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Trump Throws Washington into Turmoil, Vetoes Defense Bill, Upends Stimulus and Pardons Allies; CDC Says, More Than 1 Million Vaccine Doses Administered Across U.S.; TSA Says, Almost 1.2 Million People Flew Wednesday Despite Pleas from Officials to Stay Home. Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired December 24, 2020 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[10:00:00]

PAMELA BROWN, CNN NEWSROOM: Good morning, I'm Pamela brown. Poppy and Jim are off this Christmas Eve. Thank you so much for joining us.

For more than 300,000 families, it will be their first Christmas without a loved one lost to this pandemic. A record number of Americans are spending this holiday in the hospital. And despite warnings, a record number of Americans are traveling. Doctors fear a spike in cases and deaths in the New Year.

It's also a holiday in which millions of Americans are on edge and facing homelessness as the president holds up critical stimulus. It is just one of his last minute actions before leaving Washington in turmoil and his own party in an impossible position, him or the bill.

Also last night, another wave of controversial presidential pardons to a direct dig at the Russia probe, one, a family member.

CNN's Phil Mattingly is on Capitol Hill. Joe Johns is outside Mar-a- Lago.

Joe, first, to you. Let's break down the latest round of pardons.

JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Right. A lot of this obviously in the 12 to 24 hours after the pardons is going to be about reactions of not just the political system, not just the judicial system, but also the players themselves, the people who actually got pardons. Because, remember, the president was accused quite a few times of essentially dangling a get out of jail free card for people who wouldn't participate in the Mueller investigation.

So that brings us to Roger Stone. There has been a bit reaction from him. He said last night on Fox that he denied trading his silence for a pardon. That could be tested as we go down the road. As you know, he was a confidant of the president. He was convicted essentially for obstructing justice. And he never went to jail, nonetheless, he got a commutation earlier this year and now the full pardon last night. Probably, the person at the center of a lot of these questions is Paul Manafort. Remember him, he was a campaign manager, as well as the campaign chairman for the Trump campaign in 2016. And he got prosecuted by the Russia investigation team of Robert Mueller, ended up spending two years in prison before they let him out on house arrest and that's when he got his pardon last night, he was on house arrest. Haven't heard from him.

The outlier, if you will, in that graphic we just showed you is Charles Kushner. He is the father-in-law of Jared Kushner, essentially, one of the president's closest advisers. And the thing about Charles Kushner, he was -- Charles Kushner locked up in 2005 on tax charges but also was accused of tampering, if you will, with witnesses. So we haven't heard from him either. And we do expect for this to go a long time.

We also expect there could be more pardons in the days and weeks ahead because the president's term isn't finished yet, not until 27 days from now. Back to you.

BROWN: Yes, still expect a flurry of pardons. All right, Joe, thanks for that.

To Phil Mattingly now, you are clearly not on Capitol Hill, unless there's a room there that we weren't aware of. But you're part of the team that reported on what is going on with this GOP aide calling the president unhinged. What more can you tell us ability the reaction in Washington to the president's fires that he essentially said?

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, we'll start by party. And, first, Democrats said, all right, let's go. The president wants to expand the direct payments that were in the very large COVID relief and government spending package from $600 to $2,000, and they tried to do that this morning. It was blocked by Republicans. They will try again on Monday with a full House floor vote on a bill to expand those direct payments from $600 to $2,000.

But let's just kind of get down to brass tacks here. Only one person knows what's going to happen, and that's the president of the United States. And I think when you get to kind of the reaction is from Democrats and Republicans on Capitol Hill, it's just this kind of unsettling notion of having no clue what's going to happen next.

And, Pamela, you covered this White House, you understand the kind of dynamics here. This isn't the first time that legislation that both sides considered important has been held up by the president. The president threatened to veto it, the president maybe will veto it.

[10:05:01]

But I think the issues right now are a couple of things. One, obviously, there's such limited time left until the end of the year and until of the president's term. Obviously, there is limited time before the U.S. government shuts down again. That would happen from the night of the 28th, that's on Monday. And I think the biggest issue of all is the economic pain that's being felt around the country. You have got two crucial federal unemployment programs that are expiring on December 26th, that's two from now, nearly 12 to 13 million people will be affected by that. Obviously, you have the plus-up of the federal unemployment benefits that are in this bill, $300 as well. You have the $600 direct payments, maybe not as big as people would like, but $600 is not nothing.

And I think there's another key piece in this that maybe hasn't gotten as much attention, Pamela, and that there's significant food aid in this bill as well. Food stamps, the percentage being upped to 15 percent in this package, when you look at those lines of food banks around the country.

So, I think, right now, the reality for both Republicans and Democrats is purely wait and see. One person told me earlier today, it's purely hope and pray, but I think all eyes right now, or at least ears, are based on the president's Twitter account and what he might say while he's down in Mar-a-Lago.

BROWN: And I think an avid layer to this, of course, Phil, is that the president -- he lost the election, he's mad, he's mad at people on Capitol Hill, like Mitch McConnell, who acknowledged that Joe Biden was the president-elect. As one source told me, he's mad at everybody right now. And it really is anyone's guess what he's going to do about this stimulus bill as millions of Americans are just out there in limbo waiting to find out.

Phil, thanks so much for breaking it down for us.

Back in the summer and fall, U.S. officials have said 20 million Americans would be vaccinated by the end of December, but that's not going to happen. The CDC says 9.5 million doses have been distributed across the country and over a million people have been vaccinated. What is causing the slow down?

CNN Senior Medical Correspondent Elizabeth Cohen is following these developments. If you would tell us, Elizabeth, how long will it take to get to those 20 million vaccinations?

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Pamela, that is just unknown at this time. It was hoped that it would be done in the coming weeks and maybe it still will. The problem is that this has just started, and so it's going to be a little bit slow and then it will probably ramp up. The growth will be, we hope, exponential, not linear.

So let's take a look at the numbers as they stand now. As they stand now, more than a million people have actually received the vaccine, have had shots in arms, however, more than 9 million have been distributed. And you might look at that and think, where are those 8, whatever, million? What are they doing? Are they just sitting in someone's basement? No, they're not. They will be going out.

First point here, nursing home residents have not. That federal program to vaccinate them only started on Monday, so it's only four days old. That really hasn't gotten fully sort of off the ground. And then the second part is that health care workers, the other people who are receiving the vaccines at this stage, you can't do everybody at once. It just takes time. Pamela?

BROWN: It just takes time. And help us understand what the chief scientific adviser for Operation Warp Speed said about the frequency of allergic reactions to Pfizer's vaccine. He said it is greater than what would be expected for other vaccines. What does that mean? Why is that?

COHEN: Pamela, it's a great question and it's a bit of a mystery. They don't know why they're seeing this rate. But let's talk about how low this rate is. We just saw more than 1 million people vaccinated in this country and six, I mean, six people have had allergic reactions. That's not good. You never want anyone to have an allergic reaction. But from everything we've been told, they were treated very easily, obviously, EpiPens and whatnot treat these kinds of things quite easily.

And so it's important to remember that if you've had an allergic reaction to a vaccine in the past, talk to your doctor before getting this one. And if you, for some reason, know that you are allergic to one of the ingredients in this Pfizer vaccine, well, then you shouldn't get it.

BROWN: And also that's why they tell you after you get a vaccine, stick around for a little bit just to make sure you don't have an allergic reaction.

And you also spoke to Dr. Anthony Fauci. What did he say about his future?

COHEN: Dr. Fauci turns 80 today. So, happy birthday, Dr. Fauci.

BROWN: Happy birthday.

COHEN: And I asked him, you know, what -- that he's working so hard at the age of 80, I said, Dr. Fauci, it seems like you're working 24/7. Here was his response.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: Well, not 24/7, but more like 18/7.

COHEN: Do you think you'll ever retire?

FAUCI: Well, I think I have to be realistic.

I think that sooner or later, I'm going to have to do that. I don't see that right now, clearly, in my future. The only thing I see ahead is the challenge that we are currently facing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COHEN: Dr. Fauci will be President-elect Joe Biden's chief medical adviser. So, seems no stopping for him any time in the foreseeable future. Pamela?

BROWN: No stopping at all.

[10:10:00]

Again, happy birthday to Dr. Fauci. Elizabeth Cohen, thank you.

COHEN: Thanks.

BROWN: Well, the U.S. just hit a new record for air travel during the pandemic. According to the TSA, almost 1.2 million people flew yesterday alone despite pleas from health experts to stay home.

Joining us is former Baltimore Health Commissioner and CNN Medical Analyst Dr. Leana Wen. Dr. Wen, thank you for coming on.

And let's look at these numbers of people traveling. More than 4 million people passed through security checkpoints over the past four days. Dr. Anthony Fauci says there will be another surge of cases next month due to the holiday travel.

People are still traveling. What is the best advice you have for families that are gathering just given the dynamic right now and what is the risk, again, if you would remind us of why traveling is risky during this pandemic, why being on an airplane is risky?

DR. LEANA WEN, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: Pamela, I'm less worried actually about people being on the plane than about what they did before and after they traveled. On a plane, you can definitely take precautions, for example, everybody wearing masks, try to get up as few times as possible. But then think about what people are doing after.

Almost certainly, they are getting together with their loved ones, and I understand it's Christmas and New Year, so we want to see our loved ones. But there are viral hot spots all over the country. And if people are gathering indoors without masks for prolonged periods of time, eating and drinking and laughing and having a good time, chances are, somebody -- there are going to be a lot of people who will get infected as a result just because of how much virus there is all over the country. And so people really want to get together, I hope they spend as much time outdoors as possible with households spaced at least six feet apart.

I know, again, that this is difficult but we have to get through this winter holiday. Next winter, it's going to be totally different. Ideally, everybody will be vaccinated and we can see people indoors and celebrate again. But we have to get through this winter because we already a surge on a surge. Our hospitals are filled because of Thanksgiving get-togethers. We don't want the same repeat for Christmas.

BROWN: Yes, that's right. I mean, we're seeing, basically, reflected in the numbers right now with these record deaths, more than 3,300 yesterday, I believe it was. We're seeing these record numbers, that is a reflection from Thanksgiving.

If you would, bring us behind the scenes. What does the surge look like for the hospitals are on the brink of capacity right now?

WEN: One in five hospitals in the U.S. right now are reporting that their ICUs are full. And what that means, it's not as if there is a magic number after which patients are then turned away, but what happens is that a nurse who normally takes care of five patients now may have to take care of ten. That patient who normally would get ICU levels of care are spending time in the emergency department and then the emergency department is getting overwhelmed and not able to see other patients with heart attacks and strokes as easily.

I mean, this is a serious situation and we cannot afford our hospitals to be even more overwhelmed. And so, again, I think it's a plea to people that hospitals are the last line of defense. The first line of defense is the community, where people are. And we can be each other's heroes right now because I'm certain no one wants to inadvertently infect others and land them in a hospital.

BROWN: Right. And you really just, again, point out the ripple effect that this virus has. It's not just about getting it or giving it to a loved one, there is a whole ripple effect at the hospital and people who may need care and can't get it because they're so filled up.

And there are growing concerns about this new variant, Dr. Wen, this coronavirus identified in the United Kingdom, which European health officials say may be 70 percent more transmissible than the old variant. Dozens of countries have enacted travel ban in an effort to contain the spread. We see the variant that popped up in South Africa. How concerning is all of this to you?

WEN: It is very concerning, because this coronavirus is already one that's highly contagious. Just by speaking and laughing and breathing, we are expelling these microscopic aerosols that can infect others. And so a variant that's even more -- that makes people even more susceptible because it can bind to cells more easily and enter them easily, I think that's very concerning.

The takeaway here though is that this virus doesn't spread in any different way, or the variant isn't spreading in some kind of different way, so the same precautions of masking, physical distancing, avoiding indoor gatherings will protect us against this variant. But I think this is another call for all of us to get this infection under control as quickly as possible. Because the more time that we let elapse and the more virus transmitted, the more likely we are to have additional mutations that could be even more contagious or more deadly.

BROWN: Right. And it's just unfortunate too, the timing of these new variants and record number of people traveling during this pandemic right now with the holidays.

[10:15:06]

As we've been hearing from health officials, they believe the worse is yet to come but there is still hope with the vaccine on the horizon for people who want it here in America.

All right, Dr. Leana Wen, thank you very much.

WEN: Thank you, Pamela.

BROWN: Still to come, President Trump is spending his final days in office sparking chaos across Washington. What will the impact be on the Republican Party?

And California has become the first state to surpass 2 million confirmed cases of coronavirus. Hospitals there overwhelmed.

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[10:20:00]

BROWN: The president coming unhinged, that is how one GOP aide described his actions in recent days. Those actions include vetoing a defense policy bill that's essentially for governing the future of the Pentagon, threatening to veto a hard fought stimulus coronavirus relief bill, a move at any minimum could delay any assistance for Americans struggling financially in this pandemic -- more criminals.

And we have some new (INAUDIBLE). Republicans are (INAUDIBLE) to talk to us about this. Congressman Charlie and (INAUDIBLE) as well.

Okay. And we're actually going to take a quick break and we will be right back.

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[10:25:00]

BROWN: Well, welcome back. Joining me now to discuss everything going on in Washington right now from President Trump issuing a wave of pardons to leaving the coronavirus stimulus bill in limbo is former GOP Congressman Charlie Dent and former RNC Communications Director and Republican Strategist Doug Heye. Great to see you both gentlemen.

Charlie, I'm going to start with you. GOP Senator Ben Sasse, who has been critical of some of President Trump's post-election actions, called the president's latest round of pardons, quote, rotten to the core. How does this impact the Republican Party going forward?

CHARLIE DENT, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, in a variety of ways, Pamela. First, let's just talk about the Georgia elections. It seems to me now that Senators Perdue and Loeffler are placed in a bind, do they stick with the president or do they vote (INAUDIBLE). That's a problem.

What Ben Sasse has pointed out clearly, in my view, is that the party has lent itself to the whims of one man. That has been their guiding, governing philosophy. Whatever President Trump seems to want, that's where they are, rather than establishing their policies based on some core values or principles. And so that's really the longer term problem.

So we've got short-term issues here with the Georgia election, the peaceful transition of power and then longer term for the GOP will be what does the party look like post-Trump and particularly it's going to be harder as Donald Trump, you know, tries to keep his hand in the game with his post-presidential activities.

BROWN: All right. Doug, why is that? Why do so many Republicans still kowtow to the president? You know, is it just because all the votes he got and they're afraid of him, they're afraid of the tweet? I was talking to Adam Kinzinger the other day, a Republican congressman, who said he talked to his colleagues, Republican colleagues, who basically said they don't want to speak out because they think that it's good for them to be on the president's side for the re-tweets that they get. Others said, well, look, he's going to leave office January 20th, we'll just stay quiet until he goes out the door.

I mean, what do you think?

DOUG HEYE, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Ultimately, it comes down to voters and what Republican members of Congress are hearing directly from their voters. They are still upset about the election. They still question the results, which I think it's pretty clear that Joe Biden won and won convincingly. I mean, that shouldn't be an issue, but it is an issue for their voters.

And so they're acting according to what they're hearing on the ground in their individual districts and individual states. It is, by no means, an ideal situation but that's the reality of what they're hearing on the ground when they go home and when they get emails and phone calls from their constituents. They're directly replying to them.

BROWN: But isn't that kind of a self-fulfilling prophecy because their voters believe that because there isn't leadership saying, no, here are the facts, here is what's actually going on because they don't want to stand up to the president?

HEYE: Yes, absolutely. I think for the Republican Party to heal itself, whenever that may be, it's going to be both a bottom up and top down situation. We need the followers of the Republican Party to set a better example and we need leaders to lead. That's not happening in Washington right now. It's part of why we still have the limbo that we do over the COVID relief package. And until that happens, the Republican Party won't be able to heal itself.

BROWN: So, Doug, I want to -- I'm sorry, Charlie, I want to get back to the pardons and go to this tweet from Connecticut Senator Chris Murphy. He said, once one party allows the pardon power to become a tool of criminal enterprise, its danger to democracy outweighs its utility as an instrument of justice. It's time to remove the pardon power from the Constitution.

Do you think the president is inadvertently making the case for limiting presidential pardoning power?

DENT: No question, the president's behavior with pardons is really going to affect people's view of the whole pardoning process. I can't imagine the founders of this country would have granted this type of authority to a president had they known a president would conduct himself like this. I'm not so sure we should get rid of it, but I think there will probably have to be limits placed on this pardoning power because this power is clearly being abused by this president.

When he uses that authority, you know, to accommodate his cronies or his sycophants or his relatives or people who are engaged in real corruption without any type of serious vetting from the Department of Justice, I mean, it really brings -- it calls into question, you know, why we have this pardoning power.

[10:30:06]

I think it will have to be reformed as a consequence of this president.