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Trump Remains Focused on Election Loss as Pandemic Rages; Brexit is Done, But More Negotiations Still Ahead; Pope Francis Misses New Year's Mass Due to Sciatic Pain. Aired 4:30-5a ET

Aired January 01, 2021 - 04:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[04:30:29]

ISA SOARES, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, and a very happy New Year to our viewers in the United States, and all around the world. I'm Isa Soares. And you are watching CNN NEWSROOM.

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SOARES: The world says they're not so fond farewell to 2020 and welcomes 2021 with a hearty hello.

But while we're celebrating the passing of the year that was the pandemic, the pandemic remains, infection, hospitalizations, surging everywhere it seems and in the United States, the problems are particularly acute.

The U.S. set a new record for hospitalizations on New Year's Eve Day, more than 125,000.

But President Donald Trump who returned to Washington from Florida on Thursday remains focused on his election loss. Late on Thursday, he tweeted his support for Missouri Senator Hawley who plans to object when the votes are counted next week, and Republicans tell CNN that 140 Republican representatives will oppose the counting of those votes.

Now, let's get more, Natasha Lindstaedt is in a professor of government at University of Essex. She joins me now from Colchester, England.

Natasha, a very good morning to you. Happy New Year to you.

Let's start with the developments out of Washington. First, it was Republican Senator Josh Hawley who said he would vote against certifying Joe Biden's win but we're hearing at least 140 others will do the same.

How dangerous is this even if it is just a delay tactic?

NATASHA LINDSTAEDT, PROFESSOR OF GOVERNMENT, UNIVERSITY OF ESSEX: Well, you're right that it is going to delay the outcome but it's not going to change it and it does set a very dangerous precedent for our democracy. And you hear about contested elections happening in newer democracies in Ukraine or in Mali, or in Ivory Coast, you don't really hear about it happening in an established democracy like the U.S.

Now, in newer democracies where you have weaker democratic institutions and where democratic norms haven't been established yet, these kind of things can happen and it sun heard of in the U.S. because we have a commitment to democracy, and who would have ever thought of this happening in 2008 or 2012, when Obama won, because he was running against Mitt Romney and John McCain.

But it appears that there is a very different type of Republican now, the party is almost mutated into something that is unrecognizable, and it really seems to be attacking democratic norms. And I find it to be highly dangerous, because at the end of the day, it's really all about our belief in democracy and the elite play an important role in cultivating these beliefs.

But a recent poll from Quinnipiac University revealed that only 60 percent of registered voters thought that the election was unfair, that is so, so problematic. This could happen again, where baseless claims are laid out there, and then we decide, okay, we might overturn an election, and that really will be the end of our democracy if that ever does happen.

SOARES: And like you said, you know, President Trump has virtually zero chance of changing the results, no credible allegations of any issues, with voting. So, my question is, why actually ponder to President Trump, or whatever this game is?

LINDSTAEDT: I think it is a very dangerous game and I think Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell did not want this to happen and was trying to convince senators to not engage in these types of antics because it is very dangerous.

There is a real gamble here. I think the Republicans, either don't think that the Republican voters don't care about what they will do, or punished severely if they go against Trump. So, they're making a bet here that if they do this, they're going to gain a favor of Trump, and that Trump is so important to the Republican Party and to their future chances that this is something they need to do.

SOARES: Natasha, he is leaving in three weeks or so, so loyalty perhaps is a bit late at this stage. So how much of this is personal gain, or are they just trying to tap into President Trump's base?

LINDSTAEDT: Yes, that's the question, and I think it's a little bit of both. They think that this is going to create a favor of Trump who can be very ruthless on Twitter if you decide to disagree with him.

[04:35:04]

SOARES: Yeah.

LINDSTAEDT: And they think that voters approve of these types of action, but you also see in the Republican Party there are some cracks, I mean not a lot, but you have Republican Senator Ben Sasse of Nebraska criticizing Josh Hawley, the senator from Missouri who decided to do this, to protest, criticizing this move.

There are other Republican senators who disagree with this. And then, of course, it's not going to lead to anything, because the outcome is already determined because you have to have a vote, a majority vote in both chambers, and the Democrats have the majority in the House.

So all of these antics, all of these ploys, as Ben Sasse mentioned, is a very dangerous ploy and it is something that Republican senators may find will bite them in the end and Republican House members who are agreeing to do this as well.

SOARES: I think you're right. It's a dangerous tactic. Might to be delay but President Trump definitely has the growing support of many allies. So, the question then is, you know, in terms of long-term damage, what does this do, not just as a Democrats, obviously, but as a Republican and as well as democracy in the United States.

How do you see this playing out in the next few weeks or so?

LINDSTAEDT: Well, I think what will be critical is whether or not the Republicans can come together, and decide to support the electoral outcome. And that is really, really important. In any kind of transition, whether it's a newer democracy, a weaker democracy, any democracy, these elections are so critical to our democracy, and I mean that is basically what distinguishes democracies from authoritarian regimes.

So democracies need their elite to get behind the results, and the outcome. Now, in terms of the long view, it's really interesting, for the Republicans, because they have about 20 of them that are up for re-election in the Senate, in 2022, and only 13 Democratic senators. So it really is a gamble that they are taking, by challenging the very outcome of this election, where Biden won by over seven million votes.

SOARES: Yeah. I know what we are hearing as well is that the president is demanding that his VP Mike Pence, fight harder for him and that puts him in a very tight spot.

Professor Natasha Lindstaedt of the University of Essex, thank you very much, and happy New Year to you.

LINDSTAEDT: Thanks for having me. Happy New Year.

SOARES: Now, you are watching CNN. Do stay with us. We'll be right back.

Happy New Year if you're just joining us.

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[04:40:48]

SOARES: It is a New Year and the U.K. is waking up to a new reality, Brexit is finally a done deal. And at 11:00 p.m. London Time on New Year's Eve, the United Kingdom and the European Union officially went their separate ways.

There is still a lot of details to iron out but Prime Minister Boris Johnson says it's time for a celebration.

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BORIS JOHNSON, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: Pioneered in the U.K., it is also free to do things differently and if necessary better than our friends in the E.U. Free to do trade deals around the world and free to turbo-charge our ambition to be a science superpower, from bio sciences, to artificial intelligence.

This is an amazing moment for this country. We have our freedom in our hands. And it is up to us to make the most of it.

And I think it will be the overwhelming instinct of the people of this country to come together, as one United Kingdom -- England, Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland, working together, to express our values around the world.

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SOARES: Anand Menon joins me now via Skype. He's a professor of European politics and foreign affairs at King's College London, well- known face her on this show.

Professor, very good morning to you. Happy New Year.

ANAND MENON, PROFESSOR, EUROPEAN POLITICS & FOREIGN AFFAIRS, KING'S COLLEGE LONDON: Good morning. And to you.

SOARES: Let's talk Brexit. We're still talking Brexit after all of these years. But while it may be done and dusted, and I don't think, if I'm wrong, if that this is the end of the conversation between both, there are plenty of loose ends still.

MENON: Absolutely. It is far from done and dusted for a few reasons. Firstly, there are still decisions that are pending on financial services, on access to data from the European Union, the E.U. is going to make decisions on those things over the next months. There are issues that are going to be revisited.

Fisheries was key to the negotiation. The whole fisheries deal gets opened up again in five and a half years and the whole deal is reviewed every five years. So, the E.U. and the U.K. will be sitting around the negotiating table for the foreseeable future.

SOARES: And, of course, it is -- it is way too soon to see the impact of Brexit because of COVID-19 and restrictions in place. Do you see major bumps ahead? And if so, in what areas in particular? When do you think we'll start seeing this?

MENON: Well, the way I think this will play out is perhaps into next week, remember it's a holiday today so there won't be as much traffic as normal at the ports. As we get into next week, we'll start to see signs of some disruption I think, simply because people who trade either from the E.U. to the U.K. or the other way, are going to have to get used to a whole new set of paperwork, people will get it wrong and turned back to the ports and that will be called tail-backs.

But I think the other thing we're saying is the impacts of Brexit beyond that disruption will be relative slow burn and relatively subtle and swamped I suspect by the economic impact of COVID in the short term. What most economists expect in the U.K. is once the public health aspects are brought under control with the vaccine we will run smack into the economic outcome of the pandemic which is very high unemployment. That will essentially disguise the effects of Brexit for the short to medium term.

SOARES: And that's exactly what I was going to ask you, you read my mind, because I read your piece in "The Guardian" and in it, I will read it for viewer, even with a deal, the impact of Brexit on the economy will be significantly greater than that of the pandemic. I mean, the U.K. economy is suffering a deep recession, GDP shrunk by, what, 20 percent in the second quarter, how much worse do you think it can get?

MENON: Well, I think what will happen with the pandemic is we'll have this economic sort of aftershock in the spring, around Easter Time, and most people expect the economy to bounce back fairly strongly from that. The difference from Brexit, is Brexit feels like a slow burn, medium to long term process of attrition and over ten years, yes, I fully expect the economic impact of Brexit to exceed that of COVID. But the interesting question politically is how noticeable that Brexit effect is, because it will be slow burn and long term?

SOARES: Yes. And of course, the threats are not just economic, the dangers, I'm thinking of the union here.

[04:45:02]

I want to show our viewers this tweet from Nicola Sturgeon, Scotland's first minister. She tweeted overnight, I think it was. And she says: Scotland will be back, soon, Europe, keep the light on.

Do you think we'll be seeing further cause of Scottish independence and where do you think that puts Boris Johnson?

MENON: Oh, we'll certainly see further calls for Scottish independence. The S&P Nicola Sturgeon's party saying they have been dragged out of the U.S. and Scotts voted to remain in, and they want another referendum and there is another parliament situation next May, and Nicolas Sturgeon will go into that election on a platform a referendum and if she wins the majority, she will claim she has a democratic mandate.

The problem they have, is to have a referendum, the British government has to say yes, and Boris Johnson has said he will not say yes to a referendum on social independence and we face something of a standoff in the year to come.

SOARES: Professor Anand Menon, always great to get your insight. The professor is from King's College London, thank you very much, sir, and a happy New Year to you.

MENON: Happy New Year.

SOARES: Thank you.

Now, Croatia is struggling to bring relief to devastated towns south of the capital. When we come back, we will talk to a doctor who helped evacuate at least 200 people from a hospital at the epicenter. We'll bring you that story after a short break.

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SOARES: A convoy of aid rushes for the Croatian town of Glina, near the epicenter of Tuesday's 6.4 magnitude earthquake in Croatia, followed by a series of powerful earthquakes.

The main quake killed at least seven people and the country's prime minister says it expects that number to rise. Dozens more were injured. Rescuers are still digging through the rubble, looking for survivors. The mayor of the town says that residents are going through hell.

The images from the town, about 50 kilometers south of the capital, Zagreb, show devastation, as you can see, homes destroyed, and residents left homeless and living in tents and electricity and water cut off and patients from the town's hospital have been evacuated to other cities.

Let's get more on this, Dr. Aldin Begovic helped evacuate 200 patients to hospitals in Zagreb. He is an ENT specialist and joins us from Velika Gorica, in Croatia.

Doctor, good morning to you. Happy New Year.

DR. ALDIN BEGOVIC, ENT SPECIALIST: Hello, good morning.

SOARES: Doctor, give us a sense of what's happening where you are. Have the aftershocks finally stopped?

BEGOVIC: No, not yet. Some 200 aftershocks after the big break, we are feeling them every 15 and 20 minutes here. The ground won't stop shaking.

SOARES: So it continues to shake every 10 to 15 minutes and I imagine that that makes it so much harder with search and rescue.

BEGOVIC: Yes, it's really stressful. Our hospital is some 15 kilometers away from the epicenter. It consists of six buildings, four of those are in complete ruins, and one is semi functional and one is functional.

And I must say, one good news, in this New Year, a baby was born, and that complete building that wasn't ruined.

SOARES: That's wonderful news. We all need some good news. After all of the tragedies we have seen. Doctor, when you are saying that aftershocks are still happening every 15 minutes, so where are people staying?

I'm guessing many people don't want to return to their homes, if there are any homes left standing, so where are they staying?

BEGOVIC: There -- people are staying around in their homes. We have a lot of good people who brought mobile phones and some of those people are in those mobile homes. Some are in city stadiums, and something like that. From 400 beds, that consisted of, in our hospital, we have around 20 to 30 left, in the building, and other patients are in tents.

So, it looks a lot like a mess, but only a deadly virus around us.

SOARES: Yeah, and I suspect with COVID-19, like you said, the deadly virus, everything is so much harder.

Talk me through the challenges you're facing and what help you need right now, what do you need most right now, doctor?

BEGOVIC: Most, we need medical equipment. Luckily, we have one building, in our hospital, that is under construction, and it is almost done, it's a big building, but we need medical equipment for that building, so we can put all the patients there. Beds, ICU units. All stuff like that.

SOARES: Yeah.

BEGOVIC: When the quake happens, we have to carry those, we carry around 100 COVID-19 positive patients in our hospital, some of them in intensive care units. So it was really hard to evacuate them to our capital, Zagreb, we had to carry them, because the elevators weren't working, and there was no time to mind the safety and address the safety. We had only masks and gloves, and everybody helped -- doctors, nurses, other staff. It was really stressful.

SOARES: I can't -- I can't even imagine, Doctor, with everything going on, as well, with COVID-19, the stress and the, really the anxiety for so many people.

Dr. Aldin Begovic, in Croatia, thank you very much, thank you for all of the amazing work you're doing and we're thinking of everyone in Croatia, and hope you get all the help you need. Thank you, sir.

BEGOVIC: Thank you, thank you. Bye.

We're going to take you now to Italy where New Years mass is getting under way at the Vatican. There are a few noticeable changes this year. There is social distancing, as you can imagine, as well as masks, but Pope Francis isn't leading the service.

CNN's senior Vatican analyst John Allen explains his absence.

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JOHN ALLEN, CNN SENIOR VATICAN ANALYST: Pope Francis on Thursday was forced to withdraw from the Vatican's traditional New Year's Eve liturgy featuring the singing of the great hymn, Thanksgiving to God for the Year, and also from the New Year's Day mass in honor of Mary the mother of God, also is the Vatican designated world day of peace.

And now, all of this, because of what the Vatican described as a painful bout of sciatica.

[04:55:04]

That's a nerve condition that generally affects the back and the legs. Pope Francis disclosed he suffered from the condition in 2013. In the years since, it has occasionally gotten in his way and he got treatment of it over the summer of 2017 but there is no situation here that it is in any sense life-threatening, and certainly no papal health scare in the Vatican.

For CNN, this is John Allen, in Rome.

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SOARES: And that does it for me. Thank you very much for watching. I'm Isa Soares live from London. I will be back with you in the next hour.

But first, we can't wrap up the show without taking another look at how the world looked in 2021. A look at celebrations from New Zealand to New York.

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