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Interview with former director of National Geospatial- Intelligence Agency Robert Cardillo; Interview with Bismarck-Burleigh Public Health Director Renae Moch; Tiger Woods Repeats Best First Round at Masters. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired November 13, 2020 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[10:32:01]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: A group of election officials including some from the Trump administration are calling the November 3rd election, quote, "The most secure in American history." These are people from the Department of Homeland Security.

Meanwhile, more than 150 former national security senior military and elected officials say that delaying President-elect Biden's access to the presidential daily intelligence briefing could result in serious national security damage.

Joining me now to talk about this is Robert Cardillo, he's the former director of the National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency, also briefed Presidents Obama and Trump himself. Mr. Cardillo, thanks so much for joining us again.

ROBERT CARDILLO, FORMER DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL GEOSPATIAL-INTELLIGENCE AGENCY: Good morning, Jim.

SCIUTTO: All right, so for folks at home who don't know, the PDB -- as it's known -- includes intelligence on some of the greatest threats to U.S. national security. In your view and your experience, does preventing access to this to the president-elect make this country less safe?

CARDILLO: Jim, quite frankly, it does. And it does it really in two ways. In one way, you know, we've got a rich history and tradition of peaceful transition in this country over 200 years. And it's important that the incoming president have not just access to but get awareness of what activities he will be soon in charge of. And you can't do that overnight, that's why we need this time for him to get more prepared.

And then the other challenge is, is that the rest of the world is watching. And we don't want to give an adversary any indication that there's a gap in awareness and understanding, and that gap could lead to them making a miscalculation. So I worry about it on both fronts.

SCIUTTO: Where do you look right now with the most concern about that possibility? Transition periods always are nervous periods, but this one more so because of exactly what you described there. Is there a particular country or threat that you're watching most closely right now?

CARDILLO: You know, it is the usual suspects. I guess I would categorize the near-peer, the China and Russia threat as maybe a little less worrisome because I think that they'll have enough experience here, they'll appreciate the president-elect's experience and understanding as well. And so I'm less worried there.

But it is perhaps a state with less maturity and less, you know, thoughtful approaches to the world. So North Korea could be looking to test us and our resolve in this period, and that does worry me greatly.

SCIUTTO: You have many decades in intelligence. For folks at home who don't know, they might not have heard of the NGA but these are the folks who built a model based on satellite imagery of the Bin Laden compound, helped identify that that's who was there and helped make that whole raid happen.

[10:35:02]

But you watch intelligence around the world. Countries try to damage America by damaging its democratic process -- we saw that in 2016. What damage does it do in this cycle for the disinformation about the election to be coming from inside the country? In other words, Americans damaging it themselves.

CARDILLO: Now, it's more worrisome. As you said, Jim, you know, it's part of the equation in which adversaries will seek to undermine us and to make us less certain about our government and our institutions. And to have them question from within certainly adds to that purpose. It creates the uncertainty that undermines the confidence that people have in their government.

And we should remember that, you know, this thing, this democracy we have is fragile and it's only as strong as the belief the governed have in their government. And I just worry about what damage we're doing long-term -- not just for this election and this transition, but long-term -- to that confidence.

SCIUTTO: The president is taking the rare, really unprecedented step of gutting the leadership in the Department of Defense during the transition now, and there's a lot of concern as to what he's setting up for including accelerated withdrawals from a place like Afghanistan, Syria, et cetera. But also, a fight to release highly classified intelligence about Russia's interference in 2016.

From your chair, your experience, what are the dangers of doing that?

CARDILLO: Well, my worry is that he's putting into position some people with little experience in the challenges that we've just been discussing. And while there are many, many patriotic Americans still serving, any weakness, you know, causes me some concern.

And so I guess it's that chain of command that you want to be rock solid, and I do worry about it just because of so many changes in such a short period of time.

SCIUTTO: Your name has been floated about joining a Biden administration. If asked, would you serve?

CARDILLO: Well, Jim, I haven't been asked and I've had the privilege of serving for almost four decades, it's in my DNA.

Right now, what I do know -- so I don't know what's ahead, but what I do know is I'm just happy right now for the country and the position it's in. I'm relieved for our allies, and I'm heartened for our democracy as we work through this challenging time, but I'm very optimistic that we will get to the other side and we will be better for it.

SCIUTTO: Robert Cardillo, thanks for joining and thanks for your service as well, often done by intelligence professionals like yourself, very much in the dark. So we appreciate it.

CARDILLO: Thank you.

[10:38:04]

SCIUTTO: Well, COVID-19 deaths have more than doubled in the state of North Dakota in just the last month, hospitals overwhelmed by a huge new wave of coronavirus patients. Coming up, we're going to speak with a public health official who says the state's focus on personal responsibility just isn't cutting it.

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SCIUTTO: Across the U.S., public health systems straining under the weight of new coronavirus infections -- a wave of them -- and smaller communities in particular.

Our next guest writes, "In North Dakota, infections are, alarmingly, occurring at more than six times the national rate. How is the disease spreading so quickly through a small, rural state? And what lessons can North Dakota offer as we head into a winter season that Anthony Fauci, the country's leading infectious disease expert, has warned will bring 'a whole lot of hurt'?"

Joining me now is Renae Moch, the public health director for the city of Bismarck and Burleigh County, North Dakota.

So good to have you on, Renae, and we appreciate what you're going through there. This week, the governor of your state, Doug Burgum, announced that hospitals were so strained, health care workers with the virus would be allowed to continue working even in the midst of a positive test. What's your reaction to that?

RENAE MOCH, DIRECTOR, BISMARCK-BURLEIGH PUBLIC HEALTH: So my initial reaction is, there are so many more mitigation measures that could have been implemented first before we went to the last resort, critical measure of having our health care staff come to work when they are positive, even though they're asymptomatic, to treat COVID-19 patients. So yes, was a little disappointed to see that. SCIUTTO: OK, all right. So what do you need -- well first of all,

describe the situation there, just how strained. Because you know, early on, you heard this a lot, well, this is just a big-city problem. Clearly it is not, because it's sweeping through those northern Midwestern states and elsewhere. What exactly are you seeing on the ground?

MOCH: So as you said, a rural state, you wouldn't think would be spreading this rapidly. But I think a lot that has contributed to that is there has been no enforcement of mitigation measures statewide. And so here at the local level, we're trying to do what we can in our cities to make a difference in our numbers.

We're seeing positive cases, we're doing tests, local public health is doing tests and a lot of them are coming out positive, there's more demand for tests, our hospitals are at the surge, they're implementing their surge plans right now and we're just really in a critical situation at this point here in North Dakota.

SCIUTTO: So you've got a particular problem there, right? Because sadly, a lot of these measures have become political even though they are backed by science, simple things like mask-wearing. How do you convince folks there who say, oh, this is overdone, I believe the president, it's a hoax, you know, it's a matter of personal freedom not to wear a mask. What conversations do you have with them to protect themselves and their families?

[10:45:22]

MOCH: So that's been an ongoing challenge for us here in local public health and across the entire state of North Dakota, is to get people to understand the severity and to do the right thing.

As far as our mitigation measures go, they haven't changed since the beginning. A lot of the messaging has been focused on personal responsibility and doing the right thing, and we gave that a try. We tried to do that, gave the people the opportunity, did public education, trying to work with people to understand this is the right thing to do and this is where we are, unfortunately, with our numbers and the worst-case scenario that could possibly be at this point.

SCIUTTO: In a little over two months, there will be a new president and this -- President-elect Biden has said that responding to COVID's his number one job when he takes office. If you had a moment with the president-elect, what would you ask for? What would you want to see from him?

MOCH: I would really like to see federal mitigation measures that are adopted across the entire nation. We're all feeling the impacts right now and for us to be able to follow a federal plan would be ideal. It would allow us a strategy, and have the same comprehensive plan across our entire state and we can work with other states as well -- I know all of them around us are experiencing a surge right now.

SCIUTTO: So what in that plan in particular? National mask mandate, testing protocol? MOCH: A national mask mandate would be ideal, that's the first line

of defense when you're out in the public and trying to keep moving forward with normal life. Also, I know a big thing right now -- and we're struggling with here in North Dakota -- is the large gatherings and events, and looking at bringing a lot of people together, and that's been a big factor for us too.

SCIUTTO: Finally before I let you go, do you find that you can change minds? I mean, we're in such an atmosphere now where folks are just so locked into their views, whatever it is, including on the virus, even as the facts change, right? Even as the virus comes in like a wave, like you're seeing there where you are. Do people change their minds when they see this about how serious this is?

MOCH: So I know that some have changed their minds, where they may have not thought that it was that serious, but they now have loved ones or friends or family members that are turning positive and have gone through some real severe situations.

And I think once people are experiencing that personal impact where it's happening to them, we're starting to see additional support and mitigation follow-up with our public because they're seeing it happen to their friends and family.

SCIUTTO: Well, Renae, we know you've got a lot on your plate. We do wish you, we wish the people around there the best of luck, going forward.

MOCH: Thank you very much.

[10:48:04]

SCIUTTO: Coming up, because of coronavirus, golf's springtime tradition is going on now in November. We'll have an update.

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SCIUTTO: Well, it's the middle of the morning in November, and because of the coronavirus and Mother Nature, the second round of the Masters Golf Tournament is just starting now, complete with the Tiger Woods we can all expect. Any Scholes joins us now from Augusta with this morning's "Bleacher Report." Woods on the leader board?

ANDY SCHOLES, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Jim, Tiger, tying his best first round ever here at the Masters, that was probably the big story from day one. Other than the weather.

I mean, the weather to start off the tournament was just awful, we had some big thunderstorms come through, caused a three-hour delay. That caused a lot of the players to have to go out here this morning to finish their first round. They did that, we are now at round number two but the weather looks like it's going to be beautiful the rest of the weekend here in Augusta.

And Tiger Woods is in contention. He tied his best first round ever, shooting four under yesterday. It was his first bogey-free round in a major since 2009. Tiger, three shots off the lead. And he said after his round that you know, this November Masters, it certainly has a much different feel than the one he won 19 months ago.

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TIGER WOODS, FIVE-TIME MASTERS CHAMPION: No patrons, no roars, no -- we asked a few of the camera guys today where the ball end (ph) up because we just didn't know. So that's very different.

A lot of firsts today, and you know, that's just kind of the way this entire year has been, and the fact that we're able to compete for a Masters this year, considering all that's been going on, it's a great opportunity for all of us.

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SCHOLES: All right, here's a look at the leader board as round two is now under way. Thirty-year-old South African Dylan Frittelli and the world number-one, Dustin Johnson, this morning both joining Paul Casey on top of that leader board.

Johnson, it was his first bogey-free round ever at the Masters, so lots of people in contention right now, 53 players shooting under par in round one, which was a record for the Masters.

All right, elsewhere in the sports world, the Ivy League is the first Division I conference this year to cancel all winter sports including men's and women's basketball. The Ivy League has certainly been proactive in the fight against coronavirus. It was the first conference to fall off its post-season basketball tournament last March, then many of the other conferences of course followed suit.

[10:55:07]

But back here in Augusta, Tiger Woods will tee off for his second round at 2:30 Eastern. And, Jim, you know, this is the first November Masters, so for the first time ever, they're dealing with it getting dark early. So Tiger teeing off at 2:30 certainly not going to be able to finish his second round, so the second round, it's going to have to be completed Saturday morning, similar to the situation we dealt with here this morning.

SCIUTTO: Well, maybe we go into Monday. I know you'll be there, Andy Scholes, thanks very much.

SCHOLES: All right.

SCIUTTO: And thanks so much to all of you for joining us today on this Friday. I'm Jim Sciutto, NEWSROOM with John King will start right after a short break.

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