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COVID-19 Cases Spiking; New York City Schools Close Amid Coronavirus Spike. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired November 18, 2020 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:00]

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN HOST: All right, we will take it.

I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thank you so much for being with me. You're watching CNN.

He may be on his way out, and we may not be seeing very much of him these days, but the president is not going quietly, and he's not doing anything about the pandemic or ensuring a peaceful transition of power.

And, yes, he is still fighting the election results, as president- elect Biden's lead in the popular vote continues to grow.

And President Trump's actions seem to include firing anyone who disagrees with him, the latest today, a senior Homeland Security official who refuted his unfounded claims of voter fraud.

I'm talking about Chris Krebs. He is out of a job today, much like the president come January. And as the chaos ensues at the White House, president-elect Joe Biden is full steam ahead and gearing up for the most pressing battle at hand, defeating this deadly pandemic.

In fact, right now, the United States is facing unfathomable coronavirus numbers. We saw the most deaths in a single day in six months just yesterday, with new daily infections climbing above 140,000.

And this is huge, huge for people here in New York City. Breaking moments ago, New York City schools, the largest school district in the entire country, with more than one million students, will close, effective tomorrow.

Let's start there.

CNN's Alexandra Field is following the New York City school closures. She is live for us.

And so we know Mayor de Blasio just dropped the news. And this is effective immediately, Alex. ALEXANDRA FIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Immediately, Brooke.

And, look, this is a big step back for New York City, which had really beat back from such a difficult spring. The reason this is happening, the city has hit a 3 percent positivity rate. That is high enough to trigger alarm in the city. But it is a relatively low number, compared to what we are seeing nationwide. Take a look at the rest of the country. And we are moving alarmingly in the wrong direction by nearly every measure.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FIELD (voice-over): We were warned it would get this bad and that will get even worse, the daily death toll on Tuesday at its highest number since May, 1,707 lives lost, and six states reporting their highest number of deaths in a single day.

DR. JONATHAN REINER, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: If you're alarmed at the 1,700 deaths today, two to three weeks from now, we're going to see 3,000 deaths a day.

FIELD: The nation now standing on the precipice of a quarter-million deaths. Demand for tests is fueling long lines from Massachusetts all the way to Illinois. Hospitals are dealing daily with record-setting numbers.

Scotland County Hospital in Memphis, Missouri, is so stretched by COVID cases, it's willing to accept volunteers with health care experience.

DR. JEFF DAVIS, SCOTLAND COUNTY HOSPITAL: We could use any kind of caregiving aide, like a CNA, or you even can have nursing aides volunteer, work in the hospital.

FIELD: Some states upping the fight with new restrictions. People in Michigan stocked up for the three-week pause that starts today. Oregon is implementing a two-week freeze. Ohio will have a curfew. And Illinois' measures fall just short of a shutdown.

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, NIAID DIRECTOR: We need some fundamental public health measures that everyone should be adhering to, not a disjointed, one state says one thing, the other state says another thing.

FIELD: Like the two Dakotas taking vastly different approaches to skyrocketing cases, in North Dakota, a governor reversing course over the weekend on masks, now mandating them, in South Dakota, a governor still choosing not to take action.

GOV. KRISTI NOEM (R-SD): I have consistently said that people that want to wear masks should wear masks, and people who don't shouldn't be shamed because they choose not to.

FIELD: In some of the darkest hours of the pandemic, the promise of vaccines now fueling the most hope, Pfizer and BioNTech today announcing that its vaccine is 95 percent effective, that there are no serious safety concerns, and that they will seek emergency use authorization from the FDA on Friday.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FIELD: The question on everyone's minds, of course, how quickly could that vaccine be made available?

Well, that authorization could come by December 10. We're learning that distribution, at least for the most vulnerable among us, could begin pretty rapidly after that. But we know it's going to take a while to ramp that up, Brooke. This would be just a start.

BALDWIN: It will. It will.

Alex, thank you.

I want to stay on vaccines here. And the question, as she just pointed out, when should we expect these vaccines to be available to reach Americans?

Let's go to our chief medical correspondent, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, who's with me now.

And so, Sanjay Gupta. I got a few questions for you on this, just starting with what -- you're going through all the data. What does the data tell us exactly?

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, it's really important to see what the data tells us, what it doesn't tell us as well.

It basically -- if you look at the numbers, you had tens of thousands of people receive a placebo, tens of thousands of people receive the vaccine. And they basically followed them, Brooke; 170 people developed symptoms.

They have looked at these 170 people and found the vast majority, as you can see there, were in people who had received the placebo, 162 versus eight in the vaccine group.

[15:05:08]

And, also, if you can read at the bottom there, Brooke, of the people who had the most severe illness, nine of them were in the placebo group vs. one in the vaccine group.

So, what can you say? You can say that this vaccine appears, this data coming from the company, after it's validated, this vaccine appears to prevent illness, mild, moderate, and severe illness in those who receive it.

We don't know how well it actually prevents infection. We don't know how well it prevents transmissibility. Those are all still questions that still need to be answered.

BALDWIN: So, just with all of that in mind, when should we expect the vaccine to be available? GUPTA: I think Alex -- Alexandra of got it right. I mean, the --

we're hearing that there's going to be an emergency use authorization application that's done on Friday, two days from now. That's pretty extraordinary.

And then, probably in the next couple of weeks with after that, they will make the decision. If all this data is true, it sounds like it's a favorable decision, because the safety data and the effectiveness data looks good.

And then, after that, there's another committee that meets, Brooke, lots of committees, and that committee basically decides who gets it, when do they get it, sort of creates the vaccine schedule.

That all goes -- I mean, I'm talking, before Christmas, you could start to see the first people ever outside of a clinical trial receive this vaccine.

BALDWIN: Wow.

I don't care how many committees need to have a committee to have a committee. I want them to make a decision, because I know a lot of people want to get their hands on this vaccine.

But when you look at the polling on who's willing to take the vaccine, there's a new Gallup poll says four in 10 Americans, four in 10 remain unwilling to get this thing. What do you do about those people?

GUPTA: Well, I'd be curious, Brooke, polling vs. what ends up being the reality.

I mean, it was higher earlier in the spring, the willingness. Then it dropped really low. I mean, there's been some erosion of trust of the FDA. I think that there's -- that trust is going to have to be regained.

I can tell you, having reported on this for so long, there is an independent body that sort of decides whether this vaccine is going to be safe and effective. And there's lots of different checks and balances here. So I think if it gets to that point of authorization, it's going to be a safe, effective vaccine.

Ultimately, it only works for a society, for the world as a whole if enough people take it. And we're talking 60 to 70 percent of people. So if they hear it's 90-plus percent effective, they hear it's gone through the safety checks, maybe, maybe that makes them more likely to go ahead and take it, Brooke.

BALDWIN: What about, Sanjay, just big picture? We keep seeing these record highs of cases and hospitalizations here in the U.S. We were just looking at numbers out of -- North Dakota is the worst, South Dakota is number three worst death rate in the nation.

And the task force is warning of further deterioration. I know you can't predict the future. But just how bad -- how bad might this get?

GUPTA: Well, Brooke, it looks like it could get really bad.

And I -- it makes me sad to say that. I think there's lots of things that can be done even before a vaccine to prevent that from happening. But I study these models way too much. And I look to a lot of people who look at all the various inputs.

And they sort of say, look, by the beginning of January, maybe even by New Year's Eve, we may be sort of hitting over 300 (sic) cases, new cases a day, they say potentially going to a million cases every three days, in January.

It took us 98 days to have the first million, three days potentially to get to a million in January, according to these models. I mean, that's exponential growth. A few weeks after that, as you know, that's when you have the peak in hospitalizations. They think 130,000, 140,000 people might be in the hospital at that point, and then, sadly, after that, as you know, Brooke, the deaths.

And by March 1, they say, it will be over 400,000 people who will have potentially died, maybe even more. So, there's things we can do. And there's also even worst-case scenarios than the one I just described. But are we going to rise to this occasion or not, Brooke? I mean, I think that's been the question for months now.

BALDWIN: Will this administration rise to the occasion? I mean, there's still 60-plus days until the new administration, until president-elect Biden is inaugurated.

And you look at the lack of action. You see what the president is not doing. And I'm just curious, from your perspective, you hear the president-elect the other day saying that people will die, more and more lives will be lost if they can't have access to the vaccine distribution, coronavirus efforts from this current administration.

How will this affect team Biden when they come in?

GUPTA: I think it's going to have a strong impact, and not a positive one, because you would like to say, hey, look, as soon as I start, I believe in the value of tests. I want to make sure there's enough tests for every household to be able to test with some degree of frequency.

In order to do that, you need to start manufacturing now, right? You would have to have a vaccine distribution plan, because this is going to be one of the most complicated distribution plans we have ever seen of any product in our history.

[15:10:04]

Rick Bright, you remember that name, Brooke. He was the whistle- blower.

BALDWIN: Yes.

GUPTA: He is now on -- going to be on the Biden/Harris task force.

He talked about that this morning. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. RICK BRIGHT, FORMER DIRECTOR, BIOMEDICAL ADVANCED RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY: We haven't had any official contact between the transition team coming in and the current administration.

It is really setting us back. We are working really hard to ensure that we have the best plans in place for equitable distribution of the vaccine to make sure everyone who needs, and needs it first, is prioritized and can get it.

But we haven't been able to sit down with the Trump administration at all to be able to understand what plans are already in place.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUPTA: That really boggles the mind, I mean, Brooke, just no communication at all--

BALDWIN: It does.

GUPTA: -- which -- I mean, that's obviously not a good position.

BALDWIN: Not at all. Not at all. Dr. Gupta, thank you for your honesty through all of this. I appreciate it, looking at so much data. Thank you.

As the pandemic rages, and the current president continues to fight hard against the election results and not the virus, president-elect Joe Biden is pushing ahead with his own pandemic game plan for when he takes over.

And CNN's Arlette Saenz is covering that for us today.

And so, Arlette, we know that the president-elect just wrapped up a virtual roundtable with front-line workers. Tell me, what was the biggest takeaway?

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: Well, Brooke, president-elect Joe Biden once again warns that the Trump administration's failure to ascertain the election is complicating his own team's transition planning as they prepare to take on the coronavirus pandemic.

At this point in time, the Biden transition team doesn't have access to basic government data relating to testing supplies and PPE. And they also don't have access to the government's plans when it comes to distributing a vaccine.

Biden in that event warns that, unless they start to get access to that information, their own planning for distribution of a vaccine, that that could be delayed and put back by weeks or even months.

So, Biden, really, for the fourth day in a row, he and his team are again pressing the case and trying to keep the pressure on the Trump administration to begin coordinating with them when it comes to the coronavirus pandemic.

We heard from the HHS secretary, Alex Azar, today, who said that he isn't going to work with the Biden team until that election is ascertained by the GSA. So, the Biden transition team really wants to get access to this information as they start to prepare their own plans.

But Biden also was trying to put a personal face to this pandemic, talking to the front-line health care workers who are battling this virus day in and day out. He promised them that he would work for them, that he would work to protect them and to pay them.

And there was also quite an emotional moment when he heard from an ICU nurse who talked about her own experience. And he said he grew emotional. He's really trying to put a face on this pandemic, as he's trying to craft his own plans going forward, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Let's take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARY TURNER, MINNESOTA NURSES ASSOCIATION: The physical impacts of this virus have been devastating. I myself helped have held the hand of dying patients who are crying out for their family that they can't see.

I have taken care of co-workers as they fight for their lives on a ventilator, and knowing that they got sick because of the hospital or their government hasn't protected them.

I'm sorry I'm so emotional. It's just--

JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENT-ELECT: You got me emotional.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAENZ: And those are moments we often saw play out over the course of the campaign, something Biden is continuing now, as he's trying to put that personal connection to the pandemic -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: I was talking to a nurse just yesterday from Iowa. She said, I can't unsee what I have seen. Please help us, protect us, pleading with people to wear masks.

Arlette, thank you so much with team Biden and the transition efforts there.

Want to get you back to our other breaking news this afternoon, New York City, home to the nation's largest school district, just announcing that it is closing school starting tomorrow, as case numbers are rising. We have more on that.

And President Trump's transition rampage continues, this time firing the guy in charge of election cybersecurity for simply telling the truth. And the Trump campaign formerly requests a recount in two Wisconsin

counties, even though Joe Biden is winning in those counties by huge margins. Let us walk you through the numbers.

You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin. We will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:19:00]

BALDWIN: You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Here's the breaking news. The largest school district in the whole country is now shutting down schools tomorrow until further notice.

New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio just tweeted, writing that the city's positivity rate has hit the 3 percent threshold, and now over one million kids will not return to class tomorrow.

Listen, we don't have to go too far back to remember that New York City was once the epicenter of this virus. They turned it around. Everyone was looking to New York City to see how they have done it.

CNN's Bianna Golodryga is following this for us today.

And, Bianna, I mean, I'm thinking first and foremost of the parents who just this afternoon are finding out they're basically in a lurch now, trying to figure out their plans for their kids for tomorrow morning. What is the positivity rate in New York City schools? And are these kids contributing to the spread of the virus?

BIANNA GOLODRYGA, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: So, from what we know thus far, Brooke, it doesn't appear that students in schools are contributing to the spread of the virus, that they are not the vectors or super- spreaders that many had feared.

[15:20:00]

The city public school parents had been warned to expect and be prepared for this day nonetheless. At 10:30 this morning, the mayor was scheduled to announce some news. Many had assumed that it would be that schools would be closed.

We did not hear from him for hours. The governor then spoke and sort of danced around the issue as well, and said that it was up to the New York City mayor to decide. And, remember, it all goes back to that 3 percent threshold. This is an arbitrary, rather conservative threshold that the mayor came up with, along with city unions, teachers unions and principals unions, to get to a safe place where students and faculty could return to school.

They have been in school for roughly eight weeks. Some 300,000 students and families opted for in person learning, as opposed to 700,000 that are learning remotely. And thus far, the latest data that we have, as far as testing and pool testing for schoolchildren, is a positivity rate of point 1.7 percent. That is very low, which is why many education experts were really

encouraged by this news. And, nonetheless, this 3 percent threshold that the mayor had set a few weeks ago, continued to climb for the city. And in his view, he wants to hold on to that number and that promise, because he wants to reassure teachers that helicopter, in fact, is taking their safety into consideration and honor that pledge.

One could argue, look, we have learned a lot more about the spread of the virus. It doesn't appear that there's a lot of spread going on at schools. But, like you said, this is a big setback for many parents in the city, especially if you consider that indoor dining is still allowed, gyms are still open, and look at what's happening over in Europe.

BALDWIN: Exactly.

GOLODRYGA: They're also experiencing a second wave, and their priority is to keep schools open.

So, this is the biggest city in the country. So many people have been looking to see what New York City would be doing with in person learning. It is a disappointment. It is on the heels now. We're coming up on the winter break and Thanksgiving break. It's on the heels of an uptick in cases. So, many people are concerned that we will continue to see the closure of public schools, again, when we know that kids don't look like they are the super-spreaders.

What's going to happen when they're going to come home? It's really cold here in New York. They're going to be indoors. Who knows where? At least when they're in schools, they're accounted for.

This is confusing. I'm not saying this is an easy decision to make. But it is a disappointing one if you talk to education experts overall.

BALDWIN: I appreciate you saying all of that.

And, again, let me underscore your point. In New York City, you can go to the bars, you can go to restaurants, but now, apparently, you can't take your kid to school.

Before we heard from the mayor today and his big announcement, you mentioned the governor a second ago. There was a bit of a communication mess that left millions of parents and students in limbo. And it seemed to set off Governor Cuomo before his briefing.

Bianna, what happened there?

GOLODRYGA: The governor had to have anticipated that he would be asked about schools, particularly since the mayor was a no-show for his 10:30 a.m. presser. And all of a sudden, you have one from the governor. And they have different numbers gauging the positivity rate and how they measure the positivity rate in the state and in New York City.

The governor said that the positivity rate up on the -- his standards from their measurements was at 2.5 percent. But, nonetheless, the way the city measures, many argue that that is a more accurate assessment, came to be 3 percent, which is why the mayor said he was going to honor that initial pledge that schools would be shut down at 3 percent.

But, like you said, reporters were just doing their job, asking the governor questions. And he seemed to get really irritated by some of these questions, as to be expected if you're going to have a press conference at 1:30, which is what so many parents want to hear. What's going to happen with schools?

And now, as parents were en route to pick children up from schools is when they probably got the alerts on their phone. Let's watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. ANDREW CUOMO (D-NY): What are you talking about? How -- what are you talking about? You're now going to override.

We did it already. That's the law, an orange zone and a red zone. Follow the facts.

(CROSSTALK)

QUESTION: I'm just still confused.

CUOMO: Well, then you're confused.

QUESTION: I'm confused.

(CROSSTALK)

CUOMO: Then I'll tell you what, Jimmy.

QUESTION: Parents are still confused as well. The schools in New York City tomorrow--

CUOMO: They're not confused. You're confused.

QUESTION: No, I think parents are--

(CROSSTALK)

QUESTION: -- confused as well.

CUOMO: Read the law. Read the law, and you won't be confused.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GOLODRYGA: So, I would say that's a comical moment if this, in fact, were a comedy situation. Obviously, it's anything but that.

You see how heated things got in that press conference. It's a delicate issue. This has been something that the mayor and the governor have gone back and forth on. No one could call them best friends. And we saw what took place in this city with the whole world watching

the country's largest city right now, the only -- the largest school district that has been open. This has been something, an experiment that we have been hoping to see turnout well.

And though the positivity rate among students doesn't seem to be that high, the mayor's honoring that 3 percent threshold.

BALDWIN: Bianna, thank you so much for all of the news there.

Let's get some analysis.

CNN medical analyst Dr. Celine Gounder is with me. She is now on the president-elect's Coronavirus Advisory Board.

So, Dr. Gounder, on the one hand, you have Dr. Fauci saying this week to -- quote -- "try as best as possible" to keep the schools open. And now you have de Blasio saying, shut them down.

[15:25:09]

Do you think this is the right move for New York City?

DR. CELINE GOUNDER, BIDEN CORONAVIRUS ADVISORY BOARD MEMBER: yes. And just to clarify, I'm no longer a CNN medical analyst. I, unfortunately, jumped ship to advise the Biden/Harris team.

Yes, I think what we have learned over the last several months is that schools are not super-spreaders, especially elementary schools. We really do not see transition from those kids to adults, educators working in the schools.

Now, with older students, for example, high school students, that's a different story. They do seem to be more like adults in terms of how they transmit to others.

So, if you were to do -- if you were to restrict on the basis of the science, in terms of how risky is the activity, and how essential is the activity, you would be closing indoor dining, indoor gyms, especially group classes, before you would be looking at closing, say, an elementary school to in person learning.

BALDWIN: That's -- I can only hear parents saying, why can I go out to eat, but yet I can't take my kid to school?

There are also, Dr. Gounder, real concerns about children learning remotely, falling behind. How will these kids catch up?

GOUNDER: Yes, I don't think we have very good answer to that.

I think a lot of these kids are really going to lose some serious ground. And it's not just educationally speaking, but also psychologically, socially.

And we know that schools are really an essential services -- service in terms of providing food, social work support to many hardworking families.

And so those are -- that's a really difficult balance to strike. I know the mayor in New York really struggled with this early on during the first surge in New York. So, this is not an easy one. You're trying to please a lot of different parties, help parents and students feel safe, help teachers feel safe.

And it's something I personally really sympathize with, because I have a younger sister who's a high school principal in Houston, which has also been very hard-hit, and she's really struggled with how to keep herself and her staff safe, too.

BALDWIN: It's -- none of this is easy, whichever perspective you look at.

Dr. Gounder, thank you so much for all of that. And we will continue to the coverage, as, again, New York City schools, the largest district in the country, closing classes tomorrow.

President Trump is getting ready to make a rare appearance outside of the White House to pardon a turkey. But he is still denying the election results and firing government officials for simply stating facts.

That's next.

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