN that they had run out. Local officials later announced this distribution was only for those with specific foreign travel needs and preapproval.

She was not the only one disappointed. Notice the groups of people waiting around the hospital parking lot, some of them of traveling in from neighboring provinces, wanting the vaccine.

CULVER: Would you take the vaccine?

CULVER (voice-over): Originally from Syria, we met this man as he pulled up with his young daughter and wife in the back seat of their car. He was curious, if not also a bit hesitant.

CULVER: If you were to walk in there and they had it, would you take it today?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Actually, I don't know. I don't have answer.

CULVER: As you can go into the main entrance here, we know folks are going in to inquire how they might be part of this trial. You've got to remember, this is part of the emergency approval use granted by the Chinese government. This is not the actual release of an approved drug as of yet.

CULVER (voice-over): The vaccine distributed is made by Sinovac Biotech. CNN took you through the Beijing base in August. It's more than one of a dozen Chinese companies working on a coronavirus vaccine.

At the time of our visit in late summer, they were constructing a new facility to meet the production demands while still going through phase 3 clinical trials, which have not yet concluded. It all seemed to be happening at rapid speeds.

HELEN YANG, SINOVAC BIOTECH: None of the staff is sacrificing any quality of our vaccine. So because Sinovac's goal is to provide a vaccine with good quality, good safety, good immunogenicity to the people in the world.

CULVER (voice-over): China's been trying to push past the early allegations of mishandling, cover-ups and silencing of whistleblowers surrounding the initial outbreak in Wuhan.

Instead, officials here have highlighted their swift and seemingly successful responses to many cluster outbreaks, the most recent in Qingdao last week, following a major travel holiday. After only a handful of confirmed cases surfaced, health officials began contact tracing and tested more than 10 million people in less than a week.

And life, it seems, quickly returned to near normal again. But that's mostly within China, a bubble of sorts; for some whose livelihood is rooted in other parts the world where cases are surging once again, their only hope may be the vaccine.

Annie Koo (ph) and the others now on to the next location to track one down -- David Culver, CNN, China.

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VAUSE: Still to, come British scientists looking for volunteers for COVID-19 vaccine trials. In this one, the applicants must be ready to be infected with the deadly virus. Details on challenge trials in a moment.

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VAUSE: Thank you for staying with us. You are watching CNN NEWSROOM. I'm John Vause.

One vaccine maker in the U.K. is planning what's known as human challenge trials. They differ significantly from regular human trials by exposing volunteers directly to the coronavirus. Despite the risks, volunteers seem more than eager to sign up. Here is CNN's Phil Black.

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PHIL BLACK, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Alastair Fraser-Urquhart desperately wants to be infected with the coronavirus.

ALASTAIR FRASER-URQUHART, CHALLENGE TRIAL VOLUNTEER: I've just got an email.

BLACK (voice-over): He's part of the campaign group One Day Sooner. It's been busy recruiting COVID-willing volunteers, so far tens of thousands around the world, and lobbying the U.K. government to use them for potentially risky research.

FRASER-URQUHART: I wake up thinking about challenge trials and I go back to bed thinking about challenge trials.

BLACK (voice-over): Challenge trials involve giving healthy people a potential vaccine like this one developed by London's Imperial College, then later testing it by deliberately dosing them with the virus.

FRASER-URQUHART: By taking that small risk on myself, I can potentially protect thousands of other people from having to be infected without consenting to it. BLACK (voice-over): Advocates say challenge trials are more efficient than the usual method, waiting for large numbers of test subjects to be exposed to a specific virus in the real world. With numerous COVID- 19 vaccines being developed, some scientists believe challenge trials could help them to identify the best of them sooner.

DR. MARTIN JOHNSON, SENIOR MEDICAL DIRECTOR, HVIVO: At the moment, the government is having to buy at risk lots of different vaccines, hoping one is going to work.

BLACK (voice-over): Dr. Martin Johnson works for hVIVO, the testing company hired by the British government to set up challenge trials for three possible vaccines. Its London facility has years of experience running similar programs with influenza and other viruses.

But working with this new coronavirus is far riskier. The trials will be conducted at London's Royal Free Hospital, which has the U.K.'s only category 3 biocontainment ward. And the first round of volunteers will be exposed to the virus without getting a vaccine.

JOHNSON: We're basically watching disease in motion, right from the very start of the inoculation, right through to the disease going out of the body. So it gives us an absolute view of what is happening to the human body during an infectious process.

BLACK (voice-over): The company says challenge trials can be conducted safely because treatments are now available, like the antiviral, remdesivir, and the steroid, dexamethasone.

But the World Health Organization recently found remdesivir doesn't appear to save COVID-19 patients' lives or help them recover sooner. And the data on dexamethasone is still early and limited. The ethics of the trials will be closely scrutinized. England's regulator will have to be convinced the risk is worth the potential reward.

TERENCE STEPHENSON, ENGLAND'S HEALTH RESEARCH AUTHORITY: A challenge trial would have to make the cogent argument that the benefits to society greatly outweigh the risk and that that evidence of those data could be achieved in a simpler or safer way.

BLACK (voice-over): Volunteers will be strictly screened to include known risk factors. So those selected must fit a limited profile. They will have to be young and very healthy. Alistair hopes he's in with a chance.

FRASER-URQUHART: If ever it's a time to push the boundaries and discover how quickly we can do stuff and how well we can do stuff, to take on risks for other people is now.

BLACK (voice-over): Phil Black, CNN, London.

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VAUSE: Dr. Shoshana Ungerleider is an internal medicine specialist and is founder of endwellproject.org, with us this hour from San Francisco.

Good to see you. Thank you for being with us again.

DR. SHOSHANA UNGERLEIDER, CALIFORNIA PACIFIC MEDICAL CENTER: Thank you for having me.

VAUSE: Right now, the WHO has 44 human trials around the way in 16 different countries. These are considered viable. It's a slow process, we are always told it's the slowest part of approval for a vaccine.

Is there a way of qualifying if these are human challenge trials how much quicker this entire process would be?

UNGERLEIDER: That's a great question. It's hard to say because we truly are in unprecedented. Territory the amount of work being done worldwide to find a viable vaccine for the novel coronavirus is really unprecedented.

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UNGERLEIDER: What I can tell you is if a vaccine candidate emerges, most likely it will consist of 2 shots spaced 2-3 weeks apart and, at the earliest, I suspect widespread availability of a vaccine that we are all waiting for and hoping for won't happen until the middle of next year.

It's important that in the absence of challenge trials that phase 3 trials get completed to determine safety and efficacy of a vaccine. They absolutely must take the process slowly and uphold the highest levels of scientific rigor and not be swayed by political or economic pressure.

VAUSE: How could volunteers possibly know all the risks?

Each day there is new revelations about how harmful the virus can be and the dangers to long term health, prognosis for those who have had it. At this, point no one knows all the risks.

UNGERLEIDER: That's absolutely right. Historically, human challenge trials have been used to provide insights into other diseases like influenza and malaria. In the case of COVID-19, we do have more treatments for patients that become seriously ill.

However, the fact remains, we don't yet have an approved drug that is a cure. If you are infecting healthy people with a potentially deadly virus, you need to think very, very hard about the ethical questions and be as certain as you can that they are informed and in consent. This is largely uncharted territory here.

VAUSE: Dr. Shoshana Ungerleider, we are at a time. But thank you so much. We appreciate you being with us.

UNGERLEIDER: Thank you.

VAUSE: The Trump administration has Google in its legal sights. Coming, up we will look at the Justice Department's biggest antitrust case in decades.

Also, the airline industry hoping a new app might just get more people back on planes and into the skies and traveling. Details on that also in a moment.

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VAUSE: The Trump administration is taking on Google in the largest antitrust case against a tech company in over 2 decades. In the lawsuit, the Justice Department thinks Google has stifled competition in online search and search advertising.

One example they give is Google's practice of paying billions of dollars to be a default search engine on smartphones. More from CNN technology reporter Brian Fung.

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BRIAN FUNG, CNN TECH REPORTER: What the DOJ is alleging is that Google controls 80 percent of the search market in the United States and it's using its power to hurt rivals and damage competition.

Now, DOJ's deputy attorney general, Jeffrey Rosen, said nothing is off the table in terms of what types of remedies the DOJ is seeking here, which could include a break-up of Google.

And Google, for its part, says -- and let me just read you a quick statement here that they just put out -- that, "Today's lawsuit by the Department of Justice is deeply flawed. People use Google because they choose to, not because they're forced to or because they can't find alternatives. We will have a full statement this morning."

Now obviously, this litigation comes days before a pivotal election in which tech companies including Google have been criticized for their role in, you know, affecting democracy.

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FUNG: And this case could, you know, have dramatic implications not just for Google but also for the rest of the tech industry and the economy at large.

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VAUSE: Well, Google says the lawsuit is deeply flawed, adding that the Search engine is popular because people want to use it, not because anybody is forced to.

Well, for the latest on the story, visit our website at cnn.com.

A new app could make flying easier amid the coronavirus pandemic. The app called CommonPass says if someone tested negative for the virus on arrival at their destination. A transatlantic flight which lands in Newark, New Jersey, later on Wednesday will see the app in action for the first time. More now from CNN's Anna Stewart.

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ANNA STEWART, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The world is a patchwork of travel restrictions. Closed borders, quarantines, pretravel testing requirements, all of which keep changing.

STEWART: It is enough to put people off travel altogether and that is damaging to the aviation sector, for tourism, for the whole global economy. However, one solution to travel could be a passport, not this kind but this, a digital health passport.

STEWART (voice-over): The app is being developed by the Commons Project Foundation in partnership with the World Economic Forum. The concept is simple enough: a traveler checks the app to see what the COVID-19 rules are at their destination. For example, it might require a PCR test 24 hours before travel.

The app tells them where they could get a government approved COVID-19 test and upload that test result to the app. If negative, the app generates a QR code, confirming the traveler's compliance to be scanned by airline staff and border officials.

However, testing prior to travel has its limitations.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The moment that person is safe to fly on the way to wherever they are, if it's PCR negative, it might be meaningless if they were about to turn PCR positive 5 minutes after the test.

STEWART (voice-over): CommonPass says the screening minimizes the risk, it is already a requirement for entry into many countries. A trial of their app is underway for volunteer passengers, flying with United Airlines and Cathay Pacific, between London, New York, Hong Kong and Singapore.

If it goes well, CommonPass hopes more airlines and airports will use this in the future.

PAUL MEYER, CEO, THE COMMONS PROJECT: We have actually managed to convene over 50 countries that have come together through dialogue that led up to CommonPass, most of the world's biggest airlines, most of the world's biggest airports.

I think one of the realizations they've come to, through these discussions, is this kind of system has to work in a globally (ph) operable way. It can't only work within one bubble or with one travel corridor.

STEWART (voice-over): If a COVID-19 vaccine is successfully developed, CommonPass hopes travelers will be able to log their vaccination into the app. Yes, there are concerns that too little is known about vaccine efficacy. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I would not feel comfortable, as a sort of

minister of health, to be stamping, sealing the legislation on these immunity passports (INAUDIBLE).

STEWART (voice-over): Immunity passports are pie in the sky, at least for now, helping people to take to the skies with an app that simplifies and coordinates COVID-19 travel restrictions is at least on the horizon -- Anna Stewart, CNN, London.

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Thank you for watching CNN NEWSROOM, I'm John Vause. Please stay with us for "WORLD SPORT" after the break.